I love how Tod could have just dunked the sword under water, but no, he dunked himself in at the same time. Does it make the experiment any more valid? Not really, but I can't help but admire the dedication.

It actually makes a lot of sense for knives and swords to be made by multiple people in medieval times. If you are going to outfit an army, then instead of a single person makeing one entire sword maybe every two days, it would be faster for someone to be churning out blades all day while another person churns out handles and another scabbards, all to be assembled by another person elsewhere. It's kinda like an assembly line.

Really appreciate how you don't romanticise old craftsmen but also show respect and understanding for the work they did, they were people just like us and they weren't stupid, they just had their own priorities and needs.

I spend a lot of time working in the bush (not just strolling, doing actual work), and I always have a big knife on my side (blade about 16"). When I watch those videos about how medieval people used to do stuff, a lot of it is still applicable for when you do actual physical labour in difficult contexts. Having your knife tightly bound to your hip is very annoying. It gets caught on everything, and then you get caught. If you let it hang loosely, it will get caught on stuff but will free itself as you move.

My grandfather before getting drafted he was advised by his war veteran father " never let your knife bloody in the scabbard and your revolver get wet in the holster" He found out why the hard way when he tried to remove his revolver from the holster and the gun was just refusing to unstuck He really got lucky, because the opponent just started uncontrollably laughing finding it very amusing and told him just to walk away from them 😏

Naval swords have had a little folding clip on them to retain the blade in the scabbard since the 1700s, even if it ends up upside down. Also means the scabbard can be relatively loose. Wonder if there were any such features in the mediaeval times?

I love these little bits of experimental archaeology - it's always interesting. Never giving us absolute answers, but always adding valuable data points! On this particular point, I can honestly imagine guys arguing about things like this in the pub. One walks in with his new dagger and starts showing off how tightly it fits in his new sheath; and his friend responds by going on about how, "after my da' came back from fighting those bastards over the border, he always said blah blahblah blah blahblahblah...."

You heard it here, boyos. If it is too tight when it gets wet, it becomes a two hand operation.

Its not medieval, but I have an Iranian shamshir circa 1600 with an original scabbard which is extremely tight - even accounting for shrinkage and warp over time, it is fitted VERY well despite the deep curve of the sword. Other swords I have are quite loosely fitted despite being "good" quality scabbards made specifically for that sword - such as one of my Kilic. It varies, quite a lot, even for the recent stuff.

I think the importance of being able to retrieve any blade one-handed is often under-appreciated, if not completely overlooked... whether it's carried for self-defense or as a tool. I have a lot of knives (pocket and fixed blade) and the ones I carry are almost always ones I can pull out and start using with one hand. It's just frustrating having to put something down or stop what you're doing to fumble around with a folding knife that requires both hands or pull a blade from a sheath that's too tight...

I never considered it before, but it makes sense that multiple craftsmen would be making the various components of swords and knives. It was a cottage industry much as was found throughout the world for literal ages. Also, bravo to Tod for sacrificing his personal comfort for research and for our entertainment. Thank you!

For everyone musing on pre-soaking of leather scabbards, the leather is almost always pre-wetted during manufacture, simply because you need the leather to stretch a little as you stitch it so it has a tight fit over the wooden core. The tightening issues arent just about the leather on a scabbard, but rather how the wood core swells when wet and presses on the blade. So soaking a newly made scabbard again after its finished would probably be a bit redundant, since it wont keep the wood from swelling as humidity changes

"For the sake of science ..." Thank you, Sir, for your noble sacrifice and thank you for your excellent educational presentations. You are rapidly becoming one of my favorites.

