Here were MCU canons begin: Captain America The First Avengers movie Agent Carter series (one shot on Iron Man 3 DVD, Season 1 and 2) Captain Marvel Iron Man 1 and 2 The Incredible Hulk The Consultant (one shot on the Thor DVD) A Funny Thing Happened on the way to Thor's Hammer (one shot on Captain America The First Avengers DVD) Thor The Avengers Item 47 (one shot on The Avengers DVD) Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D Season 1 (Ep 1-7) Thor: The Dark World Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D Season 1 (Ep 8-16) Iron Man 3 All Hail to the King (one shot on Thor:The Dark World DVD) Captain America: The Winter Soldier Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D Season 1 (Ep 17-22) Guardians of the Galaxy Vol 1 and 2) I Am Groot Season 1 and 2 Daredevil Season 1 Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D Season 2 (Ep 1-10) Jessica Jones Season 1 Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D Season 2 (Ep 11-19) Avengers Age of Ultron Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D Season 2 (Ep 20-22) Daredevil Season 2 (Ep 1-4) Luke Cage Season 1 (Ep 1-4) Daredevil Season 2 (Ep 5-11) Luke Cage Season 1 (Ep 5-8) Daredevil Season 2 (Ep 12-13) Luke Cage Season 1 (Ep 9-13) Ant-Man Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D Season 3 (Ep 1-19) Iron Fist Season 1 Captain America Civil War Team Thor (one shot on Captain America Civil War DVD) Team Thor part 2 (one shot on Doctor Strange DVD) Black Widow (watch post credit scene after Avengers Endgame) Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D Season 3 (Ep 20-22) Marvel's Defenders Season 1 Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D Season 4 (Ep 1-6)💀🔥⛓️ Doctor Strange Black Panther Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D Season 4 (Ep 7-8)💀🔥⛓️ Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D Slingshot (Ep 1-6) see this on KZfaq Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D Season 4 (Ep 9-22)💀🔥⛓️ Spider-Man Homecoming Thor Ragnarok Team Darryl (one shot on Thor Ragnarok DVD) Inhumans Season 1 The Punisher Season 1 Marvel's Runaway Season 1 Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D Season 5 (Ep 1-10) allowing for time travel craziness Jessica Jones Season 2 Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D Season 5 (Ep 11-18) Cloak and Dagger Season 1 and 2 Luke Cage Season 2 Iron Fist Season 2 Daredevil Season 3 Marvel's Runaway Season 2 The Punisher Season 2 Jessica Jones Season 3 Ant-Man and The Wasp (watch post credit scene after Avengers Infinity War) Avengers Infinity War Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D Season 5 ( Ep 19-22) Concurrent with Infinity War Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D Season 6 and 7 (takes place in Endgame's Five years time jump) Marvel's Runaway Season 3 (seems to take place post snap mostly) Avengers Endgame Loki Season 1 and 2 Marvel's What If...? Season 1 and 2 Wandavision The Falcon and the Winter Soldier Shang-Chi and the Legends of the Ten Rings Eternals Spider-Man Far From Home Spider-Man No Way Home Doctor Strange Multiverse of Madness Hawkeye series Moon Knight series Black Panther Wakanda Forever She-Hulk Attorney at Law Ms.Marvel Thor Love and Thunder Werewolf by Night (you watch either the black and white version or full color version) Guardians of the Galaxy Holiday Special 🎄 Ant-Man and The Wasp Quantumania Guardians of the Galaxy Vol 3 Secret Invasion The Marvels

@@johnsantos507Love it!

@@AbitofEverything4U Yeah, but I don't see Hellstrom.

Yes, I do think your theories are possible. The nice thing about Multiverse of Madness is that it basically opened the door that each Darkhold we saw is a copy and thus a single version didn't have to change hands, but your idea works very well. Great feedback! Thanks so much for watching the vid and sharing your thoughts. Really appreciate it!

But there are 2 copies of Darkhold. 1 is Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D Season 4 and the other one is Marvel's Runaway Season 3. However in Wandavision, the Darkhold the one that Agatha have it is different. And yes, Chthon is the one who created the book of Darkhold.

Yeah, I wonder if perhaps there is some answer we can come up with. Your idea seems to work okay. But what makes it so difficult to explain is that at the end of the final episode they do succeed in changing time which causes the future versions of the time traveling characters to be erased. Ugh. I guess we'll have to wait and see if we get some type of explanation down the road. But your solution is certainly one possibility.

Yes, I think that's a very possible explanation for what Kang meant. He could have either meant he'll literally re-write time in the 616 timeline or he could have meant he'll find the right branch in the multiverse were time played out the way Janet wishes. Excellent point. Can't wait to learn more about what Kang can and cannot do as the multiverse saga plays out! Thanks so much for watching the vid and sharing your thoughts. Really appreciate it!

