Everything we DO NOT know about Santa Maria

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Kroum Batchvarov - Underwater Ship Archaeologist

Kroum Batchvarov - Underwater Ship Archaeologist

7 ай бұрын

Santa Maria was the largest of the three ships used by Christopher Columbus in his voyage across the Atlantic Ocean in 1492...
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Пікірлер: 84
@AlexModeling
@AlexModeling 7 ай бұрын
Your insightful observations on the historical context of Santa Maria and Christopher Columbus provide a nuanced perspective on this pivotal era of exploration. Indeed, the directive from the King of Aragon and Queen of Castile to construct Santa Maria, (as a reference to, provide all logistics in favor of this goal) but, indeed, marked a significant chapter in maritime history. Columbus, despite his perceived arrogance, and yes he was and needed to be arrogant, (please note, im Portuguese, and proud of it) exhibited, however, a remarkable determination, or inability to accept failure, (he was in the middle of the ocean, what to do?) that ultimately led to the discovery of the American continent. Santa Maria, in my humble opinion is one of those ships that, transcends its physical form as a vessel and becomes a symbolic icon in history. Its legacy gains prominence only in the wake of the discovery of the (of corse) American continent, And if you allow me maybe Hollywood has something to do with that also? The lack of widespread publicity, when allegely "Santa Maria" was probably found in the bottom of the sea near Hispanola,never convinced me... if back then she was really found, it would exist way more publicity, and never was, so that tell me probably who found it knew that. If you allow me a personal remark here, your expert knoledge is always regarded by me as a Must. I would never throw a Rotten (or what ever condition would it be) Tomato at you... Im a Latin man.. Tomatoes are way more valuable in the kitchen, and cooking... and i do love to cook.. i said i love it, never said i was good at it:) My respects goes to you, your family and thank you for another very Interesting video... BTW.. im building another non existing ship (and im sorry Sir, but this time its way worse, than My last Santa Maria :) ).. Stay safe! Much Respect Alex
@pitanpainter2140
@pitanpainter2140 7 ай бұрын
Yes please to a discussion covering actual 15C ship building.
@kroumbatchvarov-archaeologist
@kroumbatchvarov-archaeologist 7 ай бұрын
Thank you for watching and commenting! Very good, I will put together a talk on our sources for 15th c. Shipbuilding.
@lidialidia6981
@lidialidia6981 7 ай бұрын
Beautiful assistant 😻
@kroumbatchvarov-archaeologist
@kroumbatchvarov-archaeologist 7 ай бұрын
Not mine, really
@lidialidia6981
@lidialidia6981 7 ай бұрын
Thank you very much, Kroum Batchvarov 👍👏✌️
@kroumbatchvarov-archaeologist
@kroumbatchvarov-archaeologist 7 ай бұрын
Дуже дякую!
@HyperboreanAnchovy44
@HyperboreanAnchovy44 7 ай бұрын
Definitely would enjoy a video covering 15c ships
@kroumbatchvarov-archaeologist
@kroumbatchvarov-archaeologist 7 ай бұрын
Thank you! We shall produce one as soon as possible
@maxymvoloshyn
@maxymvoloshyn 6 ай бұрын
Yes, for sure! It's really interesting to know what we now understand about XV century ships! I’m just one of those Santa Maria builders. :) But I’m not disappointed with your video at all. On the contrary- I really thank you for proving this once more. I think our knowledge of history before the XVI century is generally limited. However, this doesn’t stop painters, cinematographers, and writers from 'recreating' this history. Sometimes it seems we know more about ancient Greece or Egypt than about events that occurred 150-200 years ago, which definitely cannot be true. On the other hand, these interpretations may have a right to exist if they are considered not as reality or truth but as a piece of art created by the artist's imagination. And I build my Santa Maria with exactly this in mind. Additionally, the lack of detailed knowledge about this ship allows me the freedom to experiment with some parts and manufacturing details, which would be much more challenging with any other well-known and thoroughly documented historical ship.
@keithbell6866
@keithbell6866 7 ай бұрын
I was not disappointed at all! This was very interesting as I did not know that so little was in fact known about that ship. I also would like to cast my vote for a video on what is known about fifteenth century ships. Though warships are interesting, I am much more interested in the working vessels of the era, and that is what it looks like was provided to Columbus.
