Running my own place,I have found dealing with the customers myself is better,it takes time but you also aren’t paying an advisor,and the customers seem to like it better, no communication problems,lies to customers ect. That advisors do. If you have techs that are decent with people it works great

When it comes to service writers, I have found that the majority have little to no formal training in the automotive industry. This is detrimental to the field. They should be able to explain to customers how a system works, why service is needed, and how to go about testing that circuit. I've discovered that most don't even know the voltage of a fully charged 12-volt battery. Ex-shop owners whose businesses collapsed due to financial ruin often make the worst service writers. They tend to bring their bad habits along with them, negatively impacting their new roles as service advisors. Independent garages that hire someone to work the front counter often face high turnover due to a lack of understanding of how the automotive business works. Today, you need more than someone who can take a name and number and answer the phone. That’s why it’s crucial to have the right person at the front desk assisting your customers.

Get rid of service writers, have mechanics deal with customers like the did traditionally...and give them the pay the service writers make!! That won't happen though.

Shop Owners answer: They both are just a number that make me numbers so I can put those numbers in my new boats gas tank.

Can't wait till service advisor are replaced with AI

The answer comes down to who produces. A shop can run without advisors but if nobody is turning wrenches the shop makes nothing.

A service writer is 100% vital to the shop’s productivity, I just can’t comprehend how a writer could make the same or more than a tech who often times went to school, bought 10s of thousands of dollars worth of tools, has needed many years of experience, deals with slow parts department, back breaking work day in and out, mentally stressful diagnostics, talking to customers because a lot of writers don’t know how to explain how a pencil works, dealing with unrealistic service writer deadlines and much more all to just earn the same as someone who put in 1/8th the effort we did? It’s just infuriating.

I have done both jobs FRM! They have just about the same problems in a dealership and for ten years now it has been really tough on the writers as well as the techs! Let me tell you, your right and nothing makes your job better than a good advisor!

both are valuable....MORE valuable, that is deep.... does the service provider only write up tickets or do they also play the role of manager and make sure technicians are neat and clean and keep their shop squared away.....many variables

Sales drives the money.

I came up thru the shop starting with basic services and PDI of new machines. I've been an advisor for about 4 years now, or as I call it a glorified receptionist 😃. I understand what a tech goes thru and absolutely agree they should be well compensated. Not only for the hard physical work but the background of thousands in tools and countless hours of training. Our OEM's require I have the same technical certifications. As an advisor, my #1 goal is to get the customer what they need. Selling is just recommending the best course of action for the vehicle. That being said, in the atv/sxs game, either they are toys of people with money to spend or work horses that people have to depend on, so it's usually not a hard sell. As for advisor pay vs annual spending/ investment back into the career, it's not as much as a technician, especially one starting out. So long story short, should advisors make A tech level wage? Probably not. It's hard to say exactly as that role has many aspects in my position. I still get my hands dirty from time to time but most is spent answering phones, making appointments following up with post diag calls, building quotes, finding the best source for parts, pulling parts on occasion, and staging parts for technicians in our holding area. We also sell tires and wheels in our dept, so that can take a fair bit of time depending on the customer. For the nay sayers, and this isn't true for some shops, but we run 3 full time tech's and in peak season, they're all busy all day. Imagine if they had to stop even 15 minutes every hour to deal with customers (good luck keeping it that short) that's 2 hours a day, or $250 in lost income for the shop, PER TECHNICIAN. Sorry for the long comment, felt my 2 cents was worth putting out there. 👍

In the last 20 years i have heard this quote"with out me or us you wouldnt have a job" it started in the military and than it started in military than i saw it in the corprate structure. My last job in a fleet shop the drivers stsrted that crap. With out the maintenance team they would be delivering fuel with 5 gallon cans. Buisness is a team function but in buisness school the sales team is considered part of management and considered an income generator and the blue collar techs are always looked at as an expence like incentory. As much as i would like to call out greedy management the root goes back to the buisness schools who doesnt understand running a buisness is a team effert and its sucess cant be creadited to one person. This is why i chose to work for my self when i got canned shortly after you did. I wont work for some one who doesnt want to give the respect due for what i have learned in the last 30 years

