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We will know the answer 20 years after today

For me i think the difference of the 2JZ from the B58 is that: 2JZ: It can withstand Extremely high-boost (PSI) and insanely reliable. But it is a heavy engine (Iron Block) and prone to heating at rapid speeds if tuned to 4-digit numbers (needs insane amount of cooling) B58: Its a much more torque-y engine (bigger stroke), therefore easily puts power on the wheels. In terms of the block, i think the Aluminium Block can withstand Medium to High-Boost(PSI) (but i personally think these engines cannot run very long with extreme boost since its not that strong compared to an Iron Block) But at the same time these engines have the ability to lose heat more efficiently than a conventional Iron Block and it is much lighter. In summary: 2JZ has insane potential, suited for tuning that involves extreme boost or heavy stress, but needs good amount of a cooling system, or it will overheat rapidly. B58 has great potential, but it should be done carefully; since it is not that kind of an engine to withstand heavy stress.(High Boost applications) That's my opinion. No hate.

Papadakis just hit 1000 hp with their built b58

Im a toyota boy but salute to bmw for sticking with the I6, the b58 is goated🫡

Hats off to BMW because they have stayed with the inline 6 and given us a highly tune-able motor as well. From my perspective 2jz's are ridiculously expensive to buy and year that figure rises. The B58 predecessor the 600hp+ tuneable N54 is cheap as chips to buy now and the B58 will be in that category in 10-15 years. The relevance here is what you can get with bolt on's 700 hp maybe 800 is a shed load of power, if people want a 1000 plus HP then its irrelevant what motor they choose 2JZ, Barra, B58, RB because once you open it up costs go through the roof. To the diehard 2JZ boys Papadakis racing just made 1000hp with a B58 and like a 2JZ there were new rods pistons etc so if you hate the Supra because it's not a 2JZ then go and buy a new car with one in, oh that's right you cant.

Great job at explaining both engines without having any bias.

I'm not an engineer but surely it's about emissions, an engine made 20 years ago might be a fantastic engine but would struggle to meet modern emissions standards, I'm led to believe that's why many cars of that type and time were killed off.

The b58 has already broke 1000 HP.

I have both. There are pro's and con's with each one of them. I love the simplicity of the 2J GTE. Time will tell for the B58, but I'm excited to see how it does 10 years from now. I bought into the platform mainly because of how fast its growing and how well it is doing.

man you explane everthing so perfect .. really like your channel

Came here for all the triggered 2JZ fam boys and the comments didn’t disappoint! 😂

b58 more torque better response better fuel economy and make more power in stock trim or with simple bolt on like a simple tuned

The 2jzfse was a direct injection version. People have avoided it like the plague but it exists.

Great perspective on the engines.

If there really was a focus on high end development then Toyota could have (perhaps) accessed the new S58 motor - which is for racing and highend development. The B58 motor in my M340i is absolutely phenomenal, smooth, revs and extremely fuel efficient. 382 horsepower and 500Nm in standard form with a closed deck alloy block and head. It's a world beater. I think Toyota have got the right motor!

UPDATE AFTER A YEAR----- I personally own an n55 AND b58 and I'm very active in the forums, b58 has long surpassed 1000hp with a built bottom end and has long surpassed 800hp with a totally stock engine. The only times it breaks is when the tuner fks up, CHEERS 🍻

imagine being the stupid middle schooler that comments “should’ve used the 2jz”

GOOD job, good video, very clear explanation.

I came from the future, the b58b30 allready hit 8sec in 1/4 mile and 800whp on stock internals

When a brand new engine has to compete with a 20 year old engine, that shows how good the 2jz is, period.

Something else to consider is that BMW seems to be putting the B58 in a lot of vehicles so there will be lots of them around a decade from now, where as a good 2jz-gte is getting harder to find.

The cams on the b58 will also mean that it will still be a fuel efficient daily, so at least it has that.

Love all the information thanks

But the reason for making the power is to go fast. Within a few months of its release, the A90 Supra is firmly in the 10s with a couple of bolt ons, in the 9s with nitrous and is only getting quicker.

Having watched the papadakis videos, I think over time the opinion of the B58 will improve. It's closed deck, it has plenty of meat between the cylinders and it's modern - something I think a lot of people overlook is how much stronger aluminium blocks have become over the years, especially with motors built for boost (check out what people are doing with VR38s now). Cast iron being a stronger block is not a given (RB26 anyone?) Much like every new performance engine, we will have to wait a while to find out its true potential. Do people think that the moment 2JZs hit the market that people were immediately pushing them to 800+ horsepower on stock bottom ends? Of course not, that wasn't happening on any significant scale until the motors got more common and much cheaper so people were more willing to risk a catastrophic failure. The reputation of the 2JZ was built over time, as will be the reputation of the B58.

