When a master musician starts to tune their instrument, before the structure of the music itself, there are old, nameless sounds... unholy creaking of worn leather cases, disfigured and discoloured metal hinges, the unintentional scraping of finger over string. With an entire orchestra tuning, believe me, many nameless things are created, none intended to be part of the performance.

I think they're meant to be more incomprehensible than malevolent. Gandalf's might have felt uneasy talking about them out of fear. And it's plausible that if Sauron didn't know these things, Gandalf didn't either and he may just fear what he doesn't know.

It was 1000 years after the fall of Sauron a local taxonomist ventured into passageways and gave names to the nameless things. Unfortunately he got lost trying to make his way back out and the names were lost along with him. Legend has it there’s a notepad down there still with all the names of the nameless things still on it.

There's one possibility you overlook: During the song of the Ainur, they didn't know what they were creating, they just sang their themes. Melkor sang dissonance and brought chaos to the song of the Ainur, it could be possible that these nameless things were a byproduct of Melkor's dissonance during the song of the Ainur, and he would not know about it because they didn't know they were creating things. On the topic of Melkor using the nameless things to create Dragons, I think that is very plausible, even with Sauron not knowing about it. Remember that Morgoth was also very covetous and paranoid, he kept secrets close. He knew dragons were his greatest creation, he surely would hide the secret of weaving dragons into being, even from his closest allies, so only him Melkor the Great would know how to make them. That's like saying that the Witch King would know how to create the One Ring because he's Sauron's Lieutenant. Powerful despots keep secrets for their power close to their chest. So, in short: I don't think Melkor knew at the time of the song he was creating the Nameless Things, but he discovered them later when he dug really deep for Utumno or Angband, and then he used them to create dragons. Edit: on a side note, I also think that the origin of Ungoliant is very similar to this. The dissonance and chaos from the song took shape in them even though they did not know they were creating an universe through that song.

Tolkien once said that “even in mythical age there must be some enigmas” and I think this an example of that.

I believe The Watcher in the water from Fellowship Of The Ring could be one of these nameless things. Tolkien never gave us an origin of The Watcher and the fact it was in the water outside Moria could mean there are underwater tunnels leading from the depths of the earth to the surface and that is where the Watcher came from among those Nameless Things.

Balrogs were specifically Maiar though, not some other kind of created being from before Arda. And what's really weird, is that the Nameless Things are said to be older than Sauron. This suggests maybe Sauron did not enter Arda at the very start.

In The Book of Lost Tales Part 2 and in The Lay of the Children of Hurin Tolkien mentions Nan Dumgorthin, a gloomy valley located between Ered Gorgoroth and Doriath, where "ghostly dwellers" live and worship idols of "nameless gods". And once I have read that Tolkien knew about Lovecraft and quite liked his writings, even if it is possible that he didn't resonated with some of Lovecrafts ideas.

I believe these beings are from the Silence of the Void. Creatures of pure darkness and terror. The Nameless Things are beings like Ungoliant which Melkor could not control. So it baffles me that people think that Sauron could enslave these primordial creatures. Ungoliant was strong enough to kill Melkor and only fled after being swarmed by balrogs.

I tend to think of the nameless thing, Ungoliant, Tom Bombadil, etc as being something like elemental personifications. Tom is likely a personification of aspects of the natural world. Ungoliant is the personification of the Void (consuming even light, like a black hole), or maybe the very essence of hunger. So, maybe the nameless things are elemental representations of darkness, the unknown, or even fear itself.

I'm going to be honest, the depiction of the Balrog at 0:54 is awesome. No horned demon with wings, as awesome as THAT looks.

I have to say I am enjoying this channel very much. As a massive fan of Tolkien from 11 or 12 years old, I am still massively invested in the lore and so I applaud what you are doing here and long may it continue

Note: I researched any Lovecraft/Tolkien connection. Though there appears to be none between the two, they were both inspired by the Norse version of the Kraken Myth. Also, Lovecraft from his "Dagon" (1917) Short Story, does mention HPL's own version of "Nameless things" - "I cannot think of the deep sea without shuddering at the nameless things that may at this very moment be crawling & floundering on its slimy bed, worshipping their ancient stone idols & carving their own detestable likenesses on submarine obelisks..." Let the reader decide.

