Yes; I think a well known bike fit specialist has been saying this for a while; race bikes are designed for 20 somethings putting out 350-400+ watts for many hours. A 9-5 office worker needs a different bike.....

100% Agree. I purchased a Domane SL6 back in 2018 and love the versatility. Can Keep up with group rides and long 50 plus mile rides are more enjoyable. Super comfortable. I still have my old 2007 madone Ill take out on occasion. Thanks for making this video.

Great video, David, as always. I could not agree more about the premise of endurance bikes for we mere mortals. One of things you touched on was geometry between endurance and road bikes. Just this week; I was looking closely at the geometry of the new 61cm Synapse vs the new 61cm SuperSix. The dimensions are nearly identical. What I think really separates the two are things like aero tube shaping and the carbon layup between the two models. But apart from that; you are very much correct that the gap between the endurance and race platforms are starting to narrow! I always enjoy your content, Sir! Thanks!

Riding tougher gravel stuff on my road race bike is what taught me I was wrong about my bike choice. After a few leery trails, I built up a bike that could handle trails and found it was also more comfortable on the road. I still like my more stretched out bike geometry on occasion, but I've found myself actually looking at the scenery and noticing the world around me on my gravelish bike.

I have a specialized diverge 2019. This had the best geromomitry for endurance riding comfort for me at the time.48/32 at front and 11/34 rear. 2 sets of wheels with 28mm Conti for road and 38mm panaracer for gravel. Completed plenty of 60 plus Sportives.

Race, Endurance, All Road and Gravel, soon to be announced Unobtainium (the 20k bike everyone must have) . Based upon all the marketing hype, you could N+1 yourself into the poor house.

I think you are absolutely right. Ive been riding strictly road race bikes for the last 15 years. I limit my rides to no more than 2 hours as it gets fatiguing. When I get a bit older I will get a Ti endurance bike.. For now I still love the pure racer as it makes you want to ride as hard as you can.

I sold my Roubaix during the pandemic because I wanted an even more versatile and comfortable ride. I bought a Lynskey titanium GR300 gravel bike and have three wheelsets I cycle through (pun intended) depending on my mood; 700c road, 700c gravel and 650b mtb. The Shimano 600 GRX 2x drivetrain meets most of my needs splendidly. My favorite setup is with 650b tires and WTB Sendero knobbies; I feel like I can ride nearly anywhere with this setup. BTW, I also use a Redshift suspension stem and suspension seatpost because singletrack descents are brutal! I start with riding road from my house to my nearby (of farby) trailhead and often concoct loops with all three surfaces; backroad , doubletrack and singletrack to boot. When riding 9n 700c road mode, I give up a little top end gearing but not much else. Score!

Dave, you are awesome..I recently switched to pirelli p zero 30mm tires and i can say they are super comfy,fast and traction is top of the game..

I agree 100%. I've done a couple of PBP1200 rides and hundreds of Audaxes. The biggest improvement I made (apart from modern LED lights) was buying a Trek Domane. It's by far the quickest bike I've owned but more comfy than any of my "Really comfy Steel frame" bikes. The bars are quite high BUT it means I use the drops much more than I ever did before. OK, it's not exactly like Mark Cavendish on the final sprint but I can stay in the drops for a few hours. It has micro suspension, is flexible in all the right places but totally stiff along the Drive train. That's beauty of Carbon Fibre.

Nah buy bikes second hand the ones that get ridden a couple of times then get fed up and sell them for a fraction of the retail price🤫

As long as seat height and middle seat to hoods alignment fits you, the bike does not matter much IMO. Tyre choice and tyre pressure matters much more

I think I’d get measured up and fitted for a custom steel frame , external cable routing and put a lovely mechanical campag groupo on it. Simple to work on and a joy to ride. Nice looking Willier though.

Great advice thank you!

