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CROSSBOWS have gone TOO FAR | Opening A Can Of Worms
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@Alaskabuilt_ 3 жыл бұрын
Just like “long range hunting” has gone to far. 500 and under. I live in Alaska and have almost been shot multiple times from 1000 yard shooters. They are not hunters. They are shooters.
@brycehiigel235 3 жыл бұрын
My grandfather beat into my head get as close to the animal as possible to make a clean shot clean kill put the animal out quickly. He was never a bow hunter just rifle. So that has always stuck in my head.
@vfonte218 2 жыл бұрын
Another 100% agree
@thedukeofmoot7962 2 жыл бұрын
Agreed
@JS-nf1sn 3 жыл бұрын
In the state I live, you can only use crossbows during rifle season....
@2cthetruth 3 жыл бұрын
Your state sucks
@longdrawarcher4857 3 жыл бұрын
That’s a good thing
@2cthetruth 3 жыл бұрын
That’s your opinion.
@V1KTOR33 2 жыл бұрын
@@2cthetruth somebody’s feelings are hurt... go back to rifle season..your prolly over weight and hunt from the road.
@jowho9992 2 жыл бұрын
Your state Rocks! REALLY ROCKS!!!!!!!
@coltonslama8621 3 жыл бұрын
In Utah you have to have a doctors note submitted to the DNR in order to use a crossbow. Makes it fair for everyone in my opinion. And it’s only during the regular archery season.
@davidayres9865 3 жыл бұрын
Question... how is using a crossbow "unfair" as compared to using a compound bow? Not sure how "fairness" plays into it
@nathanielkidd2840 3 жыл бұрын
I wonder if people made these same arguments when a lot of people started switching from traditional bows to compound.
@victorybeforecombat5783 2 жыл бұрын
Probably, and rightly so.
@thetowndrunk988 2 жыл бұрын
Oh yeah. Took awhile for every state to allow compound bows.
@Trickydickysticky 2 жыл бұрын
100% people always gonna bitch.
@Benjamin.stevens 3 жыл бұрын
Here in Alaska they just said no more crossbows. I’m happy with that.
@TheKevinwildman 3 жыл бұрын
That’s odd I talk to people in Alaska crossbow are still being used there.
@LifeisGood-ye8rl 3 жыл бұрын
I’ve seen the 10 point crossbow that has x1 farm in digital sight that you don’t even have to learn t sight in just input data and the sight will do it for you. The crossbow reverse draw shoots 450 fps with 5 inch width. Hand crack cocking decocking mechanism. Might as well be a rifle.
@TheWobSmith 3 жыл бұрын
Two months ago I took my first traditional whitetail, after seven years of practicing with traditional bows. I had shot seven deer in five seasons (5 with a compound bow, 2 with a shotgun) but the sense of reward after the time and effort that went into a successful longbow harvest was just unparalleled... it was actually a profoundly spiritual experience that crystalized my identity as a hunter. I agree that there are exceptions for who can justify using a crossbow, but I can't imagine feeling quite as accomplished. Maybe that's just me. But I have seen a huge uptick in crossbow hunting on social media in recent years, and I'm just not convinced that a lot of those folks don't have time or strength to practice with and use a vertical bow. It does seem pretty lazy, especially since hunting is considered a sport.
@2cthetruth 3 жыл бұрын
Traditional isnt good enough! Got to use a dam rock and sling shot to be a man! You get em tiger!
@caninphx 3 жыл бұрын
A shotgun for a whitetail? I've only heard of guys using shotguns on moose. Interesting.
@welderoo 3 жыл бұрын
@@caninphx on a moose ? Never heard of that you get them to sniff barrel first ?😂
@TheWobSmith 3 жыл бұрын
@@caninphx Massachusetts. No hunting whitetails with long rifles; population density. Where I live, if I missed with a 30-06 it could spell serious trouble. 12ga sabot slugs mitigate that issue since gravity gets the best of them relatively quickly
@TheWobSmith 3 жыл бұрын
@@2cthetruth fuck the slingshot man! I'm gonna run those deer to exhaustion and eat them raw :p
@shadyp-zv3uf 3 жыл бұрын
I have had open heart surgery and my chest sawed open... yet I still shoot a #60 vertical bow- so people are full of it!
@2cthetruth 3 жыл бұрын
You should be pulling more..prove your a man dammit
@ScottWConvid19 3 жыл бұрын
It's all about resolve. Most ppl in America have am entitled mentality and they will quickly take the most paved road that's available. Good for your for getting back on the horse instead of laying there, crying for favor and concessions
@shadyp-zv3uf 3 жыл бұрын
@@2cthetruth lol I can pull #70 but i shoot around 100 arrows a days so i stay at #60.
@shadyp-zv3uf 3 жыл бұрын
If I was going after something bigger than whitetail I would crank it up for the hunt- actually I keep a 60 and a 70 pound bow.
@thetowndrunk988 2 жыл бұрын
Something tells me you’re from my generation, where we didn’t whine about pain and just got the daggum job done
@wesd3370 2 жыл бұрын
I will say though, I feel like the leap between traditional archery and compound is probably similar to the leap between compound and crossbows.
@vfonte218 2 жыл бұрын
Disagree. Using any bow you still have to physically draw the bow aim and release an arrow....maybe people thought that way back in the day....but it's definitely not the same
@Trickydickysticky 2 жыл бұрын
No, the leap between compound and crossbow is SIGNIFICANTLY smaller than trad bow to compound.
@KTMsoldier1988 3 жыл бұрын
This previous yr here in PA i took my son to his hubter safety course...the game wardens there stating that there is no advantage to using a crossbow over a compound bow....gave him a huge Eye Roll!
@75superfan 3 жыл бұрын
I agree with you, Vt did the same thing and is allowing anyone to use a crossbow. I just bought a new Hoyt Torrex Xt this fall and almost everybody I know gave me crap for not getting a crossbow instead. I couldn't get them to understand that I enjoy ARCHERY just as much or more than bowhunting. I don't think its right letting able bodied people use a crossbow just because their lazy and want to take the easy way out. Crossbows are so fast and simple to shoot, plus the bow is already cocked back and you don't have to draw back without being seen which is a huge advantage. One more point I think lawmakers should consider is the more crossbows there are out there the more deer are going to be poached. What better way to poach a deer than roll down the window of your vehicle and silently shoot them with a crossbow which is effective to over 100 yds. Enough of my rant, but these crossbows will eventually kill the sport of archery as more people look to take the easy way out.
