No, I do not think the 4 Daleks from the cult could have defeated the 5 million cybermen without the Genesis Ark. I think that it would take just 1 Dalek.

What's interesting is that the void ship broke down the barriers between worlds, which allowed the Cybermen through, but the sheer mass of 5 million Cybermen crossing at once is what caused the void ship to open, so they were always going to meet.

I do like how the Battles in Time magazine showed some of the conflicts between the Genesis Ark Daleks and the Cybermen, and thus showing some Cyber-victories. One victory in Scotland has the Cybermen rip a Dalek dome off, and another sort of victory has some accidental friendly fire between Daleks. Wish the TV series would do another war but make it more equal.

"You are wearing flares! You cannot conquer the world with disco fever!'

As a Cyberman fan, thanks for pointing out that these were primitive Cybermen lol

Here's an even briefer history; . Cybermen conquer Earth. . Daleks curb-stomp Cybermen. . The Doctor curb-stomps both. You're welcome.

Sec was right that one Dalek could have destroyed all the Cybermen.

Dalek be like: You have only one superiority Cyberman: What is that? Dalek: You are better at dying.

No one actually won the Cyber-Dalek battle of Canary Wharf except for The Doctor but even he lost in a way by losing Rose. I would love to see RTD continue the battle in his new era of RTD2, if there are any spin offs then this would be a perfect opportunity If Star Wars can have The Clone Wars then Doctor Who can have The Cyber-Dalek Wars. I have a feeling RTD reads all the comments from different Doctor who videos and he takes notes, I hope he is taking notes right now.

4:28 I’ve always felt vaguely cheated that they heavily simplified the Dalek gun effect for these shots so they wouldn’t have to commit to showing what’s inside a Cyberman suit.

“It’s like if Steven Hawkins meets a talking clock”

I definitely think the nightmare is silver cybermen would have definitely beaten the daleks here. Honestly hearing a dalek acting confused and screaming the typical dalek bravado at a third cyberman being immune to his gun after saying "upgrade in progress" and start approaching the dalek before cutting off as it screams with the sound of metal being ripped apart would be a haunting scene to see

It so cool that the two best monsters fought and it has the best line in the entire series "you are better it dieing" 😎

I love the moment when they first meet in that corridor, both species sizing each other up, and just how outmatched the Cybermen are against the Cult of Skaro. What always gets me is when those two Cybermen fall, the shot showing them hit the ground doesn't match the surroundings, it shows a Dalek right there, but Thay was at the other end of the corridor, it felt like they forgot to film a shot of them hitting the ground and inserted something else. When the Cult storms the hangar, they go in shooting at all targets, but I feel they waste time by shouting exterminate as they do, they needed to adjust their rate of fire and prioritize the biggest threats first (the Preachers with the upgraded weapons, then the Cybermen, then the Torchwood soldiers). Had this battle been allowed to unfold without Time Lord interference, I feel the Daleks would have stomped the 5 million Cybermen in less than a week. I also wished more of the Daleks remembered to use their Emergency Temporal Shift (unless this feature was exclusive to the elite Daleks of the Cult of Skaro, not sure if any others than them have ever used it).

One thing i loved about this two parter episode which is completely random is that the anti dalek weapons originally coming from the preachers soon became the default cyber gun for most of new who. Wish they used it more in a similar way to doomsday in more cybermen episodes.

This wasn't the first Dalek/Cyberman war - the earlier Daleks seem to have had skirmishes with the Neomorph variant of Cybermen, in a fight that was a lot more equally matched.

I think the Daleks would inevitably have won, they and the Sontarans are on a whole new level and have waged war against the time lords.

Wish they could have explored dalek-cybermen conflict in classic who

I remember watching Cyber woman with my brother all those years ago. what I liked about the design at that time was the fact that Lisa's face was visible inside the Head piece. I also learned what cyber conversion was too as I didn't completely understand what that was before hand

Sometimes I wonder what would happen if a Kaled was converted

Some people incorrectly call this "The battle of Canary Whalf". It`s true designation is "The massacre of Canary Whalf"

My headcanon is that the Cybusmen created a rank of Cyberleader with enhanced intelligence like a Cyber controller called a senior Cyberleader (seen on screen in "Revenge of the Cybermen", "The Next Doctor", and "A Good Man Goes to War") during the Dalek-Cybus War while inside the Void to lead the Cyber army against the militarily-superior Daleks.

A nice video that explains one of the greatest Doctor Who stories ever told.