I think you suggest a very cool idea. But I struggle with that since I thought the entire point of DoFP was not to fix an adjacent timeline, but to fix their own timeline. They were in a terrible future and wanted it to be fixed. So I'm not sure I see why they would send Logan into an adjacent branch. I thought their whole goal was to fix their own past to prevent the current future from happening.

@@AbitofEverything4U That's just it, though. They clearly *thought* they were fixing their timeline, but they weren't actually doing that. Kitty Pride didn't fully understand her new powers (powers she only has for this movie). The final results are: Logan & Xavier's minds/memories being transported into the revised timeline, and them altering *that* timeline. It basically an "I have failed, but learn from my mistakes" sort of thing either way you look at it.

Believe me, I like that idea. It doesn't seem like that's what the movie is indicating, but I'm all for your idea being canon.

@@AbitofEverything4U I think, at this point, the idea is to figure out how the other Marvel movies work with the timeline logic we've been presented in the MCU. Especially with Secret Wars / Battle World coming up. The time travel in DoFP must retroactively work in service of the larger Marvel Multiverse. *I mean, in DoFP, wasn't Kitty basically just making Logan dreamwalk into the body of one of his Variants?* If Deadpool 2&3 can mess with the Fox timeline stuff, then surely the MCU can retcon it to fit into this newer, larger, context as well. Recontextualizing the nature of the mind-based time travel in DoFP seems like the key to making it all fit. -and the mechanism for that retcon (dreamwalking) was recently introduced in a widely distributed blockbuster franchise movie! So, it's an easy thing to explain and move forward with. The new and old audience will understand. If anything, it kinda makes the X-Men movies feel like they were always part of this bigger thing. In my opinion, it's more of a positive, than a negative.

@@OpinionParade Yeah, we'll just have to see how Marvel handles it. They have alot of time travel to explain!

Nice! I absolutely adore the wiki, and particularly the timeline. Thanks for all your amazing work on it. I use it all the time for research as it is so detailed. And that's terrific news to hear you are adding Helstrom and you are looking at an Oct 2020 placement. Not an easy one to land on, but it seems to work well. Keep up the fantastic work on the wiki. I know it's alot of effort and very time-consuming, but it's so important!

I like your explanation...but I guess my confusion is that in the main timeline, the Agents are taken away to the future and then 6 months later Fitz goes into cryostasis and wakes up in the future where the earth is destroyed. So we have a direct line between the 616 present and the destroyed earth. Plus, I have to wonder why any of it was even necessary, if the earth wasn't originally destroyed in the 616 timeline. Why do anything at all if there was no issue. It just seems like they went to their own future, learned how to fix the issue with the earth being destroyed, returned to their own present, and changed their future. I could be wrong, but that seems to be me to be what happened.

@@AbitofEverything4U Future Fitz dies. Then they realize that their Fitz must be in deep space somewhere, in hyper sleep, so they go looking for him. In their timeline, Fitz is woken from hyper sleep by aliens rather than making it to the future. -and that wasn't because of time travel shenanigans by the team; it just happened. The two Fitz' were from different timelines, otherwise main timeline Fitz would have still been sleeping when they went looking for him in space. It's confusing, but it makes sense if the parallel timeline wasn't their actual future. Which it's shown not to be by the end. *The controversial idea is:* It was never going to be their exact future; and only by fighting to avoid that future, did they fall into the patterns and actions that lead them so close to actualizing that future in their own timeline. They explore this idea in the final season a bit.

@@AbitofEverything4U I think that's because Fitz goes into cryostasis in both timelines. The one in the Destroyed Earth timeline avoids the destruction and stays in cryosleep until the future year, comes back to 616 with the team, etc. While 616 Fitz does the same thing but, because the Earth doesn't get destroyed, gets into trouble in space during S6 while they try to find him. One way I look at it too is if I supposedly went to your future and didn't know or think about alternate universes and saw my actions seemingly lead to the same outcome when I return to my timeline, I'd probably be thinking that future is inevitable while still trying to change the future. Plus, it makes for good television. All the twists put me at the edge of my seat as things moved closer to the end.

@@draftspartan1182 When the team returns, not much time has passed in the main timeline. Only afer this do they go searching for Fitz in standard timeline and time. Fitz is awoken from his sleep very early. By the time they find his old ship, he'd been living among aliens for quite a while.... but wasn't that all before the EarthBreaker event would have plausibly happened in their timeline? It's been a while since I last watched the final seasons, so maybe I missed something.

@@OpinionParade I totally commented before your first reply showed up lol so I think we are on a similar page. As for Fitz, I don't remember if it tells us how long he's been awake for, but it's likely after S5 ended. There's a whole year between seasons so he could've been out for a few months of the whole year.

Thanks for the positive feedback! I did indeed put these timelines together to summarize the info on the wiki in an easy to reference format. The wiki is outstanding when it comes to digging deep into the details and then these summaries are great for a high-level view of how it all fits together. Thanks so much for watching the vid and sharing your thoughts. Really appreciate it!

