Hopefully there is a video covering the story. Would love to learn about it!

same in Germany with SV Markkannstädt who became RB Leipzig

From an American perspective, it feels as though bleacher seating would solve the problem of crowd crushes while being cheaper than an all-seater stadium. Tough to push forward with a bunch of baffles even if they're just knee high. But your reaction to the team moving a half-mile away reminds me of what would happen if the Red Sox or the Cubs moved that far from their current grounds, which they have been using for 112 and 108 years, respectively. Once a team's been in one spot that long, they have a traditional connection to _that specific ground._

@@philipmcniel4908Very true Philip and at our old dilapidated ground,we were right on top of the pitch with Home fans on all 4 sides of the ground(3 sides=Standing: 1 side: Seats) and the Away fans were tucked away in a far corner. lol We broke The Football League Record there by going 59 Home games,in succession, unbeaten but in this new ground we once lost 6 homes in a row, and before Millwall's last 2 home wins, we had won just 6/25:the worst home run in our history. The Away fans get one whole end and,like all Away fans everywhere, insist on standing though in many grounds Home fans stand and ignore the seats. They have FINALLY introduced"Safe Standing" in many grounds now. Good Luck:)

The world mate, the entire world hates MK Dons.

yeah vinnie was a nutter , and honestly should never have been allowed on a football pitch , which is why he ended up being banned and changing careers. his portayal of violent psychopaths in movies doesnt require a lot of acting on his part

Wow. Thank you for the insight, man. Seriously didn’t know this. 👍

I'd love to know the source for claiming that Winkleman thought he'd pick up the fans of the original team, it seems unlikely given how few of the fans could be bothered to travel to Selhurst Park!

What is the current Bury situation,please?

@Isleofskye they're in the northwest counties premier division (the 9th tier) right now, the fans bought back their old stadium (Gigg lane), the name Bury F.C and their old memorabilia,hopefully they continue to thrive, it's really an inspiring story

@@mrmr5580 Fantastic. Good Luck :)

FC United of Manchester an others alike don't only oppose the new sets of owners they just feel like the premier league has lost its connection to grassroots football with all the money and stuff that goes around nowadays. And tbh I get it because its almost like they get to start from ground 0 all over again and create their own stories and history.

I recall reading a fair bit about Enfield and Enfield Town at the time. It was before the internet though so less likelihood of seeing such articles as you relied on print media only. Watched Wycombe play Enfield a few times in our non-league days!

It’s true. Our pro sports are really just sports entertainment. NCAA is our closest parallel to European sports

Raiders moved three times as well. Baltimore colts moved to Indianapolis, the the browns moved to Baltimore and became the ravens. Houston Oilers moved to Tennessee and became the titans Huge markets all of them; usually the main reason is public money was offered to build stadia in the new cities and refused in their current one.

Seattle sonics moving to Oklahoma is another crazy one. The supersonics were a well supported team

If there’s another franchise moving one more time, I’ll start losing my count as if it hasn’t already.

Good shout.

Winkelman approached a few clubs about moving to MK. I recall reading that he tried with QPR.

@@jasonuk8333 yeah he did try with QPR as well and I think he even proposed a merger with us as part of his proposal. I remember reports of Winkleman pitching the deal to QPR fan groups and getting a very frosty reception.

Also common in early years was the merging of clubs or shifting within close proximity when they intend to identify as a club for a even bigger area. But all that was still acceptable .

As someone who was born after mk dons was founded , I fucking hate mk dons , I support Luton but afc Wimbledon is so clear of Mk dons

Yes, it used to happen a lot in the early days of football in England, but once clubs were established in a certain area they became part of the fabric of the local community and represented the people of that community and that is why the FA changed the the rules after the Wimbledon move to "Franchise-land" to stop this sort of thing happening again in the future. A football club in England belongs to its community, town or City.

Yeah the more I pulled at the thread the more I realized how desensitized I had become

If you change the name, the badge and the kit colours you have no right to keep the nickname Dons

@@TDtog2112 even if they changed everything, the stain of their origins would still remain. Every other league in the country was either a founding member of the league they were in, or earned their spot in that league through promotion. The Franchise just went out and bought it. He could have done a Wrexham on their MK’s non-league side, or founded his own team at the bottom of the pyramid, instead he went out and purchased what every other team in the country had to earn: a spot in the league. If they ditch the name, and *then* get relegated out of the league, then they can fight their way back up and earn some respect. Until then, they’re a fake team that shouldn’t exist

It’s actually worse than that. Houston Oilers became the Tennessee Titans.

