True Bore Alignment System In-Depth (for Metal Lathe)

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True Bore Alignment System In-Depth (for Metal Lathe)

Рет қаралды 47,701

Күн бұрын

Get your own TBAS: bit.ly/2RPD8bh
Take Gordy Gritters' class: extremeaccuracy...
Full Story: bit.ly/3eKHbOR
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UR on Patreon: / ultimatereloader
Nathan Dagley over at Straight Shot Gunsmithing developed the True Bore Alignment System (TBAS) to make lathe alignment jobs both quicker, and better (stress free). And that’s what we’ll be exploring in-depth in this video!
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Ultimate Reloader LLC / gavintoobe Material Connection Notice:
The following Ultimate Reloader partners are featured in this video:
- Straight Shot Gunsmithing
Ultimate Reloader partnerships involve one or more of the following:
Product supplied for evaluation + testing + features in videos/articles, paid advertising and promotions, engineering and product development services, scientific testing and evaluation, external media production and related marketing services.
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Пікірлер: 81

@charltovorster4319 2 жыл бұрын

Great video Gavin, just a note, when you place the true bore plate onto the spindle, the mark on the locking screws for the cam ( number 1, etc.) should when tightened, be between the two V marks on the plate. if it is not, you need to take off the plate and adjust the height of the cam pins with the screws located right next to them, this should be done until all of the marks when tightened, are between the two V's. This helps with alignment and keeping the plate at zero runout for long periods of time. Cheers, a fellow machinist.

@karolinaopaczynska7562 11 ай бұрын

well it's a lathe kzfaq.infoUgkxN9zrzkkhnjUF5PQbuA_B1gYdsfCu9k6z but it wasn't what i would have anticipated. Headstock, tailstock, carriage apron are manufactured from aluminum now not cast iron. The spindle diameter for the bearings is too small allowing for a few play in the spindle so I am using some blue Loctite to take out the play.

@tonydevich7937 Жыл бұрын

I'm glad people like yourself are out there to help people out, GREAT JOB

@craiglovelace1753 3 жыл бұрын

Nathan is an amazing machinist and Rifle Smith! Builds a heck of a rifle, glad to have a few customs built by him and even happier to live an hour down the road from him.

@brguide 3 жыл бұрын

I love mine. Glad you finally got one. You will see how fast it takes to indicate in now. Very slick set up and even better for no stress.

@Sub-it7zs 3 жыл бұрын

I’m glad you got one. Nathan is a standup guy! Builds great rifles as well.

@Ultimatereloader 3 жыл бұрын

Thanks, yes, I'm very glad to have my TBAS, and to be able to work with Nathan!

@tonydevich7937 Жыл бұрын

Gavin thank you for all you do, im thinking of a leblond 1330r

@tonydevich7937 Жыл бұрын

I'm excited for you, been maching for 35 years,im going to make a couple of rifles myself,retired in a couple

@dennisl4000 5 ай бұрын

I know nothing about this, but find it amazing. Thanks for sharing!

@blakemadigan9925 3 жыл бұрын

ive had to make a shit ton of bushings to thread muzzles with my tbas but on my haas tl2 this is the only real option for double dialing since the headstock is so deep ive also had to go to rigid reaming which beats the floating holder method by a long shot

@bobabbott8370 Жыл бұрын

I bought based on your video. What did you finally end up with for runout?

@GT3Hank 7 ай бұрын

Hi Gavin. I just received my own TBAS and notice that you aren't dialing in the work piece as prescribed in the instructions. I am wondering if that means you found a better way to do it or if you are just more comfortable with the method you demonstrated. In any case, are you still using the TBAS, and, if so, are you still using the method used in the video. I will try it both ways and see for my self but interested in any comments you have to share with two years of experience at this point. Thank you for all the great and educational and entertaining videos!

@ccfirearms 21 күн бұрын

With that thing being so long/thick how do you get a reading on the muzzle end to verify north/south etc?

@magic4221 4 ай бұрын

VERY interested in that small 3/8 drive torque wrench. Please where,brand name, aprox price etc. thanks.

@tommyj7087 4 ай бұрын

Do you have to buy a new chuck with it or can you use the chuck you already have?

@magnus5356 3 жыл бұрын

*Will this guarantee a perfect center from now on, or you have to realign it every time it come off the lathe? (Or will it stay on permanently?) *A bit more indept why this is wanted vs. using a regular 4-6 jaw chuck would be nice Gavin. *Is the 'rod' used an reference tool with perfect/consistent diameter and straightness?

