How to know your spawn pool and wave triggers

How to know your spawn pool and wave triggers - Deep Rock Galactic

Рет қаралды 32,081

Күн бұрын

In this video we examine how spawn pools work, allowing you to know what enemies can spawn in your run, such as if you will ever see a bulk detonator or not. We also look at wave triggers like walking close to a mini mule can cause a wave to spawn.
My Haz 7 solo refinery run with Lok-1 Smart Rifle: • Haz 7 Refinery Solo: L...
Ike smashing solo refinery as the scout: • Haz7 Refinery Solo Scout
Ike's spread sheet file with all the data: docs.google.com/spreadsheets/...
Ike's document explaining the hazard files: docs.google.com/document/d/1O...
CCShads original Steam post: steamcommunity.com/app/548430...
CCShad questions:
Q: What made you interested in trying to gather additional data regarding DRG in general and specifically the spawn pool algorithms?
A: As tryhard-ish as it sounds, I'm pretty sure I started testing to understand the game more, and to become better at it. It's also pretty fun to unravel a game's mechanics and see how it works for yourself.
Q: You have obviously put a lot of effort and time into gathering, analysing and making this data available. Why is it of so much interest to you both?
A: Besides improving my own gameplay and experience, posting it and sharing it with the community is great and can help others the same way it helped me. I read and post on the drg forums quite often, so it's come up naturally in a few threads.
Q: What additional data do you wish you had regarding DRG but you just can’t quite get your hands on right now?
A: I'd love to see hard numbers on actual terrain generation, things like the chances of Dense Biozone's hazards spawning (ejector cacti and trapatactuses). And the spawn rates for minerals like gold and nitra - they definitely feel different across each mission type.
Q: Any final thoughts you would like to share?
A: There's still many mechanics in the game we don't understand, or at least don't have solid numbers on. I'd like to encourage as many people as possible to go and test their theories and questions they have about the game for themselves, or to even look into datamining if it sounds interesting to them. I'm sure we'll know so much more in the future
0:00 Intro
0:42 Before this knowledge
1:55 How to start using this information
2:18 Enemy types
2:42 Disruptive enemies
4:30 Gameplay against disruptive enemies
5:12 Special enemies
7:02 Gameplay against special enemies
8:09 Hazard warnings and the pool
8:31 Stationary enemies
9:23 Wave strength
9:55 Veteran grunts and oppressors
10:27 Wave intervals
11:21 Unique wave triggers
11:46 Wave trigger examples
12:39 Point extraction spawns
13:16 Salvage operation wave triggers
14:11 Unique swarm types
14:29 Unique creature encounters
14:46 Developer deserves credit for the RNG
15:00 CCShad details
15:24 Interview with Ike

Пікірлер: 105

@Rievven 2 жыл бұрын

Alternative hypothesis from a coder: I and my kind are lazy. Instead of selecting a random number of slots then filling I would always keep 4 slots and randomly fill, allowing repeats. Easier algorithm to write and let's me reuse code from the other spawn select algorithm.

@GamingExistence 2 жыл бұрын

Interesting! 🧐

@lein5300 2 жыл бұрын

Coder here as well, and this is exactly my sentiments and what I strongly believe to be the case. I actually started suspecting this just from my playing the game and occasionally experiencing an overwhelming presence of one enemy type over others in certain missions. As for how many slots there were, I had no idea, but there being a certain number of slots that allowed for repeats seemed like the most likely explanation, especially when taking into account how someone would probably program such an algorithm.

@Arkonoid404 2 жыл бұрын

Same, I thought that's what was implied by the video. Just cycling through all four slots and filling randomly would still give a chance for all 4 to be one.

@GamingExistence 2 жыл бұрын

You are all so lazy! :D Thanks for commetns and insight!

@Mallinuts 2 жыл бұрын

Small correction: it's not lazy, it's efficient (just like reusing the algorithm). BTW, remember that the next time a manager starts about increasing efficiency, you'll be smiling the entire meeting.

@Zippokovich 2 жыл бұрын

Another trigger (or anti-trigger) is that once you fill Doretta's canisters and put them back in then swarms don't trigger - so it should be the top priority and you can often avoid fighting a swarm completely

@joshmay2944 Жыл бұрын

This is a great tip! So on refuel stops always prioritize the fuel and then go for the nitra and other goodies.