@dougdiplacido2406 3 жыл бұрын
It was kind of fun seeing you so animated. You have always been so laid back and calm. I do agree with what you are saying. I have been happy to let you vent and hope you feel better. Actually after the events of this week you were a refreshing change of pace.
@suckthispistol 3 жыл бұрын
I had to give up vertical bow hunting for years because of permanent shoulder damage and a few surgeries. I wasn’t able to stay at full draw with the 35% let off bows we had back then but could still shoot. With the high let off bows now I have been able to ethically hunt with a compound for a few years again.
@vahol5428 2 жыл бұрын
I am in my late 70's. I started bow hunting my freshman year in college. I loved bow hunting and hunted small game as well as deer. I joined a club and target shot for a number of years during early adult years. Then I had a accident that damaged my shoulder to the point I couldn't shoot a bow. Years went by with no archery at all. When I retired I purchased a crossbow and shot a buck the first year. The crossbow has been in a case under the bed for years now, it didn't turn out to be the fun the old recurve was. On top of that, the crossbow is a pain to carry in the woods. It is heavy and only comfortable to carry on a sling upside down. I am tempted to buy a compound but all the tuning and adjustments needed is discouraging.
@leonj1102 3 жыл бұрын
Here where I hunt in florida we can only take 5 deer (3 bucks 2 does). The WMA I hunt bucks have to have 4pts on 1 side and 15" spread and even though the state has several doe days during gun season, the WMA doesnt allow does to be taken on those days. I use a crossbow because archery season is my meat gathering time and as such I am willing to use every advantage I am legally allowed to use.
@justinsidervag1643 3 жыл бұрын
Bow hunters : The fly fisherman of hunting. I remember when compounds were considered an unfair advantage because of the let off. I'm surprised , working in the industry, you don't realize its still a 40yd game. Sure 400 fps and 200 plus lbs, but , its also a 15" power stroke. The speed drops off dramatically. No one is taking 100 yd shots in the woods holding 10 ' over . You could, But, real world its not happening. Archers in the dark ages were accurate at 300 to 500 yards with long bows , that puts it on par with a 30 06 ?
@Njjb122 3 жыл бұрын
40yd game for compounds yes even being accurate out to 80 i wouldn't shoot at an animal further then 40.. crossbows however can easily i mean easily shoot at an animal out to 70 efficient and effectively the 2 should not be looked at the same unfortunately pa and nj dont really care how deer are harvested
@chavezv.c.7249 3 жыл бұрын
Isn’t that the truth in so many ways...
@justinsidervag1643 3 жыл бұрын
The 1st season they allowed " everyone " to use crossbows in my state , there was a big surge in sales and hunters. It fell off after that. They realized its NOT " the gun that shoots arrows " . The orange army tactics don't work. No " freezer drives " , running shots or stop the truck , fire into a cornfield. No 50 yd neck shots in the swamp. You still have to know the animal , sit still , play the wind and wait for a double lung hit. 3,4 or even 500 fps , water is still wet and deer jump the string at 30 yds.
@zzz7zzz9 3 жыл бұрын
This. It's a shame outdoors-people can't just get along. Flyfishermen have to act elitest over other fishermen, and bow hunters act elitest over crossbow hunters. Are there not enough antis everywhere, already against us?? We have to crap on each other and divide ourselves???? Stfu and support our community. You want to complain about things? Complain about the poachers and trespassers and law-breaking hunters/fishers. Stop driving a wedge into our community and belittling others because they don't do what you do.
@travistwwreck1535 3 жыл бұрын
@@zzz7zzz9 The complaint is about sharing the season with crossbow hunters, They should be in with guns not Bows , Your missing the point as your being to ANTI yourself
@larryfalquet9372 3 жыл бұрын
I disagree...it doesn't matter when a season falls also the type of equipment employed is strictly up to the individual hunter. The reasonable stat that matters is the number of kill tags issued. But your generation is only interested in yourself. Limit the kill tags to one deer a year per hunter . Then all the stuff that concerns you would go away. All those lazy hunters would be in and out of the woods in a jiffy. Then all you archery hunters who still use compounds can stick all the left over deer you want especially those which you'll never find anyway. Have you ever destroyed a tag when you couldn't find a deer that you stuck ? Think Bout it.
@tylerjones1814 3 жыл бұрын
I definitely understand your frustration. A couple thoughts from another state perspective. So I deer hunt in both WV and Ohio. Crossbows have been legal in Ohio during the entire archery season for a long time (1976). In West Virginia, they became legal only a few years ago. Both these states have the advantage of only using archery equipment during the normal peak rut time. I started off as a kid only gun hunting. For a period of a couple years after college, I got a crossbow and started hunting that way. I killed a couple deer, but I got more into waterfowl hunting and sold my crossbow equipment. Fast forward about 10 years and I start getting back into deer hunting. I started shooting a Howard Hill style longbow just for fun. I practiced compulsively for a couple months and killed a small buck off the ground. The personal reward from that harvest was unlike anything I ever experienced in hunting. However, because I don’t want to shoot 50 arrows every day, and I would like to kill a deer further away than 15-20 yards, I bought a compound, and it’s awesome. I still shoot compulsively about every day, but I don’t need as much volume. So long back story to lead to my point. Enjoy what you can, be happy with what you can kill in the way you choose. Some folks just want to hunt. If the woods are crowded, I don’t think it’s the crossbow’s fault. We can’t be selfish with a state’s natural resources.
@Patrick-zs2jy 2 жыл бұрын
Here in NY they just added a week of shotgun doe season right before the archery season. One of the things I appreciate about bow hunting is the deer aren't running scared yet. This messes that all up!
