THANKS! For my own layout (this is a club layout) which will be a NYC subway layout, I will have the third rail with the chairs ("mushrooms") but without the wooden covers as that would be custom. The third rail is available and is well used by the British modellers who are brilliant modellers and they even have arcing! I'll find a video of them in action and post it as a reply to you.

All still photos of a nice OO Scale London Underground layout with the third rail on the outside of the running rails (like American third rail power) with the white chairs. In the London Underground, there are four rails: two running rails, a power rail in the middle of the running rails and a the powered third rail on the outside of the running rails. Both powered rails are uncovered. kzfaq.info/get/bejne/ntqXnZuZl7C8o2w.html

The outside third rail with the white chairs, and notice the arcing! kzfaq.info/get/bejne/e51_hN2YrLu0Y2g.html

Nice but asking for to much

HAHA, that's a great and very funny point, but I was there by myself. An idea I thought about on Sunday was to bring the four Walthers R-17's that are already upgraded (four more to go) to the club when I have the place to myself, and run two trains per mainline (ignoring all of the signals of course) as that would be fun.

robo931 Thanks! Yes, we love our club layout!

housetrancformer Thanks, but please explain "just ordered the R-17" meaning new from a hobby shop, preordered, online (eBay) or used? I'll explain why after I hopefully hear from you. Thanks again.

Mark 'BhigDaddyMark' Ferguson I ordered them from a train store. And authorized dealer, not eBay.

Mark 'BhigDaddyMark' Ferguson I apologize, I meant to say that I ordered the MTH R17 HO scale MTH silver and blue. I just started collecting subway trains, and I am learning the difference. But I definitely know eBay, and I would never overpay for a train. Unless of course it is the Lionell subway sets. I managed to get the r27 two car add-ons but I want the full sets

housetrancformer Thanks for the response. I asked because I wouldn't think that you'd you'd be able to find the MTH HO R-17 set new as that was their first release in HO about or almost a year ago now. I bought both sets (silver/blue #5 and maroon #6) and I have them both in another video. The next sets to be released are the R-22 in a MOW (work train), #4 train, and I think the #2 train and one other line I believe. I also asked because if you're still able to get that set new, then perhaps they're also still carrying the add-on set for the maroon #6 which I failed to buy initially (but bought the add-on set for the silver/blue #5) and haven't been able to find used even on eBay. The next sets to be released (R-22) will not hit the hobby stores until either July or August according to MTH. As far as the Lionel subway sets are concerned, I still want the R-27 and the R-16 but I refuse to pay what those thieves on eBay are asking eff them, I don't want those sets THAT badly besides I have the R-30 with the add-on set and I LOVE it. The other Lionel set that I foolishly didn't buy upon its release was the LIRR M7 set and again, even though I rarely if at all see it for sale on eBay, I'm not paying what people are asking for it. I did back in 2015 buy the Metro-North M7 set and two of the add-on sets. It's too bad that Lionel stopped making the subway sets since MTH isn't allowed to produce any train newer than the R-142A since they lost the licensing from the MTA/NYCTA.

Mark 'BhigDaddyMark' Ferguson I just checked the website and they don't have the two car add on for the maroon set. I think I got lucky with the blue and silver . I am trying to find out online how long/ length of the 4 car oh scale or 17th that is. Would you happen to know?

no. the paint colors were a real thing - then graffitti covered it

Hi Jim! Thanks, hope all is well with you!

Yeah cool...I hope you are too...

NH Shire Thanks! Are you asking about the directional lighting issue? I don’t believe they have with the current release of R-17 and R-22 sets. I seriously doubt it.

MICHAEL GLASS Thank you Sir!

joe smoe The power comes from the track and is picked up via the metal wheels in the trucks.

the power car is very similar to a regular "diesel-style" ... there is an internal motor thats powered by the rails ... the SOUNDS are battery operated

TheCondoInRedondo I too am not a fan of that whine emanating from the MTH model albeit a nice model. What drives me nuts about the MTH model is the lack of proper directional lighting as I had done on my Walthers sets as they could’ve added an additional decoder to get working tail/headlights on the rearmost car as that cost me an additional $30 for realism on my Walthers sets, and it was well worth it.

