Thanks Mr. Busta Nut!

Sounds like you are on the right track. As long as everything smelled okay when you made your 1/16 tsp k Mets addition, then I wouldn't worry too much. Make sure that everything is topped up completely though since you are relatively vulnerable. If using carboys, top up to the skinny part of the neck. Use a store bought wine if you need to. You don't need to worry about the geranium. That is only with the potassium sorbate. It is very common to add potassium metabisulfite before malolactic fermentation (right when you get the grapes). It generally very low or gone by the time primary fermentation is over but the co2 and tannin will provide some protection. After malo is when you should really hit it again with SO2 but a small addition in the middle won't hurt if you were concerned.

Yes, you could rack it. You are probably going to want to squeeze or press out as much as you can from the cherry skins when you do.

I don't use them anymore just because they are such a pain to crush up. They are just tablet form of either sodium metabisulfite or potassium metabisulfite depending on which ones you buy so there really isn't any difference other than the process of adding them. One tablet at 550mg will add about 13.5ppm of SO2 to 6 gallons if potassium metabisulfite and a little more if sodium metabisulfite since it is 67% SO2 vs 57%. Since you will oxidize a little SO2 out during any wine process that exposes to air, the 10ppm calculation is pretty good for a ballpark. If you end up making more wine, you can switch over to powder and a scale to save a little hassle. Not knowing your pH or current SO2 level, id say to use 5 or 6 tablets on 6 gallons to be safe. As long as you are below the sensory threshold, then it is better to have a little extra than not enough.

The Home Winemaking Channel wow super helpful and detailed! I am always scared to use potassium metabisulfate, but have read multiple places to use 1 campden table per gallon. Thanks a ton for verifying that I will not be over doing it. Can you add it the night before you bottle or is better to do it further in advance?

Potassium Metabisulfite and Sodium Metabisulfite will both achieve the same result in that they are both adding sulfur dioxide to the wine. The difference is that one will leave behind residual potassium and the other will leave behind residual sodium. The amounts are of sodium or potassium are REALLY low, so it probably doesn't really make a difference either way. Potassium will usually drop out as Potassium Bitartrate when it combines with acids in the wine. Sodium will probably stay around. If you are already struggling with high pH in the wine, you could maybe lean towards the S-Meta, to preserve as much acid as possible, but the difference would likely not be measurable. If using S-Meta, keep in mind that it is 67% sulfite by weight, vs 57% for k-meta which will slightly change your calculations. To prevent re-fermentation you would use K-Sorbate (Potassium Sorbate/Sorbic Acid). Neither K-Meta, S-Meta, or K-Sorbate will actually stop an active fermentation unless the dose is extremely high. But the sorbate will coat the yeast cells, and inhibit the ability of the cell to bud and multiply. So the wine needs to be crystal clear, with a very low yeast cell count for the K-Sorbate to be effective. It is very effective though when done right. As for the boiling/pasteurizing, it I normally wouldn't recommend it for most wines, as it can convert the fresh fruity aromas and flavors into more cooked flavors. With something like apple wine, that is a route that can work well. You could also do it on something like a concord if you are trying to replicate the cooked taste of Manischewitz/Kosher wine, but I would still sulfite a bit before going in bottle.

@@TheHomeWinemakingChannel fascinating. Thank you.

Hey any luck did this ever fix. Now that it's been a year do you have advice? I am on my first batch and am getting a smell. Read the yeast might be over working and to add an extra tsp of nutrient that helped maybe a little but still got the smell. I am on 3rd day of fermentation.

Hi! I would probably target a starting pH in the 3.1-3.3 range and finish around 3.2-3.4 for something like that, and 20-22 degrees brix which would probably be around 1.080 to 1.090 sg ballpark but check me in that conversion... I like to work in brix which is percent sugar by weight and makes the math a little easier for adjustments and alcohol calculations. I would specifically try to prevent malolactic fermentation with a pomegranate or it could get weirdly buttery. Then you can choose if you want to back sweeten or keep it as a crisp dry wine.

@@TheHomeWinemakingChannel thank u v much ,how to prevent ML FERMENTATION in an easy way.

Keep the wine appropriately sulfited with potassium metabisulfite once fermentation is complete. I have an article on my website smartwinemaking.com going into the details about managing sulfites. If you had a pH of about 3.3, you would want to maintain about 25-30ppm of free SO2. Since it readily binds and oxidizes, you may want to over shoot a bit and target more like 40ppm.

I think so. The yeast is really going to town on the sugars in the juice and producing CO2, just like they would with bread. I have the same thing happening now on my first batch.

I read quite a bit info on EC Kraus web pages and hated the idea of adding sulfites as much as they indicated. I think it was every 3 months... Bah. I do pretty good without using any K-META after Fermentation. Usually I use juice. Now last year I made my first attempt at pumpkin wine. I saved fresh pumpkin after Halloween, in a bucket I let the pumpkin mellow at 76f for 2 weeks in water with a ton of sugar. You know precess, bottle, got to a year later. Was gonna show it off at Thanksgiving. It gave me the midnight shits 2 nights in a row. I think I will save it to use on the lawn for dead spots where my dog has peed. Keep the good info coming!

