I Was Wrong About Champion Pools

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Coach Curtis

Coach Curtis

Күн бұрын

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Пікірлер: 371
@sinthorias
@sinthorias Жыл бұрын
Character development: after years of coaching league, Curtis realizes that people learn better if they're having fun.
@illusry7631
@illusry7631 Жыл бұрын
he just means that before he used to say the real fun begins with champion mastery, and to try to stick it out with champs that dont feel 'fun' at first. bc some simpler champs can be considered better for learning fundamentals. and now his point is if its not your style and youre not initially interested and having fun with them, you will struggle. but i get youre prolly just being sarcastic
@sinthorias
@sinthorias Жыл бұрын
@@illusry7631 yea, just a joke
@boserbischof1178
@boserbischof1178 Жыл бұрын
If only our teachers would realize this too
@ElectricKatana
@ElectricKatana Жыл бұрын
what new skill will this next character arc bring? Find out! in the next episode of MID LANE ACADEMY!!!
@juanmiguelhernandezantonet5793
@juanmiguelhernandezantonet5793 Жыл бұрын
I think this is the first time in years that I reply and vote on a comment. Genuinely laughed!
@Lilacil
@Lilacil Жыл бұрын
Something I feel doesn't get mentioned often (by anyone) is that just because a champion is 'easy' or 'hard' mechanically doesn't mean it will be for you as an individual player. A good example of what I mean is when Ornn came out I could just do his ult because I'm good with timing, but I saw many others struggle to execute it. The degree to which it was challenging varied & I'd say the same thing about someone like Zoe; some people just have a knack for it. On the other side of this though, some people will not have a fluid connection to easier champions. I consider Alistar one of the hardest champions to execute (for me) but don't struggle with something like Azir. The way you connect to different champions, and how easily they flow for *you* I think is an extremely important thing to consider when picking champions & I personally think you're shooting yourself in the foot if you don't pick champions that you already have a head start on if you're looking for quicker results.
@CoachCurtis
@CoachCurtis Жыл бұрын
Agreed. Some people automatically/naturally CLICK with a particular champ even if it doesn't really make sense on paper (due to their rank or past experiences)
@tsunika26
@tsunika26 Жыл бұрын
@@CoachCurtis yeah I full agree, it took me 200k points to get over 55% winrate on Katarina but it only took me like 10k points for Yasuo, probably also contributed to a lot by the fact that Yasuo is a lot stronger but they way the champ works just flows so well for me, probably also why I learnt Irelia pretty fast
@uotafak8479
@uotafak8479 Жыл бұрын
@@CoachCurtis That's how I picked up elise (1.4M). She's been with me since silver 4 and I am climbing my way to diamond right now for the first time, all with your help of course.
@Megan-ii4gf
@Megan-ii4gf 11 ай бұрын
Yeah people call Lux a "simple" champion but the kind of stuff I pull off on her is definitely not "simple" for other people to do. She can be extremely complex when you're playing her with solid micro.
@eriksand7553
@eriksand7553 11 ай бұрын
@@Megan-ii4gfMe when I slob on my own knob
@michaelperkin89
@michaelperkin89 Жыл бұрын
Great video. Would love to see a deep dive into lissandra much like you did with vex and galio. Your thought process and champion identity conversations are so insightful
@coolbrotherf127
@coolbrotherf127 Жыл бұрын
As an ADC player, champ pools in bot lane can be pretty weird. As everything is pretty much ranged verses ranged, I pretty much choose a champ pool that works well with different types of supports or is just fairly generic. In my experience, Tristana is probably the most independent ADC as her great mobility and burst damage means that she has safely, damage, and wave clear that allows her to stay relevant in so many situations.
@kimikophoenix356
@kimikophoenix356 11 ай бұрын
Hi Curtis and the rest of this wonderful community! I've recently gotten back into ranked after failing previous times through years before as a result of feeling like I had no talent for the game. I've definitely learned through your videos and the BBC that I was not respecting the difficulty of the game and was letting myself get demotivated after seeing friends who were learning at a much faster rate than I was. I've overcome a lot of the anxiety I had back then and have learned that I have to study and put more time into things to learn them in comparison to others. I'm currently in Bronze, but I am motivated to prove that I can become a proficient player through hard work , effort, and continual self-discovery. I apologize for the long rant before the question! I just wanted to give some background since I believe it could be relevant. I chose mid as my position and made a champion pool of Leblanc as my primary champion and Tristana as a secondary since I chose Bottom as my secondary role and wanted to have an AD champion as a secondary. I noticed Leblanc is fairly mechanically intensive, along with having a fairly high reference point on your graph, and I am wondering if it's okay to be learning the game through a champion like Leblanc at this early of a stage. I know there's no clear-cut answer, and there's a lot of factors that can come into account. Mainly, I'm just worried that I will potentially develop bad habits and ruin my ability to play her at higher ranks in the future. I appreciate any thoughts and/or advice anyone in the community might have. Keep up the great videos, coach! They've helped me become extremely excited about learning league!
@guymontag5084
@guymontag5084 9 ай бұрын
I would say focus on a single role and pick one champion you like regardless of skill requirements then pick 2-3 easy champions in the same role as fallbacks. Don't worry about AD vs AP. For instance Ahri/Lux/Vex would be a good set of characters if you like Ahri.
@slaintwice
@slaintwice Жыл бұрын
Love this vid Curtis, all of our perspectives change over time and it is refreshing for you to share yours.
@CoachCurtis
@CoachCurtis Жыл бұрын
Appreciate that man
@Userre
@Userre Жыл бұрын
Something I'd like to add from a top lane perspective is that when it comes to champ pools, class identity is incredibly important in figuring out what champions to play. For example, I main Fiora 100% and love her to death, but I also play Camille, Irelia, Shen, Jax, and I'm trying to learn Gwen a little to have a topside AP threat. Personally, that's too many champions for me so I'm only actively playing 3-4 of them. But what's important to note is that all of these champions have very similar identities: Gwen is quite similar to Fiora in gameplay while Camille, Irelia, and Jax are all stereotypical divers (and Shen is more peel oriented but can definitely dive the backline and do loads of damage). Even more importantly, all of these champs are auto attack based so learning the melee auto attack trading pattern translates to improved performance on all of them. Sure, many of these champs are mechanically quite complex, but their reference points are all quite similar which makes them more palatable to learn as a group of champions. Compare that to a top lane champ pool consisting of Gragas, Teemo, and Yorick. The overall shared skillset of these champs is pretty small and so training on one champion doesn't necessarily translate to improved performance or understanding on the others. I have no idea if what I'm saying is worth anything, but just something I wanted to add to the overall conversation :)
@Londronable
@Londronable Жыл бұрын
Yep. I love tanking. So playing both top and jungle in both cases I tend to go the tank champions. But for support I go casters. No idea why.
