Rhino 4X4 roof rack: Why I didn't buy one | Auto Expert John Cadogan

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Auto Expert John Cadogan

Auto Expert John Cadogan

3 жыл бұрын

If you’re thinking about buying a Rhino Rack for your 4X4, I suggest you don’t. I certainly didn’t, and I was going to. Here’s why:
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4X4 roof load limits are typically in the 75-100 kilo ballpark. The Rhino Rack for Hilux weighs 27 kilos - that’s the flat ‘Pioneer’ rack and the ‘Backbone’ rail system. Therefore, that’s 48 kilos of cargo ‘upstairs’. This might be OK if that were the end of this story, but it’s not.
There’s a further reduction in payload capacity mandated by Rhino in conditions Rhino calls (erroneously) ‘off road’. Basically, you have to knock a further one-third off the payload. The basis for this reduction is not stated.
If I got this right, this reduces the Hilux roof rack payload by 16 kilos, to just 32 kilos. Nearly $1800 for a roof rack system to carry just 32 kilos.
It’s just bad value, dude - $55 per kilo (of off-road payload). That would be like paying $1000 for a jerry can. You’ve got to be kidding.
I suspect, were this limitation to be prominently displayed on Rhino’s website it might turn many people off buying the product. It certainly turned me off, but I had to dig to find it.
This load reduction is buried in the PDF fitting instructions for the ‘Backbone’ rail part of the system. I’m not saying Rhino is actively or maliciously hiding it. I’m saying that this critical safety information should be much more prominently displayed and unequivocally clear to intending buyers, in my view.
I’d suggest, if you’re a potential customer, you’re unlikely to download the fitting instructions. That’s the kind of thing you’d do only after buying, and even then, only if you plan on fitting it yourself.
Even though Rhino refers to this reduction as a (quote) ‘off road cargo allowance’ … in the fine print it actually applies to:
“Any driven path taken that does not contain a surface protection layer (tar/bitumen)”
Unsealed roads are roads. They are not ‘off road’. That seems kinda misleading to me.
But it’s even worse than that:
“Load must be evenly distributed over the system”
Rhino fitting instructions there. So let’s not be putting a 32-kilo second spare tyre ‘up there’, maxxing-out the rack. Because that’s not evenly distributed.
The latent engineer in me considers this an entirely impractical operational stipulation. This rack is supposed to carry 4X4 gear. That’s why people generally buy them. This equipment is not generally amenable to even load distribution. It doesn’t work like that. Gas bottle. Spare wheel. Jerry can. Whatever.
Even load distribution is, like, sand in a trailer. You can’t spread out a gas bottle and a jerry can. (And you can’t carry much more than that either.)
Bottom line: I’ve got a Triton. It’s got a 100kg factory roof load limit. I’d only be fitting a rack that enabled me to exploit all of Mitsubishi’s roof load capacity, in all foreseeable driving conditions. And I think that’s what most roof rack buyers expect.
I ask you: Why fit a product that actually degrades your vehicle’s fundamental capability? This makes no sense to me.

Пікірлер: 720
@TylerThompson90
@TylerThompson90 3 жыл бұрын
Amazing 🙌 100% support everything you said. Thanks for helping bring this information to the public eye
@lordrikiller
@lordrikiller 3 жыл бұрын
Thanks Tyler - you started all this mate!
@mals4897
@mals4897 3 жыл бұрын
Apart from not all 4WD owners are wankers like he says
@jamesmcmillan2656
@jamesmcmillan2656 3 жыл бұрын
Thanks to you mate you might have saved someone from a terrible tragedy
@CohnmanTheBudbarian
@CohnmanTheBudbarian 3 жыл бұрын
Nah, thank you tyler, if it wasn't for you, I'd still be overloading my crappy rhino that can carry nothing.
@stuartpx1
@stuartpx1 3 жыл бұрын
As above.
@blackbandit1290
@blackbandit1290 3 жыл бұрын
Good to see things haven't changed much in 50 years! When working with a mining company in WA back in the early 70's, all their LWB (and narrow track) Land Rover wagons (weren't called 4WD's in those days) were fitted with very heavy full length roof racks. They were loaded with spare axles, spare spring sets and many metal trunks full of spare parts and tinned food (just in case you got stranded somewhere northeast of Kalgoorlie). With more than 200kg about 7ft off the ground they were absolute dogs to drive on seriously rutted roads and even worse on the highways at higher speeds. You can imagine what the fuel economy was awful and we had to carry extra fuel tanks and jerry cans as well. Many were lost to roll-overs and of course if you rolled one you lost your job instantly. I managed 12 months with the company without rolling one but I didn't put all the heavy stuff up the top only deck chairs and bed rolls. Actually it was better to tow a small Heavy Duty trailer with all the heavy stuff in it and then park it at the campsite whilst doing daily bush exploration trips.
@FJUH
@FJUH 3 жыл бұрын
This wouldn’t be a thing if Tyler Thompson hadn’t done the hard yards with Rhino! Rhinos conduct is a disgrace!!
@lg8188
@lg8188 3 жыл бұрын
They are all piggybacking off him. Good that the word is getting out though.
@Handlesplus
@Handlesplus 3 жыл бұрын
Tyler is a great guy, and extremely fair about all things 4WD.
@brandleverage
@brandleverage 3 жыл бұрын
Yes, some more value added via different perspectives, but definitely feels like piggybacking
@gacoxd
@gacoxd 3 жыл бұрын
100% Tyler Thompson did the hard yards.
