LOL 😂 : how did his Revelation changes turn out ? A: CURSED!

​​@@davidjanbaz7728where are these plagues, that the book of revelation promises to someone adding or removing words, apparent in Joseph's life? Dying is not the same as having specific curses that are predicted in a prophetic book. They were absent in some miraculous way, if he supposedly was violating God's will and going against a promised specific curse.

Do you have any source for this I don't see any evidence for this

@@sheepinwolfesclothing. I know there have been studies done on the subject but the one example that comes to mind is Isaiah 2:16. The BoM adds “all the ships of the sea” to the KJV of “ships of tarshish and pleasant pictures”. I’m paraphrasing. I don’t have it in from of me. But “all the ships of the sea” is in the Septuagint.

@@sammoon67 i just read a direct version of the dead sea scroll translation, KJV has the correct translation. Do you have a video or study your referencing?

That's the problem, so many people stop digging after reading the CES letter and end up being fooled. Glad you kept going!

I agree. My concerns have been resolved, and my testimony is stronger than ever. Opposition in all things.

Exactly me too, read it, researched it and debunked it, and my testimony is stronger than ever now!

These comments make me happy to hear❤

Where did you find the document? Just a Google search?

Things like, endure to the end; attend sacrament regularly; serve in the Temple for your kindred dead; and many others are not mistakes by any modern prophet. If you throw them away, you have overstepped the mark. What few mistakes there would be are not enough to throw the baby out with the bath water. Stay on the covenant path.

Let me get this straight, some random dude wrote a bible fan fiction with his head in a hat based on treasure guarding spirits and magic rocks, and a bunch of people put their faith in him and let him marry 40 of their wives and daughters? Think of the harm people. That random dude was exploiting people for sex, money, and power. The CES letter only helps shine a light on the things a 200 Billion dollar megachurch would prefer to hide from their general membership so tithing keeps flowing. Which document sounds more reasonable? That's a tough one. See how easy it is to write a couple exaggerated sentences and make it sound crazy? I believe what I wrote above, but it is entirely without context and makes it sound much crazier than reality. That's what you did with the CES letter.

Don’t judge someone’s merits by how “random” they are. Judge them in accordance to the content they share & probably how they apply it. And I don’t think it’s fair to say he’s “leading people away from Christ”. Following him is a personal decision & endeavor. Reading a book or practicing a religion is only one way to do it.

Underrated comment

LDS Discussions is the answer from you then :)

Your answer doesn't lie with man. Only God can make clear, even though he requires us to make a huge effort to see on our own. Man's premise is that all is false, but with God all is truth. Where then should we look?

I’ve personally had it witnessed to me by the Holy Spirit through a friend that this is the true church. I’d love to talk about that experience if you’d like :)

Turn your heart towards Jesus. Read His words in the gospel of John. He is speaking directly to you. Give your heart to Him and He alone will show you the way. His way.

@tomjones3901 I agree, and if I hadn't, I would know less and be less than I am today. Jesus is the way as in gatekeeper and the way as in exemplar.

^_^ Great ! Maybe you can help me understand : Brigham Young said : You see some classes of the human family that are BLACK, uncouth, uncomely, DISAGREEABLE and low in their habits, wild, and seemingly deprived of nearly all the blessings of the INTELLIGENCE that is generaly bestowed upon mankind... Cain slew his brother. Cain might have been killed, and that would have put a TERMINATION to that line of human beings. This was not to be, and the Lord put a MARK UPON HIM, which is the FLAT NOSE and BLACK SKIN. Brigham Young ( Journal of Discourses volume 7: p.290) Speech in 1863. Do you agree with him ? Is it TRUTH ?

Snagret, I am not kidding when I say this: EVERY SINGLE TIME I see you comment on a video it makes me smile!! Ever since our bonding on Midnight Mormons I think of you as a legend!

@@thestickofjoseph hahaha, that livestream was legendary - love you guys, keep it up!

Bingo!!

Maybe because God helped him translate it and God approved it?

