Dave Lee puts the macbook in the freezer and Linus takes it out of the oven. I see a pattern here.

Apple stores : Sorry sir, we can't fix the scratch on your screen. but you can buy a new screen attached to a new macbook

As people say, 'Pro' stands for 'profit' not 'professional'.

I just don't get why they went for the paper-thin laptop trend. I need a portable workstation, not a knife

We have Intel not using enough solder, Apple using far too much.

We have soldered everything to prevent you from having to think about repairs or upgrades. If your MAC fails or needs more storage or memory simply buy a new one. We do all this thinking of you.

400$ for 16 gigs of extra memory, Apple in a nutshell.

If only you could install MacOS on a laptop not made by Apple. Some sort of hackbook, customtosh.. hackmac.. you know what iMean.

somewhere on this earth every hour an i9 laptop is Thermal Throttling.

Talk shit about mac. You get da Smack. I’m personally glad I can cook dinner while working. Great for productivity.

"Pro" is just like "Gamer" for hardware - buzzword for overpricing.

Still using my Late 2013 15' MacBook and have had 0 problems for the past 4 years. I strongly believe this is the best model they've ever made, and just looking at all these issues in the newer Macbook's makes me sad, because I don't know what I'm going to upgrade to in the future.

apple needs to fix their cooling solution before making macbooks slimmer

I do think Apple should have done something to the cooler, but you are right about this being an industry wide problem. It seems like i9s shouldn't be in ultra thin laptops yet.

This is why you buy apple 'pro'ducts at least 6 months afrlter the release

I love the way the monitor flickers and blanks out then comes back that just oozes quality.

Next video: liquid cooling the *2018* MacBook

The way you sponsor stuff never fails to suprise me

Steve Jobs is rolling in his grave. Dude was mean and rude, but knew how to lead Apple.

What a great video. I loved how it was presented and well researched.

No recoverable storage? Why do they even bothering calling them "pro"?

Thanks Linus, I didn't realize that port in the MBP 17 was meant for data recovery! Totally not worth the upgrade now.

I honestly don't think Apple is concerned with losing the 'Pro' market.

I agree, I bought a new MacBook pro 2018, and it was slower than my 2014 , I returned it... and will keep using my 2014

"Pro" just means expensive for Apple

Just download better cooling

I used to love Macs but after Steve Jobs passed away there have been some unusual design features, that just don't make a lot of sense , from a consumer point of view. I really don't like having to search for a "Dongle" when trying to use a usb drive etc..

I completely agree, I have a late 2017 model and even that thermal throttles quite badly on light to mid gaming or video rendering. It's especially bad on a warmer day if I'm not using the A/C.

Well this is perfect for Apple isn't it? The "firmware fix" that isn't a firmware fix at all, ensures that nobody can conceivably run Windows on this thing. And the constant near 100 degrees on the CPU under load ensures a nice and short lifetime so they can make money off ludicrously expensive repairs or new devices.

When these MacBook pros were announced in October 2016, I was watching the keynote with my checkbook open. I had a 27" iMac, a MacBook Pro, and an iPhone (and had owned almost every version of the iPhone since waiting in line on launch day for the first iPhone), and was excited about finally replacing my aging but awesome MacBook Pro. (I'm a developer and a power user.) Flash forward to today.... I have a custom Windows desktop, an Asus laptop, and a Samsung phone. For me, this device was the signal that Apple had lost touch with it's power users. At the same time - Microsoft under Nadella started showing true technology leadership, and Linux Subsystem for Windows made all of my work possible on a Windows laptop for the first time. I transitioned slowly at first, and then realized everything was fine with Windows. Apple is now a consumer-brand more than ever. I mourn for the loss, because I loved the experience of Apple products during the "golden years", but they've been making some bad decisions in the last 5-or-so years, and IMO they've lost their touch.

I'm due for a new MacBook Pro but I have decided to wait until 2020 to see if Apple listen to its customer and come out with a computer that is worthy of its cost and its origin.