@jtv2748 2 жыл бұрын
Here in Indiana we've had these crossthingys in our archery season for a while now.. started out for "handicap only", ... then for all, but only in late season/gun season, then they crept their way into the whole archery season for ANYONE ... I hunt state lands/FW areas and they are packed with guys using the crossthingys, guys stumbling around with 'em, many are gun hunters who now can be in the earlier archery season ... it is stupid with the amount who now use these things, they have now surpassed the bow kills ... the archery season has been ruined, the pressure is overwhelming and the DNR dosnt care ...for 20 yrs I managed or worked in archery /gun shops and I sold dozens of these things, so I know how easy they are to use, I work my ass off to stay proficient with my VERTICLE bow, unlike the crossthingy users .... I have had more hunts ruined with these Elmer Fudds walking in on me than I ever did with BOWhunters doing so, 4 times this past 2021 season hunts were ruined by these guys and I walk in a mile or more to many of my locations backpacking in a stand/sticks, and then these guys come in and flop their asses down anyplace ...... the DNR should never have allowed them for all in archery, but kept them in with the rest of the shoulder fired seasons .... there was a new #2 B&C buck taken by a guy using a crossthingy, yea its a nice deer, but it would have meant so much more if he had use a bow which still has to be hand drawn and hand held in the prsence of game, unlike those other 'things' ..... smh
@jowho9992 2 жыл бұрын
Yes, the Elmer Fudds don't even know how they effect the archery hunting experience most of them simply don't posses the same level of awareness. All ruined for money.
@lukereed9885 3 жыл бұрын
I’m 15 and have used a crossbow the past several years just so I can get out into the woods for archery session but hopefully before next season I’ll be getting a compound.(I’ve been wanting to for a while this video didn’t shame me into getting one lol but still great video man) I’m also a PA hunter I live down near hyndman, PA
@youtoober87 3 жыл бұрын
No lie - the add served to me in the middle of this video was for a crossbow company lol
@pabloesquivel754 3 жыл бұрын
Dude best video ever!!!😂 bad shoulder BS at every big box store lmaoooooo
@douglasguenter9982 3 жыл бұрын
Shoulder issues are a real issue for a lot of men and women in their forties and fifties and it only gets worse as we get older. Please don’t judge to harshly they may have a history of rotator cuff tear or some other issue. I like cross bows for that very real issue and frankly we need more hunters here of any type.
@huntermazzio713 3 жыл бұрын
My advice for any dads getting kids into hunting(take it or leave it) When I was 12 and started gaining interest in going hunting with my father. He made it very clear from the start that I was to shoot a compound and nothing else until I harvested my first deer. That Christmas I got a diamond razor edge and remember being pumped to hit the woods until I realized how difficult archery truly was. My dad gave me the rule that until I can put 8 arrows in a 8 inch pie plate 8 times in a row I’m not allowed in the woods! I worked my ass off for a weeks and weeks and finally got the got the approval from my dad with about 2 weeks left in the January season. I can vividly remember our first hunt together being set up in a ground blind here in Delaware on the edge of a grass field with a fresh blanket of snow cover. Last light 2 doe and 4 fawns came across the field to 30 yards from our blind where they fed around for a bit. I remember I had my release attached to my D loop But I was shaking so bad that I kept accidentally clicking the release off the string...eventually they caught out wind and trotted off. From that moment on I have been I die hard bow Hunter(now 22) it took me many more failed attempts(countless) until I connected with my first whitetail the following season In late November. My point here is that I truly believe that if my dad had just put a crossbow or a slug gun (which I could’ve easily killed those deer with)in my hands on that first hunt. I wouldn’t have the same passion and respect for hunting whitetails that I do today.
@victorybeforecombat5783 2 жыл бұрын
Crossbows make people who don't practice enough (probably most archery hunters) more accurate/ethical; so I generally support it. Also it gets more people hunting which is good. However I'd prefer a season breakdown such as 1 week trad bows, 2 weeks compound bows, remainder crossbows.
@jeffscaparra6985 2 жыл бұрын
I think this is what people are missing. The guy shooting the crossbow would likely wound an animal and cause great suffering because he didn't have the time to practice as much. They made the decision that they are more effective with a crossbow. As long as they practice enough for that to be true (which is definitely less than any other type of archery) I don't have a problem with it. I also like the solution of having different seasons that would open from most skill needed to least and we should have these conversations instead of targeting other hunters following the laws.
@keithhill7572 3 жыл бұрын
This sounds a lot like the arguments we used against the compound bow and against the release aid when they came out. Our MI DNR says the DATA doesn’t show a big difference in the effectiveness of the crossbows over the other archers in harvesting deer. People generally don’t care what the DATA shows when they form opinions. I’m 72 and recently switched from conventional archery to compound bow. I started bow hunting when I was 12.
@pythonithon5916 3 жыл бұрын
Crossbows are basically just guns with short range.
@zzz7zzz9 3 жыл бұрын
No they aren't. Wow are you uneducated.
@pythonithon5916 3 жыл бұрын
@@zzz7zzz9 I know very well what crossbows are... I'm just saying that they are shoot like guns, have a scope like guns, they require the same skill level as guns (not much)... but they are 50 yards and under in a hunting situation, so short range. Sorry you don't understand.
@robertsophiea05 3 жыл бұрын
@@pythonithon5916 You can explain it to him but you cant understand it for him. Your comment was obviously true and accurate.
@davidmcgahan5021 3 жыл бұрын
i am 55 and disabled after 2 strokes left me virtually paralyzed on my left side. fought hard to be able to just walk again. i bought my first compound bow last summer as therapy to build strength and hand to eye coordination with left arm. my infinite edge pro is set to 35# and after shooting it every day all summer i've seen a vast improvement. looking forward to warmer weather here in new hampshire maybe bump it up to 40#. thanks for all the great videos keep them coming.
@colbykinney5633 3 жыл бұрын
I'm glad you are getting better. Good luck this season!
@rx1hunter896 3 жыл бұрын
You hit the nail right on the head...people will come up with every excuse they can to make it easier to hunt because they don’t want to practice. 2 years ago I scheduled a shoulder surgery (torn labrum, 4 anchors) in early May and I did that because of the recovery time it would take me to recover for me to shoot my compound. Used rubber bands to get stronger, worked out hard and was able to pull back the 60 Lbs I lowered it to. Pennsylvania has ruined the archery season, just like you said because the kill has tripled from when it used to be back in the day, hence why you don’t see a lot of rifle hunters anymore. They switched to the crossbow for the easiest hunt and better weather. 👍🙏🦌🏹
@Voxguitarsrock 3 жыл бұрын
I own a crossbow and a compound bow. I blew out my shoulder at work a few years ago. When prepping for deer season it occasionally goes out on me and makes shooting my compound bow very difficult. I just wind down the poundage to where I can draw it again. I've never hunted deer with my crossbow. Is that weird? Lol
@timbo749 5 ай бұрын
I actually started with a compound, got tendonitus from shooting too much and thought I trashed my shoulder for good, switched to crossbow to compensate, after a while got a Recurve and found out I can shoot it, so I crossed over from croossbow to Traditional and luv it!
