Why Do Christians No Longer Follow Certain Old Testament Laws? | Jonathan Pageau

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Jonathan Pageau - Clips

Jonathan Pageau - Clips

4 жыл бұрын

Taken from:
Feb 2020 Q&A: • February 2020 Q&A
Sept 2019 Q&A: • September 2019 Q&A
Apr 2020 Q&A: • April 2020 Q&A
The clips on this channel are selected and compiled by certain members of the Facebook Group (linked below) and not by Jonathan Pageau himself.
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Пікірлер: 33
@Facconti
@Facconti 4 жыл бұрын
Without denying what you say, in the Catholic Church it is explained very easily: Anything that in the Old Law is only divine positive law ("malum quia prohibitum," bad because forbidden) is abolished, while everything that besides being divine positive law also is *natural law* ("prohibitum quia malum," forbidden because bad) is preserved. Thus, it is clear that eating pork is not intrinsically evil, therefore that precept, and others such as it, like having a childless widow marry her deceased husband's brother to give offspring to the deceased, are abolished. Making an image cannot be intrinsically bad either, or we wouldn't be able to even paint a landscape, and besides God himself commanded images in the Temple's interior. However, adultery, polytheism and similar sins are against natural law. This is why St. Paul tells the Romans that they are not excused by not having the (Jewish) Law, since they had the law that is in the nature of things and thus "they are themselves the law to themselves." He clearly refers to natural law. This is also why Sodom and Gomorrah were destroyed *before* the Mosaic Law was given: because the sin of those cities was against natural law and they should have known better. Natural law both precedes and succeeds the Mosaic law, because it is the law in things themselves (having its origin ultimately in God, of course), and endures as the things endure.
@Strategos300
@Strategos300 2 жыл бұрын
I agree but then how is the natural law properly defined ? If it is so crucial in our understanding of the Mosaic Law, how do we know exactly what the Natural law is, in an age and society where all moral laws are disregarded.
@elektrotehnik94
@elektrotehnik94 Жыл бұрын
@@Strategos300 Read the bible. And then read the Bible some more. And then read other wisdom traditions. And then question if your understanding of what you have read is correct, and if it might be not correct. Do it over hundreds & thousands of years, with thousands & millions of other people. This is what we do. "Properly defined"? Out of what I've understood, only the Highest could have those answers. But hey, what do I know.
@therealkingbaldwin
@therealkingbaldwin 7 ай бұрын
@@lb7625we don’t depict the Spirit or the Father or the divine nature but there is nothing wrong with representing the human nature of Christ as he is the living visible icon of God the Father. Just keep in mind also that God commanded statues of Cherubim and other iconography to be erected in the temple and if you read the command literally, you can’t draw images of the layers of earth or anything else. Let me just restate orthodox iconography DOES NOT depict the divine nature of Christ, only his human nature
@nickj5451
@nickj5451 4 жыл бұрын
We follow the law not for the sake of law-following, fear or glory, but for love. Christ gives the freedom to do good, compelled by nothing but love.
@jonnyschaff7068
@jonnyschaff7068 2 жыл бұрын
The pinnacle of Pageau’s beard
@cflam939
@cflam939 4 жыл бұрын
Thank you for this clip channel for picking and cataloging these gems from Jonathan.
@user-xf9bj6lh8m
@user-xf9bj6lh8m 3 жыл бұрын
I am just beginning this, but I know I will love it as I do all of your other work. Just wanted to thank you in advance so I don’t forget.
@panokostouros7609
@panokostouros7609 4 жыл бұрын
Saint Paul just collapsing all kinds of dialectics
@shivabreathes
@shivabreathes 2 жыл бұрын
This made a lot of sense.
@acrxsls1766
@acrxsls1766 4 жыл бұрын
Christ fulfilled the Law. We are the New Israel through Christ.
@lionofapollo4636
@lionofapollo4636 4 жыл бұрын
Now just to get that memo to a great percentage of Christians who idolize the physical region and "people" of that land.
@ktwdrummer
@ktwdrummer 3 жыл бұрын
And hereby we do know that we know him, if we keep his commandments. He that saith, I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him. But whoso keepeth his word, in him verily is the love of God perfected: hereby know we that we are in him. He that saith he abideth in him ought himself also so to walk, even as he walked. Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil. For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled. Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven: but whosoever shall do and teach them, the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven. As far as I can tell, heaven and earth are still here. Just because Christ fulfilled the law, does not mean we should not walk as he did and fulfill it as well. And when we stumble we gave him to fall back on. Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven. Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works? And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity. He that work iniquity.... lawlessness....
@regpharvey
@regpharvey 2 жыл бұрын
I think the Bible is pretty clear that God is not done with either "that land" or the "people" who dwell there.
@Friedrichsen
@Friedrichsen 2 жыл бұрын
The book of Galatians explains it well but like Jon said, Paul can be hard to understand.
@traditionalgirl5585
@traditionalgirl5585 4 жыл бұрын
It means that it is not possible for us to follow the Commandments without God's Holy Spirit, but with Christ's sacrifice, the Holy Spirit is available to those who humbly sacrifice themselves to God's plan and not our own will, for we are not spiritually healthy without the Holy Spirit.... once we sacrifice ourselves back to God, the Holy Spirit fills our spirit, so we NATURALLY want to follow the Commandments and grow into becoming HOLY and hopefully fulfilling the law through the giving of the Holy Spirit. The Holy Spirit WRITES these laws on our hearts to want to follow them and take pleasure in following the Commandments.
