As a fellow noob myself with only 2 semesters of woodshop and years between practice, my advice is to practice. I watched all sorts of videos before getting back into the swing of things, but you learn best from your own failures. Soaking up all of this new information is one thing, but being able to recall and apply it with skill takes practice.

This comment is 2 years old. If you've stuck with the hobby; please share what you have learned on this topic.

Little late to the party here but how did you upgrade the fence on yours?

I started woodworking a couple of months ago and wasted my money on a ridgid portable saw. It takes me a hell of a lot of time to adjust the fence, the rivig knife is aligned with the blade. Complete waste, I wish I saw this video earlier, I would have saved up my money for a real contractor saw.

Saw Stop is a very good saw, but when you start getting into that money, it's worth looking at euro saws. Love Felder/Hammer.

But you are foolish if you don’t realize that anything besides SawStop is too dangerous to use on a regular basis. You are kidding yourself to not factor in the cost of accidents times their probability.

@@garnetsteen I strongly disagree. Good practices go a long way. Yes, there are people who follow bad practices, and have been lucky. Many even promote those bad practices here on YT, and if you call them out, attack you with "Safety Sally" comments and the full wrath of their rabid supporters. I feel like that cavalier attitude does more to promote unsafe practices than tools to to promote them. But there are lots of channels here that promote good practices like the right kinds of push sticks, using riving knives, guards, etc. The good riving knife and optional overhead guard do more to protect you on the Saw Stop than the emergency braking mechanism, because amputations (partial or full) of the finger are not the worst or anywhere near the most common saw accidents. The SawStop protects against only one kind of accident, which is relatively rare compared to kickback. It's a good saw, but the religion around it is annoying. I'm a big fan of proper euro sliding table saws. I know not everyone is. But f you look at those saws, the workflow is different enough that you don't run into many of the same issues (required brake for the blade. better riving knives, overhead guards, different operating position, workpiece carried by the sliding table, no need for sleds, better dust collection, etc.). In the UK and Europe, they're also available for relatively cheap across a broad quality range, whereas only the high-end ones tend to be available here in the US (except for with Grizzly, which has a decent lower-price one). I favor these over the Saw Stop because of all the reasons mentioned above, and how they contribute to an overall higher safety level vs the Saw Stop. Don't get me wrong: the SawStop is a really good saw, but it's a bit of a strongly-funded sock puppet religion here on YT. There are very few channels here recommending Saw Stop who actually had to pay for it themselves. I've found that few actually disclose that openly as well, which is a bad practice. Anyway, this is old, but the database is online and you can build your own queries. www.popularwoodworking.com/article/table-saw-injury-numbers-in-perspective/ . (It's interesting to note that doors cause more finger amputations than table saws.)

Pete Brown why?

What do the European saws have that ours do not?

I have the cordless version of that saw as well, along with the 40 tooth DeWalt blade that makes cleaner and slower cuts. The cordless version has a very interesting motor; it's a brushless variable speed variable load motor with an electric brake, and gives this particular saw some very different characteristics that I don't see in other saws.

Thank you this comment

While doing interior carpentry work to my home I bought a table saw at Wal Mart for less than 200. I was only wanting to be able to make square cuts along with 45s to cut my own window trim. I'll say for what I needed I was surprised at the accuracy and ease of cutting straight and accurate. I made a side table same height and a couple jigs for specific cuts. It did all fine but the quality waned with time and I had to use square to check fence. The table also developed problems. It was however well worth the $ it cost and Id recommend it for this type job as well for a beginner. I was both and it helped me recognize what I liked or didn't as well as what all I could do if this was the only floor tool I had room to use. They all even the 189. dollar model can be dangerous and cut hands like wood. Use safely.

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that_G_EvanP Spell check strikes again. 😁

Zerostar369 what do you mean by “runout on the arbor”? I don’t know what that means.