Two of them, actually

In a way, the American sporting system is a bit against American values. The draft system is kind of like socialism

Wigan pier is famous for having a book named after it, The Road to Wigan Pier is a book by the English writer George Orwell, first published in 1937.

If you listen to the MK version, that is the bullshit story they come up with. Also, we Wimbledon fans were told that, "It would not be in the wider interests of football to restart as say, Wimbledon town fc" by the football authorities. And, although we protested so much against the move to MK, we were told that no matter what, that the move would still go ahead, and fans of "The Franchised" club to this day, still accuse Wimbledon fc fans of abandoning our club. We did not abandon our club, it was taken away from us, and therefore saw no point in continuing the protests and decided to start our own new club from nothing before the old Wimbledon fc were moved to MK. We started at level 9 of the English football pyramid at the same level as Milton Keynes City fc, an already locally established team in the MK area. Pete Winkelman wanted a team and it's place already established in the football league and stole it from Wimbledon fans. He claimed that it was impossible to raise a team up from level 9 to the football league, but we, AFC Wimbledon fans, PROVED HIM WRONG. In the process of moving WFC to MK, he also killed off Milton Keynes City fc.

It's been emotional

Less cups than Queen's Park and won hee haw for a decade ya 🐑 shegging bass

Would they not be called Aberdons in that case 🤣🤣🤣

It is not considered a derby by us Wimbledon fans.

80 miles difference in location is not a derby

I am not a Wimbledon supporter though I loved this story and had a tear forming at the end but Everton,as you know, came back from 9/2 on the last day,the other year ,to win 3/2 to survive but they did EXACTLY the same when 0/2 down at half time at Goodison against Wimbledon(lol) in the most crooked game I have seen in attending since 1962. Everton, also,had to win that day and The Ref gave them the most ridiculous Penalty in the 2nd half to start to haul them back. You won't go down and with the new stadium,it should be happy, exciting times for Everton though a real xxxxx leaving the atmospheric Goodison. I hope they have arranged a Standing Home End at Bramley Moor. Have they, please?

"0/2" not "9/2" lol

Yeah that day against Wimbledon is seared on my memory. It was an outrageous comeback from 2-0 down. Seems to me that Hans Segers let a goal in - I don't know. Everton have discussed the possibility of safe standing at Bramley Moor Dock in light of the slightly underwhelming capacity of 53k which doesn't really live up to Nil Satis Nisi Optimum but nothing has been decided yet. The ground is, however, designed with a solid bank of fans behind the goal in the South stand. @@Isleofskye

The football magazine 'When Saturday Comes' is great too. Even now when they do their regular season review/preview supplements (where representatives of each club answer a handful of questions about the season just gone, and the upcoming one), the MK Dons section always simply reads 'No questions asked'. Excellent.

That kind of works with a growing league like MLS, but with a mature league that already has 30-32 clubs at the top-flight level (the only level that American sports fandom really cares about because "if you aren't rooting for your team to win the national championship, then just what _are_ you rooting for them to win?"), you can only add so many before it becomes this gargantuan, unwieldy league. The teams that end up moving in the US are generally the ones that don't have a large, vibrant fanbase to begin with--the clubs that would've folded if not for relocation. Not always, and there are always fans who get angry about it (see the Oakland A's protests last baseball season), but it's almost never the really big, popular clubs that relocate--or usually the ones with a lot of history in one place. For instance, the Boston Red Sox have been playing at the _same ground_ for 112 years, and there would be an uproar if they moved even a half-mile away due to the historic nature of both the team and the park, and of the team's connection to the park. Same with the Chicago Cubs, whose fanbase is so loyal that they stuck with the team through over a century-long trophy drought in a league where trophies are basically the only thing there is to play for. Even the somewhat more recent teams that are successful and have deep roots and large, loyal fanbases aren't just going to get up and move: Teams like the Kansas City, San Francisco, and Seattle teams aren't just going to get up and move in the foreseeable future. When a team does settle in a new city, the fans generally react about the same as if a new club had been founded there. To them, it _is_ a new team.