@cpaoutdoors9926 3 жыл бұрын
How much does your bow cost does it make you a better hunter or a better shooter ?
@bobbyjones5411 3 жыл бұрын
Totally agree! Ive been bowhunting for 27 years and i see the change. I'm 52 and practice endlessly. DNR dont care, they just want to fill numbers. Not to mention us bowhunters know how important scent elimination and scouting is to be successful. My wife bowhunts too, she shoots a Mathews ignition @ 45bls 25.5 draw and successful harverting deer. Thank you for speaking out!
@archery365 3 жыл бұрын
AJA, I really love your channel and the fact that you give back by sharing your knowledge in YT form. Please keep it up as you really do a great service to archery. I have never hunted with a crossbow. As for your argument about crossbows it don't hold water. If your arguing that xbows have an advantage over compounds bc they don't take a lot of effort to learn how to kill with them, then I could say the same about rifles or shotguns over compounds, or I could say the same for compound over traditional archery, or I could have the same argument for traditional archery verses chasing a herd of buffalo over a cliff (that takes guts and talent!). I have archery hunted for 42 years now and heard all the arguments about who's right or who's wrong with a persons "tool" choice of taken an animal. I choose to be in the outdoors and hunt so I can be in awe of the Creators miracles. What weapon I use to take home one of Gods blessings for consumption shouldn't matter to anyone.
@ericwolbert3256 2 жыл бұрын
Spoken like a true crossbow owner trying to justify why they’re lazy!
@jeffscaparra6985 2 жыл бұрын
@@ericwolbert3256 I have never shot a crossbow but recently picked up a compound and plan on hunting with that this year. I care more that people use what makes them effective and that there is less wounded loss. When making my decision I wanted to put in the time and learn a how to shoot a bow. I decided to go with a compound over a traditional stick bow because I thought I could be more effective. What matters to me is that people follow the rules and hunt ethically within their abilities. If you don't like the rules you should target your state government and not other hunters that are just following the rules and may have other things going on in the lives.
@bentonmcmullen7445 3 жыл бұрын
I totally agree with you. I think crossbows should be in the same category as muzzle loaders. Just wanted to let you know, Wisconsin crossbow season is the same time as archery season. I live in Wisconsin, and I have the same arguments with our season as you do. Also, people that say this is the same argument as the traditional bow hunters had with compound bow hunters are wrong in so many way I can’t state them all here.
@robertsophiea05 3 жыл бұрын
Yes!!!! Not only do crossbow hunters not care about archery they don't even care about crossbows. If we changed the law to say you can only use your crossbow in rifle season most those people would never pick up a crossbow again. We need to stop being polite about this, and start shaming people as cheaters. You don't bring flippers to a swim race, a motorcycle to a bike race, or a crossbow to archery season.
@mattcomchoc2957 2 жыл бұрын
couple things i picked up from muzzleloading in Washington state, who i feel did this subject "right": force the muzzleloaders to remain fairly primitive, which in WA meant no 209 waterproof primers, action open to the elements, no scopes, no saboted projectiles, no modern/smokeless powder. in order to use a crossbow, you had to actually qualify under certain age/disability requirements, you couldn't just "choose" to. i totally get where you are coming from on this. i only hunted ONE TIME during a modern rifle/muzzleloader overlap period. the woods were PACKED, and i did NOT feel safe out there at all not being head-to-toe hunter orange.
@JamesSmullins 3 жыл бұрын
Same argument traditional bow hunters had about wheelbows and just as inaccurate. All we keep doing is making it so there are fewer hunters at a time when hunter numbers are already declining which is not good for us when it comes to keeping anti hunting laws off the books. If it's ethical to use let people use it and get over it.
@jimmytheweed4978 3 жыл бұрын
Would like to give you 100 thumbs up for that James.
@thehumblepundit9790 3 жыл бұрын
Amen, brother. Do what you enjoy. Let others do the same. Period.
@MHobbs06 3 жыл бұрын
Yup. I can understand it being frustrating that a slob hunter can pull his crossbow off the shelf the night before the opener and just shoot a few arrows and call it good. But shooting a compound with a 90% letoff is a big advantage over a trad bow. It's all about perspective. I shoot a compound but have been looking at a crossbow for ground hunts. You still have to put yourself in the right spot and make a good shot. Ultimately I'm trying to put meat in the freezer. A crossbow is just another tool.
@JamesSmullins 3 жыл бұрын
@@MHobbs06 I've been thinking about getting one as well, I can hold my old decree at full draw for quite a while but there's times a crossbow would be better choice.
@mariahpennell3628 3 жыл бұрын
@@JamesSmullins Yes but the difference isn't in how long you can hold at full draw it is in getting drawn on a deer in the first place. You only have to point and shoot a crossbow.
@chippooutdoors5325 Жыл бұрын
crossbows are the JET SKI of bow hunting
@derbestrafen Жыл бұрын
I remember when I went from a stick and string Bear recurve to a compound with 70% letoff with sights and string release. I thought, this is so easy anyone can be an expert in a day. It takes no skill to shoot a modern compound bow.
@phantomcruizer 3 жыл бұрын
Sounds like the argument that recurve target archers have about compound target archers equipment.
@darrellstout8014 3 жыл бұрын
As a Pa hunter I can’t agree with you more about the season’s and having youth and seniors firearms during archery.
@stephanieb27 3 жыл бұрын
HUGELY important - crossbow manufacturers, unlike compound manufacturers, don’t pay into the “Robertson Pittman Act” which is an 11% excise tax that goes back into conservation because they argued they use a “bolt” and therefore weren’t considered archery yet they want all the accoutrements that are associated with archery. Why does nobody talk about this?
@Trickydickysticky 2 жыл бұрын
When crossbows are fully legalized for all archery seasons i think they should ABSOLUTELY pay the tax.
@misterwhymer4473 Жыл бұрын
Another Pa guy here.. you’re absolutely right. The gun seasons in the middle of archery season is ridiculous. The people who structure our seasons have their heads up their asses
@williamlewis3982 3 жыл бұрын
First. Crossbows are rifles at this point.
@welderoo 3 жыл бұрын
Wondering if the trad and longbow guys had this same feeling with the release of the compound ?😂😂😂
@SoSwiff 3 жыл бұрын
I really want to know that because it took me a long time to decide to go compound. I felt for a long time it was that I can build my own recurve or take down or long bow and not rely on manufacturing. And then it was about not being able to build my own arrows from scratch. I can say that for me the basic principles are the same but I don't see myself ever getting a crossbow.. ifvi were considering it wouldn't take me a minute to buy a rifle instead.