Great video as always btw :)

Great feedback! Okay, I see where you are going with that. Back to the Future II did seem to be more of a branching scenario. It's really Back to the Future I that invented the "go to the past, change it, and wipe out your future" concept. So perhaps some of Runaways S3 was branching after all. I just remember them seeming to wipe out their future timeline after the changes they made in Aug, 2018. Anyway, I do hope Marvel clears it all up at some point. Would be great if the new timeline book coming out later this year addresses it. Thanks so much for watching the vid and sharing your thoughts. Really appreciate it!

Yeah, I definitely walked away from Paul Zbyszewski's interviews with the impression that we won't see any ties or easter eggs, but that the show is still part of the greater MCU. And I do think Loeb wanted Adventure into Fear's shows to tie into Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D., but when the Ghost Rider show never materialized I wonder what that ultimately means for the shows. Anyway, excellent feedback on the vid. Really appreciate all your great commentary!

Yes, I agree, I think including the different web series that are basically news channels reporting from the ground level will be a nice addition to the overall timeline. Like you said, it adds a different perspective to things and really rounds it all out. Thanks so much for watching the vid and sharing your thoughts. Really appreciate it!

I love it! Fantastic explanation. Thanks for sharing that!

Thanks so much...really appreciate the positive feedback!

Yes, you raise a great point. The Marvel TV shows (before Disney+, that is) all tied together really well. It was a very impressive feat to keep them all so well connected. I also agree that phase 4 seemed abit disconnected. However, I think it was a huge set-up phase and that Phase 5 and beyond will start connecting together very tightly. Will be interesting to see where things go from here in the MCU, but I think we are in for an awesome ride! Thanks so much for watching the vid and sharing your thoughts. Really appreciate it!

@@AbitofEverything4U of course! Happy to watch your videos. Hopefully this Jonathan major’s stuff gets sorted in an appropriate manner so marvel’s future isn’t in as much of a limbo

@@ShaneFussell Yes, I agree. I really hope Jonathan Majors gets things worked out. It's looking good for him, based on what's been released so far!

Excellent thoughts on Helstrom. Yeah, I don't see any reason it can't be canon along with Agents of SHIELD (i.e. the Ghost Rider tie). I would have loved to have seen Adventures into Fear and it's such a bummer it never happened, but your point is valid that it could have still happened, but we just didn't see it. Thanks so much for watching the vid and sharing your thoughts on Helstrom. Really do appreciate it!

Wow...that's so cool that you are working on those scripts and plan to show them to Marvel. Best of luck. The ideas sound great!

Thanks for the positive feedback. I enjoy putting the timelines together, as it helps me as much as I hope it helps others. Thanks so much for watching the vid and sharing your thoughts. Really appreciate it!

Ikr? Gotta really dig deep sometimes to find the hints and clues. That said, they made that video game reference really visible, so I give them credit for placing that very prominent timeline easter egg. And yeah very excited for that timeline book to come out. Should be awesome! Thanks so much for watching the vid and sharing your thoughts. Really appreciate it!

Fantastic feedback as always. Here are a few thoughts: 1. I do think Ms. Marvel's time travel contradicts Endgame, but I also think it was intentional. I think Kang's device will let him alter the past w/o branching and I think we will find that the bangles are remnants of what powers Kang's device. Thus I think that's why Ms. Marvel did what she did. But just my theory. 2. I also think Agents of SHIELD S5 goes against Endgame rules (but not S7, as they do mention branching in that season). I have to wonder, however, if going in the past creates a branch, but going to the future and then returning to your present doesn't create a branch. AoS S5 did something fundamentally different than Endgame by going to the future rather than the past and they did their time travel using a means other than the quantum realm (i.e. the time monolith), so either of those things could come into play. 3. I can't wait to see what Marvel does with Deadpool 2's time travel. It seems to be a key point of DP 3 with the TVA coming after him. So I wonder if Cable's device is tied to some of the tech that Kang will end up using for his time device and thus they will explain that Cable's device does allow changing the past. Of course, that hinges on my theory being correct that Kang's device will allow him to change the past. 4. Runaways final episode is so problematic as it definitely rewrites the past. So I think Marvel will either decanonize that episode or will find a way to explain that Chase also has Kang tech. Another option is to decanonize the entire series but I guess I disagree that it means they have to decanonize Cloak and Dagger. It could be that in 616, Cloak And Dagger went to check on the girls ending up dead on the beach but that it isn't due to Runaways, which is no longer canon. Thus, the C&D appearance is runaways wouldn't be considered 616 canon but the C&D S1 and S2 could remain canon. Just a thought on how they could address it. 5. I think the creator of Helstrom was pretty clear that Helstrom isn't canon to 616 but I also think he did a terrible job of stating it. So I think it isn't canon, but I'm also fine if it ends up being canon. I do think it's a bad idea that it happened during the blip, however, so that's another vote for it being non-canon, imo. Again, fantastic feedback. Always love to read your thoughts on the videos!