I’ve thought a lot about that recently, as well. The most recent thing I was pondering was the timeline of Christ’s death to resurrection to His ascension to heaven and then His subsequent visit in the Americas. The New Testament authors contradict each other with some making it seem as though His ascension into heaven was shortly after His resurrection and other authors stating that He spent some 40 days with the apostles before His ascension. The Bible isn’t perfect. The Book of Mormon isn’t perfect. Both are the word of God.

Atheist scholars? You mean you didn’t know that there’s actual contradictions between the book of Mormon and the doctrine and covenants? Like for example, how the Book of Mormon as God as a spirit and yet when you look at the doctrine covenants, it says God is not a spirit? Which is it?

Are you essentially saying, you won't listen to the criticism of your faith, but you will listen to the apologetic of those criticism? Wouldn't it be better to just stay sheltered and rely on faith alone?

This might be the most Mormon comment I’ve ever read. “Perfect you did the research for me so I don’t have to look on my own” This is exactly why people call your church a cult. Why can’t you just do your due diligence and look at both sides like you would do with any other topic. You’re hypocrites.

@@jamesbayless5842 No I listen to it all the time I don't have time to sit and read anything. But I have a job where I can listen to whatever I want for at least 2 or 3 hours a day, but not free time to read.

Yes, outsource your thinking instead of investigating the truth of it for yourself. What a good widdle Mormon you are 😊

Interesting criticisms, illustrating exactly what the anti-position tends to do...not study carefully. I'm not sure where the intellectual value is in taking time to 'study' half-truths, and disenfranchised complaints. "If there is anything virtuous, lovely or of good report, we seek after these things." Seeking after the opposite serves no redeeming value. So yes, having someone else break this all apart to truly examine it is helpful. Disses lack true intellectual exchange. Waste of time for both parties.

Hey bro, thanks for sharing that! Glad you watched and hope you know you're welcome here!

Love it bro! Love when we can all share and treat each other kindly despite our different beliefs!

Prayers for you brother, 🙏 I appreciate your kindness ❤ thank you!

Everyone is uplifted when given knowledge. Thanks for joining the trip 😎🙏

You’re a legend yourself!

^_^ I like "legend", Let's listening to this one : Brigham Young said : You see some classes of the human family that are BLACK, uncouth, uncomely, DISAGREEABLE and low in their habits, wild, and seemingly deprived of nearly all the blessings of the INTELLIGENCE that is generaly bestowed upon mankind... Cain slew his brother. Cain might have been killed, and that would have put a TERMINATION to that line of human beings. This was not to be, and the Lord put a MARK UPON HIM, which is the FLAT NOSE and BLACK SKIN. Brigham Young ( Journal of Discourses volume 7: p.290) Speech in 1863. Do you agree with what Brigham Young said ? Is it TRUTH ?

Why be afraid of, in your coded language: "losing my testimony", isn't it just finding the truth instead of relying on your feelings and then trying to cherry pick evidence and twist evidence towards your feelings so that you can belong in the Church? Religious faith is lying, plain and simple. You don't need a testimony to live a good and authentic life, a life in which knowledge and understanding isn't perverted by claims of the supernatural. I find it ironic that those of the LDS faith believe that their family is "saved" when married and sealed and do all the ordinances of the Church when all you are doing is perverting your families one certain life for pretending and unauthenticity. A promotion of sociopathic behavior, that is, to tell yourselves over and over those things which are not evidently true until you finally believe the lies and then call people "lazy learners", "korihors", or 'The light of Christ has left them' to discredit, poison the well, and alienate those who leave. It is ironic that there is a scripture "For the natural man is an enemy of God..." when you rely on the social emotions and manipulate them to feel the "spirit", it is the same mechanism to get people to socially accept smoking and other drugs; the church is just a glorified cigarette salesman. Wearing magic underwear and building temples like gangs who wear similar attire such as long white t-shirts and tagging their territory with graffiti. There is no scientific evidence of a 'soul' the world would have known by now after so much understanding of the body and the brain. Religious faith is lying

But don’t you think it’s a good test? I mean it’s been done in most other religions/denominations. I would also say its not unappreciative of the gift, there can be a lot of pain associated with the words Christ or Christian. There’s a lot of non believers who don’t have a problem with God/Christ but with Christians. Please remember that some really do have a valid reason to have problems with . . . established religion.

