That sounds like a threat, you work for Snell?

@@thepioneer6178 he said keep it up, so definetely not a treath ;)

That's when you know he's doing something right!

That's why they don't give Ryan lots of bikes to review as well. He doesn't BS the viewers with fake or paid reviews.

@@motorcityoctane6713 The hero we all needed.

Don't think he's getting a Snell Xmas gift this year, lol

@@billmcmeekin7909 judging by the info he just provided, who would want one anyhow 😂

We're going to find him with two self-inflicted blunt force impacts to the same spot on the back of his head

@@creamydonk 😂

@@creamydonk They will not throw him off the moving vehicle after done tho because they be damned to partake in variable force impacts.

Yeah that’s found nowhere on the internet. Need more detail.

​@@highball7347 not everything is on the internet. It's a random quote from an unnamed article.

And the answer is always: "Yes. It means whatever is the worst version for you, will be the one you get. Always."

like the Ford Mustang, for example? Jesus, Ford fucked that up.

Yeah! Fuck the word "wound"! Lee: "Stop getting me wound up Brenda!" Brenda: "Wound up? I haven't stabbed you yet! How did you know I had a knife?"

Funny thing, reminds me of the word woman now....

What is a woman?

It always has been

They would be right to do so.

Not really. Most tracks in the US require helmets to have SNELL certification to be allowed to ride there. That makes this a very sticky situation.

ECE is actually safer than snell, has been for a while. DOT is kinda bare minimum.

I skip ece and go for fim. If it's good enough for MotoGP good for me

More like what should be accredited course study on the topic, but I'm feeling your vibe.

🤘🏻😎🤘🏻

But what did you learn?

Yes. It is a super production.

was going to add a like, but let's just leave it at 420

Ah, yeah, like every other business, organization and government.

Snell served a good purpose when they started, and still do with their automotive standards and possible some of their other standards. The fact is the ECE standard has just caught up and surpassed them in being relevant. Snell really should simply abandon the motorcycle helmet market, but that might cut a big chunk of revenue from their pockets.

That's what happens when you got hard headed people running an organization/company. They don't typically adjust to the times and trends and often than not, get left behind. In short complacency. (See Kodak, Nokia and other companies that were not relevant today)

@@kurtjustiniani1354 “Hard headed”. I see what you did there :-).

Would make sense for them to keep their standards as they are and state that it's intended for race car driving, not motorcycling. That would be of benefit to both motorcyclists and race car drivers. Problem with that, the reason they don't take that approach, is that far fewer helmets are sold for race car driving than for motorcycling. They'd rather have a meaningless standard on a lot of helmets than a relevant one on a few. Profit above mission, apparently.

"Sad" is the perfect way to describe it. No winners in the long run. ~RF9

A very M'urican way to do it.

Bingo

this reminded me of a quote from Tim minchin's poem, Storm: "Science adjusts its views based on whats observed, faith is the denial of observation so that belief can be preserved"

@@dustyoldhat In that case, go look at the animated video of the poem on KZfaq. It's full of lines like that one.

Evolve or die. SNELL was the go to standard when I bought my first helmet in 1974. I would expect data based science to push new standards. Looks like ECE is the alternative safety standard when helmet shopping.

Wow man, that's some hard fact you just shared here. I'm happy that you keep racing champ!

Its the same ith crashing old cars with no crumplezones. The car looks fine, but everything inside it is mush.

This info is giving me anxiety about my own Snell helmet

Have you looked into 6d helmets? They were the first ones to tell me what a crock of shit Snell was years ago but their acessebility to a market suffered because they're a US brand and far too many people wouldn't look their way because of how they rejected snell (due to how it causes concussions) and stuck with ECE. They have a major focus on preventing concussions and after that crash you probably can't be affording any more dude

@@tobiaspieringer1653 I have a car with no seatbelts, My grandmother crashed an identical one years ago and was simply thrown through the windscreen to safety. It has a split windscreen so you only have to replace half of it too

But it was a class full of Harley riders so 95% I'm guessing we open face helmets anyways which are knowhere near as safe as almost every full face no matter what sticker is on it.

