Rainbows & Butterflies Great analysts! However, I wonder if his happiness with the new love would have lasted. In the beginning of a relationship, most people are happy and think they found the love of their life....

@@darcymusicpy4274 yes, the videos Where you see him play and having fun time with his children, he appears to be pretending, play along just to satisfy Shanann, so she could post them in facebook. I guess She might have known this all along.but simply kept on going and not accept the inevitable

@Jenny Agrippa Good point. The issue of his disconnection, or disassociation, has to be factored in centrally in this horror tale, in order to acquire understanding of the complex driving dynamics. How do you link this to the problem of Covert Malignant Narcissism?

@Jenny Agrippa I agree. I think he had the affair to give himself the nerve to kill Shanann. Somewhere I read that he said he was "furious" with Shanann. I think the "disconnected" aspect is key. I've read a little about "object relations theory" where object is a generic term for people and things in a person's environment, mainly the people. Sam Vaknin has videos where he talks about it. In a psychopath's perceptions, all objects are outside the mind of the psychopath. In narcissists, all objects are inside the mind of the narcissist. For the narcissist, people only exist in his mind. People do not exist as people outside of his mind. For the psychopath, people do not exist as people in his mind. They do exist as objects outside of his mind. Both narcissists and psychopaths are completely disconnected from others, but in different ways.

@@susux7332 just like I'm sure it started out great with shannon.i wonder why he didn't bring chris being bisexual or gay or whatever he was.i think he was doing his best impression of being a straight guy.he should have moved far away with out getting married & lived the life he was meant to live.but then I think geez what if gets bored with the old boyfriend & kill him & find a new one?something tells me he likes prison.

She definitely helped put him behind bars! I hope I have a friend like that if I need one. 💖

Yes. She must feel so bad for dropping her off and not knowing what she was going into. She was a great and fearless friend

God bless that lady! A true friend.

Yes especially as Chris casually said “she’s probably on a play date, don’t bother ringing the cops”???

Amazing. I'd love to have friends like her Few and far between.

Really? I think she's extremely incompetent. As a former investigator, you NEVER tell the subject that 'it would be extremely dumb to take a lie detector test if you're guilty' right before the test! He could have gotten up and walked out at that point and they would have had nothing. She was over zealous and she's lucky her tricks didn't backfire. I hope she gets better at her job.

@@jimsmith7326 she could be really dumb or really smart for reading him. She took away any confidence he had of getting away with it in that short time he was in the room with her. I'd love to hear her take on it and what she saw to feel confident in approaching him the way she did.

@@FrothLyfeSailingNandji I think hunchback was good.

i was thinking that... She could have just told him he failed the test...

@@FreedominLove711 she did

I know. They already lost their daughter and grand daughters haven’t they suffered enough. People can have their own opinions. Opinions are like assholes everyone’s got one. But even if I don’t agree you are allowed it. But don’t go harass a grieving family who just had their daughter and granddaughters murdered. What is wrong with the human race.

Nowadays everybody thinks they have something worthy to say. No matter how the evidence point in other direction. The victim’s family in this case became victims on top of the tragedy that struck them.

yeah, that made me sick too. I hate how people think they know everything. I've had people do this in real life, and I imagine it it so much worse online. There was a news article about my brother committing suicide and people said things like, "good! thin the heard, That guy deserved to die, etc." His daughters read those comments.

That was the worst part of what chris did, not only did he kill all 3 of them but he didn’t care about their reputation either. He only cried until he was caught and it was for his own sake

@Lisa Hunt Yes.... I remember Cindy being called every name in the book because she told Chris at his sentencing hearing that she forgave him and that she still loved him. No matter what he did he's still her son. I'm sure she feels enormous guilt wondering if she did something wrong raising him. And no one has the right to condemn her for still loving her son. No matter what my kids did I could never stop loving them either. Both families are indeed victims in my opinion.

The timing of the in utero graphic was surreal.

@@decimanightelf4135 That was apparently an ad for an episode of American Horror but the timing of it turning up just when the neighbour had paused the video recording was eerie and one hell of a 'coincidence' considering what Chris Watts had done.

Prairie Aire moments like this give hope of a higher power. He had to realize he wasn’t going to get away with it.

Another thing I noticed was when the neighbor was showing the camera video to the police officer, Chris immediately launched into an explanation about why his truck was parked where it was... even though nobody had asked. Came off very bizarre

Indeed it is easier to recognize from the outside looking in.

Susan Marie absolutely! Everyone looks so “perfect” on their social media.

Well said👏🏽

This! 👏🏼👏🏼👏🏼

Yep and never take social media as gospel. No one ever posts when their having a bad day!!

