khorne is right. if his lackeys start claiming each others skulls, the skull-claiming performance will sink exponentially really fast. he did the math

The great hypocrisy of the chaos undivided, saying you don't rely on the gods when you clearly rely on all of them.

I think Kharn would win, and apparently, so does Khorne. The fact that Kharn can die and be brought back from glorious combat tells me that Khorne only intervened because Abbadon was at serious risk. Khorne had to send an emergency diplomatic bloodthirster to convince Kharne not to kill Abbadon. If Abbadon had gotten the better if Kharne, he could claim glory in combat as a better warrior... but Khorne knew that wouldn't happen

I think Abaddon wasn’t putting trust in “the Ruinous Powers”, he was putting trust in Khorne, who, despite being evil, comports himself with twisted honor

I guess Kharn didn't know that Abaddon can only lose three wounds per turn before his chaos dads step in and break it up.

Reading Betrayer now. Pity he went traitor, but Kharn, despite the nails, seems like a level headed guy. And like it says in the book, hard to dislike. He's disgusted by the Word Bearers treatment of prisoners, for their penchant for torture of prisoners. He'd rather just kill quickly and not prolong suffering.

Kharn is the chosen of Khorne, 100% That said, Abaddon has the backing of the four. With their spiteful nature I'd imagine that the other three would pour power into Abaddon, if the chosen champion of Khorne were to make a move.

Abandon is unknowingly doing the work of the emperor

Basically like with Sigismund, Abaddon loads the dice in his favour and still only survives because the gods cheat on his behalf.

Shroud of Night had a dope perspective on him. He was like a rampaging Jason X.

Imagine offering blood to the blood god and the blood god just says no.

This would have been a perfect opportunity to showcase Abaddon's diplomatic prowess. Having Khorne forbid the taking of a skull is an questionable way to resolve the conflict say the least. Sounds like the write just wanted to have Kharn fight Abaddon without really thinking too hard about the ramifications

I think Kharn is a heavy contender for the title of "Best melee combatant in the WH40K Galaxy" but it's almost surreal to hear him having conversations. That dude should be screaming in incoherent fury whilst cutting something in half .

It doesn't seem like Abaddon is the "chosen" but more that there is a deal that has been struck. I wouldn't be surprised if Abaddon included immunity from other champions of Chaos. Abaddon clear has an important role to play, and Kharn kind of assumed Abaddon was the reason he was on the red path. This was kind of Kharn's mistake in my opinion.

Abandon isn't the chosen of the chaos gods, he's the chosen of Games Workshop with all the plot armor and retconning of failure that comes with it.

If there was only one person a Chaos God could love, it has to be Kharn.

Honor is one of Khornes things, so of all the gods to make a promise he's probably the only one I would trust to keep it. In addition Kharn is his favorite and his champion, but he can't lead a crusade that will destroy the Imperium Khorne and his brothers (/sister/whatever) are also smart enough to realize Abaddon is probably their only real shot so he kind of needs him alive. If terra falls I don't think he will stop the fight a second time. As a final point it wasn't Abaddon who was told to stop, so I think we know who Khorne would be betting on.

I see it more like... if abbadon dies, then the amount of skulls and blood will drop dramastically since none of the traitor legions can actually plan shit and not kill each other, on the other hand, if abaddon DOES win against Kharn, then he loses his best champion... It's a generals worst nightmare, Your commander and your best most experience warrior are fighting each other.

I wouldn't say he chose Abaddon. He has made a bargain with Abaddon, as well as his brothers of Chaos. He can't back out of that bargain. The one thing I didn't hear mentioned was whether Kharn was forced to serve Abaddon. If he wasn't forced to serve Abaddon then I would say it was a wash. Kharn couldn't take Abaddon's skull but he also wasn't forced to serve him either.

Surely it's Kharn. The guys got a kill counter inside his helmet, for goodness sake!

This is totaly understandable abbadon is only 1 skull from kharn If abbadon is allowed to live and carry on with his war there will be many skulls for kharn to claim I wouldnt count it abbadon having khornez favor jus khorne thinkn of the bigger picture the long march back to terra

With Khorne sure he's not only the God of blood and skulls but also honor I wouldn't be so sure zeentch or slaneesh would be as likely to keep there pact if they thought they may benefit some way in the great game

Khorne literally has to send his demons to break up the fight between Kharne and Abaddon to avoid that Abaddon gets Roflstomped, and yet Abaddon has the gaul to hide behind the demon and whine like a bitch... "Mom says you have to do what I say, waaaaaaaahh!"