What really intrigues me is the possibility of the nameless things is that Gandalf, a Maiar, knew them as frightening beings. But consider them being neither malevolent nor benevolent, and simply living as amoral creatures. Being so far underground in their own world, interacting with no one other than each other, they would have little to no reason to have a developed sense of purpose, and never venturing out. If they were simply mindless, and neither good nor evil, and Gandalf still saw them as horrifying then that would say a lot about how frightening they were.

I cannot find any flaws in your hypothesis about the 'nameless things' and like you, I believe they were most likely created during the Great Song, along with Ungoliant. They are certainly not Maiar, like the balrogs and Mairon/Sauron or Gandalf and the Istari, as Sauron would have known of them. It is possible that the balrog in Moria would have encountered them as he traversed the tunnels before his demise. It is also possible that The Watcher In The Water is a nameless thing as we have no idea where it came from and no real name as 'The Watcher In The Water' was just a title given it by the dwarves in Moria.

It’s wild to think that Tolkien could have been inspired partially by Lovecraft, but the theory of them being draconic in at least some fashion is most likely. Much of his influence comes from Norse mythology, which includes Níðhöggr, a dragon that *gnaws* on the world tree’s roots as you pointed out. Even if they weren’t meant to be dragons (I agree they would probably be more fleshed out), no doubt Tolkien wanted some sort of elder beasties as a head nod.

I think when they say the Nameless things were older than Sauron, it meant they were some of the first living things existing on Arda. Eru created the Valar and Maiar to aid in the Song of Creation, which preceded the existence of Arda. At the time, they existed as beings of thought, without physical bodies. The first beings on Arda predated the physical manifestations of the Valar (like Melkor/Morgoth), and Maiar (like Sauron and the Balrogs). So in that respect, they could be considered ‘older than Sauron’. Alternatively, since Sauron was not named as such until later in the First Age (originally being Mairon), it could be that Gandalf meant it in that sense.

I’d say it’s more likely Tolkien just had a very similar idea to Lovecraft. Beings beyond any sort of comprehension and instill terror just by existing. Would it be so unusual that two authors have similar ideas?

They are evil, like Melkor, but not OF Melkor. Not of his kin. But they are not his allies. For all evil hates and they hate him to. Seek not the nameless things. Seek not to define or know them. To do so is to garner their attention. And then they will seek to know you. No, let them remain nameless. Let not their mention darken the light of day. Seek not their machinations. Lest you be consumed by them.

Melkor raised the Misty Mountains so they have an inherently evil aspect to them. Perhaps the nameless things came into existence as a side effect of Melkor creating the Misty Mountains.

Gnaws at the world also evokes hunger or gluttony imagery so I could see an argument that the nameless things are related to Shelobs ancestor. Even Sauron was terrified of the depths her power reached, so much he ended up breaking his deal with her. Alternatively, when the world was formed in song Melkor couldn't make anything original so he twisted others' songs into his creations. What if he ended up making these nameless things as a by-product of twisting others' work he was jealous of? These things slipped through the cracks in the world unnoticed by most beings including their creator. If Melkor was unaware of his creations it would make sense why Sauron wouldn't know of them. So they gnaw at a world they despise or are jealous of in the end.

THANK YOU!!!! That passage at 6:58 from the hobbit is AS important, AS useful, and AS informative as the passage from LOTR about them, so how come basically everyone leaves that out of their video/discussion of the nameless things?!?!?!

I feel like the nameless things are more of a literary device to convey the mysterious and sinister nature of dark places. For instance when Gandalf says there are older and fouler things than orcs in the deep places of the world, and the balrog shows up at the end, more ancient and fouler than the orcs of Moria. My take is thus that the nameless things serve as a way to show how ancient the world is and how out of their league the fellowship is, like theres ancient evil that we do not even know or fathom.

Tolkien, HPL, Poe, Ambrose, Blatty, Goodkind, Rice, G. RR Martin... I am so happy I was alive to view their work! Fantasy to horror... cosmic to Sci-Fi, terrestrial all amazing!

