*This got tense...* With a wind so calm, I find senseless to instruct a go around and state the wind component. What do you think? Were the pilots really confused by this? Anyway the GO AROUND instruction was clearly instructed but they landed instead. Glad no one was hurt.
@bndahi82515 жыл бұрын
agreed, why give wind direction and go around
@gucha75 жыл бұрын
Pilots fault for not listening to the ATC protest ("Negative. Go Around") But why would ATC follow a "Go Around" with the runway number and wind component. If there had been blocked frequency or any other radio problem it would just confuse pilots. The standard language as I understand would be: "Go around. Standard Missed Approach" or "Go around. [Altitude]", or just repeat the "go around" over and over like in Air Canada SFO incident. Just another reminder that little things like this can make difference between life and death, especially in heavy workload situations.
@maverick75265 жыл бұрын
That was odd to give wind when telling someone to go around. Usually it's just, xyz 316 go around, fly runway heading, climb to X,000ft, contact departure on xx.xxx or whatever.
@TheDuckAndRogerTheHorse5 жыл бұрын
I think he needed to give one instruction to go around and readback.
@rikkubeauty8395 жыл бұрын
There were no read back for any of the two go around instructions. Maybe ATC should be more insistent on this until the crew get the thing right. Also given the slow response to ground vehicle while the Airbus was landing I suppose the controller was busy with something else at that moment. Anyway, can't tell what was going on in their minds. I'd love to see the final report on this by the way...
@elyannouh88804 жыл бұрын
Hi everyone, this might come a bit late but this could clarify a few things. I work at Orly (as an ATC) and know both controllers that you can hear in this video. There are a few factors that led to this situation, of them which : • The male controller was on training and the French phraseology standards expects us to mention the wind for go-around clearances. In that case the wind was calm so I perfectly understand why he could have got rid of that anyways, but when you’re in your training phase, you tend to stick to « the basic rules », so yeah, I guess the wind instruction came out automatically of his mouth before he could even compute the data. • The tone might not be firm enough because of the same reason : training phase. • When the Inspection vehicle called TWR to say they vacated the runway, the controller got all hesitant because he didn’t know how to react given the situation : the Inspection vehicle reported out of the runway while it was barely vacating, and the plane cleared to go around kept going and landed. I guess at that time, that’s when the trainee looks at their instructor with a half-open mouth like « What the hell am I supposed to do now ? ». The instructor at that time then took over the mic and discussed with the pilot : that’s the female controller you can hear. • Tunisair (callsign « Tunair ») pilots all speak French, are used to Orly and usually are well-aware of the ongoing situation. I’m not defending anyone, or accusing the pilot of going against the rules, just stating a few facts that most likely have led to this misunderstanding between pilot and controller and giving you a little bit of a context. Cheers fellow aviation enthusiasts !
@andydaniel23 жыл бұрын
Thanks for that clarification - I have studied many air crashes and near-crashes from the point of view of "what went wrong in the human factor". I have found noticed recurring failures - confirmation bias, failure of a junior crew member to aggressively question the captain, and failure of both ATC and crew to take action when there is indication that they are "not on the same page". This case is interesting because based on your information about the trainee, it seems to fall into the second category, but with the trainee controller being the junior crew member. I was born in Canada and live near San Francisco, so I was shocked a few years ago when an Air Canada flight almost landed on a taxiway at SFO where 4 jets were lined up for takeoff. Shortly before landing, the captain asked ATC is the runway was clear, saying he saw lights. ATC assured him it was clear. A few minutes later, the captain asked again and ATC reported that there were no aircraft on the runway. Just before landing, the captain saw the four aircraft and went around, passing just over them. Of course the captain was disciplined and I agree that he was mostly responsible. But I would have liked to have the ATC think to himself "what on earth does that pilot think he is seeing that isn't there?" - I think calling a go-around would have been very responsible recognizing that pilot and ATC are not in sync. In another case out of Canada several decades ago, ATC cleared a foreign pilot to land in Montreal. The captain reported short final but the ATC realized that he couldn't see the aircraft and should have been able to. He immediately asked the pilot to describe what he saw. The pilot replied and ATC immediately issued a go-around. The pilot had lined up on a short runway at a nearby abandoned airport. (What I don't know is what part radar did or did not play in this, this happened 40-50 years ago). But the point is that ATC found a disconnect and rather than ignoring it or trying to figure out what or why, immediately took action to avoid an accident.
@elyannouh88803 жыл бұрын
That's a very interesting point you're making here about making sure the controller and the pilot are on the same page, because one thing for sure is that when you're in training phase, especially in early phases, one focuses all their energy to "making their part right". Yet it is something that everyone involved should be aware of : we are all playing different parts about one same situation. It is part of our training (here in France at least, I don't know much elsewhere) to follow regular Human Factor courses. And I feel that what you just mentioned should be covered more often. Thank you for your reply, it's one of the many things that help me grow as a controller.
@emrebaskocak3 жыл бұрын
@@elyannouh8880 I think one factor you haven't addressed is that after the "negative, go around" instruction, the controller didn't get a proper readback from the pilot, and didn't include the pilot's callsign.
@aquarius77893 жыл бұрын
@@elyannouh8880 Hello Yann and Andy. Please let me jump into this conversation just to tell you that I'm very satisfied with the outcome of this exchange of clarifications and opinions. I am the one who have captured and sent this extract to Vasaviation and performed the French/English translation. My purpose was not to blame anyone or to shame the controller or the pilot. Not at all! My sole motivation was to see this kind of constructive sharing of knowledge and usefull information. It is very interesting to receive the feedback from an Orly ATC showing how the French Regulation and training can affect the Human Factors and to compare it with the analysis of a Canadian specialist thousands of miles away. That's pretty cool ! I am personnaly working as an Airworthiness Officer for a French airline and I believe that we are all part of the same machine and if we can learn something new every day about Safety and our industry we didn't waste our time ! So thank you both for sharing your knowledge like gentlemen.
@ailivac Жыл бұрын
I was surprised the first controller didn't get more forceful after the first readback failed to confirm the go around; being in training easily explains it. From a more experienced controller I'd expect something like "Tunair 716, GO AROUND, GO AROUND, cancel landing clearance" (without the wind information to make the transmission as short as possible and wait for a reply, which might have helped since that was apparently what confused the pilots) after either the first readback or seeing the plane approach the touchdown zone still descending.
@samborlon5 жыл бұрын
Cleared to go around runway 26 wind 320@2.
@3GM65D5 жыл бұрын
hahahaha
@maxitomix5 жыл бұрын
clear as mud!
@dissimulii5 жыл бұрын
yeah, i'm not a pilot and i haven't watched a lot of these, but are they normally "cleared" to go around? i would think you would be "cleared" to take off and land, and maybe... "instructed" to go around? i dunno, adding "cleared" at the beginning coupled with the accent and loss of audio quality from radio, the tunisair pilot was probably just trying to pick out key words to work with. he heard "cleared" "runway 26" and the wind directions, what else would he be cleared to do on runway 26?
@samborlon5 жыл бұрын
PoundMeToo I was just mocking the stupid ATC, who should have just said TunisairXXX GO AROUND with no wind information or any other bullshit. The controller should be retrained.
@maxitomix5 жыл бұрын
@@dissimulii you are are right. Nobody requested a go around. So no need to clear anybody to do anything. A go around is an instruction that should be commanded LOUND and CLEAR, no clutter or distractions. "Aircraft123 GO AROUND, say again, GO AROUND"
@greatflyer_aviation5 жыл бұрын
Giving the runway number and wind HAS to sound like a landing clearance. Shows the importance of BASIC radiotelephony...