@kroumbatchvarov-archaeologist
@kroumbatchvarov-archaeologist 7 ай бұрын
You are correct: he was just handed a vessel that was available for hire. Nothing special about her: just a regular run of the mill merchantman.
@RaduB.
@RaduB. 7 ай бұрын
A video about XVth century shipbuilding would be most welcome! And about the accuracy of today's available ship blueprints in general...
@kroumbatchvarov-archaeologist
@kroumbatchvarov-archaeologist 7 ай бұрын
Very good! Thank you - we’ll put one together!
@Imightbewrongbutsomightyou
@Imightbewrongbutsomightyou 7 ай бұрын
Thank you for sharing your expertise explaining how little is known on the Santa Maria. I have assumed historians must have just had detailed scribts on the style of ship the Santa Maria was. I was always assuming that the scale of the event undertaken would have been recorded in fine detail. However, like you mentioned, nobody ever mentions the type of tyres that we use to get from A to B, especially if it requires the story writer to take further attention away from the captains amazing navigational skills and superb seamanship that helped make these historic achievements back in the day 😆.
@kroumbatchvarov-archaeologist
@kroumbatchvarov-archaeologist 7 ай бұрын
Exactly! The vehicle is of little interest when there is no sponsorship in it for the film-makers :-) How she was built, what such a ship would have looked like was either of no interest or it was coming knowledge, so why bother recording it. What mattered was the tuns and tonnage figure because based on this is calculated the hire of the ship. No knew what would be the impact of this voyage, no one was looking beyond the moment. To them, it was not momentous; just another questionable Undertaking.
@fredericrike5974
@fredericrike5974 7 ай бұрын
I rather knew this, but thank you for weighing in. For all of that, Pavel Nitkin's kit is gorgeous! How much research on the middle of the 15th century would it have taken to achieve his result, or had he deviated from period? I've never built a ship model; one meter R/C gliders and the like, yes- but Ohla's unboxing really makes me think this kit is with my meager skills; if it isn't it won't be for Pavel's lack of trying. My best to Imbir! And yes to a series on 15 th or any century of ship building and ship builders. These ships allowed men to see all of the world, using the Earth's own tides, winds and currents to do it.
@kroumbatchvarov-archaeologist
@kroumbatchvarov-archaeologist 7 ай бұрын
I am sure the quality of the kit is very high. And it is no less accurate than all the other Santa Maria kits out there. This video is in no way a criticism of this specific kit, but of the very idea of building a Santa Maria
@tedr.
@tedr. 7 ай бұрын
Truly sad information, or lack there of, on the Santa Maria. Though it won't deter me from building Pavel's lovely kit !!!
@kroumbatchvarov-archaeologist
@kroumbatchvarov-archaeologist 7 ай бұрын
The kits is great. Nothing to stop you from building it as long as you don’t mind that it is NOT of Santa Maria. None of the available kits are
@denisv4385
@denisv4385 7 ай бұрын
Seeing the title of the video last night, I suspected the speech you would have))) For those interested in Santa Maria, it must be built solely for the history it represents. I too would like a video on the 15th. Glad to have seen Imbir for a long time)))
@kroumbatchvarov-archaeologist
@kroumbatchvarov-archaeologist 7 ай бұрын
Hahaha- yes, it is not very hard to guess what someone like me is like to say about A ship like this: Santa Maria, Mathew, Golden Hind, Mayflower, Susan Constant…
@markr5787
@markr5787 7 ай бұрын
I’d love to hear more about 15th century shipbuilding.
@kroumbatchvarov-archaeologist
@kroumbatchvarov-archaeologist 7 ай бұрын
We’ll put it together as soon as I can!
@ianb3895
@ianb3895 7 ай бұрын
Loved the video Professor, greatly appreciate the honesty in the review. It is a great risk to put a specific name on a kit when there is little reference on her to be found. You answered the question I had while watching the sister's channel if the kit was a good replica of the Santa Maria, blew the question out of the water so to speak. As a kit, am happy to add this Caravelle to the list to be smuggled through the wife in the future. The risk is justified by the kit quality alone, great work Pavel. Am hoping the 15th century ship building will be considered for one of your video uploads in the future. Thank you to the both of you sir.