Really nice comparison summary!

Great video Keep it up 👍🏼

fanboys be like engineers and killing each other in the comments and im here enjoying what i read, those dudes aint even got the real thing and yet speaks like they already tuned one.

Two of the best sounding engines of all time! Just bought my first bmw 440I with the b58. 👌 the low end tq is amazing!!

I like your videos, well presented and well narrated with good facts. Keep up the good work. As much as I'd like to like the BMW engine, it looks disposable to me.

Man. AWESOME video!

Funny how many people comment about these two engine like if they were mechanical engineers lol 😂

Great video and two great engines in there own right. The b58 will just be a pain to work on as it gets older with more moving parts, more plastic parts and the timing chain on the back side of the engine. It reminds me of how the b6s4 was great till you had timing chain and guide problems on the back of the engine requiring engine pulls and now you dont see that car anymore. The 2jz is ancient but still more reliable with less moving parts, very little plastic parts, easier to work on and all major components accessible without an engine pull. The BMW supra will be a good daily driver with the b58 while under warranty but when it starts falling apart or timing chain issues start happening most people are not going to deal with those problems and trade it in for the next new shiny thing with planned obsolescence. 2jz is better and a great value for diy guys, 30 minutes of research will show this.

Very informative video!

People don’t understand that through emissions auto makers can’t go back and remake old engines again. It would be embarrassing if the b58 wasn’t better than the 20 year old 2JZ. As time goes on, engines are stronger and better. But don’t forget the b58 is direct injected. DI can make more power with same bore and stroke.

@PapadakisRacing managed to squeeze out 1000hp from the B58 engine on their latest video upload

B58 also gets me 34mpg @75mph

Bro ur videos are amazing. Watched all ur Honda vids. I live in Orlando and titan motorsports has a 2020 Supra running 10.8’s, saw that car run with my own eyes. The supras look so solid, sound great, and they launch hard.... idk what anyone says about the new supras they’re gonna be fast!

Good information Thanks

Sooo, 2 months later and we are already over 1000hp... Think about 20 Years from now, took years to accomplish 1000hp from a 2jz, and only months for the b58

Hey friend, can you do a video on a B18a&b everything I need to know Integra LS motor.. I'ma check if you made one already brb

Man your videos are informative and entertaining afff keep up the good work bro

thank you for the infos!

People are stupid, does anyone really believe Toyota has all the tooling for the 2jz in a storage locker somewhere deep in Japan

Great Info! Question! I have a 2011 E93 Msport N55. I'm looking to tune it, do bigger intercooler, cold air intake, a upgraded charge pipe, and exhaust! What's your suggestions, and what kind of power could I expect!?

I can’t afford any of this shit, but as a computer guy, and a new driver, I totally get why this is an addicting hobby.

both are amazing engines i love them both

Over time I can imagine the valve springs in the head break over time with age. What would that do to the b58 engine if that happens?

BMW spends a lot of money on there R and D for their engines. To think a engine from 20 years ago would be better is dumb. I love the MK4 and the MK5 both amazing cars

I love how there are only about 30k supras sold and yet everyone acts like they could own one. They really expected Toyota to develop an entire engine for the Supra.

Great videos Thanks

1jz for me

The 2JZ was good for it’s time. However it’s a heavy engine and probably couldn’t pass modern emissions. The BMW B58 is lighter, emissions compliant and powerful. Apples and Oranges really.

What are the overall dimensions of the b58? Considering it for a swap, but having trouble finding it's exact size

I know lots will not like this but the B58 engine is so good and is defiantly the best engine I have ever used long term. I have only driven the Supra with the 2JZ in for a short time and it was fun but For me the B58 wins.

B58 will be able to get more than enough HP with simple mods. I don't need 800+ HP. The B58 would be lighter improving handling plus have better efficiency. The B58 everyday of the week for me.

N54 is the second legend.

the gall of this man!

You wanna see a REAL crank girdle? Check out the Mazda KL series V6 engines. They're split crankcase like a racing motorcycle engine. The blocks crankcase actually splits in two around the crank and IS the bottom half of the block and is bolted together with sealant. In all my years I've never seen a road car engine with a split crankcase. INSANE rigidity out of that bottom end. Also has ribbing in all the right spots. Downside? Fully open deck. The design is REALLY interesting, however. Almost makes me think it was a homologation engine that found no use, so they lightened it up, weakened it a bit and slapped it in road cars. Power figures for a KL-ZE is 200hp. From a late 80s designed 2.5L V6. Always had respect for that engine.

The most insane thing can happens: BMW give Supra the P60B40 V8 of the M3 GTR

2jz is the best , no direct injection is better , iron block is better , shorter rods is stronger ...

