Got a really good pointer on how to get Logitech battery monitoring working! Much love. Thanks MissingClara twitter.com/MissingClara/status/1463290819885031424?s=19

"We don't know what fixed it, but that's cool, I guess" - My IT career in a nutshell

Linus consciously chose that font on his desktop. Let that fact sink in for a moment.

"magically fixed itself and we don't know why or how" seems to be a constant theme with this episode

6:10 "But I'm frustrated by the condescending tone" That's stack overflow for you bro. They don't want newbies to exist

"the control panel looks like it's from 10 years ago." You'd think so! But it's actually looked like that for the 13 past years I've been using it! So it's even older!

As someone who uses Linux as their daily driver and for gaming, I wanna say that I appreciate the impact your videos have had. Your two Linux videos have created a spark in the community to fix many issues that help with user friendliness (including a patch that was applied to apt as a direct result of your issues in the first video). Many of them have been relatively minor changes that simply never got changed because there never was a need. A Windows transplant was expected to essentially rice their setup and solve issues on their own and through questions, not have things just work out of the box. Although a bit controversial in the community, the videos have created important discussion and seem to be making a positive difference overall, so I thank you for continuing to give it a shot. I'm sorry it's been so problematic, but I hope you'll be able to smooth out all of your issues soon!

As a developer this is hilarious. Many things we do in Linux, we forget aren’t trivial.

Man, I really miss seeing Luke in normal LTT videos. His cadence is so calming

I love how Luke can literally buy any matching monitor set he wants but still keeps it real with mixed model triple monitor setup.

As a long time Linux user, it's really nice to see it be used from such a new-user perspective. Every thing they encountered I have too at some point, I just don't notice anymore. Really need to watch out how much I try to sell Linux to people. Awesome video!

I really like this critical take on linux for end users. I personally use linux as my daily driver for almost everything, and saying the switch from windows to linux was painless would be a lie. there are speedbumps with linux, no matter what way you slice it. be it ubuntu or arch there is still setup involved that wouldn't be required normally with windows. Edit: Thanks for the likes. Glad I could bring up some conversation

Just as a note, any version of software that's labelled "Canary" can usually be thought of as an unstable beta release. It's using canary in the coalmine imagery to indicate that. It's not obvious, and one of the many products of Linux naming culture heavily influenced by decades of engineer dominant input.

I think this is my favorite series on LTT in, well, forever. Would also like an 'Anthony Reacts' follow-up at some point.

When done, I'd like to see a version with Anthony, starting from scratch. I'd like to see the difference.

I like how things randomly fixing themselves is an ongoing thing with these two, and as a linux user, I can say that this is absolutely my experience as well.

The "doesn't work/leave it broken/now it works" cycle has been about half my experience with Linux. The other half is "does work/leave it working/ now it's broken".

I hope we get an Anthony Reacts to this series once it's finished, I'd love to hear his comments on this all

This is the "vendors treat Linux as second class citizen, if they are even aware that it exist" chapter. Sadly, the community can't pick up the vacuum left by companies with 1 man projects (like the GoXLR) when they don't offer support or when the software is closed sources (Teams/Discord).

Screensharing is a mess for experienced users as well on Linux, as its going through a transition from X11 to Wayland, Wayland is using Pipewire and proprietary NVidia drivers don't support this as well. So even as someone who daily drives Linux, I emphasize with the difficulties that Luc and Linus are going through here.

“An idiot admires complexity, a genius admires simplicity, a physicist tries to make it simple, for an idiot anything the more complicated it is the more he will admire it, if you make something so clusterfucked he can't understand it he's gonna think you're a god cause you made it so complicated nobody can understand it. That's how they write journals in Academics, they try to make it so complicated people think you're a genius” ― Terry Davis, Creator of Temple OS

For the record, the reason you got an HTML file when trying to download the script is the the link takes you to a web page with a preview of the file. Then you can click "Raw" at the top to get to the actual file.

For those having issues like Luke had with OBS, OBS looked like it was set to 44 khz, sample rate, while iirc pulseaudio (the sound system linux mint uses) tends to run at 48. The conversion tends to mess with the sound making recordings sound "weird". ;) Maybe OBS picked up the proper sampling rate after restarting it.

Mac is like driving an automatic. Windows is like driving stick shift. Linux is like building the car while you drive it.

