It is very unique to see the changes made to history as if there wasn't a world full of people present to watch what happened between the 50's and the 70's. Craziness

Viejo Tronco you’re quite right :-) Now I hope I did make it clear that Modern Taekwondo does have older roots (just not the 2000 year myth) :-)

Agreed. No natural modern martial art I believe can be beyond the 16th or 17th century. Maybe the Hindu ones? But still I would doubt that. By natural I mean the ones that survived by itself passed from teacher to student with out historical research or institutional involvement.

Edward H. Valholm true, but the same could be said about many of the Kwan. After 1975 when they were officially abolished they continued as social clubs, but with the weakening of the Kukkiwon several Kwan seems to be on a path of resurgence(but still just beginning)

Very happy you liked it :-) Thanks for commenting 🤗

Karate kicks came from Savate. Taekwondo came from Karate. Taekkyon is a false myth. That is all.

@@doriangray92 did you even see the video? :-)

MaharlikaAWA None of the KMA pioneers have produced any Dan certificates from Japan as far as I know. Yun Byung In and Yun Kwae Byung are both listed as instructors of Karate in one of Toyama Kanken’s books but that is all. The two most disputed ranks are the two most politically disputed people (Choi Hong Hi and Hwang Kee). I don’t see that as a coincidence. Like I said in the video it is difficult to say what rank he had and it is difficult to pinpoint an instructor, but we do know he taught karate while living in Japan so I don’t think it is far fetched that he indeed had a dan rank. Also he wrote a textbook in 1959 which is as good a resource as any other at the time, and unlike the later works (1965, 1966, 1972 and onward) the 1959 book was written by himself. So in short he did not provide documentation for a rank in Karate, but neither did anyone else. Politically he is the one most often attacked, while most others gets a free pass on the very same issue. If we make the demand of documentation and don’t bother looking at his works we should apply this standard to all Kwan founders, not just this one. No one will do that though because they would all fail :-) The Dan ranks I provide is based on the research of others (most often Eric Madis, but also Udo Muenig, George Vitale and others). Hope that helps :-)

@@traditionaltaekwondoramblings witnesses help. Where are Chois witnesses of his black belt promotions? Nobody at the time questioned a 4th or 5th dan from Kanken bc they could prove it in skill infront of them.

Like a Kukkiwon guy would say anything positive about Choi.

@@moominpic Believe it or not they respect him for some of the early stages of Taekwondo and give him what credit he is due even though they do not like him necessarily. They were very fair in their discussion of what he did.

@Rob-lw1uw I thought the 5th Dan was honorary given by Duk Sung Son.

A modern history of Taekwondo by Kang and Lee, Taekwondo a killing art by Alex Gillis and you can search for “storming the fortress” by Eric Madis. Those will be good resources to start with :-)

@@traditionaltaekwondoramblings Thanks!

@@justinmattos9726 I firmly second "A Killing Art" have met the author several times, and sat in on some of his interviews with pioneers mentioned and interviewed for the book.

Korean Karate: The Art of The Kwon Do by Duk Sung Son.

MaharlikaAWA I have been told in a PM that he was indeed a Judo black belt, but I don’t have anything I would call a valid source for the claim (only a pm by someone I respect). He trained a lot with Yun Byung In who was well versed in Chinese Martial Arts. Unfortunately both men disappeared in the Korean War (1950-1953), so they didn’t have much time teaching all they knew. As Yun Mu Kwan opened in the mid 1940s we’re talking about a 5-6 year transmission of knowledge before they disappeared :-/ Yun Byung In was an assistant instructor around 2 years in the Yun Mu Kwan before opening his own school. Palkikwon is often translated as Bajiquan but t appears as one of the forms listed in the 1962 joint black belt gradings and not as a separate martial art. I don’t know for sure what that entails. Joo An Pa is a generic term for Chinese martial arts which is why it is difficult to pinpoint which Chinese martial arts Yun Byung In taught :-)

@@traditionaltaekwondoramblings What it means is that Taekwondo originally had a fighting technique mindset which it lacks today. We have to bring it back.

That isnt English

My Weight Loss Journey you did see the video right? 😅

In the case of tkd its tai chi Quan fa and shotokan mixed with soo bak do.

Please consider expanding your statement. Karate origins are from China, and did NOT originate from Japan. Independent OKINAWA, the source of Karate was NOT a Japanese province. Much of Japanese civilized culture originated from Korea. After 35 yrs of occupation and oppression, TKD was born from oppression. Korea was a peaceful nation, learned the need for their own martial art to prevent future incursion from Japan. Koreans used Japanese arts as a base and made it more painful. World Taekwondo is an exception, it's very useless and is NOT Taekwon-Do, in its original form. I do not see any embarrassment in this origin.

kendo and jiu jitsu have korean origins though.

Yes if you see any Korean martial arts who doesn’t wear shoes their original art is Japanese. Traditional Korean culture always were shoes.bear foot is a disrespectful

MD JAHID TKD 🙏thank you :-)

This video focuses on the founders of the different Kwan and the major international organisations. While Son Duk Song was a great man (and authored some great books) he was not a founder of a Kwan (he was the second kwanjangnim of Chung Do Kwan) and he was not to my knowledge a key player in the founding of the orgs either. If I had or will make a follow up to this video, or a video focusing on Chung Do Kwan alone I’d talk a lot about him for sure, but in a short video summarising all the major Kwan and development of taekwondo? Not so much. Sorry if you didn’t like the video because of this, feel free to complain :-)

Master Son's book, "Korean Karate: The Art of The Kwon Do,", was the "textbook" used by my own instructor, Dick Worcester, who was a student of Master Son during the Korean War. I still have a copy, along with the follow up text, "Black Belt Korean Karate." Both are essential reading for anyone interested in the traditional style of TKD.