I've always believed that...no one knows what really goes on.

I know what you mean. He started acting weird from the jump. HIs neighbor spotted it right away. That neighbor should get a medal, by the way.

@@marthawoodworth6907 absolutely!!great neighbor!!!

That’s the million dollar question. How did he think he was gonna get away with this? I would really like to know what and how he was thinking.

He's still trying to get out 🙀

Bottom line..Lust and selfishness !!

Thank you!! If he was truly submissive he wouldn't struggle in this dynamic.

@@joannasaadati8810 Also, to say he was "submissive" is a put-down of Shannan, as if she was some kind of dominatrix. I saw her as simply a healthy, go-for-it woman who was struggling to know her worth. Just because there's a video of him doing the dishes doesn't mean he was "submissive." I don't see her as a demanding, bitchy type at all. If she was, she wouldn't have had so many loyal friends.

@@marthawoodworth6907 I think Shanann took charge because Chris was so passive. I think it's a pretty ordinary dynamic in families. If she didn't make things happen in the family, nobody would. Also possibly Chris never stood up for himself so Shanann couldn't know what he wanted, but inside he was fuming for years and not showing it. I think part of why his mental pathology, which I think was deep and extreme, was mostly unnoticed is because he was so quiet and withdrawn.

@@marthawoodworth6907 she was extremely controlling. It's evident in many videos and in many ways.

@@oliviatree I heard that the neighbor who said he heard a big fight retracted it. I never heard that they regularly had fights. The one that the neighbor supposedly heard would have been fairly close to when the murders occurred, if it happened. I was under the impression that her car was provided by the mlm she worked for. The house was above their budget it looked like, also the kid's preschool. By standing up for himself I was thinking about day to day things where Shanann told him what to do etc. in addition to major spending. You have to wonder, if their lifestyle had been simpler, a small ranch with Shanann holding an hourly wage job and the kids going to a cheaper pre-school, etc., if Chris could have felt he could leave, even with his psychopathic mental issues, without killing them. I also wonder why they really moved to Colorado. It seems Chris moved there first and Shanann followed after selling her house. Everyone who gives a reason gives a different one. I kind of wonder if Chris had committed some crimes in the Charlotte area that he was getting away from. Just speculation. But if he was a homicidal psychopath he always was one.

munchausen by proxy being the biggest here

He's what nightmares are made out of. Imagine those nights where you snuggle down with your loved ones at home and watch a thriller or a horror movie and you get scared so snuggle up closely to your partner. Imagine every night when you make sure all the windows and doors a locked before sleep incase an intruder were to try get in. Now imagine that worst fear was that partner you thought you were safe with or that you were locking your doors and windows but that dangerous intruder was already inside your home because it's your partner. Shanann, Bella, CeCe trusted Chris and he was supposed to protect them againts evil and he violated that trust in the most cruel and henious way imaginable. He's the lowest form of human being there is and No one would be safe with such a deeply disturbed individual...not even his own children were safe. He's the devil in disguise.

@@kellywilliams3530 yes, abject terror....he violates human nature not to protect his own ,thank goodness she had a good friend though

@@corneliakobilke4638 I think Shanann was a great mother and you can see that in the videos. Her girls were smart, respectful and happy children. That was because of Shananns good parenting and from good modeling encouraging the girls to be good to one another and have that sisterly bond. You have to remember that the videos posted on youtube were from a few years time span. They actually put the amount of videos Shanann posted on facebook on a monthly basis going back to january 2018. There was not nearly as many ppl seem to think. Some months she only posted 6 video's and the most she had posted in a month was around 18 videos. Considering it was her full time job and her video's were around ten mins at most I'd say that's not very much. She was a sales person so that's why she was always on social media making out what she sold was great-that's what advertising is, it's always about the suggestion the product improves your life. They would not had half the flexibilty if shanann had continued working two jobs killing herself because of her health and child care for when the children were sick. Bella had started full time in the january of 2018 and CeCe had only started full time in the month before they went to NC. People say Shanann didnt have enough time to devote to Chris because she was on facebook(posting a maximum of about 5 posts a day if that and takes only minutes) If Shanann had been needing to go out to work her and Chris would have seen even less of each other and would have both needed to work around one another for child care. Bella was starting full time school anyway in the september and CeCe would have been the year after. In the meantime Shanann was building her buisness making good money. People don't consider these things when they rip into thrive. Sure it had downsides but it also had many perks and benefits for their lifestyle. Chris knows this which is why he has never complained much about Shanann's job. It allowed him more freedom and it's not many marriages where the wife who has two small children has a job earning the same money as her partner.

