Transpersonal States: Awakening, Enlightenment, and the Ego | Vivian Dittmar
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Vivian Dittmar is an author, speaker, and wisdom teacher dedicated to enhancing holistic development for over two decades. Through her books and the Be the Change Foundation, she focuses on emotional intelligence, ecological sustainability, social justice, and spiritual fulfillment to address modern society's crises.
What does it mean to truly transcend the ego and embrace a transpersonal state of being?
In this episode of “Voices with Vervaeke,” John Vervaeke and Vivian Dittmar thoughtfully explore enlightenment, viewing it not as a final destination but as an ongoing journey of maturation and integration. They challenge conventional perspectives on enlightenment, proposing a more dynamic interplay between personal growth and spiritual awakening. By examining the delicate balance required to maintain higher states of consciousness while cultivating a healthy personal self, they illuminate the complexities of spiritual bypassing and the necessity of embracing imperfection. Their conversation explores the importance of aligning inner and outer worlds, the role of synchronicity, and the transformative power of confronting our own mortality. Join them as they unravel these intricate themes with intellectual rigor, poetic insight, and a commitment to deepening our understanding of what it means to lead a truly awakened life.
Embark on a journey with us to tackle the Meaning Crisis by joining our exclusive Patreon community. www.patreon.com/johnvervaeke
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00:00 Introduction: Exploring Transpersonal and Transegoic States
02:10 Navigating the Spectrum of Egoic and Transrational Consciousness
07:20 Beyond the Social Conscience: Discovering the Voice of the Soul
12:35 Exploring the Implicate Order and Transrational Ways of Knowing
19:00 Redefining Spiritual Awakening and the Mythology Surrounding It
23:25 Bridging the Gap between Inner and Outer Worlds through Wisdom and Virtue
32:20 Cultivating a Healthy Personal Self after Enlightenment
43:45 Beyond Spiritual Bypassing and the Pursuit of Perfection in the Journey Towards Wholeness
57:00 Facing Mortality: A Journey Towards Wholeness and Maturity
01:18:00 Conclusion: Reflections on Convergence, Gratitude, and the Quest for True Prosperity
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The Vervaeke Foundation is committed to advancing the scientific pursuit of wisdom and creating a significant impact on the world. Become a part of our mission. vervaekefoundation.org/
Join Awaken to Meaning to explore practices that enhance your virtues and foster deeper connections with reality and relationships. awakentomeaning.com/
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Ideas, People, and Works Mentioned in this Episode
The Death of Ivan Ilyich, by Leo Tolstoy
David Bohm
Plato
Carl Jung
Leo Tolstoy
Spinoza
Fallible Man, by Paul Ricoeur
Relevant Episodes
Exploring the Transrational: A Journey into the Realms of Consciousness with Vivian Dittmar kzfaq.info/get/bejne/gbl_lbeUtpzDcps.html
Exploring Emotions and Transrational Wisdom with Vivian Dittmar kzfaq.info/get/bejne/f7eHf8mAq8uUnKM.html
Wisdom Through the Imaginal: IFS Insights with Seth Allison Part 3 kzfaq.info/get/bejne/bcCGpZqDmLKzep8.html
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Follow John Vervaeke
johnvervaeke.com/
vervaeke_john
www.youtube.com/@johnvervaeke
www.patreon.com/johnvervaeke
Follow VIvian Dittmar
viviandittmar.com
youtube.com/@viviandittmareng
Workshops/Courses:
Introduction to the Practice of Conscious Release signup.lebensweise.net/conscious-release-workshop
How Big Is Your Emotional Backpack? signup.lebensweise.net/free-backpack-workshop
The Emotional Backpack campus.lebensweise.net/o/the-emotional-backpack-online-course/
Books:
The Emotional Backpack a.co/d/3aehB4B
Your Inner GPS viviandittmar.net/en/your-inner-gps-book/
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Thank you for watching!
