Beautifully explained Tim and I appreciate the shoutout! Subscriber numbers seem to have jumped a bit so thanks for that! Glad to see you ended up with the same findings as me. An EV really does seem to sway the figures to a much closer calculation. Did you register your interest in Intelligent Flux yet? I haven’t yet, but suspect I should in case I decide to switch. Thanks again Tim!

Thank you for being prepared to be a ‘guinea pig’ by testing out this new tariff and doing all the hard work for us all.

Definitely a summer only tariff. My only other issue with handing over control, is that I make use of the Hybrid inverter's ability to put excess solar (above the Inverter's AC limit) into the battery if there is room. I start the day with an empty battery and manipulate the charge rate (using automations in HA) to maximise this on sunny days and I can gain 7+ kWh of energy that would have otherwise been clipped. I have a 10.1kWp East/West split, 5kW Gen 2 inverter and 9.5kWh battery.

Really interesting video. I’m glad you added the calculation with more import, we charge my wife’s PHEV 8-10kWh every night and don’t export as much as you do so I don’t think this is a tariff for us 👍

Very interesting, looking forward to hearing how you get on

Thank you for another great video and giving out the link. I had been trying to sign up using the Octopus app on my mobile but could not find out how to do it. I am now on the waiting list :)

Lovely data driven video Tim 🙏

Very interesting Tim, thanks for explaining the new tariff and for modelling how it works with your data. I hadn’t appreciated that there is a common flat rate for import and export, which is definitely innovative. There’s been discussion about the new tariff on the GivEnergy forum and most people there seemed to think that they wouldn’t want to give up control of the battery charging & discharging, fears of causing extra battery cycles, discharging too much that then causes peak rate imports in the evening, etc. I’m still waiting for my export MPAN to be allocated as part of my move to Flux so I’m not going to join the waitlist yet, but since we have lots of excess solar in the summer and no EV, we’re by far a net exporter with only tiny amounts of import so this tariff is likely to be very beneficial to us. Would just want a bit more reassurance about how Octopus use the battery over the day, if its as described in their FAQ’s then it’s just a simple overnight charge, peak discharge which is no different to what most Flux users will program in anyway

Another informative video - thanks Tim. Having looked through your videos, I don't see any references to the Agile Octopus tariff - have you ever considered this?

It is interesting to see these options coming out. My concern is what you mentioned about if Octopus will want to take the same amount of export as I am currently selling. They may want more, but also may want less if it is very windy. Will be interesting to see your results. Not that I can go onto the system yet as do not have GivEnergy.

Thanks for the analysis, Tim, that's very interesting. I wonder whether the timing of the release of this tariff in the height of Solar production is not a coincidence. I am wondering with the high import rate, what will be the figures for the Autumn and Winter period when there is much less solar export to balance that high rate. I am on intelligent Octopus and my plan in the winter is to charge the battery and the car on the low 7.5p rate at night and run the house on that during the day topped up with any meagre solar.

I think the winter months will be big test here and I would guess with your export dropping off that the standard flux or even one of the other tariffs would be better

Will be interesting to see if Octopus go back to fixed term tarriffs to stop people jumping around. IOF not compatible with our system, but as you mentioned, having an EV to charge in winter makes it less attractive. Think I'll be moving back to 'Go' for the winter, hoping to see what's available next spring.

sounds pretty neat for big exporters. I was going to switch from flux to intelligent flux, but I think your points at the end about importing apply to me. A bit of EV usage plus increasing heat pump usage (our first winter with it) I think mean I need a reliable cheap window for water heating/battery charging/car charging. I'm reluctant to let go of the decent export rate, but it seems like it might be the smart thing to do, just so many options to choose from now!

Hello Tim, I am currently on intelligent Flux at the moment. Just to let you know that not everyday Octopus are discharging for full 3 hours at peak rate also some days finishing at 18:30 which then puts you drawing back from the grid at peak rate when my battery has over 50% left. I think this needs to be factored into calculation. Alan. Also sent to Gary does Solar.