@Ultimatereloader 3 жыл бұрын

Magnus- if you align the chuck to the spindle, it will re-mount to the lathe centered each time (I'm going to mark my "pin #1" on the TBAS). RE: compared to a 4-jaw and spider- this fixture imparts less stress on the barrel or action, and is quicker to dial-in in my experience. Yes, the ground rod is for alignment reference.

@magnus5356 3 жыл бұрын

@@Ultimatereloader Thanks for clarifying. Love the indept technical and machining stuff you do!

@duckslayer11000 3 жыл бұрын

@@Ultimatereloader the chuck setup will repeat fairly consistently but rifle bores aren't straight and seldom centered so you have to dial them individually for best results. I do believe you hit a point of diminishing returns at some point. But the fact is treating every barrel as a unique setup will always provide ultimate accuracy.

@johnferguson2728 2 жыл бұрын

Just curious, do you need the lathe spider when using this system?

@richardwitt4308 2 жыл бұрын

I was wondering the same thing. I'm guessing no. Since this is supposed to be the same with short and long barrels. Even really short barrels that don't pass through the headstock. Which obviously wouldn't be able to use the spider anyways

@TedRoza 3 жыл бұрын

Hi Gavin . Great video & walk through in assembling etc. Looking at the adapter with the chuck assembly, will the added weight be a bit heavy on the spindle Barings. Keep up the Great Videos. Catch you on the Next One

@jeffreyparks9923 9 ай бұрын

Is a spider still required? Or eliminated all together?

@richardmattix5322 7 ай бұрын

out standing work

@FullSendPrecision 3 жыл бұрын

Heh. I ordered one after seeing it in Gordy's shop. Nice kit for sure.

@Ultimatereloader 3 жыл бұрын

Very cool- I trust you had a good time at the class? :) I sure did!

@FullSendPrecision 3 жыл бұрын

@@Ultimatereloader No doubt. My gunsmith and mentor went there a few years ago. Been wanting to go for a long time.

@chethaynes5802 3 жыл бұрын

Great Info ! Thank You 😃

@TXPremierSporting 2 жыл бұрын

love all your videos. thanks

@mdk777s6 3 жыл бұрын

Wait! What? How are you going to indicate barrels or anything in now? Is it a Gator Tech-Tru chuck? So you are going to throw a barrel in the .0004" repeatable chuck the indicate down?

@brguide 3 жыл бұрын

The entire back plate that the chuck attaches to is where you indicate in the barrel at which in turn does not introduce any stress in the system.

@badoldboy5557 3 жыл бұрын

Who needs this - if the spindle is worse? - ok - but now what about your tailstock - the center? Well, I've never had a machine like this. I only used it at work - German machine quality - we had bearings made at SKF

@chadbakkene5056 Жыл бұрын

So if you have a 26"-30" barrel that isn't perfectly straight, hanging 22"-26" out the backside of that chuck, spinning at around 600-1000rpm, how do you deal with the whip created by the centrifugal force of it being out of balance?

@randomidiot8142 Жыл бұрын

A spider on the backside of the spindle restrains its movement. If it's minimally eccentric the forces are pretty low, so the outboard spider doesn't need to be super beefy.

@Irishjay1025 3 жыл бұрын

Stop making videos I am trying to save money for a big vacation and now I am ready to spend it on a lathe and all the goodies you show in your videos hahaha.

@Ultimatereloader 3 жыл бұрын

Sorry! (not really :) )

@olanordmann7836 3 жыл бұрын

I need to start to make my own guns in preperation for SHTF. Do you have any books to recomend on how to make guns from scratch?

@SpinandThrowDiscGolf Жыл бұрын

I've tried to contact Nathan so I can buy one of these true bore systems. He doesn't answer his phone he doesn't answer texts and he's not answering any of his emails. If you have some idea how to get a hold of him please let me know

@tomliemohn624 3 жыл бұрын

These look pretty badass. Any suggestions on how to grip a tapered barrel with one? That is a hurdle I've not yet traversed successfully.

@Ultimatereloader 3 жыл бұрын

I'm using shims, see: kzfaq.info/get/bejne/pbt3bNSo25qpemg.html

@FullSendPrecision 3 жыл бұрын

You have a link or part number for that torque wrench?

