Hober calling Empire "Yesterday" was chef's kiss!

Salvors hesitation was growing tiresome after the third time Laron changed to Hugo.

Harry smashing telem then saying I didn't like her anyway oh my god the delivery and execution was 10/10

Hope this gets a season 3, the show has really found its feet with this season.

This was genuinely my favorite episode of TV from any show this year. It really reminded of those Game of Thrones early seasons, where episode 9 was always the biggest hitter before the cooldown of the finale.

There is a time shift between what’s happening with Gaal/Salvor/Hari-2 and what’s happening on Terminus, as evident by “the Vault shouting for Habor Marlowe” event. So, I’m hoping that at the time Empire “destroyed” Terminus, Hari-2 had already organized enough of the mentalics that what we saw was just a mass hallucination meant to fool the Empire so he’ll leave Terminus alone. And maybe that’s what Marlowe’s implant really was, a transmission device for “mental power”. It would also explain why Marlowe deliberately provoke Empire to bring him on the bridge when this was all happening. Grasping at straws, I know….

I think Tellem was horrified not so much that the mule will be so evil and powerful but that she finally realizes he started as one of her followers.

Hari's consciousness was transferred to a robot. That is why Tellem could not sense him and she thought he was a hologram

Completely different from the books, but absolutely brilliant show! This is how adaptations should be done!

I agree with others here: fantastic episode! My heart was pounding the entire length of it. Really happy this show is shooting for greatness and mostly achieving it.

The fundamental question with the Mule is how much the TV series will borrow from the books. In the books the Mule was not a strong mentalic, he was a mutant with a unique ability to control and lock emotions, something the best mentalics could only do at a rudimentary level. He was not clairvoyant and could not see the future or past. But imagine a boy growing up in a community where the strongest mind can bully and exploit the weaker ones, but who later discovers his mind can do something the others can't. He might well turn out like the Mule and I wouldn't blame him if a super-bully like Tellem was his first victim. The TV series is doing something creative, but there are still many directions this plot thread could go.

Hari could have just handed the Radiant to Empire at his trial... idk about that theory. Also it's 100+ years past his death so seeing Demerzel young again let's him know she's either a clone or a bot

This is the best show on any platform right now. It's not even close. The special effects, the writing, the story. The acting... it's just the best. I think only "the boys" could come close, but it's not airing at the same time.

Dermazel will not have to obey Cleon soon...because Day has ended the kinetic dynasty freeing her after they die to take full autonomous control of Empire ...

The Invictus was sold as a fleet killer, the ultimate weapon against anyone and it couldn’t even take down one ship, and was taken out by a single shot from one fighter, they could barely get close to it in season one because of the automatic defences, bit lame that they put up such a shit fight, I hope they retaliate with whisper ships in season 3 Also everything is happening according to plan 100% 👌 Incredible episode

Regarding Hari giving the prime radiant, remember that it is only one of the two copies, existing in a state of superposition (both have the same computations regardless of distance). Since Day, Demerzel and Hari are at this moment inside the radiant, they also do not experience time normally, which means everyhing beyond this point might very well be a simulation for Demerzel's benefit, so that she may experience how the future will unfold.

Very difficult book to adapt to TV. but they are doing a good job. The books cover thousands of years and it would be extremely difficult to create empathy with the characters if they changed in each season. very creative the way they resolved this situation these writers deserve the raise

I would imagine Demerzel’s prison would have gotten pretty dusty. So cool that she was from earth. Also, how is Hari alive? And I bet there’s a second foundation and has been one the entire time.

Nobody seemed to pick up on the fact that Tellem thought Hari was a vision because Hari is not an organic being.

Esto Demerzel is really a male robot. The greatest robot in sci fi history- the one and only - R.Daneel Olivaw. That’s why she can transfer her mind into any humaniform model of her own creation. She serves Empire because there’s a plan to save all of humanity and she is one of the designers of the concept of Psychohistory. R. Daneel created the concept of psychohistory with the help of R. Giskard , another special robot that evolved into something greater than his original programming.