Well said, downsmath! Can’t wait to see more. It is laughable at how little effort it takes to debunk the critics. It is a clear evidence as to the amount of true study they put into the subject matter before completely dismissing it - next to none. It boils down to the truth of the matter which is that they were just looking to an excuse or “off-ramp” to leave the church and to excuse why they do not follow the teachings of Jesus. It is sad they throw away something so beautiful for something that will ultimately be completely fleeting. As the scriptures say “the wicked taketh truth to be hard” and “wickedness never was happiness.”

@@Stingray1965 Are you sure people are just “looking for an off ramp.” The answer they would give you is different than an answer they would give someone who will listen. “The wicked taketh truth to be hard” can be said about both parties Christian/non or lds/not. While I don’t disagree with you on most critiques of the church, I do disagree when you talk about some individual stories. BOTH can be true without offending anyone and still giving credit where credit is due.

@@YDKM1959Not worth my time or the argument. I stand by what I have said. Now move on. God bless!

Thanks for the love! You’re the man!

Well. The LDS missionaries were firm and almost rude in telling me my Catholic baptism was “unauthorized” and “illegitimate”. I told them I don’t go door to door and bash Mormonism. I was shocked at their disrespectful nature after initially being so nice.

​@@Zeett09I'm sorry that they were rude. It does make sense we would have different opinions on what constitutes a valid baptism that's why we are in different churches but I wouldn't like it if someone was rude to me about it either.

Not to be rude, but as an RM myself, that is quite literally what we would do in SA. We were taught to bible bash, shove our feet in people's doors to make sure they heard our message, and all sorts of other things. It really isn't very different. And at least this lady was relatively upfront with you and left it as a single statement, rather than pestering you for moths or even years. Missionary work is also very conniving (thoguh most members don't realize this) and involves forming lots of fake friendships, purposefully seeking out weakpoints in their lives and exploiting them to push the message, etc.

@@jonbaker476 I'm not going to say that you weren't taught that in your south African mission and that you didn't do that because I wasn't there. But that sounds totally opposite to what I did in my mission. I mean we could do any of those things you mentioned if we twisted what we were asked to do into something more conniving as you say but we were never "trained" to do that. My roommate went to south Africa and it sounded like a very difficult place.

​@@logankearl8115I thought he meant South America 🤷

Just curious, how do we know the Book of Mormon didn’t have any punctuation or italics when initially translated? Where do we read that?

​@@brooksy0ung We know this largely because of two things: First, the original printer's manuscript shows signs of the punctuation being added during its creation. Second, the work done by Royal Skousen has shown that the Book of Mormon was originally dictated, as evidenced by the remaining portions of the original manuscript. The original manuscript contains no punctuation. Royal Skousen also went through and repunctuated the text as well, according to his own understanding. I'd recommend looking into the critical text project of the Book of Mormon.

Exactly!

Exactly, and in addition God knew the words in the KJV of Isaiah and could easily give those words to Joseph. The CES letter complains that Moroni couldn't have had those exact 7 words. Of course he didn't write in English, they came from God to Joseph at the time of translation.

So you're saying the seer stone gave the KJV verses (errors and all) because that was the conventional translation? What about the Joseph Smith translation of the Bible? It changed some of the KJV verses in the BOM. Why didn't the stone give The correct translation from the start?

Haha 😂 ... great comment 👏

What’s the name of the mobile app. Can’t find it in the Apple store

To be fair, there are many refutations of FAIR's interpretations as well. If I rememebr correctly Bill Reel used to work with FAIR as well. One must adequately listen to both sides fora while and n ot just assume FAIR has actually debunked anything. Sometimes they do but I've also caught them twisting information or trying to shove things under the rug

@@jonbaker476as someone who has worked with FAIR and on their wiki, they do not deliberately/intentionally try to sweep uncomfortable things under the rug.

My experience with FAIR is that their content is dry ... as an older millennial I find this delivery is much more entertaining 🙏

Thanks for mentioning the FAIR app, I had no idea!

