Hi I have enjoyed cycling over the last 35 years or so until I gave up about 4 years ago following a serious back injury. Two rounds of major surgery later I started convalescence but had become unable to manage my road bike at all, I purchased a Scott e bike which I suddenly found I could ride and enjoy but must admit I avoided other riders when climbing as I felt as though I was being a fraud , rather odd really as we were not competing against one another I just felt uncomfortable doing it . The biggest benefit with the e bike was it helped me back to better health and I have now sold the Scott and resumed enjoying my road bikes . I believe that without the e bike I may have lost cycling for ever. I definitely feel there are benefits to be had in my case it allowed me to continue my hobby whilst actively recovering.

Strava will have to add a new checkbox next to every ride, "Motorized/Doped"

Can you try EPO next and tell us how it works?

I've watched about 15 GCN videos this morning (I really should be doing some work...) but I just wanted to say thank you for being such a reasonable and level-headed bunch of presenters/producers. Often bike shows seem to be full of elitism, and give out "advice" which is only really relevant to professionals with big teams + financing to back them up. You guys are so different; you perform sensible tests & analysis, and then describe what these mean to a whole range of cyclists, from pros to commuters to teenagers. You are doing a great job of making the community more inclusive, and encouraging more people to get out of their car and onto a bike! Keep it up!

Why didn't Dan just ride up the hill twice? Once with the motor on and once with it off to see a real comparison.

I have a back injury that is not going to get better. I gave up cycling as it was just too painful. A few years ago I tried a Kalkhoff Agatu. Very upright comfortable riding position. I bought one the same day! It has enabled me to get out on a bike again. Not everyone who cycles wants to race or even go fast. I like touring with my loaded up panniers. Been to the Netherlands and all around France on it. Best thing I ever bought. Ebikes have a place but not in a race.

I’m a chef and I work in a kitchen all day for years. It wrecks your knees way before your time. I bought an e-bike last fall and have been getting fit again. My knees are even getting better as I’ve been riding a regular bike as well. I am now in the market to get a gravel bike. Thanks GCN!

That is actually interesting.. I had a huge crash last year and broke my back.. I lost a lot of strength in my right quad so that would allow me to keep up on easy rollers...obviously weekend rides.. no racing

"teen age son or daughter the can't keep up" give them a few weeks and they'll get much fitter than you ahahah

i love that these guys pointed out the pluses of this (like my wife - new to road racing- using it to keep up) rather than just poo-pooing the idea like many cyclists do. great stuff

Was Dan juiced as a pro though? Should do a juiced versus motor video haha

Using motors in racing is obviously a very, very bad idea. But I see a lot of people here hate e-bikes in general. I own an e-bike and a "normal" road bike that I use to get around, and I hear this all the time, that it is cheating and so on. The one thing most of these people criticizing e-bikes have in common is that they own a car. HOW IS THAT NOT CHEATING!? I even see some of these people with their bikes on roof racks on their cars! Relax guys, it is just a means of transportation, just like a car or a bus or whatever. And probably the most environmentally friendly at 18 times more energy efficient than an SUV. Using e-bikes is nothing to be ashamed of. I think it is something to be proud of if it means one less petrol powered car on the road. But like I said... not in racing ;)

I used to be a great cyclist till I had a heart attack. As it turns out, exercise alone is not enough to keep the arteries clear. Thankfully it was a minor one. I didn't even realize I had one, and it was only a few weeks later when I became unable to climb hills on my bike that I knew there was a problem. I didn't want to give up cycling though, so I turned my bike into a Ebike. It has actually helped me in my recovery. I can pedal for as much as I can, then let the motor take over while I let my heart calm down.

Not surprised Dan was slower. He was able to talk. No KOM worth having is done being able to talk.

Electric assist is AMAZING for commuting. Totally replaced my car for day to day use. However if you're using it... no need to get a hidden motor.