BTW this is all just hypothesis based on how things usually seem to go: Tod's description of the cutler buying parts and assembling them to sell the whole piece makes a lot of sense for a reason I don't see people mentioning: if you don't have a factory where all this is done in-house, each craftsman needs to make his stuff and sell it for money. He can't hand everything over to a cutler and wait for the cutler to sell pieces and reimburse him for his crossguard or whatever. And no customer wants to buy all the pieces and then mangle things putting them together. So the cutler has to exist, and he has to have either a strong professional relationship with his suppliers or the money to buy all his materials outright. Or some combination. Which means not every one of the individual craftsmen could afford to BE the cutler; just because you can make sheaths doesn't mean you have the trusted connections and capital that the cutler does. And it also means customers can just come to one shop and buy the thing, which means all the component craftsmen can work out of their homes instead of having to maintain anything like a storefront or blanket full of their wares in a market area. That storefront is more expensive to maintain, and cuts into profits. It does mean that the cutler is presumably the more powerful and wealthier of the whole group. If a component craftsman wanted to raise his price, and his cutler didn't accept, he could try to find another cutler. But now he's on the lookout and competing with that cutler's current supplier on price, so he probably doesn't get the increase he's looking for anyway. And also just burned a bridge in a small community. Meanwhile the cutler is a harder-to-achieve position and there are more component craftsmen out there than cutlers, so he has his pick of them. He probably has multiple craftsmen in each category supplying him. So even if informally and in an unspoken way, he has more influence over their price to him than they do. But of course doesn't want to push that relationship too hard, because if they REALLY wanted to they could probably figure out a way to cut him out of the process by promoting one of their own and just working together on credit or as a partnership.

That is exactly one of the scenes i love from Gladiator ... Maximus is able to kill the Praetorian because he couldn't draw his sword due to frost sticking the blade to the scabbard. Genius.

I think that last few seconds shows that it was probably likely that swords and knives went through multiple sheaths/scabbards. You wouldn't want to carry that sword in that sheath, so get another one. Maybe on a knife it gets wet and tight and even your draw it, the leather is cut. Now you get a new one...

So, idea, what if medieval scabbards were made loose like that on purpose for WHEN they get wet so that they would fit properly when they do? What if you were expected to grab a sheath that kinda fit pretty good and were expected to water treat it so that it would then tighten up slightly and mold itself around the blade some? What if they pre water treated the scabbards before selling them so that it wouldn't get too tight?

Very interesting. Given that you prove the change and binding is so immediate and obvious, it would have to follow that ALL of the campaigning men would be well aware of the issue. They probably thought close fitting scabbards were a stupid idea that would last just as long as it didn't rain.

I really respect your empirical approach to history! Make no assumptions, do things that historical peoples did, learn from it. Wonderful stuff, thank you.

I think it bares mentioning that the maker and the user often live in vastly different climates in this global era, not to mention seasonal variation in humidity. I live in a hot dry climate, my buyer may live in the tropics or a cold snowy climate. I may make a scabbard in an Australia summer and two weeks later it's in a new York winter. Definitely want some Lee way in the fit.

0:00 I can tell that this video is going to create an interesting discussion. 😄

Great content as always Tod, I use a bit of Bees Wax on the first inch of the inside of my own personal bush crafting Knife sheaths so it holds the blade a bit but is still an easy draw when i need to use them, adds a little waterproofing too I guess

Brilliant video. I think we often forgot what using and wearing a sword or dagger day in and day out really means. For allot of us collectors in the modern world our pieces probably spend 99% of the time leaning against a wall or on a display stand.

Awesome stuff Tod! Well thought out and fun to watch.

Tod: sir, A looser fitting scabbard is the way to go. But a proper footbridge wight work too. Enjoyed the video thanks. I learn much from all your videos. Keep them coming. Thanks!

Always fascinating to see your experiments and hear your views on these topics! Thanks for sharing with us!

Great work Tod, thank you for the great craftsmanship and dialogue to us laymen. 👏

I got taught leather working by a saddler, or well two because it was a couple that taught me, and one was focused on making saddles while the other on making the tac-wear (like bridles ect.). It was super interesting how while they officially have the same "work" they do really different things, and also taught differently. They did point out that while they would prefer to work with a local blacksmith for the metal fittings, it wasn't really profitable in current day and age for them.

