Could Sauron Sense Bilbo Using the One Ring? Middle-earth Explained

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3 ай бұрын

We know that the Nazgûl were drawn to Frodo when he used the One Ring… so why wasn’t Bilbo caught in all the time he had it? Could Sauron sense his use of the Ring? Let’s take a look! Thank you all so much for watching, let me know your thoughts on this in the comments below! As always, a great thanks to the online artists whose visual works made this video possible! If you are one of the artists, please let me know and I will post your name and a link to your work in this description!
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Пікірлер: 122

@SekuACDC 3 ай бұрын

I don’t think Sauron was able to passively sense the Ring. He had to actively search for it, bending his will towards it. The only times when Sauron really senses the Ring are: 1) when Frodo wears at Amon Hen and then looks directly at Barad-dur while sitting on the Hill of Vision 2) when Frodo claims the Ring for himself at the crack of doom. So while he is at the centre of Sauron’s reign and at the source of his power, Frodo not only wears the Ring but claims it, declaring himself as a rival Lord of the Ring which immediately draws the attention of the true Lord of the Rings. Before and during the events of the Hobbit Sauron was looking for the Ring in the vales of the Anduin because he knew that’s where historically Isildur had been ambushed and perished. There are even times when Sauron receives misinformation on the location of the Ring, like when he thought that Saruman had captured the halfling carrying it or when Aragorn challenged Sauron through the Palantir of Orthanc. Why Sauron doesn’t sense Sam, is stated by the narrator, the borders of Mordor are protected by a veil of darkness that Sauron made to prevent others to spy on his land and this shadow blocks view from both sides (“oft evil will shall evil mar”). Similarly I don’t think the Nazgul know every time that the Ring is used or worn, they are drawn to it and when they are close to it they can sense that “something is wrong”, like when Frodo is at the gate of Minas Morgul. At Bree it was probably the squint-eyed southerner, Bill Ferny and the gatekeeper that told the Nazgul where to go, while at the Tower of Cirith Ungol it was the Watchers and the bell to summon the winged Nazgul. I know, I have written an unnecessary long comment, but if I weren’t such a big LotR dork I wouldn’t be here watching this video.

@oIJustForFunIo 3 ай бұрын

I like your comment more than the video!

@LangstonDev 3 ай бұрын

This was really well explained. Thank you for the perfectly necessary long comment!

@rhiannoncollins3042 3 ай бұрын

That’s what I thought. It was as though they really had to pay attention to it. I imagine it was like a quiet voice they really had to strain to hear and if they were distracted, they’d miss it.

@Jayjay-qe6um 3 ай бұрын

Smaug: There is something about you. Something you carry, something made of gold... but far more PRECIOUS...

@oIJustForFunIo 3 ай бұрын

Is this in the book?

@dustwyrm 3 ай бұрын

@@oIJustForFunIo No

@korgclips868 Ай бұрын

@@oIJustForFunIo Not sure but Smaug does say this to bilbo in the movies

@kaidorade1317 3 ай бұрын

Because he was thin..like butter stretched over too much bread. But seriously! Thank you! I’ve wondered this for decades

@geviesanta3631 3 ай бұрын

That just made my day. Thanks! so much

@expred 3 ай бұрын

hahahaha thank you

@CorpusCrispy 3 ай бұрын

That’s one of my favorite lines. It’s so relatable

@socialaccount0000 3 ай бұрын

If Sam could resist the temptation of the ring, I imagine, with Sauron weaker during the events of The Hobbit, that Bilbo may have just considered the whispers in his head to be simple selfish thoughts and nothing magical. Something along the lines of: "You're a simple Hobbit, not a burglar! We should flee, leave this Dragon's den and return home to a nice cup of tea. Keep the ring, it's a worthy souvenir in of itself!" "No no, I mustn't do that. My home will be there when I return, I must be brave even if for a moment."

@concept5631 3 ай бұрын

Good thought

@HPugwash 3 ай бұрын

Can you imagine Bilbo just runs away with the ring 😂 Couple years later Gandalf rocks up in the shire banging on his door "BILBO BAGGINS YOU LITTLE GIT! GET OUT HERE NOW" Then Bilbo runs away with the ring turning into another Gollum

@concept5631 3 ай бұрын

@@HPugwash Implying Bilbo could find a place he could hide from Gandalf

@HPugwash 3 ай бұрын

@@concept5631 Gandalf doesn't have Sauron's or the Nazgul's ability to see people when they wear the ring though

@nicodemusedwards6931 3 ай бұрын

I mean… Bilbo and Golumn never got shanked by a magic knife that turns people into ghosts. And while yeah, said Morgul Knife got removed, it still affected Frodo in the anniversary of the stabbing. So it’s POSSIBLE that the power woven into the blade somewhat “aggravated” the effects of the One Ring on Frodo.

@miahconnell23 3 ай бұрын

Did Elrond and his healers get 100% of the blade fragments out ?