@riccardogiura6785
@riccardogiura6785 Жыл бұрын
I stopped playing league almost 2 years ago but I'm still watching your videos every now and then. I love your approach at coaching and how you explain league concepts. Keep going
@unlikelay
@unlikelay 3 ай бұрын
I see you, probably because curtis has a way with perspectives and analogies that makes his theories about the game applicable to real life for example.
@Victorvonbass
@Victorvonbass Жыл бұрын
Really cool video. I would love to see more in depth looks at the chart and other roles (I play mostly top, supp, jg; poppy otp) I have been trying to expand my champ pool but no one plays tank/frontline usually so I have been stuck doing it. Ive tried Ornn, Shen, Maokai and Sejuani. Still looking for good tanks into my bad matchups, but maybe tanks just can't beat champs like Sett, GP and Illaoi easily. I struggle with mid but I might have to try Galio. I can play Malz at least lol. Thank you for your content. Gg
@SunBro01
@SunBro01 Жыл бұрын
I feel lost in the game without you’re videos man Ty so much for uploding
@badhygiene6822
@badhygiene6822 Жыл бұрын
This is a great video and exactly how I make my champion pool and suggest others make theirs. I just wasn't quite as good at explaining it as you are. Keep it up Coach Curtis!
@tempasdiz1j
@tempasdiz1j Жыл бұрын
good shit coach love your work keep pumping vids and sessions
@DoodleBubble50
@DoodleBubble50 Жыл бұрын
Thanks a lot Curtis, as always everything you explain is fascinating and really helpful (: I wish you could give us details in an other video concerning the reference point complexity /mechanical complexity and the way you consider every mid champs. For example, I feel like Syndra and Orianna - wich I play a lot - have a very close champion identity, but maybe Syndra is more mechanically demanding and can play for ganks and skirmishes quite ok as, in another hand, Orianna really needs the game to be played around her spikes and wants to slow down the pace of the game and make it as structured as possible, wich is a skill in itself. Also, it would be absolutely lovely to get more informations from you about "player identity". For example, as a very skillshot oriented mage player and range/poke accustomed, the only assassin I feel comfortable with is Zed, probably because he pokes and gets a lot of reward from hiting Qs. Finally (I promise this is my last suggestion ^^), I would really love you to go deeper with the concept of "covering multiple bases". The champions I like to play are Orianna, Syndra, Zoe, Vel'Koz, Zed and Azir. I wonder - let's say for the next season - about picking Orianna as a scaling control mage, Zoe as an early/mid mage that plays more agressive and can roam or impact skirmishes, and maybe Vel'Koz as a pocket pick I feel comfortable with, but I'm really not sure about this. As a french, I hope my english is understandable (I did my best, litteraly). Have a great time coach, see you next time (;
@TIRapi1993
@TIRapi1993 Жыл бұрын
Great concepts! I "unstuck" myself playing zilean mid only. Even though i was winning a lot these games felt so boring. I´d rather stay stuck forever than play another game on zilean lol
@CoachCurtis
@CoachCurtis Жыл бұрын
That's for sure hahaha
@mrgamingpanda16
@mrgamingpanda16 Жыл бұрын
My main pool right now is viktor zoe and yone. I like to have an ad pick, control mage, and a burst mage. For some reason Champs like zoe and yone took me maybe 10 games to get used to them and I feel extremely confident in lane with them. But the viktor took me weeks to be able to use but he's such a good blind pick compared to the others I feel like it was worth it. I feel like the agency and chaos I have with zoe is just unmatched and it really throws the enemy team off. One bubble on a carry through a wall has led me to so many victories. And the mispositioning is very high in my elo so I get a lot of free bubbles in lane and otherwise. I think it also helps zoe having such a low pick rate a lot of people are not comfortable in that match up. I've mainly been playing her recently. I put a large priority on enjoying my Champs when I main them. When they get stale I go learn another. I've been much stronger in matches knowing what they are trying to get out of the lane and when they aren't getting that.
@stone1719
@stone1719 Жыл бұрын
Went from hardstuck Plat 4 for around 5 years to Diamond 1 quickly in EUW using your material. Appreciate all your videos - accepting I was the issue with different aspects of my game, instead of blaming others for 'what they could of done' has fixed my mentalilty and given me a holistic view of the game to really build on what is going well and why + what is not and how it can be developed. Jumped from Diamond 4 to Diamond 1 in like 2 weeks, which really surprised me, considering my blockade at Plat 4 - all thanks to you!
@Klauskunze99
@Klauskunze99 10 ай бұрын
I ❤ that you’re the type of coach that can change his mind on certain beliefs when you encounter new information from other areas, e.g. Piano lessons.
@kevlarsweetheart9272
@kevlarsweetheart9272 Жыл бұрын
Hi, coach. Would you consider completing that chart and posting it in Twitter or something? I got really interested in it and would love to see it in full form. Cheers from Brazil!
@elessar6950
@elessar6950 Жыл бұрын
This. As a top laner it could be pretty helpful
@CoachCurtis
@CoachCurtis Жыл бұрын
I can look into that and post it in the community section
@d4s0n282
@d4s0n282 Жыл бұрын
@@elessar6950 did this ever get posted at all?
@andrewwong8483
@andrewwong8483 Жыл бұрын
16:23 +1 agree with having a core champion identity. Until you pointed out the concrete example, I hadn’t internalized it. I used to be split between diana and veigar, but after fully committing veigar I’ve been climbing a lot better. The philosophical approach you take is quite interesting, since most KZfaqrs just talk about technicals or decision making
@Iced_Capper
@Iced_Capper Жыл бұрын
This is very true, I've dumbed my pool down to Akshan, Twisted fate, and now looking for a complex champ (Between Sylas or Ekko since he got a great buff) but before I used to do Yasuo, Katarina and Zed lol it was brutal to keep up with their mechanics especially when I didn't play one of them for a couple of days
@ahhanahhan6749
@ahhanahhan6749 Жыл бұрын
I would say go with ekko but i may be a bit biased cause i main ekko lol. But tbf hes in a much better spot than sylas on account of him getting buffed and sylas getting nerfed. Ekko also provides viability to a wider variety of playstyles as compared to sylas imo.