@kroumbatchvarov-archaeologist
@kroumbatchvarov-archaeologist 7 ай бұрын
Thank you for the kind words! The kit is very well done, I am sure. There is no kit on the market that can claim to be an accurate representation of the Santa Maria, though. It is clear that I will have to do a video on what we know of the 15th c shipbuilding practices in the Mediterranean and Atlantic.
@g-kip
@g-kip 7 ай бұрын
Great video, thank you. I would like to point out that the majority of model kits available to build are inaccurate in one way or another.
@kroumbatchvarov-archaeologist
@kroumbatchvarov-archaeologist 7 ай бұрын
I was talking in general of Santa Maria. NOT the specific kit!
@thomasdeak7762
@thomasdeak7762 7 ай бұрын
Do we want a separate video on 15th century shipbuilding? Of course we do!
@kroumbatchvarov-archaeologist
@kroumbatchvarov-archaeologist 7 ай бұрын
Very good! We’ll make one
@andrewjones1649
@andrewjones1649 7 ай бұрын
Excellent as ever. I presume the same can be said for Cabot's ship Matthew, that we have no real idea what she looked like?
@kroumbatchvarov-archaeologist
@kroumbatchvarov-archaeologist 7 ай бұрын
Yes, indeed! It’s “replica” is no more than somebody’s imagination on the subject of what such a ship Might have looked like
@andrewjones1649
@andrewjones1649 7 ай бұрын
@kroumbatchvarov-archaeologist You referred in your lecture about the replicas of Santa Maria being poor handling ships, I suspect the Bristol based Matthew replica isn't a great deal better. The first skipper of her mentioned that she rolled like a barrel. Do you think ships of that era did handle so badly?
@imthomasag2747
@imthomasag2747 7 ай бұрын
Great video as always! I find it intriguing that not a lot is known of this particular era, hopefully it can change at some point, as it would be great to see accurate representations of vessels of the era. On another note, having been watching your videos for a while, I want to ask: have you taken any interest in Spanish ship building throughout history? If so, what do you find most interesting about it, what time period? As a proud Spaniard who has studied quite a bit of Spain's maritime history (especially the late XVIIIc.). I don't usually see many studies or people talking about it, doesn't seem to very well known, despite the great achievements and technological advancements that some of the later ships had. Then again, I do not know if this is your area of expertise, please do let me know! Have a good day.
@kroumbatchvarov-archaeologist
@kroumbatchvarov-archaeologist 7 ай бұрын
There is very little published about it. Part of the reason is that most of the 17th-early 18th c Spanish wrecks were looted by treasure hunters and no data was actually recorded. Just for example, Nuestra Senora de Atocha had a lot of hull surviving, but treasure hunting gang essentially destroyed it; Santa Margarita- too; Concepcion- ditto. The next that is likely to suffer is San Jose. The list goes on and on. This, of course, limits the knowledge database. As to historical works, there are a few studies by Carla Rahn Philips- excellent maritime historian and she did address more technical aspects of design and proportions, but hardly on construction. There is one more General study of the Spanish navy in the second half of the 18th c. And of course, there is Fernando Duro. Unfortunately he remains untranslated into English. Also, Spanish archaeologists seem to be more interested in Punic and Roman material than in early modern. There is one galleon (I think one of the 12 apostles) under excavation off Cadiz. I am not aware of any other major work, alas, despite the obvious importance of one of the foremost maritime powers of the early modern period.
@imthomasag2747
@imthomasag2747 7 ай бұрын
@@kroumbatchvarov-archaeologist Very interesting, I do find that there's not much information on early 18th century ships of Spain, though there are some documents, and models. It's a shame that looters ruined a lot of the wrecks, though it's expected, seeing how badly some archaeological sites have been treated in the past. Thank you for the reply!
@Hellspijker
@Hellspijker 7 ай бұрын
I would love to hear about the mayor ship types and what we actualy know about them, kogge, karack's, galeons ect.
@kroumbatchvarov-archaeologist
@kroumbatchvarov-archaeologist 7 ай бұрын
Very good! Thank you for this - I will put together a video on the topic
@dumbear169
@dumbear169 7 ай бұрын
Yes please to C15th ship building. Another great video Professor.