@istari0 3 ай бұрын

Gandalf said that Sauron first believed the Elves had destroyed the One Ring and even once he realized, like Saruman, that it had been lost when Isildur was slain, thought it lost in the Anduin. Sauron may have never known Bilbo had possessed the One Ring until Gollum was captured and tortured into revealing what he knew and by then Bilbo had given it up. As far as Sam's use of the Ring goes, Sauron may have sensed something unusual but not realized what it was; this would fit with his belief that the Free Peoples would use the Ring against him.

@oscca7756 3 ай бұрын

I think it comes down to tactics. If the ring has a will of it's own, that will aligns with the will of Sauron, and the ring wants to get back to its master, it would probably bide its time until an opportunity arises. It wouldn't want to risk being found by someone who could dominate it, so Sauron would need to be strong enough. Gollum kept it *safe* for an immense period of time, hidden from the istari and the elves, and it left him when Sauron was getting back some power as the Necromancer. It didn't pull its full influence on Bilbo, because doing so would have revealed it to Gandalf too early, when Sauron was still rebuilding his power in Mordor. But then Bilbo leaves and gives the ring to Frodo, and Gandalf figures out what it is, and Sauron is getting ready to rise. So it chooses to reveal itself, to the extent it is able to do so. So this is at least how I've always understood it. The ring works to get back, with what means it has, but sometimes that only means "wait".

@orrointhewise87 3 ай бұрын

"Never put it on." Interesting; so the knowledge or cognitive realization of knowing that it's the one ring further affects the bearer and when they wear it it makes them more easily detected. Makes sense to me, the evil u know holds a weight on your mind and heart more so than one u do not. I accept this explanation 😂

@FantasticExplorers 3 ай бұрын

Man I love that you've never changed the name of your channel! So many KZfaqrs have now... I hope you stay Men of the West forever!

@zenguru79 3 ай бұрын

I heard the Tolkien estate went after many of the KZfaq channels that had LOR related names and content forcing them to change their names.

@agustingomez1575 3 ай бұрын

@@zenguru79 "oh, hello there, mr. lawyer! I've followed this channel for quite some time and I have it on good authority that the name "Men of the west" reffers to San Francisco, as in Village People's song, and is not at all related to Middle Earth, I pinky swear!" Now I'm curious as to what channels had to change its name, and whether it's a recent thing and I didn't notice, or if it happened before I first came across LOTR related content on KZfaq.

@kaidorade1317 3 ай бұрын

@@agustingomez1575 same here

@zenguru79 3 ай бұрын

@@agustingomez1575 I recall the History of the Ages channel had legal trouble with the Tolken estate for reading some of Tolken’s work online. That channel got deleted and later came back as The Broken Sword. I think that went down in 2021. I vaguely remember hearing about some other channels having similar issues but too much time has past to recall all the details.

@agustingomez1575 3 ай бұрын

@@zenguru79 oh, so it was before, then! I only ever knew his channel as The Broken Sword.

@OtherWorldExplorers 3 ай бұрын

Always chalked it up that sauron was only getting stronger as the story went along. While gollum had it he was barely hanging in there. When Bilbo found it a little bit stronger but not enough. And so forth. Also being distracted by the war that was going on may have distracted a momentarily from the exact knowledge of where the ring was or how close it may have been. Just my theory. But I would hope not I'm a little sick so I didn't proofread this any mistakes I hope we're humorous.

@AndrewCarlisle11B 3 ай бұрын

Thanks for featuring my question, Yoystan! Working on my Masters degree is keeping me busy but I'm sick right now and able to catch up on videos.

@slicerneons3300 3 ай бұрын

Maybe if Sauron hasd two eyes he would have noticed! 😅

@teemusid 3 ай бұрын

He had no depth perception! The answer was too simple for a learned loremaster...

@CybeleCotter 3 ай бұрын

Sauron's Eye was not like that of Randall Flagg in Stephen King's "The Stand"; it did not "travel" to spy on others at a distance, but was more limited to its location in either Dol Guldur or Barad-dur.

@upschutt4842 3 ай бұрын

That is one of the questions that really makes one think. Thank you for your awesome work :) God bless you

@Comicnut64 3 ай бұрын

Excellent video Yoystan I’ve wondered this myself

@saladinbob 3 ай бұрын

I think a better question is why did Tolkien not attempt to square the circle between the two books? Given the man was such a perfectionist in all aspects of the lore its strange how he never attempted to provide an explanation for this very question.

@allenrussell1947 3 ай бұрын

6:47 I think that Sauron was not aware of it having been found until Gollum was captured and tortured for information in Mordor. His focus had been on the Anduin River valley. So, while Bilbo had it he wasn't even looking for it, at least not west of the Misty Mountains. Not until Gollum told him of losing to Bilbo of the Shire did he start looking in that direction. And he didn't even know where the Shire was located. His Nazgul were only a few yards away from the ring when one was questioning the Gaffer Gamgee and still did not sense it's nearness. Unless it is worn it is apparently very vague to the enemy.