I will throw some counterarguments to the idea of loose scabbards, especially in case of daggers. So I do HEMA longsword sparring, almost always with a dagger. I've had a couple mounting systems during my years of HEMA, after a while I've started trying out historical options. Whenever I was using a loose scabbard and any kind of loose thong system I pretty often lost my dagger during the fight. The solution was usually to either use a more secure mounting system (like thongs looped over in front of the scabbard - this holds the dagger pretty securely, it creates a loop for a belt almost like on modern scabbards) or to use a tighter scabbard. So this could indicate that even historically they would do either loose scabbard or loose mounting, but not both - as much as I can take the argument that running or doing physical activities with a "fully loose" dagger isn't a problem, I can't believe anyone would ever stick to that kind of a carrying method after learning from experience that they are quite likely to loose a dagger during a fight. The other point I would make is that I've learned that people often try to take my own dagger and use it against me. When the scabbard is tight I can usually pull it out rather fast and easily if I do it the right way - pulling with a decisive upward motion. The correct angle is key here - in case of a tighter scabbard my opponents usually couldn't take my own dagger, because their pulling angle in any reasonable fighting scenario was limited, so they oculdn't execute the straight up motion that and an owner of a weapon can. Overall I would argue that tight dagger scabbards/sheaths were probably a thing, was it a majority? Im not going to make any assumptions here, but based on my fighting experience with a longsword and dagger I would rather have a tighter scabbard. Now there are two caveats here: - the dagger I use is a sparring blunt blade and it isn't balanced like a real dagger, its heavier toward the handle, this can impact how likely it is that the dagger falls out of a scabbard - I'm completely ignoring the moisture/wheather argument here which could play a bigger part in choosing the carry method than I think.

I love these videos! Really demystifies some of the finer points of that time period that are largely ignored

Loved it. Great video and topic

Brilliant as always Todd!

Excellent deduction once again. I look forward to whatever you decide to tackle next.

Good presentation, thanks mate 👍

Now that is very practical testing! Love it.

Talk about give your opponent advantage, to quote Maximus from Gladiator: The frost, sometimes it makes the blade stick!

Another great video Tod!! Enjoyed your video and I gave it a Thumbs Up💙💛

Very well done. I make my own scabbards & i tend to like them pressure fit so they dont fall out but i did run into this problem. It doesnt rain here much but when it does or if I get wet it does cause them to bind. So i discovered it is helpful to rig something to tje scabbard for your thumb to push on.

love the dedication level to accuracy you took by fording the river!

10:33 love that you stood right in the path of the sprinkler hahaha

This man asks the best questions and provides top answers, great video.

Since leather shrinks and hardens after being soaked, especially with hot water, it may give us a hint of how they fitted scabbards to the individual blades and how they got away with using only one layer of leather.

I didnt even know i needed this video in my life. Loved it 😊

Another fascinating video 👍

Tod, you're an actual damn treasure. I'm making a roleplaying system as a passion project and the perspective you bring and tests you do have made me consider aspects I couldn't have thought of otherwise.

Loved the 2 weeks later insight!

Frankly i could listen to you talk historical medieval maybes all day. You have a nice way of posing your opinions.

fascinating! thanks tod!

I very much enjoy the way you bring practical reality into our understanding of Middle Ages living and debunk our preconceived notions of how they preferred their kit! Always a pleasure to watch, thanks Todd Cutler! 😀

So there was a reason why they made scabbards loose fitting! Excellent work as always, Tod!

Love the dedication and passion towards understanding the past.

Contact cement also works well for adding leather bits in sheaths, the dry time is a little long though

Neat video. I do leatherwork. You did what is today known as wetforming. It's having a hard time drawing from the sheathe because the leather has molded to the fuller of the blade. Its narrowing angle toward the tip of the blade doesn't allow the blade to come out properly because the mold doesn't allow adequate space for it to do so. This causes the entire sheathe to need to expand when the blade is drawn, and leather isn't particularly stretchy. I surmise that leather sheathes were either well oiled, well waxed, or some combination thereof to prevent wet forming of leather sheathes and to repel water. An oiled sheathe would have been quite flexible, which may not have been the best treatment for sheathes if you wanted a fast draw, but it would keep the blade well oiled on a journey from point A to point B. I wager that beeswaxed sheathes were preferred because wax repels water and stiffens leather. Or, waxed on the outside and oiled on the inside would have been an excellent treatment method. That is, of course, considering that the leather received any treatment at all. I'm not an expert on medieval gear, so I'm telling you how I would treat a leather sheath if I were to make one with the goal of repelling water and fast draw.