@krump743
@krump743 3 жыл бұрын
#facts. Ronny was caught with his hands in the cookie jar. Tyler thompson is the real hero here, ronny is a sell out.
@garyquinlan4075
@garyquinlan4075 3 жыл бұрын
So basically a Rhino is as useful as a screen door on a submarine!
@deniscoffey1339
@deniscoffey1339 3 жыл бұрын
And just like THAT, Dingo Piss Creek becomes overcrowded & unusable. Thanks Cado!
@mael-strom9707
@mael-strom9707 3 жыл бұрын
"These hopeless hippies had broken down and it turned out the only tools they had were themselves." (Outback expert Russell Coight) 😂😋
@Nebs1
@Nebs1 3 жыл бұрын
Need to try dingo piss lake. I was there recently. It’s amazing
@juliangraziani7299
@juliangraziani7299 3 жыл бұрын
I have 2 new sayings this week... Industry Standard. And Dingo Piss Creek...
@justinfritz3367
@justinfritz3367 3 жыл бұрын
I have seen a few of the riveted on rack channels with missing rivets. The only possible reason for fitting a roofrack like this is for cost saving. Just drop the headlining and bolt them on with fish plates. The other issue is seeing all the Rhino accessories such as spare wheel clamps, jerry can holders and gas bottle holders. On one hand they tell you you spread the load while on the other they sell you the accessories to point load the rack.
@DanWallis86
@DanWallis86 3 жыл бұрын
I’ve been looking at getting one of these for my Shitlux. Thank you for the heads up.
@matt895816
@matt895816 3 жыл бұрын
You're absolutely right. Great looking product and it caught me out. Dealer fitted it so I never saw the fitting instructions. I replaced factory crossbars that in retrospect could probably hold more too.
@TyFenwick
@TyFenwick 3 жыл бұрын
My Rhino rack fell apart after about 12 months there complete crap. I’ve moved over to Yakima platforms now and after 2 years it’s such a solid product ! 👍🏼
@Ethan-mv2un
@Ethan-mv2un 3 жыл бұрын
Have you got their rail kit with rivets mate? Any issues off road?
@jasenanderson8534
@jasenanderson8534 3 жыл бұрын
@@Ethan-mv2un I do, and so far it's pretty solid, a year down the road, literally. The issue of limits still applies though, but luckily I only put the slight excess I can't fit in the tray, up there..
@ritual64
@ritual64 3 жыл бұрын
Great information, John. I thought of buying one for the CX-5, we usually buy a factory set that I then attach myself. This time, the wife wanted something sexier so we started looking at aftermarket parts. The Rhino was the leading contender but thanks to this report, and my constant procrastination, I will be looking elsewhere and with a lot more diligence. We just use them around town, roof racks are very handy items, almost as handy as a towbar.
@craigmcclure1819
@craigmcclure1819 3 жыл бұрын
Best report you have ever done
@animatedflow9974
@animatedflow9974 3 жыл бұрын
Wow... thank you for researching and raising awareness on this. So many potential court cases and deaths out there flying around blissfully unaware
@shaddonaghue
@shaddonaghue 3 жыл бұрын
That’s fantastic mate, next time i head up to my favourite campsite at dingo piss creek, not only will it be crowded because of your exposure to this great place but my roof rack supplied by rhino of course will most likely fall off 🤠.
@interceptor7905
@interceptor7905 3 жыл бұрын
Lol
@ivanolsen8596
@ivanolsen8596 3 жыл бұрын
Now the word is out all Rhino RRs will jump off and DP creek will be full of abandoned RRs.
@cameronramm778
@cameronramm778 Жыл бұрын
Thanks mate for your videos. Stumbled upon your channel a few weeks ago. I have one of those backbone trays on our Pajero. I 100% agree with understanding the different types of load limits your car's roof has been designed to handling. Cheers mate.
@CiscosDisco22
@CiscosDisco22 3 жыл бұрын
Snorkels ✅ Roof racks ✅ Please do lift kits next.
@reececulver3606
@reececulver3606 3 жыл бұрын
From a person that obviously has never been off road lol
@Forexfox99
@Forexfox99 3 жыл бұрын
Love your work John!
@Graciegunfire
@Graciegunfire 3 жыл бұрын
I love my pioneer platform! It is the most expensive LED light bar bracket I have ever bought :)
@victorbitter583
@victorbitter583 3 жыл бұрын
You could put a trenching tool/shovel up there along with some trax.
@grantadamson3478
@grantadamson3478 3 жыл бұрын
Shameful. I have been a member of a large 4WD club for over 30 years and it seems appropriate to link this video to our members site. Others should do the same.
@TheHungrySlug
@TheHungrySlug 3 жыл бұрын
Done! Cheers
@muzzaball
@muzzaball 3 жыл бұрын
Hi John, YOU used to be a 4wder, I remember when you (your article) convinced me to buy a GU Patrol years ago, and that was a terrific vehicle - thank you! I have seen the vids from the KZfaqrs you mentioned so I have a reasonable understanding of this issue. Rhino Racks are attached with a handful of Aluminium pop rivets, that has got to be a worry. You mentioned dynamic loads off-road, and as we are bouncing around there, those limits obv need to be applied, but if only THEY used M8 bolts through the roof with backing plates, that would have to make a diff. Owners who have it pro-fitted would NEVER see those reduced values, I have been doing this for a while, and I didn't know about the reduction. Cheers mate.