@Sleepy.Time. 3 ай бұрын

without Gollum giving away the location of the Shire it didn't seem like Sauron had any clue of the Rings whereabouts

@Apollo1989V 3 ай бұрын

Unlike in the movies, Sauron never actually perceived Frodo and those who wore the Ring until it was too late. He verily nearly caught Frodo when Frodo gaze was drawn to Barud dur. The Ring sent out a homing like signal to nearby agents of Sauron when it was worn. When Frodo wore the ring in Bree, some of the Nazgûl detected its usage, leading to try to ambush Frodo on Weatherop. When Bilbo used the Ring before Frodo set out, Sauron was unaware about the Ring being in the Shire nor did he know where the Shire was. During the Hobbit, Sauron was in the position to be looking for it yet.

@ajsmusic711 3 ай бұрын

fantastic vid :) love that you’re still going strong

@shadowofchaos8932 3 ай бұрын

What if Sauron invaded the Shire after Gollum revealed the location of the one ring?

@DD-fj2ut 3 ай бұрын

He sent the Nazgûl to search for “Baggins”. Frodo leaving the Shire just in time, almost…

@gregdingel 3 ай бұрын

I don't think Sauron knew that the ring had been found until Gollum was captured and tortured in Mordor. And distance must certainly play a part. The Nine were all in the Bree area when Frodo used it there. And we know that Sauron, although very powerful, could not pay attention everywhere at once. That was the whole point of the battle of the Black Gate - to distract Sauron and give Sam and Frodo a chance to get to Mount Doom.

@tefnenes3426 3 ай бұрын

Interesting my friend, i always thought that when using the one ring in the mirkwood level from the hobbit video game that will it draw the nazgul in :) ahh good times.

@dianecohen8876 3 ай бұрын

while both smeagol and bilbo were attached to and coveted the one ring they had no desire for power or dominion over anything - they just wanted to possess the ring at the time they were parted from it. perhaps part of the ring's influence was strengthened by the fundamental desire of the one who possessed it. additionally, sauron had not reached his full strength and corporeal form. that gave bilbo time to play with the ring and not be fully overtaken by it as he was still able to be persuaded by gandalf - although reluctantly - to leave the ring behind for frodo.

@joshuaprice1 3 ай бұрын

Using the ring causes you to enter the wraith world where you can be seen by other wraiths. Frodo was seen on Amon Hem because that seat was magical and allowed viewers to see further. Otherwise, there is no instance until Frodo claimed the ring in Mount Doom that Sauron actually detected the ring being worn (in the books).

@user-mb1hg4qu9f 3 ай бұрын

One of the (many) charms of Tolkiens writings is that they left us with many unanswered questions, both large and small. 😊

@user-sd7ri9fy4i 3 ай бұрын

Nice work dude thanks

@Dragondan1987 3 ай бұрын

I always wrote off the ring in the hobbit as it hiding from Smaug since Smaug isn’t bound to Sauron. Sauron’s essence in the ring might of sensed another great evil and went into a hibernation to avoid the detection of things stronger/comparative strength to its master. Like the ring wants to be found later, because it sensed last major threat to it getting back to its master was gone. It explains why it was hidden for so long, it was waiting for all the other great evils that could potential use Sauron’s essence to enslave him.

@tobitsubasa274 3 ай бұрын

I don't know if anyone's already stated this, but In the animated Lord of the Rings Return of the Kings movie, Frodo says that Bilbo's innocence protected him from the corruption of the ring. It probably also shiled him from the dark lords site. I think that this could also explain why Sam was protected as well, he was a very simple hobbit after all. Also, as far as I know, Sam is the only person other than Tom to be able to overpower the will of the ring. At that moment, his will was stronger than even Sarons, thus hiding the ring from his gaze. But hay, that's just my opinion.

@daviddunn8095 3 ай бұрын

I always thought the Nazgul went to the tower of Cirith Ungol because the commanders there had sent a report advising of the hobbit's capture, not because Sauron sensed the ring or it being used by anyone.

@marionbaggins 3 ай бұрын

Man this was an interesting question then and now...And I am still trying to Theorizes!!! Thanks Mellon for Exploring this Topic, Until the War of Drawves vs Ents... *(Their Parents aren't going to be too happy, and this was a War?!!!)* Marion Baggins Out!!!

@TomsBackyardWorkshop 3 ай бұрын

When the Hobbit was written the ring was just a magic ring. Tolkien came up The One Ring later. There was no link to Sauron at that time.