But yea, my opinion to this is, if manufacturers use high performance components, at least use cooling that can keep the temps optimal for best operation and durability of the components even if you compromise on the thickness of the device. This is why I went with the GT Line of MSI laptops instead of the much thinner GS/GE/GP or whatever they have. Have a max temp of 80°C with no thermal throttling and cool and comfortable temperatures around the keyboard area, perfect for longer gaming sessions. Sorry if that almost sound like I’m advertising MSI here but I’m just talking about the experience I made because I always hear people talk about their notebook thermal throttling when they chosed one with a thin design.

i dont quite understand why making the product a little bit bigger is such a no go and why "Professional Products" have to look like they are straight from heaven. My customers dont really care at all how fancy my laptop looks like and neither do i. Workstations just have to WORK fast without having any trouble an LAST as long as possible.

Im just happy that i can cook my eggs while i work

They can certainly find a good balance between thinness and performance/longevity, and then they can market based on that, and people would appreciate it. They'd also appreciate being able to swap basic components *on a professional machine.*

To be honest, I don't mind a slightly thicker machine with a more varied selection of I/O. I'd like some USB 3.0 Type-A connectors (two at least).

Just not Worth buying :(

Watercool it take out that PCB and try to hit 4.8 GHz

You mentioned that other laptop makers were doing similar crap like this, I used to have a Dell 2 in one laptop that ran its fan at full speed constantly when I was playing games on it. I ended up taking off the bottom panel and setting it bottom up. (I had it hooked up to my TV via HDMI) It helped a lot.

I'm gonna be honest I haven't yet experienced any throttling or other problems on my 2018 MacBook Pro. I really do like what it's done for me so far (though I swapped to it from a really worn-down 2012 Retina model)

This Macbook is an insult to Information Technology. No recoverable storage, heats up to 97°C... on a professional computer ?

I am actually kinda amazed at how shitty this thing is

I worked for a big nationally known company whose policy was to save the HDD or SSD in a safe whenever an employee was terminated and getting a new drive to replace it with to use the machine for another user. I can say confidently that the company I worked for will never ever buy a 2018 MacBook Pro primarily because the SSD is soldered on the board. That’s so stupid.

Still using my 2015 MacBook Pro - three years later the keyboard works flawlessly, I have (and use) all the ports and the touch pad is the right size. I have absolutely no interest in a 2016, 2017 or 2018 MBP - especially with that faulty keyboard - there's absolutely no way I'd spend my money on that.

Apple's losing it. They've basically given up on their prosumer customer base and only care about casual users now.

and people like Austin Evans and Jonathan Morrison continues to be biased about such an obvious mistake on apples behalf. Some reviewers just wont believe their god has flaws...

Here in Canada, jumping up to the i9 is almost $500 more. I decided to go for the top-spec non-custom build ( i7/500GB HD/16GB RAM) because if I have any problems under warranty, a replacement machine is readily available in-store.

Hey Linus! Just wanted to say that I have the 2018 13"MBP and highly recommend the "Mount-It" tilter laptop riser stand for it's stellar passive cooling and build quality. Thanks for the great (as always) vid!

I sure as hell wouldnt be happy seeing my CPU hit 90+ degrees whenever I wanna do something with it...

reviewers need to give negative reviews to any laptop trying to go thinner at this point, no one asked for ridiculously thin laptops with no room for a bloody usb port, its not just the MacBook, even the xps 13 is doing the same crap, seriously give me 20mm thick laptop with a decent key travel and legacy ports . no one likes the bloody dongle life

I work on a MacBook Pro. My old MacBook is showing its age. I want a new one but I don't want something that has less ports, no function keys and thermal throttling!

This is a good video. It brought up points I didn't know other manufacturers had thermal problems (prob because i'm kinda a normie). I personally think Apple need to make the MacBook Pros a bit thicker. Not a ton thicker, like 2012-2015 thick (Which is not a lot). I mean, there wasn't really any major problems (that I know of at least) with the older ones. The keyboards worked, and at least the ssd was modular. I had to upgrade in 2017 because my older one which was my daily driver at the time broke, and after thinking I got the 2015 instead of the 2017. I did this because it was cheaper, more useful (had built in usb a, no dongles), about the same specs, and had MagSafe. Anyways, just my opinion.

That soldered SSD is IDIOTIC. Me and a friend have the same MacBook Air 13", he spilled beer on his a few years back and we were able to pull the SSD and swap it into mine to backup the data, after that we were also able to fix the logic board.