@andrewdegozaru74
@andrewdegozaru74 3 жыл бұрын
I can think of a few cases where a big set of racks is great, and it doesn't include 4WD's
@markh.6687
@markh.6687 3 жыл бұрын
I can think of many, many cases where big racks are awesome, but I also support little racks, because I can! :)
@andrewdegozaru74
@andrewdegozaru74 3 жыл бұрын
@@markh.6687, here here to that!
@weegaz22
@weegaz22 3 жыл бұрын
Gentlemen...I think we can all agree that racks of differing shapes, sizes and sometimes even ones made of composite materials like silicone are all fantastic...but when they get to the point where they end up dragging on the ground because of poor "supporting hardware", be that pop rivets or no underwire/straps then i think you'd agree its time we look for a better set of "racks" :)
@markh.6687
@markh.6687 3 жыл бұрын
@@weegaz22 I should rather have natural than enhanced racks, with a few carefully-vetted enhanced racks grandfathered in (Dolly Parton, El Vira, surgical/medical issues, etc.) But wholesale mass market rack enhancement simply to show off simply doesn't work for me. Nor does it work on vehicles. :)
@murrieteacher
@murrieteacher 3 жыл бұрын
And here was the opportunity for a few videos of racks of different shapes and sizes. I was waiting for it and it didn't happen!
@phillipsampson4001
@phillipsampson4001 2 жыл бұрын
Perfect timing to see this. Cado, you’re a legend. Cheers 🍻 mate.
@michaelwebb8788
@michaelwebb8788 3 жыл бұрын
Thank you for this information! I was about to buy a Rhino Rack and am glad I looked this up.
@frednedgold4636
@frednedgold4636 3 жыл бұрын
thanks for the show .good job
@barbecuetechtips6024
@barbecuetechtips6024 3 жыл бұрын
Just when I thought I needed more support for my rack. GREAT!
@MrCarbroker
@MrCarbroker 3 жыл бұрын
Another great informative Video Please keep it Thanks
@Walkingdeath_69
@Walkingdeath_69 3 жыл бұрын
Thanks John keep up the good work.
@MudducksTouringAustralia
@MudducksTouringAustralia 3 жыл бұрын
I have been running said roof rack on my 200 series land cruiser for a couple of years now. Luckily I do load it to more than about 50kg. When I saw Tylers video I was so pleased he made this public. I don’t plan to load mine up any heavier than that but I’m glad this information is now out there. Buy the way the 200 has a roof load of 150kg. So I’m safe but things could have been a lot different potentially. Cheers Steve
@terryfrank7421
@terryfrank7421 3 жыл бұрын
Thanks John enjoy your time and knowledge well done dude
@automotiveoscilloscopediag2227
@automotiveoscilloscopediag2227 3 жыл бұрын
Well presented mate. Exactly the reason I did not install one to my Prado.
@MrHotDog70
@MrHotDog70 3 жыл бұрын
Big props for giving the credit up front to those two youtubers who broke this story.
@ItzHoot
@ItzHoot 3 жыл бұрын
Good detective work John , keep it up mate!.
@lukefenech
@lukefenech 2 жыл бұрын
Champion effort and good info.
@shadowjohn2266
@shadowjohn2266 3 жыл бұрын
great report
@MrStrokeIt
@MrStrokeIt 3 жыл бұрын
Damn it John i just bought the rhino for my triton last week and now you put this up.. Thanks heaps
@seabee167
@seabee167 3 жыл бұрын
Triton has 4 bolt down points under the rubber gutter strip. I've got cross bars and a flat tray attached, triton roof load is 80kg, cross bars and tray are about 15 -20 kg, so you'll be let with around 60kg to load up there. Take the rhino rack back
@phycling
@phycling 2 жыл бұрын
I am glad this popped up in my feed as I was about to do the same, purchase a full rack as opposed to roof bars. Needless to say a standard set of 2 bar roof racks will suffice, saving about $1K, thanks.
@alanbrackenbury3324
@alanbrackenbury3324 3 жыл бұрын
John, loved the video, great content. Having seen the other videos you referenced. I am firmly forming the opinion that, in this case, Rhino is working on the simple fact that Australians don't sue, for damages that is. I can guarantee if you get this roof rack proffesionally fitted you would never see the fitting instructions. I can also almost guarantee that anything you are told by a retail outlet about the fit for purpose of this rack would be fully and wholly denied at a later time if the poop hit the fan. Very sad situation that will not be resolved till someone dies. Even then companies like Rhino will never take responsibility for misleading or deceptive behavior and recommending the use of dodgy fittings with a well documented history of failure from metal fatigue.
@VK4HG
@VK4HG 3 жыл бұрын
Good stuff John. I am a weekend warrior watching this market segment 20+ years, this stuff is of real concern with modern vehicles. Thank you very much. My family is safer for it.
@4x4touring47
@4x4touring47 3 жыл бұрын
Bloody awesome explanation of the fundamental flaws in rhinos racks! Ive been following Tyler and Ronny for a while and as you would've seen Tyler explained it well but Ronny was a proper 🐓🐓 about it initially but did save a bit of face with his follow up vid. Bottom line this needs a lot more info out there so rhino can pick up the big ball they dropped 👍👌
@stephenlane9168
@stephenlane9168 3 жыл бұрын
Nice work John as always. I really appreciate the research, writing and integrity in presentation. Bloody great informative channel for once on facebooks youtube.
@AutoExpertJC
@AutoExpertJC 3 жыл бұрын
Thanks Stephen.