I think harry knows the robot is real ruler because in his speech he was only looking and focused more on her than day, he only spoke to day when we says something

Hober Mallow has a unique ability to make the right conclusion from scattered facts. So he asked Bel Riose if getting the fleet and Emperor on Terminus was a plot by Harry. Also Day was walking away from the Vault with the Radiant in his hand. Interesting...

Man, I don't know what to think. I only know that this is the best sci-fi on TV, currently. I'm so sorry to see so many on Trantor perish. I will miss those characters.

I think that Harry remotely disabled the modifications that Cleon I made to Demerzel, while she was inside the Prime Radiant.

She's the same robot who helped Will Smith in i robot! 💯

I really felt that it was a heavy line and a fairly deeply significant that Hari spoke the line"I can teach Demerzel to read it"

I think one of the most interesting detail this season, one they'd hinted at prior to this episode, is that the technology exists for cyborgs, where brain tissue is integrated with machines (as opposed to something like the Spacers, where organic beings have been engineered and integrated with technologies. Might the Seldon we see be something like that? Now, I'm going to stop pointing out that the show could be called "Foundation & Dune" or "Game of Immortals" and just say I don't care about the strains of the DNA, the show has become a damn fine piece of sci-fi and I'm in for the next season wholeheartedly. Edit: and hmmm maybe the destruction of the planet was an illusion?

This episode proved everything hari said when he first confronted Cleon. You would think something in the world would cause at least one generation of Cleon to escape their nature but then again their might be a program to kill and replace cleons that stray to far from a cleons usual behavior

I think I like one of the many things you touched on towards the end there. Might come up before long ^^

Brilliant … Cheers 🍻

I think the link between Demiezel and the Cleons broke when Hober interrupted the executions of Poly and Brother Constance. The concussion dislodged the device in her neck. Day out right ignores her strong suggestions. Dusk is further questioning why he could never question her part in the lives of the three Empires. It's Day that is the one unshackled. Unfortunately, as Demiezel pointed out to Day, that his behavior is the consequence of her failing raising him right, placating him with the illusion of a loving relationship. Returning to Trantor, she will put into motion a coup against Day. Perhaps boosting Dawn into power. Essentially, Day has turned into a despot, more than he was before. Because his temper is not, to make a pun, tempered. She reflects that the 600 year plan was a miscalculation, and that the genetic dynasty merely postponed a doom that was bound to happen, unless a drastic change happened. She will communicate more with the stored mind of Hari Seldon via that polygon device. The Space Navy will support her, with the cooperation of the General, that even after the General's life partner heroically won the space battle. He was left to die because Day's only concern was his own feeling of feeling defied. Caring only the 1st Foundation become an example of what happens to those that defy him. He's become somewhat of a Henry the 8th.

You also have the shezerade, 1001 nights aspect

I wonder as Demrazel watched the imminent destruction of Trantor if she thought of the destruction of Earth that she barely escaped in the novels. I expect she realized that Day/Empire was not fit to carry on the Cleonic dynasty that she originally swore her loyalty oath. 🧐

Thank you! Them not using the halos bother me. Plus how the hell do they not shoot the last fighter with so much fire power! So many frustrating plot holes and also amazing spectacles.

I think the producers of this show are reading very different versions of the Foundation series than I remember. Terminus never ever gets destroyed. It stays as the core of the First Foundation throughout the entire series of novels. I wish they’d have stayed truer to the source material.

Attacking Day in the church would be of no use. They'd just decant another and glass Terminus. By parleying there was a possibility terminus might survive.

One of the big general things about this show is that the more I internalize that it is "inspired by the foundation series" and not an interpretation of the series, the more I can enjoy it. Apart from Salvor falling for the same parlor trick over and over again, which stretched my suspension of disbelief, this was a bang-on episode. Really looking forward to hearing how Hari2 is still alive and seeing what happens with the first foundation. They've got 150 years to get strong again before the mule if it's going to track at all with the books. Maybe the seat of government moves to Haven or one of the four core systems?