American Capitalism at its finest, who cares if your brain gets turned into road grease, as long as we make our money! Absolutely revolting, non-profit my a*s

@@anthonysimoes7307 helmets?

As should be done, hate people that claim shit and can't back it up

Aka science

So does his science teacher.

Another brilliant episode telling like it is!

Crazy to see real investigative journalism

O fuckin 💘.love this man. He is a fuckin jenious. And explains. Very specifically. Why. HE VERY FUCKIN KOOL. LOVE LOVE LOVE HIM NIGHTFENCER GATEKEEPER. FREDDY FROM.NOBLE FENCE. BRAINTREE MASSACHUSETTS. I HAVE SEBERAL SICK MACHINES ONE ID THE 199I KAWASAKI ZRC 1100 EITH NITROUS OXIDE AND MANY ENGINE UPGRADES. VALVES. PORTED POLISHED. BALANC3D AND BLUEPRINTED MOTOR CRANK. LOTS OF TITANIUM. L8fters roller rocker cams. Rc engineering. Keblar CLUTCH ETC. .HOLY FUCK .

Literally

Ralphthemoviemaker

@@frednoble1833 seems like a nice setup, cheers

True af

ESPECIALLY when you catch it on your lunch break 🤤😉

Yule. "Christmas" only emulates the European tradition, and nobody follows their additions.

True

Prancing moose? I spy a fellow Volvo driver 😂

If they spent half as much time worrying about safety instead of sales as they spent on watching and downvoting the video, the sticker might mean something.

and those who paid the full price tag for a bucket.

"Hardheaded..." I see what you did there.

Unfortunately, what else do you expect from America?

@@SeraphimCramer Maybe to dominate the world like we have been doing for the last 78 years.

@@darthnatas953 Lol & there's the exact brand of American hard headedness & refusal to change I was talking about. We haven't dominated shit in the world in decades

@@SeraphimCramer The US economy is the largest in the world. Our military is the largest in the world. We have the most personal freedom in the world (in most states). US citizens have the largest per capita assets in the world. Our government spends the most money on the stupidest, most wasteful shit in the world. All this with very detrimental demographics compared with countries like Denmark, Sweden, etc. And in spite of half of US citizens either not working at all, or working for the government (which is actually worse for production, because government workers not only have to be provided for by people who actually produce worthwhile products and services, but many also actively stand in the way of production.) The half of us that are working are so friggin productive that we can protect every country’s borders in the world except our own, with a military 10 times bigger than it needs to be, carry 25% of the people on our backs, all while swimming upstream against the other 25%. We drove Russia in to bankruptcy, managed to babysit Europe for the last 75 years, fought several useless wars with no point, and still are able to hand out free stuff to nearly every country in the world. All while doing equally worthless stuff like flying to the moon. China is next to get their butt kicked if we can get our fellow citizens to focus on what the actual problem is, instead of dreaming up fake problems to spend fake money on like the Earth possibly getting warmer or colder, or that medical care, education, or some other service that someone has to pay for is somehow a “right.”

And he states all his sources, like I'd pay RF9 money to keep making videos if he ever gets dropped from fortnine (would be crazy because for me he's the guy I follow and not the website but idk how it's run) or wants to take a different direction

Um...I think Dexter Ford was "someone in the motorcycle journalism community."

The magazines get too much advertising cash to question this.

It missed a few things, like the DOT duration of g force and a puncture test, neither of which are considered in the ECE standard. Still the ECE is better, not just because it is newer, it has been around since at least 2005 from what I've understood.

@@MK-hb3xc unreal… 🤦🏼‍♂️

Im sure right now there is an email with the subject URGENT

@@dustyoldhat every foundation and company has someone in charge.

This information has been out for a while. Ryan has even made videos about different ratings.

@@dustyoldhat that's what they would like to make you think about them. Getting a non profit tag is a good way to keep your income from taxing. They charge for their certification so they make money and they are fighting to keep their rating standard as the main one not ECE/FIM even if it saves lives. SO tax evasion, care less about saving lives and more about licensing fees, making a half ass standard so their certified makers can sell in another safer standards territory! Non profit my ass!