After watching this video, I sought out other examples of the MTH R-17 sounds and what struck me was the similarity of the sound to MTH's "Little Joe" locomotive. I'm wondering out loud if MTH simply took stock sounds they used for their H0 Little Joe electric and put it into the decoder they use inside the R-17. By the way. I checked out some of your other videos and I'm impressed by your talent as a musician. I salute you, sir.

TheCondoInRedondo THANKS!! That’s nice of you!

Those Walthers NYCTA subway sets are still available (used) on eBay as they ceased production on them I think in 2011. My sets have been upgraded with LED lighting (now 4 out of 8 sets) with an additional decoder. Until just a month or so ago when MTH released their HO NYCTA subway sets, the only production subway set was from Walthers. Hopefully, they'll introduce all of their O scale subway sets in HO scale as they do a far better job.

No kidding! I KNOW that only the powered car on the MTH set has directional lighting on the powered car only and that's useless and idiotic, so what are you talking about?? I have a video specifically on that topic. My MTH HO #6 train was just completed and now has directional lighting for both ends. That's something that MTH refuses to do and it's so easy as basically, it requires an additional decoder. Shame on the arrogance of MTH. Here's the video that I did on this already... kzfaq.info/get/bejne/aa9zo5qS08iam4U.html

@@bhigdaddymark Thanx for the link, I really like watching your vids as I am getting back into the hobby and decided to do a NYC subway layout. I made the plunge and purchased both the #5 express and #6 local after watching your video with the green #6. 👍

Air whistle? From what period? The R-17 first went into service in 1955, is that the period you're talking about and would that be the same type of air whistle used by the R-1 through 9? Interesting...

Oh, and by any chance, do you have any videos? Hopefully you're not stuck like me having to run urban trains on traditional country/suburbia layouts lol.

@@bhigdaddymark If you go to the Shoreline Trolley museum website. There's several excellent videos of Subway car 6688. You can hear the proper horn/whistle. My layout is a hybrid design of the various trolley museums. I've been able to visit over the years.

@@bhigdaddymark My layout has an assortment of buildings a picnic area. If I had the room I'd like to be able to add a city as I also have several different types of streetcars including a PCC car

@@richardbrady3949 Nice! Would love to see it.

Bobby Slater The MTH set (maroon set) can be had in DC without sound I think, and the Walthers subway sets are no longer available new, you can find them used on eBay.

Thanks for the info.

Bobby Slater Not a problem.

James, I'm not quite understanding your point here, but you're grossly mistaken about the MTH model in this video which IS an IRT model and NOT an IND model, so please explain how you arrived at that notion and questioning if I'm "really into the subway" (what????). BOTH sets are R-17 models and the R-17 was an IRT train in the NYCTA system. What makes you think that the MTH model in this video is an IND model has me (and everyone else "really into the subway") both scratching our heads AND laughing too as apparently, it's YOU who knows nothing about the NYCTA subway system based on your own words. The MTH set is their very first NYC subway model set in H.O. as they've been offering NYCTA and CTA (Chicago Transit Authority) subway models in O-scale for many years now, but this set is their first in H.O.- scale. Just LOOK at the two models (carefully) and please distinguish HOW one is an IND model and the other an IRT model and let us all know how that might be. For right now, MTH ONLY offers an IRT NYCTA subway set in H.O. Go to eBay click on Categories >> Toys and Hobbies >> Railroads & Trains >> HO Scale >> in search bar type in Walthers Subway >> click on 'Search' in blue box I JUST did that, and SEVERAL Walthers NYCTA Subway 4 car sets and single car (powered/unpowered) items are listed for sale so they're NOT "impossible to get even second hand" as you've improperly noted. Of the 8 sets of the Walthers NYCTA subway sets that I own, at least two of those sets I found and bought on eBay, so that's the place to look (for everything).