It's worty to invest into a bike fitter first before buying anything. The fitter will tune you into the correct position first, then (s)he will advise if the geometry of your preferred bike is matching the fit you need. Then by using proper saddles, stems, handlebars, etc you can perfectly get tuned to the optimal fit. Monobloc and aero cockpits are a nightmare to achieve a personalized fit. I personally have a cannondale supersix evo with an upward pointing stem and a gravel handlebar. This was the only way to achieve the best fit. The bike kind of looks ugly but the rides (4+ hrs) are painless and comfortable. I also use 28-30 tubeless tires at 4.7 bars. So all in all get a bike fit first then the bike. This way you will get the best experience out of cycling as a sport.

I absolutely agree. I have Cannondale Supersix EVO. It is technically not endurance but the comfort is close. I have reduced the stem, changed the gears to new Shimano Ultegra 12 speed and the cassette 11-34t. I also have Conti GP5000 30mm tubeless tires. I can ride rough and long routes now. By the way, I have just ridden the Hell of North with this bike.

My Cannondale CAAD10 use😂 to get to my lower back in 29 miles. Switched to a BMC Granfondo 01 with 28s and let's say the difference is like night and day. Very happy now.

A well informing video thanks

It is a fallacy that endurance geometry suits everyone. A lot of people need longer & lower bikes to be comfortable and powerful. Get a bike fit and find out what geometry you need. Don’t fall for the narratives.

Absolutely correct! You make a very strong case for endurance bikes. Not every one of us is a pro racer. As for me … I can’t wait to take delivery of my Trek Domane and enjoy the heck out of it. Cheers!

Thanks for good tip to choose bike. ❤

This year I switched to the road bike race category. Until then I was riding the endurance category. And I've found that I'm much more comfortable riding the race than the endurance. So, at least in my case, it's not true that the endurance frame is more suitable for longer rides. I quickly figured out why the race frame is more comfortable for me. It's due to the fact that I have a longer trunk and thus longer arms relative to the length of my legs, so a more elongated frame suits me.

I apply this thinking to MTB. I have a rigid steel adventure bike with 3" tyres with a tubeless set-up [20psi front, 25 rear]. This essentially provide 3cm suspension travel fore and aft. The key thing is rear cushioning - upper body has built-in suspension [fingers/wrists/elbow/shoulder] but shocks from the rear wheel are always transmitted directly to the body and this is what makes cycling tiring. Fat tyres are a simple, cheap and effective solution - but the industry want to sell you complicated suspension to make the bike more expensive than it needs to be. There is only just one bike currently on the market that fits this gap is (the surly ogre) which can run 2.8" tyres. Just as 1x drivetrains simplified gears - so fat tyres could eliminate front suspension forks and rear suspension gimmicks - making bikes easier to maintain and cheaper to produce. Carbon frames and carbon wheels could be offered to keep the luxury market alive.

I'd still get a good gravel bike over an endurance bike. With road tires it will be comparable to the endurance bike but also with the possibility to do gravel and possibly bike packing. The manufacturers are just finding ways to milk the cow by inventing gravel race, gravel bikepacking, endurance and race bikes.

This topic has been in the forefront of my brain for many years - as once I can afford a new bike - this will be the big decision. I own a carbon synapse from 2011 and it is fast, light and comfy. But have always wondered how different it really is to a race bike, as have never had one. Would be really useful in a future video - to give a lowdown on the full spectrum of the current endurance bikes. Ie racy vs non-racy. And maybe just how different they are to their race-bike brothers (eg synapse bs supersix evo). Would be great to see a practical listing that would help decision-making for buyers. Video by Sam (can’t remember which KZfaq channel) a few days ago did this kind of comparison with synapse vs domane. So something similar but across all main bike brands. Thanks Dave!

Willier make beautiful looking bikes love it.

That's why I love my Defy Advanced. Perfect all round.

Thank you for your professional opinion.