Awesome video! On one point though, I believe theres a decent bit of evidence for textile or parchment liners on many medieval sword scabbards. At least from my reading in Covering the Blade by Goubitz, there are lots of imprints of whip-stitches along the mouths of scabbards, implying the presence of a liner that was attached there. If I'm not mistaken the still existing scabbard for the sword of saint maurice is one such example among many other fragmentary finds.

my basement (and clean shop area) can be humid. If I forget to run a de-humidifier, swords I am working on often stick in the scabbards I am making for them. I have to dehumidify until it shrinks enough to remove it. Then, heat the blade a little and put it into the wooden scabbard. It will shrink the wood that it touches some and then it will fit right forever. I have wanted to ship before, and had a basement leak, and had the sword stuck the day I planned to ship. That's how I learned this weird trick to salvage a scabbard without having to scrape it full-length potentially. Thanks for the video. It sort of resonated with my experiences making all-wood scabbards for custom swords.

Tod out here asking the oddball everyday questions no one else will ask.

Great video Tod!!! I can see why you have so many subscribers. I'll have to give you a shout next time I'm out your way. ...Richard

Hi Todd good to watch you on tv again today (28th May 2023) on scrap heap challenge ..

Hi Tod, could you make a video on how to care for dagger sheaths? I think it would be interesting. Good video. Thank you

*So* many good points... which it's fun to see someone very knowledgeable put forward when, ironically, I've been trying to say this to fellow modern collectors for 20, 30 years or more. (And so very refreshing to hear someone knowledgeable putting forward that "*I* don't like it, but.." and distinguish between preference--and necessity.)

Reading the comments brought something to my mind when I was a conscript: even rifles slings are set differently depending on the situation. On a parade, they are fit tightly, so they look good and you can fling the rifle around pompously. In a practice they sling is loose, so you can actually keep it hanging and still aim with the gun. Can't do that with parade-tight sling. So somewhat loose scabbard makes sense when your life depends on your sidearm being able to be drawn as fast as possible if you lose your main weapon. But if it's your main weapon, it could be a tad tighter fit, as you have more time to wrestle with it before your unit closes with the enemy.

7:47 I have made 5 scabbards for my LARP swords. I have only perfected it by the 4th attempt. My first 3 were "questionably made". 😅

Thank you , Tod . 🐺

Not sure if you will mention this, but do we have any evidence of the inside of sheaths being oiled (or lined with a less grippy material, if that would even be useful rather than counterproductive, etc) at any time or place in the Middle Ages? I ask since I own a reproduction sword and the scabbard came with the lining inside oily (or perhaps the oil on the blade stayed inside it, I am not sure)

I hear a lot about hunters bow and arrows vs the warbows and arrows. I'd love to see a comparative video.

3:52 this happen in modern day too but mostly with hammers on construction sites. You can walk with the hammer but going down the stairs or moving faster, the hand goes to the hammer automatically. There may be other stuff that hand goes to too like a knife. I have even worn a sledgehammer like a hammer and that really needed stabilization with a hand but it left other hand free for other stuff and carrying it in hand would have been less convenient.

I like the channel and the effort Tod shows, top notch. Also I thought about scabbards and came to one very simple conclusion, unlike in this piece, the inside was treated to repel water. This goes for wood and leather. And they knew about the problem so they wouldn't ignore it totally and apply protection inside and out. There are several ways of doing so, think of boiled linseed oil, varnish or tar like the boatbuilders did for centuries. The archeologists wouldn't necessarily find the fact if they don't look for it specifically. Tar in a wooden splinter is nearly impossible to recognize you need to run a test for it to do so. The high status ones may be lacquered not only for the display of wealth or style but also for practical reasons.

seeing tod in a river is all i needed in my life

Have now made over a dozen dagger and sword scabbards for myself and mates. Ive found that they start quite tight (usually fine until the last inch or so of stitching). But a bit of oil and working in and out of the scabbard and they work really well. But saying that I haven't soaked them. Interesting video.