Hi, lovely video as always, thank you 🙂. I have solar and battery, the GE AIO and am moving to Octopus Flux. I want to automate my system to achieve the following... 1: 2am to 5am - charger to say 100% (the low-cost period) 2: 5am to 4pm - use solar plus battery but keeping sufficient charge to cover the peak period requirement. This is where it would be great if I could set the battery to not fall below say 50%, but only between these times. 3: 4pm to 7pm - use battery only to avoid the high peak rate period. 4: 7pm to 2am the following day - continue to use battery down to the reserve level. The above cycle to repeat every day without any input from the user, must be a set once and forget. I can achieve quite a lot of this in the GE portal but not all of it (do need to dive into the Remote Control settings). Have you any suggestions?

seems useful if you’re a net exporter - this is effectively a net metering tariff apart from the bump in the evening. I assume octopus will charge your battery just before that (in a cheap/clean slot) to maximise how much it can discharge in the peak slot while not having your house draw from the grid during that period. That could mean you can be a small net importer but overall I think you’d want a fairly large solar array to make this cost effective

my worry about this is you're getting an unknown benefit - we don't know how much battery it'll reserve for you to self consume solar etc - and you're providing significant capital expenditure buying the battery but getting no direct benefit from it. if they guarantee Xkwh reserved for home use, or they guarantee reserving battery to prevent you being charged peak import (depending on size of battery) it'd be maybe ok. Net metering means if you're a net exporter - even out of season - you're using the grid as your battery. But still a high price of entry.. Being cynical if I was octopus I'd limit switch options for this - i.e not allow you to use it for a summer only tariff, requiring maybe only one switch a year or something. Net metering will want you using grid during the winter to help balance the costs for Octopus

Thank you for nice informative video , I’ve ask other KZfaqr if you could explain or demonstrate how to charge your car overnight not using battery, but only grid , with octopus go 12:30 to 4:30 midnight tariff 😊, thank you

Interesting information. It really makes having a battery an easy thing to live with, as you will always export at a higher rate. That just makes sense that as much as can be exported is. Then refill battery after at a cheaper rate. I would love the option of helping the grid again as I used to be on the Tesla Energy Plan, but also want the cheaper EV charging, so a mix of Intelligent and flux, would that mean it was the doubly intelligent flux?

Thanks Tim. My setup - no EV, no heat pump but 2 ACs hardly used so far this ‘summer’ but really useful in winter during the day b4 Gas CH kicks in in the evening. So, I export loads. Almost 400kWh in June and even though July is not great, we are still close to 300kWh so far this month. I am on Flux - got on it as soon as I saw it. Signed up for Intelligent Flux straight away too, awaiting details. My question - what do we do in Winter? Help Octopus and the grid and stay with Flux (one or the other) or move to Agile and Outgoing Agile, maybe fixed? With low excess solar export and more import, switching seems the financial choice? Love to hear your thoughts…Dom

Yet another Tariff for us to get our heads around! I'm already with Octopus (standard variable day / night) but now we have our solar system, GE battery, Eddi, & EV up & running I need to change my tariff. As a retired couple we are home most days so making use of daytime solar to charge the battery, power the house & charge up the car for free is a huge benefit in the summer months. Not sure I would want to hand control of the system over to someone else though.

I’m really hoping they see fit to upgrade the export tariff for intelligent/go to be comparable with the cheap import rate - still stops arbitrage but mean I don’t need to carefully use all the solar generated, and predict tomorrows weather to prevent export.

I wonder how Octopus handle battery firmware updates when there is an update waiting in the wings. I have just completed the very latest update manually. It’s important to think when you start the process as it not only discharges the battery but more importantly then completes a recharge. So best done at cheaper periods and when the house doesn’t need much power typically at night. When Octopus manage the battery do they take these things into consideration I wonder.

Tim it seems there is another new Octopus initiative. I am in Norfolk and just received an invitation to join the new "Power Ups" scheme starting from 14 August. Free electricity at times targeted in advance. I am hoping to discharge my battery to the grid before the session and then recharge with free grid power, plus charge our EV. I am guessing this grid balancing scheme will spread nationwide if it proves to be successful, and potentially good news for people with an EV and/or battery.

Hi Tim. Sorry for the late question on this video but we are going to be getting an EV in the next few months and have been debating tariffs. For now we still have gas heating and as we do relatively few miles, even with the EV our electric use won’t be huge, so I’m not sure if switching to an EV tariff makes sense if it will radically reduce our export rate in the summer. Apologies if you’ve already covered this.

I think a better idea would be that Octopus supply select PV owners having excess energy a GE AIO system free of charge and do what they want whilst giving the user a reasonable kickback of free energy.

This tariff looks much better for us. Not yet got EV and heat pump, with lots of excess solar in the summer. Plus don't have to worry about when to charge/discharge.

Can you clarify whether you added VAT at 5% to your import prices? Whilst I think it will be of benefit to net exporters of solar energy it's important to note that there appears to be no guarantee that Octopus will run this for your benefit. One could perhaps examine the Agile prices to see how often for instance it become favourable to export OUTSIDE the peak hours, because you can be sure they would do that. Similarly, on a windy day, there may be no benefit to Octopus in exporting anything at any time of the day. Finally, unless you habitually fully charge and discharge your battery every day throughout the year, then this will add wear and tear to your batteries and inverter.