@roberts.4137 8 күн бұрын
John is an excellent host and honors and truly welcomes the guest.Not easy when one has so much to say, himself. Vivian is so authentic and wise.
@gloriaharbin1131 10 күн бұрын
Your dialogues with Vivian are always the most deeply heartfelt and meaningful for me. Thank you both so very much. Sending my love and gratitude.🙏
@alexanderdenheijer565 14 күн бұрын
This was so beautiful John and Vivian. I’ve been wrestling with the idea of enlightenment as well through my work and I recognize very much how some conceptions of enlightenment can lead to spiritual bypassing. I remember being very inspired by the search for enlightenment until it started dawning on me that I was actually just longing to be free from something. I wanted to escape the dreadfulness of ordinary life. Until at some point it started dawning on me that liberation is not a freedom from ordinary life, but a freedom from the desire to escape ordinary life. As I started facing reality as on ongoing process, the idea of enlightenment started losing its appeal to me.
@adamhope8689 14 күн бұрын
💯 most seeking "enlightenment" are simply trying to escape the stuff they are unwilling or not ready want to face
@gunterappoldt3037 12 күн бұрын
In the most cases, seems to me, this search, resp. ultimate telos/aim was/is/will be “triggered“ by religio-philosophical institutions. Its is heavily and significantly “framed“ (E. Goffman) by “communitas“ (during ritual performances on the communal level) and the “organs“ of all kinds of social institutions.
@brandis3309 14 күн бұрын
John, I always enjoy hearing you give sincere & heartfelt compliments to the people you speak with. Thank you both for this convo. I feel a sense of comfort when hearing Vivian speak 😊
@headrat1 15 күн бұрын
One cannot be in the world but not of it without a basic sense of self. The ego is necessary no matter how transpersonal one's experience is. Some basic presence is needed to chop wood and carry water. Ego is a continuum between deficient emptiness and inflated narcissism. Balance between them is essential.
@howiewhitehouse1202 15 күн бұрын
nicely concisely stated
@knoweagle888 14 күн бұрын
Jung describes “Christ” as a symbol of the “Self”. After everything superficial has been stripped away that is what’s left. Which leads to another question! Does one deserve to be there? Have you cultivated enough embodiment to rest in that? A key difference between the Mystic and the Psychotic imo…
@gunterappoldt3037 13 күн бұрын
Carl Gustav Jung developed the concept of “individuation“, which somehow seems to find a middle way between an “abstract, yet also holistic absolute“ and the “real realities of the manifold“. And as Jung had some fable for ancient Greece and Egypt, maybe he was inspired by the arch-symbol of the Ouroboros. - Some more stuff for further considerations on the whole vital/basic topic of the “consciousness of there-being“ (Heideggerian Selbst-Bewusstsein des Daseins auf der Lichtung des Seins). Makes sense, no sense, non-sense...? - Sokrates: “We searched for the truth. We could not find it. Let's talk again tomorrow!“
@gunterappoldt3037 13 күн бұрын
Addendum: “seeks“ instead of “seems“, typo, sorry!
@knoweagle888 13 күн бұрын
@@gunterappoldt3037 Truth is an alignment…
@StephenEmmons-mx5yz 14 күн бұрын
I would love to see a conversation with Loch Kelly. He is a spiritual teacher in the Buddhist tradition, having studied with Tulku Urgyen Rinpoche. But his teachings are around awake awareness and nonduality, not the Buddhist tradition exclusively. Would also love to see you talk with Eckhart Tolle, Sam Harris, Jayasāra, Gangaji, Adyashanti, Rupert Spira, Tara Brach, Steve Taylor, Richard Lang, or James Low. Any of those would be thrilling! Just love seeing more nonduality represented on this channel, and any of the traditions that espouse it (eg Advaita Vedanta, Dzogchen, mysticism, etc.) Keep it up! And thank you! Namaste and God bless.
