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You're probably my favorite halo content creator at the moment, no straight negativity towards 343 and the game, just quality videos discussing the strengths and weaknesses of the game in it's current state. Keep up the good work!

Honestly, I feel like catalyst is more of the classic maps. The center area can be mostly avoided, and then it plays like citadel a lot (and citadel has a center area)

I think Behemoth is a perfectly fine map...as long as we're talking AR starts. I also think Land Grab has been where it's really shined. If I had to gripe about anything it's that the east/west towers and bases should be distinct colors so it's easier to distinguish which side is which.

Gotta say that zanzibar / last resort def fits the "causal" map design because its asymmetrical, is big on interactive features and has warthog, ghosts and all that jazz. There's also a ton of cool down areas .

I think the best casual maps are the ones with buttons that activate moving map elements and such

I like Launch Site... there, I said it! As for the viewer question; I think Halo 3's Sandtrap is a good example of casual map design. It is large, has tons of sandbox elements such as vehicles and weapons of all kinds, lots of areas to explore and fight in, etc.

What I loved in Halo CE and especially 2's maps (and that I think H5 actually brought back) is how they felt like combat jungle gyms, with places to jump across gaps, up onto geometry, and in general just felt dense with cover and places to hop up and down to flank and ambush people. On Lockout, Wizard, Sanctuary, Prisoner, Turf, etc, you're jumping or moving up and down almost as much as you are across level pathways, and there's always dense cover. I actually think Halo 5 was a "return to form" in this sense, as very few maps in 3/Reach/4 were like this (EX: a map like Construct has verticality, but it's limited to specific points/lifts), wheras almost every map in 5 was in line with the maps I describe, and I actually think Thrust, Slide, and Hover really enabled that sort of map design and brought back the sort of skillumps Halo 2 was known for, since they allowed for a lot of vertical mobility. The video brings up that old maps were allowed to be more gimmicky and the more recent Halo games have very competitively designed sterile maps, and to an extent that's true (CE and Halo 2 also had goofy, gimmicky maps like Chrion, Boarding Action, Backwash, etc; and 5/Infinite don't have anything like that) but as I established from another perspective, Halo 5 actually brought back something the series moved away from. I've always found it ironic people accused sprint of "stretching the maps out" for this reason, because 5's maps feel way more dense with active descisionaking and flanking and juking players then Halo 3's maps ever did to me, where to do anything but walk across rooms/pathways you need to go to a lift or a staircase. As it applies to Infinite, I "like" the maps in Infinite, probably more then in Halo 3, 4, and definitely Reach, and they do have a good amount of verticality and points to move up to higher elevation across the map and not just at staircases and such, but SO much of that vertical mobility is locked behind clambering. You cannot simply "hop' up on something to then jump to a higher elevation or floor, you have to clamber up a wall or a set of boxes. It's an improvement over Halo 3 etc since at least there ARE things to clamber up onto all across the map, but it really makes verticality mobility feel a bit stunted still. And I also don't think they're dense like CE, 2, and 5's maps are, either. Recharge, Streets, and Live Fire are tight, but there's not as much cover or stuff to just decide your mobility around as say Sanctuary or Turf or Plaza, etc.

Boarding action, Chiron tl34, zanzibar, I can go on and on but I’ll limit myself there. Maps that are designed entirely based on a simple question. “Wouldn’t it be cool if…” you had 2 ships next to eachother that you would cross back and forth? If you had a twisting labyrinth of teleporters to run and misdirect enemies through? If we put this giant spinning wheel in the middle of the map and a door in the main base that the other team could open if they got inside? The core philosophy of these maps was “let’s make something that’s cool, make it fun second, and make it balanced third” These priorities have been reversed in modern shooter map design and I disagree with the idea that it wouldn’t work today. I think the problem is that so many players who prefer cool first map design have been let down again and again by every modern shooter hyper focusing on balance above all that they’ve just simply given up

I think this is a really good and fair analysis of the maps. They're all "good" maps that fill out checkboxes and in my opinion, feel much more Halo-like than anything from Reach-onwards. But you also pointed out the two biggest reasons why many people, myself included, have become frustrated with Halo. First, the maps feel so sterile in their balance and design, there's absolutely no unique factors to any of them that were present in past games. Think of Zanzibar's big wheel, falling bridge, and moveable doors, or of the falling rocks and teleporters from Beaver Creek. Many of the old Halo maps had more intractability going on that changed the maps as they were played, or made the players do more than simply find and shoot each other. And of course, the aspect of Infinite's maps being made in such a way as to keep the player constantly occupied is so draining, and removes a lot of the fun that casual Halo used to have.