Ehh, those execs will probably discuss it and come up with 2 FortNine conclusions that justifies not making any smart changes

It's crazy, isn't it. Most channels would dream of hitting this quality level once, but they are doing it on a daily basis.

Dude kills it! Literally checks all boxes I’ve never even driven a motorcycle haha

Because he doesn't stuff it with filler to make it past the 10 minute youtube preference algorithm. Though in this case he definintlry should - this is a PSA.

Aside from that, his videos are so damn good. I get so engrossed, I hardly notice time passing by

It is not so much the brevity, but the frequency of same. hate waiting a whole month between installments. The delivery has always been quite enjoyable and the touch of incredulity adds a strong factor of believable confidence. The entries from this year though by Ryan and even stronger and more powerful in presentation of vital topics. Very top sort and the industry should be paying close attention to this critical research. Well done Ryan . You are making our lives safer bit by bit. Probably not in the cards, but I for one would like bi-weekly or perhaps something every three weeks.

Prob 1 guy with alt accounts

Make that 27

make that 29 plus the one alt.

71

Almost every major international brand has them both, and almost all of them get a 4 or 5star SHARP aftermarket lab rating. You are unlikely to get a helmet that fails SHARP, even cheap China crap like HJC , Fuel or Scorpion.... Ride smart, don't duche ride and you most likely will never find out which is better.

@@STho205 You dont have to be a "duche rider" to get that kind of experience. Unfortunately someone i knew personally experienced it and that didnt end well...

@@seb9940 were they wearing a helmet?

@@STho205 HJC is definitely not cheap china crap

@@arsyadgafli8749 there is almost always a personal need to reinforce ones value by the product choices made in a branded consumer all basically the same market. You can't be a man cause you don't smoke the brand I do used to be the old joke fifty years ago. I have an HJC and it wore well. It was OK. It was a plastic outer shell, some igloo cooler extruded styrofoam, some laminate gray foam rubber with glue molded fabric. All the China buckets are that. They work for the purpose, but nothing to really cheer about. When it got over six years, i took it apart to see hie it was built. The unsupported shell would squish in half under pressure. I hit it with a sander snf it holed in under a second. The styrofoam was.. styrofoam... But the padding waa taped onto it with gaffers tape. No sewing. The tape was dry and powdery. It held together for six years, but probably any China "counterfeit" bucket would also. Since all China factories are controlled ultimately by ONE PARTY CORPORATION... is there really a difference. Last years revolutionary HJC is likely this years Alibaba/Amazon $80 special. I'm sure you're fine. I'm sure you're safe. They would hold together enough for a typical accident... However the five year rule is being pushed because cheap construction doesn't last long. Like Chinese Clark Shoes that are just trading on an old Western brand name.

They work for Snell.

People very often don't seek information, but confirmation. Can't do anything against those who don't find it and are unhappy about that fact...

It's the internet, and it's youtube. It would be more surprising if there _weren't_ any dislikes. It would also be more surprising if there wasn't a comment amounting to 'how could there be dislikes'. As far as youtube videos go, this is a VERY low dislike ratio. Which is not surprising, because it's an F9 video.

Free pancakes

@@IstasPumaNevada yeah, even on rare live concert footage of an old musician with a view count just over 100, there will still be dislikes.. it's just how youtube works for some reason

FIM is actually the checkmark here. But ECE is being pulled by them so it'll do

and FIM is best

@@andy_byrd FIM is for professional racers and offers the best protection at speed. However Its expensive. ECE is in General fine for most road users, and is cheaper to buy. But as far as min standards go; ECE is far more practical and superior than the Snell Standard,

@@mateojimenez5905 But you only get fim on at least 1000$ helmets

@@ciprianb4794 Take a look at Scorpion EXO R-1 thats 500$ lid and passed FIM standards.

