I am a conservative Roman priest turning 70 and a long time ago I too came to the realization that God works outside of perceived boundaries, and that the common mission to make Christ known in an increasingly dark world unites us all. But still we hit the denominational wall that wants to insulate. God help us all to fight the good fight aganist the true enemies of Christ

As a Reformed Baptist LBC 1689, I appreciate your endevor to keep Christ's church pure. We must not bring the WORLD into the church but the CHURCH into the world.

Thanks for this. I am currently praying over a decision to leave my current church and joining the REC. I am passionate about the 1928 BCP, and am blessed to have found a congregation that uses that BCP, has Morning and Evening Prayer and holds to the 39 Articles. I will pray for you and your congregation. Christs blessings to you.

Hey Steve, I feel the same way about the REC. You articulated well how blessed we are. There were a few pauses and technical difficulties in the recording.

As a Christian who has been on the edge of Anglicanism for two decades, this is the FIRST time someone has explained the background of the ACNA, RAC and the crisis caused by WO and the internecine strife of “where do I belong.” Very appreciative of the information provided.

Thank you, Fr. Steve, for your story, insights, and advice.

Thank you for sharing your perspective and story with us, I found it to be very insightful and gracious. One question I have is if you still think women's ordination is an issue worth dividing over? Would you, for instance, be okay with being in an ACNA diocese that did ordain women as Priests? Or, if the REC did start ordaining women as Priests (not to suggest that would ever happen, God willing), would you then leave it?

You are young and are in the process of learning. Thanks for the update. (To be continued....)

@Steve Macias Thank you for this encouraging video about what true unity is all about. As someone who has been learning about historic Christianity, my current focus has been Anglicanism, but there are a few things I'm trying to make sense of, especially in light of the 39 Articles and the different kinds of conservative anglicans. Here are a few questions I haven't found answers to yet: 1. In light of the 17th article on Predestination and election, do I have to become a Calvinist? I know of no other way to interpret its definition of election, and yet I hear of Anglicans not being Calvinists. 2. On the Eucharist, it talks about receiving the body and blood of Christ only in a spiritual manner, but I've heard it said that this is still different from Calvin's interpretation of it. If so, how would it be different? 3. In the same vein, why did the Anglicans go with a mere spiritual presence view when the vast majority of the church fathers, and especially Ignatius, speak much more literally about the Eucharist? I can understand not going as far as Rome and EO does on this issue, but why not go with the sacramental union view that Lutherans do? I realize this is a lot, and perhaps it would be better suited for a video, but I sure would appreciate some clarity on these things. Thanks so much!

Thank you for this!

What you're describing is "the great falling away", I believe. It is so sad, but thanks be to God, it heralds the soon coming day when our Lord snatches us away and rescues us. "I will build My church, and the gates of hell will not prevail against it." Praise God!

Thanks for making this video! I've recently joined an REC church and have wrestled with how the REC fits into the larger ACNA confession. It seemed to me that the REC was a denomination within a denomination so I'm intrigued by your comment that the REC is insulated. Are there any resources you would recommend for learning more about the history of the REC?

Wonderful story of your journey, your struggles, and your learnings along the way. I loved your analysis. One question I had: is your parish now using the REC BCP (2003?), the ACNA BCP (2019), or the 1928 BCP (which I believe Bp.. Sutton uses at the Cathedral Church of the Holy Communion)?

Thanks for letting us into your inner journey. I am a lay minister in the CofE. There are weighty decisions to be made. Still working on it...

Thank you for this video. I appreciate your explanation for why you're in the REC now.

That pamphlet about the episcopacy was influential for me too. What was the name of it? I can’t remember.

The REC as a jurisdiction in the ACNA is similar to the Greek Catholic Churches (multiple) plus the Ordinariate that exist in overlapping geographic locations with Roman Catholic dioceses around the world.