@FM-rz3wi
@FM-rz3wi 3 жыл бұрын
Thanks John, i have been looking forward to this and all the discussion that will follow, your wit and knowledge is a dangerous mix, Now for the Rhino response both practically in the form of corrected engineering as well as a statement from Rhino as to its current position
@josephj6521
@josephj6521 3 жыл бұрын
Well done John. 👍 I find nearly ALL companies..... from selling fireplaces to garden sheds and fridges to roof racks, plus motor vehicles, have all their critical information on their installation/how to use PDFs. So, what do I do? I read all the instructions I download. Sometimes I research for hours as I become suspicious. Dealers, sales people, etc will tell you what you want to hear, not what you NEED to hear. As for Hilux’s 75kg roof load limit, that’s crap and low. I expected more for a work vehicle! My Tucson although not a work car can handle 100kg. I checked these racks. I went with a standard rhino roof rack plus a roof box. Roof box can handle heaps of weight and all my crap is protected by the weather. I don’t go 4x4 so it’s only for standard stuff on standard roads.
@nedcakovan5863
@nedcakovan5863 3 жыл бұрын
Spot on.. I bought the 1st Backbone system developed for the Y62 Patrol. 2015. Got my Rhino Platform full rack. Had 1 day to load up 5 weeks of remote touring gear to go to Dingo Piss Creek :P after fitting the Rhino rack, which alone took over an hour to fit. I too saw the 100kg load limit - the weight of the rack as my payload limit. So off I go to Dingo Piss Creek, and halfway through my trip, I find every pop rivet that was on the rack had broken off. So I had to go find screws, drill out the rivets, and screw it all back together. Went back to ARB to show them how "good" the rhino rack was. And I was told that they are only rated for 30kgs offroad.. So they got out of fixing/replacing the platform rack.....
@kenoath5650
@kenoath5650 3 жыл бұрын
Thank for the info John. Just about to start packing for our next trip to Porcupine Guam Gully.
@stevesymons484
@stevesymons484 3 жыл бұрын
5 years later..no problems carrying heavy crap on my Ranger in Central Qld on our wonderfully smooth roads out here at Dingo piss Creek. Was fitted by ARB.
@Bugsquash
@Bugsquash 3 жыл бұрын
Good luck with the insurance claim if something ever happens
@wolfman2878
@wolfman2878 3 жыл бұрын
Nice work John, have a look at Front Runner slime line 2 roof tray and roof rail system, the slats are more practical for anchoring the load too.
@vegasdevl84
@vegasdevl84 3 жыл бұрын
I'm in Las Vegas in 'Murrica and I look forward to John's videos from Straya. Always great information and funny as fuck! Thx!
@coover65
@coover65 3 жыл бұрын
I love Vegas. Visited 13 years in a row to attend a swap meet in Henderson. Just three days then fly back to Straya. Strangely enough not once have I ever played the slot machines. I must be Nevada's worst tourist.
@mael-strom9707
@mael-strom9707 3 жыл бұрын
If you love auto expert John's work you'll pee your pants with outback downunder expert Russell Coight's work. 🤣😋
@coover65
@coover65 3 жыл бұрын
@@mael-strom9707 Everything I know about outback survival I learnt from Russel Coight. That's probably why I tend to stay in the city.
@vegasdevl84
@vegasdevl84 3 жыл бұрын
@@coover65 that's where I live, to be exact, Henderson. I say Las Vegas to simplify things.
@vegasdevl84
@vegasdevl84 3 жыл бұрын
@@mael-strom9707 I will check him out for sure. Thank you
@andyc1175
@andyc1175 3 жыл бұрын
Good work..
@ozarkoverlandoutfitters9218
@ozarkoverlandoutfitters9218 3 жыл бұрын
I installed one rhino rack several years ago and seen it was junk for real use and had refused to fit anymore. Much better options out there
@AutoExpertJC
@AutoExpertJC 3 жыл бұрын
I think that's true.
@tonys8243
@tonys8243 3 жыл бұрын
I'm on the old side so my imputed is also old ... back in the 80's almost every Patrol that had a roof rack fitted used to crack the A pillar at he top of the windscreen either or both sides I believe it was caused by inability of the turret to flex as it was designed.
@discoveryingaustralia8296
@discoveryingaustralia8296 3 жыл бұрын
I read the instructions and was aware of the limitations before tracking bits down - I got mine second hand. It’s all incorporated in the GVM and GCM so there are limitations there that you have to be aware of - that’s why I did research as weight is limited when towing. Mine carries nothing generally, if we’re moving specific items they go up there. Extended trips without the van there may be a jerry can. Otherwise it’s some lights, an awning and jack. Currently 6th wheel up there. Yes - it’s an expensive ornament, but it was the most effective and lightest ornament I could get that I could configure and use with fixings from Bunnings as opposed to proprietary fixings. I paid less than $1000 for the setup (backbone and rack) simply by chasing down the parts that people didn’t want.
@edwardpace3691
@edwardpace3691 3 жыл бұрын
I need to read the "destructions" more often! Thank you for your research.
@krump743
@krump743 3 жыл бұрын
To late to read them... when you have already paid for the rack to only then discover you cant carry as much as you thought.
@edwardpace3691
@edwardpace3691 3 жыл бұрын
@@krump743 Fair point.
@ivanolsen8596
@ivanolsen8596 3 жыл бұрын
I always read the destructions, after the job is done.
@Johnhrop
@Johnhrop 3 жыл бұрын
I had a car (Forrester) in front of me loose the basket rack with a kayak on top. (Bruce Hwy) He was lucky it did not clean up anything when it came off. Thanks for posting… I check the roof bolts often but will now recheck the specs before letting my rhino carry heavy objects.