When I bought a new helmet in ~2008 I went for the British Standard. Now I go for with ECE. Snell has not been relevant for years. Motorcyclist published an article ripping Snell in 2005 (same journalist who was fired from Motorcyclist for writing about Snell in the NYT).

@@cgmoog The article you mention is titled “Blowing the Lid Off” by Dexter Ford. It’s brilliant.

I started riding in 1972. Pretty much get a Bell helmet with a Snell sticker or risk your head to an unknown. Almost 50 years later, I would expect changes. For road bikes, I want a shell that smashes and absorbs energy when my head hits the flat area called pavement. Off-road, keeping pointy rocks out of my skull and impact absorption are 2 considerations.

I've heard lots of great from magazines, but not much from actual owners yet. Still being a new engine design I'd wait a couple years before buying one. But I do love the comfort and practicality of ADV bikes.

@@randombuilds8336 The only "Owner" review I saw was some Harley bro who talked up how much dirt biking he used to do then proceeded to drive the Pan America like a geriatric down a relatively smooth road. I wont be taking his opinion on the bike, that's for sure.

Been trying to get a hold of one! It's at the top of our to-do list. ~RF9

@@WPGKLR Seems that bro has a realistic idea of 150hp elephant bike off-road capabilities. You want extreme? Harley did it in the commercial. Every fall on the Pan-am will cost like a slightly used Honda motocross bike.

@@FortNine you should ask revzilla :p

probebly someone who works at snell xd

There's two now so I'm guessing it's the president and vice president of Snell

1000% guaranteed it's the owner of a Snell approved helmet... that he just bought on fortnine 😂😂

@@nathanbossier2446 Most likely a bloke who suffered a crash wearing a Snell certified helmet. This raises the moral and philosophical question: "is someone who's brain-dead, but dislikes videos online, considered alive or deceased?"

That's me. F9 is only telling half of the story and this was very dishonest of him to do so. See, contrary to what he imply there are serious people working for motorbikers safety and doing their job with great care at Snell. And as you guessed, I am one of these people. I work as a HOST (Helmet Operator Special Tester) for Snell and we try our helmets in EVERY condition. The standard of quality is only making sure we reach the specific hardness or softness desired for either market. Nonetheless, I test those helmets myself in real conditions and I have crashed head first over a thousand times in testing already and see how I am not mentally impaired at all ? Snell quality for sure.

Honestly, living in Europe, I haven't even heard of SNELL before watching this channel. My German Schuberth helmet is as an EU certificat.

@@vinvenus4581 I have a Schuberth too, so it's not my personal issue, but having unsafe helmets on the market is a real issue in general.

Business disregards safety in favor of greater profit. More news at 11.

@@ntdscherer Wouldn't be odd if it wasn't a company testing _mandatory_ safety equipment.

The Snell foundation is a non-profit

Yeah now I'm out here looking at new helmets. Shit.

I got my helmet after watching the DOT video, went ECE as the sense I had at the time was Snell was for racing while ECE was more suitable for street riding. Now I hope he doesn't come out with one saying ECE is crap too... Even if he does, I'm guessing it's best of the three, and we all know crashing a motorcycle with any helmet isn't going to be fun.

@@quillmaurer6563 Well, ECE 22/06 (and some with 05 stickers) are basically the balance between budget and variety, versus top protection but limited options that FIM offers. However, in another 5 or so years (5 is probably optimistic, I admit) we might start seeing more budget friendly FIM helmets as manufacturers get a better handle on it and start larger production runs. Of course, then we'll have to contend with the grades of FIM, as there are multiple grades of the FIM standard. ECE will become the bare minimum for informed, sane riders, and the lowest rank of FIM will be be what most riders will actually look to get. Snell will probably start being phased out from motorcycles by then, I hope. They never really should have been used as a standard for motorcycle helmets, as the video illustrates. DOT? That'll probably exist for quite some time as the legal bare minimum. The helmet equivalent of slapping on a barely functional part to a device to ensure the whole technically qualifies as legal to use.