I9 in laptop is only possible with a proper thermal management, ie= bigger fatter laptops!

Us creative folks sure appreciate the knowledge and insight of our techie pals! Cheers for this informative review.

I agree. I need this fix or better. I have the 2018 MacBook pro. but falls short of the recall. my laptop gets red-hot and sometimes crashes when the environment gets hot.

The perfect "PLANNED OBSOLESCENCE" laptop. Since SSDs have a limited lifetime either by usage hours or data written. Also Apple will not sell you the motherboard if yours dies, but your motherboard in this case also contains your Hard Drive, what could be considered a liability in some companies, so if your Ram fails, a sensor fails, the CPU fails, the USB ports fail, the battery connector fails, the motherboard warps because the I9 is running at 98 degrees under load, your company data is going to go to Apple untouched just because you can not remove your hard drive? and they are going to keep it in order to replace your board? This is too much of a problem for a lot of companies that take security and privacy seriously, I have seen them physically destroy Hard drives and SSDs before even disposing of a laptop or a tower, those drives will never leave the company.

Ultra slim laptops will NEVER be able to perform as well as a laptop with a little more room for a full-featured cooling solution. The whole idea that EVERYTHING should be thinner is nonsense. A "pro" product ought to focus on performance and connectivity, NOT being the thinnest or lightest solution. As the owner of a 2016 MacBook Pro I was DISAPPOINTED with my purchase in terms of practicality and performance (truthfully I was ripped off and should have just spent around half the money on a modestly-specced ASUS gaming laptop). The 2007 MacBook Pro I used before was a clear example of what a professional product should have been in its day (hideously hot running tendencies and reputation for GPU failures *glares at NVidia* aside)... For a ~£1500 starting price a discrete GPU shouldn't be in question. The i9 edition should be built in an updated version of the 2008-on chassis complete with not only the Thunderbolt 3 ports but ALSO including the basics such as at least 2x USB 3.1 'A' ports and an Ethernet socket. It should also go without saying that a product in this price range should also be repairable. Apple have been design-led for years, however 5 years on from the introduction of the "trash can" Mac Pro it is apparent that the same company who brought us products such as the EXCELLENT pre-2013 Mac Pro and the XServe has become so completely overrun with a form-over-function mentality that I'm less and less likely to continue to invest in Apple products.

The way apple is going, i'm going to say apple definitely goodbye when my macbook pro a1398 stops performing. The new macbooks costs a tremendous amount of money and you get not the quality you expect. Mayor problems with cooling, impossible to replace components and if it's broken it costs you a lot of money. Design has become more important then quality. I don't necessary want a very thin laptop. It is ok to make thicker ones which has better cooling and has the possibility to replace components. If that's the case it is almost a no brainer for me to buy an expensive macbook pro.... It is for me as a consumer all about TRUST and the USP from apple WAS quality.....

I have a 2018 Macbook pro and after seeing your water cooled Macbook video i have been playing with the idea of trying to cool my Macbook Pro so it can perform longer at fast speeds. My first idea was to try to force more air though, that proved to be more difficult than expected. Now i am debating putting some thermal pads on top of the cpu heat sink to transfer some heat to the case, then put a thin heat sink on the bottom of the computer. Let me know your thoughts. I already have taller rubber feet on my computer to allow a little more air flow and also a bit of room if i decide to add a heatsink.

The only reason I want a MBP is because my boss pays for it; and it runs OSX. If it were my own money I would want the Dell XPS because you get more hardware for just over half the price (but with a 4k screen and a wider ports selection). Apple used to have MARKETING at the 2nd place in their list of priorities, TECH came first. The first amazing touch screens, the first amazing fingerprint reader, the whole iPod lineup was magnificent and changed the world for MP3's. But now? The touch bar that nobody really needs? It's more of a hindrance. And it costs us a lot of money. Crappy key switches shouldn't pass quality control. MagSafe was AMAZING and everybody loved it and they removed it... for USB-C... so they can sell dongles... to make the marketing staff happy. Apple is out of touch, it's as simple as that. Appeasing the investors and forgetting their clients. The SECOND Microsoft makes W10 have a reliable UI and makes it work effortlessly with a Unix subsystem I'll switch without ever looking back. I'm a programmer and I hate the Windows environment for developing software, but I really really want OUT of the Apple ecosystem. The iPhones are ridiculously expensive too nowadays, unless I opt for a "cheap" version which is still more expensive (in price alone) than most Android flagships... And remember the fingerprint ID thing that Apple did amazingly well? Just like the MagSafe: Everybody loved it! So they removed that on the iPhone X because now they want to reduce the user experience again for who knows what reason. I'm in the minority I guess. But they're going to meet their end in a couple of years if they stop innovating and continue overpricing their products. The Indian and Chinese and Korean companies are already there, ready to take over. And I want them to. If Dell can make a better specced XPS laptop for about half the price of an Apple MBP, then I'm just wondering what some Indian company could whip up. Bring it on, I say. I'm done with Apple and my iPhone 7 is my last iPhone.