I’m glad Tolkien leaves out solid information on most evil things. We need no more than to know that “it’s not good so stay away, or if possible do away with it” evil deserves no spotlight Kinda ironic how the films turned Sauron into an actual spotlight tho

Peter Jackson kinda did a clever switch on the unused Nameless Things of The Lord of the Rings merging them with the furtherly less explained Wereworms from the Last Desert in the Far East of Middle Earth and using them for a very uncanny fanfiction kaiju-Lovecraftian-like lore-thing on their brief appeareance on the Battle of the Five Armies movie. He mainly figured on to link the issue on some long forgotten earth-burrowers on the Middle Earth and that creature brief mentioned on The Hobbit and linked it with the Nameless Things as some worm-like earth burrowers. There appeareance seems to hint on the last doom of the world after Morgoth´s return as well.

Which AI voice generator did you use for these videos of yours? It did a pretty good job and I think I'd like to use it for a personal project of mine.

The Nameless Things that Gandalf encountered don't necessarily have to be identical to the things that made the caves where Gollum lived. The ones in Gollum's area could have been smaller, younger, weaker nameless things just as there are goblins, orcs, and Uruk hai. Perhaps younger and smaller nameless things live closer to the surface because the nameless things that live deeper are a threat to them, the way young Komodo dragons live in trees to avoid adults that eat them.

The dragons coming from a mutation of the nameless things is the best theory I heard of their origin yet!!! That makes excellent sense!!

I think your theory is brilliant. The origins of the dragons was always not entirely clear. They had intelligence, speech and even wit. That Melkor could have taken 'nameless things' and made them grander - as opposed to lesser and warped - is more than likely. Certainly everything pertaining to Smaug supports that. They have, let's call it, a 'telluric lust'. That is their hunger for gold. In the canon they always go after underground kingdoms as did Smaug. And not all of them, certainly the early 'cold drakes' even had wings. You've nailed it.

It is important to remember that Gandalf and the Valar do not know everything. Sauron became Melkor's servant before the Dark Lord did any deed upon Arda, for Sauron aided him in all these deeds in one way or another, but he did not reveal himself as Melkor's servant until Angband was ready and that it was in the midst of the Years of the Trees. So whether or not both Dark Lords knew of these creatures, I believe, if they came from Melkor, it was probably a consequence during the dissonances in Ainulindalë. In short, we must see Gandalf as someone who, although he is one of the wisest beings in existence, does not know everything and therefore assumes things based on his personal experiences, just like the other ainur.

My interpretation of the Nameless Things are that they represent a foil to conventional life forms that are familiar to Gandalf, similar to a fungus or ant colony. They have a different way of life that he doesn't understand or know, but their existence fits into the music of the Ainur in their own way by recycling or changing the earth in unseen ways. They operate in the shadows, but if they were to become extinct all together, it would have a ripple effect

I've always thought the reason the nameless things weren't spoken of is because they weren't fully to the intent of Eru Ilúvatar. Either "impurities" in the void where he formed Eä, personifications of forces (like decay), byproducts of Morgoth's dispersing of his power into the of Arda or randomness like @SweHumor's theory of tuning sounds here in the comments. I've been argued against, rather convincingly, that Tolkien's omnipotent creator is probably a lot more infallible than any deity that I myself would imagine so things not to Eru Ilúvatar's intent may be impossible.

A thoroughly enjoying discussion on a difficultly obscure member of the lore - Thank you for your contribution towards it!

Anyone else find it funny when he says "Bell-Roggs." LOL

Thank you for this information brother!

I'm enjoying this! The bell has been ring on my end.

The Norse legends talked about a variety of 1 off creatures and unnameable horrors. That particular mythology influenced Tolkien heavily. It’s entirely possible and even likely that Tolkien imagined creating more stories and front loaded that with the “nameless” beings.

Interesting thoughts, although "Even Sauron knows them not, they are OLDER THAN HE" clearly contradicts that they might have been created during the great music or at any later time, given that Sauron was already present for that.

Loved this video!

I love the artwork you added, never seen a bunch of these pieces

EPIC CONTENT

In nordic mythology there is this dragon called Nidhögg, who chomps on the roots of Ygdrasil, the world tree. When he one they finally manages to chew thru, the tree will fall and Ragnarök will begin. Ones then a new world begins, Nidhögg will be revealed to have survived, bringing the dark forces into this world as well.

I like the dragon theory! Cool video as usual!