Disclaimer I'm a developer/software engineer, and I love linux for what it does for me and what it allows me to do. However, I do agree with a lot of the experiences that Linus, and Luke have found. There are some experiences that are buggy and annoying on Linux. The Desktop experience has gotten a lot better over the years, but still has a long way to go. While I am capable of doing a lot in the command line, some things are better done in a GUI, and even as a developer I do appreciate when things just work. Although as a developer and some of the horrors I've seen it's a miracle any of it ever works, although I digress. I do appreciate that you Linus and Luke have done this challenge, and published the issues you've found, as you have a louder voice, which can effect change to make things better. I hope that in the future you periodically take on the challenge again because I think it's good for the community. While Linux's varied distributions are a double-edged sword, it is that power that give it the potential to be a powerful tool for a lot of different uses. While I'm not a hardcore gamer, I do think that Linux definitely has the potential to eventually become a contender, if it has the right backers, and irons out the issues you encountered. I would never expect a normy to use GitHub(web GUI for Git)/Git(command line based, although there are GUis), it is a wonderful powerful developer version control tooll, with a bit of a learnig curve. That said the right click save as, and get HTML crap is a browser thing, that can be an annoyance and the workarround aways requires a few more clicks to get to the raw text, that you can then download/copy. What might be a better way to do things in these cases whould be to click the button to download the git repo as a zip file, and copy the file out of that, as you probably don't care about the history of the files, that you would get from using git to clone the repo locally. The old adage "Have you tried turning it off and on again." While is less applicable to Linux, and there are usually ways to work around it, there are still places where it does apply. One thing I always do is enable Ctrl+Alt+Backspace to restart the GUI because on rare occasion I have had Linux freeze on me(usually my own fault tinkering to get something to work). Another case that I've found this applies for me is with my work's VPN, which has iffy Linux support, and every once in a while it decides to not connect. Ive tried killing and restarting the process to no avail, although restarting the whole darn computer does works. So with that VPN something gets in a stuck state, but I have yet to discover what or how to reset it. At this point I just see it at the tax my employer pays for choosing that VPN. A note to Luke I unfortunately have to use Teams for work, we were just switch from Google chat(Gchat) much to my chagrin. The app is absolute buggy trash, and I don't use it. The web interface is better and more stable and seems to do what I need it to, just in several more clicks, and in a more cluttered UI than Gchat. I have used slack in the recent past and found it better for chat, but video features are a little limited and require the app which is a resource hog. For video chat/screen sharing the best that I've used on Linux is Zoom, although Gchat was decent as well. Although I've found that all video chat/desktop share has, and probabbly always will have hicups no matter what OS/app combination I use.

"Don't expect to get a low battery warning for your mouse" I think this depends on the DE, in Cinnamon I can view the battery status for any connected device and it will give me a warning when my G603's battery is low.

9:57 the reason that desktop notifications weren't working, was because Discord Streamer mode was enabled which disables notifications (Streamer mode automatically turns on when you open obs and turns off when you close obs)

Im a linux user and dont disagree with anything here. There needs to be more user testing like this and more calling out compaies who dont support their products on it, or at least put a big windows only sticker on their products.

I am a long time linux user and am happy that you are doing this as a proper effort. Thank you for being realistic.

I would love to have this concept with Anthony in parallel, just to see how he would addresses the issues Linus and Luke ran into

Linus on Pop os: "I shouldn't have to use the terminal to install software" Linus on Manjaro: *Ignores app store and goes straight to terminal*

I really like this series and I hope it continues to bring positive change to Linux. That being said, I will remain a dual boot user for the time being.

"I've heard you don't have to turn things off and on again on linux" Usually true unless it's audio or networking related, which deserve a special place in hell

What I hear is: when a company invests commercial time into making theirs or other's products work better on a platform, the user experience is better. When it's actively ignored, the user experience is terrible. With the amount of time Valve has invested in Proton (on top of the enormous effort the community has invested in wine), I can see why the "what games will work?" went surprisingly well.

While a lot has to be said about defaults on Linux, most of the issues basically boil down to "Companies don't give a crap about the experience on Linux". The open source community has to fill in what companies don't do for their own products and that's without specifications, documentation or any sort of help. It's no wonder the final experience isn't great.

As a person who uses linux, this was very fun to watch, especially when messing around with the system😁

9:26 Canary is one of the public beta versions. It could be unstable sometimes, but it works

FINALLY! The only problem I have with these episodes are they are too short!

A lot of the issues you had would be solved if those companies supported Linux properly, but they won't, because there isn't enough customers on Linux for them to warrant that. And people won't switch *to* Linux to bolster the numbers, because their peripherals don't work, creating a perpetual cycle of torment.

Really love these Linux episodes. You are touching on some very important issues which I hope is seen by the right people.