@@randallkennedy3153 I agree :-) I have both books as well and they are a great snapshot of traditional taekwondo :-)

Yes. Taekwondo is a martial art with a series of techniques developed for self defense (hoshinsul) and full contact combat. Sports training (kyourugui) is just one of the dimensions of taekwondo that ended up gaining prominence over the years, mainly with the modality's entry into the Olympic program.

How is that? If you are takling about opening their own schools Lee opened his in 1944, while Yun Byung In started out as an assistant instructor at Chun Sang Sup’s school first before opening his own school a good while later. I did cover this in the video, which I assume you didn’t watch 😇 If you’re talking about rank as in Yun having a higher rank than Lee then I might not have been clear on that in the video, but I assume Yun had a higher rank than Lee did.

@@traditionaltaekwondoramblings byung in yun was a tai chi Quan fa student who upon returning from China to Korea ended up fending off five karate students using the tai chi Quan fa blocking system that we still use in tkd to this day. Those karate students ran back to their master and told them about yun. The master met with yun and after exchanging ideas and yun learning karate created Chung moo kwon. Then came Lee who was the first Chung moo kwon instructor and helped modernize and structure tkd. Yun was the grandmaster, Lee was was an entire generation later than Yun. Your talking about my schools lineage. Go to powells tkd in Concord and look up the lineages section on their home page. If I'm wrong than our whole school is wrong all the way back to the 1920s. Lol

@@cc1426 I had to skip that story due to time constrains. As I said in the introduction I tried to keep it short, but I want to make longer videos on each school later. I just haven’t gotten around to it. May I ask what is your source that he studied tai chi? According to Grandmaster Kim Soo who has done extensive studies on Yun he never specified the style of Chinese martial arts that he studied, instead referring to it with generic terms such as joo an pa (Korean for quanfa). The studies of chinese martial arts, the study with Toyama Kandinsky, the helping teaching at Yun Mu Kwan with Chun Sang Sup and the founding of his own school is all there in the video.

@@cc1426 you might be mixing Lee Nam Suk who took over Chang Mu Kwan after the Korean War and Lee Won Kuk. I don’t mention Lee Nam Suk in the video I think. Again because I’m trying to keep it short and sweet focusing on the founders and their roots.

@@cc1426 we have a Chang Mu Kwan founded by Yun Byung In and we have a Chung Do Kwan founded by Lee Won Kuk. To my knowledge we don’t have any Chung Mu Kwan anywhere? Are you mixing two Kwan together? Is that where the confusion comes from?

Thank you so much for clarifying that. For a moment I thought you meant it could be used a little, but now I know it was completely useless in the UFC 👍🏻

No, this is simply not accurate. Gen. Choi fled to Canada to escape political persecution from the military dictator he opposed. This was 1972. Gen. Choi did not bring his Taekwon-Do to north Korea until 1980. This had nothing to do with the reason he fled south Korea.

Luckily it was NEVER developed for use in the UFC 😂 I just don’t get why you would bother using time you will never regain to make such an “observation”. Come to think of it I don’t get why I even bothered to answer this comment 😂 You’ll likely not hear anything more from me :-)

There are MANY black belts in MMA and the UFC that would COMPLETELY disagree.

Certain elements have to be adapted, duh. It was a system meant to kill, maim, and injure. It was pressure tested & revised in the Vietnam war. The Tiger Division were at the forefront of such efforts. Your ignorance & arrogance is embarrassing. You couldnt even spell Traditional correctly. I suggest you read Part 1 & Part 2 of this article. Then go sit tf down somewhere blackbeltmag.com/taekwondo-history-the-tiger-division-

@@StevieSouthOfficial it was probably a drunken troll comment so I wouldn’t put much energy into answering him 😂👍🏻 but thanks for the link.

Incorrect.

Tang soo do was just shotokan as was all tkd,it had nothing to do with any older Korean arts

@@scarred10 correct - as was explained in the video. All the founding ‘Masters’ of KMA either trained directly with Funakoshi OR were directly influenced by him. Even now you can see the Tang Soo hyungs are identical to Shotokans, the five Heian, the Taikyoku, Kushanku and Tekki, all there…

@@scarred10 Are you for real? My korean teachers would turn in their graves if they heard that wikipedia bullsjit 🤣🤣🤣

@@THEMARTIALARTSCHANNEL-bb4fx it's the truth,theres no evidence for anything other than karate in tkd.

Yes, my master was a captain under General Choi. He also said Nam Tae-hi was the one mainly responsible for Oh-do Kwan.

There is no 10th Dan in TKD gen Choi gave himself a 9th dan as he was the head instructor of the newly named style just as every founder does.Only organizations outside the ITF use a 10th Dan.

@@scarred10 Legitimately, he was never more than a nidan in a watered down system

@@Aridzonia1 if you create a martial art then you are a master, like every first master of okinawan karate that cames from china. by your logic karatekas are nothing more than watered down kung fu

@@halfbeat7415 No but choi didn’t have enough knowledge to found an art. Most organizations require 2 fifth dans or at the very least one

@@Aridzonia1 Yeah but that's an actual requirement I think and karate master back then didn't have high Dan in kung fu either (sorry for my fk up english lol)