I think they WERE “created by Melkor”, as it were. My belief, and what I feel like is the only view that truly TRULY holds water…or at least holds the MOST water, is that they were created of the discord in the music, BUT It’s even basically said by Eru that the ainur knew not WHAT they were doing, per se, just that they were singing along. They didn’t know that they were creating things with the music, so Melkor wouldn’t even know what he was actually doing/what he might have possibly created/that he might have created anything. Eru only showed them AFTER, that the music took form into Arda, so these nameless things were born of the discord, older than all(as far as within Arda), and known of by none, save Eru himself.

Tolkien seems to have known very little of Lovecraft work a big while after finishing and publishing the Lord of the Rings trilogy so he didn´t knew about them neither was so fond of his work or knew the Cthulhu mythos probably in all, just some of the previous Dream cycle stories less famous than the cosmic horror ones. However Tolkien was fond of Lovecraft´s coworkers, Robert E. Howard specially Conan stories, and may have known some while doing the Lord of the Rings too. He also was very fond of Clark Ashton Smith but he seems to have known him at the same time as Lovecraft so he didn´t may have gotten influence from there. Anyway beside of the obvious comparative mythology sources coming from the German-Norse Eddas or the Greeks Theogony when addressing the eerie start of the world, he might have known also the precursors of cosmic horror to Lovecraft as Machen, Blackwood, Bierce, Chambers and Hogdson.

First and Foremost Melkor was Chief of the Ainur in the beginning....and the Maier who joined him were the Balrogs so these were more or less his peers who were of like mind and they were with him from the very beginning...Sauron however was the same for Aule and didnt go with Melkor until much later.....that being said this leads me to believe that the Nameless things existed in the Void....we are told that Morgoth went there frequently Alone meaning without the other Ainur.... And it does not say in the Silmarillion that there is nothing in the void and yet Melkor searched there for the imperishable flame so why did Melkor think he could find the imperishable flame in the Void? He must have had good reason to think it was there, the Void must have been a place where things were there not just a hollow and empty echo chamber.... There could have been prior creations of Eru's living there....warped prototype to the Ainur...Eru's Dirty Little Secrets, his failures....Eru told Melkor himself that there is nothing that exists that does not have its roots in Eru...so these nameless things obviously were created by Eru and they scampered and slipped into Arda unnoticed by everyone but Melkor and Eru... Additionally, Sauron always had his fortresses and areas out and away from Morgoth so it's very possible that he was unaware of Melkor using these nameless things to create Dragons.... And I would say more than likely it's probable he was unaware...I can just imagine Sauron asking Melkor and Melkor keeping it a secret for fear Sauron or others could possibly do the same ! Melkor would probably scold him or laugh at Sauron for asking... Also the Balrogs even though Maier were immediately with Melkor so were more akin to peers vs Sauron who was a converted and manipulated Servant that's why he's listed as the greatest servant and the Balrogs were not because Morgoth would view the Balrogs as Brothers and peers, and I don't know why other people haven't thought of that before....If you're getting ready to be devoured by a Massive Dark bloated Spider are you going to call your Greatest Servant or your Brothers to bail you're ass out? Obviously Morgoth called his brothers.... You always see people in art and in conversations portraying Sauron as his besty but thats not the Case more than likely Melkors besty was his Brother Gothmog the Greater.... Anyway these are all my thoughts.... Additionally who is also to say that Eru didnt have Peers that had similar power and traits and their own flame imperishable and the Void was a neutral area between all of them so these nameless things could have been created by other beings like Eru....

It’s pretty much based on nothing but I’d be pretty creepy if the nameless things weren’t creations of Eru Ilúvatar or any other valar. What if they predated the song and maybe even Eru Ilúvatar himself? Simply existing in an existential void until suddenly a world was created around them. Maybe they stay down in the deepest darkest recesses of the world because it’s the most like their old home

This was a great video! I found it very informative and interesting

The lore is breathtaking as always

Hey, I like the callout about the AI voice at the end. Much appreciated!

Wow! That is one of the most convincing AI voices I've heard, I actually had no idea until you mentioned it. Especially impressive given all the fantasy words. What did you use to generate it?