No export option, just looking for best tariff to charge 2x 5.32kw batteries?

Just a question on your A2A, did you need planning permission?

I've given Flux ago and for my setup, Solar and battery (9.6kw) its a No No. Certainly in the winter months - our solar production has been a bit of a sad affair. I've exported twice up to this point during December. I was on the E7 tariff, and most mornings I would get up to a display showing £2.50 at worse (that was for battery charging, washing machine etc). I'm oiled fired for hot water and heating (no mains gas). With Flux, getting up, £4.51!!!! I've gone back to E7. Not saying that flux isn't for some people. It probably works just fine but for OUR usage, Nah. We tend to be out of the house by 8.30am, so summer time all the morning's use is on the cheap rate. Even with the clocks going back, most is still on the cheap rate. Flux would be worth looking at if it had 7 hours cheap! The 3 hours is guaranteed to mean you'll be using more on the more expensive side unless you have a very large battery capacity or don't use much. And then you have the peak rate to look out for. The other thing I'd noticed is the batteries were starting to be used much earlier than on the E7. Those 2.5 hrs making a difference. Result, with the peak rate coming up, it was a very fine balancing act to be able to avoid using the grid during those times. I'd rather not go there. Fwiw my next purchase will be 2 more batteries. With no or little solar production we tend to run out of battery at 8-9pm. 2 more would get us to the following morning charge. I've also found that is I do get some solar production @just over 2kWh, the batteries last just fine.

I think there’s a bug, it keeps turning off the “eco” mode of the battery. The consequence is that it will not charge with solar, and it will not discharge to supply your home. It meant octopus let my battery sit at 70% at the highest rate, while I had to import from the grid and pay the premium. Not a great start!

Could you do the calculations as if you didn't import at night. This is for people that don't have EVs. So on the basis that solar charges the battery only. This would then be in a line with how The feed in tariff would have been 10 years ago kilowatt for kilowatt more less.

Interesting. I'm Exporting 3000 kWh per year. (Above what I import,until a/c is installed for the ground floor.) The Dutch government currently mandates the same price for export as import, up to the amount imported. (Per year.) I get only paid 12 cents per kWh for excess export. Intelligent Flux sounds really lucrative if there's no cap on what you can export and be paid for. Is this how it works? Isn't Octopus taking a risk here? Or isn't excess export an issue in the UK?

Quick question. You say this tariff is not so good for heavy EV use. I have a company EV and they pay for all my charging. So although I average around 300KWh per month, should I effectively disregard this in the calculation?

*apologies - I'll retract this comment, it isn't supported in Octopus's overall Smart Tariff t&c's which state 1 month. I can no longer access the t&c's that were linked on the Flux confirmation sign up email so can't substantiate. I'll email them to double check as not sure where I would have got that from!* *1.3 You can always switch from a standard import tariff to a smart import tariff (provided you meet the eligibility criteria for that particular tariff), but if you switch away from a smart import tariff, you cannot switch back to a smart import tariff within 30 days.* Note that if you cancel regular Flux you can't rejoin for 9 months. Is that the same for IOF. This looks like a (pretty deceptive) way of keeping customers from flicking between 'summer' and 'winter' tariffs - as you'll obviously lose peak summer hours if you run through the summer and cancel in mid sept, for example. I've only just had solar installed and waiting for Flux tariff (then noticed the 9 month advisory) so I might cancel that and switch to Agile or just the flat export tariff instead. Not currently on an export tariff (instal was faster than expected) but sent about 150kwh to the grid in 2 weeks with use pretty low here. Just one 3.2kw battery so discharging fully at peak time wouldn't make sense unless there's a super low import tariff overnight.

So, if you don’t have an EV but have an air source with solar and a battery, this new tariff is a “no brainier”?

Never heard octopus flux , sounds like many hands in many pies, obviously in this case tentacles, just a thought I wonder if one was to input all information in regards to heating , solar, sand batteries, basically everything to do with a house’s needs into AI, would be interesting if they came out with the conclusion which is nothing as we know today.

I suspect July's figures will be far less favourable for Intelligent Flux, as I suspect you've had far less export. Also, despite you saying not to, I am relying on your advice for this. We're just having a similar size EW solar/battery installation and EV charger, also in Glos, but we've no historical data to do on as our smart meter was only fitted last week. Don't let me down Tim and Kat.😅

It's a con, I cannot see how this will save any money unless you go out from 4 to 7 everyday. The peak rate is 10p more during this period and only 10p cheaper off peak. Of course octopus will discharge your battery during this period making the grid stable and getting paid millions for this yet you'll end up paying for energy overnight as your battery will be empty.

Very much like TEP which worked really well.