@guillaumefuentes31845 жыл бұрын
In French standard radiotelephony the wind direction and velocity is mandatory in a go-around clearance or readback from the ATC.
@tabaks5 жыл бұрын
You're not so great flyer.
@karlosbricks24135 жыл бұрын
@@guillaumefuentes3184 Really? Never knew that. But is it really necessary with a go around, especially with a wind speed of 2 knots?
@enricomosca46745 жыл бұрын
@@guillaumefuentes3184 Do the French rules say "don't perform hear back and don't look outside if you give a go around instruction" too?
@nobytes25 жыл бұрын
I'm no pilot, but I wonder at what altitude was the go around given. French speakers are hard to understand. Would doing a gi around that low already prepared for landing be more dangerous? Why not tell the plane a go around from the beginning? ATC caused a big confusion here imo.
@CaptainEarls3 жыл бұрын
I live in Norway. Where I live, we have practically zero international flights in this airspace, and all pilots are norwegian. Still all conversations are practiced in english, for the very few foreign pilots that appear sometimes.
@Boeing777FR2 жыл бұрын
And that’s completely dumb
@bee_happy9969 Жыл бұрын
In germany it's also normal, even with little privat planes that are only steered by germans.
@jimcrelm9478 Жыл бұрын
French is the international language, it has been for hundreds of years, all conversations at airports should be spoken in French. Besides, this is in North Africa.
@cardoncarl11 ай бұрын
French is an ICAO language, unlike norwegian language.
@sarposarpo5 жыл бұрын
Go around with runway number and wind info
@Faxy5 жыл бұрын
And no callsign second time on negative .. That was 100 % ATC fault
@ladale215 жыл бұрын
@@Faxy I was wondering how many people caught on but he did not completely say negative and did not specify a call sign on who he was talking to go around
@HowIFoundYourName5 жыл бұрын
Exactly
@nitehawk865 жыл бұрын
"Cleared to go around runway 26."
@nitehawk865 жыл бұрын
@@ladale21And never bothered to check if Tunisair heard after the initial confusion.
@tigersfan145 жыл бұрын
it's very very dangerous when ATC fail to address an incorrect read back
@martintheiss7435 жыл бұрын
its supposed to be the secondary Midway type airport for people who want to hit Paris but not by using the local major hub airport.
@Anonymous-de2lu3 жыл бұрын
I agree, they should make sure readback is correct.
@PianoKwanMan3 жыл бұрын
@@Anonymous-de2lu 4:11 "Negatif"
@5calambres3 жыл бұрын
They did. But they should have insisted on a correct readback to be sure no confusion is there.
@martincyify5 жыл бұрын
Speaking in French denies the pilots of having situational awareness of what was going on via the frequency.
@MrJLRAR5 жыл бұрын
Yes, but the tower and inspection vehicle were conversing in French leaving the Tunis Air pilot blind to what is happening on the active runway.
@ollietoots505 жыл бұрын
Paul Furey no. Listening to communications between other aircraft/ground ops is a major factor in situational awareness. Even when they’re not speaking directly to you, you have a much clearer image in your head as to what’s going on.
@limagustine40535 жыл бұрын
Controller never correct pilot readback ie cleared to land. Going around given too late .less than 1 min about 500ft.
@walidnaceri96655 жыл бұрын
Saffa Jake yes it happens to me i'm a student pilot and when i'm flying the tower and other traffics are talking in their language i don't have any clue whats going on they want to be pilots for big companies like Emirates but they don't know english lol
@mattbar155 жыл бұрын
And yes we are in France we speak French ! 😘
@paazhaaz5 жыл бұрын
Just a go-around. With that French accent I understand the Tunisair’s problem. Go around with runway and wind and an accent is almost same tone.m as a cleared to land. The negative is also not clear. Instead of confirmation the other transmission comes through and Tower decided to talk to the inspection. The female atc is clear but not really fair. I guess caught in the moment.
@alpinebe4ch5975 жыл бұрын
paazhaaz It's shithole Tunis Air, he won't take orders from a female ATC if he feels he knows better and even has a visual of the inspection leaving the runway. But yes, a simple "inspection vehicules still on the runway, go around" would have made it
@jfpinkston15 жыл бұрын
I’m a native English speaker and fly internationally multiple times throughout the year. French accent one of the most difficult to understand for me.
@chrisschack97165 жыл бұрын
I understood them well enough but the English wasn't great. Also, it doesn't matter how Tunis Air feels about female controllers, the one giving landing clearance (or not, in this case) was male, and the female came on to tear the pilot a new one and probably cover for a shaken controller.
@thinkdifferent64035 жыл бұрын
@@jfpinkston1 i agree with you. As a French, i have many of friends who speaks "fluently" english, but no one ever did the effort to get rid of the terrble french accent. Girls find it sexy (not sure why btw) but in some case it's pretty dangerous (like here)
@thirstofficer23325 жыл бұрын
@@alpinebe4ch597... The ATC giving the clumsy go around instruction was male.
@boyousef5445 жыл бұрын
putting the wind with the go around instructions confused the pilot , just simple tunis air go around i say again go around would have made him follow the atc. bad atc and bad cockpit communication
@DaveWhoa5 жыл бұрын
i find it a bit strange though that the pilot said "i just heard the wind direction, not 'go around'"... but didn't say he heard "cleared to land". So he took wind direction alone to mean cleared to land!? why not simply ask ATC to confirm!?
@AdiCherryson5 жыл бұрын
Dave S because neither of them can speak English...
@BruiserFL5 жыл бұрын
Confused/bad language or not, there was NEVER a landing clearance given.
@stivi7395 жыл бұрын
and thats how shit turns bad
@dukrata5 жыл бұрын
BruiserFL i would say the French “go around” sounds pretty much the same as “cleared to land”
@timmyboyproductions39475 жыл бұрын
Crappy ATC. I’m an airline captain and if I hear the wind with a go around instruction I would have questioned it. The correct ATC instruction should have been “Tunis Air 716 go around I say again go around”
@christophdollis19555 жыл бұрын
Exactly.
@enricomosca46745 жыл бұрын
And all in all... What a useful info during a missed approach: wind at 2 knots at 5 meters AGL...
@sanantonio8555 жыл бұрын
French phraseology makes us include the wind during a go around message
@1Gregos5 жыл бұрын
@@sanantonio855 then surely that is the part that needs to be looked into as a deviation from ICAO standards that in this instance caused a safety issue.
@sanantonio8555 жыл бұрын
@@1Gregos as an ATC in training it bothered me, but we don't make the laws... There's some logic to giving the wind because it's some kind of takeoff, but I reckon it is confusing for foreign pilots. I guess in a very tight situation I would just say "Go around". The thing I don't understand is why they didn't ask the pilot for read back. Costs nothing...
@matt_b...5 жыл бұрын
Sorry, tower, you never heard the flight acknowledge the go around. Tower is at fault as much as the flight.
@PVflying5 жыл бұрын
World’s least clear “Go around” instruction. Hopefully the outcome of the safety report is better training for this ATC.
@haroldk7245 жыл бұрын
not the ATC fault.....you have a polit with selective hearing
@ksthebest5 жыл бұрын
@@haroldk724 It helps if the ATC doesn't have a bad accent and speak a different language on radio half the time.