Maps like Exile and Longbow from Halo4 were fantastic casual maps, as are maps like blood gulch, beaver creek, sanctuary, ivory tower, countdown, lockout, ascension, uncaged, etc. I think what makes them so good is you can play all of them a variety of ways - up close and personal, or with snipes, and vehicles too in some cases. they are innovative interesting designs with varieties of elevation. You don't need to sweat to enjoy fun moments on them.

Aquarius is the most claustraphobic, irritating map I've played in my whole Halo career. Unless you have thrusters you have to hope they messed up a nade toss. Heaven forbid you're in one of the rooms on the sides of the starting points. I just need them to bring maps from older games into the mix in Infinite. Saves design time, just gotta update it graphically and a few other things here and there, wham bam.

You just made me realize why I like those last 2 maps much more than I like the others, it looks and feels much more like old school Halo maps but I hadn't realized that until now

As someone who primarily played halo CE and halo 2 multiplayer maps before halo infinite I immediately accepted behemoth as a good map since it had that acceptable feel to it for me. I always go to halo CE or halo 2 for multiplayer when I want an easy access to nostalgia

See this is why you are one of the best Halo youtubers literally yesterday I was finishing off the event and I was complaining to my mate about how Infinite doesn't let you breathe its just constant combat. Might just be showing my age not wanting to have to fight continuously lol. I do want to see that blend of Casual and Competitive because I really miss having that down time and having engagements that are more personal 1v1s and not worrying about running into the rest of a team when turning a corner with no shields.

a few crates / barriers here and there could greatly help infinites sightline issue. crates could also be used to reduce the reliance on clamber some of these maps have (outer circle rout on reactor, basicly everything on bazar) which would improve flow by making crouch jump viable for targeted jumps. bazar could also benefit greatly from one-tier-lower overall weapon spawns to make the gameplay less entrenched and hectic. vehicle maps could also use some ramp like objects to make the vehicle-zones less constrained, especialy with the proposed additional cover otherwise shrinking vehicle space. a general thing i enjoy in custom games is setting speed and acceleration to 90% (with sprint delay at 80% and slide distance at 110%, so slide stays as it was and sprint does not feel slugish. also 70% grenade radius to be balanced with the lower mobility and spam issue). this makes positioning and non-wobble strafing more important, as well as reduces sweatyness and claustrophobic indoor feel. with 80% acceleration you get halo 3 movement.

I think that even in the older games, BTB maps tended to capture that casual experience more than arena maps did, and I feel that applies to infinite as well, though I think Behemoth and Highpower do a better job of that than the other two maps and I think it could be even better. But given that this video only analyzed the arena maps, I think that Countdown from Halo: Reach might be one of the best casual experiences and remains one of my favorite maps in the entire series. There are just so many routes to take around the map and so much cover that flanking and ambushing enemies tends to be the main way you engage fights, and I think that's what separates casual maps from competitive maps more than anything else in Halo, the ability to engage in interesting yet "unfair" ways that many Halo Infinite maps try to avoid. A general trend of older Halo titles is that weapons were often in more hidden and protected spaces (think lockout and it's iterations, where the shotgun was in a tight hallway, and the sword in a fairly enclosed room), while Infinite generally tries to make power weapons always be as exposed as possible. Does it mean you are forced into a "fair" aim duel? Sure, but it does make every fight over a power weapon or item less interesting and "sweatier". I think the key to making a more casual experience without entirely alienating a competitive audience would be to make maps that are more able to provide sightline breaks and hidey holes, and more willing to put power weapons in more "memorable" locations to fight over in unique ways. The map that comes closest to providing this experience in my opinion is Fragmentation, which in spite of suffering from the Infinite problem of railroading vehicles too much, is definitely the most fun and casual BTB map. It's pretty fun to fight over the weapon caves and fight over the rock and hills. In other words, casual maps should give players more opportunities to individually express themselves even if that expression goes against the meta, and doing so generally requires a more "sandbox" approach to map design.