@danielfiene7770 3 ай бұрын

While Gollum, Bilbo and Sam only ever used the Ring for stealth, I've seen arguments that Frodo was - intentionally or not - starting to unlock some of its other powers. Invisibility is an almost coincidental side effect of simply wearing the Ring, but over the course of his journey, Frodo - perceives Galadriel's ring - establishes a telepathic link to both Sauron and Gandalf (via Narya?) at Amon Hen - curses Gollum to fall into the fire of Mount Doom if he ever attacks him again - which is exactly what happens - claims the One Ring for himself in a manner which was apparently spiritually significant enough for Sauron to notice I'm not saying that Frodo was on the path to mastering the Ring. He's been told time and time again by much wiser characters that he just doesn't have the intrinsic power to do so. But maybe he did attune to the Ring - or maybe trained his mind by actively resisting the Ring's pull for a long time - to a sufficient degree that he unlocked more than just its surface level invisibility effect, was able to tap into maybe 2% of the Ring's power and, in the end, had become powerful enough that him claiming the Ring could actually be sensed by Sauron. Maybe Frodo's latent connection to the Ring was also what made him more susceptible to detection by other beings who were also in some way linked to the Ring.

@therakshasan8547 3 ай бұрын

The Ring was a compass direction. Each time it was worn when Sauron was strong in the compass direction was Gondor , and other locations that seemed more likely for it to be .

@gdub19777 3 ай бұрын

I had always assumed that the Ring had the ability to sense what the individual who possessed it intentions were... Gollum and Bilbo used the ring vastly more often than Frodo but were never pursued directly, although Frodo was almost immediately chased. The only real difference between Gollum/Bilbo and Frodo was that when Gollum and Bilbo had the Ring, it wasn't in any danger and was just patiently waiting to be found while corrupting as many as possible.. but when Frodo had it, the Ring was actively being transported to its destruction, exceedingly so after the Rivendale Council. I don't honestly think Sauron was in a particularly big hurry to find it, if anything it seemed like he was okay with letting it wreak its own destruction while he rebuilt his forces and his own strength because what good did the Ring do him in the first place?

@coolelve333 3 ай бұрын

I think Sauron could sense it being use, but was so preoccupied that he couldn't do anything at the moment.

@DamonNomad82 3 ай бұрын

I would say that, as Sauron was oblivious to even the fact that the Ring had been found until Gollum was captured and interrogated in Mordor, that he could only sense it under three conditions: 1: Someone who wore the Ring was using it to direct their attention to Sauron himself. Frodo did this at Amon Hen, as he was wearing and (consciously or unconsciously) using the Ring to enhance the already potent powers of far-seeing that were upon the seat there. He looked around at various things before his attention was drawn to Mordor and Sauron, at which point the Dark Lord became aware of him and went after him. 2: Someone who wore the Ring was intentionally claiming dominion and attempting to use the Ring to dominate others. Frodo did this at Mount Doom, first by placing a doom on Gollum that if Gollum ever touched Frodo again, Gollum would be cast into the fires of Doom, second by openly claiming the Ring for himself shortly afterward. 3: Either the Ringwraiths or Sauron himself were in the same general area of the Ring, and on high alert for the possibility of its being used. This happened during Frodo's journey from the Shire to Rivendell, first when he accidentally wore the Ring in Bree, then when he gave in to the urge to wear the Ring during the Ringwraiths' attack on Weathertop, resulting in Frodo being stabbed.

@brianpencall4882 3 ай бұрын

I would like to see a speculative video on the possibility of recovering the Palantir of Osgiliath from the river, in the fourth age.

@ozmozis6073 3 ай бұрын

I believe that Sauron transferred all his soul into the One Ring; when it was severed from him, his energy took a massive hit - one that was unimaginable by him, when he created the One Ring. While he had some form as the Necromancer, it was insufficient to wield the One Ring and power it, let alone locate it. The One Ring, acted with a subconscious desire, without real direction - hoping it would awaken eventually, in the presence of those it could tempt and control.

@agustingomez1575 3 ай бұрын

There are a few fan theories on the subject that I like. One states that using the ring and "claiming it", as in claiming mastery over it, are two different things, and that the only one to ever do the latter is Frodo at the edge of Mount Doom. Other says that Sauron noticed Frodo at Amon Hen because Frodo focused his gaze on him, and that had he not done that, he would have remained unnoticed by Sauron. The last one is one you mention in this video: the ring takes the wearer from the seen to the unseen world, where he can be seen by the Nazgul and Sauron.

@IronDragon-2143 3 ай бұрын

What if Frodo and Sam were captured by Saruman's Uruk Hai while Merry and Pippin took the Ring to Mordor?

@robwilkinson5471 3 ай бұрын

Always thought that when Bilbo had the ring Sauron wasn't aware of it being found. After he captured Gollum that was when he started properly searching + he and the nazgul were able to sense it's presense more when it was used and knew roughly where it was.