Have a Ribble Endurance Ti. Put a REDSHIFT ShockStop PRO Suspension Seatpost on it, which is great as can stay seated on terrible road surfaces. No suspension on the front as not needed, just a light grip on the handlebars. Also have a leather brooks b17 saddle for supreme comfort. Comfortable as the Endurance bike is, the Kona Sutra tourer is even better as soaks up everything on the road , no numbness atall in the hands due to upright riding position. The Endurance bike though is more fun, light, agile and 10% faster on all routes. Next bike will be a touring recumbent tadpole trike for ultimate comfort and attention.

Nice & Thanks :)

We don't need new bikes, nor different. We need to clone Neill Stanbury and distribute him all over the world so everybody can correct the atrocities done by sellers and retul. The right bike is the bike that fits.

Thanks nice video I have a lovely endurance bike I have a Boardman slr 8.9 it’s my first road bike I love it, the only issue for me is to get a longer stem it feels a bit short for me

What happens in 10 years time if u need to get a new elastimer insert and they dont make them any more? Why not just build flex into the frame?

If I didn't like bikes so much, I'd get one endurance bike, and have a couple sets of wheels for varying whatever (heck I'd even gamble and try cross too on the same setup), and simplify my life. I just like bikes.

Just bought a Willier Triestina Garda and it's so comfortable compared to my Storck which is a more aggressive set up.

I wish people would stop banging on about bloody endurance bikes. I'm old and fat but absolutely love my tarmac SL7.

Just bought a Canyon Endurace, absolutely love it so far. My back isn't great so the riding position works for me plus 30mm tyres and the flex seatpost mean I don't want to cry after half an hour.

Good product and good services

love my 700x40c... dont want to go narrower that that ;)

I have a Canyon Aeroad and a Canyon Endurace. To be honest the Aeroad is just as comfortable on long rides and it’s faster and more fun to ride.

I was thinking this would only cool one room, but it does well at cooling the entire floor.

Completely agree on confort, endurance. Hail endurance bikes

Along came aluminium, then carbon, then the compact nonsesnce. Cue a load of skuldugery trying to regain the comfort. Just buy a steel bike in a size that doesn't have a ton of seatpost showing with traditional geometry, space for 30mm tyres and then it will be as it was before the marketing. Just a fraction heavier.

Ordered a Ribble Endurance SL a couple weeks ago, can't wait for it to show up

Most bicycles in motion, as your read this, are getting people from A to B. I commute to work on a Dura-Ace equip Pinnarello Prince with 700X23 tiers. This is perfect for a short (d

I love my 2018 specialized Roubaix

Wow..running to the store to buy everything you say i need😂

Girvin Flex-Stem making a comeback, I'm holding out!

It's funny how bike usage differs across countries. In the Netherlands we use bicycles for a lot more and a bike like this would be totally unsuitable for most of it.

Agree, relative to buying a road race bike when you are not actually racing. But, totally disagree. Because an endurance bike is made completely irrelevant by gravel race bikes.

I have a mid-range Gravelbike (Cannondale Topstone 1) and an entry-mid range Roadbike (Cube Attain Race). I think especially for the city the Gravelbike is the better option, as you have badly maintained roads, lots of changes on to biking lanes etc. - so for me it's an do it all bike. While saying that, even my entry-mid range Roadbike IS faster than the Gravelbike in avarage, or at least I am faster on that... But the comfort-penalty that I take with the Roadbike, isn't worth it. So in day to day action, I usually use my Gravelbike.

Nice gravel bike.