@lefroste6370
@lefroste6370 Жыл бұрын
i feel like akshan is more mechanically complex than ekko ,ekko is kind of simple both macro and micro
@CoachCurtis
@CoachCurtis Жыл бұрын
It's crazy how much of a difference it makes immediately in your journey
@subhanvasanth8292
@subhanvasanth8292 Жыл бұрын
@@ahhanahhan6749 Ekko is not better than sylas and hasn’t been since before durability lol
@ahhanahhan6749
@ahhanahhan6749 Жыл бұрын
@@subhanvasanth8292 Sure he isnt
@blackhawk2671
@blackhawk2671 Жыл бұрын
Amazing video, lots of things I could see myself in, I'm sure it'll be helpful
@dharma4248
@dharma4248 10 ай бұрын
A few months ago I began maining Shaco support and have gained over 400 lp with it. A huge part of climbing for me was the volume of games I became willing to play once I had a champ that was extremely fun for me. Before finding a fun main I struggled to play more than ~6 ranked games a week, and that volume makes gaining rank extremely slow, even at a very high win rate. My WR didn't really change, or even fell slightly, when I switched to Shaco. My game volume has increased massively though, and this has allowed me to climb at a pace that feels rewarding.
@reidmock2165
@reidmock2165 10 ай бұрын
My two mains are Kog'Maw and Azir. I'm best at Kog'Maw, and I usually prefer him, but sometimes I want to play something more mentally stimulating so I swap in Azir. The two champions are different enough to keep me focused over the long run; I'm less likely to autopilot my games. One of the reasons I like Kog'Maw so much is because of how different his playstyle is depending on if you build AP or AD and what role you play him in; AP Kog mid moonlights as an artillery mage while AD Kog bot is a teamfight-focused hypercarry through and through. As for Azir, I just like how he can do a little bit of everything. He has mobility, self peel, burst, sustained DPS, waveclear, splitpush potential, late-game scaling, poke/lane bully capability, etc. He's also low key viable in the toplane if you ever get bored of mid. Also I'm addicted to attack speed so that's certainly a factor. I occasionally play Singed whenever I'm in the mood to commit some warcrimes.
@stefanmeyer6985
@stefanmeyer6985 Жыл бұрын
Hey Curtis! Nice video and thanks for your thoughts on this one. I think there is an inherent trade-off between player identity and niche filling champ pool. If my playstyle is assassin, my champ pool will reflect that, but champs in this pool will share the weaknesses of assassins in general, meaning I can only compensate so much for the giant niche they are not filling. On the other side, if I have a small but diverse champ pool, say an assassin, a mage and a tank I minimized the niche, but can not exploit the benefits of my player identity. My 2 cents. Thanks for the video! (Ps. The graph was very illustrative, though I am wondering what negative mechanical complexity represents :P)
@kevlarsweetheart9272
@kevlarsweetheart9272 Жыл бұрын
I think the idea here isn't "negative", but "average". Let's imagine you quantify a champion's complexity on a scale from 0 to 100. The line that divides the two sections is the average (i.e. 50) and then you have an idea of the champion's complexity in relation to others.
@stefanmeyer6985
@stefanmeyer6985 Жыл бұрын
@@kevlarsweetheart9272 That sure makes sense, and the relational aspect of the graph is clear, I agree :) Just wanted to mock our good coach a bit.
@ronaldramirez9975
@ronaldramirez9975 Жыл бұрын
I think this depend on your focus objetive: if you play similar champs with diferent niches like vicktor\cassio you are developing similar skills and yes you have the same weaknesses but you are also developing the same skills so you will be learning the same way of playing the game no matter which of the two you are playing, so de focuse would be learning this set of skills for your type of players. on the other way around if your pool have 3 completly difrent types of champ you will be basicly learning diferent skill sets with each one, and yes that on paper sound good cuz you are learning a lot of difrent things, but actually you are going slow in all 3, beside at the end the type of player you are will dictate the way you will behave, if the playstyle of the champ is difrent you will be playing wrong so at least for me it really confuse my learning, so I think this would be the I just have to win way. just my opinion! thanks for reading !
@Amaling
@Amaling Жыл бұрын
What I'm currently doing is polishing out a pool of champs that fits an assassin mindset, but also being versatile for team comps. This has led to me looking for champions that prioritize flanks, but not just assassins. And my saviors been Vex, since she's absolutely looking for those backline one-shot flanks, but she also has a stable mage laning phase, and if you really need her to can play a more front to back Liandry's role. You'd definitely be better off playing an actual front to back mage which have hard to dodge spells, but hey there's tradeoffs. Another which I'm experimenting on but less sure of is Ahri, before the rework she definitely fit the Assassin mindset more, now she's looking for flanks, but unless disgustingly ahead needs assistance from her teammates which she helps set up. And of course there's no shortage of AD champs to take if you have an assassin player identity. If you really want to commit to the assassin mindset, obviously there's not a straight up front to back mage you can pick, but it's definitely possible to get creative.
@ThePsiGuard
@ThePsiGuard Жыл бұрын
This tradeoff happens often, but it doesn't always have to. You can have purposes for each champion in your pool without picking drastically different playstyles. Examples of similar champions that can serve different purposes in your pool: Zed - Physical damage (let's say this is your main) Ekko - Similar to Zed, but magic damage Diana - Bigger emphasis on group fights All three of these champions are bursty assassin-type mid laners with wave clear and strong ultimates, but they aren't totally interchangeable.
@endi3192
@endi3192 Жыл бұрын
My current mid champ pool: Pantheon, Vex, Aurelion, and Ahri.. they are relatively fun to me and i used to one trick the old Asol so it was refreshing to experience this curiosity element by relearning the new kit even though it is not very complex i have a total of 210 games playing them and 59 winrate
@xkavvu9545
@xkavvu9545 Жыл бұрын
I've never agreed with the two tricking thing as it makes the game feel like a job. End of the day, it's a game. It's for fun. Love this character arc btw
@CoachCurtis
@CoachCurtis Жыл бұрын
Spot on mate
@HanyuuHOLO
@HanyuuHOLO Жыл бұрын
It depends on the person though, I mostly play Akali and Cassio and I have a blast. At the end of the day, you have some secondary role games to play other champs anyway.