Love your channel. 💕🙏💕 Thank you so much - this video was great. I enjoyed it immensely. Your theories about the nameless things were interesting and I appreciate you taking the time to tease out what these things might be as they have always intrigued me. I also like the voice over. I don’t really get the technology behind it, but I think the voice fits the channel very well. Thanks again. 😊

I dont think Melkor made the nameless beings in the discord, i think the discord Melkor created made the nameless beings itself. not a concious choice to make, but in the music creating life and everything, the discord made some of the things come out corrupted

It would have been legendary if Amazon tackled this in their adaptation instead of identity politics and diversity. The lore of LOTR is so deep and vast.

I can name at least 3 nameless things. This is George, he is a stamp collector."a huge rumble is felt", This is Bill, he is kinda weird but he friendly."a loud roar is heard", and this is Gloria, she is an accountant." a shrill is heard followed by a smooch".

Subscribed. Keep on trucking, video man.

Great video

Great video!

Lord Dunsany (Edward John Moreton Drax Plunkett, 18th Baron of Dunsany) was a major influence on Lovecraft, and considering the body of work he created, that is a more likely source of the Nameless Things, Tolkien did not bring word back, Lovecraft did.

Good Job bro ❤

I'd say you are doing an excellent job with this channel. Your ideas shed new light on one of my most favorite stories. Thank you. Also, the AI voice isn't nearly as AI sounding as most. I kinda like it

Interesting.

Well, it's nightmares for me tonight. :)

Maybe Sauron does know about this "nameless things" but Gandalf doesn't know that becuse he doesn't have a way to ask Sauron about that things he cannot even name.

For me i think during the song their was another besides melkor who wove the nameless things into it who hasnt reveled himself. reason why i think this is due to the unfinished work tolkien abandoned "The New Shadow"

My theory is that the nameless things are a natural result of the discordant singing in the creation of the world. The gods of middle earth were not in harmony when the world was made, and the nameless things could be seen as glitches in the world.

Fair points, the only thing i would point out is you seem to give more stock to Gandalfs words than maybe you should. He was a snoopy fellow for sure and found the truth of things seemingly more often than not, but knowing that Sauron was unaware of them feels more like guesswork on his part. For my money, the nameless things are more or less the same kind of beings as Ungoliant and possibly Tom Bombadil. the idea that they are older than Sauron i think is key. And yes i am aware I am relying on Gandalfs words here, though he seemingly encountered some and being a Maiar this feels like something he could have perceived. At the end of the day, as you said we have precious little info and that seems like it was intentional. Both for the flow of the storytelling and for evoking the dread happenings of Gandalfs ordeal.

Nice one bother!

The sentence that says the nameless things is a quote from Gandalf, not Tolkien himself. While Tolkien writes Gandalf saying this, Gandalf and Tolkien are two different entities. I know this is obvious, but I think it’s important to distinguish the two. Tolkien would know what Sauron knows, but how would Gandalf know what Sauron knows? This quote by Gandalf implies that he assumes he knows what Sauron knows. Sauron could have knowledge of these creatures, but Gandalf doesn’t know what Sauron knows. I think this same logic can be applied to the Ainur and Eru. Eru is potentially eons older and massively stronger than the Ainur. Eru may have created other things in the void unbeknownst to the Ainur. Like the Ainur, he gave them freewill and let them decide if they wanted to be peaceful (Tom Bombadil) or destroy (Ungoliant). I don’t necessarily think Tom is good and Ungoliant is evil btw, but that’s a side story. While I like the idea of these entities being created by Melkor’s discourse, I don’t think his discourse would create beings as powerful as ungoliant (able to kill the physical form of a Valar) or as peaceful as Tom Bombadil. Other Valar created the Ents (created by Yavanna) and Dwarves (created by Aule). While these beings are strong in their own right, they don’t stand a chance against a Valar, and Dwarves didn’t get their own free will until Eru gifted them the inner flame. Melkor was the second most powerful being at the time, but he didn’t have the flame imperishable. Without the flame inside these unknown entities they have no free will and are easily manipulated. Ungoliant doesn’t really fit this description as she disobeyed and then defeated Morgoth. And it seems like Tom Bombadil has his own freewill. So I think these nameless things were created by Eru in the void unbeknownst to the Ainur, and like Ungoliant, had children that were then corrupted by Morgoth and turned into creatures like dragons. Lol now this is all fantasy, but this makes sense to me. Finally, I’m curious about the octopus-like creature outside of Moria. Is that a nameless as well?