@damienmills293
@damienmills293 3 жыл бұрын
Long before I bought a 100 series LC and a serious off road camper trailer I had a career as a tradesman. As such you quickly learn that anything heavier than a ladder strapped to the roof racks is going to break the rack. Even then, the aerodynamics of a car/ute is such that the air passing over the roof is compressed and puts a huge load on whatever is up top. It is quite the moment when you see your ladder sailing up behind your car... Take a look at what is on the top of tradie's utes... not a lot! Why not? Because is blows off, falls off, breaks off and you damage the vehicle and yourself getting it on and off. Use the Camper trailer, just as tradies use trailers and put the heavy stuff down low. The light stuff, bedding, camp tables and chairs goes on top.
@MrSteelAu
@MrSteelAu 3 жыл бұрын
good work John, i could not explain it better and i too am Australian qualified with 40+ years experienced Mechanical Engineer, a roof rack should be secured the same method used to fixing a seat belt.
@noproblem2big337
@noproblem2big337 3 жыл бұрын
Well done for alerting potential unsuspecting customers to this mainly 4x4 cab-ute roof rack major functional limitation👍 I actually have "Dingo Piss Creek" great adventure destination on my bucket list! 😂
@MikeDLees
@MikeDLees 3 жыл бұрын
Wow - very helpful video. I own a Rhino rack, with all the accessories. I live in Retardistan, and own a fairly off road capable 2016 Toyota 4Runner. The roof load spec, that I found on the Toyota website is 132lbs, “evenly distributed weight”. Which is ~ 60kgs. Thankfully I haven’t bought into the roof top tent fad, but I do have an awning. I don’t carry much weight on my roof rack typically, but I guarantee I’ll be doing some extra research on this topic, including reviewing the “installation instructions” for more Rhino specifications. I drive to Moab from Denver regularly, where there is an 80 mph speed limit. Imagine if the rack fell off / failed at that speed. Unthinkable! I also watched the Ronny Dahl video on the topic, which was also very good.
@Bugsquash
@Bugsquash 3 жыл бұрын
Dual Cab MR Tritons have an 80KG roof load limit John. I literally read it this morning in the owners manual looking at this issue.
@jasenanderson8534
@jasenanderson8534 3 жыл бұрын
Totally agree. Even the Yakima racks information doesn't clearly display this fact. I certainly didn't know about it when buying mine, and was told it has a 100kg limit but didn't realise that the Hilux was only 75 either. I trusted the supplier to warn me, but again that didn't happen either. Now I don't know what to do with the damn thing, but alas my 4x4 doesn't do the hardcore stuff some do. I just want to take stuff to camp grounds on road trips, not up some remote Wombat Poo Hill.
@jonniemela3661
@jonniemela3661 3 жыл бұрын
The few thumbs down must be from Rhino management.
@technopsychobedlam
@technopsychobedlam 3 жыл бұрын
Or those who can see the errors in what John is saying. He seems to be singling Rhino out for the Hilux having a low roof load-capacity and a lack of adequate anchor points. I'd like to see how the other makers are getting around physics with their racks. I agree that Rhino should be up front about the use and limitations of their product - but that is a Toyota problem too. They know how people intend to use their cars when they construct them Why is John singling out Rhino and not Toyota?
@sloth_e
@sloth_e 3 жыл бұрын
@@technopsychobedlam I reckon you should actually look into how others mount before you comment. Also, the actual guy who blew the lid on this was driving a navara when his rack fell out of its mounting points in the roof. It is squarly rhinos poor enineering and deceitful hiding of important safety information in a place where no reasonable person would ever read. Who fits thier own racks to actually warrant reading the fitting instructions to find the true limit? Why does rhino and retailers promote this rack to all makes of ute if as you say its about a utes load limits and not the rack?
@technopsychobedlam
@technopsychobedlam 3 жыл бұрын
@@sloth_e Ronny definitely had a Hilux. If its a similar issue on the Nissan, then they have an issue to address also. I agree that mounting a rack via rivets into the roof metal is just wrong. Rhino is wrong to suggest that is an ok solution. But if Toyota/Nissan only provides a low roof load limit and no proper mounts that is also a problem Other rack companies can't do better than the roof limit minus the rack weight - so that part is a Toyota/Nissan issue. It's weird that people aren't whaling hard on Toyota/Nissan about it though.
@MrKiwijosh
@MrKiwijosh 3 жыл бұрын
So what roof rack did you buy John ?
@norsehall309
@norsehall309 3 жыл бұрын
Thank you, Thank you, Thank you John the shit will hit the fan over this, see to many 4x4s loaded this way, keep kicking ass Mate love it.
@aaronp7540
@aaronp7540 3 жыл бұрын
Prorack is pretty similar, the roof load limit and the 3 bar rack I have for my 4x4 is restricted by the 75kg load limit on the mounting kit. Which of course was not advertised or mentioned anywhere except for in the mounting kit paper work
@alectraproject
@alectraproject 3 жыл бұрын
Absolutely correct!
@RobertSmith-di5ll
@RobertSmith-di5ll 3 жыл бұрын
Spot on - its all about " we told you"
@GeekTutorials1
@GeekTutorials1 2 жыл бұрын
Mine is about 8 years old and going strong. It's a bit noisy on the roof, but fantastic for carrying stuff!
@karl4834
@karl4834 3 жыл бұрын
Fortunately my low budget overcame my low intellect in preventing me from buying one of these sexy looking public liability issues that Rhino's insurers should probably look at more closely. Good on you John for recognising the public interest issue that Ronny and Tyler brought to our attention and adding your engineering perspective to the Rhino story that they minimise. Never mind disclosure on their website, it should be writ large on the display box it comes in.