Wonderful and insightful reminder and call for humility, hope, and sincere unity in Christ

I worship in an ACNA church and pray for the church to resist pressure to conform to the world, but invites the world to salvation.

Thanks for sharing!

What would happen to the Episcopal Church if the Church Pension Fund were replaced with a standard IRA or Roth IRA administered by an investment firm like Morgan Stanley or Merrill Lynch, independent of church involvement? It is my impression that if a member of the clergy leaves the church for another denomination (like ACNA), the contributions for his/her retirement are forfeit. If that is true, the CPF is a powerful tool to keep clergy from straying off the reservation,. so to speak.

I pray that ANiC will move to a more faithful and patristic view of Holy Orders. Here in Canada, Manitoba specifically, there's no other option but a diocese that has women's ordination. I've been tempted to move to EO, but I'm holding out hope that we return to the biblical tradition.

Definitely good talk and discussion. Cool, calm and collected discussion. I do have some troubles with the more liberal beliefs that the ACNA holds to from Diocese to Diocese. I was at a church in the C4SO diocese and after moving see women in ordained roles - biblically I have an issue with this. Now in terms of your video - I would say though that my only issue is you reference as sources for arguments the Book of Common Prayer & 39 Articles & the Catechism more than scripture. If we as Christian are to defend Christ and our beliefs, we should be standing on arguments out of scripture - standing on Sola Scriptura!

Really helpful, thank you. I'm in the CREC, but seriously thinking through the exegetical synod argument.

As a member of the ACNA in the Diocese of Fort Worth I have a huge respect for your position here. We're one of, if not, the highest church, most orthodox, and traditional diocese in our Province. It worries me when I think of our church in the future, especially when it comes to WO.

Thank you for this video. You make very good points about the value of unity, and the degree to which unity requires absolute alignment or a break should occur. I believe everything in the Apostle's and Nicean creeds, and love that recent addition to the baptismal vows, to "respect the dignity of every other human being". I think there needs to be a level within the body of all Christians, where we say, I trust my Bishop and rector to take care of the high-level issues, and I refuse to concern myself with pronouncing judgement on whether women are ordained or homosexuality is treated within the organization. It's not MY call. I have been in churches with female clergy, and I have experienced female clergy celebrating in my home church here in the NSKK. What I must say is: some people, male or female, clearly have been called and have specific gifts that are needed in specific situations, and some (other) people are trying very hard to be what they think they should be. I am very glad I am not the one to decide which is which. All that God has, serving as His physical hands, feet, and hearts here on earth, is a bunch of flawed human beings, and if you believe what is said, there must be times when God weeps over those flaws. Meanwhile, my thoughts center around more specific issues. We talk about being "saved", we talk about "God's saving Grace", but exactly what does that look like? I'm pretty certain that being saved doesn't look like a re-purposed Coca-Cola commercial, and it isn't a 'prosperity gospel' type of magic either. So what does it look like, day to day? And since this isn't any fantasty-magical turn of events appearing spontaneously on demand, I'm pretty sure that each of us has a role to play in the salvation of others. Do we talk about the role of every believer in that salvation of others? It probably involves acts of kindness and respectful interpersonal interactions, but maybe we need to be a bit more clear about more of the the specifics. Are we mandated to become great friends and everyone getting caught up with the new addition to the group? How do we handle the feelings of 'let's take it a bit slow here", and even 'no'? How do we keep our concern for those in our group from becoming judgemental gossip? How do we make sure that the long-term members of the group don't feel left out because they aren't the bright, shiny new arrival? The false pursuit of unity in all details and unthinking repetition of "Jesus saves" is certainly counterproductive.

It saddens me the lack of REC parishes in Minnesota, let alone the few ACNA churches around.

It sometimes sounds like you're saying "RAC." @ 22:56 I assume it is the "REC."

As someone who is returning to Christ after a long absence, as I have been looking into denominations I keep coming back to looking at the fruits of the churches that ordain women ministers. The fruits are increasing liberalism and a focus on social justice rather than repentance to accept grace. This is why I can’t return to the church I was raised in; they now get activist speakers in to talk about political leftist issues and I’m just not on board.