@@philipmcniel4908 Interesting, I can understand new MLS franchises as the high level of interest in soccer in the US is still relatively recent. I was thinking more about the more established US sports like NFL and baseball which from your explanation sounds like a similar fan attitude as there is to football in the uk and Europe. Most clubs in the uk began as part of the working community and overtime people stuck with them, the big trophies were like a holy grail among the lower leagues though they have their own trophies. The fact of relegation and promotion allows lesser clubs down the leagues pyramid to dream of rising to the top. Plus they're all allowed to enter the annual fa cup, traditionally our version of the Superbowl. As this video shows, Wimbledon fc rose from outside the professional football league to the top division and won the fa cup.

@@roboi2241 I think there are some major differences between American sports and European sports that come down to geography, population distribution, and the diversity of sports that are popular here. The system with promotion and relegation has several advantages in Europe that it doesn't here: -First, Europe has the population density to support truly local clubs (and by "local" I mean not only within two hours, but within half an hour--not like where I live in rural southern Oregon where people will drive three hours to see their local college football team play). This means that if your club gets relegated to an un-televised league, you can still go see it every weekend. Sports in the US are a TV experience for many Americans--especially in the western US which has a very low population density--because you might live several hours from your closest team, and you might make a couple of special trips to see them live during a season, but to follow them every week you really need TV (or online streaming nowadays). This is admittedly a bigger deal in the more rural areas of the country such as where I live: I live in a town of 700 people, half an hour from the nearest other town (and their population is less than 2500!). There is no way we'd be able to support a local club in the European system--at least not one that would have any hope of making it out of the Sunday leagues--and our Sunday league rivals would all be a minimum of 3-4 hours away. (I know this, because our local high school sports teams _do_ commute that far to play other 1A schools, which are the smallest classification in high school sports here. I remember playing basketball for one year in high school, and we would sometimes get back to town at 2 a.m. after away games.) -Which brings me to my second point: European countries are smaller, which means that they can break their amateur leagues up into reasonable-sized regions without having an unreasonable number of regional leagues, or an unreasonable number of steps to the pyramid. Working your way up from the 9th tier like Wimbledon is hard; imagine if they'd had to work their way up from the 56th tier or something like that--especially if there were 65 other regional leagues _at their level_ whose clubs were vying for the same promotion spots. (And promotion could be the financial kiss of death for a small club from the wilderness of Alaska, if they suddenly had to travel to the Lower 48 for all their away matches with a semipro team!) Our equivalent to the FA Cup, the US Open Cup, is highly regionalized until most of the non-MLS, non-USL teams are out, because really, can you imagine your local 5th-tier side having to travel to Baku in the third round? (The distance from LA to NYC is essentially the same as from London to Baku.) -Third, returning to my point about how you need to have a team to follow in a _televised_ league unless you live in a huge city (or follow local high school sports): With five top-flight leagues that are all very popular (the NFL, NBA, MLB, NHL, and now MLS), even the most popular professional second tier--Minor League Baseball--is rarely televised, and is a huge step down in popularity from the Big Five. With up to five major sports leagues to cover, there's just no TV airtime or newspaper print space left over for even a second-tier minor league most of the time, let alone a third tier. Same goes for sports fans' admissions money. -Since our country spans a continent, and draws from a large population as a result, its top tier is more equivalent to the Champions League level of play than even the Premier League. That increases the gap between amateur and professional play _significantly._

Maybe he should have said the second tier.

Particularly as the local Council to Wimbledon were villains by not allowing them to redevelop their ground effectively making them homeless and they nearly moved to Dublin in Ireland and even though they were ground sharing for 10 years at Crystal Palace only 6 miles, their attendances plummeted in the Premier Division(where most teams have full stadiums and long waiting lists) and one crowd was the lowest ever recorded in the Topflight at 3,000+.....None of this was mentioned and they did not go into details about why Vinnie Jones(now hardman actor) and the others were known as "The Crazy Gang"...imagine all that on top of these facts:)

@@Isleofskye Totally agree. I think that's why, with so much to cram in, that maybe an 8 part series might be the best option.

@@eddhardy1054Great idea:)

@@Isleofskye Would they be able to persuade Vinnie Jones to play Dennis Wise though?