@larsmeijerink54715 жыл бұрын
@@ksthebest i agree on all international airports they have to speak english for the safety of the airport
@aj37515 жыл бұрын
I think there was another transmission during the Tunisair's readback, but I re-watched and heard go around clearly both times. Tunisair pilot is only human, but the words "confirm instructions" could have prevented this from both parties
@dannyhanny11915 жыл бұрын
@@aj3751 There may have been a radio block we aren't hearing, but - in this case - I agree that the ATC was not clear, and just jumbling things together. "Tunair 716 Go around. I repeat, Go Around" would have been prudent by the second time.
@CorbinProxy5 жыл бұрын
This is why standard CAP 413 phraseology is used in the UK... "Tunair6 go around I say again go around acknowledge". The use of the surface wind obviously confused the pilot as this is what's used on a landing clearance
@aaronsuever24143 жыл бұрын
AND Runway. Why would you give Runway number in a go around command, especially when there's clearly a language barrier. Both ATC and pilot are speaking a second language with those shitty aircraft radios. This was ATC all day.
@beeble2003 Жыл бұрын
@@aaronsuever2414 Aircraft radios aren't shitty. The issue with these recordings is that they're made from an aerial on the ground, somewhere vaguely near the airport, but often with buildings in the way. If you watch the various videos filmed from commercial airports, you can hear that the sound quality in the plane itself is pretty good.
@darwishseif11795 жыл бұрын
Glad no one was hurt. There is plenty of blame to go around: - French ATC phraseology specifying wind speed in a go around instruction - French ATC not complying with their own phraseology by adding the runway number in the go around instruction - French ATC not escalating the tone and wording of the go around instruction after the second incorrect read back - The pilots not listening carefully to ATC and letting confirmation bias make them think they heard cleared to land ... twice - The pilots continuing at decision height when, by their own admission, they could see the vehicles still in the process of clearing the runway The supervisor lady who talked to the crew at the end spoke much more clearly than the male controller. I suspect if she was the controller on the radio, this would not have happened in the first place.
@sherpajones3 жыл бұрын
I agree with everything you just said. Upon first listen I did not realize that ATC gave the runway number with the go around. They sould have given the callsign of the craft instead.
@fangzahn5 жыл бұрын
"Tunair 716, go around"...simple as that. No wind information needed.
@leexgx5 жыл бұрын
I'm not sure but it may be a French thing where they must have the wind information included but the ATC person should have on the 3rd go abandoned that tactic and gone to the more urgent do not land go around do not land go around please repeat call back my communication
@weathervaughan2803 жыл бұрын
The pilot should have been listening out whatever he said for go around
@beeble2003 Жыл бұрын
According to other comments on this video, French procedures do require wind information on a go around.
@MrPiggywig5 жыл бұрын
How about ATC sticking to english so everyone can understand what's going on
@JamEngulfer5 жыл бұрын
If you only have French craft in airspace, fine. But the second an international plane shows up, everything should be English
@3x3-x3x-oXo5 жыл бұрын
Why english ? The world is not englishland. Tunisair pilot probably speaks better French than English. Maybe had everything been in French they'd have understood each other...
@JamEngulfer5 жыл бұрын
@@3x3-x3x-oXo Well ATC has to communicate to planes somehow. If we take Europe as an example and have a sample of pilots from say, Sweden, Germany, France, Spain, Bulgaria and Greece, are they all more likely to know French, Spanish or English? Sure the French pilot will speak French and the Spanish will speak Spanish, but is even the Spanish pilot more likely to know French or English? There's a reason English is the language of choice for communication between people that don't speak each other's language.
@walden4205 жыл бұрын
@@3x3-x3x-oXo Because all ICAO designated "International" Airports must conduct ATC radio transmissions in English.
@3x3-x3x-oXo5 жыл бұрын
@@walden420 Simply not true. English needs to be available for international pilots that request it. There is no mandate for all transmissions to be in English.
@maxitomix5 жыл бұрын
"Go around!" needs to be commanded LOUD and CLEAR. ATC used a tone that was too casual. Of course the pilot got confused. 80% ATC fault.
@ld_verfahren48405 жыл бұрын
I disagree with you the tower never said clear to land and if you arent 100% sure if it was a landing clearance ask for conformation
@altawashm4 жыл бұрын
Must be something like: Go around I say again go around acknowledge.
@cruisemissle875 жыл бұрын
"Tunair716 cleared to go aorund, wind 200 at 2kts, contact ground when off the runway"
@Silian165 жыл бұрын
Honestly... What the hell is CLEAR to go around? And what idiot gives wind info on go around, especially if there is NO wind!
@sanantonio8555 жыл бұрын
@@Silian16 standard French phraseology. Not our choice.
@Plugitinbby5 жыл бұрын
That's not what ATC said tho...
@alexb48283 жыл бұрын
@@Silian16 It made me angry when the lady put the blame on the pilot and said "he cleared you to go around"
@coy20003 жыл бұрын
I had never say "cleared go around" but "go around" and twice
@bordersmatter5 жыл бұрын
ATC should articulate "Go around" much more clearly, not to mention confirm acknowledgement.
@dmitrikonnov9225 жыл бұрын
You’re right. I heard kind of go-around-clear-to-land mix. Both ATC and the pilot has some accents which obviously made them understand each other erroneously.
@enricomosca46745 жыл бұрын
Yes. "go around" is perfect. Here in Italy, many of my colleagues use to say "go around and perform the standard missed approach procedure... Bla Bla bla". (what do you think an IFR flight is going to do then?!? Moron!) 😂😂😂
@Aeropunk085 жыл бұрын
With the French accent "go-around" and "cleared-to-land" have the same voice inflections and can be misheard if the accent is strong. Combine this with giving wind conditions I can understand how the confusion happened.
@rogerpe5 жыл бұрын
Even the french should use english in atc communication
@olivierb97165 жыл бұрын
fuck the English language (and look how i'm perfect in englih!!!)
@g00rb4u5 жыл бұрын
Practice what you preach. English is a proper noun.
@Intrepidity5 жыл бұрын
Can you enlighten us how one would pronounce a capital letter over radio? Also there's a big difference between speaking perfect English and insisting to speak your own niche language.
@ksthebest5 жыл бұрын
@@olivierb9716 You're doing very well to confirm the stereotype of French arrogance and narcissism.
@gcsim9235 жыл бұрын
Even spell for English is wrong😆😆
@AMStationEngineer5 жыл бұрын
When it takes three playbacks to fully understand a set of totally confusing instructions ordering a go-around, with windspeed instructions attached, the blame lies largely with ATC. I had no problem understanding the comms from the Tunisian pilot.
@Belchmaster412 жыл бұрын
the blame is: Ops were still doing an inspection when the next plane was cleared to land
@AMStationEngineer2 жыл бұрын
@@Belchmaster41; Providing the wind indications/info is what kicked the situation into hi gear. I'd lay blame to the bilingualism there, I am fluent in Slovak and Polish, and switcking back to English is damn difficult to accomplish, especially during the emotional pressures one experiences during landings. Do you believe that the switching between languages is in-part, to blame?? Stay safe, and healthy!
@computerjantje5 жыл бұрын
to be honest, that "go around" sounded a lot like "clear to land". Then in one breath added the wind to it, I think this was a very dangerous mistake by ATC. Not the pilot
@badbadbadkarma125 жыл бұрын
This was two people neither of which spoke English natively and one with an incredible accent. The pilot couldn't understand and didn't ask for confirmation and instead relied on tone and the ATC both needed more language instruction and screwed up his command and gave extraneous information and then didn't confirm after he noticed the bad response. This wasn't the pilot ignoring him just two people who wouldn't say they didn't understand.