@user-kb9zh5ce2g 11 күн бұрын

If I may add to the discussion: looking at the grand scale of things, we cannot forget that there is always a certain element of fate/doom at play in Area as a whole. I think this is why Sauron, despite everything, didn’t find the ring during the events of the Hobbit

@paulwagner688 3 ай бұрын

Even in the Hobbit, we see Bilbo having feelings of being watched. Also, Sauron was not at a strength to reach out with his active sonar, as it were. Gollum and Bilbo's use of the Ring may have seemed to Sauron at the time as "phantom pains" such as an amputee feels. It wasn't until Gollum was found and tortured that Sauron definitively knew the Ring had been found. Then he focused a great deal of his will to finding it. Or something of that nature.

@therongjr 3 ай бұрын

I rationalized it in my head as Sauron could only tell if someone was wearing the One Ring if he was trying to sense it. When Gollum and Bilbo had it, Sauron had no idea it had been found. When Frodo put it on though, the One Ring was at the front of Sauron's mind. It doesn't neatly explain why he didn't realize when Sam put it on at Cirith Ungol--maybe he was too distracted by the treachery or Saruman and/or Aragorn revealing himself in the palantir?--but then when Frodo put it on in Sammath Naur it was so close that Sauron couldn't miss it. 🤷‍♂️

@sheamardis7409 3 ай бұрын

My head cannon was always that Sauron was still weak and gathering his strength. (This is all in my head,) But my thought is that the whole reason he was in Dol Gurdur was because it sits right about the middle of the Anduin and he was gethering forces to begin looking for it. It's the reason he didn't go back to Mordor right away. And that when he took the dwarven ring from Thrain he was able to still it's power to regan some form. That's why at the point of the Hobbit there is activity that leads to the White Council acting. And then he heads back to Mordor to begin makeing preparations. With Bilbo's predominant use of the ring he now knows it is found, but he wasn't ready to begin searching for it. It is 60 years from the end of the Hobbit till the beginning of The Fellowship. And even then Frodo has the ring for 17 years before he even sets out with it from Bagend. So it's not like Sauron was detecting him right away either. The ring probably takes time to work its magic on an individual enough that wearing it will make them detectable.

@MrYTGuy1 3 ай бұрын

I always assumed that since he was weakened his connection to the ring was as well. but as his strength and power returned over time, his connection and influence over the ring and indeed over all the darker forces grew as well

@theemissary1313 3 ай бұрын

I reckon it would be like a scent. The Nazgul could 'smell' it if they were near, but unless you were close, probably no. Like you say, there's too many plot holes if Sauron could sense the ring and it's wearer(s)

@Dusty1114 3 ай бұрын

Sauron and the Nazgûl probably needed to be actively searching for the ring to spot it or its wearer. There was an emphasis on trying to distract them from this task as a necessity to success.

@thatsprettyfare 2 ай бұрын

i don’t know if you’ve done a video on this already but as i’m watching the trilogies (for the 100th time lol) i’m wondering what if Bilbo gave the arkenstone to Thorin right away ? would that significantly change what ended up happening ?

@rydermccall3590 3 ай бұрын

I think it was more about Frodo wearing the ring in Mount Doom. It seemed to me that The One Ring became more powerful and thus more clearly felt by Sauron and The Nazgûl the closer the ring got to where it was created.

@zipadeed00dah 3 ай бұрын

Remember that it is the One Ring itself that gives Sauron the power to perceive (and rule) the others. When Sauron put much of his power into, then put on the One Ring, the wearers of the Elven rings immediately perceived him and removed their rings. If he couldn't (at some distance) perceive the Elven rings before he diminished himself to create the One Ring, I see no reason to expect him to be able to sense easily any ring of power in his weakened state without it.

@Dr_Dane 3 ай бұрын

I belive it might have to do with the intent of the use. For instance when Sam uses the ring he never intents to keep it so that might lessen Saurons ability to detect it. While when Frodo takes the ring for his own at the end he intends to keep it which makes him much easier to detect. This is my theory due to the ring being primarily an object of evil, greed and the lust for power so when a creature has those intentions for it it would be more noticeable.

@mr.zardoz3344 3 ай бұрын

From all my gathered knowledge and memories, this is my understanding. The One Ring essentially was the embodiment and soul/essence of Sauron, and had powers of its own, described by Gandalf in a conversation with Frodo. So, the One Ring had an awareness, wanted to be found, and could betray the bearer if given the opportunity. I dont think Sauron could pin point its location blindfolded any better than Tom Bombadil. I believe you are right in your assessment. Sauron had limitations and advantages at varying times in each age. But smelling its location via Nazgul is not indicated in the books as far as I can tell.

@shanenolan5625 3 ай бұрын

Thanks

@TarMody 3 ай бұрын

Considering the uses of the One Ring, the only place where its wearer was detected by Sauron was Sammath Naur. Here, when Frodo wore the One Ring with the intention of domination, which was the purpose for which it was made, it was detected by Sauron. There is no such situation in other uses. In other words, the One Ring was not worn by those who wore it for the purpose of domination until that moment. As can be understood from this, it can be inferred that the One Ring can be perceived by Sauron when used with the intention of domination, which is the purpose for which it was made. Sauron's greatest fear is that the One Ring will be used against him by a wise man. Since he knows that it will be used with the intention of domination while using it, it is normal for him to experience this feeling since his perception is only open to this type of use.