Thank you for taking one for the team so we dont have to. Quality stuff as usual! #unsungheroes

A delightfully nuanced exploration of this whole subject. I really like the whole theme of 'just because we like it like that today, doesnt mean it was fit for purpose under medieval use.'

Seeing Tod walk into that river gave me legit anxiety flashbacks to every time my Boy Scout manual warned me that even a small river could sweep you away if you didn't have any rope or a buddy.

One thing came to my mind is that force moving towards enemy can throw multiple of these in volleys while advancing, 1 per 20-30 meters of closing in, so there might be not time to pick them up as there's more incoming. We are also bit used to seeing volleys but what if there's constant harass coming at you. Also they can be useful for a infantry to have against bigger targets like cavalry formation, to possibly injure/frighten the mounts, riders aren't going to pick them up. It's a handy piece to have, throwing it from behind the battlements fast, and get back to cover. Things might haven't been that easy to pick up in a big crowd of soldiers moving about, trampling the one's that landed on the ground, while the guy next to you is screaming due to having one stuck in his leg, arm, whatever. Also, if you get a cramp or minor muscle injury from the throw, then you could fall back to the rear maybe to get some respite, I bet they'd rotate the injured anyway in any circumstance with fresh troops, so they could fight a while later in long battles.

Yo that creek is MOVING!

Very interesting and realistic. And I like the Bunny ears.

Really interesting tidbits that I hadn’t considered before

On the rare occasions I have made knife sheaths I like to make a thin wooden sheath to wrap the leather around, it prevents the leather sheath from getting cut up.

As Adam Smith commented in Wealth of Nations when describing how pins were made in a pin factory with each worker having one single simple job. I wonder if some smaller towns would have so many specialties though and wouldn’t perhaps just have one smith and another person that makes handles and assembles knives/tools. They could then either have a family member or worker who makes the fairly low quality scabbard/sheath.

Hi Tod, another great video. I've been a fan of the channel for quite a while now and so have a lot of my friends. Recently we have been discussing a really cool experiment/video idea we'd love to see you try out. Slings vs armor. Seeing what a skilled slinger could do to various armor types with the various ammunition types that were historically used. There's an exceptionally skilled slinger who has a small KZfaq channel called "Archaic arms". He also lives in England and has said he would love to volunteer his skills for testing if you're interested. Seeing even a short film with you guys would be like a dream come true for us all. If it sounds like a cool idea to you please don't hesitate to contact him or myself to organize it.

I made a scabbard for a sword I had,, and what I did was make it from two thin pieces of wood that I carved out a slot for the sword in, and then cladding the inside of the scabbard with fur and glued the pieces together..Finally the outside was covered in leather.. The fur inside both held the sword in, and when you put your lightly oiled sword in it it never rusted...

I hadn't thought water's effect on scabbards. Great experiment.

I just bought a peasants knife from Tod and while I'm a blacksmith myself, I've always loved gods work. I watched his video on how to attach the sheath with a thong and having made knives for a long time, I don't do much leather work. So the knife is loose in the sheath, but the way its attached with the thong it doesn't fall out. I live in Oregon USA and we can and do give the British Isles a run for their money on how many days in a year it rains and how much falls. Everything that was explained makes sense and I have a feeling that if it gets wet, the fit might be perfect, but a little harder to resheath without slicing it about half way down. Great knife, sharp enough to shave yourself and solid. Good working knife.

thanks for taking the plunge for science, Tod!

Accessible and secured. My everyday fixed blade is secured with cordage through a hole drilled in the handle that loops over a button on the sheath - holds it in place but can be freed one handed - kept freed when I know I'll have to be using it often. Don’t doubt troops on the move in medieval times had reasons for the same - bad to have a blade stuck in its scabbard - equally bad to have lost it several miles back on the trail.