@TristanAD_ Жыл бұрын

@@joshmay2944 changed my life

@jajusinlao2795 Жыл бұрын

ive been doing the exact opposite every time because i thought it would be better to be able to get a resup at the bat first than filling up doretta 💀

@spoopyboi1882 Жыл бұрын

I did this the other day and my friends were both amazed and confused

@prich0382 2 жыл бұрын

12:39 People think like that as it USED to be like that, but the devs realised that players found a loophole so instead they changed it to just progressively get harder over time, unfortunately not everyone got the memo

@ikcikor3670 2 жыл бұрын

6:00 this explains why sometimes 20 web spitters can just randomly spawn at once, thank you for the very informative video!

@rzr0015 2 жыл бұрын

I have seen point extraction break twice in my 150 hrs of gameplay. There were no breaks between swarms, they just kept coming; We held out even after running out of nitra. Almost felt like mini Karls ourselves😂. Everything changed when 3x bulk nation attacked.

@GamingExistence 2 жыл бұрын

Yes I think it can get that way. I was trying to solo golden bugs and was in the map for over an hour and it was getting to the point I could deposit the gold quick enough before the next swarm. I did have little breaks in-between though so not as broken as you said but close!

@rzr0015 2 жыл бұрын

@@GamingExistence oh no, it wasn't that we were late; That shitstorm started right after we got out of drop pod lmao. Both times.

@strongboyo7602 2 жыл бұрын

I thought it was only me that had gone through the point extraction hellhole

@rzr0015 2 жыл бұрын

@@strongboyo7602 rock n stone, yea!

@piecho99 2 жыл бұрын

5:42 To me that sounds like each slot can be filled by the same enemy multiple times. For example you can have 3 mactera slots and a acid spitter slot.

@poplil3934 10 ай бұрын

Ohh maybe thats why there are sometimes huge stacks of acid spitter or web shooter. Cuz it takes all three slots so its like 3x the predefined amount.

@cubanwargaming4879 2 жыл бұрын

I feel like I should mention the following: creature encounters are generated with the map itself, so if one is hunting specifically for Krassus detonators or (god forbid) Korlok Tyrants, make sure to fully explore the cave. I once had a Krassus detonator that we almost missed during an escort mission because it was in an isolated room above the heartstone. (i only noticed the room in the scanner, i was scared pale during the whole Omaran fight)

@GamingExistence 2 жыл бұрын

Good point and yeah I bet that was a tense hearthstone fight!

@cubanwargaming4879 2 жыл бұрын

@@GamingExistence actually, if i remember correctly the fight went on without a hitch, thankfully the krassus room was fully sealed off so it did not aggro on us until we came looking for it after depositing the heartstone

@garrettmccullough2249 Жыл бұрын

It's always fun having a bulk in the Omoran room. Especially when your team decides to kill it right next to Doretta. Fuuuuuuuuuuuun.

@craftboy338 10 ай бұрын

Protip: when Doretta is fully repaired, she is invincible for 3-4 seconds. I've used this in the past to tank a bulk, even if she's currently at 100% just shoot her to get her to 99 just before the bulk goes off and then repair and trigger the bulk immediately. It can really save you in a pinch

@Draconor 2 жыл бұрын

I chuckled when seeing that unknown % on solo dreadnought spawning. When I decided to try out gunner (I had already promoted two dwarves), the very first mission I did I encountered around 8 swarms and a dreadnought. Not to mention I only found enough nitra for 1 supply drop, I killed seven swarms, the dreadnought, pushed the button to send the rocket up and then immediately died to swarm 8. I was panicking the entire point extraction. Oh, also it was only on haz 3.

@rolands.7870 2 жыл бұрын

Lets be honets all together. We know this video is top quality and should keep those spawn rules all in mind.... and we will still forget them on the next EDD and will panic because we're pretty sure a stupid grabber just waits for us behind the next corner :P

@BvaWinters 2 жыл бұрын

I've played the game since early access and I noticed a lot of this stuff in the 1000+ hours I've played this game. I especially noticed how pretty much whatever enemies you see are what you'll see for the rest of the mission while others you'd pretty much never see. I think it's really cool and interesting how the developers handled the A.I director for enemy spawns on each playthrough in this game. This video was very cool for me to see a proper breakdown of it and I'm really into delving into how games work. So thanks for uploading this cool video!

@drunkey8496 2 жыл бұрын

Wow. This is truly some of the best, most insightful DRG content on the platform for those of us looking to improve their game. You’ve earned my sub and you deserve far more!

@GamingExistence 2 жыл бұрын

Thank you! You have motivated me to keep plugging away 🙂 Rock and stone!

@haghendowdy4750 2 жыл бұрын

Lab quality research on a video game- that's what I like to see.