@tonydevich7937 Жыл бұрын

Cool,like it.

@jonlennon3348 3 жыл бұрын

Gavin how much did the adaptor and chuck actually cost and where did you buy it.

@Ultimatereloader 3 жыл бұрын

First link in video description!

@jhawker2895 3 жыл бұрын

Just one question ... Was this given to you or did you buy this system? Doesn't matter but I would like to know... Thanks for sharing.

@Ultimatereloader 3 жыл бұрын

I have a partnership with SSG- as disclosed in the video description (as in all videos)! So no, I did not pay for the product here.

@jhawker2895 3 жыл бұрын

@@Ultimatereloader Thank you for your honesty. I would love to own one to use on my PM-1440GT lathe, but the cost is a little out of my budget. I purchased my PM-1440GT because of your review and I have never regretted my decision. The PM-1440GT is an awesome lathe and everything I could ever wish for in a lathe. I continue to enjoy your videos and look forward to your next project.

@Rprecision 3 жыл бұрын

Not a bad gig, $2800 tooling for 1 video

@dahut3614 3 жыл бұрын

@@Ultimatereloader How is it you have a Gator chuck and not the TMX chuck sold by SSG?

@nathanmagman 3 жыл бұрын

@@dahut3614 I actually sell both TMX and Gator. TMX had been backordered for many months. I had these in stock when Gavin ordered. I currently have both in stock and the Gator chucks will be added to my website hopefully soon. You can order by phone if you want the gator chuck. They are both great chucks

@sketchbooksquared 3 жыл бұрын

have a nice day cool person

@Je3perscre3pers 3 жыл бұрын

im saving up for a lathe and im so excited for this stuff. is the precisiom mathews 12x36 a clone of the grizzly 12x36?

@magnus5356 3 жыл бұрын

I would say it's likely the other way around if you just look at cost and area of manufacturing. Grizzly's are Chinese and/or Taiwanese, they don't really wanna say... PM is Taiwan made.

@Je3perscre3pers 3 жыл бұрын

@@magnus5356 im happy with my grizzly minimill but PM doesnt seem to have financing.

@CJ-ty8sv Жыл бұрын

@@magnus5356 PM has a Chinese and A Taiwanese version of most of (if not all of) their lathes. Only their Ultra Precision ( PM-XXXXT) are Taiwan where as the ones that do not have the T suffix are Chinese made. Using the original mention of a 12x36 lathe, from PM there is the PM-1236 and a PM-1236T, only the PM-1236T is a Taiwanese made, the regular PM-1236 is Chinese made.

@yeetergang1015 3 жыл бұрын

cool

@terryhunt4324 Жыл бұрын

FYI. You lost torque by using the adapter for the mounting bolts. Especially with the length of the adapter. Not sure how much, but you definitely lost some torque if it matters.

@justindaves1990 Жыл бұрын

Fake news

@richlovin2173 3 жыл бұрын

Captions would help your hard of hearing and deaf followers like me.

@PeterPetrakis 3 жыл бұрын

KZfaq is supposed to auto generate that but it's more absent than not on videos that are "not mainstream"

@airenthusiast1071 3 жыл бұрын

Upper right corner hit the CC button. They work decent. 👍

@jaxchits5666 3 жыл бұрын

Were you paid to do this review? Was there unit free contingent on a review?

@Ultimatereloader 3 жыл бұрын

All of that information is in the video description, for every video in fact!

@jaxchits5666 3 жыл бұрын

@@Ultimatereloader But, do you say it in the video, Gavin? It's your platform and your choice, but amongst a large group of my peers we all feel that you are being disingenuous by not addressing your relationship in the video. The fact is, I have never heard you make a negative comment about products you "feature". While you might add language to the description, you are not giving specifics of the relationship. It would improve your channel if you did.

@D70340 3 жыл бұрын

Gavin, aren`t you a little bit worried about the alfee`bet gangsters visiting you and looking into you doing gunsmithing?

@duckslayer11000 3 жыл бұрын

Ok, but then you have to dial to the bore of every barrel if you want true axial and radial alignment.

@tyj1234able 2 жыл бұрын

Every barrel is different and would need to be aligned individually regardless. This system just makes it a little easier, provided you understand how it is used.

@jjsemperfi Жыл бұрын

Cool product. Went to check price and threw up. I'll continue taking 14 1/2 hours to indicate my barrels haha. Just kidding, this thing looks sweet for gunsmiths or folks who chamber a ton.