@@corneliakobilke4638 The illnesses the children had are not illnesses that could be faked they would require testing done by a medical Dr to get a diagnoses. eosinophilic esophagitis [EoE] which is a chronic disorder CeCe suffered from comes with a whole host of problems that would have required regular medical care and hospital visits. The children likely inherited their illnesses from Shanann. EoE and asthmma have been found to be inherited disorders related to lupus. Besides dysphagia [difficulty swallowing] other leading symptoms of EoE include failer to thrive. Childrn with EoE are at higher risk of atopic disorders and food sensitivation. There is medical records for the operation CeCe needed to widen her esophagus and Shanann spinal surgery and fertility treatments that the channel 411 now has mentioned on his channel. They are not handing out neck surgery, epi pens and inhalers for fun. There was a video of CeeCee being tested for allergies. She had to endure painful pokes on her back which introduce an allergen, if it reacts, You're allergic. CeeCee reacted to nuts. You can’t fake allergies because in order to get treatment or medication you would need to take a prior diagnostic test like skin prick testing. There is a picture of CeCe being tested for allergies where she came out in huge red welts on her back after having the allergy skin testing prick test. She tested positive for tree nuts and several other allergens. EpiPens are not over the counter they are prescribed. No doctor is going to prescribe an EpiPen to anyone unless they need it for an allergy that can cause anaphylaxis. With EoE Only a specialist or a doctor can diagnose a child with this. The type of testing that needs to be done is a scope test, they have to do a endoscopy to tell if your child has this or not. There's also a whole list of corresponding foods that effect this type of illness. There's a whole list of foods to avoid that can effect this illness. the hospital visits that Shanann was posting about and the illness the children had are hard to be faked. Most if not all of the illnesses the children had would have to be tested for. Just about all of them they either have an obvious need or they require testing done for a diagnosis. You can't fake breathing issues, pneumonia, ear infections or clogged tear duct. Which in turn was the reason she was so protective of her children because they actually did have these allergies. And along with these certain types of illnesses comes with a lot of Doctor visits. I don't see the harm in taking photos on some of these visits and posting them. was Shanann an over protective mother? Yes probably. Caring for a child with ashama and allergies you you have to be protective. They are young and they can't protect themselves and are susceptible to all sorts of reactions. Even Chris himself in his prison interview accurately described a rapid onset allergic reaction that he seen with his own eyes to celeste reacting to kiwi. Munchausen by proxy is a very serious mental illness and the abuse is extreme. The children usually look at deaths door from being poisoned or other drastic measures. They are usually kept isolated and have no contact with anyone outside the home or medical staff. Bella and CeCe looked like happy, healthy well nourised children regardless of their health issues because Shanann was such a great mother. They looked like they had a warm and loving relationship with their mother and she was very in tuned to their emotional needs. The proof is in the pudding they were happy loving kids. They looked like they were thriving and very well loved and cared for by Shanann. No parent gets it right all the time and getting it wrong at times is human, noones perfect.

@@alexanderwestphal9777 Too bad you were not an unwanted kid

Also, he didn’t want to divorce his wife thinking he’d have alimony and child support payments for three kids. That would bankrupt him. Lesson learned, don’t get married and have kids, until you are really sure your happy.

Ikr. I don't even know those beautiful, innocent, girls and I wanna babysit, they were so adorable.😑😥 Rest in peace to their mom and little brother, so very sad.💐💐💔😥

Alexander Westphal your are sick

@@thiagomunhoz5277 harsh!

Warning sign: Cheating He didn't care about others feelings.

Rainbows & Butterflies I agree with you. This was an outburst of concealed emotions he held for the long time. He should have talk about it with his partner instead of seeking solace and comfort with his side-chick

I agree

@Rainbows & Butterflies I think it’s important to note that he CHOSE not to have a voice though. He’s 100% to blame. Instead of seeking help for his insecurities he decided to let them control his entire life. He LET them get to the point in which they did and he chose to suppress them until he broke. All his choices and his fault. I don’t feel bad for him in even the smallest of ways.

Stolen

Lie detectors are bull shit way overrated.

I agree, lie detector is a pressure cooker, I think worked really well in this case.

I've watched the raw video on YT but not the documentary. It strikes me that the police hold no illusions that the lie detector mechanism is effective, but it provides an opportunity for an interrogator masquerading as a friendly machine tech to manipulate the suspect into confessing.

Dr. Grande has covered polygraph on a separate video. Interesting g to watch.

Why did he go to other side of truck?