@travistwwreck1535 3 жыл бұрын
Well was their a Archery season back in the days when Compound came in . its still a Bow , it still requires lots of practise to require form, Never heard much anger about about it.
@aaronmcwilliams7014 3 жыл бұрын
Up here in Ontario archery is universal. I personally think that crossbow unless accompanied by a doctors note should be in our muzzle loader season. Great content. Thank you. Good work.
@jeffhays1968 Жыл бұрын
69 years old, 70Lb vertical bow was my bow. Literally can't pull it any more and have not bow hunted for 5 years. JUST this year bought a higher end crossbow and will be tuning and training for the 2023 season. Crossbows were just allowed in my state recently, hence the purchase. I don't think of them as a rifle, or a good choice for 50 yard + shots or anything else. To me, they are a tool to get me back to chucking arrows again, simply that.
@tylermason3741 2 жыл бұрын
Unfortunately Wisconsin does not have a separate crossbow season. Archery is combined. When you purchase your license, you select vertical bow or crossbow. For $3 you can upgrade to use both.
@BeardedSportsman 3 жыл бұрын
Amen brother! Crossbows of today with the modern technology should not be allowed in the archery season. I live in Michigan and much of what you discussed about PA hunting seasons over lapping and such is the same here. It’s irritating. I think crossbows should ONLY be allowed for anyone under the age of 16 and above 60. It irritates me seeing 20 something year olds that are perfectly capable of drawing a bow shooting crossbows because “well I’m no good with a compound bow. I’m not accurate enough”. Well neither was I when I first got a compound in my youth. It took shooting a compound for about 5-6 years before I was comfortable with shooting past 25 yards. I only take 30 and in shots on whitetails but I’ll smack paper out to 90 yards. But it took a lot of time and dedication and practice to get to where I am with my archery today. No one wants to put forth an effort anymore. They just wanna go kill a deer so they can look good for social media like the television hunters.
@greenwoods1852 3 жыл бұрын
LOL. I don’t even know who you are anymore. Good post. Same feelings here. Well, maybe not as frustrated. Keep up the good work.
@johnsauer4009 3 жыл бұрын
I’m with you 100%. Most crossbow users are lazy and just take advantage of archery season. I prefer to shoot a bow even in gun season. Thanks for speaking up !!! Especially in PA
@ericwolbert3256 2 жыл бұрын
100 percent! I live in pa to! I think it’s time we all start speaking up!
@douglasborgaro6801 10 ай бұрын
@ericwolbert Cry all you want! Speak up as much as you think you should! You do realize that you will never unring the bell? You know that, don’t you? This argument that you and your like-minded buddies are having with yourselves is an argument that is considered long over by most conservation agencies. See my previous post. Whether or not hunters are using crossbows really doesn’t affect you at all. But in truth, you are in the minority now. Crossbows now outnumber vertical bow hunters in all 28 states that have allowed them. It’s a fact! There is nothing you can do to change that. Go ahead and try if you need convincing. I’m not sure that you understand that yet. You will!
@muddog2159 3 жыл бұрын
ThEy have bows that shoots close to 400 FPS deer don’t care what you use as long is an clean ethical shot doesn’t matter what other people want to use it’s too get people outside so welcome to your future
@travistwwreck1535 3 жыл бұрын
Then Use them in Gun Season not Bow season. Which is the point of this Video.
@davidogle4269 3 жыл бұрын
I'm a 58 year old bowhunter that will continue to hunt with my compound bow as long as I can. If I need to reduce the draw weight I will, but I'm not interested in a crossbow.
@fiddlor 3 жыл бұрын
First: i'm not from the U.S. , but the last weeks i became a huge fan of your channel. I used to be a trad bow shooter for decades. Till my finger quit. Now back to compound, hopefully my pullfinger will be okay again. I'm also a hunter and owner of a Excalibur 440 and love shooting with whatever i can get in my hands. First i was not sure what your point is but i got it really fast. And can't totally understand your two main points. Hopefully. Nr.1 getting a bunch of people in a selected time in the same area creates total chaos. Totally agree with. Nr.2 getting people in this specific area and time which want to use the pros of the seasion without earning it and (sure not all) without be qualified. It's lika pay to win. And the losers are the woundshot animals. I can see similar "evolutions" growing in multiple other situations across my country and the whole world. And this sucks... Totally agree to you. But keep going and hoping one day it will get better. I'll stick with you. And today i gonna set up my nu APA and i will keep getting my advices and tips and tricks from you 😁
@scottmercure4950 3 жыл бұрын
In Wisconsin when the season starts you can use a crossbow with upgrade fee no separate season. When I started hunting I remember when we had to stop all hunting a week before gun not no more you can bow right up to opening day. here in Wisconsin you can bow hunt during gun
@whopperplopper 2 жыл бұрын
Couldn't agree more! Crossbows were allowed for the handicapped and elderly. Now they are pretty much muzzle loaders during archery season.
@aseiler6474 Жыл бұрын
My thing with the crossbow is that at least it’s still hunting. U still have to put urself in the right spot and get the deer close enough, u still have to understand range and arrow drop. Does it give you an advantage? Most certainly, but it’s still nowhere near the advantage of a rifle that can shoot 2-250 yards point of aim, and if u can see the deer u can kill it, don’t have to get close. Gun “hunting” should just be called live action target shooting. As far as crossbow speeds, even at 450-500fps, it’s not the advantage ppl think it is, u still have to get a deer inside 40 yards for an ethical shot in regards to a deers reaction time. As far as the double barrel crossbow, that’s the last think we need. I can only imagine all the deer running around with 2 arrows in it butt instead of 1
@samivey8416 3 жыл бұрын
I agree with you. Used to be that you got a crossbow if you had shoulder surgery. Or 1 arm. But now I have people who never hunted bragging about how far they can shoot and not even practicing the shot
@40beretta1 3 жыл бұрын
I LOVE the Can of worms.. ... . I do have a shoulder issue...yet I never went X-bow. Until this yr., I've been using my Hoyt compound bow from the 90s. only by chance did I upgrade to a 2011 G5 Hammer... I do fall right straight into the "Don't Practice Enough". Yes, I'll admit it...Lazy, Club Volleyball, and Ministries have taken up some time. Personally, I don't consider Xbow as "Archery". I had many people tell me that I should have got my daughter an XBow....nope. AJA You should send this to your DNR.