I left the Anglican Church of Canada for the Traditional Anglican Church and the Anglican Catholic Church of Canada. I love the Anglican tradition and so when I left Anglican Church of Canada I found my home in the Anglican Catholic Church of Canada. Now I pastor a church in Calgary, Alberta. All Saints’ Traditional Anglican.

Im in alberta Canada and i dont know where there is a conservative anglican church

For up to 70 years (I am 90) I have loved Catholic (Roman) doctrine and worship and Anglican culture. Now at last I rejoice in accepting both in the Ordinariate of the Catholic Church.

Is the REC Calvinst/Augustinian in its soteriology, that some are predestined to heaven and others to hell?

The overall point in all of these cultural issues is our willingness to submit to the authority of scripture. We don't have to understand from our own human perspective (Proverbs 3:5-6), but we can have reassurance that God knows what he's doing. Something that no one ever seems to mention, in all these arguments, is that nothing has changed. Why are we 21st century believers(?) so self-centric to think that submission was always super easy for the ancients to accept, but we modern folk feel times have changed? In the past (and likely the present), God called and equipped women to become integral parts of his plan, and one historical figure even saved the people of Israel. Many of these times it has been because men shirked their own responsibility and calling from God, and he used whomever he would at his own pleasure, without any permission from us. Nevertheless, there are certain scriptural and godly principles that he has enumerated in scripture. Among them is a hierarchy of authority and with this hierarchy comes principles of submission. Although we are called to submit to one another in love, through Christ who submitted himself to the Father and gave himself ultimately for us all, we are also called to submit to those in authority over us, whether it be our husband, father or mother, our pastor, or even those in civil office. When God's principles and direction is disobeyed, we see destructive consequences, not only to ourselves, but to our families, to the Church, and to our society at large. Why is it that when women are elevated to the headship of anything, whether it's the family, civil officers, or even the Church, we see nothing but the falling away from God's word and the destruction of the institutions involved? Why does Paul say he does not permit a woman to speak in church? Many people have taken that to mean he doesn't permit women to hold positions of authority in the church with the exception of teaching children. I don't know the reasons, but I'm sure the reasons have to do with how God wants it. Paul referred us to the garden where Eve facilitated the sin of Adam. Yes, she was deceived but Adam sinned. There's something in that, and perhaps it has to do with the way we are made, I don't know. Of course, if you don't believe in the literal account of the garden of Eden, Adam and Eve, and original sin, you might as well not have a discussion with anyone. As my grandfather once said, "if you're gonna play Monopoly by the Parker Brothers, you have to play by the rules." I guess he meant that if you don't, what's the point? Look at the world around us now. Everybody's having their way, and everything is pretty much going to hell.(2 Timothy 3:1-5) "...having the form of godliness, but denying the power thereof: from such turn away." I don't have to always know why, but I kneel at the foot of the cross and except that I am forgiven and a son of God, and he is my father who I am called to obey. Can I get a witness!?

I love the REC prayerbook and several presbyters in it. Also love it’s founding principles. I fear though it’s becoming another Anglo-Catholic continuing church and there will be no place in it for Evangelical Protestants.

The Anglican Church has always been divided. It think it has over 30 provinces in different countries all making their all legislation. Even in the UK the CoE recognised the Church of Scotland as a member. So I'm not sure your criticism is valid. My suggestion is to wait until the primates meeting in Kigali in a few months when GAFCON is likely to merge with the Global South, creating a new universal Anglican Church, when the CoE will simply become one of the provinces of Anglicanism 2.0 and the head (like a papal conclave) will be elected by all the Primates. As to your particular theology, I wonder if you wouldn't be happier in a PCA type church?