Watching the 2011 Tour of Britain pass by my school in Wells and then up Old Bristol Road was what really got me into cycling!

I've told my club mates when I turn 50 I'm getting one. I think deserve it after years of suffering lol.

The beauty of cycling is the combination of "simple machine" and "human power". Having a motor ruins everything : (

Much respect for your thoughtful response regarding the use of these "riding aids." The more people enjoying the sport at any level, the better.

A proper e-bike would give much better performance and value for money. So if an e-bike is what you want or need. Then get the real deal and not this shady shenanigans. The only reason to hide it, is to pretend you're doing it yourself.

I have a race cube but I get allot of pain in my leg on long rides I have a cube with a motor with varying assist levels it stops working at 15.5 mph as per the law but with my knee injury I can do long distances and touring no problem with a range of 150 miles assisted it's a game changer for me, but get this it also allows me to stay on my fat burning zone so helps me loose weight ;)

am I the only one to came to the coments looking for anything laughable about dem stretchs @ 3:08? lol

The only useful bit of info I got out of this video, is that a bib short and leg warmers combination is the way to go. Thanks Si.

3:08 why you grinning Si?

That's all good, but will it help Matt to clip in??

The only reason Dan didn't beat his KOM was because of his beard. I expect a GCN science episode to prove or disprove my theory.

We are 8 years on, and still not a single case of motor doping in the pro peloton. In fact there has never been a case of a bike being ridden in a race and found with a motor. Femke Van den Driessche was not caught actively racing on a motor assisted bike, it was parked up in the pits, never actually used.

In my case being a teenage son I strive to be faster than my dad, and that's what motivates me to train harder and more frequently. Furthermore beating him up a climb or to a town sign is so much more satisfying than being powered by a hidden motor that you both know is there.

This seems like a great idea. Perhaps it could be combined with EPO and blood doping to go super fast. It looks like a winner. I’ll be getting one for my next road race.

It makes no sense on a road bike, but for commuting around town, an electric bike works extremely well, especially since you can usually keep a higher average speed for less effort, and benefit from still being a bicycle and cutting the traffic. In these cases, the motor doesn't need to be hidden...

Other racers on the peloton are sure getting pissed at me as I lay my bike down and go around to every single person's bike accusing them of having hidden motors in the seat stay!

Matt's struggling to clip into non moving peddles. This just opened a new world of hurt for him

Good luck clipping-in, Matt. :)

I wanted to see Si try to clip back in.

I love telling people I ride my Electric bicycle every day and getting their reactions. Most people say, that's cheating! or you should get a real bike and pedal! But then when i tell them it's my only form of transportation and ask them if it's okay if they put gas in their car. They usually change their thoughts and opinions after that. (ô¿ô)

Makes me laugh when friends say it's cheating as if riding a bike is always some kind of competition! I also had a back injury (that's not why I built my ebike) and it has helped me recover. I go out on my bike (mainly off road) to enjoy the countryside. Any exercise I do is just an added benefit. Cycling for two or three hours (even if it's assisted) is pretty good exercise. I've done over 5000km on my ebike over the last three years!

I have no problem with motors being used to keep up with someone. A wife can ride with her husband or reverse. But why does it have to be hidden? Companies that make these motors are only contributing to mechanical doping.

I can see these being great for commuters, getting to the office/work without becoming a sweaty mess would be a bonus to many people no doudt. I don't think I'd ride one myself though, maybe once the old knees are shot to bits haha.

Ha! Was half way in before I realised it was 8 years old. Would be interesting to see the best "hidden motor" bike now.

Dan has a KOM? Really! Wow, way to go. We are all very proud of you.

I think it will depend if the bike if it's for a commute. I'd love to have a motor on my commuting bike going up Stanedge (Pennines) everyday so I don't have to turn up to uni in a ball of sweat haha.