You seem to misunderstand my comment about really being into the subway. I did not say you weren't really into the subway. I meant that if you were really into the subway you would want the details to be correct and I believe that the round windows were a feature on the A/C IND and not the IRT. I should have been more specific. The R-17 was an IRT train. No doubt about that. However the MTH trains seem to have details, like the circular window and the blue decoration I have seen on the A/C line. I think those circular windows were found on R-11 trains built by Budd and was a feature of IND and BMT trains. It may be possible that just by chance I never encountered a subway car with a circular window on IRT lines and saw a lot of them on IND lines but again as far as I remember those circular windows were a feature of R-11 cars. I would love to see some photos of IRT cars with circular windows. Maybe the 7 train had them I never rode that line. Anyway what I don't understand is the personal attack. Even if I am wrong, I did not try to belittle anyone and attempt to make myself look superior to others by belittling and degrinating another person. I just wrote about what I thought I knew. Even if I am a complete idiot why did you feel the need to insult me? It is not like I attacked the layout, which is a fantastic layout, or anything like that. All I did was mention, although not as completely as I should have pointed out the MTH has the circular windows which as far as I remember are R-11 IND A/C line car features. I apologize if I caused you to bleed from scratching your head. As to the proto subways cars on E-Bay, even when Trainworld had the still in stock for 198 dollars, sellers on E-Bay were asking 3 to4 hundred dollars, and even now that the MTH trains are still available for 219 dollars E-Bay sellers are asking 300 plus dollars. So I should have said, unless you were willing to vastly overpay for them, the Walthers cars were basically unavailable and at times, were in fact completely unavailable at any price because for the nine months I was considering buying a set, all the while kicking myself for not buying a set from Trainworld before they ran out of stock, I spent a few hours every weekend looking for a reasonable priced set. Okay?

James Mayhew James, no offence intended nor was I attacking you, so I owe you an apology as I certainly wasn't trying to insult you 'cause you certainly didn't attempt to insult me so again, my apologies. I didn't check to see if you had a channel or not, and read some of the responses you get on your channel. Perhaps after 10 years of having my channel and thousands (I imagine) of comments of which perhaps 90% are positive, there are those that are (and I'm not accusing you of this at all) what I call 'Arm chair critics' 'Trolls' who ask idiotic questions never giving thought to what they're asking first, misinformed arrogant assholes who come off as authorities, those who are critical (non constructively) merely to be mean spirited assholes, those who clearly make statements not knowing what the hell they're talking about and the like on KZfaq. More often than not anymore, I haven't the patience to deal with that crap, so I'm a little too quick to lose my cool so to speak and respond in kind and in rare cases, unfairly as in your case. Again my apologies. As far as that door window is concerned, I remember those round windows, but I also remember the other 'standard' windows more. I have two books issued by the NYCTA that shows the history of the revenue train list (R-1 thru the most recent at the time of publication like the R-160 etc.) that I'll have to dig up and take a look to be able to identify which IRT trains actually had that round window in the end doors. Let's agree that thankfully those days are behind us now that the system finally got A/C. Sadly on eBay, there are lots of thieves who way overprice the items that they're selling. It's a game that I refuse to play. I've never felt that I paid too much for anything that I've bought on eBay and in fact, I've gotten some incredible deals on many of the trains that I've bought. It really requires a great deal of patience and just waiting until you see the deal that you want. I've convinced sellers to end their auction for a flat price upfront. That's how I got 7 out of the 8 Walthers R-17's that I have (the 8th I bought from a fellow club member), so eBay is a game. As an example, I desperately want the Lionel LIRR M7 set (O-scale) that I stupidly didn't buy when it was first released. I refuse to buy a set from the thieves on eBay until I see a set reasonably priced, so it's a waiting game as someone will be desperate to sell their set, and will do so at a price that will garner interest. The last set that I saw, the guy was asking $1,200 (f*ck him), so I'm still searching. Once you find the Walthers set of your liking, you may want to upgrade the lighting on it. My fourth set out of eight was just completed and they look so much better than stock which was laughable in my view. Jump on the MTH HO R-17's quickly before they're out of production, otherwise you'll then have to deal with those thieves on eBay. The DCC model is a reasonable price and the DC version is even less expensive ESPECIALLY if you go to Train World in Brooklyn where you'll get a discount. The video is of what I've done with 4 (3 shown) of my 8 Walthers sets in LED lighting upgrades. Good luck in your search. kzfaq.info/get/bejne/mduUltqovZyveaM.html