@elcastorgrande5 жыл бұрын
ATC didn't cancel clearance, gave wind direction on a go-around (non-standard), and let 716 get one minute away from final with inspection on the active. Very poor work by ATC.
@luzten5 жыл бұрын
Exactly
@LjL-Videos3 жыл бұрын
"Cancel clearance"? The airplane had no landing clearance to be cancelled. If you're from the US where clearance are given in advance and then cancelled if the runway doesn't actually turn out to be free - this does not happen in Europe (or most of the rest of the world). The airplane had, at most, clearance to approach. He would NOT be given clearance to land with the vehicles still on the runway.
@BIOHAZARDXXXX5 жыл бұрын
I really don't blame the pilots as much as the tower controller. He heard the pilot reply "cleared to land" twice, but didn't reinforce the go-around instruction any further.
@Belchmaster412 жыл бұрын
well, the 2nd plane was NOT cleared to land because Ops were still doing a runway inspection
@muzz1290 Жыл бұрын
He said “negative” twice after the pilot said cleared to land
@AEMoreira81 Жыл бұрын
Both can be held at fault!
@BoulevardFan285 жыл бұрын
That was squarely the controllers fault. He buried the go-around instruction in irrelevant information and when the pilot responded "clear to land" he didn't correct him with strong commands. Additionally, his accent could make understanding instructions very difficult for non-French pilots.
@andydaniel23 жыл бұрын
The peculiarity is that most Tunisians do speak French (although we don't know if the Tunisair pilot was in fact Tunisian). I agree that the controller issues poor instructions by adding the wind and the runway number. When the controller realized that the readback was wrong, he should have simply said "Tunisair - GO AROUND" and nothing else.
@francescadarimini64765 жыл бұрын
Interesting variations of English....
@karlosbricks24135 жыл бұрын
It's always fun to try and understand foreign languages in aviation setting, even when you know the language, it always sounds weird how they say things.
@cliveramsbotty60775 жыл бұрын
or 'french' as it's otherwise known...
@Ayoublouati5 жыл бұрын
Yeah very bad pronunciation
@pardismack5 жыл бұрын
I'm a Tunisian pilot. I speak English with a good enough American English, but in the cockpit, things change xD You have to insist a bit more on every word and factor in the receiver's English level, instead of speaking as if you were communicating with a friend. Besides that, there's the factor of stress which leads to a bit of regression when English is not your first language. Also, communication is often multitasked with flying the aircraft and it's never the main task. Other than this, we were trained to speak with a modified pronunciation (example: "Tree" instead of "three" and "Fiverr" instead of "five"...). I believe that these pronunciation "laws" don't apply any more thanks to the advancement made in radiotelecommunication clarity, but they're still remnant, usually if judged helpful.
@nitehawk865 жыл бұрын
Yeah the ATC sounded mumbly, especially when talking to the ground vehicle.
@AADFWspotters25 жыл бұрын
What reason to include the wind component. It was ONLY 2 KNOTS. Never have heard wind speed and direction paired with go around instructions before.
@VASAviation5 жыл бұрын
I have but only with a significant wind and not 2 knots :(
@RobisonRacing685 жыл бұрын
The guy controllers fault. Really bad communications.
@hoverauto25 жыл бұрын
RobisonRacing68 nope. Pilot only heard the wind and assumed he was cleared to land. He should of confirmed.
@hoverauto25 жыл бұрын
Also, he completely ignored the second go around instruction.
@noah91305 жыл бұрын
Ummar Razac I think it's also the fault of the controler. Why did he say the wind ? And why did he not say "go around I say again go around" when the pilots said "clear to land" ?
@noah91305 жыл бұрын
mipmipmipmipmip Yeah and that's why the pilots didn't understand
@TankTheSpank5 жыл бұрын
Ummar Razac there was no call sign for the 2nd go around. So it could have been talking to anyone.
@robbiebunge8595 жыл бұрын
Probably ATC fault for adding the wind factor. Glad all safe. Thanks for usual top class clip .
@stephenf34335 жыл бұрын
In my opinion it was definately the ATC's fault, they gave too much information in that instruction, a simple 'Go around' even would have been better
@pardismack5 жыл бұрын
it's not a matter of opinion. doc 4444 /12.3.4.18 clearly states that the go-around instruction must be given without wind information.
@TheLuxentertainment5 жыл бұрын
What makes me even more angry than the actual incident is the woman ground controller afterwards that things she has the right to blame the pilot. The Tower did never insist on the go around by repeating it until correct readback by the pilot and what is so difficult to simply say „Tunisair 716 go around, go around“ instead of that mumbling and inserting runway name and wind directions and even forgetting about the callsign in the second radio call
@leexgx5 жыл бұрын
@@TheLuxentertainment well the pilots never heard the actual word cleared for landing just the wind information but I agree they shouldn't have included the wind information on the second go and should have made sure that they repeated the message until they responded with go around
@emporytechnology15025 жыл бұрын
@@leexgx the pilot mistakenly heard "go around" as "cleared to land" without callback and no confirmation from atc.
@leexgx5 жыл бұрын
@@emporytechnology1502 once they had landed when they was talking to the women ATC person the pilot actually said "I did not understand go around " 5:30 Still mixing non vital information with instructions is bad really
@thinkdifferent64035 жыл бұрын
I think it is mainly ATC fault, why give winds and no heading/altitude for the go-around instead? And the second time the controller tells the pilot to go-around, he didn't even mention the callsign of the aircraft he was talking to...
@VASAviation5 жыл бұрын
Heading and altitude is not necessary since the pilots are supossed to follow the standard published procedure.
@robertlinke26665 жыл бұрын
winds, yeah that is dumb. but for large airports go-aroundprocedures are part of the approach SOP, and should been known. and once communication is established you don't give callsigns usually, only at the beginning to identify who you are talking with, and at the end to designate the coversation is over.
@gummel825 жыл бұрын
Have you ever heard of a standard missed approach route? Go around means go around and doesn't allow you to carry on with your approach. No needs for wind or heading just follow the missed approach route
@thinkdifferent64035 жыл бұрын
@@VASAviation i admit, i wasn't totally aware of that. But in this case i guess that it coul'd have helped
@shawnsoul4ver5 жыл бұрын
@@VASAviation but no call sign on last transmission, no acknowledgement of readback..and like every is asking, why winds?? Odd
@alvisegovia5 жыл бұрын
This is why I like the way UK controllers make you confirm of the go around “Speedbird 123 Go around, I say again, Go around, acknowledge” it is so much easier to understand
@Tom_YouTube_stole_my_handle5 жыл бұрын
I wouldn't say the controller sounded angry, just French.
@jeremieszelag67745 жыл бұрын
ah ah no, she was angry..
@Gregorius4215 жыл бұрын
She had the adrenaline pumping, scared that the plane runs into a car under her supervision, with the atc guy not giving clear instructions, and not ensuring a proper readback. A guy who can't speak with understandable accent should double-check that people understand him.
