Xenoblade 1 villains are obsessed with the future, Xenoblade 2 villains are obsessed with the past, and Xenoblade 3 villains are obsessed with the present

For all the time comparing Torna to Ouroboros, I'm surprised you didn't mention that Ouroboros is _actively being assisted by _*_an ex-Torna member._* She didn't agree with their methods and found their end goal to extreme for her, but she still looked up to Jin and had experienced first-hand the cruelty that led to the organization being formed in the first place. That cruelty was in large part the result of _fear of the unknown._ People didn't know how to treat people who so blatantly violated the order of the world, so the usual response is to either pretend they don't exist, or _make_ them not exist. Even outside of Xenoblade 3, Torna as a whole (with Nia) is honestly pretty much a traditional JRPG party in their own right, and even gameplay wise they'd be remarkably well balanced. 5 attackers, 3 defenders, 3 healers, and either 1 or 2 of every element except Light. Even freaking _field skills_ have fantastic coverage among them.

In xc2, Malos (edit: probably Jin, not Malos) literally also says that the reason Torna are fighting is the fact that blades get reborn without any memories of their past lives. They have _literally_ the same goal.

Not to mention that Jin was literally anti endless now "In the course of a lifetime, a man will see uncountable meetings and partings. Yet, as your life's candle sputters and dies, whose face is it that rises to greet you? Happy is the man who can sleep, in the comfort of the smile he sees then. No...I don’t wish for "forever". Even just for one moment...It’s enough...if it’s with her." I mean thats basically what xenoblade 3 is about

For me the coolest part of the trilogy and villains is how they represent different answers to the concept of time. Zanza=the future, Torna/Malos=the past and moebius/z=the present. Each story is about the pitfalls of getting stuck in one of these things and how the party answers that. The xeno series is just so layered and the way takahashi is able to reuse and repackage these themes over and over is just incredible. Man is a genius. Great video as always

I've had major discussions with my friends about how XC3 is the "Logos Game" even if Malos is dead. The Processors are obviously identifiable with the Christian Trinity: Ontos/Ouisa- Father, Malos- Son, Pneuma- Holy Spirit, but they are just as identifiable with the monomythic "divine triptych" of Creator-Preserver-Destroyer found in multiple traditions around the world (example being the Trimūrti of Hindusim: Brahma-Vishnu-Shiva). Ontos is the Creator, the one who helped Zanza and Mayneth shape their new dimension post-experiment, Pneuma is the Preserver, who sought to protect the world from the ravages of Malos the Destroyer (as Preserver-Destroyers often do, forming their own little dualities within the greater Trinity). The Cores might not be an overt presence in 3, but since we got the "Creation" game and the "Preservation" game the last would logically be the "Destruction" game. And ho boy that's what it is. Noah takes up that torch starting from the cutscene in Maktha where Manana asks the party "So is the World a supervillain? Since it makes everyone do bad things?" and you can see the neurons start to activate inside the boy's head. To him flat out admitting to N and Z that "if the world holds us back, I will end it". To the whole "I'LL TEAR IT ALL DOWN!" every time he draws Lucky 7. I maintain that is is absolutely the Logos=Destroyer game in the trilogy. Which makes sense because Destroyer deities in these paradigms are never represented as flat out "evil", everything the Creator made and the Preserver protected *will* eventually stagnate and at its proper time need to be destroyed in order to be remade anew. Which dovetails with the opposition of Mobius and the "Endless Now" being a representation of Ur-Stagnation.

I love when Takahashi tricks us into playing the same games over and over.