He briefly runs at the officer just before shaking hands.

@@crochunter35 thats the best sign for kicking your own butt.once u watch tons of videos you see they either have no emotion or go crazy over the top nuts.neither is good.but if you are the real killer it is going to be hard how you decide you're going to act.and I'm sure it has to do with what questions they're going to ask you.

THIS. My husband wouldn't have let the cops in the house, but the SECOND he got home would have ran through calling out to us to see where we had gone!

Yep. It was obvious. Her friend was so much more worried

I think of that b.s. answer a lot, too.

I interpret this as another lie by Chris to further spite everyone that believes in decency. It’s the only source of power he has over others at this point. I don’t know this for sure, but I bet he had some scratches on him from the strangling.

I hated the disturbing statement as if Shanaan was ok with dying. She was carrying a child & knew the other kids were doomed with her gone. The ONLY reason she didnt "fight back" was simply becuz her arms were pinned to her sides as he straddled her during strangulation. Hes a damaged person.

I think that was a lie. She didn't fight back because she was attacked while she slept.

Like that’s the first thought you’d have while being suffocated by your husband, please God forgive him wtf!! It’s always about him, are you kidding me??!!! He’s delusional

Hannah Riley agreed all of her posts are still up you can still engage with her to some extent its like being a part of her life even though its after the fact

True ..

One of the many reasons I dislike social media, it is just a shared fictional account of what people want to project and not reality.

Char Covelesky while this is true of some people, the amount of social media available on this family makes me feel I know them, both good and bad. It was also the text messages between each other and their friends. Those told a big part of the story and were full of pain and sadness. We’ve never experienced this to this degree before. I will never forget them, regardless of how much of it is fake.... the fakeness iN itself is a reality that told a very sad story.

@@getreelproductions5737 u are dead on

@Kitty Sulivan exactly. i was also shocked.

To see her Frank, Shannon’s father, crying during this was so upsetting. How could you forgive your son for killing his wife and kids right in front of her parents? Terrible. I would be so angry.

@@tbhsandra she forgive the man who killed her grandkids. How crazy is this woman?

@A Round Orifice in Nothingness indeed!

I thought that too. Like fair enough, he’s your son and you love him because you remember the boy he was before he was murderer. But how dare you forgive him for killing his wife and daughters. It’s not your place to forgive. Your forgiveness doesn’t matter. So rude, so inappropriate and disgusting.

How?

I thought the Doc said she was the dominant one in the relationship ? ( I haven’t followed the case at all) if that’s true, why do you say nothing about that?

@@Yolduranduran watch the documentary you will see how.

@@Christopher28fair What does her being the dominant one in tbe relationship have to do with the OPs comment?

Yeah. It's actually worse. These text go on forever. She's texting a handful of close friends about his behavior and the documentary only covered a small amount -as expected, really. She was completely blind sided. He was constantly gaslighting her, ignoring her, lying, giving hope then snaching it away. All while she's pregnant with a third child, and they just had a serious family conflict with Chris' mother nearly feeding one of the babies something she's allergic to. It was absolutely heartbreaking. I can not imagine the completely horror, and confusion, then he strangled her. It all feels so unfair. And today Chris Watts is in jail going on about how he's still a dad and God has a plan for him and that he'll be free one day. He said he can't imagine God leaving him in prison for life. It's truly unbelievable. It's like after the murders his mask is gone and his true narcissistic, unemotional, incapable of empathy self has come to the forefront. Like I said, it all feels so unfair.

Some killers hide their true natures for years before acting out their raging resentment. They look like great dads and husbands, but inside they are looking for a way out of what they consider their dull, confined lives. Also, might it be possible that something traumatic from Watts' young life was triggered by yet another baby coming along, something from his family of origin? Maybe his father was angry at his mother secretly for having another child, and took it out on Chris. Not sure we will ever know.

Personally I think he married a controlling woman like his mother because it was familiar. When he found the girlfriend and wanted to "move on", he just didn't have the balls to suffer the disapproval of his "authority" and the complications and consequences of trying to get out of the relationship. He just wanted it to magically "disappear" so he could live out his new fantasy. So he "disposed" of all of them, which shows us how emotionally disconnected he actually was. The guy was miles into denials, a soulless zombieboy , a disaster just waiting to happen. Nobody deserves to die, but the way he killed those babies is just brutal and heartless! He is the scariest kind of monster!

Char Covelesky and I don’t think he’s really she’d a tear over those beautiful little girls

@@CharGC123 great analysis!