@Jacob011 14 күн бұрын
Not happy to hear that Voices with Vervaeke will be retired. Maybe Vivian will start Voices with Vivian and John will be invited. 😅
@skippybe 14 күн бұрын
❤ This was a fantastic conversation and I especially loved orbiting more clearly defining what it really means to be “enlightened” and what real integration actually looks like. I think a lot of us intuitively know what this looks and feels like because we have so many examples of what it does not look like. We have a lot of work to do but conversations like these make me feel like we’re getting much closer to discovering some pretty profound truths about ourselves.
@eqapo 14 күн бұрын
Although we have two higher beings engaging in the abstract concepts, tears are falling as memories of spiritual evolution come up right alongside this carefully "mapped" discussion
@mills8102 15 күн бұрын
I have to say, I really admire Vivian. Her dedication to truth, beyond any kind of particular orthodoxy is truly admirable. I really enjoyed your last discussion and this one is starting off on a powerful footing. Thank you 🙏
@vellytothejelly 11 күн бұрын
Lovely Vivan and awesome John, What I'm kind of missing here is more metaphor and giving examples for the things you touch upon. The topics can get extremely abstract and, at the end of the day, you both expressed commitment to the applicability of your work. I would love it if your next conversations could be more graspable in the way that Awakening from the Meaning crisis argument was presented in a graspable and wrapping one's head around-able way. Thank you! 🙏
@scottjrowan 12 күн бұрын
Brilliant. Thank you both so much 🙏
@lifearttimes 13 күн бұрын
This! Great points Vivienne. Shine On, Vivienne & John✨
@colorfulbookmark 13 күн бұрын
I respect and honor people who have cares for people who need help. People's presence of this cares are what ameliorate people who need help, because there are people who can do this^^ The architecture of psychological model is difficult thing, people who can do this is what I would like to respect and honor. Of course, independent of my support feelings, Dr.Vervaeke and his fellows and guests are great people ^^ Dr.Peterson is also great man I honor and respect.
@sean2662 14 күн бұрын
28:14 I personally can't sit in the middle of my heart space with the awareness of how deep this goes for long enough to study it.
@emilthiels6256 14 күн бұрын
Hello, this was a very clear dialogue, and I can find myself in what have been said! To you John en Vivian I wish you a wonderful path and the energy of clarity, THANKS !
@projectmalus 14 күн бұрын
Thanks for the conversation.
@jutfaseweg9082 14 күн бұрын
I fully share the idea of the transpersonal as a state not of perfection, but a feeling of wholeness. Isn't the personal feeling bound to our epigenetics, to feel complete in the sense of joy when we can share our capacities perfectly with the world, even though we see our own limitations of things we will never have or be? For instance, some of us feel blessed to have good hands to be a good osteopath (as I am), without even the willingness to be in the twilight state of ‘enlightenment’. Isn't it all about discovering what on the soul level we are meant to be, to share your talents in the world with honor, which gives rise to bliss and a fullmeaning life. “Ikigai” (生き甲斐) or “Shokunin” (職人), the profound aesthetic and ethical commitment to one's talents. We are not all destined to become spiritual teachers, coaches, or 'light workers’, after one or two shakti experiences in an 40 degree heated Indian Ashram. Someone who cuts fish is also not a 'sushi master' overnight, or after a 3-month course with a chef. As Marcus Aurelius speaks; That which is allready there has no need of anything; not more than law (ethica), not more than truth, not more than benevolence or modesty.
@elsawiegers1093 14 күн бұрын
how strange to see this name ,"jutfaseweg", it sort of makes long-forgotten memories bubble to the surface.....
@sean2662 14 күн бұрын
17:00 I really appreciate this perspective. I wonder if the implicit order auto updates every instance to keep its adherents safe from being ground to pulp by the chaos and human arbitration of explicit order. And if it does, who or what might be doing it? Is it silly to think entropy could fuel such a thing?
@shamanverse 12 күн бұрын
I wonder if the work of Dr Jeffrey Martin on persistent non symbolic experience can enhance further the distinctions explored here. Please consider bringing his considerable mappings on this topic to the conversation.
