Like Sam says “people in the organization are terrified of accountability”. There in lies the problem!

JD and Sam are the guys willing to say it like it is.... they are close enuff and experienced enuff to deliver real professional insights.... but not so close that they have to pull punches and give polite analysis to "please" people in their economic circles. Thank you for calling out Dubas as a failure. He was good. But definitely NOT good enuff for the top franchise in hockey and his results are proof positive. Best Pod to date.

Mac was right on Kyper & Bourne the moment Dubas said he wasnt sure he wanted to come back Shanahan has to look elsewhere.

Thank you JD!!! Around that 23 min mark. Simple as that. It's business. And all the items you listed....peace Dubas

So Dubas is gone before the Mike Babcock expired. Classic!!!

Can we all agree that no matter what happens over the off-season, can we kill Hall and Oats

Thanks for this show!

These guys are fans first and not just boring ass media like Siegal and Myrtle

Does anyone believe Kyle hadn't discussed it with his wife long before this week?

Jason Spezza reigned too. How crazy is that.

The absolutely single thing that I care about for the Toronto Maple Leafs is the roster lineup next October

Great pod today boys !

Young men becoming middle aged men , "they brought in a young talent and got same result" "Social media saying to give dubas more time, IT'S a BUSINESS there is stuff to be done" . Enjoy watching guys have a good 1

This podcast was refreshing like a cold Pinapple Fanta

This is super an excellent balanced conversation. Much appreciated gents.

The job was Dubas's then he made a counter offer on Thursday. Obviously I have no idea what he was asking for but Shanahan wasn't having it. Reports are the original contract would've made Dubas one of the higher paid gm's in the league. The fact that Dubas still wanted more tells me that he really didn't want the job that badly. The only way Dubas would've wanted to come back is if he got everything he wanted to deal with the "pressure" of being a gm for the leafs. I like Dubas but he overplayed his hand.

16-17m of this epi… preach JD

I was a fan of Dubas but also think picking up JT handcuffed our team in terms of cap space and made Matthews and Marner look at a player they out produce and a 11 mil contract of course they’ll want higher or around the same. And already having Kadri that move was a mess. I really wish we could have another go around at this but without JT. Do we still have Hymen and/or Freddy? Could we keep O’Reilly or Acciari this season. Could we have convinced the others to take less. Sad to think about

Meant to be supportive, but JD should let colleagues talk more

The fact dubas signed those hard line contracts and aligned with his own. Tells me he was thinking about his own job security, and it back fired big time.

Seeing this pop up made me happy and sad

Now Dubas is gone, no matters whether he wanted to take it elsewhere or he really wanted to come back. As a boss, you only want result. MLSE made quick decisions, and knowing that time is ticking. Especially with the timelines of the off season and the numerious issues surrounding this Leafs team, they have to act responsibly and accordingly

Hearing the body of work reiterated, its true there were more than a few misses. I still think Dubas made some great moves also. I did like and trust him as the GM, but am excited about having new eyes on the subject.

Bell and Rogers vetoed the extension last summer, nothing Shanahan could do. Who knows what Dubas was thinking.. you don't get an extra bonus or premium for having stress on the domestic front. Toronto is a tough market for sure, but if you're not up to it, move on elsewhere. Very strange card for Dubas to play in public no less. We have not heard from Dubas (may not ever happen), so trying to reserve judgement, but this looks bad on him right now. He'll wind up somewhere else for next season. This won't really affect that. Won't be Calgary, they're about to announce Conroy as the new GM.

Straight forward talk. I don't care who is in "Management" anymore. Wake me up in the 3 round of the 2024 Playoffs. BTW: the TO media seems easy. Just win!

Sam I agree there has to be accountability but we know now that they aren’t letting him go because of his or the teams poor playoff performances but because of a poor contract negotiation. Which I am mad he did that as well but when has anyone other than Kadri been punished for their recent playoff embarrassment.

You do know that both Brian Burke and Ron Hextall are available.

Let’s call a spade a spade. Shanahan’s press conference was more about saving his own job than being transparent with the media. Not saying that Dubas didn’t deserve to fired, but Shanahan’s speech was a kind of a shady move. Plus he’s more of a failure than Dubas; he held his position longer and he controlled every move Dubas made. 4 GMs in 9 years…just sayin’

Mike Futa would be a good gm for Toronto. David Poile would be good also as new gm.

GMs will come and go the real issue with the league is the officiating. Nobody calls it out for what it is. This will continue regardless of who the GM is and what players hit the ice.