Thanks. This is the type of conversation on KZfaq I enjoy. Plus I was partially at fault because when I re-read my post I realized I was not very clear on what I meant. I will subscribe to your channel since I really did enjoy the video and really like the layout. I have learned one thing about sending e-mails or making comments--never use sarcasm or satire even with friends because it is always misunderstood. Anyway talking about E-Bay prices- was looking for an Intermountian Milk car-which have been out of production for awhile to add to the two I already for the 1950's Milk industry I am planning and there was only one being offered. It was going for 70 dollars no shipping. I sent them a message I would pay 35 and they said no and changed there listing to 70 plus shipping. A month later I got a NIB one for 32 dollars the fair price for this item. Plus last I checked no one bought his 70 dollars ones. I look forward to your next video.

James Mayhew James, As my son and his fellow millennials say, "No worries" really. I'm an old school New Yorker and LOVE sarcasm and seriously understand it. My son is pretty sarcastic with me, but I'm twice as sarcastic with him for good measure and we have quite a lot of fun with the back and forth sarcasm. If for nothing else, that's what I really loved best about Trump because he had me howling with laughter over his sarcasm during the debates with Hillary and his Republican rivals ("Little Marco Rubio" LOL) as I totally understood him as a fellow New Yorker, so sarcasm doesn't bother me at all and I'm a HUGE fan of the Onion, so I equally love satire. Well you proved my point about eBay regarding that misinformed thief trying to get twice the value or worth for a simple car. You waited it out and found a better deal. I always say that there's a better deal around the corner, you just have to wait for it. The friend that I bought 5 of my 8 Walthers subway sets from recently told me that he found in his house I think 2 or 3 more sets that he was unaware of. I can always ask him if he still has them and what he's asking for them if he hasn't already sold them on eBay if you're interested. As far as freight trains are concerned, you can find great deals on the model railroading auction site Trainz.com I might get to the club Monday late afternoon/early evening, I just have to decide what to take that will not aggravate the crap out of me with broken cheap plastic couplers and derailments as most of if not ALL of my sets are in need of Kadee couplers. One set that I might be able to get away with and keep a cool head is my Metra set which I haven't run in at least 2 or 3 years, so I'll probably film that. Thanks for your subscription and as you'll see, I have a lot of model railroading videos filmed at the club, home and in both H.O. & O scales in addition to the principal of the channel, organ music. Thanks again, and be well. Mark

You're talking about the trolley museum? I'll check that out as I've yet to go there. Hopefully they didn't CHANGE the horn to the sound you're referring to, but I'll check it out thanks.

Hi Rory, could you please clarify as the blockhead that I am (according to my son Lol), I'm not sure what you're talking about. Are you speaking about the coloured route lights on either side of the route signs and the EOT (End Of Train) marker lights? The Walthers set has directional lighting with working EOT lighting. There isn't any room for installation of lit route colours on the MTH set and the Walthers set also hasn't room to drill space for the LED bulbs to use as route colour lighting. Thanks!

@@bhigdaddymark The upper route ( or as I call them - marker lights -) are exactly what I am referring to. Oh they could install them. It might be a bit of a problem as the bulb/led would not be directly behind the upper lenses, but it can be done. Atlas and Kato did something similar wit this by with using the headlight/ led to illuminate the ditch lights on so equipped n-scale locomotives.

@@rorylovelace7151 I thought that was what you were referring to. The tech that does all of the work (lighting upgrades, decoder installations, custom couplers on my subway sets) on my trains remarked that there wasn't room for LED bulbs to be placed behind the non-existent lens of the route colours. If memory serves me, the 'lens' wouldn't exist as he'd have to drill holes for the LED's to be installed (same for the Walthers sets). It sounded complicated for sure. As tiny as N-scale is (I was into N gauge from age 7-17), I'm surprised to learn that Atlas and Kato neither of which I knew made N gauge, was able to get that lighting done. I'm going to ask my tech again about it. Thanks.

size really does matter !! .... and the cost would put these things through the roof !!

Digital Soldier XP The Walthers sets are only available used and can be found on eBay. The MTH set can be found new from MTH or on eBay new or used. Check hobby stores.