@@AbitofEverything4U 2. I believe that the Time Monolith was also branching. Otherwise it doesn't make sense for us to have that scene where Flint tries to recreate 2091 Earth after the agents have returned to the past. It also makes rescuing Fitz much more problematic. But if time was always going to branch at the battle of Chicago, then the Time Monolith can choose which branch it sends the agents down into the future. It could have sent them to destroyed Earth 2091, or it could have sent them to post-Endgame, saved Earth 2091. Then they returned to the past before the branch point. Think of it like sliding up a fork. Where the handle becomes the tines is the branching point. The Time Monolith sent the agents along the time fork to one of the tines. Then after they saved the future, they returned to the handle of the time fork. Then when they got to the Battle of New York, the Nexus Event happened that created the tines in time that branch off into various alternate universes, one where Coulson took the vaccine, one where Coulson slipped Quake the vaccine but she didn't notice it, one where Quake did notice it but was prevented from using it, and one where she did use it. All of those possibilities play out on the time-fork, and we follow two of the tines (one of the tines leads to the ruined Earth in 2091 as well as the Robin "flashbacks" where the time-traveling agents save people in the Lighthouse station, the Kree kill Yo-yo, etc., and one leads to Agents of SHIELD S6; every one of these possibilities happen in time, but the agents only experience one of them while their variants, born during the Nexus Event, experience the others). 3. Oh, I just remembered that Cable's device worked differently before the post-credits scene. Yukio "fixed" it before Deadpool started jumping around to Origins: Wolverine and Ryan Reynolds's Green Lantern script reading, for example. So maybe Cable's device was of the sort that allowed him to change the past, and then Yukio changed it into the MCU time travel sort. For a really far-out theory, maybe Cable's device (unknowingly?) notified the TVA when he made a jump, and then they went in and pruned the branch that Cable originally came from/altered time to make Cable believe that time was erased and altered, but when Yukio fixed the device to do actual time travel, the TVA started coming after Deadpool because they lost track of that device? 4. Agreed that decanonizing Runaways wouldn't necessitate a de-canonization of C&D or AoS for the reasons you stated. 5. Yeah, thematically I like Helstrom much more around the time of Doctor Strange/AoS S4 since that era has a similarly dark tone and deals with demons and the like in their own ways. From what I recall, the dates that are on the props aren't actually visible in any of the episodes, and 2020 is when the show came out, which likely means they just put a contemporary date on the props rather than intending that Helstrom took place in the MCU in 2020, but that's one you could argue either way.

@FN-1701AgentGodzillaRangerPrime Ω And one of those branching points is the Big Bang in which the Infinity Stones likely created every possible universe like the paint universe and the animated universe. Entirely possible that if the Infinity Stones drastically altered the way space and reality operate in some universes, they could have drastically altered the way time operates in some universes.

@@Volvagia0slayer 2. I'll admit, the time travel in Agents of SHIELD S5 makes my head hurt. Great story...but waaaaay too complicated. I've not found two people who completely agree on how it all worked. But I'd love for it to be branching logic as that solves alot of issues. 3. I am really excited to see what they do with the deadpool time travel. Should be very cool. I just hope they try to reconcile it all with the Endgame rules. 4. Agreed. 5. Helstrom is just a mess. I'm fine with wherever someone decides to place it. I think the wiki is aiming for Oct 2020, but it's gotta be one of the hardest to nail down from a timeline standpoint ... along with Legion.

@FN-1701AgentGodzillaRangerPrime Ω Completely agree. I do wonder if different devices let you time travel via different rules, but they need to explain that, if so.

Very clever theory! Yes, you are right, Chase had 5 years more to study time travel since 2023 and could have even built upon the knowledge gained from the time heist in Endgame. That's a very interesting thought. Maybe Marvel will run with that idea! Thanks so much for watching the vid and sharing your thoughts. Really appreciate it!

It's not even in the Marvel hub on Disney+, it's under Star (at least it is in the UK)

Excellent points! Yeah, It seems like the producers for Helstrom wanted us to know that it wasn't considered part of the main MCU based on the way that they branded it. And if you throw in that it isn't even on Disney+, you have to assume that it isn't canon. Still fun to watch from a completist standpoint, but I don't personally think it's considered canon. Thanks so much for watching the vid and sharing your thoughts. Really appreciate it!

​​@@AbitofEverything4UIt originally was going to have the Marvel branding, But after Marvel Studios dismantled Marvel TV, They cancelled all the other Hulu Marvel shows, and tried to bury Helstrom, which is why they so quickly tried to claim it wasn't canon

​@@jesusramirezromo2037 Yeah, that was a bummer. The show wasn't too bad. I enjoyed it.