My thoughts on hidden motors in pro cycling are if they have been used (or being planned to be used) it would be at such a climb as the Alp d'Huez where the atmosphere in the crowd is high energy and loud to cover any close scrutiny of the bikes on passing and, obviously, mask the noise. The wattage isn't going to assist greatly with an attack but it would work well for preserving a riders energy to attack after the climb while their fellow riders are a bit out of puff. Might I add that I really hope this never has happened and never will.

As an older guy who still rides my road bike specialized Roubaix I decided to get an e-bike mtb to go riding with my 33 year old son. Even with a big battery (trek fuel EXe ) it doesn’t give that much for that long. But I guess pros can use anything they can get

I'm 22 and I'd love a motor on my bike, especially because I often cycle to swimming or the gym or whatever. Yes, it's great to get exercise but sometimes I'm just so dead and an assistive motor would keep me out of the car- might even get a little trailer and end up buying big-shop groceries or something without the worry of weight on the way home. If I ever have the money I will definitely buy a bike with a motor- you can choose to use it or not, when you want to push yourself you can. Hopefully it'll get more bikes on the road and more cars off.

Professional riders are sneaking them. The risk factor is so extreme if caught, that you can be assured, it works. Not rocket science.

I guess this would be useful if you bonk on a ride and you're miles from home.

4.14 and 7.35 the photo skinsuit shot of the year for sales.

What team was Dan riding for when he set that Bristol Road KOM?

Just want to comment on Dan's point. Electric bike is the greatest invention in biking from the wheel,(not kidding but smiling in the same time), well maybe after gears. As Dan said your spouse or mate, may benefit from electric bike, not necessarily hidden. Example: as I train my mate would not keep up, but now I struggle to keep up with her, now she on the electro bike she can do 300W and go faster in hills. Of course the speed is limited to 25km/h so on flats I am faster, but there are no flats there. + Big PLUS is fir people that have some health issues, say joint problems, the may enjoy this, keeping up with healthy mates AND getting fitter healthier and maybe may heal and recover from those problems. Cycle long and prosper.

Simon really makes this gcn channel, great commentary and great sense of humour.

Did Lance use a motorized bike during the Tour de France? He would break way on the up hills like a mad man.

2:59 the bloke on the right is letting his Johnson steer.

the sole purpose to make this bike was to deceive . 1, its not pedal-ec, its a full on motor that turns without pedaling 2, pedal-ec is actually a pedal assist that has a large visible battery and bosch motor designed to assist and will not go if pedal power is not given. 3. pedal -ec biking is for people who like uphilling , as well as down. climbing stairs . also for people with injured knees or arthritis. what this bike is an example of a moped...full power without any effort from rider.

This is a life saver when you need one the most!

I'm a fairly active rider that could not keep up with the fast group rides in this area. On Strava my best mountain bike climbs will rank around the 50% range. I added a mid drive to my old mountain bike with a 500 watt motor that is limited to 20 mph. The hill on the south side of town that I would normally ride up in low gear on my mountain bike I raced up with my e-bike. I beat the KOM on Strava by over one minute. The real KOM was just over 15 minutes. I deleted my time so it does not show up.

My question, since I had up to recently been quite skeptical about their use in the peloton: how long will the motor give you 100w, and how heavy is the battery? I always thought that on a long race the added weight would, well, outweigh the temporary benefit of the motor.

For a minute I was thinking this would be the best thing ever for touring. But if the motor runs at a given speed instead of adding to your pedal power.... Nope. Useless! :D

Friend got an e-assist bike to help him get to work and back in reasonable time. He installed a power meter so that he can still ensure that HE is getting a good workout to record. Basically what they're saying. Cycling doesn't get any easier with the power, just factor. His wife and daughter are glad he did this.

Think we will see more and more mechanical doping as the technology becomes more and more advanced. It ups the averages, change the bike for a short spell in a competition and a gain will be made.....if only in terms of less exertion and fatigue. There are some Italian made machines out there today that are very powerful and where all is totally hidden.....and there is every reason to believe that this type of technology has been used in the major races that we all enjoy so much. Forget doping the rider....this is the new way to win (sadly). Thanks guys for posting this!!