@@eddhardy1054He would be betterplaying the thug who grabbed Gazza:)

The English FA over see the professional game. When the club restarted at the amateur level i.e. "non-league" they registered with the London FA.

There are many FA's throughout the country.

I find these English "gotchas" just come from them being ignorant about their own system and language. London FA was correct. You're just too English to be smart or humble.

They,usually,make real-life situations, into a unrealistic Fairy Tale but this already is:)

@Isleofskye yeah. In my mind, they'd alter it for a US audience that loves drama. Add things that never happened/don't need to be there or take away things that should be. Americanise the whole thing. End up doing the people/club a huge disservice.

@@almostyummymummy Yes,very true,my friend:)

Sam Hammam owned the original club during the 'crazy Gang' days and screwed them by selling the original Plough Lane and pocketing the money. He then sold the club at an inflated price to a couple of Norwegian guys who then installed Charles Koppel as chairman. Pete Winkelman (who had already tried and failed to get other clubs to move to Milton Keynes) got in touch and finally found owners who were happy to deal with him to give him the club he needed to get his property deal in MK sorted. They managed to con an FA commission into believing the club had no hope of a stadium in SW London, and could not survive, and the theft was done. The fans then left to set up AFC Wimbledon having been abandoned by their club, and they spent one further season playing at Selhurst Park in the Championship in front of an average crowd that AFCW exceeded in the Combined Counties League!

Ray Allen in that SuperSonics jersey was elite 🔥

Lol, the video didn’t paint the club in the best light. Guess there’s two sides to every story. Thanks for watching the video

@@lukessportsacademyI’m still watching but our fans are used to it and we kind of enjoy being the most hated in a way. It’s my local at the end of the day and I was born a year after it happened. Both teams are in the play offs in league two rn so there’s a chance we could end up facing each other to get promoted

@@lukessportsacademy There really isn't much of a best light for MK Dons. The lies and corruption that led to the theft of the old Wimbledon, and the FA's disgraceful decision to allow it is a stain on English football. Wimbledon's fans demonstrated that a suitable stadium could be built on the old Plough Lane site but Charles Koppel and co were never interested in staying there, going as far as to try and hold a meeting with local residents (vetting invitees for known Wimbledon fans) and encouraging them to protest any plans to build a new stadium, telling them that 'football fans are not the sort of people you want on your doorstep'. Fans of the franchise will always overlook the facts to pretend there was no choice and it was only about rescuing a football club, but it was really about business and a property deal (the stadium and surrounding stores) that required a football club to play there to get planning permission. It's such a shame the same business people could not start a new club or get behind a local non-league club that wanted their input and build them up. AFC Wimbledon showed how you could go from the lowest level to the football league in 9 years. Franchise fans could have genuine pride in their club if it had not just been handed a league place without earning one, and they had got it the same way AFC Wimbledon did.

Less cups than Queen's Park and won hee haw for a decade ya 🐑 shegging bass

@@ayeready6050 more European 🏆 tho oh I never been called a sheep 🐑 shagger before grow up 🤣🤣🤣

​@@ayeready6050One Premier League trophy in your history. You've got a cheek.

@@borachon26 55 league titles. The most in football history. Stupit

@@ayeready6050 No you don't. Sevco have one title. I mean, you have a few lower league titles as well you might want to include. 🤣

The detail you conveniently leave out is that Kingstonian all but put themselves out of business by spending way beyond their means in the 90's and lost control of Kingsmeadow. The owner of the stadium had no interest in the club, not even allowing them to keep bar receipts at their matches. I'm sure it wasn't easy watching another club buy the lease of the stadium they once owned, but Kingstonian had around 18 years of paying a peppercorn rent, being able to keep bar receipts etc from their games. If Wimbledon had not purchased the lease Kingstonian would have been out of business or evicted back then. They had 18 years of having a home stadium with next to no rent, with Wimbledon picking up the tab for upkeep and improvements. They were then given a million to help them out when Wimbledon left. Show us another club that would have treated Kinsgtonian as well.

@@jasonuk8333 You mean like Wimbledon spending well beyond their means? But please keep pleading the case as supposed victims while doing the same to another club...

AFC are the Dons it's in the name WimbleDON!!!

Another Franchise moron.

You Franchise Bastards you know who you are.