@leexgx5 жыл бұрын
@@jeremieszelag6774 it could of been very bad, for the plane and ground vehicles and her legally if it was a crash (surprised they did not see on radar that they was still coming into land unless go around is to fly over the run way) funny how they said I did not understand what "go around" Ment but the pilot was correct about if they was going to have to do a go around why did she have to provide landing information(wind speed) and at the end of that information say go around without confirmation from the pilots ( as normally when you say go around the pilots should also respond with go around assume that usually provide heading information as well)
@leexgx5 жыл бұрын
Also poor English at one point (taken more then 15-20 seconds to say a 5 second sentence) sounded like the person was starting to have problems with brain (he also did not come back onto radio it was a woman) Also why did they not continue to say abort landing and go around do not land "plane name"
@leexgx5 жыл бұрын
2:00 seems like he was trying to tell them to slow down to minimum speed (was not worded correctly) 4:00 he mixed go around with other information ( heading and the wind) Again 4:17 after just after No to landing (in French) he did repeat go around but again he mixed wind speed and heading again after it , he never made a third attempt to actually tell them to abort the landing, go around objects on the run way (he should of repeated it until he got confirmation) the male ATC person needs to be more prompt on saying go around, abort landing and stop mixing wind and direction information with go around (the pilot and ATC could of caused a lot of death that day)
@toonkoudijs56775 жыл бұрын
They should really ban native language on frequency for critical communication. This would help with the awareness of the pilots firstly and would hopefully help with the awful French accent. Idiotic ATC, which was fully at fault here.
@edwardkong85745 жыл бұрын
I agree with you but that's probably not practical given that even the ATC have such heavy accents, I doubt the ground crew could piece together any sentence with understandable grammar.
@JamEngulfer5 жыл бұрын
I feel sorry for the Tunair pilot. If everything was in English they would have at least had a chance to hear the context with the ground crew. The very strong accent doesn't help either.
@bahenbihen5 жыл бұрын
I dont think they should. Entire South America speaks just Spanish apart from Brazil and most of them dont speak English, so it would be catastrophic if they all started speaking English
@JamEngulfer5 жыл бұрын
@@bahenbihen If they don't speak English, why are they allowed to be in the aviation industry? If they can't communicate with plane crews that don't speak their language, people could die.
@bahenbihen5 жыл бұрын
@@JamEngulfer I used to think like that before too, but for some learning English is very hard - primarily for far eastern nations, French, Spanish etc. If you are for example controling a TRACON in Santiago de Chile and 95% of traffic consists of Spanish speaking pilots, it is far safer to speak Spanish rather than English on a daily basis. I know it would be brilliant if everybody spoke English, but it is just not the case.
@MikeBravoAviation5 жыл бұрын
Veery confusing to hear wind direction on a goaround call.
@megathumper7775 жыл бұрын
They make my blood boil, speaking French to other traffic and ground vehicles on a tower frequency. Who the hell gives a wind read out for a go around. Totally ATC at fault!!!
@kembooo0005 жыл бұрын
oh you don't want to go near any southern american airspace
@sbreheny5 жыл бұрын
The ironic thing is that I bet the Tunisair pilot could speak French better than he could speak English - it's just the rule that English is used for all international ATC.
@Helicasech5 жыл бұрын
Well, there is definitely a language problem in aviation. Bear in mind that the ICAO has defined six official languages to be used for communication in aviation and French is one of them...
@megathumper7775 жыл бұрын
I honestly the English should be mandatory on Tower frequency
@OctoBooze5 жыл бұрын
@@sbreheny Just because a country is listed to have two official languages doesn't mean everyone knows how to speak both.
@foxx84145 жыл бұрын
I feel like the go around was blended into the flow of the sentence at the first time he was told. A well spaced and pronounced go around before the rest of the instructions would've made things a lot clearer in my opinion
@krubokrobu5 жыл бұрын
OMG so many errors! ATC communications are designed to tolerate errors, but not this many: 1. 2:13 ATC should inform Inspection 1 that traffic is arriving in 3 minutes 2. 2:48 ATC should inform Inspection 1 that traffic is arriving in 2 minutes 3. 2:53 Inspection 1 should clarify its required time better (maybe, recording is poor) At 4:02 ATC should say "Tunair 716 go around" instead of "Tunair 716 goaroundthewind 320 degrees 2 knots": 4. ATC should say "go around" clearly without eliding it with "the wind" 5. ATC should not say the wind at all in this instruction 6. 4:07 Since the instruction was unclear, Tunair should say "confirm" or "say again" instead of "clear to land runway 26" At 4:11 ATC should say "Negative Tunair 716 Go Around I Say Again. Go. Around." instead of "Negat... Uh... Uh... Negative. Go around runway 26 wind 320 degrees 2 knots": 7. ATC shouldn't interrupt the word "Negat" 8. Since readback was dangerously wrong, ATC should use a slower and clearer voice this time 9. ATC should not say the runway in this instruction 10. ATC should not say the wind in this instruction (Added) 11. 4:21 (recording of Inspection 1 is poor, but assuming this is him) Inspection 1 should have heard the misunderstanding of errors 4-10 and should not take the frequency to say anything. (He should, however, make every effort to vacate the runway immediately, which perhaps he did.) 12. 4:28 Since the instruction was unclear, Tunair should say "confirm" or "say again" instead of saying nothing. Or, if no time to confirm anymore, Tunair should initiate his own go around due to failed communication of landing clearance. 13. 4:28 Since first go around readback was wrong, and second time was not read back, ATC should repeat Go Around instruction a third time. 14. 4:58 Second controller should not say "Cleared" in "you were Cleared for going around procedure". Even though the incident already happened, this shows that misleading phraseology is widespread in this tower and not limited to the first controller. 15. 5:07 Tunair's responses to ATC after landing seem to suggest that he had a clue before landing that his landing clearance might not be right. In that case, he should have initiated his own go around, even if he never heard the go around from ATC.
@efoxxok74785 жыл бұрын
For what it's worth at the 5:20 mark the pilot says he saw the trucks "vacated the runway". Not that it make much of a difference in the outcome. While the controller did call for a go-around the pilot read back the landing clearance and the controller never followed up fully, and never got an acknowledgement. This is a clear case of "a message unacknowledged is a message unreceived." This falls fully on the controller. No matter what, failure to get a read back on the go-around full falls on them. Their highest priority should have been getting an acknowledgement of the go-around, no way around that. I think upon examination of this incident the controllers involved will wish they and not the pilots would have done something different.
@ianhawthorn15275 жыл бұрын
Why did the pilot even bring up seeing the trucks vacating. Isn't it irrelevant to whether or not there was a go around. Did they see the trucks vacating and decide to ignore the go around instruction and land?
@emporytechnology15025 жыл бұрын
@@ianhawthorn1527 the pilot mistaken "go around" instruction with "cleared to land" hence seen the truck vacating seem to confirm "cleared to land". And even the 2nd go around instruction no callback from pilot.
@lordauriel87245 жыл бұрын
so I have a question. Why didn't the tower controller insist on correct readback after giving go-around clearance and not getting a readback. I can kindof understand why the a320 misheard "cleared to land" instead of "goaround", probably due to expectations. But there is a reason why a clearance should be given at the END of a transmission, after wind info. like, "XXX wind 180 degress 12 knots go around", not the other way round.
@afh76895 жыл бұрын
Tunisia (along with Algeria) is a country that is largely bilingual Arabic & French and had close relations with France (as former colony and francophone country). I'm surprised when they didn't understand English instructions, that they wouldn't communicate in French to the pilots.
@fredinator81645 жыл бұрын
Even so, this whole "Using the foreign language cause oh look those guys might understand us" is a mess in my opinion. Instructions should not only be heard by the aircraft that they're intended for, but also by other pilots, so they can get a sense of the traffic situation.
@compulsiverambler13525 жыл бұрын
@@fredinator8164 You mean the local language? This is France and they were speaking French, not a foreign language.
@AviationJeremy5 жыл бұрын
My policy is never land until you clearly hear “cleared to land”. ATC definitely could have done better, but ultimately, understanding and following ATC orders is the crew’s responsibility.