the 1970's started the end of the american episcopal church

Orthodox Christian here. I randomly came across this video and found it quite fascinating, especially as an outsider. Naturally, I was drawn in by your comments regarding seeking institutional unity. It is true that you should not seek in Orthodoxy an institutional unity. If someone does come to Orthodoxy hoping for institutional unity as such, you'll be quite disappointed, especially in North America! So I've written the following to give a positive account of Orthodox Church unity. Perhaps you already know this, perhaps someone else reading this will benefit. The Church Fathers and Orthodox Confessions of faith largely define unity of the Church according to common liturgy, sacraments, faith, and the sacramental priesthood - especially the bishops, not the institution per se. During and after the Protestant Reformation, you can see this definition of unity in the Catechisms of Saint Peter Mohyla and Saint Philaret of Moscow. Contemporary to us, Fr. Maxym Lysack, in his lecture "The Church as a Eucharistic Assembly," discusses how the Church is, "not an institution, though it has institutional qualities." I don't have the source on hand, but another contemporary author, Fr. Daniel Sysoev of Blessed Memory, said that the Church is not an institution with Sacraments, but that the Church is a sacrament established by sacraments. Fr. George Mastrantonis, in his "New Style Catechism on the Eastern Orthodox Faith for Adults," also says that the Church's union is based on faith, governance (bishops and synods), worship and prayer. Fr. Michael Pomazansky in his "Orthodox Dogmatic Theology" says that, "outwardly, its unity is manifested in the harmonious confession of faith, in the oneness of Divine Services and Mysteries, in the oneness of the Grace giving hierarchy, which comes in succession from the Apostle, in the oneness of canonical order." You see seeds of this even in St. Ignatius who says that, "wherever the Bishop is, there is the Catholic Church." Orthodox would see in St. Ignatius' epistles a Sacramental priesthood due to St. Ignatius' emphasis on the Bishop's importance to ensure everything conducted is, "secure and valid," including the Eucharist. So this notion of the Church's oneness not being based primarily on institutional unity, but rather faith, sacraments, liturgy and bishops is quite ancient and alive today.

I recently got into a discussion with an Eastern Orthodox lady online. I am an Anglican, but I am orthodox in my belief. I feel the ACNA is an answer to my prayers. As I recall there are 3 dioceses that allow female priests. This is how it all began to come apart with the CofE and the Episcopal church. I was disappointed, to say the least. When Bishop Duncan's wife decided to add her opinion, I knew we had a problem. I watched a local parish split with the conservatives leaving and along with a retired priest spent the next 10 years worshiping in a storefront church. It was difficult for them, but they had recently moved into their newly built church. There can be no compromise. With all this in mind, I mentioned to this Orthodox lady that I was an orthodox Anglican to which she took great umbrage. I explained to her that I used the small letter "o" to indicate that we are orthodox in our doctrine, which is actually almost identical to the Eastern Orthodox. The new Prayer Book even shows the Niacin Creed with the deleted Filioque. I asked her if she was aware that Orthodox believers are permitted to worship in an Anglican church if there is no Orthodox church in the area. None of that helped. She was adamant that we had no right to use the word orthodox because they are the Orthodox. I knew there was no way this was going to end up in a good way so I said goodbye by reminding her something that my priest told me; "be careful not to make the religion your god because that would be a sin too. "

How do deal with priestesses in the ACNA Father Steve Macias?

As a Canadian, the more time proceeds and the more things unfold in North American Anglicanism, the more I value the REC as an excellent example of continuity over time and proper development and maturity as an Anglican jurisdiction (and the REC has had its fair share of disputes over the many decades and has come through them with greater maturity).

Even though we have different views I enjoy your videos.

That was sure a long winded way to say that none of us are perfect. You could have done this video with the same impact in 5 minutes or less.

I left the ACNA after a lot of reflection and prayer. I recrossed the Tiber and I am not looking back. I think ACNA is a welcoming refuge for people who are like a Catholic looking church but not the catechism and the details ..I think ACNA actually helped me rediscover my Faith and I am grateful to my former church and pastor who answered all my questions and were very supportive.