@anthonytroia1 9 күн бұрын
My old friend Soryu Forall (a Zen monk) says you can tell one's enlightenment by how good a friend they are. It's as simple as that.
@RickDelmonico 14 күн бұрын
Eternity is not lots of time, it is an ever deepening relationship with your creator.
@oliverjamito9902 15 күн бұрын
Angels who persevere and heard the WORD will say keep watch!
@TheCoyotemonster 13 күн бұрын
My biggest bugaboo is waste. I believe waste is UGLY. But just lately, I have learned to accept that...waste happens. A person cannot survive without processing their waste, created from their living. I think this is an answer to perfection.
@ClassPunkOnRumbleAndSubstack 13 күн бұрын
I make no claim of being enlightened, but I've lost count of the mystical experiences I've had through 16 years of meditation. So since it's related to the video subject, if anyone is interested, I wrote an 11,000+ word essay on my views on meditation and mystical experiences, including talking about people I believe to be fully enlightened in a meditation sense for current humans-- primarily talking about mystical experiences that always have bliss and phosphenes which I see as likely an absolute prerequisite to full enlightenment/sahaja samadhi/full kundalini awakening-- which I describe further in the essay. That's all the algorithm will probably allow me to say.
@Jacob011 15 күн бұрын
I've had experiences that came upon me unbidden, without long history of meditation. I don't hot dog it around and many who do are BSing others, who BS themselves too for deeper reasons.
@RickDelmonico 14 күн бұрын
Imagine if everyone you knew were perfect. It is our flaws that make us unique.
@projectmalus 14 күн бұрын
at 13 min the two meta drives for self, a transform between hourglass and spinning top, where the horizontal projection moves in and out. A cone origin reappearing in the vertically orientated increasing size of pipe example, where the projections of the diamond (of the spinning top) horizontally are cones when a circle is drawn around the tips, and where the hourglass opens to the vertical.
@AhmedOfKemet 5 күн бұрын
I like that Vivian stays silent when she has nothing to say. Some other people just try to fill the gaps with nonsense.
@projectmalus 14 күн бұрын
Shear pin self, meant to be brittle and break properly, so when the perimeter which moves faster transmits a shock of energy back to the slower moving yet more powerful origin, the expensive and delicate unfolding mechanism next to the origin doesn't break. Not too soft and not too hard, reverse engineered three leaps as three pieces that leap together again, to be between the vertical as the horizontal, adding larger pipe outwards (UTOK model) in this vertically orientated spaces between, that self mediates and is mediated by, perimeter slowing and origin quickening. Could be useful in seeing anima for a masculine person as closer to the origin and powerful, with self mediating between anima and an objectified masculine perimeter (anime for the feminine expression) or the two hemispheres of the brain, etc. Trust is like a shear pin, but between people where they can take turns being rational and emotional for each other, where trust is also a bottle of wall dissolver that can be stolen while a wall is built, more of a individual in a patriarchical collective kind of way, by removing means of engagement for that individual.
@RickDelmonico 14 күн бұрын
We put on knowledge like we put on clothing and hopefully these cloths continue to let the light in.
@AngeloSomers 15 күн бұрын
This woman is the sauce 👏
@markobrien4332 13 күн бұрын
"Death happens in you, not to you." Bernardo Kastrupp talking to Rupert Spira on Consciousness.
@RickDelmonico 14 күн бұрын
I agree with some of this and wonder at some of the ideas presented.
@lianaschill6132 14 күн бұрын
Lack of impulse-control is related to Sin. The inability to reflect on the impacts/consequences of impulsive actions on orher human beings causes Sin.
@jgarciajr82 14 күн бұрын
On the next conversation I wonder if you guys would be able to talk about if God is everything and how is God connected to evil or what is that relationship?
@ElenaRoche 15 күн бұрын
John at 9:30. Tolstoi made it obvious from the beginning that Ivan Ilyich neither lived correctly nor well, but it only began to matter on his deathbed.