For me, the most interesting thing about this video is that the motorized bike is branded "race". Doesn't that give rather the wrong impression? It's one thing to say that the manufacturer isn't responsible for how people use their product but explicitly naming your product after a forbidden use of that product is rather taking the piss, don't you think?

If that one is sold in the UK then i;m 100% sure it's illegal. As far as i'm aware you're only allowed to us a PDEAL ASSIST motor in the UK, if it's just a switch it on or throttle controlled motor then it's effectively a motor vehicle.

Ah, happy memories watching all the pros charge up that hill in the Tour of Britain. Thanks for the reminder guys.

I got an E bike kit because they completely outlawed combustion-driven pushbikes where I live. They both went about the same top speed (25km/h) but I dont have to put up with the smell of petrol and oil leaks

Am I the only one who hates the term "mechanical doping"? What's wrong with "cheating"?

I think bikes with motors are great . I'm 72 [270 lbs] and cycle my mountain bike to keep fit. When I'm out on my bike a lot of other cyclists overtake me, but they are cheating because they have a hidden motor on theirs [I presume]

I had to get one as I have had racing bikes from my first Dawes to my last Holesworth to a Carrera Vulcan 250 watt and just turned 70!

I can see the benefit for those with light knee problems using an motor "assist" going uphill or other difficult days but still want to ride. It'll take the edge off those knees. Refusing to lay down but go down peddling in old age. Even if it has a motor. Good on ya.

Anybody knows where can I buy the kit(hidden motor)?

2:49 Fkn ouch mate

Once you see Dan's python though, you cannot unsee it. 😂

74 years young vet Tony Siveter of Retford Wheelers told me he has got to have a pace maker fitter & said "is this mechanical doping" we laughed, this man has ridden in races with Tommy Simpson around Harworth Notts what a clam to fame.

I'm sorry but I don't think this was a good video. I'd much rather see some form of objective test like keeping the same heart rate, measuring oxygen consumption, etc... and actually figure out if it affects competitive performance.

motor in my bike? NEVER i prefer painful legs

So glad to hear you describe OBR as a nasty climb. It is!

those winter bib tights look fantastic. i just wish they didn't cost so damned much.

Far far from an optimized E-bike, almost like it is designed with the sole purpose to cheat.

Yeah the whole thing with e-bikes and motorized cycles just doesn't make any sense to me. Yeah sure they are cool looking and yeah you can go faster and and stuff. But like if the goal is to go fast and look cool why not go all the way and buy a motorcycle that can easily beat a bike hands down. At some point you will see a failure in logic, some seemingly counter productive, and contradictory reasoning that the more you think about it the more you will realize that the purpose and value of a bicycle doesn't necessarily lay in it's ability to go fast and look cool. I had a bicycle in grade school and high school. I gave up riding it when I grew out of it. I just now purchased a new bicycle recently and the reasons I purchased it wasn't so that I could get to one place or another at light speed or so that i could look cool at all. The reason I purchased it was a list of things including. Losing weight, saving gas money, reducing harm on my environment, exploration, getting more out door time to help me with depression, allowing me to easily visit my family without sitting in traffic for an extra 20 minutes every day, and one of the big ones was so that i can still feel like I'm accomplishing something my self without relying on motors and batteries. If I were somehow alone in this line of thinking I would believe that bicycles would have been lost to history and replaced entirely with scouters and motorbikes. But just like I think many know, bicycles haven't gone away completely and are making a comeback in many areas. I for one live in Minnesota and go to school in Minneapolis. The city has invested so much money in new bicycle paths and services for bicycle commuters that it is extraordinary. The only things I can think of for e-bikes is that they are just another ridiculous way for people to cheat themselves and others. it's basically like replacing the tip of a real feather ink quill with a ballpoint ink tip from a modern day pen, It's just super ridiculous and it kinda defeats the purpose of having something like that. it's like going to a concert and standing outside the stadium to watch it all on a small monitor in front of the doors. it's taking something that has value and merit on it's own and modifying it in such a way that It no longer makes you feel good about yourself. It's essentially you ignoring everything except the end result. In a world with so many technologies and possibilities, you would think that we would use them to better benefit ourselves and our happiness instead of using them to render what we love meaningless.