@Megan-ii4gf
@Megan-ii4gf 11 ай бұрын
I would just pick Lux, but since she'd get banned and picked a lot, I'd go into Orianna as a secondary. I got really good on both, I played both in mid and support, and my ability to play them makes me able to absolutely destroy anyone who picks them against me nowdays. I really love those champs, and that's why I stuck to them. I've moved on to Leona now, and I can play Nami, Lulu, Morgana, Sona, and Karma really well. I've got a lot of experience playing them all the past three years. I had a lot of experience with Kassadin, Malzahar, Viktor, and Katarina during my mid maining days, three to ten years ago, so I can play against them very effectively too. I was still a two-trick, even though I had extensive experience with over a dozen champions, it's really just about what you enjoy playing at the time, and moving on to the next thing.
@TwistedTeaFate
@TwistedTeaFate Жыл бұрын
With the preseason changes and RoA coming back, I very much think TF will be meta again. I'd love to see you update your guide on him!
@pax1913
@pax1913 Жыл бұрын
Oh man, we can only wish!
@CoachCurtis
@CoachCurtis Жыл бұрын
Yeah I spoke a bit about this during the upcoming Broken By Concept episode. Make sure to tune in
@turretop5675
@turretop5675 3 ай бұрын
I was a mid lane otp'ing a champ for a long time and it was mostly fine. However I started playing more top during the last year and immediately noticed I could not reliably do the same up there. I have a very vast champion pool that I'm very comfortable with now (around 15 champs) and a few tricks I've been following was to have a decent amount of easy champs to play, helps learning faster and prevents spending too much time building your pool. Have a decent amount of ap/ad/tanky champions for various situations. Learn champions that do not all get counterpicked by the same champions, and lastly get a few safe blind picks.
@csashta
@csashta 14 күн бұрын
I have been playing for almost a year, as an ADC first, during a few months, and then as a support. I tried multiple champs, again and again, and I felt just so bad. At some point, I found out that Zyra was very good to climb (I wasn't playing ranked but my duo was, and I thought that we might play together at some point). I found guides made by an OTP, they really helped me understand the champ. However, I was and still am bad at dealing damage (poke is still very easy with Zyra) and the champ felt somewhat wrong. I started to try again various champs, but my duo had decided to play ADC with me (main jungle) and he told me that I had to pick a pool with basically 1 engage, 1 enchanter and 1 mage, which I did. At that point, I felt useless on the game, whatever I was doing. My ADC was also commenting a lot on my every moves, and... I really lack confidence and self esteem, IG and IRL, so it was not helping. We talked and he diminished his comments. And I don't know why, I decided I wanted to try Milio. I had kind of an affinity with enchanters, but had never found any that "felt good", like I was actually useful. Milio is really expensive, I felt like it was a bet and a last resort situation. Turns out, I really liked him. I was bad, but it felt good. So I started to pick him exclusively, which is good since it's rare to see him. I started to become better, actually better. I saw posts on reddit saying the champ is bad, felt bad, questioned my choices, but it felt good to I kept playing him. Then, I started convincing lots of players that my boy is gold, and it felt amazing. Anyway, Milio is my special champ. I love hearing him say "You can do it, Milio!", it actually motivated me in game. I like running everywhere, even if I am too often missposed. I like helping everyone, sometimes more than they imagine. I love when enemies chase me around the whole map and never catch me because my shield gives me MS and my ball bump them. I started to get more assists (that I deserve) and die less. However, I had developed habits linked to the character and my playstyle. And as I looked at all the bad habits, I realized I needed to diversify my picks to keep getting better. I also wanted to feel more proactive, but my own habits prevented me from doing it with him. I kind of started to resent him for that (I know, weird). So, I started to go back on trying champs, very recently. I like enchanters, so I gave a second chance to a lot of champs. Milio has helped me to gain some confidence, and I can now better play other champs, even though I still have my flaws (a lot of flaws). It feels so good to try other champs. I have started with champs that remind me of Milio for various reasons. I have tried to play champs with skillshots as I'd like to play hookers one day, and found out that Milio's q has helped me in that way. I still haven't found exactly what I want to play, but Milio is my feel good choice (though I try to take him when his kit is going to shine more). I am currently not ready to play engage. I have tried more mage-y poky champs because I want to work on that, but engage... I have a big mental block: I am going to go everything wrong, have everybody get killed, etc. etc. I know you have to try to learn, but it is actually stressful to me, more than the game currently is for me. So, I just can't, and that's ok, as long as I am having fun! Nobody is going to read that, but it actually felt good to write it ☺️
@SeloTSM
@SeloTSM Жыл бұрын
Was not expecting to get an advice about why I "stuck" in my piano "journey" here, but it turned out to be very helpful, thanks)
@shojinsensei
@shojinsensei Жыл бұрын
I actually struggle more with simple champions than complex champions, because I like to have options to utilize. I used to be a normal game lee sin otp for my first two years, so I rarely have struggle with mechanics. Now I'm support main and my favorite champions are Rakan, Thresh, Bard and Renata.
@Shuvi279Error
@Shuvi279Error Жыл бұрын
well that explains why i enjoy sion and lissandra as a 2nd choice pick as an azir otp
@ElectricKatana
@ElectricKatana Жыл бұрын
on the topic of the one trick portion i'm a zed one trick because he's the only champion i fine particularly attractive to play and whos identity I understand to a degree where its fun for me
@derpyefalant478
@derpyefalant478 Жыл бұрын
Nice vid. In the Smash scene, not only do we recommend easy-to-pick characters, but we also prioritize having fun with the character the most. I do like to see include how difficult their character could be, but that’s their journey, not mine. 😅
@CoachCurtis
@CoachCurtis Жыл бұрын
LOVE IT! Smash is ahead of the learning meta, that's for sure
@RA-LT
@RA-LT Жыл бұрын
Hi coach, any chance of you drawing a graphic like this for other roles ? It's really helpful
@Phonix-uh8bo
@Phonix-uh8bo Жыл бұрын
Wow amazing video. I do have a question. I am a support main, I feel very comfortable with engaging tanks should I only stick to engage champion for my identity. Even though supports have other important identities such as enchanter and mages which can complete a team comp. Is it better to stick with one identity or be well rounded in two identities as a support player?