Dang

Might have been the board who nixed the summertime offer. JD you make a lot of insightful opinion, but this one on Shanny is an unknown

Only significant hold-outs now to accountability are Keefe and the core. Although it scares me to hell that Shanahan said something about a timetable for change. Yikes

As usual Leafs managed to stack other teams with good players giving up 1st round picks for players a year or 2 from retirement and seen better days. I'm 89 so I can say this back in my day the Leafs iced almost the same team yearly except for 1/2 changes, and were winners those guys wanted to play had heart now it's where can I get the most $s.Back in the day players worked for the summer driving truck for Smyth " See Smyth for Sand"

Did anyone catch Shanny reference Keefe as Dubas's head coach

Shanahan saves his own ass by dumping Dubas. Accountability must 'begin at the top.

19:00. by this logic why would Mathews deserve a raise also. if franchise records don't mean anything.

Don't you think players would be more accountable if they were afraid of moving ? Someone needs to be the boss ? Matthews wrist is a major concern!

He took 3 questions, there is no transparency with Shanny

The culture of the Leafs are known to not be accountable, its good to see in a president

Why is shanahan not gone?

Overall I feel that its the players who should be shouldering most of the blame.

Did you two even listen to Shanahan's presser....he wanted a vet GM! wow leaf's fans are lost

I'm not a Leafs fan but I do see what's happening here and I'd like to throw in an outside opinion for you guys. I have been around long enough to see the Leafs try EVERYTHING and in my view, they are basically just running around in circles at this point. I don't think Kyle Dubas was a good choice for GM and for proof of that, I offer this; Kyle Dubas will very likely never have a GM position in the NHL again. To me that means that he was not someone who should have been running such an important organization. I do think that the pressure in Toronto is not fair or even reasonable and it is a big part of the problem (but that is another story). The best any NHL team can do is draft well, put together the best team possible and then give them as many shots as possible at a Cup run. Toronto has had a really good team for a few years now and they've not had much success in the playoffs, but what can they really do?? They're not going to be able to move Marner or Matthews and get fair value back and despite how things ended this year, I still think goaltending is more of an issue than anyone is talking about right now. I think they would have been better off letting Lamarillo run the club and then just let the existing core have their chances and get them as much help as possible. Face it folks, it's not easy to win a Cup and every year 31 teams go home unhappy.

The most prestigious in North America lmao, the Americans don't care about hockey , you get 25,000 fans to a high school football game in Texas , you win the Stanley Cup and it's on the 3rd page after womens college basketball

Disappointed to see JD and Sam are such bootlickers

Dubas agent: “yeah, we are thinking more money, say double and more autonomy, like how about absolute discretion on roster moves. Shanahan: that’s a large ask but let me ponder it. Dubas agent: oh and one other small clause, Kyle wants to choose the the goal song. He thinks that “ you make me feel brand new “ is tired and dated. Shanahan makes the the fart sound followed by the on hold elevator music in agents ear as shanny starts calling around to unemployed GM’s

Any suggestions who will be or next GM?

Unfortunate that Spezza ended up leaving too.

causing extreme inner turmoil bc your president is too prideful is not a good look. how shanahan is still employed but dubas isn't is beyond me.

JD Shanny probably didn't get approval to extend Dubas until after the season. So can't really blame him for that. Overall though the org should have just fired or extended him last year. Also, the Dubas stans are absolutely insufferable.

Core 4 contracts not the best

Yes JD Bunkis ... time for a new culture and that's why my new pick for GM is Gary Roberts; he'll know what players to bring in to change the culture of the team and turn this into a real championship contender

Dude JD, fix your camera…

JD makes me laugh here. I'm from Toronto and would love to see the Leafs win so I'm not hating when I say this But the "it's Toronto" is lame. How many people are banging on the door of the leafs to come home? JT came home because he got massively over payed. Winning in Miami is the same as Toronto, a championship is a championship. It means more In Toronto to FANS that's it. It means the same to the players regardless where it happens Come to stark realization that a Canadian team probably won't win a title for a longggg time. Canadian boys can have no pressure and rack up titles in American markets, why bother with the pressure of playing for a Canadian team? Vegas has what 20/23 skaters who are Canadian? And they're located in Vegas? Good luck Canada

Oh crap I'm going to run out of popcorn 🍿 🙃...

Most of the ' Dubas ' fans have never played a game of competitive hockey in their lives.

With a new GM on the scene, the Leafs may be embarking on yet another multi-year championship development program. ✔️

Lol u guys are clueless, sure Tavares is getting slower but he is a ppg player

Cya Kyle dont let the door hit ya on the arse onthe way out

Idk guys. It’s clear this was calculated and the only approach for the organization. This shouldn’t be a surprise.

Just like Shanahan, this Bunkis clown should be the one gone. Sammy McKee is the man!