@@CharGC123 I think it's very wrong to use the word "controlling". As her friend called her, I'd say she was bossy, it's clear that she had to handle everything in the family for everything to be in order, y'know, these kinds of mothers who want to be on top of everything, because as Shannan said herself, she was told she couldn't have children, she had a pretty bad marriage before, and she put all her energy in her family once she had it. "Controlling" relates to abuse, and Shannan was not abusive. A woman taking the wheels of her family and trying to keep it all together isn't an abuser. Chris Watts brought nothing to his family but money problems and lies, imagine living in a marriage with that kind of man. Of course you have to push harder and harder to keep the boat afloat. If she were controlling, she would have never left him alone with the girls, she would have never left him alone for weeks to "figure things out". Controlling is another level from what she was. I truly believe she was just a dynamic woman who got herself in a marriage that she felt that she was losing, so ofc she pushed harder to understand her husband and to save whatever she could. I do believe Chris Watts lived it as a "controlling" environement tho. I do believe he hated his wife in the end, and yes sadly I think it extended to everything he had built with her, which included Bella and Cece (I found myself being surprised that he didn't kill the dog too, probably because it's a small dog and barely and inconvenience idk) and by that, I mean I believe he was so detached from his kids that he did see them as an inconvience and didn't kill them because he hated them but because they were there. And he didn't "want" them to be there, and he had detached himself so much from his family life "driven" by Shannan, that he had no problem "getting rid" of his daughters (and his son). It's all a lack of emotional love for his children, given the state of his life in general. There is a part of "owning his identity back" by killing them, hoping it would trigger something for him, like a big change that would be the equivalent of a clean slate with his mistress. But that's not how things worked and clearly, the whole police ordeal got out his hands. Without the best friend calling the cops the very next day, who knows what would have happened.

I second this request. Recently, I read that the woman's parents actually had sexual affairs with the man who abducted their daughter and in part that was why they didn't put up much protest when he tried to convince them not to bring serious charges against him - they were both emotionally enmeshed with the kidnapper and abuser of their daughter. That was absolutely sickening and the producer of the Netflix documentary stated that she found the entire family of the woman difficult to deal with because of the delusions they still seemed to be having about the events and the kidnapper.

Yeah... great suggestion. I also found production to which you refer to be an endless series of seemingly increasingly impossible evolutions in WTFism!

I watched this with my friend and we were literally screaming at the screen "what the hell is wrong with you people" throughout the documentary. I had to pause it so many times because I could not believe what I was hearing

What's great about it is the makers of the doc do not ever speak. They let all the speaking be done by the people involved. If was very well done.

Thanks Dr. Grande for the great analysis, as always. The Netflix doc was compelling but I believe it omitted the very long and detailed interview Chris Watts gave the detectives while incarcerated at the Dodge prison in Wisconsin. This interview gives you a lot more insight into his motive. He also mentions that Nichol Kessinger didn’t want to be with someone with kids and that she would always feel “second fiddle” to his family. I feel she was the “trigger” that set things off in this guy who was already in a very unhappy marriage. The killings were so horrible and sad and shocking. Chris seemed like a normal guy but evidently he wasn’t.

it JUST came out

@@2006glg Actually BEFORE I watched this documentary I had *no idea* which case/crime it was about. The name Chris Watts wasn't in my "Heinous Killers" scrapbook. Using the unique format of this documentary it was *disjointed* and I felt it was a jumble of loose ends incapable of making a knot at the center. Such as how Chris felt about being an instant dad. How *could* anyone understand all aspects of this crime, the parents involved, siblings, spouses/illnesses/mental illnesses of both, etc. I did glance through this crime and there were about seven break downs about this case so "how did one of them feel" about the other is difficult ? Dr. Grande --- You mentioned in several cases the doubts in both the homicide detectives used of "junk tools" to get admissions (actually several times) of guilt. Also the *legal* use of psychological methods in interrogations. There is also showing photos/mug shots of suspects. Questions: 1.) Why do you belittle professional homicide detectives and methods used to get a resolution (confession)?? How do you feel about them seeing the *gruesome* blood, evisceration, exploded craniums? The *stench* of each murder method: bloated, rotten smell, the iron smell of blood, then the charred remains. *Perhaps you could cover the PTSD that all homicide detectives must have* ? 2.) I don't believe you mentioned this in "why did daddy kill? Didn't they *see* their daddy kill their mommy? Or hurt her? This certainly makes killing them a reason??

Yes very very well said Dr. Grande, you should be everybody's Dr. Excellent.👍

He is a narcissistic sociopath.

When their parents didn't show up to the wedding I would be very concerned about my spouse as well. Cindy is sick.