I thought for sure you were about to say..... and so Kharn took the bloodthirster's head

Considering that kharn has his own pile of skulls next to the skull throne... I’d say kharn Edit: also to note, kharn has kicked the head of a decapitated ally so that in its dying moments, it could see kharn slaying a bunch of enemies.

Backing by the 4 gods is not much as being the living Avatar of the blood god, it would be better to just use Kharn as a point and shoot weapon to do as he pleased.

Considering the force khorne sent to stop this duel, I think kharn would have won against Abaddon. Both of them are too valuable for khorne to lose but to stop kharn the blood god had to show a significant presence.

Honestly I’m not a huge fan of the direction they took Abbadon. He’s never really seemed like a 5d chess-playing hyper intelligent chosen-one style badass, but more of an over-emotional Skeletoresque duber who stumbles randomly into success, but mostly just gets thwarted. I just kinda thought people obeyed Abbadon out of some might-makes-right fear of him caving your face in as opposed to him being some inspiring commander. I mean, mostly just seems to lose his temper all the time.

The way you stretched the "daddy loves me more than you" dialogue of two schoolgirls is a masterpiece.

GW has to mess with the best chaos character. 'Oh how can we make baby abaddon look tough? Retcon! Oh, and let's demean Kharn."

Khorne, the gods give Abaddon all their gifts so they can equally control him, remember Kharn is a better fighter in the CSM codex in 2nd edition he had a higher WS.

Khan would slay ababby if all that plot armor wasnt on ababby, amazed he can move with all of it bolted on

So, all I hear is Abaddon needed to be saved by Khrone himself from the ass whooping he would have gotten otherwise. Because, why would he needed to intervene if Abaddon would have won anyways.

I tire of the Abaddon plot armour. His character isn't too desimilar from Lucius. They both fail constantly but continue to exist because apparently they're chosen. Funnily enough the chaos gods never seem to reward failure in their greatest demons.

I don’t think he leaned on favor to flex his usage of its power but I believe it was a tactical assertion. Like the enemy of my enemy is my friend. Using his adjacency to power as a means of avoiding conflict. A true lunar wolf.

Kharn my favourite character and always will be but I truly believe that kharn would slap fake horus

Since Malcador and Big E knew it was inevitable, and they could, to some extent, manipulate who fell, I wonder if they pushed their least desired choices onto the chaos gods to hamper them.

We definitely had different interpretations of the Bloodthirster's interjection. I didn't consider it to be that Abbadon is of higher value than Kharn, but that Khorne knew or at least suspected that Kharn would win and he has need of them both. We also know that Kharn can return from the dead, a gift we've not seen Abbadon flaunt.

Lmfao the bpoosthirster that stopped the fight must be like "holy shit that's the weirdest thing I've ever done"

Lozepath was decapitated by Kharn, Blood for the Blood God, and took on Abaddon after going from a void ship battle taking on astartes to directly taking on planetary forces and a living saint. Even after all that non stop fighting Abaddon was only able to take Kharn to a draw...

I thought that book was the red path? In any case, it's worth noting how many severe injuries kharn had sustained, I swear I remember lozepath stabbing him clean through the chest mid fight and blasting him into was before kharn got the win, he also took out a chaplain dreadnought just before that, as well as God know how many loyalists.. If he was fresh, Abaddon would be just another skull for the skull throne.

YES! Thank U Brother Thank U Soo Much for This.

I always love another entry into the codex of wolf lord rho.

Sorry but it's not that Abbadon have Khorne's favor. It's more of a political move because he is the Warmaster of Chaos undivided. You can't just kill him off like that. He would suddenly face a 3 against 1 situation. Even as much as Khorne would like to see it happen. That's why the blood thirster had to throw Kharn that bone of a compliment.