@pacomemanceron-delcombel1248
@pacomemanceron-delcombel1248 Жыл бұрын
Very interesting video both humanly and from the game prospective.
@sreal-iron5898
@sreal-iron5898 Жыл бұрын
i somehow benefitted on my career choices by watching this xd you are amazing man
@sachmet92
@sachmet92 Жыл бұрын
Honestly I wish I watched this a bit earlier. I always wanted to have ad assassin (Viktor player) in my pool but just couldn't click with the role. Then Galio was popular and I immediately clicked with his indetity. Kinda makes sense now
@swagmaster9294
@swagmaster9294 Жыл бұрын
ayyyyyy another coach curtis vid, huuuuuge
@thgink9wannabe360
@thgink9wannabe360 Жыл бұрын
Hello, Coach Curtis, what do You think about Syndra rework? Maybe little guide or video about her? :)
@iJonDon
@iJonDon Жыл бұрын
Bro your videos are the best I’m a Wild rift player but I watch your videos
@Terwilliger2
@Terwilliger2 6 ай бұрын
I'm in the process of swapping from being a Jhin OTP to a midlaner, and I'm having a lot of fun ruining these diamond 3 games at the end of the season. Having a lot of fun with Hwei, Viktor, Ori, and Syndra, but my sense of roaming is beyond weak. You mentioned that having extremely similar champs isn't ideal, however. I'm unsure on what champions I should use to cover all of my bases, especially skills such as sidelane roams, punishing wave neutralizers (Talon/Lux), and helping out the jungler in the early 2v2s. What champion should I pick up? Right now I'm considering TF, Taliyah, and Vex, but I'm unsure on which one is worth learning for the long term. Also, your videos explaining the basics are really helping me get started with mid, and they're carrying the hell out of my notebook. Thanks for all you do.
@sebespenshade681
@sebespenshade681 Жыл бұрын
rn my 2 favorite champions are Ryze and Viktor, an those are basically the only two I play aside from Renekton top and Fiddle jungle, do the two of them cover enough bases for my mid pool or should I add another champion?
@happycamperds9917
@happycamperds9917 Жыл бұрын
Who would you recommend for Vel'Koz? I've been trying to learn Zilean to counter assassins.
@raize8222
@raize8222 Жыл бұрын
I LOVE zilean mid 1m on it and still find fun every single game with it
@poi9784
@poi9784 Жыл бұрын
When I started I really struggled with laning and got filled into jungle so much I said f it I main jungle now this was 2 years ago and I am now mostly a top laner. I still have the feeling of wanting to pick up mid again, sadly I don't click much with the mid lane champs in play style. (I am a Poppy/Lillia two trick wanting to add Gwen as my 3rd champ)
@Skiqz
@Skiqz Жыл бұрын
I love playig: pyke and sylas in mid and recently I started having fun with Qiyana and Zoe, do you think Zoe will fit in my pool? I thought maybe cuz Zoe is kinda a burst champ and it might be good to have a ranged champ in my pool.
@MrSemmyBoy
@MrSemmyBoy Жыл бұрын
Thanks for your video! Could you tell me how to look up good complementary champions to a specific main Champ? For me I´m training myself to a Taliyah Mid Main One Trick, but at the moment its hard for to find a second champs thats easy to play when Taliyah gets banned. Thanks!
@cassianojahn597
@cassianojahn597 10 ай бұрын
The fun aspect is really important, I can really play tanks and mages very well, But I love assassins, and maybe i shouldnt go for assassins, but that what I like
@Andrew.Downing
@Andrew.Downing Жыл бұрын
Does the concept of player identity apply to support as well? For example would I be fine as being an "enchanter" player with two core enchanters and cycling enchanters? Or is this a mid only thing?
@cameronsmith1229
@cameronsmith1229 Жыл бұрын
I've loved this channel for so long and I just moved to mid lane on my team, I'm really excited to to start applying these videos to my games.
@Londronable
@Londronable Жыл бұрын
I rose quickly back when I was trying to climb by a simple Hecarim jungle. Rush 6, gank when possible, R when my team is around me and I see somebody solo. Ideal? No. But good enough to get to low Diamond. Also even if you want to play more complex champs climbing, go for it. But it's always good to have a very simple champion. Not every time you play you're going to be 100%. Sometimes you want to play just for some fun and in a more relaxed way. Having a very simple champ can be a good idea. I love Malz mid on occasion. It's calming and low stress.
@atsukana1704
@atsukana1704 7 ай бұрын
What is your thought process on champ pools for secondary roles? Is the quiyanna/or problem still present? I would really like to see more of what you think about how different is just right and not enough or too different. What I understand of it from this video is you would say try to pick from similar roles like assassin or mage, but when are they too similar?
@alexanderelmore8684
@alexanderelmore8684 Жыл бұрын
Hey Curtis is there any way you would be willing to link a better graph of where you would put complex vs simple champs? I don't know how complex I would set champs as so it is hard to make intelligent decisions on this. Thanks a bunch!!!
@swat26X
@swat26X Жыл бұрын
Wow! I do this naturally and have felt guilty not being disciplined keeping to the same champion pool season by season. This was great to hear and confidence improving. Great video
@itorres008
@itorres008 Жыл бұрын
Many people in different context use the term "fundamentals" loosely without a real explanation of what it means or "they" mean. Would be nice to hear your view. It could also give people a prioritized list of what to work on as they develop.
@panophobia8527
@panophobia8527 Жыл бұрын
Hey Curtis. You recommended playing only 3 Champs in Plat. So should i have 1 main and 2 complementarys / 2 Mains and 1 complementary then? I also have kind of a problem deciding what to choose. Espacially considering player identity. I was a katarina otp when she got reworked. I loved the rework and wanted still wanted to play her all the time, but she got permabanned after the rework. So I started playing viktor and he became my new main. Now kat and viktor are my 2 best champions by far. So for developing a player identity I guess I should decide for only one of them and pick other champions that match. But I don't really want to, because I like both... :D
@thehallmonitor4515
@thehallmonitor4515 Жыл бұрын
Something that works well for me is having 3 champions as a jungler. I have a blue side (one that prefers red buff so I can get a bot lane leash), and red side champ with one that is flex that doesn't really have a preference or can easily clear with no leash.