Windows "you must reboot to complete the installation". LOL

what i've learned so far: - luke's more considerate approach + mint seems to be working out better for him - linus' frustrations reflect both "enough to be dangerous" techies and overdetermined casuals and provide important feedback on major issues (even if many are re: documentation and community attitude) - the 2nd class citizen catch22 is still a problem to this day

9:23 Canary is used to describe software that is the super new version that is basically the released version that regular citizens use if they want to be a QA. Like Android Studio has a regular, a beta and then a canary. Canary versions aren't really ready for release while beta versions are almost ready and might just need a few bug fixes.

Why didn't KZfaq put this video in my subscription box didn't even know part 2 came out until part 3 showed up

"The control panel looks like it is from 10 years ago" 😅 Dawg, it looked the same some 20yrs ago! 🤔 🤣

I'm really greatful that linus had that "how do I run a .sh file" moment, because while it's incredibly simple once you learn how to do it, many forget that it's a skill you have to learn at some point, and those really add up over time. And if Linus, who is really is well versed in tech, didn't know how to do it right out of the get go, it is clearly not "common knowlage" as I often see posted online. Yes, you eventually get used to googling something, running into a stack overflow post that leads into a github page, downloading a script and running it, but every single one of those steps require you getting used to them, reading through lingo and trusting a random stranger on the internet. If there's anything you taught your grandparents when they started using a PC was that you are not supposed to do that: you don't download and run random files that you get on the first search result.

Video idea: Let Anthony comment on all the problems they encountered in a follow up video

There are more linux forks right now than there will ever be atoms in the entire universe.

The extensions are also used as hints for the Operating System, but it requires you to have "execute permissions" on a file before you are allowed to run it.

My god. Been using exclusively linux since 2007. I take some things for granted The problems they encountered should be like a guide for all Linux devs. We need to solve those. Its super easy to do!!!!!

The reaction videos from the Linux community on Part 1 were surprisingly nice and polite

Hey Luke. Your weird deep voice problem I think is probably a sample rate mismatch. It happens to me often when I have my audio interface at 48KHz and the OS wants to run in 44.1Khz. That's just enough of a lower sample rate to transform your voice a bit deeper without going into weird audio filter territory. Unfortunately this isn't exclusively a Linux issue, but mostly those of us who are working in the pro-Audio space and dealing with Consumer-Audio hardware and software. And in my experience, I often have to restart OBS-Studio even in Windows when I make big changes to my audio setup. OBS is just plain crappy when it comes to audio integration if you aren't using some out of the box, built-for-purpose streaming hardware, like a USB mic or go-XLR. When I started streaming I didn't buy that stuff because I had the real deal, being an Audio Engineer, But OBS doesn't even support ASIO in Windows. Not saying I"m contradicting the quagmire it is to get this stuff working on Linux, but it's a broader problem than Windows vs. Linux. I think that was the issue in any case.

can you get someone like anthony at the end (in its own section) to explain what went wrong and how to fix it it would really help new people moving to linux.

Fortunately and unfortunately, all of these problems seem to be almost entirely not inherent to linux, but inherent to a lack of platform support. A lack of support leads to less people using said platform and then less of an interest in supporting the platform. A catch 22 that I don't know if linux can pull itself out of.

To that font I say: "My eyes, my eyeees"

As someone who has started daily driving Linux (for work education being in IT and out of curiosity) I can say that the learning curve is definitely steep and the "help" is very here and there. BUT after something comes together and just works it's awesome. I don't think it's for everyone but it can be worth the hassle, if you are into tourturing yourself until you learn all the ropes to be a Linux Master.

6:55 This was a hilariously bad use of the github interface. The correct way would be clicking the file normally to open it inside github and then click the "Raw" button to get the file without any of the html around. But I do agree that it's not a super intuitive UI for people not familiar with github. Good video though.

Linus, I noticed on Discord you were in streaming mode as indicated on the top bar of the discord window, I also encountered the notificaiton problem, while on windows, it turns out Streamer mode on Discord disable notificaitons to not interupt your stream. Hope that helps.

Spending hours trying to fix something on Linux just to come back a day later and it magically be fixed is such an accurate Linux experience

Thank you for the contribution to GNU/Linux ecosystem! Spreading the word about user experience and common issues/annoyances helps to raise awareness about current state of the Linux desktop and take the right steps in direction of making things a lot more enjoyable and simple for the end users.

This series inspired me to switch to Mint! This is the first KZfaq video I'm watching on Linux!

