Challenger Mid explains SHADOWFLAME VS VOIDSTAFF!!! MUST WATCH

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Zianni

Zianni

Күн бұрын

A guide to itemization for new and experienced players :3
Vex Written Guide
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Пікірлер: 136
@Zianni
@Zianni 2 жыл бұрын
Important things to note: S.F Components also do more damage as you're building towards the legendary. Shadowflame pen can be inconsistent as it's based on current health. +200 health is pog. Skipping Ludens = -11 Mpen Meaning your total penetration is instead 38 Mpen at two items with either legendary vs 50 MR. Voidstaff will require 65 MR to outperform at 38 MPen. You can't penetrate below 0 magic resist. Both Shadowflame/Void second item have 100% penetration vs 40-50MR with Ludens If you skip Ludens, early champs might REALLY need Shadowflame to bridge the damage gap. (Still go Void into tank teams) Shadowflame will do more damage until 60-65 MR making it very good as an early item / power spike unless their team's core builds has lots of MR itemization. Sometimes your champion does OVERKILL damage, instead of doing 300-400 OVERKILL with Shadowflame, you can instead opt for Voidstaff to get more damage in on tanks while still one shotting those squishy targets with full penetration. Some champions have very high AP ratios, making Shadowflame more valuable early.
@callmek186
@callmek186 Жыл бұрын
and then we have Anaethma Chains and Force of Nature for the true magic damage reduction, multiplicatively for a total of 47.5% magic damage reduction. hard to by pass it since most damage increase modifiers are "Post mitigated damage" but the only pre-mitigation item for mages is Riftmaker.
@samuelneves8208
@samuelneves8208 2 жыл бұрын
"TOO LONG DIDN'T WATCH"?? my brother in Christ I'd like to watch more videos like this one comparing items and theory crafting. You are very good at these. Even in the gameplay videos you try to give reasons why you build X item and talk about the stat efficiency. It's unlucky they take way more effort to make and get less reward. keep it up bud
@Zianni
@Zianni 2 жыл бұрын
Thanks for the encouragement, I'll keep creating :sunglasses: ty for watching
@AltheaGray24
@AltheaGray24 Жыл бұрын
honestly pretty short video, loved it. straight to point and you used many reference pictures to get ur point across which really helps me as i am a visual learner. thank you so much!
@claudiumoise7287
@claudiumoise7287 2 жыл бұрын
Wow nice guide, i never know when to go either void or shadow. You should do more content like this, with your help i got to d3 with ori! Another vid u could do would be zhonya vs banshee(i know one gives u mr and the other armor but i’d be curious to think how their actives impact the game and the opportunity cost)
@Zianni
@Zianni 2 жыл бұрын
Thanks for the kind words and the suggestion!
@lesbazyra
@lesbazyra Жыл бұрын
Banshee is usually useless vs junglers. Why? They have a broken blue smite... And ap champions have luden/comet or protobelt. So Yeah. If you wanna survive Evelynn's burst, you gotta play HG and outplay her R. The sad thing is that banshee is better on assassins. WP rito.
@GamingXCentre
@GamingXCentre 11 ай бұрын
These item comparisons are so informative. More of this bro
@TheDracopire
@TheDracopire 2 жыл бұрын
Very nicely structured! Well done man.
@Zianni
@Zianni 2 жыл бұрын
Thank u king
@joelochoa2770
@joelochoa2770 2 жыл бұрын
Awesome guide! It'd be nice to have more content like this
@Zianni
@Zianni 2 жыл бұрын
Thanks, appreciate it.
@FakeDessert
@FakeDessert 2 жыл бұрын
I'm thankful for the algorithm that brought me on this channel, great informative content !!
@Zianni
@Zianni 2 жыл бұрын
Thanks for the kind words, and for watching!
@brandonmena7565
@brandonmena7565 Жыл бұрын
We all waiting content like this and u are the first KZfaqr that give us that IMPORTANT info
@JungGeumbi
@JungGeumbi Жыл бұрын
briliant video. Thanks for explaining with images and stats.
@chojinacd
@chojinacd 6 ай бұрын
THANKS! This helps a lot!