@marouanechetoui347
@marouanechetoui347 Жыл бұрын
I dont quite understand the idea of complementary champs , I am a main talon should I add champs that have similar identity to talon (early aggressive laning , roaming assassin ) or should I look for champions that has the opposite (what talon lacks : late game and utility)?
@stylushandle
@stylushandle Жыл бұрын
Hello Curtis. While learning a small pool of similar champions might be best for climbing, is there a long term benefit to learning champions that exist on opposite ends of the spectrum? To use your chart, would two tricking Twisted Fate and Lucian lead to a better understanding of the game as a whole? Thank you.
@CoachCurtis
@CoachCurtis Жыл бұрын
In theory yes, but not many people can actively learn two styles at once. From what I've seen in my coaching, people who attempt to play for example a hardcore mage like Orianna AND an assassin like Akali, struggle.
@tristan6773
@tristan6773 Жыл бұрын
rn my champ pool is akali and kassadin. i’m thinking of adding another champ and I was looking at Zed and yone. I think I have more fun with Zed so i’m gonna go with him
@CogumeloDourado
@CogumeloDourado Жыл бұрын
Hey coach, what would u say about a champion pool, looking like Fizz, Sylas and then cycling 2 simple champs
@meiti2000
@meiti2000 Жыл бұрын
At what elo would you say it's ok to not have a player identity? I feel like eventually you need to play different champs as you will miss out on some fundamentals by only playing a certain type of champ. For example if you only play melee assassins, you wont know how to punish people going for cs. Or if you play scaling mages, you wont know how to roam as well. Would you say masters+ is when you can play drastically different champions like zed/ori? Or would you wait until you get even higher?
@SquishyCatOnApex
@SquishyCatOnApex Жыл бұрын
Iron
@ogaimon3380
@ogaimon3380 Жыл бұрын
there is no reason to not know how to punish people juat because you play melee,the higher the elo the more knowledge of the game you hold regardless of what you play,people hit challenger playing 1champ and knowing more than people playing 10
@CoachCurtis
@CoachCurtis Жыл бұрын
I don't think you ever really NEED to play multiple styles unless you are planning on going pro. Sure it's optimal if you can later on in your journey post D2+, but its not always necessary
@vasilivanov1951
@vasilivanov1951 Жыл бұрын
We have removed summoner names in legendary ranked wild rift and people are more focused on the game and type less.
@DilanChauhan
@DilanChauhan Жыл бұрын
Hi Curtis, what made you come to this realisation? Just curious mate. Great video!
@hamzasaidi7510
@hamzasaidi7510 Ай бұрын
It's funny how this video showed on my recommended page after I switched from peak d2 fiora otp to learning mages 22% wr bouncing from plat3 to emerald4 and I've never had more fun in my life despite losing almost every game
@markusminny9472
@markusminny9472 Жыл бұрын
hi Curtis, just some clarification please... when talking about identity and then covering multiple bases. how i understand it is obviously dont pick champs that are polar opposites. but why is ori viktor syndra an overlap, and "similar" (cuz of how they play in lane? or later in teamfights) and viktor cassio vex / ahri veigar vex is a spread? is it only cause of their playstyles? please clarify thanks Im thinking maybe pick each one if your team lacks something?
@markusminny9472
@markusminny9472 Жыл бұрын
for instance if i choose a pool of lux , vex and lissandra why would it be good or bad
@Rocman55
@Rocman55 Жыл бұрын
"Don't get too bogged down on the details" says the coach of a podcast that endlessly preaches "Get into the details!" 🤪 But in all seriousness, I was JUST thinking about MY champion pool and how to build a strong foundation as I start pushing for higher elo and this was EXACTLY what I needed. Thanks!
@nyte38
@nyte38 Жыл бұрын
Hey Coach, i like to play Viktor and Cassio a lot. I learned Mid Lane with Veigar with 190 games and 60% wr now. My Acc is midnyte on EUW. I reached Plat4 now my goal is to play higher skill cap champs like Viktor and Cassio. But it feels like i have no Answer to Champs who counter both of my champs. Now im thinking about what to pick as a 3rd Champion. I think Vex is a good one, but i dont like her. Are there other alternatives you would recommend? Thanks a lot!!!!
@nyte38
@nyte38 Жыл бұрын
​ @Coach Curtis can you please say something to it?
@tofdijulian6542
@tofdijulian6542 Жыл бұрын
As a silver/gold player, I don‘t completely understand which of the champions in my pool overlap or are too far away from one another so that I can‘t transfer skills (as in the ori/qiyana example): Galio, Xerath, Viktor, Ziggs are the picks I „mained“ in my ranked time with the secondaries I rotated in- and out being Annie, Seraphine, Vex and Malzahar. With my current experimentation with Ahri, what would be good combinations of three champs?
@CorpseGodX
@CorpseGodX Жыл бұрын
Almost all the Champs you named are artillery makes with the exceptions of Galio(ap bruiser/tank) Annie(strictly burst mage) and vex(control mage with burst mage undertones) as a fellow mid laner who is basically your opposite, I mained almost exclusively ad Champs mid I recommend you put a Champ with a different damage type in your pool personally I recommend pantheon super good , easy to play multiple rune options and multiple build paths as well
@dixcn
@dixcn Жыл бұрын
Hey Curtis, do you have the full completed graph with all mid champs in it?
@CoachCurtis
@CoachCurtis Жыл бұрын
Not now, but I can
@ZacChambers22
@ZacChambers22 Жыл бұрын
If my core 2 champions are Xerath and Cassio, what are good complementary champs to fill out my pool?
@ChimkinSendwich
@ChimkinSendwich Жыл бұрын
What if your player identity is assassins and enemy team has a lot of tanks or cc? Are you just screwed or you should have a random cassio in your pool?