@yoyie1867 2 жыл бұрын

man this is truly helpful. More people need to see this I personally struggle with haz5 already

@legalnews5950 2 жыл бұрын

Need more people data mining on deep rock. I must know e v e r y t h i n g

@ccshad1 2 жыл бұрын

Really awesome to see the all the info we have so far gathered in one place, great video!

@GamingExistence 2 жыл бұрын

And thank you for all the information plus for your interview questions in the description! Rock and stone!

@michaelbowman6684 Жыл бұрын

I just had an insane Egg Hunt today where we spawned in a giant open cavern filled with about a dozen Praetorians, a couple Oppressors, Wardens, and Sentry Bots, hundreds of Glyphid Grunts, 2 Spitballers + 1 Brood Nexus all right next to each other in the back, and a Bulk Detonator for good measure. It was Haz 4. A solid 10 minutes of straight up fighting for our lives the moment we landed, we had our mine Nitra in order to get a resupply before we had even finished fighting, and we hadn't even gathered a single egg yet. It was a nightmare, but we still managed to clear out everything and finish the mission. But still, it was a lot harder than I thought it would be.

@GamingExistence Жыл бұрын

Wow! Rock and stone on your victory! With egg hunts the more eggs you need the more chance the drop ship will land in an open cave like point extraction or refinery. With 6-8 eggs be ready for hot landing zone much like those refinery and point extraction maps! Your story has made Karl proud! Keep it up ☺️

@Kwaark 2 жыл бұрын

awesome work ! thx !! love that kind of content

@Linventor 2 жыл бұрын

Fun fact - A group of Mactera is known as a firing squad. Source: I made it up

@arzodyeetus7221 2 жыл бұрын

Thanks for all the job and explaining Can’t put into words you and the lads efforts.

@GamingExistence 2 жыл бұрын

I just got everything in one place and put some glitter on it. Ike and the others he mentioned have spent years working with the data and are the real heroes!

@arzodyeetus7221 2 жыл бұрын

@@GamingExistence The difference in work load and time is very true. But we all appreciate each and very effort equally.This community is truly blessed and im so happy :D

@GamingExistence 2 жыл бұрын

@@arzodyeetus7221 Really well said! Rock and stone!

@Barot8 Жыл бұрын

Great video, thanks! I had a bulk det spawn at spawn right after my rocket pod dropped me off and departed! Luckily the map was large. It was a liquid morkite mission. Lots of gold.

@General_Fragrant_Soap 2 жыл бұрын

Awesome video about game mechanics!)

@tadferd4340 Жыл бұрын

This is why I consider Point Extraction to be the hardest mission. I joined a Haz3 Point Extraction on Glacial yesterday and it was 2 new players. A Driller and Scout. Literally only level 6, first time trying Haz3. I loaded in as Gunner with Minelayer and a BRT with a Clean for range. The mission had just started and they were in a bad spot with a Nemesis, while also having a Prospector. I kite around and expend most of my BRT anmo killing it, then pick up the 2 Greens. Resume normal Point Extraction. Start looking for Nitra because my ammo is already awkward. Also keeping an eye out for the Prospector. Then the first "swarm" hits. Dreadnought. Fortunately we had just enough Nitra for a resupply. Ended up fighting and reviving through the next swarm, until the Dread died. At this point the poor Greens are feeling very overwhelmed and express that Haz3 is insane. I tried to reassure them this was atypical. We are already very behind at this point so the rest of the mission was fairly intense for Haz3. A lot of barely getting the Nitra for a resupply in time. It felt more like a Haz4. Eventually got those poor Greens out successfully. I hope they try Haz3 more. Last week's EDD had a Point Extraction as Stage 2. Overwhelmingly the hardest part. Eventually got through it with a good group from the Discord. Had 3 of us swarm clearing while the Scout grabbed Aquarqs. I barely even remember Stage 3 as it was trivial in comparison.

@GamingExistence Жыл бұрын

That sounds like some bad RNG on that game. Good job on supporting the others and winning the mission! PE with the constant swarms can get overwhelming very quickly. Especially if you throw in some events in the mix. Gotta do em quick and get out! Rock and stone on your victory!

@luciagimenez3688 2 жыл бұрын

this video is awsome

@cocogus Жыл бұрын

14:46 very nice cut

@splitsentro 2 жыл бұрын

This is really inspiring and very useful. Thank you very much!

@LL-kv1jk Жыл бұрын

For Point Extraction: Bug spawns hit critical mass around the end of wave 3. So if you're still in a PE mission and the third wave hits, it's time to leave, you're very unlikely to get anything else done at that point.