@mylynguyen6512
@mylynguyen6512 Жыл бұрын
That is a rly interesting video ! Thanks you 🥰🤩
@xTheTamingx
@xTheTamingx Жыл бұрын
Thanks for this. I suck at LoL and know I'll never be good, but the thing I NEVER tried to learn was items and builds. I always just follow the stupid recommend items. I love your channel keep up the amazing work!
@Zianni
@Zianni Жыл бұрын
Glad you found this video helpful, the next one is on Corruption Potion vs Dorans Ring so hopefully that helps too!
@helphel2929
@helphel2929 Жыл бұрын
I’m pretty new to League and I’m just getting realising the can of worms that are item builds. Videos like this, explaining what items to build and why, are great. Pls do more
@Zianni
@Zianni Жыл бұрын
Welcome to League! Hope you enjoy your experience
@MrRudeBird
@MrRudeBird 2 жыл бұрын
Leaving a comment and like because you asked for it on your stream. Didn't think I'd watch the video but I ended up sitting through it and now I feel like I learned something important that I'll never use since I don't play League! Very solid video though!
@Zianni
@Zianni 2 жыл бұрын
HAHA good job escaping the clutches of league :3
@Silveriolol
@Silveriolol Жыл бұрын
Loved the guide!
@Zianni
@Zianni Жыл бұрын
Thanks!
@DenBeyer
@DenBeyer 2 жыл бұрын
Didnt watch - went into dept to get deathcap on first item. Another great vid XD
@Zianni
@Zianni 2 жыл бұрын
HAHA GREAT
@Cc8R8
@Cc8R8 2 жыл бұрын
Thank you gang!!
@Zianni
@Zianni 2 жыл бұрын
Thank you for watching
@REIVAJ2194
@REIVAJ2194 2 жыл бұрын
Great video, super helpful
@Zianni
@Zianni 2 жыл бұрын
Thanks, appreciate it! 🙏
@redwingchronicle7974
@redwingchronicle7974 2 жыл бұрын
Thanks for this video, I always struggle to know what I should be building. I will probably be taking void staff more often 😅
@redwingchronicle7974
@redwingchronicle7974 2 жыл бұрын
I always thought void staff was an add on to shadowflame
@Zianni
@Zianni 2 жыл бұрын
They both have their pros/cons, its just too many people build Shadowflame even when its bad contextually in a game. It's also great in a lot of games. Voidstaff into tankier drafts can be infinitely more value and open up more item choices. You can definitely build both, it just depends on your core build and the enemies. You would build Voidstaff as your 4th item onwards if you need the extra pen.
@callmetravesty8762
@callmetravesty8762 3 ай бұрын
Don't know why but the term "Losing to shopkeeper" makes me chuckle.
@minttruffles5525
@minttruffles5525 2 жыл бұрын
Can you do a video on lissandra? Also thanks for this amazing video on the item difference.
@raviranjan-fi2du
@raviranjan-fi2du Жыл бұрын
How much pen does that ivern build has at 5:08
@peagua
@peagua Жыл бұрын
thanks for the video!
@Zianni
@Zianni Жыл бұрын
My pleasure!
@yeen.7209
@yeen.7209 8 ай бұрын
unrelated question, is it possible that you're a fan of library of ruina/project moon's games?
@sebestyenviktor4316
@sebestyenviktor4316 2 жыл бұрын
Thx for this guide I wouldn't have tought it's sometimes worth to build void 2nd. Somewhere i heard that sometimes void gives you more damage than deathcap as a 3rd/4rth item, but i don't know how much mr should the enemies have for that.
@Zianni
@Zianni 2 жыл бұрын
Voidstaff gives an extra 25% damage at 100 MR. Rabadons will give you more raw damage, but it's a bit more expensive and delays your magic penetration if you haven't build any yet.
@Divinicus1er
@Divinicus1er 3 ай бұрын
When he says second or third item, does he count boots as first item?
@YukiChanC
@YukiChanC Жыл бұрын
tysm for the video
@cameronsmith9562
@cameronsmith9562 7 ай бұрын
Is there a time when it's optimal to build Shadowflame early, with the intention to sell it around level 13/14 for Void Staff? Or would it be better overall to just play for the long game with Voidstaff in those situations?