@CernnuOneDesign
@CernnuOneDesign 9 ай бұрын
i mostly play 3 champs that are viktor syndra and cassio and i notice i stuck too much (im silver elo) which one you suggest me to move :( and save it for later when im better im struggling if go for galio or vex
@azeva01
@azeva01 9 ай бұрын
just play whatevers fun and drop whatever isnt
@BobFudgee
@BobFudgee Жыл бұрын
This is why i your my favorite league tuber. Not only are you willing to admit when you were wrong but you expand on it and learn from it and help us from it
@StrawbeVi
@StrawbeVi Жыл бұрын
where would neeko be placed in the reference point complexity x mechanical complexity?
@elias1670
@elias1670 Жыл бұрын
hey man , just joined the waitlist for your coaching , how long would yu estimate the wait would be ? been climbing like crazy on cass but seem to have hit a wall , keep getting teammates that are just not the best in all honesty ill go 18-4 and still lose , I know theres more I can do and learn to carry even harder and look forward to coaching , any kind of reply would be awesome mane.
@CoachCurtis
@CoachCurtis Жыл бұрын
There is an opening this week, stay tuned in your emails :)
@elias1670
@elias1670 Жыл бұрын
@@CoachCurtis awesome ! stayin hopeful .
@jeymy2736
@jeymy2736 Жыл бұрын
Nice video, do you think as a g2 ori main who plans on learning syndra after I hit plat 4 I am better off just playing ori because both champs are really similar or do you think its okay to add syndra to my pool, I also considered adding ahri but I would prefer syndra.
@Pfannkuchenkanone
@Pfannkuchenkanone Жыл бұрын
Syndra
@SamBsound
@SamBsound Жыл бұрын
On the topic of fun, one thing Syndra has right now is a novelty buff. She's new and fresh and that makes her a puzzle players want to solve. It also means you'll be getting banned a lot and actually getting your hands on the champ will be more difficult. I'm not curtis and ain't pretending to know as much as he does but am Diamond and have experience playing amateur. Due to the fact that Syndra and Orianna are fairly similar, you may be able to pick her up quickly. You could cycle between them. You might need an overlap phase while you learn Syndra, but in the long term, it will actually benefit you a lot IMO. You've now got 2 champions to chose from that serve a similar purpose. And hey, Orianna isn't in the best spot right now, playing a new champ could be a breath of fresh air.
@CoachCurtis
@CoachCurtis Жыл бұрын
I'd personally recommend sticking to orianna and playing champs with a differing identity. Syndra is a little TOO similar imo
@reshh3h3
@reshh3h3 Жыл бұрын
what's that thing you use to draw I really like it :P
@milebackwards
@milebackwards Жыл бұрын
I'm a player that almost always plays mechanical simple champs. I play Sej, Maokai and Garen most of the time for top lane as the "core champ" but still managed to have fun in games. I usually utilize some rarely known details of these champs to get advantage and win game. The feeling from outsmarting opponents is no less than from mechanical outplays.
@shgalagalaa
@shgalagalaa Жыл бұрын
Garen q spin r = out smarting the adc
@iFParasit
@iFParasit Жыл бұрын
@@shgalagalaa where is the difference of mechanically demanding champs xD if the adc mispositions so a meele can get him he outplayed himself
@rowdyperry8030
@rowdyperry8030 Жыл бұрын
​@@iFParasit I'd think the difference would be it's much easier to see the difference in mechanical prowess (or just sheer apm considering half the games combos are button mashing to begin with) between players as opposed to the higher intelligence of a garen bush play.
@tessgrossman4408
@tessgrossman4408 Жыл бұрын
Can you explain more about player identity? Does it mean playing one type of champion like fighters? Or something else?
@SquishyCatOnApex
@SquishyCatOnApex Жыл бұрын
Yes
@rustone9829
@rustone9829 Жыл бұрын
I‘ve a question, where would you categorize kassadin in the diagram?
@alexf7484
@alexf7484 Жыл бұрын
"Lucian - You're an adc you know what to do." Me: a Lucian main with no idea what I'm doing hahaha.
@NightridingDoom
@NightridingDoom 7 ай бұрын
So, what is Belveth, Lux, Shyvana, Lissandra, Tristana, Kaisa and Lissandra in terms of champion pool on the graph?
@arthurzaneti36
@arthurzaneti36 Жыл бұрын
Coach can you say exactly what reference point complexity is? I don't really understand what you mean by it, like, isn't tf a facilitator?
@stephanseljan5196
@stephanseljan5196 Жыл бұрын
Right now I love playing sylas and Irelia. My mechanics are really good. I have a fairly good grasp of the game but i am only in silver. Is it really that bad to play a few more champs in low elo? (My mechanics are also good with LB, akali, ori and TF). It feels natural to play all of these champs (to the point where i dont think about it throughout the game). What issues do you think i will face? And if there is a recommendation on a 3rd i should really focus on? Im very hardstuck but i honestly dont think its my mechanics. Personally i think my biggest issue is putting games away. I feel like i hard win lane but i dont end the game fast enough to where i might get outscaled and so on. Any comment is appreciated :)
@JustShotsForMeh
@JustShotsForMeh Жыл бұрын
No offense, but your mechanics are probably not good, I'm doing an OTP challenge in high diamond and I can confidently say my mechanics are not good in the grand scheme of things, playing against fucking monstrosities that never cancel an auto attack makes you really get a perspective on 'mechanics', I could breeze through silver in a medical coma because the game isn't as mechanical as you think, macro and correct decision making will always beat mechanics, that's how Chinese boosters get accounts from all over the globe to Masters with 150-300 ping with insane win rates. About the many different champs, if high elo players can't do it successfully, you can't do it successfully, NEACE who is another LoL coach has put it very well, I'm paraphrasing; "Think of playing a very hard Mario level, but every time you reset the level, Mario gets a different jump height and speed, monsters have varying speeds, your fireball has different speed and damage, the game would be impossible." Step 1: /mute all, nobody in the game chat will help you or say anything intelligent to improve your gameplay ESPECIALLY in silver, only you exist and only you can improve yourself, your team is randomly generated AI, some AI ints, some AI is good, some AI dies to jungle camps, doesn't matter, pinging your AI increases the chances of them understanding your intentions. Step 2: Become good AI yourself, you might ask how do good players escape lower ranks easily? They don't give a rat's ass what anybody thinks of them, they do the cold hard calculated decision in every stage of the game regardless of who whines or gets tilted, that doesn't mean you need to jack your team's farm/jungle level 3, it means to look at the game objectively and think quickly about which fights are winnable, what waves are pushable ETC... 3. To become good AI, you need to be the AI with higher statistics than the competition, and for that you need gold and EXP, the perspective you need is this; 3 minion waves is worth more than a kill, 2 plates is worth more than a kill, EXP and gold is the most important shit in the game, if you're not getting EXP and gold, you are wasting time, be more efficient, click faster, click more, be in the right place in the right time, low elo loves to get emotional and get stuck on dumb concepts like chasing a kill, split pushing for no reason, not taking a tower for free, all of this points back to step 2. Good luck Chief!