@kroumbatchvarov-archaeologist
@kroumbatchvarov-archaeologist 7 ай бұрын
Thank you! So glad you enjoyed it! And yes, we’ll produce a video on 15th c shipbuilding
@Pocketfarmer1
@Pocketfarmer1 7 ай бұрын
A video or series on what is known of 15th century ships would be very interesting. Of course you know of the Santa Carolina, Columbus’ 4th boat. It’s the one that fell of the edge. 😂
@kroumbatchvarov-archaeologist
@kroumbatchvarov-archaeologist 7 ай бұрын
Alright, I will put one together as soon as I can- it’s the end of the semester at the moment, so a bit of tight schedule
@Pocketfarmer1
@Pocketfarmer1 7 ай бұрын
@@kroumbatchvarov-archaeologist There is no rush or pressure from this side of the screen. I , for one am grateful and amazed at the volume and regularity of your videos.
@scottyshipbuilder
@scottyshipbuilder 7 ай бұрын
I’d still like to see Olha build it, even if it’s someone’s imagination of it. Great lecture.
@kroumbatchvarov-archaeologist
@kroumbatchvarov-archaeologist 7 ай бұрын
She might build in the future but not Immediately: she has too many on her bench
@hein_von_der_werft
@hein_von_der_werft 7 ай бұрын
Hello Mr. Batchvarov, this was a very interesting video. My hobbys are sailing, ship-modelling, maritime-history and collecting maritime-literature. Im always curious to learn more about historic-ships. In the Anatomy of the Ship-Series, is the book " The Ships of Christopher Columbus - Santa Maria, Nina, Pinta" by Xavier Pastor. In this book, different Replicas of the Santa-Maria were described, and also mentioned that little was known about the original-ship. What did you think about this book and the Replicas? Is there any Replica of the Santa-Maria, that could be like the Original, from a wide distance? And what about the Nina and Pinta, also mentioned in this book? I like your video-series very much, because of the "view of an ships-archeologist"! Sorry for my poor english. Greetings from Germany!
@kroumbatchvarov-archaeologist
@kroumbatchvarov-archaeologist 7 ай бұрын
Gluten Tag, mein Herr! Schonen Dank! The book is good for what it presents: the different interpretations of Santa marias. I can’t say I think there is one better than another of these interpretations because I have no basis for comparison: where you have no information on a subject, you can really judge. John Sarsfield attempted to create a reasonable interpretation of what a caravella might have looked like, following his realization that Brazilian Shipwrights are in essence still using the old whole-moulding system similar to the treatises. The ship was completed despite his untimely death, but i haven’t seen much written about its sailing qualities.
@hein_von_der_werft
@hein_von_der_werft 7 ай бұрын
@@kroumbatchvarov-archaeologist Thank you for your opinion about the book. Also i will not forget to vote for the video of 15th century shipbuilding! 😉
@davidangelo8902
@davidangelo8902 7 ай бұрын
Thank You, I do like your videos! I'll also vote for a video on the 15th century ships. And I'm just thinking, Santa Maria could have been a poor sailer, just like the various replicas. People being people, I'm sure the Merchants tasked with providing the ships for this voyage would have taken the opportunity to unload their worst dogs on the King.
@kroumbatchvarov-archaeologist
@kroumbatchvarov-archaeologist 7 ай бұрын
From the practical accomplishments of the real ship, we must conclude that she was not a bad performer. She wasn’t much slower on the crossing than most cruising yachts. So the problems were not with the ship, but with the “replicas”. For the rest, I agree with you. I doubt they picked up the newest and best ship. The votes are coming in hard and unanimous :-) Clearly a video on 15th c shipbuilding will have to be produced soon.
@savadrenovac3537
@savadrenovac3537 7 ай бұрын
It would be really great if you make that video, i personally do not like those ships, but nevertheless i wanna know about them, for maritime history is my cup of tea. We will all appreciate it very much, thank you in advance.
@kroumbatchvarov-archaeologist
@kroumbatchvarov-archaeologist 7 ай бұрын
Thank you! Yes, I think the votes in favour of such a video are overwhelming.
@genojoe3176
@genojoe3176 7 ай бұрын
There is one additional fact that everyone is missing. That being the second and fifth letters of this ship's name, "Santa Maria", are indeed all the letter A. Whew.....I need to lay down after deciphering that one.
@kroumbatchvarov-archaeologist
@kroumbatchvarov-archaeologist 7 ай бұрын
Hahaha! Good one!