Nah. I disagree. People just need to chill

I very much doubt that in handwritten script they would have italicized, just because I'm not certain that the various scribes would have thought to/known how to mark that clearly in handwritten scripts. I know that EB Grandin added punctuation. One of my college teachers called him "The first editor of the Book of Mormon." If that's so, I think it's definitely possible that he matched the punctuation and formatting to the book of Isaiah in his own copy of the Bible. Maybe it saved him time to have laid out already in another book, for reference.

Really? Do you have an sources on this? That is super interesting!

f you were a doubting Mormon, you would be looking for an excuse to show the letter right.

Because the CES is solid.

^_^ Nice Help me understand this : Joseph F Smith said : Some people have supposed that the doctrine of plural marriage was a sort of superfluity, or nonessential to the salvation or exaltation of mankind. In other words, some of the Saints have said, and believe, that a man with one wife, sealed to him by the authority of the Priesthood for time and eternity, will receive an exaltation as great and glorious, if he is faithful, as he possibly could with more than one. I want here to enter my solemn protest against this idea, for I know it is false. Joseph F. Smith ( Journal of Discourses volume 20: Discourses 4) What does he mean by that? Is it because he was practicing POLYGAMY and he said so, to justify his lifestyle ?

@@apologetiquesinvestigations great question! My thought is anyone trying to justify behavior that is wrong is simply immature. Is there another explanation? For sake of argument, let's say he is Truly a prophet, and him making that statement refers to a celestial principle: does that require me to do anything or believe something that goes against what is said in scripture? Off the bat, I don't think so. What do you think?

Tbh you aren't really doing your own thinking though unless you actually go and read the letter

@@jonbaker476 That's fair, I should read it if I'm following along with this series. I have found it easy to run down the endless rabbit holes people will claim against the doctrines and events of the church and sometimes stepping back and simply allowing my mind to refocus on my testimony is necessary.

@@Called-to-Live ^_^ Don't be deceive, if you follow a liars as a teacher and prophet, you are in danger ! Jesus-Christ say " For there shall arise false Christs, and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders ; insomuch that, if it were possible, THEY SHALL DECEIVE THE VERY ELECT Matthew 24 : 24.

Basically the LDS Church tries to fight against the internet, which is not possible. They could only win this battle by shutting down the internet. Indoctrinating young members about the evil of Wikipedia will not cut it in the 21st century.

They can't. The prophet said only to believe in church sources...

@@xxxgabaxxx Yeah. I have also talked to members who are almost phobic about Wikipedia.

​@@xxxgabaxxx I've always been under the impression that they encourage you to question things not linger but genuinely question things if you have issues.

All churches in our secularized world have to as Peter put it, give a reason for the hope that is within them.

In this day, it is easy to get wrapped up in the back and forth. The message of the gospel is simple: read the Book of Mormon. Pray with a sincere heart to know if it is true. You will receive an answer. If you are truly interested, you can gain your own witness.

Mormon apostle J. Ruben Clark stated: "If we have truth, it cannot be harmed by investigation. If we have not truth, it ought to be harmed." Read the CES letter for yourself, and then read the LDS church's responses to it and decide for yourself if the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints is the only true and living church upon the face of the earth.

Take a step back from looking at LDS. Look at Christianity as a whole. You really don’t think that Christians are defending Christ less than the defense of Joseph Smith? Or the defense of religion as a whole or the defense of God. It’s part and parcel of Belief of another power and his prophets. It’s always been that way.