Kitty Sulivan He was tested for Asperger’s? And falls on the spectrum? That’s news to me. Interesting.

There but for the grace of God go I. I left my narc abusive husband of 14 yrs with my 3 kids, and 20 years later I am just getting a handle on all of this. I was lucky to get out with my life, but the State of Colorado did nothing to help me, and since he had all the money he was awarded the kids and I had to pay him child support. He didn't want the kids, he just didn't want me to have them. Our family was destroyed and I only have a relationship with one child and had to go no contact with the rest of my family and children. There are no happy endings in these scenarios, even when people are not killed. The abuser kills the spirit in all these cases.

Kitty Sulivan this is my thought exactly!! Thank you for your comment. I think teaching kids about this particular personality disorder is what needs to be done in order to prevent ppl like Chris Watts from entering lives. Dating a narcissist made me want to become a child counselor. Kids need more knowledge & protection, I could cry just thinking about it. It’s also important for ppl like you & I to keep speaking on this. Even when others make you feel like you’re the crazy one. No one seems to understand unless they themselves have gone through it.

He does look pretty dumb tbh.

He’s a selfless idiot. No one with any long term self interest would force themselves to live in a cage for the rest of their life. If he had a sense of self, rather than being a bundle of firing neurons, he would have changed his relationship with his life positively, or just would have moved on. Sacrificing his children and his wife-and ultimately himself-in pursuit of short term goals ruined any sort of a happy life he could have possessed. Chris Watts is a type that cannot plan in the long term, he sees what he wants, and is completely controlled by it. He’s not a person I would describe as selfish. He doesn’t have a sense of self, he’s a shell.

Ike it does make one wonder how he could have not realized how he was ending his own life. You would think self preservation alone would have been enough to give him pause. He made a positive change to get in shape but can’t go beyond that.

@@Torgomasta I think also he's very child-like, you know what I mean? That sense, that need for instant gratification reminds me of a toddler, or even my puppy! How in the world did he expect to get away with it? Short sighted is also a child-like failing......

I think he honestly thought people would think she just picked up and left him OR was abducted. He thought that because of his good reputation, and no history or violence or crime, that no one would suspect him. He wildly underestimated how loved and cared for Shanann was. I think he is a covert narcissist and sociopath.

leokimvideo so many people are guilty of pretending on social media of having a great or perfect life....It’s scary!

@@kensyskye8965 I like what the Dr says in this video. This Netflix show about the murders has lots of very important info left out. I think it's good to get the full picture to understand the story in a way that connects lots more of the dots. Especially what she was doing in connection the product Thrive that she was selling via the Multi Level Marketing company. It really looks like she was determined to paint that 'perfect family image' via endless social media posts. Was this to make out how Thrive got her life back after suffering Lupus. This was not explored in the show. Many important elements were totally left out.

It appeared to be a fairly sudden and abrupt change so I can understand why she was sticking it out hoping it was a temporary change in behaviour

If it wasn't for Shannans out of control spending and materialistic mind set she would be alive today.

To everyone, I feel that shanaan felt she did have the perfect family, until the last 5 weeks of their years together. Of course, no family is perfect and she knew that, she said that, but she did feel she had a great husband until those last week's. She was confused and afraid. As most of us do as we grow, she did start to look inside and realize that she could be a better wife to him, just as he could have been a better husband to her. He could have been more assertive and take initiative. We all have our issues. This could have ended so differently. They could have worked on their marriage and been together to enjoy their grand children. They were in many ways every family. This is why, at least for me, this is impossible to understand. How could he have done this...how. He appeared to love his family , how in 5 weeks could this change so drastically. It's insane. I did not see them as miserable, at least shanaan and the girls were not. Chris, who the he'll knows what he was thinking. He ruined so many beautiful lives. Rip Shanaan, Ceecee, Bella and Nikko.

Yes! This!!

OH YES I'd also love to here Dr. G's take on Mom. Oh yes indeed!

he does already have a video about narcissistic mothers so he's halfway there.

When she told Chris she forgives him while at his trial, I was in complete disbelief. That lady is pure evil.

AndromeDa1 hated that part! She thought she had the power of forgiving him for killing someone else’s daughter, and the grandkids she didn’t even care for! Who does she think she is!

Cardinal sign of psychopathy

Some people play the role of the "nice guy" for the favors and for the perception of being good. It boosts their ego. And they are the furthest thing from being good

Through the texts he was actively misleading her still. One of her last texts was about how it felt good to hold him. And she spoke of their sex life and how affectionate he was previously. That’s not someone who is submissive and miserable in their marriage. You are right he was acting. And once he found a woman he would be whatever he needed to be. He’s an empty vessel. There is nothing in there.