@cajunrandy2143
@cajunrandy2143 7 ай бұрын
👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍
@kroumbatchvarov-archaeologist
@kroumbatchvarov-archaeologist 7 ай бұрын
Thank you!
@timothykronser1341
@timothykronser1341 7 ай бұрын
I had always assumed that much more was known, given the fairly common representations in books and kits. I greatly appreciate setting the record straight. Have recently discovered your channel, always find it interesting. Thank you!
@kroumbatchvarov-archaeologist
@kroumbatchvarov-archaeologist 7 ай бұрын
Thank you very much indeed for the kind words! I am flattered! Specifically on her the only thing we know is tonnage and even that is listed as “about”. We don’t have any contemporary records of her. The closest is las Casas’ retelling of the Journal of the great seafarer.
@mikepowell2776
@mikepowell2776 7 ай бұрын
Many people assume that replicas of medieval and classical ships are accurate so your video comes as a salutary reminder of the limitations. I’m sure you had a good reason for not mentioning the Newport ship (built, apparently, in northern Spain around 1447) but was nonetheless surprised. A video dedicated to knowledge of late medieval ships would be a valuable contribution. Many thanks for your work.
@kroumbatchvarov-archaeologist
@kroumbatchvarov-archaeologist 7 ай бұрын
I am very well acquainted with the Newport ship. Nigel Nayling and Tony Jones are friends of mine; Nigel and I worked together in Tobago. However, the focus was specifically on Santa Maria I Mediterranean tradition. The Newport ship is an incredible site. Pat Tanner did very interesting work on its reconstruction, too. Now, she would be a wonderful candidate for a replica!
@mikepowell2776
@mikepowell2776 7 ай бұрын
I’ve been following the research since she was discovered and until COVID visited as frequently as I could, trying to attend their open days and special events. Fortunately I live not far away. I wonder, though, as Columbus had experience of Viscayan and north-east Atlantic waters and that Palas de la Frontera, Huelva and the mouth of the Guadalquivir are outside the straits, if he might have considered that tradition preferable. Assuming, of course, that he had any influence in the matter. I recognise that some sources describe Nina and Pinta as caravelles and they are usually considered to be in the Mediterranean tradition. I may, I realise,be completely on the wrong track and I thank you very much for your reply.@@kroumbatchvarov-archaeologist
@mikepowell2776
@mikepowell2776 7 ай бұрын
I agree that she would make a good candidate for a replica. At least we have a good proportion of the original. Regarding other late medieval/early modern ship ‘replicas’ (there being several Santa Maria’s, at least 2 each Ninas and Pintas, Victoria, several caravelles and so on) I wonder if you might consider making a video reviewing the kinds of sources available and their limitations. As you imply in your presentation on Santa Maria it is not possible to construct a replica of something whose original form is unknown. What is arrived at is a possible representation. A consideration of available evidence would be interesting. Best regards and, again, thank you for your work.@@kroumbatchvarov-archaeologist
@herobrinesblog
@herobrinesblog 7 ай бұрын
As a portuguese, this also makes me very curious. How much do we know about naus? And about caravels? I've found some books in my country about this, but it seems the data is insufficient on the details, even the exact shape of the hull is very much debated. So yes! Do make a video on 15th century ships! I'd love it!
@kroumbatchvarov-archaeologist
@kroumbatchvarov-archaeologist 7 ай бұрын
You are right: we do have a few treatises but they are from the end of the 16th c so not exactly compatible with the 15th c.
@orlandorodriguezpenabergue6847
@orlandorodriguezpenabergue6847 7 ай бұрын
The truth is very interesting, I mentioned data that I didn't know. But because we don't know exactly what it was like, it gives the modeler some freedom, at least that's the good part.
@kroumbatchvarov-archaeologist
@kroumbatchvarov-archaeologist 7 ай бұрын
Not that much. We do know what she could not possibly have looked like. Many modelers and kit manufacturers fail to grasp how tiny she was and overload her with sterncastles that she is unlikely to have been able to support.
@orlandorodriguezpenabergue6847
@orlandorodriguezpenabergue6847 7 ай бұрын
@@kroumbatchvarov-archaeologist I understand. but with good investigative work an approximation of the ship could be reached. but for that you have to seriously investigate the topic and the historical answer that can contribute a lot
@orlandorodriguezpenabergue6847
@orlandorodriguezpenabergue6847 7 ай бұрын
@@kroumbatchvarov-archaeologist Thank you very much for the class, it is always a pleasure to learn from someone who has studied the topic more in depth.