@iBleedStarsAndBars 2 жыл бұрын
Broken neck with 4 disk fusion, broken shoulder with 4 screws, surgery on both knees, nerve relocation in draw elbow. All this from an atv crash 6 years ago. Wish I could still pull back a bow, believe me. I have trouble rolling out of bed on a good day. Crossbows have given me an avenue back to archery hunting
@averagejackarchery 2 жыл бұрын
You're exactly the right case for it too!!! Kudos to you for getting into the woods, brother.
@CMBDIA 2 жыл бұрын
ok i'll admit, I bought a ravin crossbow because it looked cool. it was my backup just in case i couldn't physically use my bow during my hunt because of a legitimate neck and shoulder surgery shortly before the hunt. but i manned up and stuck with my bow throughout the whole day and boy! was it exhilarating to land the kill with my bow!
@josephsigmon5743 3 жыл бұрын
Just wondering what his opinion would have been when compounds came out. It was the same mumbo/jumbo back then. People were saying "this is going to ruin hunting".
@travistwwreck1535 3 жыл бұрын
No they didnt.
@williambilse 3 жыл бұрын
Meanwhile us trad guys look at compounds the same way.
@beorbeorian150 2 жыл бұрын
Change to under 15 over 60 or veteran - or 300 FPS max for everyone else. That said I just got a bow recently and at 47 I am finding I am having difficulty after shooting 20 shots a day. Lots of pain , bad enough I am now worried about being able to keep up the practice to get comfortable enough to shoot at a deer. I like your point about effectiveness and safety. I have no issues walking about the woods during bow season, but cross bolts going 400fps and 100 yards is an issue in a crowded state like NJ.
@justafan5179 Жыл бұрын
I recently took a course learning to archery hunt. We used crossbows, and I cannot tell you how many times the instructors running the course said to treat them like a vertical bow, not a firearm... i.e. 20 yards or less. I think the biggest draw is people have less and less time to practice, and they still want the accuracy and power... and as long as they are ethically minded, I'm fine with it. That said, yeah, the crowd of people tromping around sniping deer at 60 yards, is absurd... that's not ethical. I could definitely see a crossbow exclusive season becoming standard.
@bwilson7000 3 жыл бұрын
First thing first. Killing an animal should not be sport but for food purpose only. Too many people hunt for antlers now and not food. Second you should kill the animal with the most ethical means possible. Bow hunter in there 50,000 dollar vehicle using every high tech gadget out there to get an upper hand only to dumb down when they can legally use a weapon that gives them far better chance of success and not to mention less wounded animals. And also any stick and string archer could argue the point about compounds. I have taught many people to shoot a compound well enough to start hunting in less than a day and could say that compound archers are lazy. I use to be you and think the same way till I really put thought into the soul purpose of hunting is to be successful. Imagine our ancestors saying we can’t eat tonight cause I’m not shooting a bow, and bow hunters are to lazy to learn how to throw a spear.
@whitetailstorm1967 3 жыл бұрын
I have used compound bows, crossbows, rifles and muzzleloaders to harvest deer. I enjoy any and all of them. Each has its purpose or tactical advantage, which is the whole purpose. If youre looking for disadvantage maybe you should back your let off down from 80 or 90 percent and hold the whole 60 pounds back with no let off. A compound is compound is compound? I think Fred Bear would disagree. Is your 80 percent let off the same as zero? Is a 340 FPS arrow the same as 240? Where do you draw the line? Should we say compound bows should stop advancing at 300, 350 FPS to keep max effective range to 40-50 yards? At what point is it no longer a disadvantage to a crossbow? Because you have to draw the string back you are some how at more of a disadvantage. Is your $2500 compound and $800 fiber optic sights a disadvantage to your fellow hunter who though may be just as capable as you but decides to use a $250 crossbow. I am mostly a compound hunter because that is what i enjoy the most but there are times or applications in which I choose to use a crossbow. I shoot both with comparible consistency. I personally feel there are pros and cons to each. Im certainly not looking to cause myself disadvantage with the tool in which I use to harvest an animal. If thats the point youre making, I honestly find it ridiculous. I can think of 100 other ways you can bring yourself to disadvantage and with that being said, some people do go back to the longbow for the challenge of the hunt. Maybe you should try the compound with no sights and shoot it instinctively? Im just giving you some options. Give up the treestand? The list could continue. While I do see where you wanted to go with this video, it seemed to take a turn. And like many other people who claim to have no problem with crossbows, in the end I believe you convicted yourself of false testimony. Feathers definitely ruffled a tad but no feelings hurt. I would love to have a friendly debate you. Interested?
@jasonseale9219 Жыл бұрын
You said what I have been thinking and you said it very eloquently!
@gibsonlife573 2 жыл бұрын
I could not agree more with you Nate this is so true
@johnjpa808 3 жыл бұрын
Ahh I use a crossbow because I feel like it. Still have to plan the shot is it a regular bow nope. Simple more FPS and KE. My shoulders are strong and I am an able body no excuses I just love using it and the damage it does. If I ever live in a state that doesn’t allow them then I will get a bow. The biggest disadvantage on a bow is having to draw and lower power. crossbow disadvantage big and bulky. Happy hunting all! Use what you want but don’t make excuses I will take a rifle over all 😜. Gotta be careful with what we allow restrictions on. During youth season all other hunters should just stand by and give the youth a few days to hunt it’s only a few days. As outdoorsmen/women it’s our job to create more hunters.
@codeytate1003 3 жыл бұрын
Are archery season in Missouri just considers it in archery category so they can hunt from September 15 through January 15 and yes it’s considered a rifle in my eyes but what do I know 🤷♂️
@thomasham8892 3 жыл бұрын
Can of worms indeed. Personally I can’t stand the stupid things. One could also very easily make the argument modern compound bows give an unfair advantage, but let’s get real, these new crossbows are a whole different animal. Having worked at an archery shop myself I know most bow retailers couldn’t survive without selling crossguns, and that’s very sad. Personally I’m heading in the opposite direction, I have been practicing quite a bit with my recurves, and archery has never been more fun!!!. The buck I killed with my Mathews in October could be my last compound kill. I wish more people would embrace the skill and practice of archery, too many BS excuses out there to burn your cash on a cheater...unless you legitimately have a need to use a crossbow man up and learn the skill of archery...it’s a blast!!!
