Engineering Avatar’s Upside Down Architecture

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On Structures

On Structures

Күн бұрын

Пікірлер: 180
@VitaminDatai
@VitaminDatai 2 ай бұрын
the airbenders wanted a place to hang out and one of them took it a little too far
@ZacharyRodriguezVlogs
@ZacharyRodriguezVlogs Ай бұрын
Sokka, is that you?
@Empress-Missy
@Empress-Missy Ай бұрын
Siri, how do i pay a youtuber commenter for their comment
@crunchybro123
@crunchybro123 Ай бұрын
Hang on, after I realized that joke my world just turned upside down!!
@NextToToddliness
@NextToToddliness Ай бұрын
That temple existed before the Fire Nation's rampage, so it's not without reason to assume the Earth Benders lent a hand. If you look at their cities, it's pretty obvious that they "stamp their feet" and structures form up (or in this case, down) from the ground. If it's solid rock, then it's hanging from itself and doesn't need much artificial structural integrity, as the added components hang off the rock core. Since the temples don't continue into the rock upwards, then the reason it looks solid is because the connection to the overhang of the structures isn't hollow, because it doesn't have to be. The whole point of the Air Temples were for meditative seclusion and fortification, so the only way you can get to them is largely by air travel.
@Natibe_
@Natibe_ Ай бұрын
As you alluded to at the end of the video, the biggest issue of the western air temple, funnily enough, is the rock formation. The stone is apparently some sort of metamorphic rock, so it cant be cut out by air like in mesa verde, and rivers would not be able to create such a wide cut-out. Additionally, the closer to the edge you get, the less stable the rock will be as it thins and its support gets further away, and yet the biggest temples are also close to the edge. Ultimately, there isnt a rock strong enough to support all this which could reasonably form on top of a layer weak enough to be eroded away. Unless you have badgermoles in your basement, its the geology that makes the temple impossible.
@sonarun
@sonarun Ай бұрын
For me the geology would be such that it was completely solid and of high tensile strength. There are no air gaps and have a crystalline structure that doesn’t not have cracks. That is the only way the original structure can be intact before the buildings can even be built. So, in essence, earth benders.
@kv4648
@kv4648 Ай бұрын
Maybe another air nomad avatar helped them out with the earth bending? Or they could have negotiated with their limited connections for something with the Earth benders
@Jonathon_H
@Jonathon_H Ай бұрын
Whether by earth benders in this universe, or regular workers IRL, it’s possible this overhand isn’t natural and used to be a regular vertical drop. Then the temple and all the negative space was carved out and then below removed to create an overhang and the temple. There are plenty of examples of this method being used (granted right side up) where the whole temple is a solid piece of carved rock and still attacked to the ground. See the Kailasa Temple in Ellora India for an example of the largest such construction.
@Soguwe
@Soguwe 2 ай бұрын
I would absolutely agree that the main structures of the temples are made out of steel. The geography supports it. The western Air temple is situated right between two major points that would make it easier to both source and work enough iron to make that steel. It is close to the fire nation, who have the metallurgic knowledge and skill to mass produce the steel, and an area that would later be known as Yu Dao, the first Fire nation colony in the earth kingdom after Sozin did his thing with the Air nation. Later also known as Republic City, skyscraper Central. Rich in Iron and home to many skilled earthbenders. It would fit the air nomad philosophy to hire from both sides of the oceanic divide to construct a temple they could only build by all working together
@guilhermerafaelzimermann4196
@guilhermerafaelzimermann4196 2 ай бұрын
Not to mention the fact the area they camp in sports massive metal doors
@AGryphonTamer
@AGryphonTamer 2 ай бұрын
This would have been built minimum 100 years before the episode. Before the fire nation's industrial revolution, or Sozin's comet. The colonies may have existed, it's hard to say, but they certainly wouldn't be large industrial powerhouses yet.
@Soguwe
@Soguwe 2 ай бұрын
@@AGryphonTamer it was definitely built long before Doesn't change much about it, though The fire nation/fire islands were good at metallurgy long before their industrialisation. It comes with the element, smithing iron is easier when you can keep it hot by breathing on it And the area of Yu Dao doesn't need to be a colony to be rich in iron and earth bending talent
@renaigh
@renaigh Ай бұрын
a Air Nomad Avatar hundreds, if not thousands of years prior to the show learnt Earth Bending. Or maybe the Temple was originally an Earth Kingdom settlement in the West that was left abandoned for hundreds of years that Air Nomads appropriated.
@bleflar9183
@bleflar9183 Ай бұрын
Or the air nomads hired some earth mages to help them build it.
@clayongunzelle9555
@clayongunzelle9555 Ай бұрын
There is no reason why air benders couldn't get earth benders to make this temple for them... That's what I always thought
@BlazeMakesGames
@BlazeMakesGames 2 ай бұрын
I imagine that it might be easier to get insurance for such a project when your construction workers can all fly, Especially when combined with some earth benders to provide a means of moving the heavier materials in a similar way. One theory is maybe the entire cliff side was actually solid stone previously, meaning with zero overhang. And what they did was carve out the entire cliff into the shape of the air temple before hollowing out certain areas and adding in whatever utilities they needed. It would be a colossal undertaking sure but I feel like that would also provide a more stable place for people to like, stand, while working on it as the ground is slowly excavated around what would become the structures and then all of the buildings are technically all part of the same rock. Maybe it was made by an ancient Avatar with access to all the bending styles (it is worth pointing out this is above the fire nation as well so we're already 3 for 4 after including earth bender construction lol). We've seen avatars able to perform great feats while in the avatar state with them able to move huge swathes of earth and other elements. With a powerhouse like that maybe the foundations of the whole place was carved out in only a day or so.