@haugstule4 жыл бұрын
5:44 pilot: "so will i, idiots"
@kimpong67925 жыл бұрын
Actually, the title should rather be "A320 lands while cleared to go-around". Being french, I can hear the runway inspection crew say that they vacated the runway before the aircraft touched down ;)
@lancomedic5 жыл бұрын
@Kim Pong That's good info. Did they also say "stand by while we get a change of underwear" :)
@danmack31735 жыл бұрын
I thought there was some regulation passed years ago after an aircraft collision because ATC was speaking multiple languages
@kozmabalazs5 жыл бұрын
As an unworthy sofa pilot, I am more than glad to help French inspectors how to evaluate that report. An instruction was issued, the aircraft did not read back properly, that happens all the time. The next go around instruction was actually NOT addressed towards the flight - there was no callsign at the front of the message, also the message was broken apart. This is a critical moment of flight, almost before touchdown,these "eeee-eeeeeeergh" chokin sounds are just no help. No further comm towards TAR was initiated afterwards he read back the clearence incorrectly. That is my two cents.
@anilhaksever5 жыл бұрын
I -- Ooo -- Wish -- oo -- ATC -- ee -- would speak English all times so pilots wouldn't get disassociated from the ATC calls. Or think ATC is not very fluent in English and start to make their own assumptions. Either case it is distracting. Still though big mistake to "assume" you are cleared without clearly hearing the clearance. Great video and showcase as always !
@ksthebest5 жыл бұрын
Couldn't agree more, I don't understand why this isn't standard practice in some countries. I mean it's fine to say 'bonjour' at first contact but this tower even gives landing clearance in French. Really bad for the non-French speaking pilots' situational awareness at this international airport. Besides, if the controllers spoke more English perhaps their accent wouldn't be so strong.
@florichi5 жыл бұрын
@@ksthebest I have the feeling that the rest of the world just gives a fuck about speaking english on ATC, except Germany, Austria, GB, US, Australia and huge international airports with only international traffic. As a pilot flying into an airport only talking in their countrys language I would first say them to switch to english, because I would want to know what is going on around me. It's sad that a proper nearly accent free pronunciation is not taught in ATC and flying schools. There are a lot of good examples on KZfaq of pilots not able to explain a situation, which needs english skills outside of standard phrases.
@3x3-x3x-oXo5 жыл бұрын
@@florichi Tunisians speak perfect French. Wouldn't have changed a thing.
@OctoBooze5 жыл бұрын
Yes, they did not fully hear the clearance... which is why they readback to check for errors because the rest of it sounded spot on like a landing clearance. They checked if they heard right and said "cleared to land" and got a really sketchy response so they tried again and instead of correcting the communication error the ATC starts to blank for seemingly an eternity on the comms talking to the inspection crew. The tunisair crew then naturally assumes their readback was correct and proceeds... 99% ATC error.
4 жыл бұрын
Well, he 'clearly' said "Go ahead" in his broken, broken English and gave landing instructions next. The pilot's announcement of landing was not countermanded.
@Mustang_21375 жыл бұрын
Shouldn't the atc say his callsign before telling him about wrong readback and to go around?
@florianhofer24765 жыл бұрын
Several mistakes and problems here in terms of human factors. 1. Non-ICAO standard language used for ATC-pilot communication. Common awareness is nearly equal zero, if pilots don't speak french. (I know this is done in many different parts of the world, but is a problem.) 2. Wind instructions with a go around instructions are missleading, especially on short final where pilots are really really focused on flying the aircraft. 3. Wrong anticipation on an instruction, without clear understanding. 4. Probably a huge difference of experience between captain and FO. Which could result in a situation where the FO didn't tell the captain that he's wrong. (reminds of several accidents around the world... and is still a huge problem in cockpits... We had such an incident latelly, which was corrected on ground...)
@Artificial-Insanity4 жыл бұрын
I get that they misunderstood the first instruction but when ATC says "negative, go around", you really don't have an excuse anymore.
@williamdegnan47185 жыл бұрын
Thanks for the translations. The highlight indicating who is transmitting helps too.
@MonishJohnson5 жыл бұрын
What type of ATC he is where he gives wind information on Go Around but not in the time of landing clearance as done for the next traffic 45GJ 05:55. Btw why he was singing that song from 04:33 - 04:46 where he should had asked TUNAIR716 again for GoAround.
@alienb12125 жыл бұрын
I mean they're french..
@albula6425 жыл бұрын
He did say the wind but it wasn't translated. I agree completely though on giving winds on go-around being stupid.
@leexgx5 жыл бұрын
Seems to be a French thing that they must do include wind information evening vital information about not landing
@ChrisVonToph5 жыл бұрын
If he did´nt hear "Go around" he could not possibly have heard "Cleared to Land". He did´nt even reconfirm... That´s pure negligence. :-/
@angharadhafod5 жыл бұрын
I'm not so sure. The first time, he confirmed "Cleared to land" (4:09). The difference in sound between "Go around" and "Cleared to land" is not great. The same intonation on each of the three syllables, and the vowel and consonant sounds are somewhat similar. Given accents and static, I can see how it would be easy to hear what you are expecting to hear, rather than what is actually said. Given the comment on the wind, I can see how this could have happened.
@efoxxok74785 жыл бұрын
Harold Kelly agreed. My 30 years experience as a controller tells me this is 100% on the controller. The pilots had every expectation to receive a landing clearance. The purpose of a full read back is to confirm with the pilot that he fully understood any clearance. Any failure on the read back falls fully on the controller.
@haroldk7245 жыл бұрын
Well then I totally agreed to the wrong thing
@Chris564564 жыл бұрын
@@angharadhafod, In my opinion, he only acknowledged clearance to land, he didn't ask to confirm it, which by the hesitation in the response he should have.
@dumbassdriversofdenver91135 жыл бұрын
I'm no pilot but I'd say this is on both ATC and the pilot, with some possible radio issues. The pilot confirmed cleared to land and ATC corrected him. ATC did not confirm that the instructions to go around we're received. This is why instructions are read back.
@Wheelabarraback4 жыл бұрын
We are now being bombarded with ads unfortunately. Two ridiculous ones in a row at the beginning. Thanks for posting!
@VASAviation4 жыл бұрын
Thank you for watching! Glad you liked it :)
@karlosbricks24135 жыл бұрын
At 5:15 he says ''we saw the people, er, the two trucks just vacated from the runway er 26''
@onemercilessming13425 жыл бұрын
KarlosBricks--His field of vision was in front and his speed, relative to the ground, was far faster than any ground vehicle could have moved to avoid a collision. He didn't THINK that, perhaps, there were ground vehicles that his wing could have struck. Regardless of what other information was provided, or what he could see, the instruction was clear, "GO AROUND".
@kembooo0005 жыл бұрын
@@onemercilessming1342 he was not. dude has binoculars and a screen in front of him with airplane's altitude's information. you don't just give a go around instruction and go take a sip of coffee
@vincentkorpel86955 жыл бұрын
ATC tell him: go around, the pilot will hear clear to land, AND windcheck. So after the 1st go around call, i heard no good NEGATIVE from ATC, but only a sort of negat…. so i can see where the problem started… (4:00)
@theHDRflightdeck5 жыл бұрын
Standard phraseology. “ABC123 Go-around, I say again go around”
@sanantonio8555 жыл бұрын
Standard French phraseology includes wind for some reason
@Tobra12774 жыл бұрын
He (pilot) did not hear the “go around” according to his answer to the controller anger, but he can hear the wind direction and speed and also the runway number (designation). The big question mark, why the controller need to say the wind and runway instead of just “go around.. go around..”