What goes around comes around. Dubas maybe thought he should get paid like the core without any accountability.

👉SHANAHAN IS A GREAT PRESIDENT. IT'S UP TO HIM TO MAKE CHANGES AND STEER THE SHIP. I KEEP HEARING "THAT WAS SHANAHAN'S GUY", HE SHOULD TAKE THE FALL TOO. THAT 💯 NOT TRUE! IT'S UP TO HIM TO CHANGE STRUCTURE, RATHER THAN KEEP DOING THE SAME THING AND EXPECTING A DIFFERENT RESULT.

How can you be accepted as an intelligent, smart, competent GM or President when you give 4 players 50% of the Cap.................. This is not Baseball with NO CASP restrictions, when The Yankees have 350 million cap and the poor teams are under 60 million.

Steve dangle admonishing Shanahan for the firing and giving us an explanation is the worst take I've heard on any leaf news in my life

Sammy. Your income is not tied to the accuracy of your opinions, different for contract professionals in management

The gm options you guys mentioned are awful, no thank you.

Dubas is gone. Seems to have overplayed his hand. Shanahan was a warrior class player. After losing a playoff round and publicly whining about how tough the job is and deferring to your wife as the decision maker, that would have had to be the end for Dubas in Shanahan's eyes. Not reading the room and having your agent inflate an ask that already accommodated months of negotiated 'must haves' is, in any business, interpreted as bad faith. Sports is big business but at the end of the day it is just hockey. Anything other than Dubas stating "Tough to stomach the loss but instead, I focus on the awesome organization we have built, which anybody lucky enough to be a part of, knows is 1st class. We have a strong core of character guys who like me, want to win. We make moves to add depth and talent and I believe each year we have gotten better. We will continue to do so and if the leadership of MLSE continues to have faith in me, I am committed to doing anything I can to bring home a Cup to Toronto". #1 priority IMHO is goaltending. The young guy Woll looked good when called upon and might have the secret sauce but Samsonov was often caught out of position and gave up too many weak goals. Move Samsonov. Defense was outmatched with both Florida opponents and the Leafs need their Coffey, Leetch, Lidstrom anchors to transition up ice without turnovers. Emphasis on a combination of speed and nastiness. In terms of trade bait up front I think you need to shake things up. Not necessarily wholesale changes but certainly a blockbuster with at least one of Tavares, Marner or Mathews needing to go. A Losing attitude is a virus that needs to be cut out. Edmonton went all in this year and are also out in the 2nd round to Vegas, so perhaps there is a blockbuster McDavid and or Draissaitl for Mathews and or Marner. An explosive move that could shake up both rosters. Another move is Mathews and Samsonov for the #1 pick with Chicago. Do something bold to grab a potential generational talent and clear cap space. Is a coaching change warranted? Perhaps. Keep in mind NHL coaches earn their chops through experience and just blowing the coach out does not change a losing culture. A change could be positive and candidly now more likely but only if a world class guy is ready to step in. Joel Quenneville comes to mind. He took a bullet for what happened in Chicago but is a proven winner. Now it gets interesting because Stan Bowman, who won 3 Cups in Chicago (with Quenneville a former Leaf) could come in as a package deal. Shanahan with his relationships with the NHL HO could smooth things over for re-reinstatement for both. Thoughts?

Mark Hunter should get the job.

Bam Son

Hand in the cookie Jar Kyle! Back to Tier 2

They were not sold on Dubas last summer and wanted to see improvement to warrant a new deal. At the end he wasn't winning enough so it's time to go.

Sam you are really great.

Auston Matthews would be just a guy in any other franchise. He ain't leading any team to a cup.

Our father which art in heaven hallowed be thy name thy kingdom come thy will be done in earth as it is in heaven give us this day our daily bread and forgive us our debts as we forgive our debtors lead us not into temptation but deliver us from evil for thine is the kingdom and the power and the glory for ever amen

JD goof can’t block me on here too can he?

I wonder how many water bottles he's chucking tonight?

F@%& it. They should trade Matthews.The team will still make the playoffs, home ice means nothing and they wont miss him in the playoffs except his moustache and the meg meme. Even do a sign and trade, get good players and get back draft picks and build along side with that. You wont get the same value from the other 2.

Leafs are not favourite hockey team in the Country lol, second likely.