@windyday8598
@windyday8598 3 жыл бұрын
the jerusalem council, discussed false teachers claiming that believers needed to be circumcised and "keep the law of moses". no. elsewhere regarding such things paul declares that the only thing that counts is faith (in Jesus) expressed thru love. period.
@jonathankelly2655
@jonathankelly2655 2 жыл бұрын
My interpretation is prior to the realization of Christ in You, one has to engage in exoteric religious practices in order to lead a "good" life. However, upon Christ Realization, you naturally lead a "Good" life. If you are in active participation in the Body of Christ, you, by definition, are not sinning.
@MattisWell.20
@MattisWell.20 9 ай бұрын
It’s also helpful to know that most of the Jewish laws were not universal laws, but were specifically put in place for the Jewish people in context to their unique role as those who would usher in the new humanity that comes about in Christ.
@jessecerasus9621
@jessecerasus9621 Жыл бұрын
Very interesting! In fact, it's a bit like looking at Justice at different times and how it was applied. We agree that we must not steal from our neighbor, but the penalty will vary with each era. I remember coming across a trial in New France; For stealing a table and chairs, a couple was tortured and executed in the public square! I wouldn't like to have my furniture stolen, but the torture seems a bit exaggerated to me.
@lionofapollo4636
@lionofapollo4636 4 жыл бұрын
Some swapped them with Noahide Laws.
@billyrigoyourbeardedrealto1471
@billyrigoyourbeardedrealto1471 2 жыл бұрын
We are no longer under the law but under the law of Christ.
@KnightedBean
@KnightedBean Ай бұрын
Some of the laws still make a lot of sense though. The one about not wearing garments of mixed fabrics... could this mean something like: don't have mixed identities? Be "christian" alone, not "Anglican Christian" or "Liberal Christian" or "Conservative Christian"? Wear the robe of Light and don't mix it with earthly fabrics such as earthly nationality or political ideology? This happened to the Body of Christ for sure... "russian orthodox"... "church of england"... "assyrian church of the east"? One Holy Church... I believe in Her, but where is She? Woman, which are you?
@NeanderdeOliveira
@NeanderdeOliveira 4 жыл бұрын
Hmm. Yeah, we worship god in spirit now. I would just add that those who ascend the mountain eventually understand that the 10 commandments are still inside of the ark, thus the sabbath too. Things like kosher meat might good be to keep for health purposes (God had health and spiritual concerns in them), but nevertheless isn’t a dictated per say.
@acrxsls1766
@acrxsls1766 4 жыл бұрын
The Ark is the Catholic Church (St. Thomas Aquinas) The Sabbath was a Covenant law, and is not binding on Christians once Christ fulfilled the Law (St. Paul).
@Willzyx88
@Willzyx88 4 жыл бұрын
My latest video on kosher food laws lands on some pretty hard conclusions. I believe I have proven in a rather novel and impossible-to-contend-with manner that the kashrut is dead. I know how that sounds. Check out my video and let me know what you think. It's my most recent as of today, the thumbnail reads: "The Last Word on Kosher ?". For anyone humming and hawing at this, I am still open to discussion! Also, Jonathan, if you see this! Check out my content. It's messy but with gems! Let's talk sometime.
@ButSeriouslyThough
@ButSeriouslyThough 4 жыл бұрын
While your "letting someone cross the road" analogy is interesting, Judaism does allow for such things if I'm not mistaken. It's not something that Christianity introduced. As for what you say about us being Gentiles so not all the commandments apply to us... what about Jewish converts to Christianity? Would you say that this is a proper analogy? The three-fold pattern of catharsis-theoria-theosis, of fig tree-tree of knowledge-tree of life, of narthex-nave-sanctuary, etc. also applies here: the written Law-the spiritual Law-the Eucharist. The written Law is a shadow of the Law that the Holy Spirit writes on our heart when we receive Him, and the Law (both in its "shadowy" written form and its "illumined" spiritual form) is fulfilled in the Eucharist, being a preparation for it. This makes the written Law still good to study (as a shadow, an "outline" of Christian practice) and even edifying to follow (as the Ethiopians and Eritreans do) but we are not bound by this external Law with its threats but by the inner Law that springs from love, and in fact aspects of the Law can be applied differently for the sake of edification (see: how both the Sabbath and the Lord's Day were weekly celebrations, at least in some traditions, until the Council of Laodicea made Sunday alone the full-blown day of rest [the Sabbath remaining a partial day of rest, as it still is in Orthodoxy today, with fasting being forbidden for instance] to weed out the heresy of Judaizing; see also how Paul says in Romans that whether one holds one day above the others or not it must be for the glory of God). Overall we go beyond the written Law in every aspect because the written Law is a shadow of the spiritual Law. For instance, rather than just not murdering, we abstain from even getting angry.
@nuckygulliver9607
@nuckygulliver9607 2 жыл бұрын
Jewish converts to Christianity pick the gentile's covenant. I believe in James that was an issue. Jews wanted to keep the old laws just in case but that was looked at as a lack of faith.
@nuckygulliver9607
@nuckygulliver9607 2 жыл бұрын
Jesus said to come with him because his yoke is light. He states how much easier it is with him. The pharisees forgot the reason for the law was to separate from other cultures so the messiah could be born. Islam restored these laws for no reason. They are not separating to pave the way for the messiah. Those laws had a purpose but now they don't.
@waitnotable
@waitnotable Жыл бұрын
It goes against their interest .
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