@madhatterzake3871
@madhatterzake3871 Ай бұрын
Good to know I'm not the only one with this type of idea.
@adampolzin8061
@adampolzin8061 2 ай бұрын
I just found this channel. Posted 4 minutes ago? thats INSANE lol, keep up the good work
@onstructures
@onstructures 2 ай бұрын
The algorithm coming thru!
@DThorn619
@DThorn619 2 ай бұрын
Here's an idea, how about doing a similar video but on Wan Shi Tong's Library instead? Must be some impressive structure to handle the weight of all that sand above it for so long. From what I recall we really only see the tip of the tower, the inside, and a drawing of it.
@onstructures
@onstructures Ай бұрын
Ah Yes! The library has been on my list of video ideas! That will be a fun one
@nth256
@nth256 Ай бұрын
Why "instead"?
@evanjacoby7805
@evanjacoby7805 2 ай бұрын
Just watched that episode - great exploration! The thing I used to tell myself as a kid who needed every aspect of his favorite cartoon to make sense - was that it was carved from the cliff, a la Petra, but that the cliff was a much stronger granite-like material. Anyway thanks for the great vid
@dragotatsuki5303
@dragotatsuki5303 2 ай бұрын
Could be a hallowed out stalactite, the base is solid but the lower sections are hallowed out
@Diomedes343
@Diomedes343 2 ай бұрын
On the topic of avatar locations I would be interested in hearing your takes on the Boiling Rock and Northern Water Tribe. I would also like to hear about the feasibility of building a town and amusement park on a mangove in the middle of the ocean at the Sabaody Archipelago if you consider more topics from One Piece.
@onstructures
@onstructures 2 ай бұрын
Thanks for the suggestions, those sound like good video ideas! And I definitely plan on going back to One piece soon enough
@Arikanda
@Arikanda Ай бұрын
I just imagine that this place is built upon cartoon logic. Nobody really questions in depth how the building stay anchored and the moment an actual engineer comes and makes a structural analysis the whole place falls down immediately.
@user-nd7rg5er5g
@user-nd7rg5er5g Ай бұрын
It was cool seeing an architectural view on the Western Air Temple. My personal theory is that the hanging buildings were built out of the solid rock itself, and with the "roof" elements being made out of more conventional and lighter building materials added afterwards. I'm not too sure about the tensile strength of rock though lol.
@demetriuscarha9531
@demetriuscarha9531 Ай бұрын
Well, you have to consider safety when building a structure. Most humans would find it scary to live in a suspended structure so they wouldn't consider it, but airbenders don't care.
@onstructures
@onstructures Ай бұрын
Oh for sure, I’d be last in line to try and live in a place like that. I respect gravity too much
@ferydickdong2235
@ferydickdong2235 Ай бұрын
Hey .....ITS good in waste manajemen.....i mean just trow everything
@duckpotat9818
@duckpotat9818 Ай бұрын
Here's a support material you forgot: rope Since the entire structure is solely under tension, you don't need rigidity if the cables can be kept taut. Silk, cotton, jute and bamboo fibers have much better specific tensile strength than most (if not all) metals/alloys. And there are natural structures that hang of cliffs- plants! So drill through the rock overhang, drop cables down it and anchor the cables throughout the material like plant roots. You could also anchor it with laterally to the cliff face with additional cables. Drill down from the top then to the cliff face in an L shape. Also makes it easier to build scaffolding. You could use the drilled holes to drop down supplies and workers. The vertical cables could be anchored to the same beam as the lateral cables away from the overhang, making it a sort of tensegrity structure. The closest structures to what I described are cable cars and suspended railways. While not at the same scale, suspension bridges were anchored along cliff faces similarly throughout history.
@xyreniaofcthrayn1195
@xyreniaofcthrayn1195 Ай бұрын
It's assumed either an earthbender/s were either friends with an airbender or were simply contracted by the airbenders to construct the temples themselves leaving detail work up to the airbenders' hammer and chisel work. This particular temple seems to have been a cliff face at some point in prehistory that has been carved into, so the temple is precisely all rock and i would imagine that there is an entire counterweight system below the temple in the rock somewhere. The temple is really only being worn away by the breath of time and sparky sparky boom man.
@SlavTiger
@SlavTiger Ай бұрын
Combustion man
@wyattblaine7066
@wyattblaine7066 Ай бұрын
Why couldn’t this project have been the love child of some airbending avatar. The buildings would be at that point, a formation of the rock, albeit one with right angles
@AGryphonTamer
@AGryphonTamer 2 ай бұрын
Using steel in the world of Avatar feels weird to me. The fire nation had some, though even they mostly used iron, and every other nation used metals very sparingly. A suit of armor or sword. Enough steel for a building like this (especially noting it's 100 years old minimum) just wouldn't be possible in universe. I like the stalactite theory the best. I'm not sure how strong an earth bender would be able to make the rock, but if it were mostly solid I could see it being just strong enough. Wood for the most of the rest of the structure.