I think Shania is meant to be as proof as to why Z exists. A reason Z might exist is because there were people who want the endless now and Shania is one of those people who would rather keep the cycle of rebirth

I remember that convo between Rex and Jin about who would fight on even when they were gone, I love how Xeno 3 utilized that concept. Great video

Two things i wanna say... You said that “N died not knowing who the true villain was”, which I strongly disagree with. He was not 'Z's lackey' by the end, hence why his name is just "N" when you fight him in Origin and not "Moebius N". He hated Z, he only did what he was told because he couldn't let go of M and needed her. Once M was gone he had nothing left, and after Noah & Mio talk him down from his emotionally volatile state, he even takes Noah's hand and accepts the future. This is him rejecting Z and realizing he was wrong. So no, N definitely wasn't "Z's Lackey" till his dying breath, and he indeed did have an Egil/Jin moment of realization right before his death. I would also disagree with M being a double-agent the *entire time*. I think - while at first she was angry at N for what he did - a century or two does a lot to bury one's conscience. It was just that eventually she couldn't do that anymore and became depressed as her Noah changed more and more over time. She wanted to save him from his misery, but he wasn't miserable at first. This was a process. I would say M was only a double agent after a few centuries where she became depressed/suicidal This is a cool video though and makes a ton of sense, honestly Ouroboros & Torna have very similar ideals when it comes to how the world should be (freed from oppressive control), and the 2/3 ending chapter(s) comparison around 11:53 blew my mind I'd never thought of this until now 😮 Keep up the great work Luxin ✨

Another Egil Parallel I saw was that the "deprive the enemy of their sustenance" plan is literally what Monica and the Lost Number's overall strategy aside from finding/creating Ourobouros and assisting them. The LN would regularly stage raids (like in Side-Story Lanz and the end of chapter 4) to steal cradles and the people inside to weaken their enemy as there would be fewer soldiers fighting and providing life energy to moebeus.

I love how they made Noah's eyes more light showing that he still has that fire to fight while they gave N more darker and lifeless eyes showing that he gave up entirely. its a small detail but I love it.

Another parallel between the City and Torna: the City took pods from the castle but never awakened them. Just like Torna stole core crystals but never awakened them.

Yeah M isn’t really a villain to begin with since she was unwillingly turned into mobius by Z as the motivational reward for N to wipe out the original city. And while she had the same mobius status as N of managing the other consuls and their colonies (N with keves and M with agnus), she most likely hated doing it.

Funny how you mentioned that Malos would fight alongside the XC3 party were he in their world, what with the recent rumours of Malos and Noah's V.A's being seen going to the same studio or some such. It's all coming together...

Maybe the real sympathetic villains were the friends we killed along the way.🎉

When you mentioned the idea of Malos fitting in as a Hero? He’s the only Aegis players were never permitted to wield, so it would’ve been really cool if they had included that in a more literal sense (I’m sure you could logic your way through every plot point connecting Noah and the Sword of Origin/End/Infinity-whatever its truly called and eventually wind up at Malos), not to mention you can technically still wield Pyra and Mythra’s Blade and there is literally a Monado skin in the game, so Malos’ sick as all hell cutlass/Monado hybrid would have been sooo good. And hey, you could just give him access to Monado Arts like he used in 2 for the fun of it. A character who would embody both games in so many ways.

The Noah and Malos pic is canon now.

So what im hearing is we should get egil and malos as dlc heroes

I had a revelation recently with the Future Redeemed dlc that it seems to *strongly* hint that the Sword of Origin has Malos' core crystal in it: so if Shulk is the Ontos wielder in his fame and Rex the Pneuma wielder, by fusing with N Noah becomes the Logos wielder. And good for Malos, frankly. Dude wanted to destroy a world *real* bad I'm glad he got pointed in the right direction

17:14 I REALLY appreciate that Generator Rex reference.

Malos would probably love Eunie's attitude

with FR it basically confirms that Noah is supposed to be the successor of Malos

These videos on the xeno series give me the motivation to look towards my uncertain future and to not dwell within the endless now

I remember having a shower thought along the lines of this video a couple weeks ago: "Y'know, Malos' and Noah's goals and motivations really overlap. Could Noah be Malos' true driver?" It's really fun to think about, and it's even cooler that it runs deeper. Very Xeno of the game

Of all the parallels and connections between Xenoblade 3 and its predecessors, comparing the sympathetic villains to Ouruborous is something I never thought of before. Great video, Luxin!

I obviously haven't watched an 18 minute video after it being out for 7 minutes, but I want to drop a comment and like for the algorithm. Keep up the good work Luxin!