It is provably false. NO truth: Book of Abraham published with 3 facsimiles taken from an ancient papyrus. The book is a funerary papyrus showing scenes from the Egyptian Book of the Dead. In Facsimiles Nos. 1 & 3, Smith misidentifies everything depicted. "LDS and non-LDS Egyptologists agree that the characters on the fragments do not match the translation given in the book of Abraham" Quote from LDS OFFICIAL WEB PAGE NO trace of the “Two million Jaredites slain” (Ether 15:2), with iron, brass, breast-plates, shields, and armor. It would be impossible for these millions of dead warriors in armor to leave no trace. NO trace of the great city Zarahemla- it would be impossible for a city the size of Zarahemla (Alma 5:2; D&C 125:3) to leave no trace. NO trace of Jewish dna found in any Indian burial ground anywhere in the Americas from time period of BOM. Thomas W. Murphy, (Mormon scholar, DNA researcher):“We are in a dilemma, the genetic evidence shows that American Indians are not Hebrews, they are not Israelites. The Book of Mormon is not true.” John Whitmer Historical Association Journal 2005 NO temple like Solomon's described in 2 Nephi 5:16 has ever been found yet biblical temple is easily seen in Jerusalem. If the temple Nephi describes ever existed it could not disappear. NO Nephite "reformed Egyptian" writings ever found anywhere as it is not a real language anywhere in the world. NO cities mentioned in the BOM have ever been located (none of 38) anywhere. It would be impossible for them to disappear unless they never existed. NO evidence: "The whole land was covered with buildings, and the people were as numerous, as it were the sand of the sea." Yet not one ever located. (Mormon 1:7) IMPOSSIBLE for highly advanced civilizations (Jaredites, Nephites) & MILLIONS of people to have vanished. The BOM speaks of sheep, swine, silk, wool clothing & elephants existing in the Americas when they did not. 1 Ne.13:7; Alma 4:6; Ether 9:17 and 10:24 These were brought to America centuries later by Europeans. NO wheat, no goats, no metal smelting furnaces, no metal armor, no steel swords, no cattle, no chariot parts, no brass (Mosiah 8:10) no evidence of the listed Kings in BOM, no Jewish relics or Jewish Temples from supposed Jews, no metal plates like Nephites supposedly used, no middle eastern seeds growing, "which were brought from the land of Jerusalem ... and grew exceedingly" 1 Nephi 18:24 There is NO archaeological, anthropological, topological, linguistic, botanical or dna evidence to support the Book of Mormon. LDS anthropologist Dee Green: “The first myth we need to eliminate is that BOM archaeology exists” conceding 20 years of research “left us empty-handed” (Green 1969 p. 77) CAN WE IGNORE THE LACK OF EVIDENCE FOR THE THE BOOK OF MORMON AND JUST TRUST OUR HEARTS AS TO THE TRUTH OF IT EVEN THOUGH IT CONFLICTS WITH THE BIBLE? NO! D&C Section 9:8-9 - tell us that if something is true it will make our "bosom burn" and we will FEEL that it is right. Maroni 10:4 says: "he will manifest the truth of it unto you" The Bible warns us against this subjective type of truth test. Why? Because we have a sinful nature that can be deceived. Proverbs 28:26 "He that trusts in his own (bosom) heart is a FOOL." The Scriptures, however, are infallible and can never be wrong (John 17:17; Psalm 119:128; 33:4; 19:8; Romans 3:4). This is why the Bible frequently urges us to study and meditate on God's word. 2 Timothy 2:15 KJV "STUDY ... rightly dividing the word of TRUTH." Acts 17:11 "EXAMINE THE SCRIPTURES to see if what said is TRUE". 1John 4:1 says: "BELIEVE NOT EVERY SPIRIT, ... because MANY FALSE PROPHETS have gone out into the world." Mormonism claims the bible was corrupted to justify Joseph Smith's changing of the biblical, eternal God into an evolving, created god, who is not all powerful and is one of an endless number of gods . However, this is a PROVABLY FALSE claim. The Claim: In the BOM, the prophet Nephi has a vision the Bible was corrupted and "plain and precious parts" were removed after the 12 apostles and after the formation of the “great and abominable church” (1 Nephi 13:26-29). Most Mormons believe this is the Catholic Church formed in the 4th century. Nephi claims this church was founded by the Devil (1 Nephi 14:3). So let’s objectively examine the Bible & BOM. BIBLE: The Dead Sea Scrolls have been dated