@jonbrown9490 3 жыл бұрын
Couldn't agree with you more. I do, however, put some blame on the archery companies. Pretty much all you see are ads pushing more speed or a new gadget to help you shoot longer and longer distances ( presumably with accuracy). That's not what archery is about, that kind of advertising is to lure gun hunters over the fence. It's a lot easier to make money by convincing someone a new gadget or faster cam will make a better hunter than to say " archery is about understanding game and getting close" It's the same thing with sports like golf and ultimately makes for a less skilled user. Just my opinion though.
@travistwwreck1535 3 жыл бұрын
I enjoy Compound more than recurve for 2 reasons , I can use more pounds with old damaged worn out shoulders and a draw hand with little feeling in it due to injury, and way less chance of a bad shot on an animal. I did consider using a draw lock on my bow, and have it in the cupboard , but just dont like it, and wont use it until I cant draw anymore. I would never consider a crossbow I would rather a Gun
@2cthetruth 3 жыл бұрын
Personally, who cares. The goal is a dead animal. I mean, I can't stand bows myself and consider them cheaters to traditional means of harvest like jumping on it's back from a tree and cutting it's head clean off. Use of a sling shot or blowgun would be definately pushing the boundaries. Sound rediculous? Well, so does your argument ":-)
@travistwwreck1535 3 жыл бұрын
@@2cthetruth The Bows been around longer than sling shots moron.
@jowho9992 3 жыл бұрын
@@2cthetruth We don't need more hunters in the woods during archery season. The game wardens just want more money. Most crossbow hunters I have seen lack the discipline to hunt the wind. Which ruins the hardcore archers efforts. Get those stinking crossbows out of archery season except for youth and the handicap.😎
@jax9224 2 жыл бұрын
The nice thing about a bow is the light weight and a crossbow is pretty heavy
@michaelturner9450 3 жыл бұрын
Preach brother!!
@ScottWConvid19 3 жыл бұрын
Indiana...can of worms is right. I started bow hunting in 2006 when archery season was still only archery. The early season was less pressured, quieter and mostly peaceful. I took slack from traditional archers for using a compound, but not by many. There were 2 weeks of firearms season and 4 weeks of muzzle loader and archery ran from October 1, through the first weekend of January. Now every lazy weekend warrior that shoots a gun encroaches into archery season and pressures the deer heavily before the rut even starts. Most gun hunters (and yes, crossbow is a gun platform) are not skilled enough to get within 30 yards of a deer and they really are screwing the woods up for those of us that have handled the learning curve and have become skilled. So, basically gun season has filled the entire whitetail deer season with ppl that don't really know how to hunt deer, well.
@scottbennett2816 2 жыл бұрын
I am the only person I know who hunts with compound. Everyone else I know uses crossbow. I am from southwestern Ontario, Canada.
@tdc9766 2 жыл бұрын
I agree completely,but that's the same thing trad archers said about compounds when I was a kid.
@libbybenedict 3 жыл бұрын
THE BEARDDD 👋🏼
@averagejackarchery 3 жыл бұрын
😭😭😭
@renatugaming5730 3 жыл бұрын
@@averagejackarchery did you like the beard or not? Currently in young teenage years so I don't know what beards are like lol
@MHobbs06 3 жыл бұрын
Yeah some people, including myself, should stop at the scruff level.
@backrhodeskansas 3 жыл бұрын
I enjoy both bow and muzzleloader hunting here in SE Kansas. Notice I specify "hunting". My frustration is guys who put out feeders and wait until "Pavlov's" deer come to eat...they call that hunting. There is no summer scouting, reading sign, being aware of the wind, etc. Baiting like this is legal, but is it ethical? What they don't realize is that all the summer scouting and prep work is half the fun. Thanks for the vent......
@cpaoutdoors9926 3 жыл бұрын
I have heard this debate for so long let it go I have been archery pennswoods since 1982 nobody even hunts anymore
@troycox8062 2 жыл бұрын
Totally agree and have said all the same things myself which usually causes an uproar at the local hunting shop. All the special seasons burn my ass too when I finally have time to bow hunt only to find out it’s the early muzzleloader season. All the disadvantages of the original muzzleloader have been taken away just as has happened with the crossbow. Since crossbows and modern muzzleloaders are on the same plane as modern firearms they all ought to share the same modern firearm season and leave the archery season to real bow hunters!
@heathalford4721 3 жыл бұрын
In Mississippi during archery season you can shoot either one, and in private land during primitive weapon season I can hunt with my weapon of choice. However our primitive weapon legally allows a 35 whelen TC encore. It states breech loaded single shots of 35 caliber and larger. My view is as long as it keeps or increases people hunting legally and ethically I’m not complaining
@shadyp-zv3uf 3 жыл бұрын
Do not kill of the traditional and compound bow archery season!!!
@Bobbylegs37 2 жыл бұрын
I'd be upset about firearms entering the archery hunting season, but don't blame crossbows. How do you think barebow shooters feel about compound bows? The differences are equivalent.
@TheBudgetSportsman 3 жыл бұрын
I'm just here to say that the footage from this new camera is 🔥
@averagejackarchery 3 жыл бұрын
Thanks buddy! It's alright. Needs a better editor in post....
@TheBudgetSportsman 3 жыл бұрын
@@averagejackarchery the new camera and lighting looks 100x better than the old basement setup and your doing just fine in post.
@jordanpowell228 3 жыл бұрын
I get both sides as i have done both. I got into bowhunting via a crossbow. It offered a cheaper way to getting hunting now, but it was also the easiest way as i did not have to learn to shoot a bow because it isnt easy, it was intimidating. Finally i was tired of feeling like i wasn't getting the full experience of being a bow hunter with a compound in hand and i set off on this journey that has turned into more than bowhunting or archery for me. Learning how to shoot with proper form, how to set up a bow and tune it for perfect arrow flight, always working to stay sharp. For me theres no comparison, archers with a compound bow in hand are 100 percent more challenged to fill a tag than someone with a crossbow in hand. I dont know what the answer is in terms of having separate seasons or maybe requiring that they are throttled down to achieve the same arrow speeds the average bowhunter with a compound gets to level the playing field. We all know a compound shooting anything faster than 280 fps is pretty dang fast using a reasonably adequate heavy arrow. It does seem odd that the guys willing to spend the time, money, and effort to become efficient with a compound bow can have a guy next to them in the woods that bought a tag, crossbow, some bolts and broadheads only an hour or so after purchase.