The only thing I could kind of see is that you technically end the world in XC3 But Egil was doing that for self serving revenge and Malos was doing it because he had no hope in humanity. Noah and Mio reject the selfish option of becoming Moebius while changing the world because they have hope that under different circumstances these people could be better and live better lives. It's the exact opposite of Malos and Egil. If anything it's perfectly in line with the values the protags of 1 & 2 fought for.

0:32 The term used by TV Tropes to refer to this kind of character is "The Dragon". Just something to note for future reference.

I don't know how you manage to come up with all these thematic through lines across the xenoblade series, but it's entertained and interested me for years now. Love these dives dude!

Kudos for the generator rex tie in, I knew the song felt familiar

It's pretty cool that next year will be the 25th anniversary of Xeno and it lines up pretty well with the end of the Blade saga & the release of 3's DLC expansion chapter. Hopefully it also coincides with a Xenogears re-release, would be an excellent game to get the HD-2D treatment plus Nintendo & SquareEnix's relationship is much better now than in the past 20 years. After next year, Monolith is reportedly moving on to new projects.

Yep, I like to say XC3 is the Mobile Suit Zeta Gundam of Xenoblade; protagonist and antagonist sides completely flipped due to the changed context, darker tone, mental health and anti-war themes, first big time-skip in the main story, a former member of an antagonist group playing a leadership role in the new resistance (Char, Nia), both sides using the leftover mechs from a previous antagonist group (Zeon Zakus, Faced Mechon as Keves Levnises), and a ridiculously bittersweet ending.

Ive literally tears in my eyes right now. Never thought that deep about the whole story. Keep forward, ur dooing amazing stuff!

Ok now I need fanart of malos giving mio head pats. Somone please make it happen🙏

Wow an actual short video this time great content as always

not the generator rex quote in the year of our lord 2022

Part of me hopes you'll make a video on Shania and Joran as I feel like they're misunderstood by a sizeable part of the fandom

Very well done analysis Luxin, it definitely feels like there was a sublime beauty in all the themes and messages the game imparts, especially in the final cutscenes. Hard to believe that Egil and Malos woulda been proud, but u made a very compelling case for it

I love the timing of this video simply because I’ve been hung up on this fun idea for a story beat if there was a direct sequel to XBC2 or if people got the massive fan-service DLC they’re daydreaming about that takes place in both worlds where the group realizes they need a power up which leads to a revelation that Malos’ core crystal was still partially intact and they needed to track it down and awaken it once again. Which would not only thematically tie into Rex & Malos’ final conversation but also lead to some amazingly fun & awkward party banter. Please excuse me for dumping essentially fan-fic in your comments this video just stirred that train of thought again.

"The flame clock is life itself." "These soldiers will nourish me, and we could always grow plenty more." Breaking the flame clock and stealing cradles is almost like Egil's starvation tactics

Oh yeah, I also just realized that a member of Oroborous is a machina who had a form of survivor's guilt due to the death/corruption of his friend; Egil with Arglas, Lanz with Joren. Not sure if that was intentional though.

It would have been pretty funny seeing uncle Malos fighting alongside Mio

Irma is another sympathetic Moebius, even if she wasn't fleshed out all that well.

Not especially related but i find it interesting how theres like a running theme of members of moebius being artists or people who weren't able to live proper fulfilling lives due to the nature of the world that zed has created. and then makes these people fight to preserve the order of this world and seem to get abilities based off of their passions. yes there are outliers and we don't know enough about enough of the moebius to know how much of a theme it is but since it is like enough that its like a major theme to them. people disenfranchised by the very nature of the world learning from all their past lives and never able to have a proper life in any of them and then choosing to preserve the world order that took everything from them.

YYEEAAAHHH NEW LUXIN VIDEO

Malos would fight against Moebius but if he won he would deactivate it instead of rebooting it, allowing all of Aionios to be destroyed by the annihilation effect.

I just beat this game the second time on new game + what a perfect time

(I'm still at the beginning of the video, so I'm prepared to see this exact point be made, but whatever) There was a line at the end of Nia's ascension quest that talked about how they're going to reset the world and basically destroy everything in order to have things their way, and that just made go "Now wait a minute, this sounds like a villain speech"

THIS IS SO GOOD!

Never thought I’d hear a Generator Rex reference but great job!