This series is kind of needed. Being only slightly above Linus in terms of Linux knowledge, I want to use Linux but it feels like high level beginners are told to F- themselves until they become low level experts. Hopefully this helps Linux contributers target the areas that need work in terms of documentation, explanations, and patches.

9:15 FYI: Canary Builds of software are just a form of an early build like a Beta build. Canary builds are usually built off of nightly builds, IE a new one might get released every night. So you could expect the latest and greatest features, but the most amount of bugs from Canary releases.

Thank you so much for doing this series! About to build a new gaming PC and want to avoid using Windows out of principle. Now I can learn from your guys mistakes and move straight into new and surprising mistakes of my own.

This feels like all the issues I would be having if I started using Linux this year. We used to have to deal with a whole other set of issues back in the day and by comparison this feels like a cakewalk but the experience is still pretty bad

Linus, you're our community's new #1 tester. Please keep making simple mistakes and getting things to change. Thank you

Luke/Linus - also keep in mind that some bugs/issues from this video are due to the devs behind those pieces of software provide little to no Linux support at all, which is the infinite loop we've been dealing with for years: Devs won't provide Linux support for app because of lack of users/demand --> Lack of users/demand due to devs not providing Linux support --> Devs won't provide Linux support for app because of lack of users/demand, etc. etc.This is why some workarounds/patches done by the community (most often volunteers of various skill levels) sometimes are also buggy. Not saying your criticisms are invalid, just adding info that puts it into perspective.

Happy to see a shout out to the Nvidia proprietary drivers ! Their GPUs require authenticated firmware (microcode) inside the drivers, based on digital signatures, just so Linux can never develop an open-source driver for their cards !!! Talk about being anti-consumer ! As a long time Linux user, which pretty much means I must be a developer or integrator / administrator of some kind, I am very happy to see both of you guys putting up with this and trying your best to get things working !

I see a lot of suggestions on this for Anthony to do the same, and I agree. But I feel like it'd be a lot more educating to have someone from the business side of LMG do a Linux install and have Anthony guide them through where they get stuck. Would help clarify/highlight a lot of issues that linux enthusiasts or general tech nerds know their way around.

The TLDR of most things on Linux is that software gets less attention than Windows, so you need to compensate that with your own attention... unfortunately. Concerning Github file downloads. Yes, it is unintuitive and annoying. To download a file, click on the file in the list, and it will show the text content; then you click on "raw" on the top-right side, and then when you save it, it will be the correct format. You do not need to copy paste into Kate. And yes, sometimes you need to reboot. In actuality, usually logging out and logging back in is sufficient. In my experience, that is usually a desktop environment issue.

"Canary" is similar to "nightly" So you get newer stuff more frequently but also with more bugs.

I really like Pop_OS and I even installed it at one point. I was amazed by how smooth it is. I followed a video guide on how to install things and stuffs to not waste time by exploring by my own. I would have switched to Pop_OS but there is only one reason why I changed back: Games. Genshin Impact, Mihoyo themselves haven't make it playable it yet. I've read a few in forums that Genshin's anti cheat system kind of stops you playing it in Pop_OS. (I think I tried this since last year, idk)

I remember being told Linux never crashes, which I found out was basically true for the kernel. However X11/Xwindows crashed as regularly as windows (98 at the time), making you lose any work you were doing. So from an end user viewpoint stability was the same... but hey at least Linux kernel hadn't crashed so I used ctrl+alt+f2 to open a second terminal to restart X.

Now after this series I would love to see someone like Anthony do the same thing from scratch and see how things work out for someone that knows Linux really well

My entire takeaway from this thing is "if you're new use Mint" Kidding aside- yeah, unfortunately the whole Linux being a second class citizen thing is all too prevalent. As there aren't a lot of users (and a lot of those users tend to be developers who can tinker to make it work ) on Linux + the fact that testing on multiple distros is a *ton* of effort, the software just doesn't get as much attention on Linux- assuming the software even exists.

i think linus makes a good point, linux is really meant for people that know how everything works. that being said if you just set your daily driver up with linux and work through the issues, eventually it will work and you will own your computer as much as you can on a consumer level.

This series just made my mind about Linux, Linux is a cluster fuck that its only place is servers and pentesting

The part when Linus saved the .sh file directly from the repo main page cracked me really good xD But I won't blame him. I'm taking Linus' take as a non-technical person's point of view, trying to game on Linux. I would definitely not expect anyone who doesn't understand how github works to take the extra steps of opening the raw file and save that as a shell script. 100% legit obstacle!

Seeing Linus download that sh file was the most frustrating thing I've ever seen on this channel xD

The open containing folddr issue is because you're using the snap version. Same happens with vscode. Install the regular version using the package manager or .deb file and it should work fine.