@Artur.G.
@Artur.G. Жыл бұрын
Thanks man greetings from Germany
@JulitoRM
@JulitoRM Жыл бұрын
Can I build Shadowflame + Morello + Horizon at the same time?
@FunnyVideos-bs5zr
@FunnyVideos-bs5zr Жыл бұрын
Hi! I recently have been debating these two items as Annie and I found this video really helpful!! If you don’t mind, I have 2 follow up questions: 1) seems like, since champs at lv 11 have ~50MR, then naturally at lv 13+, void staff will be Beter then SF due to the champ having higher MR, is that correct? 2) Also if the enemy builds any mr ,even if it’s just enemy having merc boots, then void is just better at lv 12+, is that correct?
@Zianni
@Zianni Жыл бұрын
1) Yes, Void Staff has more value the longer the games goes. Just because it has theoretically more value later, doesn't mean its better if the game ends at 25-30 minutes. 2) It depends on how many targets have built MR, if you're itemizing Voidstaff for (1-2) player it's not entirely optimal but doable. If it's 3+ players, yes.
@jdell64
@jdell64 Жыл бұрын
Sorry this is so much later... I did the math myself... not sure if I did it right, but the "magic number" for MR came out to 112 (for just gold efficiency). Is that just incredibly wrong?
@minhducnguyen9276
@minhducnguyen9276 Жыл бұрын
My question is which style is more suitable for which champion? I known two way for ap champs to build. SF not only gives ap and magic pen it also gives health which scale with demonic embrace. So I end up with two buid paths: luden> SF> Demonic embrace> rylai scepter> deathcap or luden> SF> horizon focus/ cosmic drive > void> deathcap. Both of them can smash squishies easily but for champion using damage over time as their main source like singed or teemo ( on teemo I'd change rylai to morellonomicon for anti-healing) I don't really know which one is more suitable.
@Zianni
@Zianni Жыл бұрын
Every champ has a core itemization that suits their identity, this is more for those who play penetration builds on mages. Voidstaff will always be better than SF if you're building either of these as your third item. SF is strictly better as an early second item for Champs who want to snowball or impact the game early. Voidstaff of course is still better against teams that build MR early
@aemi_sa
@aemi_sa 2 жыл бұрын
hey zianni i would like to learn how to git gud. is it just learning all matchups? i could need info on how to close games. thats the single biggest issue in low elo. how to acess the game and what to do to end before min 50. thanks
@Zianni
@Zianni 2 жыл бұрын
The easiest step to improving is focusing on your fundamentals which is laning phase / laning mechanics. Understanding what champions do is super helpful, but if you're not applying the basics then you don't actually understand the matchup.
@kidzniper4082
@kidzniper4082 10 ай бұрын
But wait, when you hover over Shadowflame in-game, it says that the enemy needs to have a minimum of 2500 HP for the minimum penatration to take effect. Does this mean it's useless against squishy targets who build no MR? Or does the raw stats justify it?
@kekshy4175
@kekshy4175 10 ай бұрын
thank you
@colsiqt5804
@colsiqt5804 2 жыл бұрын
nice vid! I like how you think so I don't have to lol
@aemi_sa
@aemi_sa 2 жыл бұрын
ah another quick question is cpot - chapter - tear okay? or always tear on first base as ori? and is seraphs a must every game? thanks
@Zianni
@Zianni 2 жыл бұрын
Starting item is contextual D Ring for survivability + damage with Aery C Pot or tear first item for scaling or waveclear match up - C Pot if trading involved, Tear if just pure waveclear. Seraphs is usually always built as second or third item. My common builds are Ludens > Seraphs > Voidstaff Ludens > Shadowflame > Seraphs Liandrys > Seraphs > Voidstaff/Rabadons Liandrys > Voidstaff > Seraphs
@Zianni
@Zianni 2 жыл бұрын
To add on, you need tear or seraphs for the extra 600-860 mana or you'll run out of mana near instantly since your cooldowns are 2-4 secs each
@aemi_sa
@aemi_sa 2 жыл бұрын
@@Zianni thank you so much! ^^
@Sim2500
@Sim2500 Жыл бұрын
how does the shield part in shadowflame work? does it counter shield spamming teams?