Pit Stop comes to mind for some reason

Behemoth and Launch Site are my two favorite Halo Infinite maps tbh. But then again I grew up with Halo 3/Reach. The other maps were just too sweaty for me.

Based on my analysis, i wonder if 343i's intentions were to have forge launch with the game so the community can focus on social/experimental maps while 343i focuses on the balanced/competitive maps considering those maps take more time and effort to complete effectively and efficiently. But what do you all think??

I feel like alot of the hate for launch site comes from the fact that when we were first showed screenshots of it we were expecting it to be like Countdown. But it's not even close. God I miss Countdown....

I used to HATE launch site, every time I got slayer there or even fiesta it just felt like too big of a map and not enough action. Then when I started playing One Flag I realized this map is wonderful, given the proper mode! This was MADE for single objective game types! And I'm glad it exists for that reason

“When an ODST and a thicc elite love eachother very much...” JustRube is the artist

I'd love to see some map changes to address the issues you brought up in competitive map design. Map changes in seasonal updates definitely isn't a foreign concept

Last Resort is the most casual fun I could think of. That map just always had something for you to do.

In my opinion the maps are form over function when it should be the opposite

First Edit(I just had to secure my position as first before I gave my opinion.) I’ve more or less stopped playing infinite just because I couldn’t find the casual gameplay. It wasn’t the micro transactions that pushed me away, nor the desync, or any of the other problems people commonly complain about. Plain and simple, I play halo to relax and have fun. But halo infinites gameplay loop forces me to always play my best and hardest in order to succeed, and that exhausted me. Halo infinite is not a bad game by any measure, I enjoy its gameplay, I just really wished that it had more casual experiences for me to enjoy, launch site and behemoth are both really enjoyable to me, but they’re ultimately snack maps, not enough to satisfy, especially when I can’t veto the hyper competitive maps that exhaust me.

Maps like Blood Gulch, Valhalla and other maps that take the whole: 2 bases, lots of vehicles, mess around with the sandbox is more of a casual map design (to what I believe) as those types of maps don't really require you to know spawn locations, power positions, skill jumps and those other advanced mechanics that we associate with a "competitive" design. I know, I know. This may just sound like a dumb argument, but the most casual times I've really had on Halo were on those stupid kinds of maps. Along side the PVE modes.

Behemoth I like, Launch site needs to rebalance the spawns of both vehicles and power weapons when it is outside of 1flag. Maybe a warthog per team and a ghost in the middle?

I miss the neuron activation of changing the map / battlefield or straight up interactions to the maps that if my weapons themselves can cut it then a fusion coil, big laser, or a big red button that creates a plasma cutter that can disintegrate multiple people. This is why Breaker (imo) is good because of the big beam of death to get away from enemies. Like an action movie. That is missing in halo ( or in any sci-fi game) . I guess people want just a silver box paintball style and no thought to the map(s) layout. Tragic. Also, screw Live Fire . Really gives me Endless Vale vibes from Destiny 2 and I hate it . ( if you know, ya know)

Actually, base defense style maps are present in halo 5 and used for war zone firefight and war zone assault :p

I know each of the people that made these and will share this video with them. Extremely well thought out breakdown. Just know that in studio the argument of old halo 2 map design and halo 5 map design is very intense.

Idk what it is about ascend I just love his content and him. Very likeable. Ripe vocabulary even for the choicest listeners. He's one of my favorite KZfaqrs and I'm glad he's true to himself.

Chiron TL-34 (CE portal map) was probably the most casual experience I've had since Minecraft, to be honest. At first it's just pure chaos, but once you figure out which portal leads where, it becomes concentrated chaos. It allows downtime whenever you want--just go through a portal--and also allows players to pull wacky and cool shenanigans.