@@ThatSoddingGamer I found myself thinking "What a valuable footnote for the video this is" while reading this comment. Good stuff, bro. Thanks for the intel ;)

@@alexsavastru8125 No problem dood, at least someone found it useful ^_^

Seriously, if I hadn't stumbled across his channel I would still be riding with a cheap dot helmet. It was still within the return window so I sent it back and ordered a proper ece certified helmet

Does it come with a BBQ GRILL bolted to one side like their motorcycles?

@@stoneblue1795luckily no !! Well, atleast for now anyway. And that BBQ grill thingie is mandatory for the registration of any motorcycle.

And who is surprised that in India safety standards are borked?

@@reaper8887 yeah I'm curious about that bbq grill thingy in India. What purpose does it serve? Can you get rid of it after you've registered it?

@@RiloEltonThat contraption is called a "saree guard", it's designed to keep pillion riders "saree" or any other bulky clothing from getting caught in the sprockets or wheels and lead onto any accidents. Even though that thing is mandatory for the road bikes here, most will get rid of it after the registration process is over.

I have! they're in Canada too

Everybody can ignore Snell. It is not a street legal standard anywhere but racetracks that impose it privately. This video is important to the helmet marketing industry, like Ryan, Revzilla, etc... But not on the street.

@@STho205 it's still better than DOT so could be the better option for US folks that can't source an ECE bucket easily enough, altough there's little reason for that to be true with shops like fortnine and revzilla around

@@lemonbrothers3462 you know, a Ryan F9 video five years ago called "5 Safest Helmets" half of them had neither a Snell or ECE sticker.. And he said it didn't matter as they were safe. He was falling back on SHARP. His highest recommended one was the high viz Scorpion 490 which at that time had no ECE but a Snell 2015 (which is years after this video's stated controversy) and the HJC which only had a DOT sticker because it couldn't pass Snell and had never paid to get ECE. Both were China Buckets with flexible cheaper polycarb shells. 4 years ago he did the video Best Snell helmets where he sang the praises of Snell. Followed up a few weeks later with the horrible dangers of DOT. When it finally comes down to it, these guys are entertainers and product salesmen. Ryan produces a nice polished video. He filled a week. Ride safe... Your helmet is as good as you need...and I hope you never need it.

@@STho205 I have to agree with you. As much as I enjoy some of Ryan's videos, he's starting to sound more and more like a used car salesman.

@@STho205 That's not what I saw in those older videos. He correctly pointed out same thing in different way - how Snell was about a firm shell, and competing standard is about a flexible one, i.e. the harder vs. softer adjectives used in this current video. As I recall, he said neither is perfect (nothing is), but Snell's hard shells are a liability if not padded and fit correctly, and the softer standards are great for absorbing but not for point impact, etc. Too much absorb without a shape doesn't match our hard heads. Anyway, this science is changing with more testing - notice the football helmet changes in just the last few years.

I regret my purchase. Luckily I have to buy a new helmet next year anyway. ECE it is

I bought a snell helmet about two months ago... R.I.P.

@@luckify3046 yeah I got a bell race star rip hbu

A very good reason to take another safety course and practice safety at every chance. YOU are the best safety device available. Ride safe, ride long!

@@Bagration421oh I didn't know that, every website I've seen says the safety of the race star is very good. I think the pro star is even better

fortnine videos..always happy to see new uploads!!!

That’s how it is almost everywhere, you must psd the local standard. In America all helmets must pass DOT. Thankfully almost all helmets that pass ECE also pass DOT.

Also the ECE certified helmets which are undoubtedly superior, are considered ILLEGAL, as if it was contraband. ffs

Go for Royal Enfield helmets, they are ISI DOT certified and ECE approved. Affordable too.

Its funny that we indian start using helmet only recently...few years before people used to say to people who use to wear helmets *that are you going to space..if not then why are you wearing that urn on your head* ..🙄 PS: ECE helmetes are more relevant in today's India because now the bike are getting faster so the chance of you rolling on the road and hitting your head on the multiple side has increased But before the story was different

Do the police actually enforce it?

I had no idea snell isn't in the other side. A lot of tracks in my area (Canada) mandate SNELL rated helmets. DOT alone is not enough, ECE is yes or no depending on track.