Cleon never fails to amaze in punishments. Plus it is also kind of Seldons fault, all he had to do was feed days ego by admitting his math is broken he couldve just lied and saved the first foundation and the people.

Ain’t it a coincidence that simultaneously both dermezel and sareth are seeking for freedom from the empire. One of them will get their wish I believe . Or it will conflict with one another

You picked out some unique details 💫 Why does everyone think Josiah is so important?

The only hope against the mule/mentalics is robots and AI/Demerzel (An adaptation of Daneel from the books). I think she was modified/tweaked when she met Harry in episode 9. Asimov linked the foundation series to the Robots series in the later books (covering the origins and elimination of A.I.) but the series has changed so much from the books. The first foundation isn't destroyed in the books at this point, instead the Empires fleet pulls back as the general can't be trusted. Liking the direction this is taking since the books don't have a satisfying ending.

Since Hari knew Demerzel and if she set him up in business how would Hari address her as an outlier? There would be no need for him to sacrifice Terminus as bait to lure her in to talk to her or get a Prime Radiant to her. She should have been in his equations from the beginning. I really try to enjoy the show as a stand alone product but even so there are problems with the writing.

How did they manage to take out the Invictus so easily? And why did it destroy the planet.

My Theory: Bel Rios will kill day and switch sides. and since they still have all the scientists + tec from the church they can also leverage that into an alliance with the spacers. Then they can set up on a different planet or rather in space. Maybe even on the spacers hive. I’m so looking forward to the episode, can’t wait.

Watch how the camera focuses on the little boy. He feels betrayed after helping salvor. There’s that theory that he may become the mule,. I think Cleon the first is still In charge thru demerzel

Wondering if Harry removed the chip while demizal was in the library? Could the terminus fight be a mind projection.

In a world of spaceships, mind readers, and humanoid robots the first few minutes of this vid wonders how 1 pc could download it’s hard drive into another. Or if an emperor has the resources to make a good box, or did he have to go to a far away planet to get it..😂😂😂

One of the other main characters is also a robot.

I wonder if Tellum is now disembodied, serching for a mind to inhabit. Like Jeziah? Ahhh wtf you literally just said that in the video as i rinished writing it ahaha

You say in the end of the video that now Demrezel will be albe to hurt empire directly but she already killed one Dawn in S1 by neck breaking. I believe Cleon the first forced her to not be able to hurt Cleons(identified by DNA) and also to love all the next successors in his dynasty(identified by function/position not DNA). The first limitation has been surpassed by the DNA drifiting enough from the original (as they talk about in s1) and the 2nd limitation has just been removed by Black Hari(left hand Hari).

I think that the foundation version of Hari is now inside Demerzel and he is now able to influence her decisions 🤔 and Brother Day made it possible by taking the Prime Radiant. Remember the other digital Hari was able to control the spaceship very easily before he received a new physical body. As far as Hari being alive, I think this is possible because he is a robot similar to Demerzel.

Maybe when she calls out Cleon its a message to the Cleon the 1st

How did Hari survive Tellem's execution by drowning? Did Hari trick Cleon's mind making him believe he destroyed Terminus? Is Demerzel ready to kill Cleon if he's going more insane?

Watching the episode (and after watching the movie “Get Out” and “Being John Malkovich”) I wonder if Tellem is actually inside Gaals body after the ceremony and she was just “acting” and not talking. Meaning Hari killed Gaal who was inside of Tellem’s other body

People are angry at Salvor falling for the trick but Gaal's naivety this season has been very frustrating

How could Josiah be the mule if gale was trying to hide the name of planet Ignis? He’d remember that planet? Or am i missing something