@aussiex0152
@aussiex0152 3 жыл бұрын
I was on my way back from a trip on the highway when half of my rivets failed which luckily vibrated & I was able to pull over before the 2 kayaks fell off. I wasn't running a platform & it was on a 2009 colorado. With a rhino roof rack. I was previously off-road about 300 km earlier
@craigbowles8822
@craigbowles8822 3 жыл бұрын
I have a 2012 hilux with a flat platform Rhino Rack. Rhino rack uses rivets, supplied with the mounting leg kit. My style of mounting was before the backbone system. The tracks mount in a channel about 50mm in from the side edge of the roof. Seems there are a few layers of sheet metal folded and spot welded here, it ends up around 4-5mm thick. The rivets supplied are alot more heavy duty than your standard blind alloy rivet from the hardware shop. You need hands of steel to install the rivets with the hand type rivet gun, rhino recommends the telescoping or air rivet guns to install them. The only racks ive seen come off seem to be tracks that are riveted though the roof next to the factory channel, like a 1.6mm bit of sheet metal. I havnt had any issues yet, but im pretty temped to put some 6mm bolts in in place of the rivets after these stories have come out.
@CodeFoxAus
@CodeFoxAus 3 жыл бұрын
My sister's factory Toyota roof racks were ripped off the roof on the highway (at around 90km/hr), and it only had a surf board on it. The load was obviously not "heavy" but I'd love to know what the air pressure from the flat surface of the surfboard was when the rack's mounting points failed, and if that has to be taken into account in the load calculations. As you said, having a B-Double coming the other way would have had a significantly higher impact than just highway driving air pressure.
@williamjohnson8267
@williamjohnson8267 3 жыл бұрын
The Hilux are pop riveted aswell. The ‘tracks’ that the backbone attaches too with Tbolts is what is pop riveted in to the cars factory channel
@slowboat6021
@slowboat6021 3 жыл бұрын
spied a 200LC W chariot on way into caravan show. 5 pop rivets each side... thanks for the heads up, was thinking of "upgrading" my steel roof rack to ally,
@Cashewnutter112
@Cashewnutter112 3 жыл бұрын
Love the Maxwell Equation t shirt #respect
@p38arover22
@p38arover22 3 жыл бұрын
I have a Rhino Pioneer Platform on my L322 Range Rover. I bought the platform second hand and used other Rhino bits that I had. It doesn't use the backbone system, it's fitted via 6 legs to 8mm captive "nuts" in the roof. Rhino don't make a configuration for my model Rangie so I worked it out myself. It's hard to believe that anyone would fit a roof rack with pop rivets. My Rangie's hand book says, about roof rack loads: "Roof rack load (including the mass of roof rack) on-road 100 kg, off road 30 kg". I am always mindful of the load I put up there. I don't do severe off-roading but I do travel on some rough roads. I have been toying with the idea of selling it on.
@seancuffe264
@seancuffe264 3 жыл бұрын
Love the Rhino website, lots of pics of "overloaded" racks, shame ongoing
@mrrberger
@mrrberger 3 жыл бұрын
I'd like to see their engineering computations. Reasonable for an Australian driver to expect full compliance and capability while traveling at 110kph. Then there's NT's "open" speed limit as long as it's safe. What happens when the Rhino is the difference between safe and unsafe?
@technopsychobedlam
@technopsychobedlam 3 жыл бұрын
Really? Which picture shows a clearly overloaded rack?
@deanfawcett2085
@deanfawcett2085 3 жыл бұрын
@@mrrberger Faulty engineering and had to hide their mistakes in the installation instructions after the fact? Maybe. I think you could gaff 30kg to the roof and it wouldn't come off. Save you $ :)
@seancuffe264
@seancuffe264 3 жыл бұрын
@@technopsychobedlam all of them with anything on, that's the point
@technopsychobedlam
@technopsychobedlam 3 жыл бұрын
Nope. The lower limit is specifically for a Hilux with off-road use. That is exactly none of what is shown. My MUX has double the roof capacity of the Hilux and comes with a dozen 8mm roof rail bolt mounts. There is no problem. The Hilux has low load limit and doesn't provide appropriate mount points. I totally agree that Rhino should be up front with purchasers about the Hilux being unsuitable before they buy anything. But I see this as a Toyota problem as much as anything...and that isn't being addressed because these youtubers are dumping exclusively on Rhino. Separately, I think Rhinos response to Tyler was crap
@poida_de_bogan
@poida_de_bogan 3 жыл бұрын
You can also purchase LED replacement headlight globes that are not ADR approved. Some vendors do have "* off road use only" as a caveat, but most seem to bury the warning in the fine print. John - can you do a segment on that topic?
@Nathan-lr4zz
@Nathan-lr4zz 3 жыл бұрын
I had my roof racks pull the rivets through the roof on a trip to Uluru. Had my spare tyre up there
@TheFaldoran
@TheFaldoran 3 жыл бұрын
I've got one of these, but it came with the car. Only use it to put sleeping bags and other large but lightweight things up the top. I don't want to spend half my time weighing things and doing maths prior to a camping trip...
@arthol51
@arthol51 3 жыл бұрын
"I am not suggesting that"... I see what you did there... Mr CarBogans new and improved "IMO"... you gotta love this bloke 🤟
@Shanes_Shed
@Shanes_Shed 3 жыл бұрын
I'm another rhino platform owner - didn't realize there derating for off road. Mines fairly solidly bolted to the roof with the backbone so I'm not going to stress about it now (if it was a pop riveted version I'd be thinking differently). It's done plenty of trips to dingo piss creek like that already but I don't have a huge load up there anyway
@stephanusbouwer1971
@stephanusbouwer1971 3 жыл бұрын
Good rational advice! Bad for suppliers that are not upfront with their client, and future revenue!