I only make bird houses but bought a ICS 5hp with sliding attachment 52"

TheMatterManipulator those are the last version of the old belt drive BT3000 and BT 3100 series. They’re so famous they have their own forum and fan base among contractors. Really good saw, but for a portable saw, takes allot of footprint in the truck. I’ve had 2 of these. Now have something similar, with muuuuch more torque. Arguably strongest saw u can find that’s portable and is aimed at contractors. Skilsaw sp-99. Large table, Blade set towards back of table so great for crosscut sleds. Rack-punion fence ( like dewalt, but better. Larger gears and lass slop) And most importantly, blade comes up to 3-5/8” And will plow thru a pressure treated 4x4 without a sweat. I’ve plowed thru 3-1/2” oak with it, and the thing just chews thru it.

What did you replace your job site saw with

@@zachofalltrades6116 My next saw was a Ridgid 4512. Definitely an upgrade. Now an old 3hp Unisaw. Looking at a Harvey Alpha or Sawstop PCS next.

I disagree. You should buy the best you can’t afford☺️

Also, if you're close to 80, safety is even more important. I went for Sawstop because I am 80 and my eyes, arms, fingers, etc. are not as good as they used to be, but I still love woodworking.

Does your Ridgid happen to be the R4512? If so what are your thoughts on it?

"REDWINGS” yuck, I prefer unpainted cast-iron wings which are usually grey... and NJ Devils ;-)

I find I keep coming back to this video. And LGB! Miss the old "chuck" Norris.

I went through the same. If you have a Northern Tool near you their drill presses are great and affordable.

If you haven't decided yet, I have used sawstops in a production shop before I started on my own; they are absolutely fantastic saws. Plenty of power, the safety feature is a great addition, the fences are great, dust collection is great. All around a fantastic saw. I have used their folding jobsite saw, the 3 hp cabinet saw, and the 5 hp cabinet saw.

I pulled the trigger and got the SawStop. Just want to be safe.

@@AlexPrivett Thanks for the reply. I obviously missed this awhile ago.

Thank you for perspective. I will resign myself to only buy a used saw with a riving knife. Party on my friend.

This isnt really for you DJ; you sound experienced and know what you want; and I want it very clear im super on board with that! I just want a comment to help "clarify" things for those that may come across it. -> Riving knives *ARE* a great device to have installed; and you really should be aspiring to have a saw with one. That said, it is "ok" to not have a riving knife. Most issues come from a fence thats not squared up properly (even imperceptible amounts off) parallel to the blade, improper feeding of the wood, or a defect in the wood that causes it to close up after cutting (this is something you can observe quite easily. Sometimes the wood fibers create tension where the cut is, resulting in the ends that are cut to "come together" after the blade. This causes it to pinch on the blade, which can send it zooming across the room!). Zero clearance inserts also help; proper cutting techniques with a proper square fence goes further than a riving knife. Relying on a tool to make up for your work practices shouldn't really be the way to aspire your operations; at least not from a technical safety perspective. Riving knives are a relatively new addition to the table saw world; and much like the saw stop system, its not a "requirement" nor a replacement for proper operation. To those looking, YES, please get a saw with a riving knife, but also, dont pass up a good deal on an awesome vintage Delta with a solid cast iron top and 2hp motor because it doesnt have a riving knife either lol. Learn how to use it safely, learn proper techniques, make sure everything is dialed in as well as you can make it, and dont make risky cuts. I've used a saw without a riving knife for quite a long time, much as many others have as well. And for the love of god, always use a push stick and wear your PPE lol. If youre standing out of the line of fire, using a proper push stick system, wearing safety goggles, and are paying attention; even if something bad happens to the wood, you're just very much not likely to get hurt. Kickback accidents happen when people get "sucked in" to the blade or the piece gets ejected at high velocity back at you. People have died from this, that should be clear, but its very unlikely they were operating properly.