@babsbybend 3 ай бұрын

I'm curious about those "old, old tales." Were they referring to this ring, or were there other things that could make a person disappear?

@risteard11 3 ай бұрын

No Sauron could not sense Bilbo. The nazgul could see the ring bearer for the ring put the bearer on the threshold of their world if they were close by. If Sauron could have felt/sensed when anyone else used the ring he'd have caught Sam in Cirith Ungol.

@Kattawhat 3 ай бұрын

I think Sauron knew of Gollum and Bilbo possessing the One Ring, but he knew these two weren't out to use it or destroy it. So he would let that slide, for a time (and time is different for a Maia, even a fallen one) But Sauron knew Frodo was on a mission, and thus it was important to get that ring back ASAP. And Sauron thought mistakenly that Aragorn would have used it for war. Hence all that attention. In short what kills Sauron is a mistaken sense of time and hubris.

@darthfluffy2068 3 ай бұрын

He only felt a disturbance in the force every time his ring was used.

@klarname_online9356 3 ай бұрын

I think that you interpret "sensing" to literally... Saurons abilities are, as you say, limited... So what he can do and percive (in lack of a better word) depend on his abilities... Sauron grows over time... He takes shape again... Thus this might be one factor, why he did not sense Bilbo or Gollum using the ring... And yet even when he has grown, Saurons senses can be blinded... If he thinks that Aragorn, who had challenged him, must have the ring as otherwise his great captain could not have been overthrown and his army defeated, than he is described as blind to nearly everything else... Thus he cannot feel the ring... His sense is blindet there... Sauron only could feel the ring, if his other information already told him where to search... So in summary... When sauron sense of the ring can so easily be blinded, it cannot be a strong sense, if a sense it is... Accordingly, Sauron in his weaker state cannot sense the ring... If at all he knows what this feeling or sense is...

@animistchannel 3 ай бұрын

Mcguffin does what mcguffin needs to do, because that's what makes it mcguffin. Also, remember, in the Hobbit, the ring was just A ring, it was not The Ring. In fact, IIRC, it was not really The Ring until the hobbits got to Rivendell, Tolkien realized who Strider was, and he went back to insert the "Shadow of the Past" chapter and make the black riders the actual Nazgul of yore, as well as inserting Strider/Aragorn's real name into the story sooner, etc. Tolkien wrote about how the whole tone of the story changed when he realized the true lineage of Strider and that this was not only a sequel to The Hobbit, but a descendent of his core elder days. Furthermore, in the actual books, Sauron could not generally pinpoint the Ring specifically, especially if it was just put on and not used for command/spiritual purposes. At most he had a sense that it was being used, because it was a part of him, but not where or by whom. He had to send the Nazgul out to look for the Shire by normal methods. It was only when Frodo claimed the Ring IN the vocano forge room itself that Sauron could locate it specifically, because of the nature of that place. Furthermore, the Nazgul could only sense the Ring when it was being worn, and within what amounts to line of sight range. Otherwise they only felt that "something" of magical influence might be nearby, as in the Marshes, or when the army was marching out of Minas Ithil. They literally attacked empty rooms in The Prancing Pony trying to find it, while the Ring itself was only a stone's throw away in the same building. What made the event of Frodo wearing the Ring at Amon Hen/Lhaw different was a property of Amon itself, a place of magical connection and revelation over long distances. It was the place that changed the rules. Peter Jackson specifically said that the movies made much inflation of Sauron's perception of the Ring, because they needed to up the danger-sense of the Ring as much as possible to make it a credible threat in a movie setting. When your big villain in the epic story is a little lump of jewelry, it needs all the help it can get, so they gave it an enhanced voice and reach and immediacy the best they could.

@michaellefort6128 3 ай бұрын

Saurin lost the ring and never found it in his cave. He may have been able to sense Bilbo, not the ring. Unless it was being used?

@thebeatles114 3 ай бұрын

Wait a minute, who the heck is 'Saurin' ?!?!?

@rydermccall3590 3 ай бұрын

Sauron firmly believed The Free Peoples of Middle Earth would use The One Ring against him, this is why when he saw Pippen in the palantír along with Aragorn, Sauron theorized that The One Ring was at Minas Tirith which is why he sent such a large force to conquer Minas Tirith. With so much focus outside of Mordor it stands to reason that Sam could get away with wearing the One Ring briefly.

@robertcoplin2830 3 ай бұрын

Since Hobbits were naturally resistant to the effects of the Ring, perhaps the use of the Ring by Bilbo was muted. Also Bilbo didn't know the nature of the Ring so there was no conscious temptation to make use of it by reaching out to take control of the Ring's Power.