Deamon angron tried to end kharn simply because the blood God showed him what kharn would become angron choose to try and kill him so he could be khornes favorite champion so I'm going with kharn

Kharn is like khornes dedicated ho while abaddon is getting trained by all 3 chaos gods

... How is it Angron and Skarbrand not in the conversation ? But lovely video as always

Great video Rho. I think Abaddon would dispatch Kharn... he's been killed a number of times before right? Abaddon not so... Also Abaddon would be used to many a rodeo like this with top tier champions to hold his power.

Here's my take. Abaddon doesn't want to fight Kharn because he knows he will win and the war effort will be set back. Sure Kharn will be reborn, but can Abaddon afford to wait and/or lose track of one of his best weapons?

that's just Abaddon's plot armor.

I don't like this. I'm fine with Khorne telling him that Abaddon is off limits, but Khorne should have told Abaddon that Kharne wasn't his to command. That his champion is commanded by one master.

Admittedly I haven’t read the book so I’m missing context, but from your description it sounds like khorne didn’t want to lose either champion and they responded to Kharne first. I’d be curious if the same would have happened if Abby wanted to kill kharn.

Khorne is also the God of War and Marshall skills. Abaddon does this at a larger scale then Kharn’s skull calming

Of all the Chaos Gods, I think Khorne is the only one you could truly trust to hold to a pact. He was at one point (technically still is) a god of honour, even now corrupted and twisted as he is, he'll still hold to a pact. Tzeench we know will twist any and all promises, Slannesh too. Papa Nurgle will keep to a promise, though you'll come out with some extra "gifts" at the end.

Abaddon would take the win in most caseses. Khorne is following a deal made most likely knowing what the Warmaster is doing will give him more. It could also be a case of Khorne choosing to go against Abaddon might get the other 3 Gods against him since he is to Khorne as much as he is to the others. Kharn however is his Chosen Mortal for 40K, where he goes it is Khorne's essence being spread.

I dont buy the idea of Korn favoring abadon more. He just said dont kill my other guy. That isnt korn giving abadon enough power to overtake karn. And dont forget, he had to tell karn to not kill him. Not tell abadon to be patient. As in, karn would've won. That's how much more favor one god juiced into him compared to the amount in the undivided champ.

Whinebaddon the Bedwetter got saved by the bell.

I've just had an odd thought, what happens to the skull of the living saint lying on the skull throne when they come back to serve one more time ? Do they get a new skull or is it the same one took from korne's sitting place ?

I think Kharn would beat abbadon in a fight, without the plot Armour of the writers, Kharn was perhaps one of the best legion fighters, along with sigy and sevatar, he liked to duel his bro Argel when he was one of the most powerful of his possessed brothers. All through the books of the HH you are shown how fast and cunning Kharn was and that his warrior instincts were insane, his fight against Erebus after he killed his bro was one of the best duels I have read. Abbadon is described a lot as a bull of a man and more like a thug through most of his passages. So to me Kharn has the upper hand in the combat.

This speaks volumes to kharns wholesale bad assery. Abaddon shows up with ships and all those warriors and then khorne shows up with all those demons. I personally think kharn would win.

The chaos gods don’t love anyone. They are cold opportunists. They would quickly discard Kharn or Abaddon if a better option came along. Look how quickly they abandoned Horus just before the emperor nuked him. The only thing they truly love is “chaos” itself and causing as much of it as possible.

But can a saint of the emperor be reborn if their skull is sacrificed to Korne? Does it in someway weaken them?

Rather than Abbadon being favoured over Kharn, perhaps it's more that the struggle for Abbadons soul is just one more front in the great game? If Kharn wins then all Khorne gains is yet one more skull amongst the countless he has, but if in a moment of struggle against a greater foe Abbadon gives in to Khornes influences then the Blood God gains a mighty soul. It would be unlikely that Abbadon would side with Khorne in a battle against his own champion so there's nothing to gain from a contest.

Just because Khorne doesn't want Kharn to kill Abaddon, that doesn't mean that he favors Abaddon most. I think the logic you took to reach that conclusion is a little flawed. If I had to guess, I'd say that Abaddon is necessary to Khorne's desired outcome, but Khorne still favors Kharn more.

I would have to say Sevitar is one of the best duelists as well seeing as how he fought on equal ground as Sigusimund. Also Abbadon only killed Sigiusmund because he had an op demon blade and was able to survive being impaled by a black sword because he had all the gods empowering him.