Is it also a veiled reference in the song of Thorin and Company? "In dungeons deep where dark things sleep..." also from The Hobbit?

Tolkien: dude, did you see the thumbnail? I don’t want to name these things, let alone talk about them

I only have sensations about them. Some kind of primordial being bind to existence of the world itself, they are just "there". Not dragon precursor because Melkor tended to transform things in other far more dark and disgusting, think of elves into orcs; yet, people sometimes speak of dragons, with no fear of telling of them in daylight. These things, though, are something even a powerful being as Gandalf the White would not speak of. To me, they are some cthonic beings, neutral in benevolence or malevolence, that just "don't care", avoiding orcs and goblins not out of fear but of "Idontwannaseeyou"ness. Still scary though. Maybe an opposite to Tom Bombadil

I like that in sci-fi world, Lovecraftian entities are considered more evil and horrifying than demons themselves. Even in the age of discord i don't think even Melkor completely knows what horror he unleashed with the chaotic song so even though these beings of darkness existence came about through him, they owe Melkor no allegiance, they never aided him in Dagor dagorath nor will they in Dagor bragollach.

We have two creatures unaccounted for in terms of their coming into existence. Ungoliant and the Watcher at the Gates of Moria. Ungoliant wasn't a Valar like Melkor or a Maia like Sauron or the Balrogs. Her origin was unknown and her existence was unknown to the other Valar barring Melkor who allied with her prior to the War of the Silmarils. She was likely born out of the unknown darkness and she wove webs so dark that even Tulkas was powerless when caught up in them. Even Manwe's vision couldn't penetrate the darkness that Ungoliant cloaked herself and Melkor in. The concept of dark matter probably hadn't occurred yet in Tolkien's time but she was likely born out of dark matter if the explaintion makes sense. Another unknown entity was the Watcher in the water at the Gates of Moria. It is malevolent and akin to Cuthulu in description. It was also probably a nameless one born out of the darkness or the discord that Melkor caused during the Music of Creation. It is not coincidence that microtonal discordant music is often used for horror films. It forms images and feelings that elevate the intensity of horror. I think most like these creatures were 'spoken' or 'sung' into existence from the darkness during the clash of music during the Creation.

When all of time has passed on middle earth, and nothing, not even trees live on the land, they will rise to rule.

My headcanon: There were things in existence before Illuvatar created the Valar and the world. Maybe they came from Illuvatar in a previous creation, but were not part of this particular creation. When the world was formed, some remained outside of it (like Ungoliant) and others came in or were caught up in the creation and trapped in it. Not all of them were evil. This is what I believe Tom Bombadil and Goldberry to be, for example. They are from outside and before the world, but not evil, and perfectly fine to make their home there. Most are evil, and are part of what needs to be cleansed from the world before it can become the promised paradise later. A lot of that cleansing could just be them diminishing and fading away.

I always thought that the Watcher in the Water was of that type. Wasn’t it mentioned that it had likely come up from the cracks when the valley before the door was flooded?

It is true that Melkor could not have “created” the nameless ones. As only Iluvatar was the only being capable of direct creation ( not a morphing or changing if an existing being or item). And you are correct that if he had moulded a new race or strain of creature, Sauron would have been aware of them. However, Tolkien was deeply religious and was a firm Roman Catholic. As such, his beliefs could have allowed for other evils in Middle Earth nit connected to Melkor or Sauron. As a transcriber and professor of the Bible. He knew that even in the Bible itself describes in the Old Testament evil creatures that were neither Satan nor his demonic minions. Although Lovecraft was a writer of pulp stories. Much of his style reflected the interest and studies of the occult and the strange beings represented by such philosophies. Such affairs would have been seen as tremendous transgressions to his Catholic upbringing and a danger to Christian thought. He would have viewed the antics of the Hellfire club and people like Alister Crawley as dark and menacing as any of the traditional seven sins or transgressions against Christianity. In fact possible more so, as sinful actions inspired by Satan and human frailties, though bad, are not always as consciously directed indulgences in dismantling Christianity or what nay be viewed as universally “good”. That the dark nameless beings in Middle Earth could be more dangerous than the evil of Sauron or Melkor. As their evil comes about from their “sense” of order in the world. While the nameless ones have no such plans or philosophies but are rather the true definition of anarchy and madness. Keep in mind that Melkor was horrified by Ungoliant’s voracious hunger for the Light and cherished nothing. To the point of plunging the world completely into darkness with no care of what such actions would result in. It is possibly what Gandalf feared to bring to the light of day such cruel and senseless madness. Much like the madness in characters like Cthulhu; that makes Lovecraft’s stories of the Old Ones so frightful.