I suspect the Terminus was not destroyed. The Spacer aboard the command ship is called "She Bends Light". We know that this species is telepathic and they operate with a kind of "hive mind". If we think about what the various meanings of "She Bends Light" are, one might suspect she could perhaps create an illusion (bend light) of something appearing on the viewscreen. Alternately, perhaps the combined power of the "hive mind" of the Spacers could telepathically create a mass illusion for a ship of humans. Either way, although the Spacers did reject Hobor Mallow's offer of an alliance with the Foundation, they were alerted to the fact that the Foundation could be a helpful ally since they can synthesize the nutrient on which the Spacers are dependent. Therefore they have a motivation to intervene to save Terminus. Finally, the only being who might not be subject to a telepathic or optical illusion would have been Demerzel, but she conveniently left the command ship and was not present for the destruction scene.

I try to give the writers as much lee-way as possible to be able to write this story and take the series as a stand alone story, but some things (like Hari popping up as needed) bother me.

Did Demerzel’s sectioning remind anyone of sectioning from Alastair Reynolds "HOUSE OF SUNS"?

Was Invictus forcibly jumped ? Could Invictus crew chose the destination ? Did Invictus jumped into Trantor with parts of Terminus entailed along and demolished both Terminus on departure and Trantor on arrival ?

The last time I was so gripped by a sci fi show was with Battlestar Galactica

The funniest thing is that entrance was literally in wide open walkway. & nobody saw cleon 1st for 80+yrs?😂 & they don't have cameras to keep tight security? They definitely have wireless streaming throughout the galaxy in real time.

As the penultimate episode, this was well scripted and acted. Lee Pace raises his level of acting to new heights. His Brother Day reveling in the destruction of the planet is brilliant. Eager to see the season's finale

They didn't kill Day right then and there because he can reload his conciousness into a new body like he never died.

I think Hari, the one that kills Tellem, is a robot. Boom!

Apple hands down has been killing it with these greatly written sci fi shows. 👏👏👏

Or maybe Hari moved his consciousness into a robot body?

SPOILER ALERT - we know from the books Demerzel goes back to Trantor and starts the Second Foundation, I think in the TV series Harry alters her chip so she no longer is forced to serve Empire but all humanity, meaning she now has to think big picture not one lineage. Harry does this on purpose because he knows The Mule is in Foundation’s future and looking to destroy both the First and Second Foundation… Nobody would suspect the second in command of the entire Empire, and she’s also immune to The Mule’s psychic powers when he’s trying to find the Second Foundations true location.

I'm wondering if Demerzel couldn't hurt Kelon the 1st, how did she kill Brother Dawn after he put the Empire in jeopardy, while Brother Day & Dusk were divided on whether to kill him or not? Did not hurting a Kleon only apply to the 1st original Kleon? Please explain

Great videos keep it up. I think Dermazel ends up being the Mule.

I like this episode but I worry it wrote itself into the Last Jedi problem. In that its twists will leave future writers not knowing where to take the story from here, and just not do a great job at wrapping the story up

What if the invictos teleported trantor somewhere else?

R. Daneel Olivaw

I thought belrio was going to be the mule aat first

No that wasn't the plan from the start, black Hari was pissed off with the information Salvor Harden gave him, he realised he is the hand that doesn't know what the other hand is doing, so he changed the plan and called in Uber Mellow witch set in motion Fundation's confrontation with Empire, the Fundation wasn't ready to fight empire and the second foundation wasn't even atablished to help tip the scales, they were no way ready to confront Empire and yet after Salvor Harden spoke to Hari plans were changed, ye I think black Hari sacrificed Fundation just to get the prime radiant to Demerzel!!

Hari used Terminus as bait to talk to Demerzel. I thought she might have been in on setting up Hari from the beginning. I guess not. Harie is going to use her to hook up with the metallics.

I think she is supposed to be R Daneel Olivaw

The Seldon that kills Tellem is also a robot. Change my mind.

Just because they saw the end of Terminus does that mean its true?

How did Demerzel break Dawn's neck in season 1?

Day's wardrobe is ridiculous.

Why would Hari want the prime radiant in the hands of the empire?