to as early as 350 BC. One is the Great Isaiah Scroll, which is the oldest known copy of the Book of Isaiah dated to 180 BC. Do ANY ancient scrolls show Smith's "uncorrupted" version of scripture? NO! Yet they would if the scripture was later corrupted after the 12 apostles died as Smith and Nephi said. Also, if they had been corrupted, Jesus would have corrected scripture instead of affirming it! Jesus sd:“ I told you EVERYTHING written about me in the Law of Moses, the Books of the Prophets, and in the Psalms had to happen.” (Luke 24:44-46) Scripture is the same today as it was 2,100+ years ago with only minor spelling and punctuation differences. Joseph Smith was wrong. These scrolls pre-dated Catholics, and are Jewish scrolls and the BOM says the Jews had the Scriptures in their "purity". 1Nephi 13:25 LDS Apologist Wayne Ham admitted the Isaiah scroll does not support the the BOM. Apologist Dr. Sidney B. Sperry, of BYU, said the Dead Sea Scrolls do not help the case for the BOM. BYU Professor Joseph F. McConkie: "Rather than Joseph Smith as Found in Ancient Manuscripts, it ought be Joseph Smith as Lost in Ancient Manuscripts.” (Religious Studies Center, 1984) IS THE GOD OF THE BOOK OF MORMON THE SAME ONE AS IN THE BIBLE? NO! In the LDS Church’s 147th Conf., Gen Authority Bernard P. Brockbank said: the Christ followed by Mormons is NOT THE CHRIST followed by traditional Christianity. (Ensign, May 1977 p. 26) "Before me NO god was formed, nor shall there be ANY after me.” (Isaiah 43:10) If Mormonism is true, then God could not make this claim, for he was just a man at one point; nor could he claim that no gods would come after him, for that is the goal of LDS members. Like Joseph Smith, this was the goal of Satan, to be like God and have worshipers. "I will exalt my throne above the stars of God ... I will be like the Most High”’ (Isaiah 14:12-14) The new testament has not been corrupted either. See the book of John. Smith changed it to make Jesus a created being. Research a 1900 year old papyri known as the Bodmer Papyri of the book of John. (written 150 AD, around the Apostle John's time) John 1:1 "In the BEGINNING was the WORD and the WORD was WITH God and the WORD WAS God." ΕΝ ΑΡΧΗ ΗΝ Ο ΛΟΓΟΣ ΚΑΙ Ο ΛΟΓΟΣ ΗΝ ΠΡΟΣ ΤΟΝ ΘΕΟΝ ΚΑΙ ΘΕΟΣ ΗΝ Ο ΛΟΓΟΣ (look up this ancient Greek yourself on google) John 1:1 Joseph Smith translation: "In the beginning was the GOSPEL preached through the Son. And the GOSPEL was the word, and the word was with the Son, and the Son was with God, and the Son was of God." Smith's Jesus is no longer God in the flesh but the biblical Jesus is: "God was manifest in the flesh" 1Tim. 3:16 KJV There are 4,000 Greek manuscripts of the New Testament. Some go back to 350 AD and NONE support Joseph Smith's claims that the bible of today has been corrupted. Papyrus fragments exist of the New Testament dated to 175 AD and show that the new testament has NOT been "corrupted". (New Testament Docs: Are They Reliable? Grand Rapids: Eerdmans, 1967 pp. 15-17) The manuscript and archeological evidence for the BIBLE is the GREATEST in antiquity. I pray you know the true Jesus and not Joseph Smith's exalted man from another planet who is not eternal, not all powerful, not perfect but evolving, and was polygamous. God is much greater than the humanoid of Mormonism and NOT just ONE OF AN ENDLESS NUMBER OF EVOLVING GODS. Jesus said ALL scripture will NOT fade away but "many wolves in sheep's clothing" will come trying to add to the word. Mathew 7:15 Joseph Smith changed Jesus, the Father and taught you can become a GOD. It hurts my heart to see Mormons fall for the lie that we can become God when there is only one eternal God found in the bible. "The only men who become Gods, even the sons of Gods are those that enter into polygamy." (Brigham Young) Journal of Discourses 11 p.269 Apostle Orson Pratt, in The Seer, page 172, “the great Messiah who was the founder of the Christian religion was a Polygamist…the Messiah chose to take upon himself his seed; and by marrying many wives, … The son followed the example of his Father" God gave us critical thinking & logical reasoning for a reason, which is why he does tell us to EXAMINE and TEST what we are being taught for TRUTH. The bible withstands the truth test. Joseph Smith's version fails the truth test. It's your eternity, study it for yourself. God bless.