And to you! I owned one of those Rigid contractor saws myself a few years ago; was definitely the 24" model (Mine was the r4512; the new one is the r4520). Had a cast iron plate and the same stamped side pieces; I cant imagine those are changed lol. IF you havent, the single best thing I did to that saw was upgrading it to a biesemeyer fence. Im not sure if mine was just notably bad, if im just super picky, or if its really just a crappy fence (I have my ideas lol), but that fence was just not inspiring for me. Once I swapped the fence out with a biesemeyer from JET (it was a pain to install, but the difference was staggering), got some jigs and sleds made; that thing served me pretty well for a while. Wound up having to upgrade because the power was inadequate for the cuts I was doing (it'll do a 2x4" with a smile, but ripping Jarrah and other exotic super hard woods? Not so much lol). The capacity was fine for my uses; and I imagine 30" should cover pretty much everyone thats not an industrial worker for a while. Wonder if it would be worth while to upgrade the motor on it as well? I noticed a lot of "bad reviews" were from people that didnt set the damn thing up lol. Sure, some tops werent flat, and thats a problem, but in every case home depot replaced them to my understanding. The rest of it I couldnt see anyone complaining about? Its a good saw, if I didnt get a great deal on an old school mahoosive 12" beast for 400$, Im pretty sure i would have hot rodded mine. If they'd upgrade to a biesemeyer, i think they'd have something real cool there.

@@JgHaverty Good points. I definitely have trouble now and again because the fence goes out of alignment. This takes a lot of fussy adjusting. The riving knife itself can also get misaligned; I think that is a consequence of the fence misalignment. What happens is that the work pulls one direction or the other when the fence goes out of whack. This can put a lot of lateral force on the saw blade, and on the riving knife, which is mounted on socket head screws. Worse, the misaligned fence can cause a skewed cut, and of course can increase the likelihood of kickback or some other mishap. I have learned to live with this, more or less, but I do sometimes have a bit of dread about using the saw. I had honestly forgot about the possibility of a fence upgrade. A Biesemeyer fence would be great, but I'm wondering about one of the more affordable upgrades from Busy Bee Tools here in Canada. Some research is in order.

@@djpenton779 Id be hard pressed to recommend you go find a "cheap fence" to replace your "cheap fence" if yuo catch my drift haha. Used ones pop up on amazon and ebay semi routinely; mine was from an overstock warehouse for like 100 bucks; but I had to supply the side rail (not a huge deal at all). I remember hating that fence because of the exact things you're talking about. It would always seem to lock in askew no matter how much i tightened it. It got to the point where I did get some kick back from a longer board and i stopped using it all together lol. I actually took an an aluminum extrusion and just clamped it where I needed it to be for my cuts. (Most of my cuts are repeated numerous cuts of the same material, so its not too bad for me). What drives me bonkers, I bought one of those hercules job site saws from harbor freight for some projects out and about and it irritates me to no end... the fence on it is proper decent lol. it locks perfectly parallel to the blade, doesnt wobble, doesnt deflect, and doesnt find itself askew either lol. If my "cheap" (it was like 350, not pocket change, but certainly not a full cabinet either) jobsite saw can make a reliable, useful fence... why the hell cant these other manufacturers do the same? haha Is what it is I guess, but its truly baffling. Im actually gonna have to take it apart and see how it works; because its honestly quite nice. anyway good luck with your search; Im not gonna pretend to be an expert on every fence out there; so id just recommend you hop on a forum and ask around a bit. Be careful with reviews; and get more than one, because a lot of people have this weird "need" to "justify" their cheap purchase and explain how awesome it is, when its potentially quite not. Happens with table saws more often than people like to admit. "I have my vintage table saw and since it has a cast iron top, its QUALITY". NO mate, its just heavy lol.

@Harry Knows well, like I said, mine is much older, maybe the quality has dropped since I got mine, plus, I'm only on my second general purpose blade in the tool, seems to me that those guys who are always forcing a cut are using too much pressure whether it is a saw or a drill. Wears it the cutters quicker. I've always let the tool do it's job at its own pace. I rarely even use the dog's on a chainsaw. Sharp teeth and gravity does the job well enough. Of course you don't have gravity helping with a table saw cut, but light pressure greatly reduces burning in the wood and heat in the blade that allows it to dull more quickly. Thanks for the well wishes, that some day I can afford a better table/cabinet saw.

The same for me except I bot a skilsaw portable job site. While the fence is not in the same league as the more expensive saws it does stay square to the blade when locked down and will be easy to readjust if it does come out of line. With a good blade it has enough power to rip most hardwoods.