@fattybourgeois1014 3 жыл бұрын
One thing I like about crossbows is how accurate they are. As a bow hunter I worry about anti hunters finding out about the seldom talk about non lethal kills in archery hunting. We all know it happens.
@travistwwreck1535 3 жыл бұрын
Most the Compound shooters I know are way more accurate than a Crossbow user. Its seldom talked about because it seldom happens
@jeffhays1968 Жыл бұрын
No offense, and you do make a couple points worth noting, BUT somehow you harken back to the days I lived through where stick bow snobbery was rampant against any wheel bow or compound, And it was virulent hatred of compounds, I can tell you. It will all work out I am sure. Primitive firearms season in some states is just that, no scopes or inline, while other 'Muzzle Loader' seasons allow sabots, scopes, inline ignition and NOW Firestick ignition tubes. Time marches on as they say ? My muzzle loader is sighted in at 200 yards now. Did anyone mention heated clothing yet? That's a coming thing. You can't stop innovation unless you legislate it.
@ethanfeatheroff9135 3 жыл бұрын
The problem lies who’s to determine who has the disadvantage that needs to use a cross bow I put off shoulder biceps surgery in 2018 so I could kill a 215 inch slob with my compound😉 then the next year I had to use the cross bow to hunt then once I healed up back to my compound but idk how I’d have been able to hunt it there was some rule about health or age I think what your missing is hunting is a dying sport I do agree this two arrow cross bow has gone to far but I think it’s great that a cross bow can get more people involved in the outdoors the only thing I don’t agree with is when there scoring deer I think u should have different categories for archers trad is a huge accomplishment that should have its own scoring and well as compound and cross bow but I think if u want to give all these rolls why people shouldn’t be able to use cross bows your going to kill the sport and the industry in a hurry something that’s already lost so many hunters your not at a disadvantage u can use a cross bow if you choose u are given the same opportunity it’s like anything you shoot your compound because u love it you love the challenge just be happy for others success man the only disadvantage I can see is you called your self average jack when you should be captain jack lol
@thetowndrunk988 2 жыл бұрын
It would be very easy for states to implement medical exemptions, and note it on your license.
@johnscranton8365 3 жыл бұрын
Crossbows are great...during muzzle loader and rifle seasons. I am 73 and cannot properly employ my 55# traditional recurve bows (Rotator issues). My Scorpyd Deathstalker-LT has 115# limbs and launches a 401gr arrow at 365fps. Using a rope cocker I am lifting about 57# to cock my bow. This combination will work fine on all game...during the proper season.
@jonbrown9490 3 жыл бұрын
I have a bad shoulder( granted not a rotator cuff tear) and I shoot a 70lb recurve. My physical therapist even suggested to shoot more often as it helps my rhomboid muscles stay loose. And given that you can get a compound with 90%let off in 40 lb...I don't think there's much room for the "sore shoulder" excuse. There's nothing wrong with crossbow hunting...as long as it's during modern rifle or muzzleloader season😜
@mattwilliams6392 2 жыл бұрын
I love my crossbow shot compounds for years. I still have to hunt , scout and practice to be proficient with my crossbow and it’s nice not getting busted every time you have to draw especially from the ground. besides how many compound guys are hunting from the ground! A crossbow is not a gun! If you want a challenge get a low poundage crossbow with open sights where your shots are 20yrds and in. I watch guys shoot deer way further out with a compound then I would ever shoot at a deer with my crossbow. Just my thoughts to each his own. Just go out and enjoy hunting!!!
@davidayres9865 3 жыл бұрын
I started hunting with a crossbow because it was familiar to shooting. I still hunt with my crossbow but now also use my compound. My thing is, I know a crossbow IS NOT A GUN, so I never tried to hunt with it, like it was. I am deadly with both, but I am a little more accurate with my xbow because I can aim more accurately. I will not take a shot at a deer past 40 yards with either, even though I can hit a target out to 70 yds with both.
@mattatter3850 2 жыл бұрын
I live in Wisconsin and crossbow and compound bow are the same season you just have separate licenses. There was a big push to separate but never happened. Yet
@gladegoodrich2297 3 жыл бұрын
Not a crossbow fan, no practice needed, any one can shoot right out of the box. I'm 75 broken, shoulder (twice) major heart attack April. Pull my bow just fine, shot my Utah buck in August and packed it to my truck. MAN UP ALL YOU OLD TIMERS !
@mine8009 2 жыл бұрын
Fortunately Montana has not followed this trend (yet). The newest regs are still pretty explicit that a crossbow does not constitute archery equipment. Yeah, you can use them in weapons restrictions areas, and during the rifle seasons, but you can’t in the archery specific seasons.
@halfcalkt8367 2 жыл бұрын
I think the cross bows should have to hunt with the muzzle loader crowd. The capability of a side lock hawken and a modern cross bow are almost exactly the same thing now. I hunt both hawken smoke poles and stick bows. I have a real hard time with an “archery season “ that allows equipment capable of lethal shots as far out as 150 yards. (And yes, if you put in the time, you could reliably make kill shots that far and farther with some of those.)
@bkbowhunter1 3 жыл бұрын
You’re right on point. West Virginia does same thing doe/ gun season in October. I don’t have a problem with them but I have No Desire to shoot one. Actually im thinking pretty hard about giving a recurve a shot this fall 👍
@TheWVgoodguy22 3 жыл бұрын
I have been calling them String Rifles for a long time now. I remember over 6 years ago WV required a Y license (had to have a doctor's note stating disability), but now it is open for all. My Dad who is now 63, but has had a legit elbow injury for a couple decades now where he it hurts to draw a bow back is finally going to get a crossbow to extend his hunting season. He use to be a pretty good recurve archer. I hope that he does so before turkey season. I agree with you, these weapons are great for youth or the older crowd. There are some folks who work in a high intensity labor job or have been in a wreck and sustained a disabling long term injury that are in their 30s to 50s, but many people take advantage of the system and are lazy. My cousin asked me if I wanted to use his crossbow that he has for his kids since I missed 3 does. I just couldn't bring myself to doing so. The only time that I can see myself using a crossbow is winter time when it's really cold and difficult to draw. Since I never practiced with a heavy coat on I didn't go out with a bow after our rifle and muzzleloader seasons. We have an early doe rifle season during the 3rd week of October. I saw the biggest buck of the year while holding a rifle during early antlerless season.
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