Strait up spreading superglue around with your finger is somehow the most macho thing I've ever seen.

Excellent video. I have to admit I have never given any thought to the hows and whys of sword and scabbard making in the medieval days. Do you thinking oiling the blade with grease or oil would have helped at all?

Now I want to see the same test with wool lined scabbards and such.

Guessing in tournament or when marching into battles they would use some simple that didn't hold the sword too tightly

In some 'samurai-esque' style movies there is a type of rope binding the sword (handle) to the scabbard. Might be a thing they did, if you use those thongs a bit, you could quite well prevent accidental falling out of the scabbard. Of course, you'd want to do it in a way like a pushbutton on old gun-holsters: easy to flip open if a fast draw is needed.

Tod! You The Man! Love ya work, asking the question, testing the question and generating more questions. So were scabbards/sheaths considered a ‘disposable’ (for some strange definition of disposable, a fighting season, a year, so many river crossings, or it’s just too bloody tight) item? And was the material (poplar or birch) valuable enough that after it has swollen, we let it dry (in a box near the cooking hearth) for “some time” and it’s back to ok? Same question for a completed scabbard: it gets wet, it becomes unusable, is it worth “carefully drying out” or just chuck it in the bin & get a new one? You mentioned scabbards with a small amount of wool - greasy (water repellant) wool? Some sort of self lubricating effect? Would this have been any use on voyages of Scandinavian tourists or similar? I dare say we simply don’t know…but you put a lot of fun into the asking of the pragmatic questions 😀 keep up the terrific work, Hi from Oz 🇦🇺 Oh, you caaaaaan’t have them shlopping about, You caaaaaan’t have them shlopping about, You caaaaaan’t have them shlopping about, But they MUST NOT be too tight!

Am the same my seax is a bit loose and its fell out a few times. So i ended up tying a bit of string to keep it in until i got a friend to glue a leather band inside the scabbard.

I had the same issues with making a scabbard for my Albion bastard sword. I steamed and formed the poplar around the blade, and covered it with linen using rabbit skin glue. At first, it was snug, but would "lock" in at the last fraction of an inch. Later, during the hot, dry summer, it loosened up. Now it is ready to fall out, but it still tightens noticeably with any ambient humidity. Being an American, I have the same issues with holsters for my various handguns. Snug fit and secure hold, or quick draw? Fortunately, modern technology provides me with a variety of different options.

Great topic. The whole medieval manufacture of quality is not something I ever considered before.

I've been watching all this time never knowing there's a stream just yards away.

I just received that messer that's stuck in the table. It's real nice and quite beefy

Here in Germany I've learned from a swordsmith that they often lined their scabbards with oiled fur with the grain facing downwards. This way the blade was kept nice and greasy, had a bit of wiggle room and the grain of the fur (goat mostly) had some grip to keep the sword in place. What's your opinion about that?

A classic mud test would be interesting, simulating falling into mud / dropping the sword into mud while sheathed. Would a tight fit / loose fit produce different results.

Regarding the end there- That scabbard will loosen back up though in a bit of time and with some use. Though not as nice as yours I do make scabbards too- even made a couple for my Albion Knight- one with fittings I bought from you- Mine are usually pretty snug when new made but after just a bit of break in they loosen up some. My end goal is a scabbard that when held upside down holds the sword but when lightly shaken easily releases. That seems to be my sweet spot So you have to consider the new fit as opposed to the broken in fit too

Thanks for doing so many of these types of videos! You are showing me exactly what I want to know, how these weapons and armors perform in the real world. I've often wondered how practical a group of archers would be when trouping about the english countryside in the rain, do crossbows require less care and attention? And again wondering about the armor such as chain links when they get super rusty, how would a man-at-arms clean each individual link? Would the rusty armor perform differently or cause mobility problems?

I've seen at least one image (ca. 1500) that depicts a high-status man pitching forward off his horse, with his sword falling out of the scabbard, too. No question about that loose fit.