@sbultitude-paull303
@sbultitude-paull303 3 жыл бұрын
I'm not a 4x4 owner, but the wind noise generated from roof-mounted accessories would drive me insane during the times they're not being utilised.
@mcduck5
@mcduck5 3 жыл бұрын
Plus the extra fuel usage, Ouchies!
@mcduck5
@mcduck5 3 жыл бұрын
@@oldbloke204 I'm in a similar boat, I am a fruit grower that really needs a ute but I don't want/need the hight and handling of modern utes. The old commadore and falcon utes are ideal but I can't see a replacement out there?
@oldbloke204
@oldbloke204 3 жыл бұрын
@@mcduck5 Yeah same reason people are buying 4wd wagons these days as the old school falcon/kingswood large wagons don't exist now. Maybe have a look at the single cab 2wd varieties from various makers. Not nearly as well advertised but they do exist, well last time I looked they did.
@njwithers
@njwithers 3 жыл бұрын
I had racks on my last vehicle, and only used them a few times per year. I removed them when not in use. Yes, the wind noise at 110kmh was pretty loud.
@oldbloke204
@oldbloke204 3 жыл бұрын
@@njwithers Fair call but I actually use mine off road and, at least for me, my MaxTrax have already saved the vehicle once and they go on every trip with me. I am happy to trade off a bit of noise and worse fuel economy but I hadn't expected to trade it off for so little.
@jeffkeech8786
@jeffkeech8786 3 жыл бұрын
Hi john love your work. Me not an engineer nor highly educated but think to my deterrent (peroberby) l'm reasonably sensible and yes I go to dingo piss creeks often and every time I do I try to keep all my cargo as low as possible. Have never run roof rack and never will
@harryrayeroux2345
@harryrayeroux2345 3 жыл бұрын
When I saw the " Rivets" again , this time I went for the fully welded ARB platform. Few years back I did get a Rhino Rack but bolted each panel with extra set screws fitted with Nylock nuts after it was fitted by the seller. That was ok carrying two full spares on it doing few nasty tracks.
@jamesop22
@jamesop22 3 жыл бұрын
When
@michaelswitzer8930
@michaelswitzer8930 3 жыл бұрын
Just actually picked up a Rhino catalogue and it does have statement in it regarding roof loading on/off road and static
@deanfawcett2085
@deanfawcett2085 3 жыл бұрын
Might be a (very) new addition?
@TheKnobCalledTone.
@TheKnobCalledTone. 3 жыл бұрын
My interpretation of Rhino's definition of "off-road" suggests that anyone living in a house with a gravel driveway would technically _never_ be able to use their vehicle's Rhino rack to its full capacity, as said driveway is deemed by Rhino as "off-road driving".
@darrenhale6320
@darrenhale6320 3 жыл бұрын
Do they mentioned tarred road? Concrete road? Gravel road? What is your definition of road?
@Beavereater84
@Beavereater84 2 жыл бұрын
@@darrenhale6320 Did you even watch the video?
@darrenhale6320
@darrenhale6320 2 жыл бұрын
@@Beavereater84 yes a year ago but I can’t remember it why the hell would I remember a video like this from a year ago?
@DukeVanRobinson
@DukeVanRobinson 3 жыл бұрын
i just bought myself a triton wank Chariot and Was an literally about to buy one of these This weekend. Definitely giving it a miss and going to read the fine print on my next purchase
@seabee167
@seabee167 3 жыл бұрын
Triton has 4 bolt down points under the rubber gutter strip. I've got cross bars and a flat tray attached, triton roof load is 80kg, cross bars and tray are about 15 -20 kg, so you'll be let with around 60kg to load up there.
@bruceparr1678
@bruceparr1678 3 жыл бұрын
I have found the best way to carry stuff on the roof is to weld on tie down points directly to the roof and then just tie the stuff down on to the roof. When the paint wears through and the metal starts to rust just slap on a few coats of galmet.
@yeahnahyeah9559
@yeahnahyeah9559 2 жыл бұрын
Had a Rhino Rack exactly the same. Was pop riveted on. It popped many rivets after 2 months. This was professionally installed. When i took it back they said they would re rivet it. We decided against that and drilled it out and put riv nuts in. No issues since and we have "overloaded" many times. Just arse covering from them.