@zennvirus7980
@zennvirus7980 2 ай бұрын
You are right, hanging buildings, fictional or otherwise, have very little references available. There are just too many variables involved in their construction and integrity. The only other big reference I can think of, off the top of my head, is a location from the old Dreamcast/Nintendo Cube game, Skies of Arcadia (year 2000). In there, you have a whole ass city called Glacia that is made of and hangs of ice. Or some opaque, ice-like material. It is built and looks more or less like the western air temple. The catch here is that the city is supposedly built using "super advanced lost technology", so it's any bunny's guess how they built the whole thing under a glacier floating in the sky, and what manner of materials they used. Also, as the paragraph above hints at, the world of Skies of Arcadia is a world of floating continents (very cool looking, and arguably the best damn world ever made for a game), so aside from the tech and materials, there's also the unique gravitational quirks of the world of Arcadia, which should make a hanging city more feasible because of them. In theory. Maybe check that one out and make another video on that unique and wondrous place. There's also plenty of footage available thanks to the many walkthroughs and playthroughs in Ytube.
@onstructures
@onstructures Ай бұрын
That sounds epic, I appreciate the suggestion. Gaming videos are a bit harder for me to work and research on, especially if I’m not familiar with them, but this is definitely going on my list. Thanks for watching!
@bwjclego
@bwjclego Ай бұрын
I think the most plausible way to construct this sort structure would be anchored cables (likely steel), that are tied through the structure to the 'base' (the low tip), and is tightened such that the main structure is under compression. Look at the cables anchorages for massive suspension bridges.
@onstructures
@onstructures Ай бұрын
Ah a post tensioned structure! That’d be like upside down versions of Toronto’s CN tower! Good idea
@seannall7718
@seannall7718 2 ай бұрын
The thing is as air benders, they actually can play a weird role in concrete since they could probably more or less have it set instantly. ontop of a deeply connect root system like with the foliage around here (foliage down here with no light, hanging in a ravine) might be alright to afix it to the rooting systemover a period of time. If we can pull water out of course sand, you can prolly yank the air out of it while possibly being able to keep a hydration level, hence the free running water in a structure that, for flying people, prolly shouldnt be there unless necessary. And since back in the day we sometimes had a habit of just... pooping down tunnels that could just be far enough from the smell, idk if the waters for plumbing I hope they had a good relation with fire benders though and maybe got steel, but besides needing then earth benders to take extensives to bring all this stuff down here and assemble it for them (Cuz I dont think the airbending can get there, maybe with the bison like ox for the job) I almost feel like the airbenders are friendly, but bad earth bending partners if theyre always asking for ridiculous places to store their cakes and meditate all day lol
@the11382
@the11382 Ай бұрын
The problem with concrete is low tensile strength. Concrete is reinforced to improve tensile strength, but rust prevents reinforced concrete from lasting long. This is especially true if there's a climate of hot summers and cold winters due to the expansion and contraction of the metal.
@jsbrads1
@jsbrads1 Ай бұрын
The bottom surface the air temples are connected to have small stalagmites already implying that a stalagmite structure is also the core of the air temple. The air nomads minimalist approach would imply they would also choose to live in an environment where their homes conformed more to the natural environment rather than fighting against it.
@NickAndriadze
@NickAndriadze 2 ай бұрын
Great analysis video, I like your takes on how a real-life freely hanging structure like the gorgeous western air temple could be designed. I still think that it is possible that the structures could have been sculpted by earthbenders from the overhang rock itself or maybe *actual stalactites* they turned into structures or added ornamental elements onto. Also, the scaffolding could just be hanging from the ceiling rock (And connected to the ground above the cliff overhang via ladders), there are a lot examples of scaffolding or other platforms hanging from the roof of buildings, like those window cleaning platforms outside skyscrapers.
@onstructures
@onstructures Ай бұрын
Thanks! Glad you liked the video. Yea the window washing supports (I call them Davits) sort of what I was alluding to in the video with regards to the construction support. Recently on an 11-story building I was workin on, the contractors had to install something outside of the highest floor and proposed more or less what I sketched during the video.
@TimeKitt
@TimeKitt Ай бұрын
Note the cliff structures behind the hanging buildings. The whole overhang could have once been that height, and they could have carved up from the bottom, doing things like carving away fissures and following the overhanging slope to place and size the buildings. An earthbender using some stone sense is likely very important, but I can imagine just an air avatar devoting a significant amount of time to this construction.
@ramonruijgt4532
@ramonruijgt4532 Ай бұрын
i could see a metal chain on every corner ancored to the sealing. and use some kind of wooden beams going through or conected to the chains making floors
@carmelhadar3495
@carmelhadar3495 Ай бұрын
It is possible to replace the steel with Dyneema (uhmwpe) cables. Since there is only tension, the use of such cables is optional, and they are significantly lighter than steel. It is not traditional construction materials, but that defenetly possible ( it steel require anchors in the rock of course, but everything will)
@onstructures
@onstructures Ай бұрын
Oh interesting I wasn’t familiar with this material!