Love this series!!!

"If github is only for developers, then Linux is only for developers." In an ideal world, Linux is shaped by the contributions from users. There is no corporation selling you something, this is a community built tool. So in a way, yes, Linux is for developers.

As a Linux Sysadmin this series is hilarious. Can't wait for more.

I felt that complaint about condescending tones with Linux uses. Same goes with a lot of developers, they just, for some reason, don't like newbs or people asking for help. Of course this doesn't apply to every developer or Linux user, I've met plenty of helpful people on discord and on forums, but many don't seem very welcoming.

As a Ms user since DOS, these guys have shown exactly why the normal user doesn't use linux. I've tried many distros over the years, and even have a box running Kubuntu which I really like but would never use it as my main PC. Most people are not nerds and don't want to be, they just want their system to work without having to go into terminal and run bash commands. Nor do they want to run wine, or install different packages, or spend hours and hours trying to figure out how to set up Samba shares for their particular distro, etc..., etc.... Windows has had its problems, but since Windows Xp I've found it to not even come close to the headache that Linux is.

The install.sh script would likely have done as it had been advertised if the whole repository had been cloned prior to running it. As a general note, the others files in a repository other than the file that is to be run are usually dependencies.

"apps that fix themselves can also unfix them selves - choosing the most critical time to do so" - DaVinci

The way you're downloading that Github file is hilarious. No, no, no, that's wrong.

I would like to see a revisit of this series at some point to see if there have been any changes or developments with Linux

I am fortunate to be a Linux user for many years so all of my hardware was chosen specifically because it works fine with Linux. I was a university student when I installed it on my laptop which supported it just fine. Then when I was upgrading my desktop over the years I always had Linux in mind even though I was using Windows on it back then. Switching over with tons of proprietary hardware sure looks very painful.

The video editing in this is incredible. But I think I'd prefer more of the docu-style filmmaking of the first one. Even if it is 30+ minutes.

This is the best content on LTT of all time. It is a shame the videos are so short!

"Everything works! All is good!" **shows screen cap of a Windows desktop**

Linus, one thing you could do to improve the situation with hardware support for linux, would be to actually bring it up as a point of discussion for hardware reviews or PC builds. You could for example complain about nvidias linux drivers nvidia GPU reviews. That might get their attention to take linux seriously. And that sound card of yours could use some love for linux. Perhaps tweet about it to get the manufacturers attention about it. You could also praise hardware that has good linux support. Similar to how you want hardware to be open and maintainable (framework laptops) you should want the same for drivers and software. You could also do linux PC builds where you use hardware that works great with linux.

Discord Canary is on Windows too, it's just like a nightly build.

i wish people would stop saying you don't have to turn things on and off again in Linux. Rebooting and restarting and updating are the quickest fixes for so many things in the OS

In my opinion what (I think?) many view as Linux biggest strength, I believe is really its' biggest weakness: fragmentation. Too many different distros that specialize in different things, thus making it virtually impossible to replace the likes of Windows. Now, I usually go with Debian-based distros whenever I do give it a try (as i understand they're supposed to be the most beginner-friendly(?)), so I don't know if that's part of the problem: but I've always been astounded by how easy it is to break the OS and make it unbootable or otherwise broken to the point of becoming unusable, just by following one or more guides that happen to be outdated (often there's no good way to know, and sometimes they are actually up-to-date and still don't yield the promised results), and on top of that, few of said guides even explain what all the commands are actually doing, so reversing whatever damage has been done quickly becomes difficult (or nearly impossible for someone of my skill level). Unless you're willing to begin again, that is. It has been a couple of years since I last gave it a try, but judging from the video many of the problems I ran into in the past are still there. Other than that I feel that these videos have done a good job of demonstrating why Linux isn't likely to become a proper replacement for Windows for a long time yet; if ever, which is saddening, because if it was I would've ditched this mega-corp OS already, and I believe that goes for a lot of people out there. Just my take on the matter.

Linux being reliable "no need to restart" really only speaks to the kernel. it's not like linux desktop software is flawless. far from it as you have seen 3rd parties put little or no effort in to it so it's largely all community efforts.

4:08 In my experience, if the application changes the title of the window, OBS just can't deal. This is particularly noticable with emulators, as they often have stats (e.g. the FPS) present that regularly change. 5:40 Near the top you should have a 'download source' button; one of the options is as a zip file, that's the way to go if you don't want to git clone it, and there are no pre-packaged releases.

Oh man this series is great!