@AlexModeling
@AlexModeling 7 ай бұрын
Hum... Very interesting... I want to watch this vídeo. 👍🇵🇹
@kroumbatchvarov-archaeologist
@kroumbatchvarov-archaeologist 7 ай бұрын
Hope you like it!
@user-ov4wk3tv5s
@user-ov4wk3tv5s 7 ай бұрын
Il I remember correctly, most of the Santa Maria’s wreck was utilized to building the settlement(later dedtryed) on Hispaniola after the wreck. Very little would remain to be found.
@kroumbatchvarov-archaeologist
@kroumbatchvarov-archaeologist 7 ай бұрын
Correct: her superstructure was dismantled for the fortification where he left part of his crew.
@jlr8356
@jlr8356 7 ай бұрын
Interesring lecture.
@kroumbatchvarov-archaeologist
@kroumbatchvarov-archaeologist 7 ай бұрын
Thank you. I am glad that you enjoyed it!
@wuyseh3310
@wuyseh3310 7 ай бұрын
are there no models from that time that give an indication of what the ship might have looked like ?
@kroumbatchvarov-archaeologist
@kroumbatchvarov-archaeologist 7 ай бұрын
The Mataro model, usually dated to the mid 15th c. It is a votive model and for this reason the proportions can’t be trusted. There used to be a video of the interior of the model and it was visible that she is build on frames, exactly as the original would have been. So constructionally she can be trusted. The shape and proportions: with very great reservations.
@VitaliiPitia
@VitaliiPitia 7 ай бұрын
The history of the Columbus expedition is popularized by books, films, paintings, etc. for many years/generations. Therefore, it will always be commercially successful among shipmodelers. You can fantasize as much as you want. Historical inconsistencies are completely unimportant. Only not for scientists who are deep in this subject.🔍📚📜🔬🤔
@kroumbatchvarov-archaeologist
@kroumbatchvarov-archaeologist 7 ай бұрын
Yes, you are right about this.
@tommasobalconi
@tommasobalconi 7 ай бұрын
After seeing the Santa Maria video drop on the sister channel, why am I not surprised to see this here? ;) After almost six centuries on a rather warm, very lively sea bottom, I'd rather doubt the chances of finding anything identifiable of the shipwreck, if anything still survives at all. But perhaps other vessels of the period will be discovered in the future. We can but hope.
@kroumbatchvarov-archaeologist
@kroumbatchvarov-archaeologist 7 ай бұрын
You are spot on! I, too, doubt that more than part of a bottom is likely to survive. And that only if she slid off the reef and god buried in sand. Think of Molasses Reef Wreck, Highborn Cay wrecks. I doubt more than this will survive. As to 15th c carracks, we do have one fantastically preserved in the Baltic, the Gribshunden. Alas, there are some complications there in its study.
@kroumbatchvarov-archaeologist
@kroumbatchvarov-archaeologist 7 ай бұрын
On the arrival of this video in this channel- how Right you are! I was “requested and required” to produce it despite my misgivings. Orders are orders and you obey them or court-martial awaits for mutiny 😁
@tommasobalconi
@tommasobalconi 7 ай бұрын
And I think we are all very happy that this 'obligatory rant' happened! Also, aside from purely timber work surviving, there would also be the problem of identification. I doubt it's going to have a convenient bell with the name stamped on it given the time period.
@johnjohnson1709
@johnjohnson1709 7 ай бұрын
No rotten tomatoes from me. I see on the box they call that model a caravelle, are the models that are sold as being the Santa Maria at least representative of a ship design that could have been sailed by Columbus?
@kroumbatchvarov-archaeologist
@kroumbatchvarov-archaeologist 7 ай бұрын
Not really. Heaven knows what they think these models represent, but it is not ships that sailed. I will do a video on sources of information for 15-century shipbuilding. The contemporary turn for Santa Maria was “nao”, which simply means ship. Manufacturers tend to forget how small she was and add way too many and weird shaped levels of sterncastle. This specific kit is good quality and the only one at 1:48 that I know of, but is no more “the real Santa Maria” than any other is.
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