@hellohelloington9442
@hellohelloington9442 2 ай бұрын
Another awesome video. I'm definitely gonna be coming back for more of your videos :)
@onstructures
@onstructures 2 ай бұрын
Thanks! So glad you enjoyed it
@scifriskyxy583
@scifriskyxy583 Ай бұрын
My theory on this city is that an avatar helped to build it mainly but maybe also some hired earth benders in the past which would be a decent explanation on who build this place
@xavierrodriguez1370
@xavierrodriguez1370 Ай бұрын
I like the idea that they might be carved out of the cliff using airbending. You can see some lines that make it look like some big stones were put together, but maybe those were put in deliberately for the aesthetic. Some temples in India are made from stone, but made to resemble wood, so there's a precedent for that. Placing glazed tiles upside down sounds like a nightmare though...
@striker2588
@striker2588 Ай бұрын
I like the stalactite thought because that sounds like it would fit with air nomads to me. If they came to the area seeing these hanging sections and used their "flying" ability and sky bison to build balconies as a place to live and work. Then this could also explain the solid mass of the building as one was seen falling because they are not earth benders and don't have heavy tools or equipment to hollow it out except for some small rooms which would fit with being a nomad.
@Obsidainstorm
@Obsidainstorm Ай бұрын
The flying bison likely were the work horses, tansporting stuff for the buold
@megamagicmonkey
@megamagicmonkey Ай бұрын
If the structures have large swathes of the interior as solid, then it could well be horizontal construction using massive stalactites as the base to build around. The interiors are large columns of natural rock. Considering the shapely nature of the cave, and the stone carvings on the interior face, maybe they used air bending to erode a cliff side and literally carve out the space? Considering the large brick looking nature of the walls though there might be some polished stone slabs as a veneer. All in all it’s pretty appropriate for an air temple in earth kingdom territory to make use of the rock so well. I imagine there was a lot of coordination between the two.
@Davanthall
@Davanthall Ай бұрын
1:23 that both scared the crap out of me and sent me into a coma of laughter.
@albasu_
@albasu_ Ай бұрын
I think the easiest answer is that it was made by earth benders. Its just formed rock. also you are trying to figure out how to build something into an over hang like that but what if it wasn't built but carved? what if it was just a massive cliff face that had been carved out to form the temple?
@Jonathon_H
@Jonathon_H Ай бұрын
Whether by earth benders in this universe, or regular workers IRL, it’s possible this overhand isn’t natural and used to be a regular vertical drop. Then the temple and all the negative space was carved out and then below removed to create an overhang and the temple. There are plenty of examples of this method being used (granted right side up) where the whole temple is a solid piece of carved rock and still attacked to the ground. See the Kailasa Temple in Ellora India for an example of the largest such construction.
@ripgeneral
@ripgeneral Ай бұрын
using cables in pipes with stone exterior layers. cables can be anchored somewhere deep in rock mass. i dunno but stone benders can in theory make porous or variable density rocks looks like they were carved from stalactites with using mass that were carved to make balcony.
@Sergio1Rodrigues
@Sergio1Rodrigues Ай бұрын
I loved this video!
@onstructures
@onstructures Ай бұрын
Glad to hear it!
@kimbleangus7321
@kimbleangus7321 Ай бұрын
This is a good start to looking at the structural feasibility of the Western Air Temples. I'd love to see you push this further. Like, I think rock anchors are used in mining, so if you wanted to investigate the steel idea, that would probably be a good place to start. I'd love to see the numbers involved in this kind of thing. I also think the stalactite idea is warrants a lot exploration too. I'd love to know how forces would be distributed in this kind of structure and which points are most likely to fail. How would removing the roofs change things? Along this line, I noticed you had some 3D models of a generic temple structure rotating around, but you never explained what they were or why they were there for. Is this how you would layout the structure structural elements for any given temple? Did you use these models to run simulations? Did you analyze them in any way? Why are they here? That said, I just wanted to remark that your editing and jokes are like being squirted by a squirt gun. No impact and completely non-incendiary. More than anything else, it just felt annoying. Another thing you could look is specific cultural influences and architectural elements on the temples. Like, what's with the green roofs and golden finales at the bottom of each structure? I loved the beginning part (minus the complete disregard for good shot to shot editing) where you talked about similar looking historical buildings!
@onstructures
@onstructures Ай бұрын
I appreciate the feedback here. Unfortunately the reason why the videos don’t answer many of the questions posed are due to Time and Demand. In my first 4 or 5 videos I get into the math on infeasible structures, but those take MUCH longer to make and I like sticking to a monthly schedule. And also… those videos (until recently) didn’t have much of an audience. I’d love to dig deeper eventually for future videos, but that might be a ways off. Thanks again
@MousechrisTFM
@MousechrisTFM Ай бұрын
Aside from carved stalactites one other explanation could be, bending. We know airbenders used to be able to fly so they could definitely be able to build this. And we know this was build in the earth kingdom. Meaning its likely they got help got adding structure from earth benders who just thought what they were doing was cool. Earth benders could also push up building supplies from the ground then bring it back down. They could also push the earth around in a way that reduces chances or earth quakes or even how much damage one would do. Thus explaining why the structure is built out of stone but in a seemingly impossible way. There could also be connections on the side of the mountain that arent shown. Like it could have a connection above but also one on the side. And considering angle and everyone went into a tunnel on the side of a mountain. Its definitelyyyyy implied to be the case.