If they were to dual, I believe Khorne would actually withdraw blessings from Abaddon and funnel that towards Kharn. Abaddon clearly has the wargear advantage, I believe before either was tainted/blessed by chaos Kharn was the superior dualist. So I give the experience/skill to Kharn. The only reason I think Abaddon wins is because he has more sponsors and wargear. I do think this dual would be closer than most think because Khorne could actually depower Abaddon to an extent and perhaps grant Kharn an additional boon as he is prob the only chaos god who does enjoy a fair fight to some extent. And knowing the other 3's blessings would be against his own, I Khorne would try and close that blessing gap as much as he could so that his champion can make it a wargear/skill battle as much as possible.

Abaddon is the undivided chosen and Kharn is the champion of Khorne

If you have any reason to think getting into melee with Kharn is a good idea, you have been listening to zeentch too much.

Another excellent Wolf Lord Rho video. To be honest, in all of Warhammer40k, Angron and Kharn stories are over done. They are just versions of the same character and the same story. Both of which are overworked to include nuances and details that actually don't add any complexity or ambiguity to their stories. Bote are just rage demons with insatiable bloodlust betrayed by their "father" and the depravity of their circumstances. I would happily trade every Angron and Kharn story for stories of Corvis Corax or Lionel Johnson.

Plot twist, the chosen of Khorne is a Wulfen Logan Grimnar.

Sounds like failbadon with his deamon sword talon of horus, all his guard still had to get someone bigger to save him from Kharn...in just power armour. After has been fighting for how long? Khorne is probably just honoring his pact till he can send Kharn after him later

I think I remember that when Horus was dying in the dirt, Abaddon openly wept, like a bitch. Kharn is the most badass guy in 40k.

First one of you lore guys that takes AI and uses it to turn your soft slow (sorry its killing me) voices and turns them into space marine voices will win the war.

I think Kharn would win. However, it will not be a victory for Khorne for he will lose face to the other 3 Chaos god who supports Abaddon and his standing with the other primarchs who worship Chaos undivided. And who would say Abaddon will remain dead, it is easy for one of the other 3 Chaos god to convert him to a demon prince, and that's one more enemy for Khorne if that happened.

They both have his favor. Khorne was just thinking about the bigger picture for once. They had something to do right? A Black Crusade or something. Abaddon is stronger but Khorne doesn’t like him more. He hasn’t given his everything over to live breathe eat and sleep the tenets of the Blood God. Kharn is by far his favorite but Abaddon might be empowered more simply because the task he must accomplish is much bigger.

If chaos would stop fighting each other, the galaxy would be in big trouble.

I'd say Khorne wants the betrayer close by, should the need arise to dispose of Abaddon. After all the warmaster owes no true allegiance to any but himself. I'd be suprised if Slaanesh, Tzeentch or/and Nurgle are of simmilar mind. Each wanting a fail safe incase Abaddon proves to be more trouble than his worth. Maychance that if only for a short moment of time, those four champions, bearing the title of chosen by their allotted patreon. Maybe enough to bring the warmaster down, not as allies, but as hated warriors with a common even more hated foe.

Oof! That time when Kharn got friendzoned by Khorne :o

if i remeber right it is even written in the betrayer that kharn is the choosen one by khorn. he is even the one who gives the most blood and skulls to khorne as far as i know. and he is so much better portraied so much better then abbadon. as far as ive read abbadon comes across as just someone with so few facets and with such a huge "daddy issue", whilst kharn has alot more depth to his charater even thoe he is supposed to be this kickass angry world eater who kills soo many. and even if khorne told kharn to not claim abbadons head, i think that he just basiclly said not now seanse we have a plan to do something first, i think abbadon is just a pawn in the gods great big plan to be tossed aside efter. but that is just my guess. but with that said i have to say that there is so many books that i havent read yet, so i can be wrong. but with all this said i truly belive that kharn is khorns favorite homie

Young sigismund would killed abaddon

Wow 👍

Abbadon isnt Khorne's chosen, he has a bargain with Khorne, that being said. Kharn cant just kill Abbadon because Khorne needs him alive, sending the force Khorne did was merely to tell off Kharn, and Abbadons reaction kinda shows that. Its like the reaction of the annoying younger brother hiding behind dad.