It is going to be hard to compare a Shiraz from juice to a store bought Shiraz made from grapes. Since you aren't getting the seed and skin contact time with the juice, you can end up with a thin, wimpy wine. The flash extraction that they use to get the color can also add cooked flavors, plus who knows how bad those grapes look going in. I think they reserve the unacceptable grapes for the juice a lot of times. Sometimes the juice can start bubbling before it gets to you also, and who knows what yeast or bacteria is causing the bubbling. Could get lucky but it could also be a less desirable strain. If you are going to make red wine from fresh juice and it is being trucked any distance before it gets to you, I would suggest getting a nicer wine kit instead. With the kit, you are starting from a clean slate and you can do some tricks to pump it up like adding a little less water. But eventually I would recommend making your reds from grapes and your white wines from fresh juice if you can.

Also, not sure what the bitter taste is. Could be a biproduct of the acid adjustment that they made to the juice. If the grapes were way off they may have added a lot of potassium bicarbonate, resulting in excess potassium. Or if they were off in the other direction they may have added citric acid since it is cheaper than tartaric acid... But should never be added to a red wine.

@@TheHomeWinemakingChannel Thanks for your expert opinion.

Yep! And you can treat it pretty much the same. If a hard cider/apple wine goes through mololactic fermentation, it is bad news. Since most of the acid is malic, you can be left with a cider that smells like old milk. And worse yet, it can start a chain reaction. As the pH climbs from all that malic acid converting to lactic acid, it becomes very vulnerable to bacterial spoilage and oxidation. So you could then have old milk with a hint of nail polish remover... Not good!

Is it bottled yet? It is probably just a little fizzy still from all the CO2 released during fermentation. It can be degassed before bottling. If it is bottled it likely had a little residual sugar and was not stabilized properly so has fermented in bottle a bit. It could also have undergone malolactic fermentation in the bottle if it had a little remaining malic acid and inadequate SO2. If it is just the slightest bit of CO2, it can occur from bottling too cold for a wine intended to be served at a warmer temp. A cold liquid will hold a lot more CO2 which will release as it warms up.

@@TheHomeWinemakingChannel Thanks for the reply. Really liking your channel by the way. It is still in the carboy and has been bulk aging for about 10 months and has been racked 4 time's. Do you think I should degas? Thanks

You are welcome! I would suggest checking out my video about back sweetening a wine. A mango wine has very little tannin to contribute to the mouth feel of the wine so you might notice the alcohol a bit more and it just might not present itself well dry. 1.005 is not completely dry but it still may need a big more sugar. If you are not accustomed to drinking wine, the alcohol may take a bit to get used to. The other thing it could be is too much acid, which can cause an acid reflux line sensation. If you can get your hands on a pH meter, check the pH. Anything below about 3.0 can be a little aggressive. A little potassium bicarbonate or calcium carbonate can reduce the acid to an acceptable level.

@@TheHomeWinemakingChannel Thank You for the prompt response. I added about 4oz. of resins and 2 tablespoons of black tea extract for the reason that mangoes are very low on tannins. Still, I don't see much mouthfeel or astringency. Can I use 1/4 or 1/2 teaspoon of Acacia catechu powder (high on tannin) now after fermentation and third rack? How long, after wine tannin and before bottling should I let it sit to get some mouthfeel? The wine came out very light in color, just like white wine or more like champagne in color. I will check the acidity tomorrow. I have watched all your videos; they are all great. I am not inclined to back sweeten as it already a bit tart and decently sweet to my taste, but would not mind to back sweeten if it can help to reduce the burning sensation in the throat.

@@TheHomeWinemakingChannel Can you make a detailed video on wine tasting for beginners?

Methanol is not really a problem with wine fermentations. Though some is produced naturally as any seeds or stems ferment in the must, it is such a miniscule amount. Less than 250 parts per million vs 130,000 parts per million give or take for ethanol. Methanol is more of an issue in distillations where all of the methanol could be concentrated into first bottles that come off of the still (the "heads").

To stop a fermentation, the best way is to "cold crash" the wine, or chill it to about 30F. This will stall the yeast out, and allow it to settle to the bottom. Once settled, you can rack the wine off or the yeast and add potassium metabisulfite and potassium sorbate to prevent any rogue yeast from multiplying and restarting a fermentation.

Sir potassium metabisulphite can Kill wild yeast.

@@shyambiswas7352 yes it can kill most strains of wild yeast if dosed high enough. Many wine yeasts (also found in the wild) have a very high tolerance to SO2. If the fermentation is established it would be very difficult to stop with SO2 alone. You are more likely to stress the yeast and cause hydrogen sulfide formation than to totally stop it. If chilled though, the yeast will go dormant and fall out of suspension, allowing you to separate the wine from most of the yeast. With a low cell count, potassium sorbate is your friend, as it will coat the cells and prevent budding/multiplication. When using Sorbate you should always sulfite accordingly to prevent any malolactic fermentation from kicking off. If malolactic fermentation occurs in the presence of potassium sorbate (Sorbic acid), it will create an undesirable geranium smell.

Sir potassium metabisulphite can kill wild yeast from dough /batter. If the dough/batter is fermented with dry Instant yeast.

Sir .Thank you very much for the information .

Depending on the additives it will probably be fine. You can also double the wine to bring it back to normal. If it is sulfite it will gradually react and oxidize which will reduce the levels. Unless you are a more experienced taster you will likely not percieve any difference at 2x the SO2.