@illuminati1866 Жыл бұрын

U awesome dude

@peanutm9346 2 жыл бұрын

Haha that leech grab

@GamingExistence 2 жыл бұрын

Slightly longer clip of the crassus dozer leech finisher here - kzfaq.info/get/bejne/edeilMmb1tjKfJs.html

@NickMaovich Жыл бұрын

14:45 perfect cut :D

@jafsrob 29 күн бұрын

One of the most common questions from greenbeards on the drg discord is “I just got 3 bulks on a mission, is that normal?”

@choty7066 4 ай бұрын

Hate the fact that stingtails are now normal enemies and can spawn anytime

@vexlegend313 2 жыл бұрын

I love popping more than 1 egg double sawrms are fun even triple swarms

@ethanedwards7834 Жыл бұрын

There's a lot of cool information in this video. Does the number of players affect any of this or is it all hazard level?

@GamingExistence Жыл бұрын

Number of players impacts health and resistances. It does not change spawn pools though. Hope that helps and glad you found the video helpful!

@jordangoh4775 2 жыл бұрын

Thanks for this video and I'm sure it will help me on my runs, but I wish I never watched it because now it feels more like a game instead of a blue collar job simulator

@GamingExistence 2 жыл бұрын

Lol! 🤣 Rock and stone!

@danielfletcher706 10 ай бұрын

Are you planning to do a video on swarm manipulation? different swarm types have interesting interactions and can really impact the flow of a game if you go high enough in difficulty.

@GamingExistence 10 ай бұрын

That's not on my radar right now. Can you explain more?

@danielfletcher706 10 ай бұрын

@@GamingExistence from what I've heard, a swarm announced by MC can stall the in-game timer for spawning natural swarms that are unannounced. if you plan out how you trigger announced swarms (going quick with Doretta and strategically popping eggs for example) you can technically avoid fighting a natural swarm altogether, which can save a lot of ammo. There's more nuanced tech on salvage that I'm not aware of but that's the general gist of what's dubbed "swarm glitching" by the select number of people who do this in modded (and vanilla) runs

@GamingExistence 10 ай бұрын

@@danielfletcher706 Ah yes I got you! Yes that is true and yeah I wish I had included it into this video at the time!

@FenekkuKitsune 9 ай бұрын

The title is misleading and/or easily misunderstood. I took it as knowing what you’re going to see by signs before seeing the enemies. But it’s less “knowing your spawn pool” and more “knowing what ISN’T in your spawn pool”. It’s more tips, tricks and general numbers, stuff that most players will understand after their first few high-hazard games.

@qwsxedcrfv 2 жыл бұрын

I’m pretty sure I’ve seen the point costs for enemies in another mod before, maybe spawn menu?

@GamingExistence 2 жыл бұрын

Interesting. I'm sure Ike would have been all over that if that was the case. I will let him know though! Thanks for the info.

@MOHHpp3d 2 жыл бұрын

You might be thinking of the mod "Custom Waves - Advanced" which is hidden by the mod author. Here is the description: " Adds a fully customisable wave system that works in tandem with the game's natural wave system (they don't override each other). This means you can use this mod with difficulty mods such as Hazard 6, Swarm Size Control, etc. without conflicts. The mod uses a "spawn cost" and spawn chance system to make wave compositions feel more natural and varied. Every enemy is assigned a spawn chance that determines its rarity (higher number = higher chance to spawn), and a spawn cost that determines how expensive that enemy type is to spawn (higher number = less units spawn per wave). Each wave is made up of multiple "stages", where each stage will spawn a group of enemies on a random player (at a set distance). "

@shadowlegend738 11 ай бұрын

Pretty sure the breeder counts as a stationary enemy as well !

@jelliman9238 10 ай бұрын

i think pretoria s have something to do with this because i’ve have multiple missions where i got an absurd amount of pretorians that just refused to stop spawning and it was not a pretorian wave

@hungerjames4018 Жыл бұрын

Great video!! Do you know how biome-specific stationary enemies work? Do stabber vines, honeycombs, and wasp's nests get priority to spawn in their respective biomes? Do they count against hazard 5's normal 2-4 stationary enemy type limit?

@GamingExistence Жыл бұрын

Thank you! I have no idea really... My guess would be they are a separate thing and don't impact the stationary limit or cost pool.

@hungerjames4018 Жыл бұрын

@@GamingExistence thanks :) your content has been a pleasure to watch!!

@GamingExistence Жыл бұрын

@@hungerjames4018 Always lovely to hear! Working on the next video right now! Rock and stone!

@frostfiredirewolf8517 Жыл бұрын

It's been a year. I don't suppose we figured out the missing details yet?