I like the REC.

The world is as tough as it is today because man still believes he can escape the judgment of GOD.

Oh, how I wish the REC existed in Minneapolis. The nearest ACNA parish probably has good preaching. But, I tried guitar worship in my mid 20s to mid 30s, in the 1980s and 1990s. It just doesn't work for me. I even played Tenor Saxophone in the worship team, back in the day. Nope, it doesn't work for me. It's not wrong. Its just not me. I quite like your video. I'm that guy who can fit in with conservative liturgical Reformed or liturgical confessional Lutheranism, though my reading of the early Church is for episcopal church government. Subscribed and edified by your KZfaq channel.

I had an Orthodox priest tell me that women were ordained for the first 350 years of church history, but I haven't been able to find it.

REC rocks.

Thumbnail had me sweatin

As a Roman Catholic, I agree with you that there are many differences between Christian sects, but there are much more similarities than fringe differences. And there are enough similarities that I see that we are actually still united. I studied various church denominations and it turns out that they all support each other. In history there have been many church divisions, and we think that Christianity was divided into many different groups. But history shows that those many Christian groups are still influence each other, enrich each other, and this looks like some kind of unity even though we are not a unified organization. It is all the result of the shepherding of the Holy Spirit. Against the wishes of many Christians themselves, it turns out that all Christian denominations in this world are used by God together and made to support each other. Romans 8:28 is proven in history. As a Roman Catholic, I join the Charismatic movement but by the direction of the Holy Spirit also doing the daily Anglican Divine Office. The divine office lectionary that I use is from ACNA BCP of 2019.

An interesting development concerning your former "bishop" Will Boyd. He's gone of the deep end and started his own church, headquartered in Singapore. He now styles himself as the Overseer of the Ancient Church of the West. It gets crazier and crazier!

In the Roman Church, everyone is SUPPOSED to submit to the Pope but, to be honest, many Catholics (most?) listen respectfully to the Pope and bishops -- and then make their own decisions.

1. You didn’t touch on conservative viewpoint that marriage is a sacrament or at least sacramental. 2. Institutional unity coming from apostolic succession and a unity as discussed in the counsels for guidance within the faith. 3. The problem with the ACNA is that they got people who had, and still have, no idea what Anglicanism is. They gave them a prayer book and said “go have fun”. Then they ordained them as bishops. They put more of an emphasis on find raising rather than an appreciation for traditional liturgical practices. There are several bishops who want to turn ACNA into the vineyard. One took the creed out of the service. 4. As for Women’s ordination, phoebe…..

Great Rector

The ACNA has always been the closest to my faith, The Lutheran Church Missouri Synod.

No matter a person's view, we can not change the truth. I believe in the doctrine of the marriage of one man and one woman. Stretching or changing it is twisting Scripture to meet men's wants. My 2 cents.

That is my current struggle. I go to a baptist church and theyre lovely. But I dont agree with the dismissal of the sacraments, the primary ones of baptism and the eucharist. But the only ACNA church near me ordains women and thats something I cant support, as its in scripture. Theres a continuing Anglican church near me and a TEC church that atleast seems moderate. Im thinking i may end up in my local LCMS church theyre atleast consistent. Anglican Lutheran? 😂

If you love me, feed my sheep.

I am struggling to understand, based on this logic, why Gentiles should be allowed into the priesthood - biblically, only Jews were priests. The early Jerusalem Church only thought to include Jews in its communion. Isn’t the question of female ordination to be decided, as the question of the Gentiles in Acts, by the Spirit? Does the Spirit come upon these women? Do they bear spiritual fruit? I’m not asking about the larger denominations, I’m asking about actual flocks tended by actual female ordained priests. I imagine the Spirit would also be the One to decide the question of blessing same sex union. Does the Spirit come upon those in committed same sex unions as it did upon Cornelius? Isn’t this the ONLY question? Edit to add: I mean these as real questions, not rhetorical. Do people know folks such as these whom the Spirit has come upon as happened to Cornelius in Acts? If yes, and it is demonstrated, what else needs to be considered? Can’t the Church grow, as it did when it grew to include gentiles in the first place? Certainly with women conducting mass? Isn’t it up to the Spirit?