Do the people that dislike the video within the first 5 minutes really subscribe and put on notifications just to dislike the video?😂😂

so what's the best MacBook Pro ? for coders and UI design

I still have my mid-2012 MBP Retina, in which I did have to replace the keyboard and top case due to a few keys failing earlier this year... past that, though, it still runs flawlessly. I bought a 2017 MBP 15" Touchbar around that time as well and honestly for some things the 2012 is actually a better/faster machine. I'm probably going to offload the 2017 model at some point if and when they re-engineer things again, even though I have no major complaints. My luck with Apple products and their service has generally been positive.

I am an Apple user, I have always been a fan. But for the last couple of years, I completely disagree with their philosophy of every edition of a newer machine having to be much thinner instead of actually improving and upgrading the machine with adequate components and cooling. I mean my gosh, the 2012 or so version of the MacBook Pro WAS PLENTY THIN. I would much rather it be that size, and have plenty of cooling and be SSD and RAM upgradable. My dad bought a HP convertible (detachable) laptop where the screen comes off and all of the components are actually in the screen area which has NO FANS OR COOLING WHATSOEVER and from being left in his car for an hour or so in a briefcase the laptop completely fried the display and CPU. Absolutely ridiculous that was like $700-$800 professional use laptop... So it’s not just Apple. The whole thing is just silly. With the technology we have now these machines can only be so thin. Most people would agree that performance, cooling, reliability and upgradability is more important than size.

This years i9 vs this years midrange i7 is a more interesting comparison imo, the two extra cores keep the 2018s mostly above all previous, but the real question is if the i9 is any better than the midrange i7 in the same thermal envelope (in most tests, it's not worth it).

LTT has officially taken over my youtube feed. Bless you Linus!

Running Matlab from mathworks creates thermal spikes even under no load. In other subject, Have you notice for a few years now, the keyboard on MacBook Pro devices damage the anti-reflecting coating due to the physical contact that takes place when the machine is closed?

They've been designing computers this way for three decades. The Apple 3 had no cooling, so the board would warp and the chips would pop out of their sockets. Apple's tech support fix? "Have you tried dropping it?" I don't understand why people buy Apple products.

I was so waiting for "This video is sponsored by The Rossmann Group. Don't delay"....LOL

Hi Linus what are you using to film? Hardware and software and editing please. Also what lighting please ???

Recently upgraded from an aging but still competent 2011 mbPro to a top spec 2017 mbPro b/c I got it off ebay for about 50% off Apple retail. Your video is making me really happy I didn't go for a 2018

Lol that one guy in the chat called that they would remove the power gadget utility.

7:17 RIP, the 8750H can pass 1200 points in Cinebench without throttling, so still getting less than an i7 there :/ wonder if it's just due to the difference between windows / macos performance.

@ 9:30 ... And people over clock thin notebooks as soon as they get them out of the box..... As long as I can run any game in ULTRA @ 60fps and everything is stable .... I'm happy. I have the GT75 Titan....Its the cooling that attracted me.

Wow, that's a really good review. I am very impressed. Thanks!

I hate Apple so much, is it really necessary to solder everything on the logic board. And price it like bloody gold.

Me: watching LTT videos is making me hungry! *Gets my Macbook Pro 2018* time to cook some egg!

What do you think the best laptop for music production would be??? Thanks! Subscribed!