Well said. It would indeed be very cool if all of the forms of time travel could somehow co-exist. Thanks for your feedback on the vid. Really appreciate it!

​@@AbitofEverything4UI think it's possible for there to be multiple of time travel. I think it all depends on what you use to travel with. Kang,TVA & Avengers all use the Quantum Realm to "travel through time" aka branching. We don't know what fuels Cable's time watch or the one from Runaways they seem to work the same way. With Cable's he could use it only Two times to go back in time then go back to the future. To me what ever is powering Cable's watch is pretty strong but it needs time to recharge. For the whole "you can't interact with your past self" line in Runaways I just chalk it up to him not knowing how it works. He probably just didn't bother do that he just learned how that time watch worked then went to past to save one of his friends.

​@@spider-dude2476Yes, I think ultimately that Marvel will indeed go with the logic that how time travel works is based on the way you are traveling (i.e. the quantum realm vs. the obelisk vs. tech like Cable's device vs. magic, etc). I think that's the best and safest way for Marvel to address what appears to be inconsistencies. Great feedback!

Good point! Yes, that could very well be what Kang was talking about. But I also have a suspicion that Kang will be able to travel thru time w/o creating a branch if he's in his time chair. I could be wrong, but just a personal theory.

@@AbitofEverything4U I think the time chair was just Quantum Kang’s way of traveling through universes. Because his goal was to destroy any timeline he deemed dangerous or they had a Kang he didn’t like because he felt his other selves were a danger to the multiverse. So he would’ve just found Janet a reality within the multiverse where she didn’t get trapped in the Quantum realm & just remove that variant of her. Gotta remember its just Rick & Morty writers put Rick & Morty multiverse rules within the MCU. Kang’s chair is just Rick’s portal gun

Yep, totally agree that your assumption could be correct. For now, I'm still sticking with my theory that Kang will be able to travel time w/o creating a branch, but your assumption is the safer bet, to be sure!

Right, I definitely agree that Feige has been ambiguous about the pre-D+ shows more recently. But I don't believe he's ever rescinded his original statement. Personally, I wish he would just say one way or another if they are still canon and perhaps the new timeline book will finally answer it. But for the sake of this video, I assumed they are all canon so I could show what the timeline would look like if so.

@@AbitofEverything4U I don’t think he remembers saying that in an interview. I think his overarching plan is to use the multiverse to canonize everything in someway, we just haven’t seen it yet.

He may not remember saying it, but fans sure remember it! Anyway, I think it would behoove him to give a clear statement about the canon or non-canon status of the shows. Would be nice to end the argument for good. Great feedback as always!

Thanks so much for the positive feedback. Really appreciate it!

Good points...yeah, I enjoyed Runaways overall, but it got abit crazy with the storyline at times and it seemed to trip over itself here and there...such as with the 2 years vs. 3 years vs. perhaps even 4 years issue and ofc the time travel elements. Bummer that Marvel seems to have eliminated it from their library, as I can't find it on D+ or Hulu anymore. Sigh.

@@AbitofEverything4U Yeah. Supposedly it was one of the shows they had to remove from the server to save money, but... I don't quite understand that statement. It's not like leaving it on the server would actually have taken ke much money, if any at all. Their server is already massive, and they've now combined Hulu and Disney+'s server if one is paying for both, and they leave it on all the time, because obviously if the server is off then nobody can access the content unless it's downloaded. But I also quite enjoyed the show. I had never heard of the characters before the show came out and had absolutely no framework for what it would be. And I ended up really liking it. Not quite as much as Cloak and Dagger (though their appearance in season 3 and retconned connection to the Dark Dimension/Loa is cool), because the writing in Cloak and Dagger is just that much better, especially from a character standpoint. Later on, when the Stargirl show came out, it kinda helped that I had seen Runways, because Stargirl was very similar. A bunch of high school kids inheriting powers and abilities from their parents, combining them with their own skills, and fighting either a bunch of evil kids, or the evil parents themselves. Though Stargirl I think went a bit too into that stuff at times and could be pretty cheesy. Runaways was at least partially believable, as a bunch of kids simply ran away from their evil parents, but over time come to learn more about why exactly they did those things, and that at the end of the day they do love their children very much. Can't really be said for the Injustice Society.

Yeah, I definitely enjoyed Runaways and I'm really glad I got to see it before it was removed. I also agree that Cloak and Dagger was even better. What a great show. Would love to see them again. And that's a very interesting analogy about Stargirl. I never considered that before.