@Zianni
@Zianni Жыл бұрын
Shadowflame gives you max item pen (20) against shielded targets which is basically irrelevant to be honest
@copyleft2880
@copyleft2880 2 жыл бұрын
Low elo noob question. Is it ever viable to build both void AND shadow flame? I would have to swap high ap ratio itens like death cap or mejai.
@Zianni
@Zianni 2 жыл бұрын
This is tackled in the opportunity cost section, but it'd likely be your fourth item. Ludens > Shadowflame > Zhonyas OR Rabadon > Voidstaff would be the realistic progression you'd see (This is where they don't build MR until much later like 4th item themselves) Going Shadowflame -> Voidstaff means you're typically overcapping on penetration vs a few targets and isn't as gold effecient. If your champ requires ZHONYAS or SERAPHS to function in team fights it can be hard to build this particular way without losing too much in return.
@LecherousLizard
@LecherousLizard Жыл бұрын
In short: You don't want to do it. Currently a setup of Luden's+Void Staff+Sorcs does true damage to every champion below 74MR (assuming full build for the purpose of Luden's m.pen passive), meaning getting Shadowflame becomes nothing more than an overpriced 100AP stick. What you should use in place of Shadowflame is something like Horizon Focus, Cosmic Drive, etc.
@gamerscommunityletsplay7819
@gamerscommunityletsplay7819 Жыл бұрын
ekko is better with lich bane or shadow flame in 2º item?
@Zianni
@Zianni Жыл бұрын
Lichbane synergizes better with your champ identity
@Twenbe
@Twenbe 2 жыл бұрын
I always play vex with dark harvest or arcane comet depends if I can abuse in lane I go for comet
@Zianni
@Zianni 2 жыл бұрын
Dark Harvest / Comet are both niche runes that are actively playing against your win condition. You only run Comet in your worst match ups typically (Long ranged waveclear) If you're playing against Melee / Counter match ups like (Kat/Yone/Yasuo/Akali) etc and you're not taking Electrocute, you are handicapping yourself.
@tinycloud99
@tinycloud99 2 жыл бұрын
Thank you daddy 💗
@Zianni
@Zianni 2 жыл бұрын
😅
@smoke_ttg4842
@smoke_ttg4842 Жыл бұрын
Bro how are you the most intelligent person on this stuff , i must just be a noob < Silver > but you just helped me so much ! thanks bro
@Zianni
@Zianni Жыл бұрын
Glad to help, thanks for watching :3
@saiyza6730
@saiyza6730 2 жыл бұрын
Never really thought about using Void staff if my opponent is melee. Wondering about Yasuo since he's melee but tends to skip on the mr
@Zianni
@Zianni 2 жыл бұрын
You can always google "champion name fandom" and the first link will be their stats + skills so you can check yourself. Yasuo for example has 50 MR at level 11 so it's not as pivotal.
@karthizzle7340
@karthizzle7340 Жыл бұрын
Why u a talking bear with a crown tho? Great vid
@DetectiveCosteauRCM
@DetectiveCosteauRCM 2 жыл бұрын
So void staff as a second item is a good option but it simply starts to perform better later on (when the context is fitting for it) if I understood correctly.
@Zianni
@Zianni 2 жыл бұрын
Voidstaff outperforms SF at 60 MR with penetration build, but I already have full pen VS their squishies. Voidstaff here is just 100% better than SF.
@LecherousLizard
@LecherousLizard Жыл бұрын
One thing to consider is that Rabadon gives much more AP, which allows you to clear waves more efficiently, so you should prioritize that over Void Staff if the enemy isn't building MR (yet). Not to mention Shadowflame becomes a waste of a slot later.
@Phxmenhp
@Phxmenhp Жыл бұрын
This little bear has such a deep voice huh
@waifuconnoisseur4872
@waifuconnoisseur4872 Жыл бұрын
Is it ever justified to buy shadowflame second when the enemy team hasnt bought mr yet and then getting void staff later when they have, or is it bad to build both generally?