@blarglemantheskeptic
@blarglemantheskeptic 3 жыл бұрын
I have a 2009 Navara that had a pair of Rhino bars attached via a pop riveted set of tracks. I replaced the bars with the exact flat rack shown, strapped the 2nd spare and the high lift jack to it, and of to the Telegraph Track the missus and I went! 👍🤪👍 When we get to Loyalty Beach I discovered that a heap of the rivets had let go. I borrowed a rivet gun, and re-riveted them, only to have these let go as well. I ended up ratchet strapping the rack in place until I got home. For noting - the corrugations on much of the development road were HORRENDOUS, some in excess of 10cm high. As such, the roof rack system was being subjected to hundreds of thousands of impulse accelerations, all attempting to pull the gently rounded mandrel and upset head of the rivet through the metal. I removed the rack when I got home to discover that the previous owner had had the same issue at least twice (but failed to disclose), and there were numerous holes in the roof. The cost of a panel shop repair was going to be thousands, so considering the options, I went with M6¹ *"nutserts"* to repair and reattach the tracks. I could bore out a number of the damaged holes to fit the nutserts, getting back to fresh metal. The large flat "grab" area at the back of the nutsert _SIGNIFICANTLY²_ increased the attachment strength over the pop rivet, and the nutserts are even available with a blind end in stainless steel, preventing water ingress. I then asked a _generous_ helping of adhesive mastic under the rails, gluing down the rail along is full length to the roof and sealing the water out of the unrepaired holes, then using domed hex drive bolts³ with silicon applied to the holes, I bolted it was back down. Since then, nothing has EVER looked like moving again. ADVICE: if you are planning on doing what I did, beg, borrow or steal a magdrill. Doing it with a stepped drill bit worked, mostly, but wobble trying to hold a hand drill steady means that your tolerances are messed up and the nutsert will not have the maximum grab. The magdrill will help avoid drilling the "side roof frame structure" (the internal structural roll cage). Also try to get the shortest nutserts you can for the same reason. ¹ Might have been M8 ² Nutsert manufacturers list _pull through_ strength in thin metal that is (from memory) at least an order of magnitude higher than pop rivets. ³ Had to grind the head smaller to fit in the track slot.
@Wdeane1957
@Wdeane1957 3 жыл бұрын
I had a Rhino mesh platform fitted by a Rhino re-seller to my MU-X and the wind noise was horrendous - like sitting behind a 747 at take off. I had to fit a wind deflector to the front (Yakima brand) and the wind noise has all but disappeared, and now I find that with Rhino's load limitations (not told to me by the place selling and fitting roof rack) I can carry about 20 kgs on the platform. I have an awning, solar panel, and couple of Treds - mainly stuff that won't fit in the car - there's my weight limit reached 🥴. Just as well I don't have plans for any heavy bulky stuff.
@kelvinjones7425
@kelvinjones7425 3 жыл бұрын
The reduction of load for off road and dirt road is most important. Too many decades ago I crossed the Nallabour in convoy when it was dirt. One of the vehicles was combi van fitted with a large and seemingly well constructed custom roof rack. The three girls driving this outfit loaded it wit everything imaginable. The rack showed no sign of stress on the tarmac . However on the dirt road soon failed at the weld joints of the tubular steel construction. These were the joints that came under stress which took sway loads. Side rolling on a cyclic basis caused the failure.
@markday5797
@markday5797 3 жыл бұрын
Good afternoon Mate.
@donbrackenreg2270
@donbrackenreg2270 2 жыл бұрын
Binge watching to catch up, so behind the times. I had previously watched All 4 Adventure fit three Rhinos to a DMax, a 75 and a 200, not once was it mentioned that rivets held the whole together. Just by watching their videos you would never know they had fitted rivets.
@johncitizen5377
@johncitizen5377 5 ай бұрын
That's incredible. The g forces applied to a 4wd on the sand can be incredible. I see these roof racks everywhere on Stockton Beach. Very scary stuff.
@kerrowmcgaw
@kerrowmcgaw 3 жыл бұрын
I had a cheap alloy full rack on my previous vehicle for ten years with zero issues. My new ute has a $1600 Rhino rack and the big difference is the massive increase in wind noise from the Rhino rack. Was warned against fitting the backbone system as it is difficult to feed the tie downs as you cant reach under the rack either.
@Wdeane1957
@Wdeane1957 3 жыл бұрын
I had a Rhino mesh platform fitted by a Rhino rre-seller to my MU-X and the wind noise was horrendous - like sitting behind a 747 at take off. I had to fit a wind deflector to the front (Yakima brand) and the wind noise has all but disappeared, and now I find that with Rhino's load limitations (not told to me by the place selling and fitting roof rack) I can carry about 20 kgs on the rack. I have an awning, solar panel, and couple of Treds - there's my weight limit reached 🥴
@adamsimpson2041
@adamsimpson2041 3 жыл бұрын
Don't try and feed straps underneath those platforms. You can get drop in eyelets that you can mount anywhere and just hook your straps to those. Will save you a lot of headaches.
@lesliedsouza4077
@lesliedsouza4077 3 жыл бұрын
Good Subject, John + comments :) One thing that comes up with some products - Not just Rhino rack: They Don't State Limitations on the Label. The buyer can only read instructions - After - He's Paid for - & opened the package :( Then the seller won't take it back - & Consumer Protection Won't Help :( They refer the plaintiff to some department that deals with product labelling :(
@kenezos
@kenezos 3 жыл бұрын
The face you made when you said racks should be held with pop rivets 😂😂
@Oosh21
@Oosh21 3 жыл бұрын
I bolted a 6kg wire mesh panel for $75 from Hammer Barn to my roof rack. It looks like arse but supports the roof bag full of relatively light stuff like bedding and clothes when we head to Dingo Piss Creek.
@ScottMurrayBestFamilyCars
@ScottMurrayBestFamilyCars 3 жыл бұрын
Did you also get a new pizza oven from Hammer Barn? #Bluey
@Oosh21
@Oosh21 3 жыл бұрын
@@ScottMurrayBestFamilyCars Nope. Nobody's gnome husband was injured either. Greatest kids show ever.
@tubby5006
@tubby5006 2 жыл бұрын
Thanks John, you saved me a heap of money. That said any recommendations for carrying the off road necessities, aka recovery gear?
@_bodgie
@_bodgie 3 жыл бұрын
This info should be part of the standard published specifications in my opinion. Putting it in the fitting instructions is trying to hide the product limitations but. I’m sure it helps sell more product.
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