Great comments as always! You may be right about Danny Rand not being a very good businessman. That said, to the outside world I think he was respected and it was just with the board and key members of the company that he wasn't respected. Remember that he paid to get Misty's arm suited with the robot transplant so he seemed to be pretty savvy. I suspect that Rand was considered to be a pretty good businessman to the world at large. The reason I suspect the Deadpool time travel will come in to play is that the TVA is showing up in Deadpool 3, so it doesn't seem they would be involved unless Deadpool was somehow tied to the sacred timeline. But hopefully DP 3 will answer all our questions. I'll have to watch AoS and Runaways again to see exactly how they referenced the Darkhold, but you are probably right that they tried to connect dark magic to the Dark Dimension. So there could be other continuity issues there. And I agree, while I really liked Runaways, it didn't seem to integrate very well into the overall MCU. Would be great if Marvel gave us a hint on whether it was canon or not. It does seem like Nico (or a variant of her) will appear in Spiderman: Freshman Year.

@@AbitofEverything4U About Danny, the common people liked him, but I don't think he will be respected as a businessman from any executive of the same market, from what I recall they know he made the decision to sell a pill at low cost, costing his company a lot of money. Well maybe that isn't enough for people to think he makes bad decisions, but still he didn't brought revolutionary ideas or something. "I'll have to watch AoS and Runaways again to see exactly how they referenced the Darkhold, but you are probably right that they tried to connect dark magic to the Dark Dimension. So there could be other continuity issues there. " I think I'll also need to rewatch the show at some point but from what I remember before Dr Strange (movie) if there was like another dimension of "evil", they called hell in AofS, but after the movie came out the Marvel TV shows started to use the concept of Dark Dimension a lot, I guess to try to keep the idea that they were happening in 616 (athough we saw an alternative timeline version of the Dark Dimension in What If, so nowadays that doesn't help much). Most of the time if something magic happened it was related to the Dark Dimension, I guess because we saw that characters were performing rituals to gain power from it, so in the mind of the people behind the shows magic=Dark Dimension. From what I recall Nico's powers where drawn from it and that's why she had an evil appearence when she used it for destruction, I don't know if that was taken from the comics or if it's a show origin thing. Also I believe Morgan Le Fey was trapped in the DD and she had the Darkhold, presumably the same one from AofS that Ghost Rider took somewhere so maybe it was the Dark Dimension. I don't remember if in S4 of AofS they mention the Dark Dimension but at some point I remember Coulson, Fitz and Robbie where trapped in a dark mirror reality or something so that could be nod to the DD.

@@FranciscoRamirez-nb4uu Good news on the Rand quote is that it was only one more reason to place C&D S1 in Feb, 2017, so even if it doesn't help with the placement after all, it won't change the Feb, 2017 date. I personally think that people had respect for Danny...I mean Trump, Elon, Zuckerberg, they are all a little crazy. But regardless, that particular reference isn't needed to place C&D S1. As for the Darkhold, I've tried my best to reconcile it all, but in the end, I do fear that AoS and Runaways don't mesh as well as they should with what we learned in Wandavision and Dr. Strange. I am glad that at least they resolved why there are multiple copies of the Darkhold. So that issue is taken care of.

Very interesting ideas! My personal guess is that Marvel won't attempt to connect the Fantastic Four universe and the X-men universe, but perhaps we will get an answer on whether they are connected when the Deadpool 3 movie comes out. It seems that movie will feature several of the Fox universe characters, which will be awesome. Can't wait for that movie to come out. I also suspect Marvel won't attempt to connect the Daredevil/Elektra movies with the Spider-man movies and will instead treat them all as happening in separate universes. However, we may see some of the characters return in Secret Wars and they will all get a chance to interact at that point. Will be epic! Anyway, love your ideas and I may do a video covering them as we get closer to Secret Wars. Thanks so much for watching the vid and sharing your thoughts. Loved reading them all!

@@AbitofEverything4U thanks I appreciate you reading all that! Great video as always and I agree with what you said I doubt they’ll get references soon if ever in the mcu. Maybe in secret wars but I love discussing the connections so I thought it was worth bringing up.

Right...I love the connections as well. I suspect between DP 3 and Secret Wars we are in for quite a wild ride and that the Fantastic 4 and X-men universes will be well represented. So much great content for Marvel to use. It's gonna be amazing!

Yeah, I hope to have the Daily Bugle / WHIH video together soon. As for how to download the Google Sheet, you just go to the directory at drive.google.com/drive/u/0/folders/1R_PrexMkTjYpQAraxlhzs2U5EPJEPioc. Then double click on the file to open it and then chose File and then choose Download. If that doesn't work, let me know, but that should work for you. Thanks so much for watching the vid! Really appreciate it!

Sure thing! Updated it now. Should have done that earlier, tbh.

Yeah, Runaways has some issues, especially that final episode. I did enjoy watching it, however. Cloak & Dagger would be great to see back in the MCU. Definitely agree the first season had some pacing issues, but it was a fun show overall.