@patheron7812 Ай бұрын

Rather than using an expensive gizmo, wouldn't it be better to properly install your lathe? It seems that you are putting a band aid on poor lathe installation. The ways should be properly leveled, and the headstock and tailstock should be carefully aligned.

@Ultimatereloader Ай бұрын

@fluffyfullbox9289 3 жыл бұрын

Just use a Buck Chuck.

@justg2949 3 жыл бұрын

This product doesn't seem to improve much if anything over using a four jaw independent chuck in the way of how quickly you can dial in your barrel. It does add multiple interfaces in comparison to a simple four jaw. Anytime you add those interfaces you introduce more possiblity of movement or error post indication. Another thing I don't hear mentioned is that this product moves the chuck further away from the spindle bearings versus using a chuck mounted directly to the lathe. This imparts, albeit small, additional force on the spindle bearings. That additional leverage result in potential deflection. Seems like a lot of money spent for little to no return. And before you keyboard warriors with no machining experience take off pecking on the keys, I am a highly experienced machinist who has chambered some very accurate rifles. Many well known gunsmiths still chamber between centers. This is more of a sales pitch for an unnecessary product than a review of a innovative product that benefits the majority of end users.

@9point3 3 жыл бұрын

How does one chamber between centers? Kinda hard to get a reamer in the bore with a center in the way. Maybe I'm.confused

@justg2949 3 жыл бұрын

@@9point3 thread the tenon between centers. Use a steady rest to hold the barrel and move the tailstock out of the way. Now you can access the bore of the barrel with the reamer. That's my problem with many of these videos. People are watching them to learn because they just don't have experience. You get sold something by a KZfaqr making a promotional video of a free product they are given. Look up Mike Bryant. He's a world class gunsmith and shooter who has an excellent article on his website about different methods of chambering. I am not bashing Gavin, I like a lot of his build videos. But I don't like useless promotions which impress people with little to no experience who are simply trying to learn something.

@nathanmagman 3 жыл бұрын

I agree with your comment that this system is not needed to build accurate rifles. But I do want to bring some things to your attention. Ultimate reloader approached me several times over several years wanting to Showcase this system. it had been referred to him by someone that uses this system and that Gavin Trusts. My advertising up to this point has been all word-of-mouth, happy customers telling their friends in the industry. Although Gavin did not pay cash for the system he is not getting it for free. He is offering a service to me. He has built a company with great product reviews And a large following. Making and editing videos is not an easy task and it's worth a Fair wage. I believe he only promotes equipment honestly and that he believes in himself. I would never ask anyone to lie about my system. I have not been seeking out someone to promote my product But because of Gavin's persistence and his reputation for Quality reviews I agree to his terms, to benefit both of us. My goal in all of this is to persent what I believe to be a game-changer in the precision rifle building world to a larger platform. This system can only benefit people if they know about it. that is my goal in working with Ultimate reloader. Although it is important to work with what we have, discouraging small improvements and innovative ideas would only keep us in the Stone Age. This idea of it's good enough we don't need to try to improve something I will never stand for. My system is not required to make extreme accurate rifles, the one behind the machine is the one that controls the quality of their work. This is only a tool meant to add efficiency and consistency to the workholding process. And it does work very well! I only build and sell products I use myself and have seen the benefits of. Sincerely. Nathan. Straight Shot Gunsmithing

@justg2949 3 жыл бұрын

@@nathanmagman please don't take my comment as saying this isn't a quality product and a nice addition to a lathe for certain applications. Just as you said, Gavin has a huge following and therefore a tremendous amount of influence on people. Many of his followers likely have little to no machining experience. Showcasing a product like this without clearly pointing out who it's geared towards, who would benefit the most, and some of the negative aspects of the product is a disservice to the viewer. Case in point, by shifting the entire chuck and workpiece off the spindle centerline you can create a serious imbalance which is exaggerated as spindle speed increases. Much more so than offsetting the workpiece in a four jaw chuck. This can create a dangerous situation. I didn't hear that mentioned as a negative or at least precautionary statement. An amateur machinist or gunsmith would be much better served to invest in quality inserted tooling if they don't have it. Or possibly take a course to enhance their skills rather than spend a large amount of money believing a product is magically going to make them understand basic principles of machining and supersede experience behind the machine.

@9point3 3 жыл бұрын

@@justg2949 So you are not chambering between centers.