@yorkshirelad346 3 ай бұрын

I always thought that because the ring seems to heighten one’s desires and twisted them to evil Bilbo and Gollum where not taken by it or could be seen because Hobbits don’t really want anything monetary or power they only wanted the ring and they had it , Frodo had a desire to destroy the ring , so Salron could see that desire the ring transmitted it . Maybe ?

@lincolngravemann682 3 ай бұрын

Maybe the ring knew sauron was occupied working on rebuilding his forces so it didnt call him and make him stretch his thin forces until he had more troops or was in a better position to spend the time and resources looking for it and maybe it knew Frodo and fellowship was trying to destroy it hence why it was more actively corrupting the fellowship and trying to be found even more calling the ring wraiths telling them it's intthe hands of someone trying to destroy the ring

@zendoproducer2727 3 ай бұрын

If you like the content on this channel and have not read the books.. Read them!! You will NOT be disappointed.

@CONTINGENCY_sys 3 ай бұрын

It is to the extent of the intention of use. The hobbits aways used it to hide or to get away, not as a source of power (except in Sam's case where it was detected by a black rider only in faint). The ring amplifies what is not what was. Though it was created beyond measure of power, the hobbits used it in hiding for hiding so it amplified that power, even hiding them from Sauron. In comparison the great stones in the possession of someone had the same impact as when someone had a ring on, clearly the stones had an impact to the measure of the impact upon the ring bearers as it expands his vision at range and those connected to him. The same falls to the fall of the ring, It's destruction sends a wave of absolute power that no one could deny, that everything constructed by the wearer at the time was destroyed at its demise. It all connects together as Tolkien was a master of logistics at range, even as more layers were added over existing designs. Have fun in the worlds of fantasy where the many rings exist and once again cycle back into creation for more and more stories to be told. I can't wait until more Tolkien create more Tolkien stories for the futures of the worlds their father created as a baseline for more adventures.

@Jay-ql4gp 3 ай бұрын

I think that, as Sauron regained power, he regained awareness of the ring.

@calebowen2006 3 ай бұрын

I think from my own understanding Sauron could sense the ring but that sense was greatly limited. We know Gollum was drawn to Mordor mistaking the power of sauron with the ring itself meaning that ability must exist. That being said, it took Gollums years to find Sauron in Mordor, or moreso be found himself, meaning it wasnt a simple easy task. Also we have to think that during that time Sauron was calling evil to himself so that couldve made his power more notabke than that of the ring. Another point I'd want to make is that using the ring for things like stealth itself may not be inherently overly dangerous and it was mostly on dangerous to Frodo because in the eyes of the characters he was the one that needed to have the will to destroy the ring when the moment came and each time wearing it increased the likelihood of it corrupting him and stopping the quest

@brocklawer7635 3 ай бұрын

Here are my theories I believe the ring was dormant until Gandalf put it in the fire and revealed the evil script and it seems then it awakens. I also think that the wraiths sensed the ring in the area when it was near them as it was put on they were drawn to it. I believe when the ring was put on Sauron was alarmed of the ring kinda like when you hear your phone ring but don’t know where it’s at whether it’s under something or too dark to see. Then to answer your last question I think Sauron made a mistake thinking that maybe the hobbits were a diversion when they take Frodos mithril coat and thinks Aragorn has the ring assuming men haven’t learned and that he’s certain with such a bold hopeless attack they would try to use it against him and that their was no plan to destroy it.

@MountainFisher 3 ай бұрын

Bilbo never knew that he had a ring of power and never used it as such, just put it on to turn invisible. Turning invisible is all he thought it did. Galadriel warned Frodo to not try and use the ring in power as such because he was not powerful enough and it would break him.

@gravestone4840 3 ай бұрын

I think the inherent goodness of the Hobbits acted to drown out the evil of the ring. It grew quiet because they were not ambitious, everything they did while in possession of the One was selfless. They did what they did for the sake of others. Perhaps Sauron couldn't sense it because it was weakest in the hands of those he could not goad in to trying to use it to dominate others, saving them from being dominated by Sauron in turn. That or all the Old Toby being smoked around the ring got Sauron too high and he just kept forgetting where he placed it.....

@robertmiller1299 3 ай бұрын

Perhaps the power of Sauron to sense the Ring operated under an inverse power law

@pinkace 3 ай бұрын

I think that if it was a 'compass', sauron had FIVE HUNDRED YEARS to find it in the mountains where Gollum hid, yet he didn't. Then he had 60 years (?) to get it from Bilbo, yet he didn't. Then suddenly SARUMAN found out that Bilbo had it, so it was SARUMAN that sent word or awakened or somehow started the whole One Ring hunt. SARUMAN dispatched the Nazgul, on behalf of his lord, Sauron! What do you think?