@ZorillaMyrid181 2 жыл бұрын

(I didn't get to finish the video so I'm sorry if I get this wrong) So is there any way the special enemies are affected by the class playing? Since I started DRG I've played on Haz 2-3 (I haven't been able to promote any dwarfs yet because I've moved between the Xbox and Steam version) and it seems every time I play a match with the driller, I almost always got exploders. I suppose RNG can do that, but sometimes I feel like class has at least some effect on the special enemies that spawn

@GamingExistence 2 жыл бұрын

Just RNG. Keep playing and it will even out. 🙂

@MMock Жыл бұрын

really enlighting but i have a question from something i didnt understand, if you pop several eggs at the same time or start the drilldozer at the same time you do an egg, do you get a double sized wave or does one wave override the other?

@GamingExistence Жыл бұрын

You will get a double wave effectively 🙂

@zxoblue 8 ай бұрын

this video proves that drg is a game based on rng (and i don't think that's bad)

@gummygal008 Жыл бұрын

stationary enemies are spawned upon cave generation

@vYperMystic 2 ай бұрын

Any chance we can get an updated video with all the new bug types?

@0mn1P4wn4g3 2 жыл бұрын

Can you provide info for the most recent version? This doesn't mention anything robots or the new macteras. Also where did you get the fancy tables with enemy icons? Is this info on the wiki as well?

@GamingExistence 2 жыл бұрын

The fancy tables with enemy icons I made. The robots will be a new type of enemy that won't use the slots. They will just spawn when doing the new hazard warning or seasonal events. Hope that helps. Oh and new mactera?

@0mn1P4wn4g3 2 жыл бұрын

@@GamingExistence The new macteras as in brundles and trijaws. I assume they spawn in as replacements for the regular macteras. What about the Nemesis? You can encounter it outside of Rival excursion hazard warnings.

@GamingExistence 2 жыл бұрын

@@0mn1P4wn4g3 At the time of recording I think they did not know exactly how trijaws brundles worked or did not have the exact data mining data. I would assume they work like the veteran grunts which is mentioned in the video. Less likely but maybe like preats going into oppressors. I would highly think that the nemesis functions more like unique creature encounters, Bet-C korlok etc. Outside of the hazard I have not seen 2 on the same map. If you can get 2 on a non hazard map, perhaps they have some new percentage chance and timer to spawn them. Perhaps future data mining will tell all!

@ExiMaster 2 жыл бұрын

One thing that was skipped was boss spawns. Was any of that calculated in this video? I didn't see anything about it.

@GamingExistence 2 жыл бұрын

Do you mean when a random dreddy spawns in a mission as a special wave? If so it's in the section about special waves. I think I say they are all about 6% but if you look at the image on screen I'm fairly sure from memory dreddy has like less than 2% chance. 14:12

@vfctffu3797 6 ай бұрын

Damn

@ryezheld 10 ай бұрын

how do i make sure that i always get a crassus detonator to spawn? it's fun hunting them idk why

@GamingExistence 10 ай бұрын

Unfortunately it's purely down to RNG. Something like a 3% spawn chance each game. I put the wiki image up on screen for special spawn section, but if you Google unique creature spawn chance or something like that you can find the exact number.

@ryezheld 10 ай бұрын

@@GamingExistence hmm apparently 1 in 26.. well, painge. i am watching your scout playstyle vid rn, and i think i have to change my way of just bursting crowds (gunner main newb here)

@GamingExistence 10 ай бұрын

@@ryezheld I was 800 hours in before I got Golden Pots with a crassus 😞 Hope you enjoy that video and good luck with the other classes!

@ryezheld 10 ай бұрын

well, so far i'm loving gunner and engineer (except for the ammo-glutton that they are). driller is kind of a cheese but i just can't seem to get used to his weapons... for scout, so much i play hit and run, but i can't deal with crowds as effectively as i do with the other classes@@GamingExistence

@Flamme-Sanabi Жыл бұрын

I have the feeling that the game is more fun not knowing. So I shall not continue this video.

@something1285 4 ай бұрын

Has any of this info been updated?

@bestolotch2534 2 жыл бұрын

your speech is very difficult to sit through, however the information you've gatherer may come in use

@avocadothecat 2 жыл бұрын

you talk a lot... idk maybe it's just me but I like it more if people get straight to the point and not talk about other stuff. anyways thx for the information.

@GamingExistence 2 жыл бұрын

Thanks. I will keep that in mind 😉 This one was difficult because I felt I needed to show what I was saying had data to back it up. Next time I will think about flipping it though and putting that after the info for those curious.