Love this video, I think that you have stumbled on what is a fundamental critique of capitalism - exploitation of labour and the alienation of workers from what they produce. This is something that needs to be fixed in our industry and across the board

I been waiting for this one to come out. It all comes down to nuts and bolts baby 💪💪

Well in Australia we have service advisers they are paid salary and it’s a bonus system based on Manufacture CPS and tyres sales and our main sales so they work with us in the shop as we do the work and with out us they can’t sell it works well as we educate them on what we need from them and no they are not paid more than the techs even after bonuses

Like the chef at a high end restaurant... The technician brings the customers back Excellent work done in a timely fashion sells itself. The service writer should be salaried, and have automotive repair knowledge... Perhaps an older tech with good customer relation skills nearing retirement.

The reason dealerships value service writers over mechanics ( sorry, "Technician" was a prestigious sounding title granted to mechanics to help pacify them so they could deny higher pay a while longer) is because anyone selling brings more income in than anyone doing the work. Also, managers probably trust salesmen talking to the customers more than allowing most mechanics because many would likely undersell the workorder by only writing up the complaint they came in for and not selling additional things the customer might not need at that time.

Yeah. What you said.

A top notch service advisor can make up for subpar techs but there's no way a top notch tech can ever make up for a subpar service advisor. The customer will notice very little difference between a competent tech, a decent tech, a good tech, a great tech, or an AMAZING tech! Yes of course techs have way more responsibilities and requirements put upon them. No question about it. The problem is we're so used to working in shops that are so poorly run without any organization or management that it feels like you have to be a rockstar to keep the ship barely above water and if you weren't so bloody good the ship would've sunk ages ago. But take a step back and think about that... If you tally up all the times customers got angry and why you'll realize it's almost entirely because of communication issues.

The shop i work at has split the "service advisor" role between 1st and 2nd shift foreman and our owner... We seem to have far less issues with this system even though it gets annoying, but customers seem to like talking to somebody who actually does the work and can speak confidently about it!

I am a former dealer tech, and wrote service a for a few months, I’m now a parts and service manager. The tech position is required, or the business doesn’t exist. The tech is the most important position in the dealership. The manufacturer could sell cars direct to the consumer if they had to. You could hire techs who could also talk to customers (very undesirable for many reasons) but possible. A good advisor is a technicians best friend. A bad advisor needs to be a good advisor or find a new career! A top 10% advisor should make a lot of money. A top 10% tech should also make a lot of money. Both 6 figures plus. But I will say a B tech should def get paid more than a middle of the road advisor. Because half the public could answer a phone and take orders. A lot less than 50 percent of the public has the aptitude to be a B tech.

It's like in the collision industry, a good estimator is worth the money cause they can make both the shop and the techs lots of money

After doing both I can’t see how it’s justified, the technician will make or break the whole process he is definitely more valuable to me personally

Nothing happens without the tech, the advisor role is optional depending on the size of the shop. The biggest debate often becomes which job is harder. As someone who's filled both roles, the tech job is by far easier and less stressful for me. The advisor role is complex, down to the word you use, and the tone you used to say it can back you slap into an uncomfortable situation. The advisor faces substantially more emotionally/mentally taxing workload than techs do. The tech role is far harder on the body physically, but the advisor role is quicker to leave you feeling like you've been in the boxing ring with Tyson than the tech role.

Our Ag Shop has a service writer that makes less then a good trained tech. You need a decent service writer that knows what they are doing. Our service advisor was a former tech as well.

With the addition of newer software like video mpi as a tech I show the customer what I see and write the quote up. All my writers needs to do is see approvals and add lines reducing the work they need to do. Those systems also don't work the best in my opinion so no matter how you look at it the writer role still remains. Good techs should be making more money in the end.

Facts!!

Techs all the way.!!!! GOOD Techs!!!!

The service advisors position did not exist until larger dealer style corporations felt the need to "sell people." Mechanics just told them like it is and if they didn't want to fix it they pulled it around. An "Advisor" convinces them to take a loan to fix their car, adds flushes the mechanic didn't mention were needed and other trinkets to pad their commissions. Not that mechanics never do that, but MOST just want to fix the car and go to the next one. That honesty hurts sales. Yet the mechanics are the thieves in our industry.

Service advisors are ticket passer outers. Don't need them and app can replace them. Stack the tickets on the table and grab the next one.