Please don't think it's a contrarian take for contrarianism's sake, but...I really like my race bike. I'm comfortable on it, and can easily do a 5-hour ride without pain. While I agree with the general premise, as ever, "it depends." Granted I don't have a hyper-stiff, high-mod carbon frame, but my mid-range Supersix Evo feels good from mile 1 to mile 100. It definitely has some deficiencies where comfort's concerned, but I ride poorly-maintained rural roads slathered in rough chipseal and unpaved paths without feeling like I'm rattling apart. The snappy handling and general get-up-and-go nature of the bike more than make up for what it lacks, in my opinion. I've got a steel commuter fixie that a friend once described as a "couch" due to its relaxed geometry. It's upright and smooth, and I I've put as many miles on it as my C'dale. However, I'd rather go attack the road with my race frame if the mileage count starts to head north of 20-25 mi. To sum it all up: I'm with you that many people would be better served by reaching for a Roubaix or Synapse instead of a Tarmac or SuperSix, but that won't be the case for everyone. Fitness, flexibility, age, goals...all of these factor in. Probably the best option for those looking to plonk down a tidy sum on a new frame would be for folks to get a good, unbiased fit *before* reaching for their wallets.

Yes, most people are buying the wrong bike. They should be buying a used bike with a steel or aluminum frame and rim brakes, external cable routing, and a standard seat post, stem, and handlebar. They should be focusing on a proper saddle, dialed in height and reach, good quality aluminum wheels with serviceable bearings, and supple tires (irrespective of width) instead of aero BS and high-tech gadgetry.

Its very hard to get a low head tube aggressive frame even as spec now. Finding a 56cm effective top tube bike lower bb sub 70mm and a low stack is not easy outside if a custom build. A head tube length of 165 to 170 on a 56 is common with only a couple i can think of tbh.

In contrast to pure race bikes, endurance bikes come in a wide variety of designs, A BMC Roadmachine is essentially a race bike with higher stack and shorter reach, while the Trek Domane is almost a Gravel bike. So, it is hard to give general recommendations.

IMO, Giant TCR is the best of both worlds!

5:47 Ouch, that rust! You should look into chain lubes and waxes. 🙂

Comfort, performance and versatility. Asgreens crux is the answer. That is if you can afford one. To me the endurance bike is becoming irrelevant. You can either choose for a race bike or a gravel bike (with a road friendly gearing if you ask me)

Reading some of these comments as a layperson wanting to learn what to buy, it seems that gravel bikes fitted with fast tyres for road and fat ones for gravel is the best choice.

Any chance of reviewing the cube agree or wilier garda??

Gravel bike. Your average endurance frame can take wider tyres, or mudguards, not both. With the state of your typical British road, 35mm-or wider- and mudguards- are the best option.

I have an endurance/gravel bike. Now I’m looking at an additional race bike.

Any suggestions on a good endurance aluminum bike?

is it possible for an endurance RB to have a dropper post for additional comfort?

Given that's true, you don't need those carbon wheels then, and could be just as happy on bike that costs 1/2 that like my carbon synapse - Nice looking bike though!

Interesting topic from the channel with topics like is "Endurance bike dead" One minute hacking a gravel bike now back to Endurance bikes

If you want proper comfort buy a nice steel frame

David please. What is the difference between a caad 13 and a synapse aluminium. Thank you

Didn’t you do a video on the trek domane recently saying endurance bikes were pointless?

As someone that's been on a flatbar hybrid for some time now, I find myself looking at the endurance road category for the next bike. I was all about the gravel bike for the even more relaxed geo and big tire clearance. But being on flat roads 99% of the time I don't need the big tires. Just changed from 38mm to 28mm tires on my hybrid, and that alone has made a big difference. Although I think 32mm would be the sweet spot for width.

The Wilier there is $12,786, not very attainable for the average person! How would a trek Emonda ALR 5 (2023) be? - with the stock 28 tires, or with GP5000 28’s? Or GP5000 25’s? Or the trek Domane AL5 etc.?

Simplon Kiaro Disc- my choice.

Can i add a suspension seatpost/stem/fork for more comfort?

I'm 51 and I use my bike to get me about and doing bunny hops.

The latest dropped rear stays in relation to where it meets the seat-tube, give flex/suspension already - if it’s say a third of the way down the down tube, it gives about 0.5 to 1 degree flex which is about 2.5-3mm at the rear axle (55cm frame).