This is on the Mendips near where I used to live! The motor would make the climb up "deer leap" into Priddy a lot easier :)

E bikes are awesome! It allows my mum to ride longer routes without getting tired

If it's working beyond 25kph then it's illegal in the UK. Just how illegal? Well you're riding a motor vehicle, without registration, VED, MOT, license, insurance... So very illegal if you get caught.

How to ensure that none of your competition cheats with an "electric advantage" in the next race you do: Do a self-supported bikepacking race. Gonna be hard to use that thing for very long, much less recharge it when you're doing 100+ miles per day in the backcountry wilderness, miles away from any electrical power sources. At that point it's nothing more than useless dead weight. Fail.

I recently got a job that is a 40 mile commute each day,and pretty hilly too. I alternate 1 day on my road bike,the next day on my e- bike. I am actually faster on my road bike by an average of 12 mins each way. But I don't sweat so much on the e-bike. The biggest difference I love the e-bike for,is when I ride into a head wind. As any cyclist can tell you that can be soul destroying,and even a strong rider won't enjoy it. The e- bike battery gets zapped,but I don't.

So glad GCN are back smashing out great videos again, chapeau

All cyclists are untrustworthy.

They now have to x-ray bikes prior to every stage start to find the motors because some riders were using them in that not too distant past and possibly currently to this day.

@Global Cycling Network I don’t know guys. You’re racing fit. You can tackle those hills without the motor. All that 200W motor does is add some extra insurance against fatigue on those long inclines.

The electric motor assists are ok, but you haven't lived until you've tried the diesel powered models.

I am addicted to your channel someone help off lol...maybe it's the calming British accents...ever since I did a 200+ k from Toronto to Niagara I am now an avid biker averaging 30 to 40K a day 5 days in the city and I can't get tired....weird. I would love to ride around the those cool British country roads.

nice. Hiding the motor seems like a good idea for when it comes to locking up. Less of a thief magnet.

You guys look cold! I did not know there were that many hills there! beautiful.

Today I tried to maximize my speed on a flat road. I wish I had a larger gear ratio, not a motor! This is one thing, cycling is about.

One year Contador changed bikes a couple of times during a stage of Le Tour. I was convinced he was making use of a bike like this one. They tried to hide that he was changing bikes and weren't pleased to have been spotted doing it by the TV coverage.

I own a low end eBike and a nice road bike. I like riding the road bike because it is 20 lbs lighter and much nimbler. I ride the eBike when i need to carry groceries or when I need to go distances or conditions that exceeds the limits of my body such as distance, heat or elevation gain.

I wonder how many people went to the Old Bristol Road to try and beat Dan's KOM!

The beauty of cycling is its simplicity and the fact that you are powering it. Fitting a motor is just wrong. But if you need the assistance to be able to ride then ok.

Loved the ghost in the machine podcast! Thanks !

This was a fairly neutral review of hidden motor bicycles, well done guys. Keep up the professionalism++, GCN!

Anyone who has bonked in winter, with headwind and been far from home would seriously have considered getting one, a little bit anyways

It is feasible to make the back wheel into a stepper(brushless) motor and it has been done. This wouldn't add the same wattage but it wouldn't make any noise either

I was watching this and thought the road looked familiar. Revealed at 4.23 as the Old Bristol Road, a short bike ride from where I live. Quite a serious hill and even the newer road further east is not something to be trifled with. Some of the hills in the Mendips are absolutely insane, like Draycott Steep.