David Poile retired with his good friend taking over but you think the leaf's could get him??? I think you think to highly of T.O....sorry but most American's dont even think of the Leaf's 1st when it comes to Canada 100% it Montral! Stop thinking your the center of the hockey world...NY bigger market Florida no Taxes....stop thinking you are the best STOP

Dubas was offered that contract last weekend, he did not have it "sitting on his desk" since March. (SOURCE: SHANAHAN). The "Dubas Plan" was working. He completely rebuilt the entire organization in the front office and on the ice. Spezza left (he was Dubas' assistant, so that makes sense), and based on insider tweets a lot of the organization is unhappy with how Shanahan sewered Dubas. (Yes, it was a sewer job. When a tight lipped organization decides to be so open it is a calculated move, and it's not a hard batch of math to do). He would have GMed the Leafs to a cup, now this team is going to implode unless they get lucky. I hope Matthews, Marner and Rielly tell Leafs management to go love themselves, they deserve it.

Dubas gone is a loss for Leaf Trolls.

It's almost definitely an L for Dubas. The question is: is it also an L for the Leafs? Can they afford to throw their organization into chaos with 3 of their core 4 getting no move clauses in 45 days?

Dubas is gonna win a cup before the Leafs do. And when he does, I'll be laughing.

Babcock is still being paid lmfao

Dubas should have taken a pay cut for doing nothing

Bye bye Duffus !

Great now shanahan and keefe

😂 these tokked “fans” want MORE of Kyle after 9 years. It’s insane the amount of runway this cult will give objective failures.

I understand that you may be expressing your REAL opinions, however you both come across as apologists for leafs organization. Are you employees?

Liv take is an L.

They gotta just steal Yzerman somehow

Use the lords prayer as i just left pray to lord jesus christ😮 if you feel scared or lonely or unhappy or if you want a relationship with him below is the lords prayer to use

I need to talk to you. First off, I think the truth was that Dubis was not going to be accepted back. He was probably told in game 3 of the second round, loose and you're out but will run the following year not with any team so not to sabotage any following contract negotiations. Auston needs to go. I don't understand the support for him if the information I have is correct. Auston is a center with under 54% faceoff win percentage. While Tavares is higher with 58%. Since Tavares has a no trade contract, we keep Tavares, keep Marner. Why Marner over Matthews? Marner was the best Leaf player with 3 seasons 90 plus points, highest consecutive points earner on the leafs, 99 poonts in this last regular season. I value assists. It shows Marner is a play maker. I would also like to keep Nylander who was top 3 point earner on the Leafs. Although both Marner and Nylander are right wingers, I would try Tavares, Marner, Nylander on the same line. Try to trade Auston even as a loan to Chicago for their draft pick which is suspected to be a 3 year contract. If the Leafs can have all 4 contracts endcat the same time (next three years), do or done opportunity. Win the Cup in the next 3 years or they are all done with the Leafs. I would be fine to promote Woll as full time goalie. If we can't get Chicago's draft choice, if we release Auston, will it open our salary cap to keep Bunting and others currently here that are soon UFA? If so, even better. I'm ok with keeping the team as it is minus Matthews. What did Matthews do? 60 goals 2 seasons ago? That is a personal stat. The team only needs to win with 1 goal and if they can be the best defensively to leave as a tie, that earns them one point that adds up at the end of the regular season. 1 goal lead only important during the playoffs. I think they need better plays. Dumping the puck into opponents zone is never a good plan. Keeping control of the puck is always the better plan. How to take advantage of the right opportunities is what they need to learn. Why did Dubas sit on the contract offered? Because Dubas actually thought or hoped that the Leafs were going to perform well during the playoffs that it was going to boost his staus. Leafs lost miserably and crushed his value to the point that its better to let him go.

No more woke hockey in Toronto

Kyle is an illiterate, why? No modern team has ever won a Stanley Cup, with four finesse forwards coupled with average defence and average goaltending...it’s not a winning template.

Shannaplan 2.0 incoming

Oh yeah, truly a terrible hockey team he built there in Toronto. He definitely deserved to be fired 😶 221-109-42 lol pretty decent record!? 4th best record in the league last year? Can Kyle go out and perform in the playoffs for these guys? Sheesh. I hope this mess chases everyone away starting with Matthews and then Leafs nation can remember how much worse it is to be at the bottom of the league rather than being a team good enough to lock into a playoff spot at basically the midway point of the season. No appreciation from fans spoiled with one of the best teams in the league for how many years now? Do yall really not remember being really really bad? It wasn't that long ago but it seems you guys still act the exact same way lol... Leaf nation could also take a look at the 4 teams left in the playoffs now. Ya'll put so much pressure on these players rather than just letting them do their thing and actually supporting them. Seriously yall went from cheering like you won the god damn cup after finally getting out of the first round to blowing it all up firing the GM and likely the coach right before several pivotal decisions need to be made with the core contract situations and there's no GM in place. Talk about making a mountain out of a molehill WOW.

LOL WRONG YOU WERE