Where you from? Here in EU shell is still very well known as well

@@benclimo461 SEA(south east asia)

@@gwot SEA(south east asia)

@@benclimo461 Never seen it in any west europe store but to be honest I only check the CE sticker or maybe I only take brands that don't care about it, don't know.

Worthless safety standards should be killed off.

@@UpstateDS No, they go to a farm upstate.

You mean unsafety standard, right?

I mean, yeah, Ryan's totally right, but bruh, he's on the killing spree

"Safety" standard

I'd agree, but Snell used to be the authority. Always question everything. They are only the authority because the data points to their standard being better right now, but lobotomies used to be a standard because they were better than what came before. Question everything.

Until someone comes along with a better standard and FIM stubbornly sticks to their own formula. Seems like a common occurrence over the history of safety standards lol

@@mmaaddict78 legit, yeah. Standards don't change until someone calls out a different standard is bullshit. It becomes a money-making game eventually. Always starts out great.

@@johnb8440 except that the FIM standard isn’t there because they want to get their stickers onto helmets. Only a few helmets in the world actually are FIM certified. The FIM rating is there because the FIM wants and NEEDS to protect their most important assets… MotoGP riders. The FIM is the motorcycle equivalent of the FIA. They’re the organisers of premier-class motorsport. They don’t make their money from certifying equipment, they get their money from organising championships. Without the riders/drivers those championships are doomed, so they have to protect their riders to the best of their ability in order for them to protect their revenue.

@@johnb8440 except it wasn't really the authority, it seemed so because it was a requirement to enter a track but for long ECE has been considered better by a lot of people (until FIM showed up). Previous F9 videos showed just that, with SNELL being recomended if you wanted to go to a track, otherwise ECE.

Welcome to the club!

Any brand that races on FIM events has to be certified, there are lots of other brands that will follow the new ECE R22-06 .

In the limited space between the outside of the helmet and your head, where do you think the hard surface should be? I still want the exterior to be as hard and as impenetrable as possible , while having the most cushioning possible inside. Is there a part of your head that you would consider to be a safe "crumple zone"? The best improvement I feel has been made through the years and can further be made is in the overall weight of the helmet. Keep the hard shell exterior and soft interior, while reducing inertial load/strain on the neck as much as possible. Other areas I feel should be improved if possible are: outward visibility, hearing ability and ventilation comfort.

The only downside is that you can mess up your helmet when it just slips out of your hand from a 2 feet height and you wouldn't even know by looking at it :(

I'm more of a GIVI guy myself

@@reason2gether The harder the shell, the more likely it is to shatter on impact. A hard shell transmits more energy to the inside. A softer shell absorbes energy by deforming. Like a crumple zone.

Over 100 in the desert, and I'd say you'd be lucky to not be seriously injured even with the best gear.

no that helmet probably saved your life

@@GhostKing6790 You're probably right.

@Huo Shing I vouch for Jon Madden, so you can trust it's important.

Anish, the man behind the edits 🤩

Thank you for pointing out the real crucial value of this video - the journalism, sure the editing is top-notch but what Fort-9 has done is really draw attention to the politics of motorcycle helmets. Sure hope we don't miss this, as we congratulate the videography. Again the adage proves true - do anything well enough and you end up in philosophy[at least in ontology]

With the level the FIM is considering for velocity of impact be glad you don't have one. They are looking at rate of acceleration that is so high it is not a survivable situation and, in turn, will make the helmet transmit more shock because the helmet/liner need to be made harder/stiffer to meet that unsurvivable standard. Dual sport helmets are dealing with rates of acceleration at 1/2-1/3 that of the FIM and done right will have a more flexible giving shell and liner to suit, transmitting less shock to the brain. Go to 10:50 in this video to understand what they are doing kzfaq.info/get/bejne/h9N9lJZjx9-tenU.html And yes I realize the video is about 50% promotion of 6D, but the other 50% is dealing with the standards. Even includes what is good in the DOT standard and missing in others. See 2:55 in the video, understand what is missing from ECE and should be added.