This very well describes the main reason why I stopped playing Infinite not long after launch. It's simply exhausting. Theres absolutely zero downtime in this game, It's so fast paced and there's so many things you have to stay on top of for the duration of the match that after a 1,5 hour play session all I want to do is lay down and go to sleep from sensory overload. How do you expect players to keep playing your game and make it their main hobby for the next couple years when you make it this demanding? Also, I think hatred for Behemoth and Launch Site really stems from other design issues with the game, such as Infintes weapon balancing, and not just these maps calling back to a less serious design philosophy. If the BR wasn't a perfect laser rifle at range and behaved closer to a H3 BR (with some tweaks ofcourse) and other sandbox elements such as vehicles were more usueful and less fragile I think these maps would be much more pleasant to play on because you wouldn't be as restricted as to how you can move around the map. In Quick Play Behemoth is actually a load of fun when you dont get 4 tapped by 4 different people from across the map without anywhere to hide as you try to cross the map any other way than through the middle. Level design works in tandem with everything else and no amount of genius level design will save you if other elements of the game dont gel with it very well.

I would say all the big team battle maps in infinite are casual because combat isn’t too sweaty and they all have a fun gimmick to set themselves apart from one another.

I feel like it's so hard to do with infinite's weapon sandbox though, with all the weapons being so accurate, and having so much range.

Hoping for a Chiron TL-34 Remake.

I appreciated in halo 5 how maps were tailored to a specific playlist. Breakout exclusive maps, infection exclusive maps, warzone excusive maps and maps built for casual 4v4. In contrast, in Infinite maps are reused for all gametypes and it kind of waters down the gameplay experience. For example, NONE of the maps were designed for that cyber showdown event a few months back. Just haphazardly applied to whatever maps were available. Same thing with LSS besides the new BTB map.

High Ground is the perfect mix of casual and competitive maps. It is easy to be good in HG because of the advantages placement of power weapons, but at the same time it has a very high skill sealing with many advanced strategies being effective for evicting the enamt from advantageous locations. The map is also has the perfect pacing in 4v4. Also the map has a lot of fun quirks like the door to the base that can be opened (sadly removed in mcc) and the vent you can crouch in and covertly flank your opponents.

I feel that map interactions bring a casual flavor to maps (Buttons, shield doors, teleporters, lifts, coils, etc.). I think hitscan brings a challenge to creating nostalgic maps. Some classic maps won’t play as good as we want them to in Halo Infinite. Sandtrap, Boneyard and Spire are my answers to the viewer question.

hope you feel better mate, love your videos

Behemoth and launch site are literally my favorite maps, but I'm not a sweat... I play fiesta and I'm here for the signature "halo moments"

I love AR start Behemoth (Launch site is also pretty damn good)

As they've added more modes I've definitely appreciated some maps way more. Launch Site is great for One Flag and Fiesta, Aquarius makes Land Grab absolute chaos in the best way, and Live Fire just works with Oddball. Behemoth is my favorite map in the game right now, hope to see more like it and Launch Site in DLC.

My favorite Halo map of all time is reflection from Reach. No one else seems to like it but I always though it had so many interesting aspects to it. It’s one sided verticality and it’s striking art style differing it from its H2 counterpart.

I wish there was a switch on catalyst to turn on / off the light bridge or even change which two places it's between... would add a fun troll element to the map but also make it more varied

Your videos are always great. If you did a podcast style long-form version of some these more deep/layered topics, I would absolutely listen. I mean if you made a longer format video I’d also watch that, but audio-only sounds easier.

Launch Site is my favorite map so far.

I think Waterworks from H2 is a good example of a map that can do both. It feels casual when playing it, but when you look at the map from above it's actually very symmetrical. It also had spikes you could shoot from the ceiling to crush players and vehicles. Waterworks is the most underrated map imo.

Sword Base! Probably my favourite purely casual map, especially in multi team and rumble pit style modes.

Huh, that's funny, behemoth and launch site are both my favorite maps, by far. Didn't even realize they're attempts at old fashioned maps

Intro is perfection every time.

I’ve always felt that Infinite felt way to fucking fast for a Halo game, but I couldn’t really place why. This video nailed it. I think what you said about enclosed rooms being grenade pockets is 100% the biggest factor. Grenade spam results in often being unable to recharge shields fully before the next player encounter. I do feel like Catalyst plays better though. Each of the three lanes are so narrow and the doors are smaller which makes it harder to grenade spam into one of the bases. Which can slow down the gameplay nicely if you play right.

Alot of maps nowadays seem to not be allowed to.have cover anymore, or dynamic cover that can be blown up like UNSC shields or sand bags. Not even many rocks. They all have to be perfectly cut pylons or blocks that look 'grabbable' and with a flat top surface to walk on/use for a very obvious skill jump

I don't think I ever considered that vehicles add to the fun of arena matches. Maybe they're why I enjoy BTB so much more...🤔

Halo: CE level design + Infinites sandbox - Sprint = Classic casual halo experience

I like the launch site map, but just hate always playing 1 flag on it.