@matracox5740
@matracox5740 Жыл бұрын
Yes, choose one
@matracox5740
@matracox5740 Жыл бұрын
I mean yes its bad
@LifeForAiur
@LifeForAiur 2 жыл бұрын
Love you
@Zianni
@Zianni 2 жыл бұрын
love u more
@altazmaul51
@altazmaul51 Жыл бұрын
thx
@Zianni
@Zianni Жыл бұрын
No ty
@nockcraftg.6798
@nockcraftg.6798 Жыл бұрын
you didnt say anything about the after shielded bonus on shadowflame did you?
@nockcraftg.6798
@nockcraftg.6798 Жыл бұрын
would be nice to hear about that regarding the ''Maw Bug'' at worlds last night and i was hoping for an answer in this video
@Zianni
@Zianni Жыл бұрын
The shield bonus is so useless it might as well not exist
@nockcraftg.6798
@nockcraftg.6798 Жыл бұрын
@@Zianni okay thanks
@Elgamed1
@Elgamed1 Жыл бұрын
anyone was like damn im bad when he said ( low elo "below diamond" )
@Zianni
@Zianni Жыл бұрын
Its all relative :3
@anabaciu3182
@anabaciu3182 2 жыл бұрын
POGGERS
@Zianni
@Zianni 2 жыл бұрын
PogChamp
@iAbod100
@iAbod100 Жыл бұрын
So in most of the games, don’t buy Shadow flame
@Zianni
@Zianni Жыл бұрын
Shadowflame spikes faster and makes it easier to snowball, but falls off post 25 minutes. So it has tangible value, it just depends when you're building penetration. Carry mids typically build Shadowflame very early, whereas Control Mages go seraphs second right now which makes Void third pretty much always better due to time stamps.
@cc1drt
@cc1drt 20 күн бұрын
tl;dr ? and its actually too the point and not fluff? goat
@lesbazyra
@lesbazyra Жыл бұрын
Exactly. I am tired of boosted AP players. They never understand simple math. One cheap item can easily ruin your flat pene. (I hate you -> Mercury Boots) In 90% of cases, you need void staff for penetration. I play mid Zyra. And whenever I see people picking more ap in my team, I get mad. Especially, if they start building Shadowflame over Void. WHY? Why do you want to lose the game?! You just bought an expensive 100 ap. WP. There is no reason to build Shadowflame vs double mr items (merc + hexdrinker or maw...). Just go for Raba + void. I hate pro builds. Sheep cannot build on their own. My build is usually the same. Liandry -> Void - > Raba. Sometimes I build HG, Demon, or Banshee. I rarely have an enemy who's building only armor. Very rarely. On top of that, Zyra has a really low ap scale. Plants have a 0.15% scale. KEKW.
@Idk-vg2qc
@Idk-vg2qc 2 жыл бұрын
What about akali what do you think Is the best
@Zianni
@Zianni 2 жыл бұрын
Akali typically goes Shadowflame for the raw AP and health. Of course building VS into the proper teams is still important.
@Idk-vg2qc
@Idk-vg2qc 2 жыл бұрын
@@Zianni thank you so much omg you’re so active also can you recommend me weapons for her for the best output
@Rubix-Qube
@Rubix-Qube Жыл бұрын
thanks meow
@PinkeySuavo
@PinkeySuavo Жыл бұрын
0:23 why you assume shadowflame gives 20 pene if it is dependent on enemy hp? It is 10 pene + 1 per every (-150) enemy's hp as far as I know
@Zianni
@Zianni Жыл бұрын
After the first spell or into a shield, you're basically hitting threshold immediately. Average champion has like 1.7-2K hp at level 13.
@francobuzzetti9424
@francobuzzetti9424 2 жыл бұрын
all good and dandy but why am i getting constantly winked at by a bear?
@Zianni
@Zianni 2 жыл бұрын
Why not ;)
@HarpieLady683
@HarpieLady683 2 жыл бұрын
Dad! Should I get Shadow Flame instead of Void staff as a last item? Cuz I just can't build it as a first item, I play TF and naturally I build RFC, Lich Bane, Mythic, Boots, Rabbadon(not in that order) but I always doubt about going Void staff or Shadowflame last. Anyone else could help me with this too?