@Tangent_Pixel
@Tangent_Pixel Ай бұрын
I've always imagined that they commissioned help from Earthbenders to "carve" this structure.
@marielavela7952
@marielavela7952 Ай бұрын
I thought he was gonna talk about it, but there was something in the western US very similar to the western air Temple and their case they just carved the surrounding rock. It was literally under the Cliffside a whole Metropolis. Please look it up. Maybe you’ll find some answers.
@onstructures
@onstructures Ай бұрын
Ah, that’s the Mesa Verde in Colorado! I showed a picture of it in closing, but outside of it being built in a cliff I didn’t feel it added much to the video I was writing. Good reference though!
@celestewilliams5681
@celestewilliams5681 Ай бұрын
I assume the best way to build this is to hang a series of steel cables from the rock, maybe anchor it on the surface even! They would go down either through the whole center of the building and meet at the tip, or to various points. Build the building up from the bottom, at the end, post tension the steel, similar to a post tensioned concrete beam! That's how I've thought of it.
@onstructures
@onstructures Ай бұрын
Nice post tensioning reference! And making the anchors like thru-bolts all the way to the surface above would be a really solid connection. Great engineering thoughts!
@kumogate
@kumogate Ай бұрын
Minor correction: It's "Potala Palace" rather than "Polata" Palace
@tyrannosauruswrex123
@tyrannosauruswrex123 Ай бұрын
Your ATLA videos are very nice 🙂👍
@onstructures
@onstructures Ай бұрын
Thanks friend!
@JKTCGMV13
@JKTCGMV13 Ай бұрын
At 10:50 you show a hanging hotel pod and I think I might’ve driven past that exact pod lol
@onstructures
@onstructures Ай бұрын
Really? That’s so cool, I think I read that this was somewhere in Peru, is that near you?
@JKTCGMV13
@JKTCGMV13 Ай бұрын
@@onstructures I’m from California but went to Peru as part of Milo Rozzi’s (miniminuteman on YT) archaeology/traditional medicine tour. The photos I took are from around (-13.2728529, -72.2180279). That’s probably “Skylodge Adventure Suites” near Ollantaytambo.
@sweatyspaghetti500
@sweatyspaghetti500 Ай бұрын
My theory is either they are giant carved stalactites or they drill through from the top of the cliff and build downwards with suspension cables hidden in the other part, then backfill the roof.
@chalkisplacebo.6697
@chalkisplacebo.6697 Ай бұрын
I personally think of porta ledges used in rock climbing using bolts or placed gear the ledge hangs off cliffs for multi day climbs. In general bolts are either those expanding rock anchors or now more commonly epoxy glue ins. Personally, I've taken some decent falls on single bolts and with heavy gear I've probably put a dynamic force of 600 ibs on the bolts or 3 Kilo newtons. Most bolts can hold around 20 kns or about 5,000 ibs (downward not outwards) While outward pulling leads to failure around 3,000 ibs. If the air temple had multiple bots per stud all bolted into the side of carved out holes (downward force) I think a steel structure would hold
@onstructures
@onstructures Ай бұрын
I considered separating out a discussion that compared anchors for rock climbing! Though by my napkin math estimation, the building would weigh upwards of 750,000 pounds, so it might take a lot of the climbing anchors!
@glavatazelva
@glavatazelva Ай бұрын
maybe they can do an episode or two where they explain the construction of the western air temple. I can imagine that the temple is the work of an avatar who wanted to fulfill the wishes of his "countrymen" to defend themselves from others without using force.
@onstructures
@onstructures Ай бұрын
Yea, pre airships, that would’ve been a totally unassailable position.
@ohnono
@ohnono Ай бұрын
As a Civ player my head crashed when you said Polata Palace
@onstructures
@onstructures Ай бұрын
Ah I know… I mistransferred it into my notes. Sorry!
@esoqueexiste
@esoqueexiste Ай бұрын
For airnomads the problems of constructing hanging infrastructure are almost neutralized They have flying bison that have the mobility of an helicopter and the cargo capabilities of a semi-truck, and the airbenders themselves have no need to get extra support beyond their air gliders, and maybe some ropes For the process of construction itself, to airnomads having the y-axis inverted or to just build high towers should not be that different, they probably did not use cranes to make the other air temples anyway, they just used airbending and bison to lift up the materials
@bhmand1669
@bhmand1669 Ай бұрын
The entire overhangs could also be artificially bent into place. One mad airbender wanted their house hanging over the ravine, another follows suit, soon there's an earthbender camp up top and an airbender camp below, but when there is sufficient housing the earthbenders move elsewhere.
@germimonte
@germimonte Ай бұрын
I'm no geologist, but an overhang like the one necessary to support said temple would probably be formed by erosion or dilution or de-lamination, 3 things you don't want near your house
@onstructures
@onstructures Ай бұрын
Certainly not me!