Yeah it's not a luxury saw, but it works, and it is as accurate as you are. That's what matters to me, at least.

same :D

I too have one of those old craftsman 113. Keep it clean and lubed. After market Vega Pro 52 fence - great guns. Also added the trunnion adjustment brackets. Can’t recall the name offhand. Very pleased. Only nits are insert location and size relative to the blade (blade sets too far back for a splitter), and the blade guard needs redesign to incorporate dust collection.

@@grobish PALS :)

The PALS kit is next on my list. Still got it to .002 accuracy without it but they are a pain to adjust

SS Pro is a full-on Cabinet saw. SS Industrial is also a cabinet saw, just beefier. Notably the Trunions are stout enough to handle the demands of the optional 7.5 HP motor, and the table is larger, thicker and heavier to withstand the greater forces involved.

I am with you. I am in my 60s and new to table saws. I also know I am slowing down, my balance and reflexes are not what they used to be, I did not see that one coming. I will spend the extra grand or so and feel better. I don't need any serious injuries at this point of my life, no one does.

I wept until my SawStop arrived. Now I am all smiles!!!

Brandon Peterson and 11 thumbs up. I can’t change that!

I almost didn't like this... Because it had 11 & I was 12th

Liquid Wrench puts out "Silicone Spray"... AND I use it fairly religiously on just about any application that involves both metal and plastic and/or rubber... such as electric motors with bushing or bearings or both. The occasional squeal isn't necessarily "damage done"... but can come from dried dust in a bushing... or a dry bearing... A couple shots of silicone (while Power is OFF) and turn the blade manually can quiet the hell out of it... and at least buy you some time to get that bearing replaced. ;o)

HI, James. I really love your videos and the things you've built and designed. Regarding this video though, I have a question. Is the Sawstop professional a hybrid, or Cabinet table saw? In other words. Do the trunnions and motor mount to an internal framework, Or do they hang from the under side of the top itself? Thanks, and keep building more Awesome projects. Doug

I have a 12" 3hp sliding table saw... 35 years and going strong. I run 10" blades.. never found a need for 12".

I have same but fence is a pain.

Delta has a hybrid saw at Lowes for same price range but much better fence

Returned my R4512 today. Alignment issue still exists in 2019, ridiculous. Never buying another tool from the orange store

John - The trade off is a much better fence for worse dust collection. I chose the Delta got the fence.

Had a DELTA from 1998 ,somewhat portable, integrated motor/arbor with a very good fence. The motor self destructed within 3 yrs of moderate use. 2nd motor (cost was near saw replacement) developed a vibration pretty quickly. Sold it and replaced with a ridgid 4513 portable which has served well through 2 complete kitchen makeovers. Alignment and fence were very good and held 1/64” or better across 36” consistently. I use a sled for more precision on rails and stiles drawer construction. Could be just luck and perhaps the newer DELTAS are more reliable but the motor problems gave me no confidence in the brand.

I didn't know DeWalt made a contractor saw. I've seen DeWalts jobsite saws, and they're great. Summit stumpy kinda skipped a level of new contractor saws

i am goin to buy my first table saw, and for several reasons, i decided to go for a Metabo 254 m (thi si sthe mobile version). IT cam as a result of comparing over 15 saws from several brands. Metabo has many security and engine features (slow start, overload control, quick stop, quite good cutting capacity and some positive reviews. But after your video i am not so sure anymore. The saw will be built into a workbench, so the weight and vibrations should be sorted out and the extension as well.. Even Though it has pretty good results on precisions and the fence looks solid i am planning to replace it with an aftermarket one. However the main Cns i can see after "absorbing" your knowledge: aluminum but not iron casted table; seems that it's underpowered with only 1500W. Could you advice then on an alternative to my choice? For the money and space limitations i will not go for anything in the cabinet class, but the Bosch GTS 635-216 with a disc smaller by 1/5 (8.5 inches against Metabo's 10 inches) has 1600W power and pretty much similar features. PLus the cutting capacity is only 1 cm difference (7 cm against 8 cm on Metabo saw. Well there si a more performant version of Bosch model GTS 10 J with 10'' disk and 1800W but still with an aluminium top. Any hints would be greatly appreciated... Thanks and regards, V.