I hate bikes with short top tubes. I find them far too cramped, more difficult to get up for climbing. For me to compensate for the long top tube, I use a shorter stem, and raise the handlebars.

I ride bikes for exploring nature,new locations,adventure travel,touring,not just fitness

28 32mm tyres still too thin 36mm are best if you can fit them

I'll agree that most cyclists need an endurance bike, but I'd disagree with the premise that it must be an either/or scenario. What is my garage for if not for more bikes. Aggressive road-race bike? Check. Cyclocross / gravel bike? Check. MTB with suspension? Check. Alloy frame endurance bike with disc brakes? Check (if you allow for the fact that I bought one for my son that I occasionally "borrow"). Don't let on to our wives that it may be reasonable to go through life with only one bike. Otherwise, I'll have to start spending my money on golf clubs!

How comfortable are you on the drops on an endurance bike vs a road, since a shorter reach would mean your back might be a bit more bent on an endurance than a road bike? EDIT: do you feel like you would be falling over' compared to a road bike ?

One point is everything: low resale value

Last week you were telling us gravel bikes are the perfect bike🙄

At 6:07 you’re talking about the benefits of low gearing while passing a guy walking his red Wilier up the very steep hill. Hard to tell but is it the exact same bike you are using as the example? 😀

Lets face it, the ONLY way u can keep your avg speed, after a big climb, is to BOMB the downhill without even thinking about the brakes (or breaking yur tuck). Its SO much easier to do on a bicycle that has stability.

A few years ago I would have said, No way--too much stack, too little reach, stupidly slack head angles, too much gimmickry with Zertz, decouplers, Future Shock, silly handlebar shapes, multi-angle stems, padded handlebar tape, etc., etc. Now I'm seeing bikes like the Giant Defy, Scott Addict, and Cannondale Synapse and I say. what took you so long?

Giant defy, Specialized Roubaix-great examples of endurance bikes that loose 80% off their resale value in a heart beat-not recommended😢

Still want a gravel bike. Being slower doesn't matter because I ride solo.

Does this mean I should get an aethos instead of an s5 and put some deeper carbon hoops on it?

That's why I need N+1 bikes

What's the point of an endurance carbon bike?

Wasn’t this same video made about 10 years ago when bikes like the Trek Domane and Specialized Roubaix were being promoted?

I ride my bike twice a week. It is a Specialized Allez Spint first gen. No spacers, 17ª degrees stem, outer cables, 54 tooth 1x chainring and a 132 cm wide saddle with no padding. As a normal cyclist, I think it is the worst combination as you can find, but for me, even for an alloy bike (not the most confortable material), it is the most confortable bike in the world. With all respect, for me this video does not make sense at all. Everyone has to ride the bike that get you a smile, and fulfill your needs.

Whats the mt bike equivalent?

A more comfortable bike will let you ride longer and more often, which will make you stronger and fitter. Being fitter is going to make you faster than any marginal aero gains ever could.

28c is nice and all but what about us rim brake riders? Do they still fit?

I’ve got three bikes all different and all good at what they do but whatever I ride I refuse to wear those Peter Pan Lycra trousers 😊

I think they're buying the wrong bike pedals also. They should try Pitbull bike pedals as they are the easiest to learn to use and the quickest to engage:-)

Front tire on backwards m8

To be honest i see many comments that tell the endurance is mach slower than aero well something that you never realize is that the aero bikes the most of the times have 53/54 teeth crankset and endurance bikes 48/50 crank in my endurance road bike i chance from tiagra 48/50 crank to dura ace 53/54 the difference on the flat is significant from 25 khm to 32 khm per our with tiagra with dura ace 40 khm without even try so in the bikes there is a lot of manufacturers that its matter but when i hear all the time about aero is a pure bullshit the comments do the most of job and especially the rider want a good bike you dont have to spent 10.000 dolars . My is 7.590 weight without pedals and the the price was 2240 not bad i see many brands that the cost a lot and to me its make no sense. Just enjoying the rides with whatever bike it is