Baron Mordo had a more comprehensive understanding of time travel. He lists every possibility in Doctor Strange, including branches (Endgame), loops (Ms. Marvel), and erasing yourself from existence (Runaways)

I suspect Hulk was correct in regards to time travel via the quantum realm, but I agree that he was likely unaware of how it would work via other means. I do hope Marvel explains it all at some point, as it would be nice to have a definitive answer. Thanks so much for watching the vid and sharing your thoughts. Really appreciate it!

@@Cris00900340 Yes, I completely agree. I think Mordo was explaining all forms of time travel, while Hulk was just discussing how the quantum realm works.

I've been thinking about doing that timeline for awhile. But it's so hard to figure out what they are doing with the timeline right now, tbh. I may take a stab at it soon, but I suspect we'll get alot of answers when The Flash comes out. Should be an epic movie!

Unfortunately at the end of the episode they do succeed in changing time which, if memory serves, causes the future versions of the time traveling characters to be erased. But then a piece of paper that was brought from the now-erased future that was left behind in the past remained in existence... Not sure how that works if I'm remembering that totally correctly. I suppose it's possible that the piece of paper existed in the past, and the person from the future just wrote on it, leaving that information behind despite him ceasing to exist.

Yeah, I wondered at first if the Runaways time travel could be creating branches and the characters just didn't understand what was happening, but they did indeed show that the original future was reset after the Runaways made the changes to things in Aug, 2018. So it seems it wasn't creating branches. But I do think your point is spot on that in general, branches could have been created in alot of the time travel instances I mention in the video and that the TVA doesn't care, as long as they don't create a new Kang in the 31st century. I do hope Marvel gives us some explanations for all of the different time travel at some point. Thanks so much for watching the vid and sharing your thoughts. Really appreciate it!

​@@Volvagia0slayer Yep, you nailed it. They really seemed to make it very clear that it was re-setting the past. I wanted so badly to find a way to call it branching, but I just don't think it's possible.

@@AbitofEverything4U do you feel that this could, if marvel desired, be retconned as something Kang wanted to happen? Maybe them disappearing would be them being pruned?

@@ShaneFussell Okay, now that's an interesting idea! I'm game for any logical explanation that eliminates "back to the future" type time travel. I love your idea!

Yes, I think you are correct...how you do the time travel impacts whether you branch or not. I do hope Marvel explains that at some point, but I think your theory is correct. And you a raise a good point about Helstrom tying to Moon Knight. I'm totally fine if Helstrom is considered canon. Those quotes from the producer were strange, but it could very well be canon. Thanks so much for watching the vid and sharing your thoughts. Really appreciate it!

That's true, but I think it's important to note that the Moon Knight producer was clearly very confused, and he didn't fully understand what "MCU" means as a franchise. For Helstrom, meanwhile, Paul Zbyszewski has a very comprehensive understanding of what the MCU and canon means to fans. He was an executive producer for Agents of SHIELD and wrote some of the best episodes in the series, just a big Marvel Television veteran overall. So when this guy announces that Helstrom isn't canon, it's a big deal and shouldn't be taken lightly

@@Cris00900340 Great feedback. Yes, I think you summarized it very well!

Great question! So there are rumors we'll get a Ghost Rider special presentation in the next few years. If you haven't seen this video, then you might check it out as I cover the rumored slate: kzfaq.info/get/bejne/g8WPfd1z29yllnk.html. The real mystery is whether it will be Johnny Blaze or Robbie Reyes. But either way, I'll just be so glad to see Ghost Rider back in the MCU again! Thanks so much for watching the vid and sharing your thoughts. Really appreciate it!

I'll be interested in your thoughts after you watch the video. I agree that at first, the Hulu and Freeform shows seem pretty disconnected, but there are actually several fun ties between these shows and the Netflix shows. And for a deeper dive, you can check out this video for a more focused look at all of the ties between the different shows: kzfaq.info/get/bejne/nqd_oruixNXbon0.html. Anyway, I think you might enjoy watching Cloak and Dagger and Runaways, if you get a chance. Thanks so much for watching the vid and sharing your thoughts. Really appreciate it!

Presumably if they don't contradict canon, we should treat them as being placed intentionally. If they do contradict something, then they're just a cool easter egg. You could take it further and say if it affects the plot it's intentional but if it in no way affects the plot it's just an easter egg. But those are the two general schools of thought on it.

In my opinion, there isn't much difference. Easter Eggs should inform the viewer about other things happening outside of the current show / movie they are watching. They might be there to help place things in the timeline or they might just be nods to the fact that the MCU is a connected universe. Easter Eggs are placed there intentionally by Marvel (in other words they aren't there by accident) and are meant to increase your viewing experience of their connected universe. They should never contradict something else, but unfortunately that does happen at times and normally Marvel will correct the error or at least explain that it was an error, as they take great pride in keeping things as accurate as can be. Just my take on easter eggs, but I hope that helps. Thanks so much for watching the vid and sharing your thoughts. Really appreciate it!