With the b58 the head is the biggest performance restriction. The head design on both the intake and exhaust prevent a much larger camshaft to be used. Then the 2 port internal exhaust design. Then the direct injection system. You may see 800whp out of them with added port fueling, but that’s about it imo. The only good thing about the engine is some of the oil drain ports and scavenge, you didn’t mention those.

great vid, no wonder b58 sounds so different than n55 🤔 2 exhaust port

2JZ swapping the new supra is a special thing. Id love to see that.

Fan boys will say 2JZ before even hearing the facts then still say 2JZ even though they have the facts right in front of them proving them wrong.

I love the b58 and n54 and n55 but no one in here is talking about the s55. It too is a 3.0L I6 but it also has a twin turbo setup like the 2jz-gte. And with a single turbo conversion like most people would do to the 2j it to can make amazing power numbers.

My B58 had been flawless for 8k miles but just developed a misfire. Probably just a coil though so i don't think it's serious.

These new A90 Supras are running 10 seconds and 11 seconds in 1/4 mile with basic tune / mods. A car that just went into sale just a few months ago. How much time did it take for a JZA80 Supra to run 10 seconds since its introduction in 1993? It took years (I think it was 1997-1998 when Vinny Ten ran 10 seconds with his modified JZA80 Supra)

I would have much rather for Toyota put the old band back together by collaborating with Yamaha again to make a new and improved inline 3JZ. Not to mention that BMW’s lack of reliability doesn’t have Toyota enthusiast ecstatic about the new Supra.

Gotta love that they already recalled the entire vehicle not even 6 months into sales

Either way both are highly rated ,I think partly the jz sound and power is what people are missing .

Literally this debate is Fanboys VS Facts

B58 because I do not need 1000 hp and I don't need turbo lag

Not spraying the intake valves? with no gas spraying to clean those valves won't they start to crap out unless I'm wrong?

Glad this guys got a 2j & b58 to pull down & compare the 2 😑

B58 have too many plastic parts ... 2JZ is still the strongest Inline 6 to this day

Toyota: if we make the supra it would be too expensive. Chevrolet: hold my beer

Good video, what's the trans good for wtq?

Good vid

Can you do a Barra 270 video?

The 2JZ GTE is the God of inline 6!

Lol most people were pissy about the b58 because of the supra hype, but when you look at it objectively the b58 is actually pretty stout compared to their previous engines, hell, it shares the same platform as their diesels lol, on top of that people were pushing around 800hp on stock parts before the supra rolled around. The b58 FAR exceeds the 2jz in capability, it's just more expensive and complex like most new stuff, give it a few years lol

A90's need the Z4 cyl head. that integrated EX port shit fine for stock stuff not making big power. And we'll see about those super thin liners reliability when under real abuse.

Maybe Toyota was afraid to make a new engine because they thought they could not make one as good as the 2JZ. In reality it was simple for Toyota to use the 2jz original block design but in aluminum, make it 3.4L. Work the air flow of the cylinder head, better intake, add mechanical fuel pump so it can have direct fuel injection, some 15 psi of boost. And work done. That would hit 500hp out the box.

For the same boost levels a B58 will make way more than a 2JZ

Does the BMW engine break down in the counterfeit Supra as much as it does in the other BMW cars?

This video needs to be updated as there is much more info on the engine in 2021.

N54 💪

What 2 jz has made it without being modified?

great comparisons and yes it is quite early to tell..but the older design being less complex is what makes the older 2JZ reliable..newer cars with newer technology would require more maintenance in the long run..but im sold..the fact that new motors are direct injection should help with longevity by keeping cooler cylinder temps..that alone is amazing.

Doesn’t the b58 have direct injection and injectors after the throttle body?

Closed deck blocks were a lot more common in the Japanese early 90's engines, they all began cheeping out towards the end of the decade.

2jz king u can tune d hell out it.wont blow up.let see how much hp will get out the b58bmw engine.b4 it blows up..2jz 1jz king legends..toyota for life..

The MKIV supra was also under rated hp wise. The 320 crank hp was wrong because they were putting down 300-310 whp in stock form which put it at ~360 crank hp .... back in 93 ..!!! With all the major bolt ons, now your talking 400 crank hp.

Owned both Toyota and BMW. Toyota superior in all aspects of car manufacturing. My 91 MR2 turbo and other models with over 160k miles never gave me the problems my 80k miles BMW has. I hope for Toyota's sake partnering with Bavarian does not compromise the Supras legendary status as a well built and reliable sports car. And I'm talking stock and not HP monsters with insane numbers.

2jzx best

The Two Jay Z is better. Or whatever that dude said.

Crank does handle over 1000 hp, Stephan Papadakis already built and engine dyno tested with proof.

Is the 2jzgte and the 2jzgte vvti have the same block end and internals?