@erictaylor54625 жыл бұрын
The controller can say "Go around" 200000 times, if the pilot never hears "go around" then they were never actually told. Radios are not 100% reliable. If you are concentrating on something else, like landing the plane without breaking it, it is easy for the pilots to miss something like that. This is why there needs to be a clear, reliable way to signal the pilot to "go around." Flashing the approach lights would work nicely, because that is the one thing you'll know the pilot is looking at. Did the go around order even reach the plane? Is it clearly audible in the CVR?
@sergiyp.38865 жыл бұрын
Controllers are really week there. WHO gives the wind during go- around instructions?! It is confusing. Plus the controller should change the tone of his voice to alert the crew and repeat as many times as necessary. Controllers need to be reprimanded as well as the pilot, who didn't pay enough attention. A Classical case of psychological deafness . Pilot hears what he wants (or expects) to hear.
@sanantonio8555 жыл бұрын
It's standard French phraseology to give the wind during go around.
@maxsupergiovane4 жыл бұрын
Something like "Tunair 716, wind 320 degrees, 2 knots, runway 26, clear to go around."
@madrockxvx5 жыл бұрын
So many issues with this, 1. they should not have been speaking French on frequency... Then the pilots would have understood more of the situation. 2. after giving the incorrect readback, the controller failed to properly correct them. 3. the woman wasn't listening - the pilots told her twice they heard cleared to land. They should have indicated that was what they read back as well, but either way I'm sure it'll all be sorted once investigators listen to the tapes.
@AirspotterUK5 жыл бұрын
A better instruction would be to give a go around instruct twice, Goaround I say again go around, Only then after the crew acknowledge or visibly going around, maybe give wind, I do not think the wind is so vital because the wind is surface wind and its light, The aircrafts on board wind would give a better realtime go around wind. The pilot didn't hear the go around and assumed it was a cleared to land because the instruction contained wind info, Seems he was reacting to what he was expecting rather than what was being instructed. - Confirmation Bias is a killer. The pilot replied clear to land so the controller should have been more clearer and repeat the instruction until he got it.
@fredinator81645 жыл бұрын
In my opinion ATC was at fault here, he didn't get a readback the second time (why would he, he didn't say their callsign), so he should have called them again. Also, using both french and english would be super confusing if I was a pilot flying into that airport. In this incident, the Tunisair crew might have heard that the trucks are still on the runway if they would have talked in english.
@maxhvargas5 жыл бұрын
Good point. They should only speak English. The pilots never confirmed the go around and the controller got distracted talking to the ground personnel and didn't use the standard terminology.
@ynot6473 Жыл бұрын
i clearly heard "go around", and when the first go around was answered with"clear to land" the controller clearly stated "negative, go around". the wind speed and direction are not needed, but the "go around" was plain and clear.
@timwalter47255 жыл бұрын
no matter if he didn´t understand the words go around. There was no " cleared to land" instruction... without landing clearance with thos exact words, the pilot needs to initiate the go around on his own with the words " going around"
@aj37515 жыл бұрын
The controller made a good move by saying "call me on short final." I heard Go around clearly both times. And the pilot saw the vehicle on the runway which he admits. I wouldn't gamble with an aircraft like that. Sounds like gotta-get-there-itus. That being said, controllers are responsible for their runways and communications, including getting clear readbacks from pilots. In this case, it sounded like two transmissions at once (4:19) which blocked the readback, but this is where the controller should step in and say "I say again, TAR716 Go around!" The controller also never told the inspection crew about traffic until they were a minute away! I realize that that could be a good amount of distance, but I've never seen a runway inspection take only one minute before. He needed to paint the picture for everyone. And then he practically froze up when it was happening. No good. 50/50
@FrankyLon5 жыл бұрын
I could hear the go around too, but it is very easy sitting in your armchair, reading the summary of events before the video and then listening to it, knowing what happened, ti what to expect, what to listen for and even having subtitles added. I would really like VASAviation to upload some vids without any subtitles every now and then, it would be interesting to see how much the armchair pilots really understand clearly. You and me are just listening to a conversation to which we are dedicating our full attention, those guys had a plane to fly as well, I imagine they had a bit more on their plates then just listening to what that ATC tried to tell them.
@aj37515 жыл бұрын
@@FrankyLon Indeed it is, but as someone who works in a control tower I can't exactly hold back from my feelings. You're definitely right though, hindsight is 20/20
@raixbox3605 жыл бұрын
french accent on top of wind direction doesn't help at all. just adds to more confusion
@Trek0015 жыл бұрын
"Really, really dangerous" lady ATC sounded like she was disciplining a naughty child
@Hadzz955 жыл бұрын
You could have gotten a boo-boo, sir!
@alexb48283 жыл бұрын
In my opinion it was the controller's fault because he gave wind information and runway number when he instructed the go around. A few moments later the lady said he "cleared you for go around procedure" but a go around is not a clearance, it's an instruction.
@garycharles86495 жыл бұрын
ATC should have been more clear no wind report needed when informing to go around.
@wildgurgs36145 жыл бұрын
I was thinking the same thing as I heard that. MAYBE the pilots were only pretending to be confused, but I don't see much benefit in a wind check along with a go-around instruction. Also, I would omit the RWY number unless there's a similar callsign on final for a different RWY.
@martinslischka31155 жыл бұрын
Well.. Firstly I didn't know that Frech is a ICAO approved language to use but I have to say one thing...As a person who doesn't speak French nor Spanish I always feel very confused when listening to frequencies in countrues speaking those languages(eg. Mexico, Brazil, Spain, France and others) because I don't understand what's happening on the airport which lowers my overall understanding of the current situation on the airport. I can imagine that the Tunisair pilot was kinda "confused" as well as me(at least a bit more than if he was landing somewhere where they speak English only). Also.. Why the hell would you give current wind during a go around procedure and thus make the pilot feel he just misunderstood the clearance. Secondly - he clearly repeated "cleared to land" and after that there was no direct disapproval from the ATC followed by a proper readback by the pilot. The ATC couldn't have been sure about what the pilot understood. I do believe this was the fault of the ATC, they should have made sure that the Tunisair pilot understood the go around and not ignoring the wrong readback.
@karlosbricks24135 жыл бұрын
The languages of overall do cause a more dangerous environment yes, as you say with the situational awareness, but I as a non pilot do enjoy picking up the aviation terms in other languages, to help my situational awareness, should I ever need. yeah, I agree ATC was pretty poor here, seemed to be doing something else as the flight landed too, given his slow response to the truck. I suspect the ATC will end up with at least 50% responsibility. In the event though, pilot thought he had clearance, and checked the runway was clear, so it all seems under control.
@fabioguedes48725 жыл бұрын
It could be harder for you but why should the other 90% of traffic that is local flights and other airport personnel be burden having to speak in a non native language?
@karlosbricks24135 жыл бұрын
@@fabioguedes4872 To allow for 100% of people to be able to understand what is going on? and to allow for good situational awareness by all?
@martinslischka31155 жыл бұрын
@@fabioguedes4872 Why would it be only in French and Spanish countries then and not the others? :) Honestly, I do believe that English should be the number one language everywhere. I do understand, that for example during emergency situations, the emergency traffic can use native language because it's probably easier to describe the problem in details. But come on - saying basic phrases like "cleared to land" in English isn't such a big problem..