@Zianni
@Zianni 2 жыл бұрын
Voidstaff is 10x better as last item yes
@vojisvavseselj
@vojisvavseselj Жыл бұрын
bruh, im 10 sec into the vid and im fkin stunned by ur majestic voice. Trully jealous
@Zianni
@Zianni Жыл бұрын
Ty friend, appreciate it
@nathanielle494
@nathanielle494 2 жыл бұрын
thank you dad 🥰
@Zianni
@Zianni 2 жыл бұрын
no thank u
@nathanielle494
@nathanielle494 2 жыл бұрын
@@Zianni too kind; might i ask whether you have any interest in playing seraphine rn? if so, i'm sure to watch your sera gameplay in an instant 🥰
@Zianni
@Zianni 2 жыл бұрын
@@nathanielle494 I enjoy playing seraphine I just don't get ADC too often + she's perma banned in high elo rn :(
@nathanielle494
@nathanielle494 2 жыл бұрын
@@Zianni i think she's getting a micro-patch nerf; hope to see your seraphine one day tho :3
@jenericjoe7565
@jenericjoe7565 2 жыл бұрын
“Lose to shopkeeper” 💀
@Zianni
@Zianni 2 жыл бұрын
Boris is OP
@sauracifer3557
@sauracifer3557 2 жыл бұрын
i honestly prefer building cassiopeia against tanky enemy teams
@Zianni
@Zianni 2 жыл бұрын
Drafting a good champ for each situation is always a plus, but itemizing is equally as important 👌
@sauracifer3557
@sauracifer3557 2 жыл бұрын
@@Zianni true im just salty i cant oneshot enemy adc anymore
@ltzLegit
@ltzLegit 2 жыл бұрын
Hmm I think you just build shadowflame every time, cooler icon and name.
@Zianni
@Zianni 2 жыл бұрын
Exactly.
@cro4891
@cro4891 2 жыл бұрын
so i go void staff on vex got it 👍
@Zianni
@Zianni 2 жыл бұрын
Did u watch the video
@cro4891
@cro4891 2 жыл бұрын
@@Zianni lmao yes it was very helpful
@FakeDessert
@FakeDessert 2 жыл бұрын
Also I'm not sure where you're from, your name is a very common last name where I'm from
@Zianni
@Zianni 2 жыл бұрын
I'm from the US, I got my name from a book that was inspired I believe by the name of Venetian doge Ziani?
@fatherofpearl5456
@fatherofpearl5456 Жыл бұрын
It’s kinda hot when he calls me a fucking low elo player….
@aurah8245
@aurah8245 Жыл бұрын
For your intro it's kind of off. Talon has the highest base mr in the game with akali being the 2nd highest (39 and 37). Practically every other champ is 32 with some being 30-28 And very few below that. Also for your v50 and v60 mr testing. Voidstaff did more 16 dmg against 60 mr than 50 mr while shadowflame fell 152 dmg? Most likely an auto being missed on one of the combos. Your combo also isn't super good as you are shoving everything into it at once rather than doing solid testing because you can barely see the auto attack she declares.
@Zianni
@Zianni Жыл бұрын
ngl man, this comment was super cringe please do not engage with my content anymore
@aurah8245
@aurah8245 Жыл бұрын
@@Zianni Helps when you make these vids to be accurate man 🙃
@Zianni
@Zianni Жыл бұрын
@@aurah8245 1) Who cares if Talon has highest base MR 2) Average champ MR is irrelevant because its a variable based on pick / shard / growth stats 3) Early MR has more value because the less you have, the more efficient it is 4) Mpen has more value the more you have / less MR they have. 6 mpen vs 10 MR is much more valuable than 10 mpen vs 20 mr. 5) There are no autos in the combos 6) The 60 MR damages were 93 off, not 152. Even if you were saying between 50 - 60 for same build, it was like 70. This is again related to point 3/4. Additionally, all champs have different base damages / scalings making Magic Pen more or less valuable. (I.E. Why we see Combat Mages build Seraphs) I absolutely hate reading your garbage comments.
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