@Fingledoodler 2 ай бұрын

I really like the unseen world theory, but this unfortunately doesn't account for Sam putting it on as there and then they would have spotted him in mordor and known it wasn't Aragorn with the ring... I do like a few of your theories, but I wonder something else. A combination of people not searching for the ring at specific times as they are preocupied, but maybe the ring also senses if someone has ill intent towards the ring and then has to work harder towards swaying them. So as Bilbo and smeagol wasn't intent on destroying it, it was relaxed, but in Frodo;s hands it worked hard to corrupt him. Perhaps Sam it would have worked harder on Sam if he had it a little longer.

@sheamardis7409 3 ай бұрын

I would love to hear your thoughts on the differences between the dwarves and elves in the Hobbit vs the Lord of the rings. In the Hobbit the dwarves are described as wearing different colored cloaks and being marry and quite always gave me the image of the dwarves from Disney's snow white rather than Lord of the rings. Same for the elves they are hanging in the trees and singing nonsense and teasing the dwarves, rather than being aloof and graceful and everlasting, like they feel in Lord of the rings.

@normthompson923 3 ай бұрын

Gollum was using the ring for hundreds of years to off goblin under the misty mountain with dol guldur quite near inhabited by the witch king and also sauron.I dont see why he wouldnt sense it when Galadriel could.

@Clyde-S-Wilcox 3 ай бұрын

He could sense mah bawlz

@jasonswann5167 3 ай бұрын

Since the story of The Hobbit was written first, with even J.R.R. Tolkien unaware of Sauron at the time, the lore of the ring had no effect on Bilbo.

@ajaydassani9931 3 ай бұрын

I think its because of when it was written so same as star wars new hope where leila kisses luke maybe it wasnt the intention of the author to continually expand the universe which was the later outcome

@gustavoolivieri6568 3 ай бұрын

It feels like people try to understand this more than Tolkien himself. 😄 It feels like Tolkien behaves as a reader, sometimes. He just didn't know. (Although he did think about it and reviewed.)

@jdblackshear9431 3 ай бұрын

What if Bilbo still showed pity on gollum but slayed him anyway?

@patrickols 3 ай бұрын

While I understand why you try to explain this for the channel, in reality the reasons are in the books themselves. Bilbo story was written in the early 1930’s and was intended to be a children book. Frodo story was written in the late 1940’s right after the worst war in human history and intended as an adult book. While the Ring is the main character in but stories the differences cannot be helped. Even Gandalf is very different in The Hobbit from the way he is written in LOTR. Tolkien did try to link both stories but the way The Hobbit was originally written truly make’s the differences in both books very clear. I usually don’t bother much about those differences, I just read them like they are the same book without being worried in the differences in style.

@DBat-sp1tp 3 ай бұрын

My question is that Gandalf knew Bilbo had acquired a magic ring after escaping the goblins then why didn’t he investigate earlier on whether it could have been the one ring?

@DamonNomad82 3 ай бұрын

At the time of the events of "The Hobbit", Gandalf's knowledge of the One Ring was very limited. As the ring Bilbo had found was a plain gold ring with no visible decorations or embellishments, he most likely would have thought it was one of the "lesser rings" of power, which were relatively common and had been made by the Elves of Eregion while they were first learning how to craft magical rings. Also, Saruman was the White Council's expert on ring lore, and he was very adamant that the Ring had been washed down the River to the Sea and was beyond finding. At the time, Gandalf had no reason to doubt Saruman's word, so he naturally assumed that the One Ring was gone forever. He only gradually became suspicious of Bilbo's ring over several decades when Bilbo didn't age and his behavior started to be affected, culminating in "The Party" celebrating Bilbo's 111th and Frodo's 33rd birthdays. That was what led Gandalf to start researching the One Ring, both by going to Gondor and studying Isildur's old writings about it (by which he discovered that the One Ring was plain and unadorned, unlike the other Great Rings, which each had a jewel of some kind, but had writing that could be revealed by heating the Ring) and by finding and interrogating Gollum (which filled in the gaps about how the Ring had been found, and had come to Gollum and then to Bilbo).

@stevemonkey6666 3 ай бұрын

If Sauron sensed the ring existed and was being used by someone then he's actions would have been different.

@fragefuchs Ай бұрын

What if the Ring wasn't a Ring, but a Smartphone?

@Royballe 3 ай бұрын

FIRST!

@laqutis 3 ай бұрын

No. Because he never ''claimed'' it for his own, when knowing it was the One Ring.

@dwdinrolla 3 ай бұрын

Right. The whole point of calling Bilbo and Frodo ring bearers was to avoid making any claim. Frodo, within Mordor, within Mt Doom, within the Crack of Doom, still didn't pull Sauron's attention - until he made the claim. Once he did it immediately drew Sauron. Gollum calling it my precious was making a claim for centuries, but without understanding it was the One Ring, so apparently drawing Sauron's attention needed both claiming and knowing what you were claiming.