Well, when heads stop turning, I finally chose the Anglican Western Rite Church under the ROCOR. I am 66 years old and grew up in the Catholic Church until the 3rd grade. Then I joined an Episcopal Cathedral men and boys choir. Then I started seeing the evils coming into all liturgical churches and saw the destruction of old, true and good biblical things, teachings, doctrines, etc. I should say that from childhood, I have been a Christian mystic, clairvoyant and Seer who has a huge majority of dreams and visions that come true. Also, at an early age, I seem to know and have great intuitive insight into many biblical and spiritual mysteries. Anyway, I joined an ACC church, then finally, after much prayer, started an independent, autonomous, autocephalous monastery modelled after the Anglican Western Rite Church; using the both the Sarum Rite and the 1928 Anglican Altar Missal. I absolutely refuse to accept females and practicing homosexuals in any ministerial roles - even the reading of scripture in any function within the church or even to function in caring for the dressing of the altar. Woman are not allowed in the sanctuary or choir. Professionally, I was a world expert in men and boy choirs and male schola. Our monastery using only traditional classical sacred music from chant to polyphony, motets, anthems and traditional hymnody.

The "genuine Orthodox" or "Old Calendarist" splitter ( called Protestants in the East ) from mainline Orthodoxy hold strict, "right belief" over Apostolic succession. But they have Bishops. They are not in communion with main line Orthodox who they privately view to be in heresy. To their negative however, I believe the "Matthewites" have developed a "New Doctrine" seeing Icons in a hyper magical way, which has led to further separation.

God calls me as a woman to ministry, so I'm to reply, the men won't let me?

You keep referring to the Church as an institution. This is strange to me, since the Church is the Lord's body.

What is your age? You look so young not in a collar!

So...instead of polarizing/offending claims to be either Catholic or Orthodox or Protestant or Evangelical....why not the option of confessing to be simply BIBLICALLY APOSTOLIC!!!!!!!

"monolithic set of beliefs..." Yeah....it's called the Rudder.

It’s important that we the faithful return to the Catholic Church. I made my return back 2 years ago. Christianity is imploding around the world due to too many whacky worldly ideas seeping in. Our best bet for survival is maintaining orthodoxy under the Roman umbrella in my honest opinion.

He seems unaware of the major issue facing the American Episcopal Church after the American Revolution. The Anglican Bishops had to take an oath to the Crown. This was not acceptable in the US. They got around this by asking Scotish Bishops who too no such oath to ordain a line of American priests. This is a huge opps.

I left because of the lies and the favoritism, and priests and bishops (well one particular bishop) who, condemnation without investigation. Who actively worked to Stifle ministry.

Someone needs to invite him to a Christian for Biblical Equality meeting. What about Priscilla and Acquilla?

I left the ACNA for Orthodoxy because I knew no part of Anglicanism was truly right because of the Great Schism. Schism hews off the whole parts of the tree of life and separates the truth from them the longer they are gone. This is why we see Anglicans with women deacons, priests, and bishops. Come home to Orthodoxy, the Antiochian Western Rite Vicariate is always open for conversions of clergy, laymen, and whole parishes.

Greek Orthodox.

I left organized Christianity because of the internal judgment, against others, petty doctrinal differences, childish cliques, double standards on materialism, soft shunning of ex members.

😂

You should get that mole checked. You could have made your point without all the histrionicism. You would have been more credible as well.