@TheReverses785 жыл бұрын
Hum believe me, The tunisian pilot understand perfectly french, Tunisia is a former french colony, YOu would like to understand everything around you?? Dude you're no pilot, you don't know what it feels like!!!
@HamSweetHam254 жыл бұрын
this is why we dont include the winds in a go around, it should be "Go Around, i say again, go around, acknowledge"
@cdmx275 жыл бұрын
Dunno why but the light on the ground car at 2:42 cracked my up. I btw love these videos so thank you for your good job every time.
@tinojsachintha78855 жыл бұрын
ATC so unprofessional. Why do they use French on radio? Everyone on the frequency does not understand French. And it’s so disturbing you hear two languages on radio.
@VASAviation5 жыл бұрын
French is one of the approved ICAO languages.
@tinojsachintha78855 жыл бұрын
I thought it should be English all the time. Thanks for the info.
@lillemand55 жыл бұрын
The ATC should always communicate in English. Switching between the languages creates confusion.
@VoraciousAvgeek4 жыл бұрын
4:36 drowning in a deep swimming pool be like
@ziggy2shus6244 жыл бұрын
In a situation like this the "go around" command should be repeated 3 times to make sure the pilot understands. In this case the "go around" was lost in the other information.
@qweit_forza6358 Жыл бұрын
Exactly it was clearly not the pilots fault
@jordanc74905 жыл бұрын
Air Traffic Controller Fault.
@eduardopessoa56795 жыл бұрын
If the atc inform go around why he said the wind? This confused the pilots i guess
@sanantonio8555 жыл бұрын
Standard French phraseology
@norbert16364 жыл бұрын
Oh, so ATC has been well trained in filing reports, surely not in communication with pilots. First time I heard phrase "you are cleared to go around" with wind data. LFPO is quite busy airport yet they stick to French. Same problem was when ground control cleared KLM and EZY for pushback in Dutch at EHAM and the result was tail-to-tail collision not that long ago.
@horasano2 жыл бұрын
You can not thought,you have to be sure,if you hesitate, you have to ask again for conformation.Tower tried to be polite at first:)
@tbhightower98445 жыл бұрын
ATC informed TAR716 that 26 was under inspection and to maintain min approach speed and report short final to try and get TAR716 in. To ANY pilot this means there are vehicles on the runway and pilot awareness should be at the highest as a go-around may be coming. Then the GO AROUND comes. TAR716, hearing wind information thinks that means Clear to Land. Then comes NEGAT, followed by negative, GO AROUND and wind information again. I Have to disagree with most of the comments here, Go Around means Go Around no matter what is said afterwards. This pilot lost situational awareness and landed the plane based on some wind information totally ignoring all other information. Landing with vehicles on the runway most certainly leads to catastrophe. I usually side with pilots but in this case, NEGAT.
@flyoverfredusa5 жыл бұрын
So poor from atc, why on earth would he give him wind direction etc on a go around ?
@icarus_falling3 жыл бұрын
The wind information made it sound like a cleared for landing. Especially when you have two people for whom English is a second language. In a go around just say "[aircraft id] GO AROUND" so it's clear.
@g35tr3 жыл бұрын
Definitely seems odd to give wind info on a go-around, especially considering that when they cleared the next plane to actually land, they didn't give any wind info at all!
@juliusreiner57335 жыл бұрын
To me this is 100% ATCs fault: 1) They created an unsafe situation by talking to the inspection crew in French. While Tunisair was notified about the runway inspection in process, they did not have full situational awareness since conversations between the tower and the crew were in French. IATA official language is English and all communications on channels that feature any non-native local language speakers should be in English. 2) ATC never got a correct read back of the go-around order. They should have continued to say "go around" until they got a correct read back. And each time with increasing urgency. 3) ATC distracted Tunisair with the wind readout and muddled the transmission by saying the most crucial piece of info without any emphasis. I'm not a pilot but I see from these ATC videos why the pilot thought he was cleared to land, since generally the calls are "Cleared to land, wind is ___." - The only thing Tunisair did "wrong" was fail to understand 2 radio transmissions that were given in a poor fashion and never read back correctly. It is ATC's responsibility to make their requests clear.
@martintheiss7435 жыл бұрын
They are based in a nation that was a close French colony back in the day. French should be an important secondary language for the flight crews.
@juliusreiner57335 жыл бұрын
@@martintheiss743 the official language of aviation is English. It's only by chance that the arriving aircraft was from a former French colony. The airport in question takes arrivals from across Europe and the world. Furthermore, there's no guarantee that even a pilot at a French airline is French or speaks French. Airlines hire pilots from around the world. One of the benefits of a standard language is it *prevents* incidents by making sure everyone is on the same page; they are not on the same page when the policy is violated.
@martintheiss7435 жыл бұрын
@@juliusreiner5733 sounds like you observe a death wish. FAA counterpart in France has a long investigative history. I don't like the chances for the first arrivals controller. Insisting on French when they got away with it. Dumb.
@SuperMcfly125 жыл бұрын
Why do I care what the wind is if I'm going around? Doesn't make sense.
@44hawk284 жыл бұрын
This is the first time I've ever heard Communications in anything other than English. There is a reason why English is the only language to be spoken in air traffic. And when you say go around you don't just say it as a oh, by the way, we might like you to go around, and here's the wind speed and the runway we've already told you to land on. The other one I cannot figure out is why did they tell the inspection team it was all right to be on the runway if they had already given clearance for a landing. I just recognized why they're speaking French instead of English. There in Canada. Only French Canadians are so arrogant as to ignore standard procedure across the rest of the Civilized world. They almost killed people when they forced the metric system and they were half loading fuel on aircraft.
@bugattiss115 жыл бұрын
Oh it's nice to see my country's flag carrier airline on your channel ! keep up ! :)
@zeymon12925 жыл бұрын
How about French controllers start speaking english on frequency?
@Aupsi25 жыл бұрын
How about the Controllers learn some english. Very bad french accent.
@aviatordube5 жыл бұрын
Doesn’t matter if he heard the wind direction. He clearly heard “GO-AROUND” so he should’ve obeyed.
@fuckjewtube695 жыл бұрын
He responded with cleared to land and the ATC didn't correct him properly.
@MrVin7203 жыл бұрын
I hope Inspector 1 had a good reason to be on the runway that long. When I inspect a runway, I’m quite clear to tower for any reason to stop. And as soon as I do, tower usually sends planes around immediately. There’s some ‘splaining to do by all three parties.
@IS-lz5ev5 жыл бұрын
VFR now includes landing i guess
@BrokebackBob5 жыл бұрын
I thought English was the global mandatory language of aviation, it is for science.
@xSaucecode5 жыл бұрын
It is. Doesn't mean they have to use it
@javiercaselli5 жыл бұрын
It is commons practice to use the native language if possible (i.e. between ATC and pilots who have the same native language). The ATC defaults to English when they communicate with a foreign airline or are spoken to in English.
@VASAviation5 жыл бұрын
French is an approved ICAO language.
@TheReverses785 жыл бұрын
May be because others languages have enough vocabulary to express themselves in a language other than english??? Don't you think???
@RaysDad5 жыл бұрын
It had been a long flight. The pilots were tired and had already gone around once. They saw the trucks leaving the runway and decided not to go around again for no reason.
@paulin16065 жыл бұрын
He Said "go around" twice. Orly airport has one runway for arrivals and one for takeoffs. the pilots know that, , so i you hear "goaround".....If you think just a little bit ( or change job...), you should ask at least for confirm...plus, most tunisians understand french so thats no excuse