@tommyvalenzuela7504
@tommyvalenzuela7504 Ай бұрын
While very informative on modern and real world building and structural techniques to explain the Western Air Temple, I think the simplest and most likely explanation is that this was possibly a cave system with massive stalactites that were converted into buildings. You have to look into the formation of cave systems and the type of materials that stalactites are made of. Apply that to a FANATSY setting like Avatar and it’s not far fetched that massive stalactites could’ve been shaped into buildings. More evidence for this so the water system you pointed out as caves and stalactites are formed from ground water seepage over eons. Not to mention it wouldn’t be so difficult for an Air Nomad avatar to earth bend the cave system and features. This is also evidenced at many features in the actual cliff face. So while using real world modern techniques to explain this is interesting, we should probably stick with the basic and most likely reasoning of earth ending and the fantastical topography of the world of Avatar
@Michelle-iq2yp
@Michelle-iq2yp Ай бұрын
I think they just carved into giant stalagmites. That would explain the fountain as the stalagmites still work they just have hallow bits here and there. So that one frame was actually how it is.
@CrowandTalbot
@CrowandTalbot Ай бұрын
to be fair, the walls don't have to be stone or concrete or have a stone veneer, they could be wood supports with a painted clay veneer. since they don't need to worry about the temple being rained on and clay is lighter than stone and easily replaced when damaged. if they wanted it to look like stone they could and it would still crack with weathering, explaining the cracks we do see on some of the buildings since the temple isn't exposed to conditions normal to construction on the surface, plenty of older and otherwise unconventional materials could potentially be used to recreate the temple
@onstructures
@onstructures Ай бұрын
Ah that’s a good point, in the same way that a stone veneer mimics actual stone, clay could do the same… would it be that much lighter (100pcf v 150pcf)? Yea if whoever would actually build something like this has the means, no kind of material would be off limits
@floortjetjeertes3898
@floortjetjeertes3898 Ай бұрын
wouldnt they bey able to buy around stalagtites as there seems to be many of them in some of the shots. meaning the building is not atached from below but from the side of the stalagtite
@bluwasabi7635
@bluwasabi7635 Ай бұрын
What if the building method was literal wind erosion? Idk if sharp edges would be possible, but with enough air benders maybe an entire under hang could be carved and sculpted. Perhaps edges would be rendered later.
@onstructures
@onstructures Ай бұрын
Oh that’s a cool idea, I wonder how long or what level of airbending would be be needed to do that
@jackgamer6307
@jackgamer6307 Ай бұрын
I think the answer to why we don't have anything like this is simple. We can't fly. Imagine we built an upside down structure like it. Great. Now how are you getting there? Stairs down trough the roof rock? Or stairs up from bellow? In either case, wouldn't it be just easier and more practical to build something that's on the same level as us?
@onstructures
@onstructures Ай бұрын
But of course architecture isn’t always about practicality!
@mahaphoublue7644
@mahaphoublue7644 Ай бұрын
I believe they may have learned the way to build like this, I mean like many airbender city were all built normally only the western one that not make me think that they must have surpassed new knowledge that able for them to build this.
@zebjensen4251
@zebjensen4251 2 ай бұрын
Another thought to consider is flying bison and flying. it's unknown when this temple was built. for all we know it was the first ever built of all temples before they lost the ability to fly and gained there bison. or they used flying bison and earth benders to help. So if this was all carved with natural stone the workers could have simply floated and fixed this all up. and as for plumbing they could have made something like the romans did and all there plumbing is based on a gravity feed mechanism like that school science thing with have two ends of a hose near each other in hight.
@hokied88
@hokied88 Ай бұрын
In world, it seemed like metals as building construction materials were almost exclusively a Fire Nation technology/aesthetic, and relatively recently (leading up to the Air Nomad Genocide 100 years prior), so that seems unlikely for an ancient temple. I like the ideas I've seen in the comments about natural giant stalactites being carved/hollowed/earthbent into structures, though the Air Nomad reverence for nature would make me think they would be reticent to destroy natural wonders just for human habitation. Given that, I think it's semi-plausible that earthbenders helped them develop giant hanging shells of stone that could then later be embellished or refined (earthbender craftspeople bending grout lines into monolithic stone, for instance). I also had a thought which might make wood framing more viable: aircrete. If the giant stone masonry walls and stone/concrete floors aren't structural (the pagoda eaves/balconies could easily hide trusses/joists), perhaps they could be a building material innovation between the Air Nomads, Earth Kingdoms, and Water Tribes. A waterbender and earthbender working together could develop cooperative bending techniques for mixing water with cement/aggregate and manipulating the slurry (no formwork? 🤯) while an airbender could assist in aerating the concrete, impregnating the mix with tiny air bubbles that make for a solid material that's hard and light but brittle, like concrete styrofoam. Also, if an earthbending builder's guild included a lavabender, they could easily create pumice/volcanic rock on site to use as a very light aggregate. And perhaps the saddest expansion of this theory: Romans created durable, self-healing concrete using a special, specific volcanic ash. Although one could theorize that a lavabender could create this, I'm inclined to believe that ash such as this with a specific chemical makeup would be something more intrinsic to the mantle/crust composition beneath a volcano than just a property of lava/magma itself. So, ash needed for making self-healing air-light concrete could've been imported from the most volcanically active region in the world: the Fire Nation. This would make the Western Air Temple a wonder of the world not just for it's scale, beauty, and seeming impossibility, but also for its development as a cooperative project between all four bending cultures. Which makes the Air Nomad Genocide by the Fire Nation all the more tragic, given the ancient harmony that was lost/violated.