@CoachCurtis
@CoachCurtis Жыл бұрын
Sylas and Irelia are EXTREMELY hard to play, especially in silver. I'd recommend simplifying it and playing easier champs OR only playing one of the champs you mentioned and really OTPING it until gold 4
@tonyjaka
@tonyjaka Жыл бұрын
Gold player looking for a 2nd champ. Malzahar has been my only champ for awhile now. Would Vex be a good complimentary champ?
@upyonderr
@upyonderr Жыл бұрын
Is there a resource that helps with identifying champions? Like Viktor Cass and Syndra are all basically the same. I'm not as knowledgeable so I'm confused to why those 3 are considered basically the same.
@dustyacer
@dustyacer Жыл бұрын
i have the worst player identity. My M5+ from mid are Ekko, ahri, pantheon, neeko, diana, ap shyv, some soraka mid, viktor, tristana, xin zhao, ap kaisa. recently picked up zil as well. Sure lots of champs I don't like the style of anymore, but I consistently play assassins (aggro and scaling), all kind of mages pretty much, some tanks/bruisers and enchanter mids. sure dif mages play in dif ways but playing a completely dif style is very nice for me.
@namthanh9485
@namthanh9485 Жыл бұрын
When is guessing your rank video uploaded?
@faithduey6686
@faithduey6686 11 ай бұрын
where would ziggs and neeko fall on the graph? i wanted to keep my pool to ahri, ziggs, and neeko, but i dont know where they lie and i dont want to have too many complex champs in my pool
@omarhossam9200
@omarhossam9200 Жыл бұрын
Thanks coach for the amazing content I have a question As an Orianna main, which two champions can complement my weaknesses but can also help me keep a slightly similar player identity? And can an AD mid champ be one of the two or they doesn't really fit?
@chi0224
@chi0224 Жыл бұрын
I would recommend give Viktor and Zoe a try, they are pretty similar to Orianna in terms of lane bully mage play style, as for ad champions, tristana or Akshan could be a good option to start. Hope it’s any help to you, good luck on your league journey. Cheers.
@SamBsound
@SamBsound Жыл бұрын
Vex, vex, and vex. Ori is skill matchup vs most ranged champions. She loses to mobile assassins which Vex decimates, without having to greatly change your playstyle. As for AD champions it's a little more difficult. But as the previous comment suggested, Akshan 'might' work, but will take longer to master.
@omarhossam9200
@omarhossam9200 Жыл бұрын
@@chi0224 Thanks for this suggestions it really helps specially Zoe and Akshan suggestions 🙏❤️
@omarhossam9200
@omarhossam9200 Жыл бұрын
@@SamBsound Vex is an amazing suggestions thanks man 🙏♥️♥️ I will actually go for it ASAP 👌
@CoachCurtis
@CoachCurtis Жыл бұрын
I'd say champs like Vex/Galio/Liss/Veigar/Ahri/Anivia/Cassiopeia.
@nekonyla
@nekonyla 5 ай бұрын
About the champion pool complexity graph: where do Irelia, Pantheon and Neeko land there?
@mustangcody
@mustangcody Жыл бұрын
Can you update prior guides? I know some of them the mindsets, concept, and generally the playstyle is still good but league has changed. Cassiopeia/Orianna are my picks.
@CoachCurtis
@CoachCurtis Жыл бұрын
Yeah thats the plan
@tsunika26
@tsunika26 Жыл бұрын
My midlane champ pool (I’m a mechanics one trick, I can mechanically pull them all off well I just have dogshit macro 😂) Core: Katarina, Kayle Complementary: Yasuo, Zed Top lane pool: Core: Camille, Kayle Complementary: Fiora, Irelia
@L9nexah
@L9nexah Жыл бұрын
where do you think would kassadin belong? and what champs would be good to have in my champ pool next to him? rn I'm an OTP but I really want to have at least 1 or 2 champs I could play if he gets banned or picked or counterpicked. btw great video as always
@xXWorldgamefunXx
@xXWorldgamefunXx Жыл бұрын
Kassadin is counterpicked by ad midlaners like Yone, Yasuo, Akshan and Tristana. You should learn Vex because she should shit on most of them, while not being too different from Kassadin. She also wants to jump right into the enemy, land a full combo and get back out again. + she's very strong right now. Otherwise I would also recommend my first OTP Veigar if you are below diamond he is still really good and just wants to chill and scale, while being a lategame 1v5 monster. He is also really good into all these champions I mentioned and gets countered by control mages with long range. You already have the answer to that, though: Kassadin.
@L9nexah
@L9nexah Жыл бұрын
@@xXWorldgamefunXx thanks a lot! Yeah I'm plat 4 and I realise OTPing kassadin isn't the best idea
@xXWorldgamefunXx
@xXWorldgamefunXx Жыл бұрын
@@L9nexah I main tristana mid rn and I have to say keep OTPing Kassadin haha ;D its very good, trust me!
@MaxwellPerlman
@MaxwellPerlman Жыл бұрын
Low-Elo player here: love Zed and Qiyana but they fill the same role, any good picks to add to that pool that will fill in the holes?
@anaxagoras9812
@anaxagoras9812 Жыл бұрын
fizz, yasuo, ...
@urosjovanovic808
@urosjovanovic808 Жыл бұрын
Where would you place Vel'Koz on this list? Asking since I main him and Viktor mostly, sometimes LeBlanc
@SquishyCatOnApex
@SquishyCatOnApex Жыл бұрын
Bottom right
@vincentproud6589
@vincentproud6589 Жыл бұрын
I was thinking Viktor / Malz / Naafiri if i enjoy them would be a good pool. Then you hit me with the player identity. 😂
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ВСТРЕТИЛ ПОУ В ЗАКУЛИСЬЕ Garry's mod
19:18
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Рет қаралды 239 М.