@Michlin-rp5iv 14 күн бұрын
Lots of great comments will be given, one I'd like to give quickly by pointing out the sacred pattern of time, by which I mean that simply the number one clip came out 6 months ago, n.2 three months ago, and now the trilogy episode. The sacred and the appreciation of ceremony is as important as sleeping and eating.
@Schtoopot 14 күн бұрын
This was a good one
@allenneher9136 15 күн бұрын
Epicurus, the Greek philosopher, said, "Why should I fear death? If I am, death is not. If death is, I am not. Why should I fear that which cannot exist when I do?"   
@gunterappoldt3037 14 күн бұрын
Master Kong Qiu: “not knowing life, how knowing death“ - a koan by master “Konfuzius“, as presented in the “Lunyu/Talks“. -Regards
@oliverjamito9902 15 күн бұрын
Little ones will say, surrounding about as a little lights! Surrounding about the PARADISE! Gratitude and Honor
@oliverjamito9902 15 күн бұрын
Time come here in front and remind!
@Richard_Paradise 14 күн бұрын
❤✝️
@khaderlander2429 13 күн бұрын
01:09:34. People are sleep when they die they are awoken, meaning they come to attention, regain consciousness. So practice the art of dying before your actual death. Consider yourself of the people of the grave. There is a substantial reality behind appearances. Remove the veil so you can witness beauty. The cosmos is meaning set up in images and anyone who understands that is among the people of discernment. Quran 50 (Verse 22) “You were indeed heedless of this. Now We have removed from you your cover; so today your sight is piercing.”
@projectmalus 14 күн бұрын
Con-science, an inhuman power assuaged by a statistical knowing. Consilience thru science where objectification of self can be bounced off of, to move collectively, which is powerful and needs folding back into the world as care.
@ValentinBrutusBura 14 күн бұрын
"IT IS MISUNDERSTANDING" :))
@oliverjamito9902 15 күн бұрын
Students what is to lose touch? Mimic come here in front and remind!
@oliverjamito9902 15 күн бұрын
Pops FATHERS our Beautiful Mothers! If a SON OF MAN sitteth comes to thee all. Visitations unto all HIS SHARED FEET!
@oliverjamito9902 15 күн бұрын
Students remember thy shared "i" AM, came with sincere conversations given just for thee, and thy shared Feet resting upon. What is a REBELLIOUS HOUSE?
@rocketproductions1441 15 күн бұрын
Chill out my dude! It ain't that serious
@oliverjamito9902 15 күн бұрын
Very tip of time will say
@hernansoto2631 Күн бұрын
Minute 52, "if I hear someone saying I´m enlightened, I will say: probably not" says John. I believe that's the reason why Sufists doesen´t say the are Sufi. It is against the tradition. You just embodies it.
@oliverjamito9902 15 күн бұрын
Why needed to remind unto all fed?
@catholicpog7183 15 күн бұрын
Second
@ReverendDr.Thomas 15 күн бұрын
Are you a THEIST? 🤔 If so, what are the reasons for your BELIEF in God? 🤓
@ejenkins4711 14 күн бұрын
Won goes up One falls down Two goes forever With four leaf plant i found 🍀🚪🦍
@knoweagle888 14 күн бұрын
And God decided this person who has been sitting around meditating on nothing, breathing and stretching for decades. I’m just gonna enter him for 30seconds so he can write a book.
@lianaschill6132 14 күн бұрын
How would a “healthy personality” deal with the egotistic would-be dictators, leaders running our geopolitical world? Is it wishful thinking to believe that a human being with a “healthy personality” can navigate the difficult realities of work, mortgages, responsibilities of children & parents, illness, accidents & injuries, etc.
@ZL0WBEE 14 күн бұрын
The system definitely makes things harder but that doesn’t mean we shouldn’t strive for wisdom and the embodiment of it
@oliverjamito9902 15 күн бұрын
Students a little new minds Sons and Daughters will say?