Viewer Question response: H3 Sand Trap epitomizes the casual Halo experience, to me. You can focus on vehicles with the open loop and lanes, with 4 or 5 different vehicles to pick from, and you have the opportunity to be silly and tempt the Guardians by driving "out of bounds". It also affords the opportunity for both CQC and long range encounters, with almost the entire weapon sandbox. It is care-free but still highly entertaining, and with just the right amount of "sweatiness" mixed in

No mention of BtB? And why do people dislike Behemoth. That wasn’t clear to me.

Live fire is a great map; I do agree catalyst is too exposed. But most all of the launch maps were better than reach's and 4's. Also 343's been trying to give us a large comp map for a long time with Cat, Argyle, and now Forbidden, but none of them are great. All 3 are serviceable, I guess. Glad we don't have all 3 at once. ... It's good that 343 is introducing some very unique maps, post-launch. Cliffhanger, Prism, Chasm, Illusion--all have something special. But for comp, there are so many great forge maps they could toss in. Check out Vyrant, the forgehub winner. Very creative.

How cool would it be to get a banished redesign for the spire? Grapple from the lift to get a full map launch omfg mint blitz stuff right there 👌 Wasp and banshee gameplay wiuld be great, spire was the best air map we've had I think, great map for invasion too.

The annoying thing is that the multiplayer maps have more varied environments than the campaign does.

Oh hey I’ve seen those ODST and thicc elite photos. To get some research on the Halo fandom of course

great casual maps in old halos for me were like Rats Nest good vehicle play on the perimeter, and good infantry play in the middle sections so you could choose what you wanted to focus on. A map that i think strikes a good balance Blackout because of all the close quarters gun play in the lower sections mixed with some angles from the higher floors.

I really wanna see more maps that have less symmetry like launch site. In my opinion the only thing that would make launch site better, is to remove the jump pad that Boosts you across the map the other side.

I’ve always been most fond of the maps with interactive elements; opening doors, breakable glass/walls/props, environmental hazards like trains, lasers, falling rock formations.. this is something that they’ve been moving away from for over a decade now and I find it a crying shame. Forge has definitely allowed for a return to this level of interactivity, at least for fanmade maps, but it’s left much of 343’s catalogue feeling stale by comparison.

Rat’s Nest from Halo 3 is a great casual map in my opinion, sure it’s symmetrical, BUT it has 4 warthogs, 4 mongooses, a ghost, rockets, and grav ham. It’s complete chaos when the warthogs are all getting used and so much fun when teaming up with a friend in hogs all match.

This concept really shows in swat. I got spawn killed too many times.

I love Behemoth and Launch Site! and classic maps from earlier Halos. Let competitive have grey Forge maps with perfect layouts while I play on the crazy stuff ^_^

I hope you feel better, and get a COVID test if you haven't already! I got sick at the start of the month; thought it was a normal cold because I'm triple vaxxed, but found out in the last few days of my recovery that I had COVID - only _after_ giving it to my brother, roommate, and who knows how many other people. Felt like a real asshole. As far as the map design goes, I think your analysis is spot-on as always. Launch Site in particular has always confused me because it _does_ feel like more of a classic Halo map due to the asymmetry, and yet the "old Halo was better" crowd hates it. The competitive map fatigue has never really registered in my mind as such but it's real - I often find myself changing modes or ending my play session entirely because there are only a small handful of maps in the game that have a low probability of descending into a sweatfest. Catalyst in particular has been driving me nuts lately because there are zero safe spaces on the entire map. If you're playing Land Grab, there's a 100% chance a given capture point will turn into a skirmish, whereas on some other maps there are at least a few confined capture points that turn into attack/defense. Last night I ended up in an _Oddball_ match on Catalyst, and it was a colossal pain in the dick, because there was nowhere my team could hole up with the skull! Other maps have at least one hidey hole a team can play defense from, but Catalyst? Every location on that map has at _least_ two approach paths you can be shot at from. With that in mind, I do want to give 343 at least _some_ credit here: the "some maps are ultra casual, some maps are competitive" design formula has been used before effectively. CS:GO literally divides its maps between the two categories, and throws in a rotating pool to boot, and few people complain about it. That doesn't mean it's fun, or an ideal way to do map design, but it's not without precedent.