This makes me want Egil and Malos to be DLC somehow even though it’s impossible

6:47 I love how you italicised your words, thats it

This video does a great job showcasing thematic parallels between casts. Just one thing, I was confused abour: didn't Torna just want to destroy the world, instead of recreating/restoring it like Ourobouros? I could still see Malos aligning with the party, but moreso out of coincidence than anything. It'd be like "I don't care about the two worlds, are we killing god or not?"

17:13 Did not expect a Generator Rex reference in a Xenoblade video... Spark yes

One tiny note: Nopon still go to their home worlds. Riku and Manana went back to their home worlds and Riku was Riki or Kino’s child (most likely Riki) both of whom were alive in the old world, which means that nopon in Aionios live for centuries. We know nopon are mortal (you can find Riki’s grave) though If we assume it was Kino, who is much younger than Riki’s 40 years in the original Xenoblade, it still means between the start of the thousand years of Aionios, and the end of the endless now, a maximum of two generations can have happened. The *smallest* possible lifespan for nopon here is the amount of time between the city forming and the end of the game, and Riku looks as young now as he did then

Kinda hoping for more fanservice with the DLC. I'm pretty much 100% certain, that we'll get Shulk and Rex as heroes. Maybe in their OG design, but more likely in their Designs of the statues in the City. But DAMN would it be amazing if they'd bring Malos and Egil back as well. I think I would genuinely cry if there were hero missions with them, where they reminice about what they did with the others.

Huh, how very interesting, I didn’t think of that.

Xeno 3 manages to have both sympathetic villains and pathetic villains, the latters being X and Y. It's criminal how underused they were.

I have few Theories that you might talk about in future videos. The first theory would be about N, Noah, Mio, M , Nia, Sena , and Vandham family’s origins and about how they connect to the old Xenoblade 1-2 Characters. Second theory is how the Titans Dead. And Last theory is Who are the 7 Founders?

I think the supervillainpon/suicide conversation from chapter 4 is very tied to malos/egil as well. The world is bad, and the end point of that is suicide, sounds a whole lot like malos and sort of egil. Maybe Noah's conclusion about imbuing meaning to the world is a response to those ideas?

The Ouroburos truly is a party of Endbringers

What a nifty take. Makes me appreciate XB3 a bit more!

Right in time for the nightly decision of what to watch in bed 😁

I was always Egilpilled

Ngl quoting Generator Rex like that was a huge shock of nostalgia for me

N does not stay on Z’s side the entire time. He realises his mistakes when he joins Noah and switches sides.

Another funny parallel is that one of Noah's default arts is "Sword Strike," which was one of Malos's arts with Sever Edit: Believe he's also one of only two playable characters that can use a full combo in one move, the other being Jin

Omg ya just release a good boi Valdi on them!!

Z is based on Zanza and The Architect and carring on Klaus sins.

Why do uour xenoblade 2 footage look so good?

In xenoblade 3 you don't destroy the world. You save two worlds from finishing fusing together, that fusion would have caused everyone to die. Seperrating the worlds again will save everyone and undo the constantly reborn. Zanza wants to kill everyone and restart the world of 1, Egil wanted to kill the homs, amalthus wants power, jin wants revenge for lora and malos is jus crazy because of amalthus. So the xenoblade 3 protagonists don't allign with the 1 and 2 villains, because nia and melia would have told them about it if noah and co did.

Egil would align with the city and Malos would align directly with Ouroboros.

Ooh, very interesting video! I do want to ask though, where is it implied that the City folk got downloaded to origin before the end? (…Or that the party talked it out with them beforehand? I mean, I didn’t even know that was what they were trying to do until the final cutscene…) Is it in a sidequest I missed?

6:53 imagine Consul A is a reincarnated Amalthus

Wait is that generator Rex as the background music in the very end?

I don’t think the Nopon and City Folk would just disappear, but would exist in a New Xenoblade universe or Xenoblade 4. Or a Xenoblade spin off game that covers what happened to City Folk and Nopon.