" Isaiah gains understanding from God, writes it down -> Nephi translates it himself into reformed Egyptian, writes it on the brass plates -> Joseph translates the brass plates, Oliver writes it on parchment -> the printer sets the type for the printing. That's 4 levels of translation of the word of God." And yet we are told that JS translated the BOM by looking into a rock placed into a hat, that he saw the words in English as through they were written out, and then merely read the words he saw to his scribes. He would occasionally pause to make sure the scribe was writing things and spelling correctly. To me that sounds like a very precise revelatory process.

@@senorbb2150 Elaborate hoax. There was no brass in America at that time. Nor was there 1600's era English, nor has there ever been a language known as "reformed Egyptian".

@@brettpinion4233Oh I am aware of those issues. I am in no way a believer in the veracity of the BOM. I was pointing out that the apologists will sometimes claim that the translation was a loose process when in actuality Joseph and his scribes do not describe it as such.

I could sense your sarcasm. I was just adding to the it. I cannot understand those who choose to ignore the indefensible.@@senorbb2150

Hayden@thestickofjoseph.com and jackson@thestickofjoseph.com

Even the ones about black people being descended from Cain, and native americans turning white if they're righteous enough?

Happy you do! Enjoy the video!

We did to double check that there weren’t any inconsistencies, but the original manuscript doesn’t exist of those verses

Mic dropped!!!!

RE #2: That's along what I thought of when the Red Sea text was discussed in the video. But more along the lines that it could have been Nephi's mistake since so many life changing experiences happened as Lehi was camped by the borders of the Red Sea.

Similar to the Christ birth in Bethlehem vs Jerusalem idea. Great points

One other idea to consider is there are some studies that talk about Moses and the Children of Israel crossing the Red Sea as being practically impossible (logistically speaking). But Bible scholars have discovered a “Reed Sea” a bit closer to where the Israelites most likely camped and probably crossed there.. my point? Well it could have been a different “Red Sea” at the time and have since changed the name. Or it could have been a “Reed, Reid, Read (or any other slightly different spelling) of a Sea. Bottom line. Just like my unconscious bias makes things like this strengthen my testimony. Someone not living the gospel will likely take these things to validate their leaving church and discounting any good that it brings to the world.

This makes so much sense!

@@AndrewLarsson Thank you! Isn't it amazing how simply criticisms of the Book of Mormon can be appeased? All we need to do is study the Book of Mormon and ponder on it - as the Prophet Joseph Smith Jr recommended that we all do. The Lord Jesus Christ has restored His Church and the fullness of His Gospel to the world.

Yessir. Royal Skousen has it in his version, but unfortunately the original BOM manuscript of this verse doesn’t exist…

No argument disproved the BoM was translated.

Relying exclusively on apologists and true believers to formulate your opinions is not using critical thinking. I made the same mistake when I was a true believer.

yeah and relying alone in "factual information" doesn't also gives you everything that you need to know about the truth. There's always need a balance for both. 1 Cor. 2:11 says we cannot rely on on human knowledge alone to know the things of God.@@senorbb2150

Most correctly holds the gospel. Not most perfectly written.

You totally understand the exhaustion! Haha I don’t use caffeine unless I’m pulling a late night or something, but maybe I should start haha That would be awesome, email is hayden@thestickofjoseph.com

Isn't it against the word of wisdom to use caffeine?

​@@CMO999no its not but if your a really really good mormon u don't drink it. U go to some church gatherings and theirs Pepsi and coke you go to others water and sprite. It's like the lottery you have to get lucky.

⁠@@CMO999 not strictly, but caffeine is an addictive substance. Part of my understanding of the word of wisdom is keeping us free from the bondage of addiction. An occasional caffeinated beverage from time to time (aside from coffee and tea) is probably not an issue. If you find yourself saying, or thinking, ‘I can’t function until I’ve had my in the morning,’ then take time to make an honest assessment of your standing with the Lord. President Nelson recently counseled that we rid ourselves of all addictions.