The RCC has 'institutional unity', but in reality, it's the most heterodox church in history. Indeed, it now approaches 'maximum heterodoxy'. The hierarchy, especially after Vatican 2, decided that there would be no more 'formation' - no passing along of the orthodox traditional doctrines, laws, teachings of Christianity. Now, there are roughly a billion different versions of Roman Catholicism - as each individual Catholic is left to mold his faith to fit into his personal lifestyle - which is dominated by the intensely anti-Christian 'mass culture' of America.

I left ACNA because of their covert charismatic tendencies.

You should set up your own "church". Plenty of people do. Unlike those of the last 2000 years I(including the ones written to in the New Testament), it can be perfect, without blemish. Purely biblical. No accretions.

The vast huge majority of humanity will not accept Christ and his free will gift of salvation and so will find themselves in the Lake of Fire! If I were the clergy, I would be more concerned about being involved in Christ's salvation of a single soul - a child of the Light, rather than the multitude of the children of the dark one. GOD's temple is built brick by brick, stone by stone, soul by soul.

I really appreciate your point of view but the reality is you can’t be in communion with heretics. How do u have communion with a another diocese if the bishop is a woman when you believe the sacred ministry is gender exclusive (as I do) You can’t both be right ….so either that women is a bishop or she is not. And If she is not then you are in communion with a heretic. I really do see what your saying and it sounds nice in theory but I don’t believe that is biblical…. I believe the bible calls us to seperate ourselves from those who don’t keep the pure doctrine. I agree there is no perfect institution…but when a church is as far gone as the Church of England is then I don’t think we can even call it a Christian church anymore: the Mormon’s are more Christian than the CofE is

Homosexuality is a sin love is not, there are many sins, we do not cast out sinners neither should we hold them upon a pedastal to teach others how to sin. Marriage is precious in the church it is not just a bond, it is a promise of bringing life into the church and the church in turns aleves resources and support in this effort, the church is at its base a pro birth effort, and such followers should recieve marriages benidiction as is the tradition. This thing where gays demand marriage is not good, it lessens the word, and shows another sin of jealously. Its not good. A selfless moral gay would understand the value of this. The govetnment should stay out of church matters and stop using a faith word as marriage for tax breaks and other gov plans, government should stick non faith words such as civil unions

you don't look very Anglican!

I don’t agree with X, so let’s form another church, and I don’t agree with X so let’s form another church, and I don’t agree with X so I too want another church. This is the poison of Christianity, this entitlement that the church should adhere to one’s beliefs politically, personally, professionally, etc. It’s a joke.

This all seems so unnecessary.

So...t's a conversation about men. Women always seem to be on the "outside" - being talked about and observed as if they aren't really "a part." So it's a man talking about not liking women being in any leadership position in the church, and being so offended he left. But that was going too far towards stuff he didn't like, so he came back. And it's a video to be watched and pondered by .... men. I sometimes wonder where women fit in the ACNA. Having the babies and cleaning the church while the men discuss the theology. Just an observation.

I am so glad I am Presbyterian. Thank you for that validation through the most confusing speech I have ever heard. This is word salad.

Paul is just like any pastor/ priest, sometimes he gets it right, sometimes he gets it wrong.

repent and return to the Roman Catholic Church

Call me inconsistent, I'm with you on denying practicing homosexuals into the clergy, but I just cannot understand why people hate women ministers so much. You brush off the historicity of women in church as simply false without much of an explanation, but the obvious biblical example is the deacon Phoebe recognized by Paul. At the very least female deacons should not be objected. You deride the patriarchal aspect, which, sure, fuck feminism and fuck the way the youth use that meme, but it objectively was a patriarchal culture, and we still use the title patriarch in the church today. It seems silly to pretend that cultural governance that existed before the church and even before Judaism had no impact on this early church structure or on Paul's epistle to Timothy. But I'm just a lay person, I expect to be rebuked. Still gonna say you need to get over it anyway.

Show me a man who thinks women cannot be ministers, and I will show someone who looks down on women in general and does not have the true heart of Christ. They worship power and religion and not Jesus. This is particularly bad on the Reformed side.