Truly good description.

Wtf.. Killing his wife was just as horrific.

@@Iceis_Phoenix yes it is, i just feel like i can understand hating your spouse at times. To hate or kill a innocent child is unfathomable to me.

@@ameygarcia-aviles5332 His evil that's all

And she was pregnant so she had a child inside her as well. All 4 murders are horrible. :(

Yup she a big reason

Cindy Watts is the mother from hell.

Agreed. Chris is a covert-narcissist and his behaviour is learned from childhood.

Could you recommend any other good documentaries regarding this case? I would love to watch more and learn about his relationship with his mother

@@stefaniebrennan7726 to be honest, I can't really remember any one documentary its been so long since I last seen one...it could've been from an interview or something..but I remember thinking what a horrible person she is..not a nice person at all

Or even just confront her about it. She was dominant, but if you look at her private messages with him and others, it appears she really loved him. He didn’t even confront her about it. He just made the executive decision to kill her at a time when she was begging to go to couples counseling to work through their issues.

@@simplynon-traditional1757 very true

Same here the selfishness of this man disgusting. How he could do what he did to those babies is beyond me.

@@janx8695 I'll never understand why he didn't just leave like why did it have to come to this.

@@shannane5171 B/c he is evil

His mom is a narcissist. Shannan's mom talked about how the first time they met, his mom mentioned how disappointed they were to find out shannan had been married before and that she was not good enough for Chris. Shannan's mom retorted that her own daughter (Chris' sister) was also divorced so how is she any better? After that, Cindy Watts was never nice to them again. The dad was passive just like Chris.

Lily Dell -Chris’ parents didn’t attend their wedding either.

His parents were not supportive. He was not man enough to show them his family is important and they need to respect or Take a hike. Mommas boy.

His Mom, all the way

I thought it was interesting his mom said she forgives him in the courtroom

I think she would’ve been very stubborn to let their marriage go, still none of what happened to her was deserved. Her biggest fault having faith in her husband

Lived wayyyy beyond their means!

Shannan was fighting to make the marriage work. I don’t see anything wrong with that. Chris Watts was cowardice by not having the balls to say he wants out. He wanted no confrontation it seems like, and took the easy way. He thought the murders would be easier I think. But I’m just guessing of course. Shannan gave him the benefit of the doubt, he never said things weren’t working, he never confirmed her suspicions. She was going by faith and trust. In my eyes she did no wrong.

@@jesselox3470 her biggest fault was her murder-suicide lol.... she had no faith in her husband. she was always calling him names and making fun of him. she was too cocky to think he could ever cheat on her. thats a big difference though

@@33Dannyb how was she fighting? she was telling chris to find his balls and stand up and fight with his family. how is that fighting for you marriage??? to me fighting for your marriage is talking, openly and trying to find a compromise.......

This had the dramatic music. That helped make it good.

Agree. However, in his sick mind this was the only way out. So, so so sad and disturbing!

The social worker attempts to do a welfare check on the kids, after Susan has gone “missing,” calls dispatch to report she is very concerned for their immediate safety and that their father is not cooperating, meanwhile he locks the doors and burns down the house with them all inside.

Awful case

Poppy Fields There was a dude named John List who murdered his entire family in the 70s - his wife, his mother, and his 3 children. Then he disappeared and lived under another name. Authorities finally caught him in 1989 when America's Most Wanted hired an artist to sculpt how John List might look 18 years after the murders. There are some similarities between both men and their stressors: financial difficulties, dominant/overbearing family members, family discord. John List wasn't having an affair though.

@@angelicadelgado6073 he was religious. He said he was ashamed. His inability to care for them led him to kill them. Financially strapped. I dont understand his reasoning.

@@fallyneprinciotta9058 He was also pretty stupid. In the foyer ceiling there was a 19th century Tiffany chandelier which would have paid off all debts and then some.

It's weird because usually men would think of suicide over murdering there own. He was indeed selfish.

@@angelicadelgado6073 that we knew of.after seeing him when they finally got him i wondered if he was gay also?

She totally out smarted him! She was brilliant.

Yep he is very off-putting

I always felt he look relived when they was gone. So sad x

I don't recall ever seeing Watts with a genuine emotion.....and I've seen hours and hours and hours of footage. He mimics those around him, it is so bizarre!

Probably not her intention - but I think it's insensitive to describe a documentary where a whole family was killed as something that a person would "love" to watch.