I know I'm late to this comment section so not many people will read this, but ever since chapter 5 I've thought there was a really interesting parallel between Aionios' reincarnation and Alrest's reincarnation of its blades, as seen though Jin and Shania. In Xenoblade 2, Jin hates that blades keep living the same lives over and over. He detests the thought of no longer remembering those he once cared about, and because of this philosophy he becomes a flesh eater, sending him down his dark path. Shania is the antithesis of this philosophy. She hates her life, and wants to start again, living over and over because she *wants* to be able to forget. The world of Aionios with its reincarnation is very similar to blades in Xenoblade 2, and the ouroboros are hailed as heroes in their fight to end that system. Jin and Torna, however, were villains over the same goal. I think it's really interesting how the morals of a repeating life is flipped between games, with the context behind each game being the difference of why it's good vs why it's bad

Another parallel between Torna and the City that struck me was the City depriving Moebius of cradles just like Torna was depriving Amalthus of core crystals - but not actually weaponizing those stolen resources because of moral principles.

Thumbnail + Title makes Malos and Egil look like rantsonas LOL

One thing we can agree on is this theory. Good job. Still disagree about Alvis being ontos, but this theory I agree with.

Neat!

If the two planets are bound to rejoin as its implied in the end wouldnt it mean that in due time the ppl that were lost by the splitting will be born again?

I think the main difference between Malos and the Ouroboros Party is that Malos didn't have any plans to reconstruct the world in a better way; he wanted to burn it and leave it burnt. He hated both the world and humanity, and wanted the permanent destruction of both. The Ouroboros wanted to destroy the current world, but replace it with the world that used to exist, and constantly had hope for a better future for all humans. While Malos loathed humanity, the Ouroboros loved humanity; while Malos wanted to permanently end the world, the Ouroboros wished to make a new, better world by ending only the current one. And I also think you interpreted Noah's hesitation about restarting the world wrong; he wasn't hesitant because he wasn't sure if it was right to sacrifice peoples' lives because I don't think they were even considering it a sacrifice of lives as everyone would be reborn in the old worlds. I think Noah was hesitant because at the last minute, he started fearing what would happen if the worlds didn't drift apart again, and instead Z's insistence that the worlds would collide and erase each other, killing everyone was what would happen.

Egil and Malos as DLC heros would actually be pretty cool

With the ending of 3 I assumed that eventually the two worlds would eventually merge together safely allowing the people of the city to be born again.

Neat

I was thinking about this video and this is kinda interesting. Since Jin would definitely become mobieus. He wants to eternally live with Lora. He's definitely becoming mobieus and there are moments where most protags would become mobieus. Shulk before Fiora dies. Sharla when she reunites with Gadolt right before his sacrifice. Melia when the emperor or Kalian dies Dunban same as shulk Rex when Poppi kept her promise to Mythra Morag right before Niel died Mythra before Milton died Pandy when Zeke almost died

I think Irma was a pretty sympathetic villain as well

As a community we need to protect and support flute guy from the game awards. We need to support him in all of his endeavours from now on! Please pin this comment.

You can tell the authors love using the same beats. EVERY game starts thousands of years after the "planet" was destroyed/reformed (Xenogears, XBC 1/2/3) Companions recycled into elite enemy forces (XS: Vergil becoming Testament, XBC1: Mumkhar becoming a metal face, XBC3: Joran + Crys becoming Moebius). Everybody's soul/mind is in a computer that recycles their bodies after death (XBCX, XBC3)

I really would like to see fan service heroes like Xenoblade 2 did it with shulk and fiora. I'd love to see at least Malos team up with the cast. It's never gonna happen but it would be awesome as fuck. Malos is awesome 👍 If that won't happen I'd definitely play a Xenoblade game that isn't canon and have all the characters interact in some way like how fire emblem heroes does it

Whats the last song he played in the video called?

There is nothing to support the claim that the No pin and the people of the city would be erased by the main cast decision to restart origin. If anything what was shown was that they all would persist. The nap on can also be separated into the other two worlds. On a side note, I would postulate that the people from the city split off as their own world after this and in the future are shown to first the universe that is X.