I knew there was a reason I liked launch site and I could t put my finger on it until now

It feels like 343 heard all the COD players from the past few games complaining about camping and "safe places" and then 343 set out trying to create highly competitive action focused maps where combat is always right around the corner. At least that's how it feels to me, anyway I hope you feel better soon Home Slice - and on a side note I really want the Cinder helmet to come back, such a cool design.

First I want to clarify that I do not understand the English language well so I used a translator to support me, sorry for any errors that may be. Now I think the map styles that would fit well in Halo infinite would be Halo 2 Anniversary I mean I didn't play all the original maps I just tried them in the remastered version and those few maps are really good especially the fact which were not only maps with 3 lanes and 2 towers, they were at least two levels high, example: Zenith, Shrine and Lockout have levels of height, with strategically placed elevators and bridges, which was great since you can dodge the enemy snipers and attack them from behind, the combination of long distance weapons and close combat was well done, I would like to see something similar in infinite, not completely the same, but if they experiment and do something different from the conventional way, and that is a place where you can start 343

Idk man the back of catalyst has a lot of hallways and such and I love playing back there. Those spots make it my favorite map

I often find myself hating on launchsite yet I started to realize I have way more fun in that than any other map

I don't even think the competitive maps are well made: 3 lanes structure work only when the map design is symmetrical, while basically every single map except aquarius and catalys are asymmetrical with one team clearly having the upper hand on spawn. Also, the "claustrophobic rooms followed by full open space" is just bad when your main weapon can crossmap from one side to another.

haven't seen the video and already liked it😂

I've been thinking the area where i live would make a pretty decent casual map it's kinda funny but it's a pretty decent layout

I also think that Halo Infinite (and all of 343’s maps) feel like they aren’t as recognizable or unique as the bungie games.

Great video

Too many human maps. Bungie nailed the alien maps

Behemoth is good but.... 1) i think the opeing/flag spawns should be the towers not the bases idk why that is its just somthing my gut is telling me 2) the bases need a drop to top mid not a just a lift in from top mid 3) the spawning needs a tweak spawning next to an enemy spawn at the same time should not happen on a map that size . 4) a little bit of cover for approaching the towers would be nice ( like a fold in the land/hill/sand dunes) 5) a dedicated anti/counter vehicle weapon spawn 6) then just some minor things like widening the entrance to top mid so a hog could cross easy the map has a lot of potential but it has this uncanny valley effect somthing is slightly off and creates this unsettling feeling

Rats nest, whilst a btb map, had a very casual feel imo. It think it defp should be remade in Infinite

What halo is complete without returning maps. Like bloodgultch or Valhalla for example. I would love some of the classics to return. Halo 3's Valhalla especially. But for both btb AND 4v4. Not just one or the other

Sometimes I feel like 343i should consult this man. Hes telling me stuff I didn't notice until he pointed it out

I love Behemoth... and Launch Site. I guess I'm just that kinda Guy... tbh I pretty much like all the 4v4 Maps in Infinite.

2:47 What title did this happen to? If we look at the most popular shooters, they are almost exclusively BR focused. I can't recall a shooter coming out and having it fall by the wayside because it wasn't comp orientated, in fact, the only shooter I have seen flop in recent years was Cliff's super serious hero shooter. Outlaws was hyper focused on comp and being for real gamers and everyone looked at it and went "meh," and went back to playing overwatch. I also hate that the maps are so open. I hate getting shot from 3 different angles, I hate trying to cross no man's land, I hate being forced to play like it's a cover shooter.

get well soon bro

This is a very good video

0:12 AYO IS THAT RUBE

I really like all the original halo 2 maps they may be what your looking for

Behemod and launch site, they play well in fiesta wich is cool

4v4 on btb maps would probably make for a good casual mode

What skin is that on your AR? The green one…

Your intros are fucking amazing😂

The two new maps are near perfect in my eyes, if they keep going ill be happy

Catalyst plays great and looks amazing

I made it into the intro!

I actually really like behemoth they should just add like more rocks or something to break lines of sight for ranked