I really like the reference to Dragons, and think you may be right. Melkor could have kept this as a secret from Sauron. Sauron spent a lot of time in Angband, out of contact (or proximity) before Utumno fell. Maybe in that time (which was very long) he fashioned the nameless things to Dragons.

I dont mind that it was voiced by AI at all. Loving your content. Keep up the great work..

Reminds me of the trick Lovecraft made popular with the "things that can drive a man to madness"

There is also "The Boats of the Glen Carrig" and several other novels written by William Hope Hodgson, who's writing inspired Lovecraft, and Hodgson's works are full of eldritch horrors...and "The Boats of Glen Carrig" especially is WELL worth a read! 😶‍🌫

Wow, the narration was an AI voice-over? I'm both impressed and creeped-out, haha. It sounded very real to me. (Your note on the mis-pronunciation of certain words actually explains why I've been hearing so many hiccups on other videos from other channels).

lovecraft claimed that the cthulhu mythos was influenced by the works of writers such as lord dunsany, arthur machen and william hope hodgson among others. it is known that tolkien was also influenced by dunsany , and i wouldn't be surprised that he knew the work of machen and hodgson as well. the name "nameless things"may be a coincidence. it should also be remembered that the entities of the cthulhu mythos originate from other planets and dimensions, as do their creators and masters.

First of all, this be a grand video, with wondrous art and tale-telling. This one finds it plenty enlightening! Second, this voice, it is crafted by the spirits of technology‽ This one never would have believed! You've done noble work, despite this 'limitation' as you say. If anyone givin' you grief, send 'em to the shadowed abyss of the nameless ones!" 🌌📜✨🎙🐺🔥

I always just assumed Gandalf was spinning a tale for his audience, rather than just recounting his battle he decided to spice it up a little. Gandalf always enjoyed being mysterious after all

He fought in WW1, they're probably just of similar nature to what he encountered but as Gandalf stated does what to darken the light.

Could be a reference to Isaiah 66:24 'where their worm does not die' As a Catholic Tolkein would have known that this is one if the most mysterious verses in the Bible, Jesus uses it in Mark to speak of hell, a place of :gnashing of teeth" = gnawing of self hatred; and Tolkein himself says in an interview that Gandalf effectively parallels Jesus' "harrowing of hell" when he falls into the Abyss. Naturally it is a subject which is so horrible that it would receive no further articulation from a writer mindful of the attraction of evil, and who knows that what is least spoken of can be the most terrible.

The nameless things work for Amazon as script writers.

Wait your voice was AI? I wasn't even aware until you mentioned it o.o That's impressive. Also, gud video c:

These are then kinds of things your DM comes up with when the party has been having it easy for a while and are getting a little cocky.

I have always thought that the world was there before the music was made. It would make sense in the essence of that Tom Bombadil was there before the music. Another possible theory is that if the music created the world, some/most of the nameless things (that escaped the void into space) may have lived or been carried by the forming rocks from the music bringing them together, entrapping them at the lowest and earliest formation of the world, which might explain why there's so very few of them on the surface

They are Hobbits Gandalf doesnt want to elaborate to the hobbits because he doesn't want to scare them

I believe that The Nameless Things are primordial entities that stem back to before creation, Eru existed before creation, so it would make sense that he wasn't the only being that existed then

My hypothesis is that the Nameless Things are being that came into existence as direct products of the discordant song of Melkor.

Holy crap 😮😬

Everyone forgets that in the Hobbit, the wild were worms of a desert are mentioned. Relative of the nameless things? Possibly the breeding stock of dragons by Melkor?

Is that music from KotoR you are playing? :) Btw I couldn't tell that the voice is produced by an AI, though I noticed the tendency to emphasise the last syllable instead of the second or third to last

The nameless things could be the wereworms that was mentioned and showed as a deleted scene which wasn't a deleted scene if you went to the movies to see the last movie for the Hobbit