@hokied88
@hokied88 Ай бұрын
Additional idea for firebenders being involved in some form of cement/concrete manufacturing: fly ash concrete if coal was being used that far back, or making quick lime in cooperation with earthbenders (bending them up fresh limestone from the strata) or by incinerating bones/shells from the food waste of the camp for the construction crew (sounds sustainable and almost zero waste).
@fanthonyfictions
@fanthonyfictions Ай бұрын
Without seeing the video yet. Earth benders built it? Or a previous Air Avatar?
@GioZilke
@GioZilke Ай бұрын
Solid rock base + air bending + send would be simple explanation ! Or a Gift from some crazy earthy emperor ....
@onstructures
@onstructures Ай бұрын
Send it!
@dallinelliott5695
@dallinelliott5695 Ай бұрын
I always imagined all the air temples were carved with wind/ air bending
@advladart
@advladart Ай бұрын
in terms of moving material, couldnt the airbenders have used something like 2 flying bison and a giant platform ontop to transport people and materials to build onto the structures.
@slightlyembittered
@slightlyembittered Ай бұрын
One long-standing theory is that the world of Avatar is actually smaller than the planet Earth. What with the giant beasts and how people don't get hurt as often. This would mean that load-bearing structures could hold a lot more weight than they can on Earth. Perhaps making many impossible structures possible in the world of Avatar.
@onstructures
@onstructures Ай бұрын
Ah that’s a really good point! I’ve seen that evidence presented by looking at the time it takes to travel across the globe... it’s funny to think how that could impact design. More slender structures would be very possible.
@racehen
@racehen Ай бұрын
Sparky sparky boom man 😭 has got me for years. Like okay that’s just what we’re calling him, a lot of problems lately, fast consensus
@Varus304
@Varus304 Ай бұрын
You forgot Petra, Jorden. they have curved the structure from the rock that could be done in Avatar and explain why the building is not hollow
@Sugar3Glider
@Sugar3Glider Ай бұрын
How do they construct it? They start by planting a tree upside down. An exceptionally large tree at that. Once it pokes out they secure the roots. Then they build from there on the part sticking out.
@NekuroMC
@NekuroMC Ай бұрын
are thete upside down trees in real life?
@Resomius
@Resomius 2 ай бұрын
looking at how smooth the roof of the overhang is there could be a chance that the overhang was much bigger and the buildings were carved out of the rock. Not sure how stable it would be but it might be an explanation
@Rose_Nebula
@Rose_Nebula Ай бұрын
CONTRAPOINTS MENTIONED!!
@TheGreatPyroWolf
@TheGreatPyroWolf Ай бұрын
What about giant chains on the inside?
@lforc25
@lforc25 Ай бұрын
could it not have been a flat cliff that the simply carved into? Would that be strong enough to support its own weight?
@theuproar3914
@theuproar3914 Ай бұрын
Hear me out here, they all seem to be built upward from the bottom, each one sharing the spire point at the bottom, so what if they're all built outward from from a central solid pillar embedded into the cliffs above. Like the rock anchor, but it's just one large anchor with an excessively long bolt extruding past the surface it's set in. ** This is assuming they aren't just giant stalactites that the earth benders grew from the overhang.
@ChrisBode
@ChrisBode Ай бұрын
What if each tier is independently anchored to the rock such that each tier's weight is supported entirely by independent structural members? Since the tiers shrink as you descend, the total weight of each nested structure could be roughly the same. I'm much more worried about the integrity of the rock than the towers themselves. It's unclear how advanced fire nation metallurgy was at the time the temple was built, but the temple is shown to have large metal doors light enough for Aang to close with airbending when Azula attacks them there. How much support would huge cast iron cantilevers internal to the overhang running away from the chasm give you? With earthbenders to make the forms and fire benders to prepare the metal on site, you could cast metal in-situ.
@onstructures
@onstructures Ай бұрын
Good thoughts! Yea, I’d be uncomfortable with rock anchors too, but with some testing, and large factors of safety (as we do we standard construction) we could probably anchor it well enough. And interesting point about the steel doors, quite the anomaly in a place that seemed so organic.
@FantasKanal
@FantasKanal Ай бұрын
I would've assumed they chissled the buildings from stalagtites, considering that there is water coming from above.
@carvedearth5676
@carvedearth5676 Ай бұрын
See, you want to start with galvanized steel beams, it's a very human design
@TheHarimir
@TheHarimir Ай бұрын
i mean building truout history has been used as a means to flex on future generations, the world of avatar has people capable of some seriusly impressive building, shure the earth-benders themselves prefer what to them is tempromary and fast-built stuff but it not even a little hard to belive that material strengthening woud be one of their sub-disiplines. anny master worth their salt vant to show off their skill so having one or more of them take on a project like this is entierly posible. every acolyte o the disepline woud be raised on stories of great works like this. they may not be praktical but imagine an yung earth-bender traveling the road long below looking upp at the damaged temple realising that given time and effor he to cud make something as impresive as that. and it is impresive, with the posible exeption of the north poles canals its buy far the most awe-inspiering civilian piece of infrastructure in this world. the wals of basingse may outscale them in size but not ambition, the vestern air temple needs no walls, unless you can fly it is nigh-unasailable and all youd find annyway is a bunsh of pasifistic monks. hardly a milletary or political powerhouse
@dagothmenthol
@dagothmenthol Ай бұрын
But what if they used these stalactites as the foundation and core of the building and built the living space around it? Could that help with the structure? I mean, it wouldn't leave a big living indoor space, unlike with the skeletal construction, but I think it could fit? I'm no engineer, so Idk if it's possible tho ^^"
@dinofiles9002
@dinofiles9002 2 ай бұрын
Now hear me out we get hot air balloons
@onstructures
@onstructures 2 ай бұрын
Heard!