I've been asking the same question....

the O-scale trains have a separate battery operated sound file

I'm NOT surprised as there are many like those thieves on eBay. They have their own idea what the value of things should be versus what they really are. Back in 2012 I bought my Lionel NYCTA R-30 Subway set on eBay for $400. I jumped on that because many others at the time were selling those 4-car Lionel sets for $800 to $1000. The seller told me that some windows had fallen out. When I got the set, a few door windows were out but all of them were in the box and all I did was use plastic cement glue and put them back in and they've stayed in place since I glued them back in, problem easily solved saving me $800 and the doors on a rare occasion would stick, but that was it (the 1st set the R-27 was alleged to have been plagued with door problems). So there are those on eBay who are fair and reasonable, we just have to be patient and out wait the thieves. Happy Holidays to you and your family James!

Yes on E-Bay patience really saves the buyer money. I have been keeping my eye out for a Walthers R-17 set and if a reasonably price set shows up I might buy it and if I don;t use it resell it for a small profit(10-20 dollars, I'm not greedy). Actually I checked my roster and I have about 10 to 15 mostly new cars to sell, like the New Haven and Emerald Green NYC cars that are not in my era - basically the fifties when the change to diesels was almost complete- and may you and yours have a happy holiday and great New Year.

James Mayhew James, I'd be interested in those New Haven cars possibly if I can see them as I plan on buying a Rapido FL9 loco and I'd like to see those NYC cars too as I have a NYC Green loco that I use with NYC Silver Streamline cars. I'll private message you if I in fact can, with my email address and hopefully you'll be able to send photos of cars in question if that's possible. If possible, perhaps you can send those photos to my channel message box (for lack of better word). I'd greatly appreciate it indeed. Thanks.

I have one unbuilt Athearn Blue Box New Haven Dinning car with an orange stripe and I would have to check but I think the othern three Nw Haven cars are RTR bachman models. These never have been used. They are the McGuiness(spelt wrong I am sure) One Bachman Gondola, one Bachman red Boxcar and one Bachman black box car. The Bachmans would go for less than list but the Blue Box dinner car might be expensive because I admit I bought it when I was getting back into the hobby, and I really wanted a New Haven Passenger train because I have some New Haven Locos. I realized later that I either overpaid or the Athearn New Haven Streamliners are hard to get and very expensive. I did not buy anymore New Haven streamliners because I could not find any of I did find one it would be 30 dollars for an unbuilt blue box kit, so I switched to the LIRR because I have a LIRR F7 Loco. Here is a link to one on E-Bay and it goes for 24 dollars. www.ebay.com/itm/ATHEARN-STREAMLINED-COACH-HO-GAUGE-NEW-HAVEN-NIB-/112041709335?hash=item1a1634cf17:g:MpUAAOSwuzRXcu5Y Also you can search for Athearn New Haven passenger cars and find more at E-Bay. I paid something like 27 dollars plus shipping because I was naive and using E-Bay for the first time and if I did sell tthe one I have the price would be based on me just breaking even and making some room in the house. Plus any money made would go into buying some cornerstone building kits like the Vulcan manufacturing Company or some kits for downtown like the oet store, grocery store or book store. Let me check the dining card streamliner with orange stripes to see if all the parts are there . Knowing how much I will have to charge if you are still interested maybe we can work out something. I have to admit I never sold anything on E-Bay before and was not planning to sell the 15 or so items I have until June 2017. Lets just see what happens. Plus I will have to buy some boxes and actually working out listings for the other items. Wow that was a mouthful Robert

James Mayhew Thanks, ignore the last response regarding these cars as I read this response last. We'll figure out a way....

TRAINS are gay?????

@@bhigdaddymark wasn't talking about your dad

@@frankwaldbaums1177 You must be publicly admitting to your closeted proclivity then. I assure you that no one is interested in your ignorance nor your desires sweet boy. I PROMISE you that you wouldn't have the courage to be obnoxious like that to my face, I promise as you and assholes like you are such tough guys hiding behind a keyboard with no spine.

@Bread And Circuses And he ran off with his tail between his legs close to his vagina too never to return.