I always thought the Cybermen should have just tried ripping the Daleks heads off Hey, if spamming lasers doesn't work might as well give brute force a shot And even if the Dalek casing reacted like what's described in Series 1 (guy who touched the Metaltron without gloves burst into flames) the Cybermen are made of *steel*

If I'm right, the Cult of Skaro had extra abilities to the normal Dalek casing. This is because a consentrated energy blast from the Preachers' Energy Blasters had been shown to blow up/ malfunction a Dalek after in Journey's End. Also, Dalek weapons in Evolution of the Daleks fail to destroy Jast and Thay straight away, but Rusty in Into the Dalek managed to destroy the invading Daleks of the Aristotle with his Dalek weapons. My one last point is that The Cult of Skaro took multiple hits from the Energy Blasters, Cyberman Wrist Blasters, and bullets. What I'm indicating is the the Energy Blasters would've impaired their casings, Cyberman Wrist Blasters would've effected them too, and normal bullets would theoretically get through the shields if the casing is impaired, AND they took MULTIPLE HITS! It shows you that Dalek Sec's line, "We would destroy the Cybermen with *one* Dalek", is absolutely true, and that these Daleks were like extra O.P.!

I absolutely think more advanced Cybermen could stand a far better chance against the daleks ^^

Great video

Can you possibly make a video about the original plans for The Wheel in Space? The original plans were to have a Dalek and Cyberman battle off. I don’t know many of the details.

One odd misconception I always noticed being spread by this episode is that the name of the building Torchwood was based in is One Canada Square. Canary Wharf is the name of the area surrounding it.

Where is that artwork from on 6:11 ? Looks awesome

One thing I've picked up on is the Daleks and (prime universe) Cybermen must have had an encounter with each other at some point in their past, leading to a temporary alliance that obviously must have gone terribly wrong for the Daleks, properly due to both races trying to backstab each over leading to a major disaster, hence why the Daleks (on top of their xenophobic sense of superiority) flat-out refused any alliance with the (Cybus) Cybermen when they suggest an alliance, the Daleks have historically had temporarily 'allied' with other races before to use and eventually turning on them... I also have a theory that the Daleks somehow acquired Cybermen technology at one point in time and modified it to create their Roboman slaves. This could also tie into the idea the (classic) Daleks and (classic) Cybermen had perhaps met (off-screen). I wonder, if true, would this make for a good (classic) Doctor Who story? Perhaps one done as an animated serial or episode?

I agree with Sec that 1 Dalek would win vs 4 million

I love the cybus cybermen but they couldnt penetrate the daleks shells. I dont think we even see one

Has anyone notice the cyberman that fell off the balcony 😂😂😂

Wonder what happened to the void ship then

Nightmare in Silver cybermen would've fucked the daleks up. Maybe a couple hundred cybermen would die (or maybe just a couple), but eventually theyd adapt to the daleks. Also, they maybe could use cybermites to upgrade the daleks into cyberdaleks, but we've seen that the daleks have "antibody" drone so maybe that wouldn't work...

I never really understand why unit never found out about torchwood and i do wonder if they integrated tech and surviving personal into unit except jacks group

the daleks do say that the cybermen are an inferior race, and plus the cybus industries cybermen were made on earth in their universe, and so were even more primitive and inferior to the prime universe cybermen, so I would say that the daleks would have won, however we also know that concentrated fire on a dalek does overload it's shields eventually. however if the daleks and cybermen were to have another war, the cybermen may have upgraded their armor to be more resistant to dalek weapons and may have found a way to upgrade their weapons to bypass dalek shields, however I do still feel like the daleks are still more powerful and could win again.

"Which side would have won"? Bruh, is this sarcasm? or you got see how the Cyberman weapons, even after upgrade, manages to do nothing effective to the Dalek? They are too OP.

That's not war, just pest control.

My problem with this was as soon as the daleks appeared the cybermen became cannon fodder and started a trend in new who that the cybermen take a step back as the main villain to someone else in their own stories and finales. Also this isn't a true match up as the cybermen of main universe would inflict damage to the daleks. The cybus cybermen are far more primitive compared to the cybermen of our universe.

I'm sorry, the question is not much off topic, but how did the Cybermen want to take over the world with only 5 million units with them? This is catastrophically small when compared with the number of people in the army of the world

The Cybermen would have stood a much better chance against TV21/Dalek Book1964 level Daleks.

How did the pair continue fighting in the Void? Wouldn’t it be a slaughter for the Cybermen? Like how did any of them survive the Daleks?

Did a 'sort off' audio sequel to this episode kzfaq.info/get/bejne/Y8l0l9SYupPJk6s.html kzfaq.info/get/bejne/ir6YnpyWv9OXeo0.html interesting video btw.

If the war continued, a draw would eventually happen. Dunno.

It was not war. It was pest control.

Didn't the Canary War went on in the void?

-12/29/2022 @ 0724- 🤔