Sienna May I’m a clinical social worker who used to practice in an inpatient forensic mental health setting. By “love” she meant would be relevant and interesting for me with my education and experience. Nothing sinister.

i found it revealing as to familiar dynamics that they had to do multiple "takes" of their own life also.

Ooh all great ideas.

I asked for the Larry Nassar case and USA Gymnastics

M M oh my gosh that guy makes my blood boil. Did Dr grande ever do videos on pedos and sex offenders? Kinda curious and wanna binge some vids now.

@@portable.adorable Hi. I'm not sure that I've ever seen one on sex offenders. The USA Gymnastics case is so complicated and has so many layers; I believe that it would take 2-3 videos to cover the case. I also believe that considering how rampant sexual abuse is, it is a very important topic to discuss. Education being the first step in prevention.

Vote for Jared Fogle!! What a weird weird sick case :(

Yes

Yes please!

YESSSS

Yeah, that's a good idea

Or the character's real life counterpart, Scott Lane of LoudLabs News, who you can watch live right here on KZfaq.

YES 👏

dropsy still, would like to watch Dr. Grande have a go at Scott Lane, then.

I agree Ken, it’s so great to seeeeee!!!! 🥰

A lot of people do that,I don’t get it. It’s too much.

I think this is a great observation. I knew every aspect of the case quite well, so I could weave the pieces together. I could also take into account the particularly gruesome facts that the documentary did not address in full. I'd also expected, and wanted, to hear from people who knew her~~I wanted to hear more information per se.....

The ad for it was literally "the last texts of chris and shannon watts. shannon: do you want vegetables? chris: broccoli or greenbeans. shannon: ok love you!

yes, i wonder why they went with that 0 explanations and forensic background policy. the case is so infamous and known in detail by so many. i kept finding myself adding side info for my husband who hadn't read or watched anything about the case yet. and also he said in the end he was hoping to get more background and forensic info as someone who was relatively uninformed about the case. i'm not quite sure why they went for that route. either is was a budget decision (more research, more writing, you need voice actor to present the info). or they really wanted to just without commentary paint the picture of these people as they presented themselves to the world via FB, TV and text and just show how this guy lies in front of the entire world with the conclusion being that even benign looking men can be a danger to their spouse. yet frankly the ending lines about the statistics of spousal murder by men seemed more like an afterthought. and i think the point would have been brought across better if they had gone more into his motivations. he was planning a life with that new gf, she was googling wedding dresses, he was worrying about money and surely didn't need the financial blow of the divorce and having to pay child support for not 2 but 3 children (I'm pretty sure the announcement of the 3rd pregnancy catalyzed things for him). The way it was they were just presenting him as a cheating dude who grew emotionally cold towards his old family. But I do think there was quite some clear financial motivating factors behind the murders, even if he didn't express them clearly as that would have shown that it was actual premeditation and not just a spur of the moment within an argument event, which to me adds to the gravity of the crime. As a third possibility I wondered if the victims' family requested to leave forensic details out of it as to not make their loved ones' deaths a target for morbid curiosity, which to me would be very understandable. Few cases get so public in so much detail. It must be awful if you think that was your loved ones people are sharing gruesome details about on reddit. I still wish they had added at least a bit commentary and at least a short explanation as to why certain details were left out. As is this documentary only really made sense if you already knew the case quite well.

Kitty Sulivan interesting, thank you for bringing that up. my first thought was he killed the family because he had met another woman. seems theres more to it.

I was shocked at how easily he confessed. He was putting on the innocent, but not so sad, act for so long. Maybe the police had some evidence we did not see in the film? All I know, you’re not going to get me to confess to quadruple murder by talking and rubbing my shoulders. If he really pre-meditated the act, you gotta figure he knew he could be interrogated. There had to be something I missed there.

yes! that documentary made me physically ill...

Same

Im really glad KZfaq recommended your channel for me today! I subscribed instantly. Thank you for taking the time to put these videos together

Maybe dr grande could evaluate Cindy watts personality?!

Cindy personailty is very interesting i belive that children our a product of there environment so I believe this impact on Chris Watts and what he will go on to do

That’s the one part I do believe of what happened that night. I do think she told him he wouldn’t see the kids anymore. She should never have been killed, but you can clearly see she controlled everything about that relationship and I do believe in the heat of the moment, she said he wouldn’t see them anymore.

I don’t think we can say he had true connection in a 6- week affair. He certainly had his ego puffed up

@@india1422 good point India! Maybe not true connection but a taste of relationship without fakeness and constant direction.

Psychopaths don’t have shame. Your sympathy for this bastard is totally misplaced. Anyone who can murder their own children should never be excused at all. i find your comments disgusting.