Salesmen are often the highest paid people in an organization, even more than executives. Why, if the product doesn't sell, there is no need to make it.

You should make a video review on the Netflix series called Tires.

Tech all day

We used to have a saying in the Navy... Choose your rate, choose your fate. Aka... You pick a shitty job your life is going to suck. Walk away if you don't like what you're doing.

Sounds to me like any tech that is not happy with their pay should consider trying something else. Think about it, if the technician is good at diagnosis and is also a good communicator they would be a great combination for a service writer. Pay plans may be different but a writer just like a technician earns based on ability. Great technicians can easily make time every day and make good money, more than most service writers. Just like most careers, there are usually a few very productive and then there are the rest. If you could have only a few high performers I think I would rather have higher skilled technicians than service writers those people have a much greater training commitment and huge investment in tools.

Im a service manager and believe me i don't get paid enough to deal with customers tantrums on a daily basis.

I think the techs should have to rotate as service writers. Problem solved!

Like asking which is more valuable, the brain or the heart. Without either the body dies. Even a one man shop has both. That guy is a hybrid that advises and turns wrenches.

If they are good salesman they are just as important as techs. else they are just order takers and the techs are more important

Many writers make over $100k

Why should a service writer make more money than a technician with tools is a good question. The shop owner will probably say, paying one or two people is easier but it’s wrong. Technicians should be among the highest paid workers in the shop. If not, everyone loses.

I will say that a tech may see it differently, and you do. From a perspective froma shop owner both are important. You comment about conmen is a very telling comment. Conmen lie to people to get what they need a good service advisor has to close the sale without lying. A service advisor in my shop goes through training as much as a tech does. They need to keep up on handling personalities, understading of the tech side of cars so they will eventually get the general service ASE certification, and the changing tech in computers. I am a shop owner, technician, and service advisor. I will say that 75% of techs could not sell a job to save their life. So most jobs will go unsold if left for a tech to sell the job. I dont disagree that techs are a very vital role but so are service advisors. A successfule muli emplyee shop requires both.

A good service writer can take advantage of the skills of individual techs. They will also know which jobs they will loose thier hat on and turn those away.

They are equally as important. I'm one of the few who has been both and successful at both. I've made 110k as an advisor and 140k as a flat rate guy. Most advisors couldn't hack it as a tech. Most techs couldn't hack it as an advisor. Even in my best year, about 113k as an advisor, the skilled techs still made more. You also have displayed by your comments on what an advisor does that you have no experience at it. Your real complaint should be bad advisors making too much, not advisors making too much. The advisor makes the shop more money, period. It's a simple numbers game. As an advisor, I could have 9 techs with 2 jobs each sold and ready to go. As a tech, I could only actively do one job at a time. I know we need the techs and their skillset to complete the work. I know we need the advisors to close the deal and get the work sold for those techs to complete. Therefore, they are both equally important. Let me go back to where I said most techs couldn't hack it as an advisor. I know the pushback is coming. Truth is, most of you have all the people skills of a courtyard executioner.

It seems like more and more the tech is expected to help the advisor with sales making videos. Writing extrapolating stories etc. which is unfortunate.

I think the biggest issue when it comes to pay is that there are lots of "technicians" who aren't nearly as good as they think they are. I see way too many techs demanding 100K+ when they refer every "difficult" diag to the dealer and just throw parts at cars. Too many techs use spending hundreds of thousands on tools as a justification for higher wages, but the tools just don't cost that much. If I buy a 50K car and finance for 84 months at 19% interest, that doesn't make it a 90K car; paying Snap-On 200K doesn't mean you have 200K worth of tools. Techs need to take responsibility for their poor spending habits because what you spend to do your job doesn't matter if you don't get the results your employer is looking for. Sales is a real skill set but it isn't a hard skill to find. Finding a service advisor who understands sales and has enough automotive knowledge to not constantly make mistakes or bother techs with questions can be hard, but it's way easier than finding a great or even a good technician. That being said, you won't find many shops that gross $700,000+ per tech without great people in both roles.

another comment...what about we stop complaining about our jobs and OWN that we chose to be technicians....let's talk about how how most techs say "work up front, fuck that...I don't want to learn that" most technicians bash the front of the house and then run from training or suggestions to learn the front of the house....I have seen it for 24 years

A good tech is superior to a service writer. Especially if the tech is fairly young and fast. Then you can churn through some tickets.