@CATusthetidsresenar
@CATusthetidsresenar 2 ай бұрын
Wouldn't helicopters be more effective though?
@philipp_surname
@philipp_surname Ай бұрын
I just now realized that this temple is not protected from earthbenders who can collapse the ledge
@davebond4451
@davebond4451 Ай бұрын
I mean in a world where people can earthbend its not far fetch to think they heped them solidify the ground above, anker the walls and eversthing
@marcopohl4875
@marcopohl4875 2 ай бұрын
I haven't considered it before this cideo, but: it's close to the fire nation, which weren't always war mongorers, and they have the best metal workers. Maybe the temple was built by fire benders?
@wertwuio283
@wertwuio283 Ай бұрын
What if the buildings are craved out stalacnites?
@jezusbloodie
@jezusbloodie Ай бұрын
I forsee such structures being feasible and maybe becoming common in lavatube colonisation if we ever colonise the moon
@onstructures
@onstructures Ай бұрын
Sweet, I never heard of this proposed type of construction 👀 thanks for sharing
@jezusbloodie
@jezusbloodie Ай бұрын
@@onstructures Isaac Arthur, host/writer of SFIA here on YT and current President of the U.S. National Space Association has excelent video's on these kind of topics 😉
@TheVergile
@TheVergile 2 ай бұрын
ome word: erosion. if you got a cliff overhang its very likely due to erosion. cliff faces move a lot over time. we wouldnt hang buildings below a cliff for the same reason we wouldnt build a house on the edge of a cliff. if you see any house on a cliffs edge chances are that when it was built it wasnt on a cliffs edge. and it probably wont be there a century or two later.
@onstructures
@onstructures Ай бұрын
This is probably the best answer, most cliff faces in reality aren’t situated like this, and would be subject to eroding elements.
@roze_assazin5289
@roze_assazin5289 Ай бұрын
what if it was just eteched in over time. the everything you see there was just larger rocks bored down over time to see what you see there. it would make sense from what the airbenders, meditave people. so a slow job that would take genrations would be no problem for them.
@commentator4515
@commentator4515 Ай бұрын
What if the buildings were carved out of giant stalactites or other hanging rock formations?
@user-pc3io5ji1o
@user-pc3io5ji1o Ай бұрын
The show Neon Genesis Evangelion has really similar buildings that hang upside down. In the Geo Front they have sky scrapers that hang upside down from the ceiling of the geo front.
@onstructures
@onstructures Ай бұрын
Ooh sweet, I figured there were some other good examples of suspended architecture out there! Thanks for this!
@idminister
@idminister Ай бұрын
the air temple is old, so it is not infesible it was built by some earth benders in good relation with the group of air nomads or a prior avatar build a cave down (possible to the building structures in the side wall that are not hanging) and then from the side structures under the overhang build up to and then into the overhang use earthbending on the overhand and into the ground itself to turn the less sturdy rock into sturdy rock
@SlayerEndX13
@SlayerEndX13 Ай бұрын
They would have to carve out the mountainside.
@HouseGhost1
@HouseGhost1 Ай бұрын
who made that minecraft version of the temple?
@onstructures
@onstructures Ай бұрын
That’s from a Reddit user named Flerakl who is making a full avatar map in Minecraft!
@metehantans7852
@metehantans7852 Ай бұрын
Maybe they are carved?
@lapiswolf2780
@lapiswolf2780 2 ай бұрын
Can you makes videos about Laputa and Goliath from Studio Ghibli's Castle in the Sky? 🏯
@onstructures
@onstructures Ай бұрын
I love the Ghibli movies, I’ll definitely be revisiting that one at some point!
@PetrifiedNightmares
@PetrifiedNightmares Ай бұрын
Isn’t it the Potala Palace not Polata?
@onstructures
@onstructures Ай бұрын
Big oof, you’re right. Must’ve worked too quickly thru that part, thanks for the correction.
@KnexJunkie
@KnexJunkie Ай бұрын
would it be possible my simpel view of it maybe but just trying to build it all hanging would make it impossible eventully also a massive headache project that would be to make a clif hanging town or city idea. Stil most coolest anime city that is upside down xd not many of these examples i believe.
@zZiL341yRj736
@zZiL341yRj736 Ай бұрын
Levels in Elden Ring and Dark Souls have crazy amount scope and almost impossible in designs.
@charchar635
@charchar635 2 ай бұрын
Ok but if that name has an asterisk at the end and you're using an asterisk citation shouldn't it be noa**
@onstructures
@onstructures Ай бұрын
😂😂😅
@Shearper2
@Shearper2 Ай бұрын
could be that the Avatar creators asked a bunch of architects instead of engineers to design the western air temple. which led to a cool, but impractical design.
@onstructures
@onstructures Ай бұрын
Architects taking the reigns often leads to wild stuff! Just needs a good engineer to handle it
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