That was a bad decision on GW part for bringing up that question but in my mind if Abbadon tried to punk Karn it would soon end in Karn victory or am I wrong that abandon lost many duels and only live by the grace of Dumb plot armor and Karn fought the best at his best and said I like you to much to actually fight you.

*This is no suprice , Khorne is focusing on the endgame , and it has been stated before , that Abaddone, is the ONLY one that can perhaps do this. Kharn maybe a bit miffed about this sudden demand that he is NOT alowed to take Abaddone's Head , but he isnt stupid , he wil axcept Khorn's desission.*

This is what is referred to as a narrative copout

Abbadon won't be the chosen champion of Khorne and that's not debatable in my opinion. Abbadon refuses to give himself over to a God of chaos and sees what occurred with the demon Primarchs as a display of weakness and in particular despises the mutations of those who give in to Chaos fully.

Also, i'd like to point out, if Kharn stood up to him that well WITHOUT THE BLOODGODS FAVOR, then uh... if the war ended and Kharn had the full support of his god, yeah, Abaddon would be screwed.

Abadons feat of killing sigismund, is the equivilant of braging about deafeating current mike tyson, sure he is still a beast but they are no longer at their best. Unlike kharn who faced him at sigis strongest twice.

You forgot to mention that when the Bloodthirster arrived, it wasn't Abaddon that got smacked out of the death-lock, it was Kharn. Almost as if our red boi would've won otherwise.

Abby says something- Kharn smacks the dogshit out of him. End of story

U dont send a bodyguard greater deamon without thinking that Abadon needed it

Khorn forbids Kharn to take the Warmasters skull. I think, that is a very straight forward resolution of this conflict and if I were Abaddon, I would shit my pants now. Khorne knows, Kharn would take the Skull, if he were allowed to. Otherwise he could had Abaddon assert his own dominance, instead of saving his ass by the referee.

Good on Abaddon, wouldn't have met Kharn with any less amount of firepower. Otherwise I'm in orbit, with planet breaking weaponry. Overkill? It's Kharn, not going to take any chances.

I think we need to get comfortable with the idea that the Chaos Gods all operate their own polycules 🤣

Since the Black Legion is made up Marines from all different legions and chapters, how does their geneseed work?

I think that it is more along the lines of not taking his skull..... yet. The blood God will probably send his champion immediately after The warmaster is useless

And Khârn probably looked right at Abaddon and said " YOU DIDN'T BRING ENOUGH" And I AGREE WITH LORD RHO HERE...IT'S TIME TO START A WORLD EATERS ARMY METHINKS😈👹⛓️🩸💀🪓⛓️🩸💀⚔️🩸⛓️💀🗡👹⛓️🛡🛡⛓️🛡🤘🏻🩸🤘🏻⛓️🤘🏻🩸🤘🏻☠️🪓⛓️🗡⚔️

"Uh... Hello... My name is Ned. I work for "The Imperial All Branches Office of Troop Deployments". I mobilize Imperial guard, Scion Tempetus, Sisters of Battle, Even Astartes, And occasionally Sisters of Silence and even Custodes. I am very good at my job. Over 90% of my deployments result in victory for the Imperium. They also result in no less than 1 million dead each time, all total, all sides. I think my record is over 1 billion dead in under 12 hours. My wife was so proud of me for that she fought population control for days so we could birth new life for the Imperium. A new skull for the skull throne. One day, I got the chance to see some combat statistics and I am actually responsible for more deaths than any champion of [that one Choatic overfiend]. So one day I declared my work for [that Choatic overfiend]. I was called Corrupted by the Ruinous Powers by the Inquisition. The Inquisitor was a nice lady. She yelled with such a good clear melodic voice that carried really well in a open space. I bet she sings quite often. But because my deployments won and they said I had no real idea what I was talking about concerning Choas, I was acquitted of the charges. I will be back at work in a few hours, once the strategy department has a new lump of space rock to throw more skulls for the skull throne at. I hear it will be Green Meanies this time... I wonder if anyone will say anything if I start wearing Blood red and brass to work from now on. The Emperor, God bless his tortured soul, don't much mind so long as we crush his enemies and [that Choatic overfiend] don't care so long as he gets his blood and skulls."

Bruh he fought siggy at his weakest he would have lost back in siggys prime

Can kharn now turn away from khorn now that he feels betrayed like he did the imperium ???