Luxin you must make a Xenoblade 3 is Episode VI of Perfect Works video now. And... it 100% is... even Takahashi is moving on by the end of Xenoblade 3 it seems and I think your video conveys that pretty fantastically because Ouroboros is literally the light to guide the future while everything else itself is perfect works and Ouroboros is sort of putting a sword in it if you will. In fact, the endless now/eternal recurrence may as well be Perfect Works itself and Ouroboros is Takahashi moving on from it.

Are you on a generator Rex kick or something?

All I'm thinking of is Malos joining the party and being Mio's uncle and having that dynamic. Assuming Mio is Nia's daughter, I wonder where her siblings are

Except that this is not jiving. Speaking for Xenoblade 2, at least, Torna has absolutely nothing in common with XB3's party. Jin's closest counterpart is *N*. He does everything for M/Lora, and then when M/Lora dies, he despairs, and then Malos/Z incite him to violence. Malos, even less so. Malos just wants to destroy. No better world on the other side, no returning to your own universe. Just oblivion. He thinks that killing "god" will erase the universe itself, forever. An end to history, in the literal sense. If Noah just wanted to end Aionios completely, then he'd match up, but the whole point is that the universe will not end, it will just be "corrected" as if nothing ever happened. The rest of Torna is even less connected - they're either unexplored, or want revenge. Nia doesn't have anything in common with Torna beyond being the same species. Amalthus, also no. Driven by hate, wants destruction... who in Xenoblade 3 has anything in common with that? Not Z, not N, not Noah's group. Xenoblade 3 isn't even about an "Endless Now" (not in how it's applied), just Z's desire to live forever, and run a perpetual war to do it. From the two nation's perspective there never was an endless now, just an endless war, and they'd die, and be replaced by completely different people, ad infinitum. A momentary, meaningless life. Even the alphabet squad aren't really permanent, outside XYZ. It's a half-baked metaphor for the daily grind, I guess, but it barely functions as that.

I still think having Egil as a party member would have been rad.

I mean, Xenoblade 1 and 2 already made me sympathise with their villains, due to how great the writing and characterisation were; Egil initially seemed like a genocidal tyrant, but then we learned why and how he became this way, and what it cost him. We saw him accept his defeat and going to accept the handshake initiated by the main character, his former enemy; we saw him protect his former enemies when a greater foe appears, and die doing so. Heck, we even see what made Zanza the evil, uncaring god he is. We saw the torment Malos went through since being resonated by one as twisted as Amalthus, and how chummy he could be with friends who shared his views - he's not a genocidal maniac by choice, his mind having been poisoned by Amalthus. Same with Jin; he was initially calm and disliking violence, but accepting that it's necessary to protect those he cares about, and wanted nothing more than to remain by Lora's side - that chance being torn away from him, along with not wanting to forget Lora (and thus the unholy act that allows a Blade like him to persist after his Driver's death), broke him, leading him to eventually join his former enemy. 3...doesn't. It kinda does with with Consul J, but he doesn't appear nearly enough to be as impactful as Egil, or even Xord. Most Moebius are optional, appearing for each Hero's Quest and sometimes their Ascension Quest, meaning they never get fleshed out. Consul D is a Mumkhar expy, but he's just nowhere near as memorable as Metal Face was. N is extremely similar to Jin in a multitude of ways, but he doesn't appear enough to stand out - in 2, you got to explore the ancient ship with Jin (and Malos) on your side, at the very beginning of the game, and we see him interacting with other members of Torna throughout the game, along with suffering from his actions and choices. N, meanwhile, does get screentime for a fair bit of the game, but not until quite a bit into the adventure, and after being defeated on top of the Agnian Castle he just sits and mopes and isn't seen much at all until partway through Origin, for his final boss fight. As for 3 and its predecessor's villains, they aren't mentioned at all, which is unfortunate - Melia never brings up how the Ferronises and Levnises are essentially Faced Mechon and regular Mechon, for example, and Nia makes a veiled and oblique reference to Klaus during the Maktha Wildwood scene required to unlock her Ascension Quest, but nothing more. I just find 3 quite disappointing, honestly, in that despite supposedly being a meld of 1 and 2's worlds not enough references are made to those much better games (it doesn't help that the overall gameplay experience is less interesting than either predecessor, as well).