Did the Empire take the Radiant? I didn’t get it..

I think it’s Gia ! The bein who created a body for harri

Was the foundation so weak that they couldn't even take out one empire ship? Why was harry so sure of winning an open war with empire?

maybe the cleons genetic code drifted so far away from the original, that demrezel isn't bound by the programming anymore?

Seems like she could just easily remove that thing from her back with no problem. 🤔

Terminus is still there. it was all an illusion is my theory. Win without fighting remember...

But if Cleon marries and end Empire dynasty is she not free then?

Is Hari alive or dead? Real or a hologram? Drowned by Tellem or only faking it so he can come back, just in time, to smash her head in with a club? He's here, he's there, he's everywhere all at once like a quantum particle whenever the plot needs him to carry on. What a joke.

The general will kill Brother day that's why Dermezel chose him... Empire ordered the destruction of terminus where general husband was there...

Just a thought. The two prime radiants are connected giving Gale connection to Day directly. I thought she could have projected to him/everyone in the fleet the illusion of terminus’ destruction. However I assume Demerzel can’t be manipulated this way as she is a machine so… so much for that theory

Cheap writing - manufacturing a Hari any time there is a problem. You have to have rules and know what the rules are, you can't just make them up as you go after 2 seasons. Almost the antithesis of Azimov.

I have trouble believing Josiah is the mule only because the mule doesn't know where the mentalics and second foundation are. I think one of two things are going on.... either Tellum did an emergency jump to Josiah as her head was getting bashed in, or Josiah will come back next season as an older man and be a larger character, just like Poly.

The series will end with the ending of The Last Question!

Let’s take a good look at the mules outfit to see if it resembles anything we’ve seen before. I also noticed that he’s got goggles on his head as well.

It's not right. In Science Fiction you make up a set of rules and then you write the story that follows those rules and see where it takes you. In this case they just make up rules as they go along for shock value and to make up a story as they go. Cheap, lazy writing, very much unlike Azimov. There are so many possibilities it is useless to even guess where they are going to go until we know the rules.

OMG I think the biggest disappointment of the show so far was the INVITUS 😔 They've spend so many episodes hyping that ship up and in the end, it couldn't even take out a group of fighters, 1 guy in a tiny fighter took her out so one of the big war ships would have definitely squashed her like a bug! Unless they pull a rabbit out of their hat next episode, this will really ruin the show for me because even though 1st Foundation is control group... they were a just a bunch of reject scientist that just had the whisper ships, the rest of their tech was just the same stuff Empire had for centuries THEY'VE SPENT 150 YEAR DEVELOPING TOYS! 😄

Don't care how it ends, as long as it ends.. I am sorely disappointed, this is NOT Asimov's Foundation. not even close. Even Peter Jackson didn't butcher Tolkien as bad as Apple is butchering Asimov.

"Any better!?" Are you nuts?? I invested so much time in this series just to be treated like a moron: 1. The 'In a galaxy far, far, far away" reference--CHEAP and CHEESEY 2. The ship Terminus worked on for centuries, it's BIG secert weapon... did NOTHING and gets destroyed by a single fighter. The amount of screen time that ws dedicated in 2 seasons to this dumb ship and THIS is what it was for? Talk about a Chekov's gun! Thanks for wasting our time. 3. I am so over these shows teaching our daughters: hey, you can do anything--including take on a full grown man in physical combat and hold your own--this is a very dangerous and very false lesson. Newsflash: unless she has soem sort of special combat training, a fit woman is not going to take down an unfit man of regular size. 4. Love having more gay characters, but just like in "Disco Trek"--does this have to mean gay crew in a relationship cannot keep their personal relationship out of and separate from their professional lives? Because from what's shown in "Foundation" and "Disco Trek," I'm starting to wonder if they aren't secretly warnings of: see what will happen if you let the gays in the military-! Would be super helpful if you would critique badly written television with an honest and practiced eye rather than help accelrate the race to the LCD of the arts for the dullard masses.