@@Volvagia0slayer Interesting take. I think that makes sense, although an easter egg that contradicts something is more of what I would call a mistake rather than an easter egg. But just my thoughts on it.

Exactly! It would perhaps be 2020, which is wild!

C&D S2 runs from Oct-Dec, 2017...so it technically starts before Ragnarok (which is Nov, 2017) but ends after it. However, it's only a small portion of the epilogue of the final episode of C&D that reaches into December. So the vast majority of C&D S2 is before Ragnarok.

The timeline book seems to imply that any Marvel TV shows prior to Disney+ are not part of the sacred timeline but are instead in a branched timeline (basically a What IF type branch). So they are still canon to the multiverse, but not to the sacred timeline. Still, they were fun shows, so if you decide to watch them, you might enjoy them.

@@AbitofEverything4U that's not really what I meant. what I meant was now that runaways is off of both hulu AND disney plus is it still worth spending all that money to watch something that will likely never be referenced again?

Really up to you in the end...it's an enjoyable show, even if it isn't sacred timeline canon any longer. But I agree, it's likely not worth $20/season to watch it.

Yep, it's on my list at some point. It's a really cool idea!

Well said...the shows are canon to 616 no matter what...so now the question is whether they are sacred timeline canon. Will be interesting to see if more shows get added to the official timeline down the road!

Oh wow, how interesting! Yes, that's a great point that I hadn't noticed. Thanks for mentioning that!

It was a deleted scene though, therefore the staff never appeared in Dr Strange. There are however a bunch of references to Dr Strange in the Runaways, like when they say that the staff draws energy from Dormammu's dimension and Nico gets those Kaecilius eyes.

Oh no...now that would send me to an early grave! Seriously, I may consider doing that at some point...I figured I'd first focus on live action stuff first, as it's readily available online, but I agree, adding in the comics would be a very cool addition. Excellent suggestion! Thanks so much for watching the vid and sharing your thoughts. Really appreciate it!

Thanks for the thoughtful response! I really like your videos. The comic books are not that hard. Most of them are prequel stories. The MCU wiki is really complete in this area. Now the books are another can of worms. Even the in the wiki information about the books is really sparse. Anyway, I hope you can continue doing this kind of videos. Best of luck.

Good feedback. Yeah, I might consider doing the comics, since the wiki does indeed cover them very thoroughly. It would be fun topic to tackle. Thanks for the suggestion and for your support!

Yeah, I agree, the general order of things is the most important. But it's also fun to try to narrow it down to even more specifics, such as the month things occurred. In the end, however, the order is the most important thing. Well said!

I loved that. Epic stuff! I will likely stick to the stuff that more readily fits into being canon for now, but I am considering a video on all the promotional stuff that's been put out over the years and that Korg/Deadpool stuff would fit right in. Great suggestion! Thanks so much for watching the vid and sharing your thoughts. Really appreciate it!

@AbitofEverything4U If you do ever make that video, definitely include the x-Box/Falcon and Winter Soldier ad that confirms that the computer tech guy from CA:WS is in fact noobmaster69. Even though it's in ad, it's canon in my mind 😁

@@howveyouben Oh yeah, that's right. I love that tie-in and I agree, it's canon, darn it!

Yes, I tend to agree that Helstrom is the least likely show to be considered canon and your reasoning adds fuel to the fire regarding the branding differences as well as not being on D+. Great feedback! Thanks so much for watching the vid and sharing your thoughts. Really appreciate it!

Okay, you definitely piqued my curiosity...did I say something wrong or strange? It won't be the first time if so. 🤣

@@AbitofEverything4U In context I understand that you were referring to the complexities and difficulty of managing & running all these shows, but Jeph Loeb amidst production of Daredevil Season 2 axed Nobu's storyline & being a bigger character because "nobody cares about asians". Peter Shinkoda(nobu's actor) came out about it in an interview in 2020. I know you like to keep things positive, but that could very easily be taken out of context.

Oh my! Thanks for telling me that. I didn't know he said that about Asians. I agree, that's reprehensible. I truly appreciate you letting me know and I'll avoid paying him any compliments in the future. I abhor bigotry. Ugh!

LOL! Indeed!

Yes indeed, Harlem was the main location for Luke Cage's 2 seasons. Love how they tied Luke Cage and Cloak and Dagger together. So cool! Thanks so much for watching the vid and sharing your thoughts. Really appreciate it!

@@AbitofEverything4U of course 💪🏽

I personally like Cloak and Dagger and Runaways, but I understand everyone has a different opinion. The nice thing about the google sheet I created is if someone doesn't agree that certain shows are canon, they can just filter them out or they can delete them altogether. I created the Type column to make it easy to see only what each person wants to view as canon. Thanks so much for watching the vid and sharing your thoughts. Really appreciate it!

@@AbitofEverything4U You are glorious time keeper🔥

LOL! Thanks...that's very kind of you!