Everything will change when they have no more techs

Whoever pinpoints the problem and hands that valuable information to the chump to collect a check by calling themself a salesman is the more valuable asset to the business. A good salesman will try sell you a third set of floor mats, not depend on skilled labor to hand them an answer and free money.

Service Writer is just a overpriced secretary.

Because no one respects the technician - simple as that.

Skip the service writer. Have the techs write it up.

Who more valuable the drug dealer or the customer ?😷😷

I couldn’t disagree more with, working on both sides of the system! It’s pretty obvious you are clueless on the service writing side.

you cant have one without the other. hear me out man, subscriber and watcher of you for many years. this will be a bit long. i also, for many years have worked in the automotive repair industry. cumulative 2 years as an advisor, and 8 years as a dealership > then mobile technician. with all of the ASE certs, factory training up the ass, hybrid and air conditioning specialist etc etc etc. these days i prefer being a tech because when im off work, im OFF WORK. i dont have to monitor my RO's, my customers and all the calamity that comes from co workers royally screwing me or screwing everything up with my customers. i have an oddball skillset where i am technically inclined, mechanically proficient but also am pretty damn good at service advising. think the bartender personality on steroids, selling stuff people actually need. i don't get to boast about much in life at all, but i can confidently say I'm good at both positions. and my reputation and my paychecks back it up. as someone who did/does well in both positions (remember when i said im odd? some would say weird, strange, wtf is wrong with this guy) and has spent many years toiling in this business i think you need to really do the job before forming a full spectrum opinion. yeah, you and are i both biased towards techs because its our people. but something tells me you haven't been balls deep in the trenches, at a very very busy dealership service drive, with hundreds of calls texts walk ins and appointments every day. to be a good performing advisor, you gotta be on top of your game. you can not turn "it" off. and you dont get a chance to breathe, much less eat. and the cherry on top is when you're a top performing advisor, that knows intimately how cars and fixing cars works and goes, and can explain it in terms the average person can really understand, and can sell, and can handle irate people, and can collect customers that only wanna deal with you, and always 100% of the time get ALL strong pertinent information on writing up the ticket to diagnose the problem (does it happen all the time, or just some times? what speed? when turning? when your wife is complaining?) - you get EXTRA work load on top of it allllllllll because you can actually do these things and 75% of advisors mess it up, because you are experienced, and you just get absolutely chewed up and spit out for 12 hours a day 5-6 days a week. i truly wish i could convey in the English language how stressful, relentless, demanding, asphyxiating and exhausting being a good service advisor in a busy shop is. you need to stay learning too - if you want to be good - you have to know when new models have telematics issues (so you can save everyone time and just help the customer on the drive instead of writing it up through the shop), when they have TSB and recalls probably related to the concern etc etc the only huge difference is the tool investment. and that will always, forever, go to the technicians. at the very least a $200 month on top - of - the - paycheck too bonus needs to be paid. that is the glaring issue. as an advisor i didn't have to buy my computer and chair.

SA complain about money all the time if there no work

Obviously mechanic. Service writers usually are stunned

Today days don’t need service advices I tell you why? Today days customers seat in home front of computer or with smart phone making appointment for service his/her car ( oops we don’t need someone take a call to make reservations) when customer arrives service writer didn’t comes out from his/her office like before 🚩service porters welcome to customers and take little iPod take a picture all necessary information customer concerns and tell customer wait in waiting room or customer left. Oops what happens to service writer?still seating in his/her offices playing game on the phone or googling something listening news or music 🚩tech bring a car in check get prices from part department,report service writer,service writer forward estimate with recommendations to customer smart phone or email customer make decisions declined or approved over the txt service writer forward to technician tech order the part,if part than report service writer part is order when will be there and mean time tech working an other cars because he is flat rate… when the car is done and very,service writer close the work order forward to customer customers are paid over the phone or see cashiers then go out ask porters to bring the 🚗 car. Oops what happens to service writer? Still seating in his/her office. Top of that if customer has question service writer bring customer in the shop we technicians or shop Forman explain what’s wrong with the car. 😂