Very well crafted presentation. I definitely agree. Guys like you lead the charge against “form before function” discussions. Cheers Linus.

It wouldn't be a mac-book without wasting customers money on thermal throttling. May as well put a lower end CPU in.

How to know when get a new laptop: When your $1000 MacBook Air takes an hour+ to render a 5min video at 1080p...

I am glad indeed that I did not upgrade my 2017 MacBook pro 15” specked out model. I know my machine is not everyone's favorite. However, it has never given me any of the issues displayed in your video. As a filmmaker who shoots and edits on the go, my 2017 Macbook Pro does everything I have asked of it yet; I have never had the problem of overheating.

The biggest issue for me remains the lack of a post-2015 MBP option without a touch bar. Melting processors I can handle. No function keys? ... glad I got the 2015.

They're sacrificing practicality an usability to make an unnecessary super thin laptop. I get thinner looks better an easier to manuver but if you're spending 600+ to 3k on a laptop its ability to function is the main priority. Chips are getting cooler, faster, lower power consumption and they're 100% convinced everyone just wants smaller devices.. when i'd personally prefer that battery life be the primary objective. Its why i'm so annoyed at AMD for putting 2-3 celled batteries in their 2500u laptops when they could have put in a 9 celled battery an had that laptop run like 12-15hrs before needing to be charged. I could care less that it weighs 1-2 pounds more. Its more practical to use as a portable pc if it can actually run a decent amount doing a reasonable workload without needing to be charged.

Why are people still buying Apple crap? (rhetorical question)

Nice work keep up the honest work.

I doubt the PCB would warp at 100 degrees C. I’ve been running the same 5 layer PCB cards from -55 to 170C constantly for 6 years for validation on devices I work on. The FR4 material can handle the temp cycles no problem.

the "thinner and lighter"craze was initiated long ago but significant consumer demand died out around the time intel's first "core I#" cpu's came out as most need for thinner and lighter at that point became efficiency and no longer required smaller designs only better thermal and power systems the problem now is that most manufacturers seem to have stopped listening at exactly the point of the first core I# cpu's and assume that we still wanted smaller and lighter devices (yes a less than 1lb device is nice but give me a 20-30lb laptop for my real gaming and work with 75% of that weight as cooling) we only complain to apple about this yet every oem seems to do this the time of thinner and lighter died 10 years ago now we must focus 100% on making the hardware we have perform to spec (cooling) or beyond (overkill cooling to promote full turbo speeds)

my how times change... Today is a far cry from the past. In 2000, I spent $4000 on hardware, software, and accessories, on a tricked out Blue and White G3. I was able to upgrade the CPU twice, once to a 1 GHz G3, and again to a similarly clocked G4. I initially had 128 MB of RAM, but was able to max out it's RAM to 1 GB... Not much by todays standards, but back then, not bad. I had a 12 GB hard drive, that I upgraded to 120 GB, then I eventually added four 250 GB drives, using a PCI expansion card and some custom mounting hardware. Eventually, I replaced one of those with a 750 GB drive. I swapped the modem with a serial module, so I could use my old TI graph link cable, and chip programmer cables. It was a nice, expandable computer, with an easy open chassis, and I loved it. The last Mac I bought was the G5. I bought it at a bad time. Apple had already made the transition to Intel, and it was all I could afford. I quickly saw how rapidly they dropped support for the Power PC equipped models, and I was stuck in a stagnant doldrums for years. The economy took a downturn and I simply couldn't afford a new computer anymore. I suffered and struggled on that out of date, obsolete, and unloved machine till 2013. I was seeing new income. It was time to buy a new machine. I was actually impressed with some of the 2010 and on Mac Pros, and hoped to get a used one when the used prices came down, after their 2013 Pro was announced... And then we learned it was rubbish... A literal trash bin. Those old expandable 2010s never dropped in price, cause they were too sought after. It was by my luck that the Hackintosh scene had developed much simpler to use tools, and the process was decidedly easier. I ended up building a 3770K based Quad core i7 Hackintosh. It had 18 TB of storage, all migrated over from my G5. It had 16 GB of RAM, and by reusing parts, salvaging, and buying new only what I needed to, I spent a measly $630 to get it up and running! I couldn't have settled on a Mac Mini for that price! I soon spent $50 on a used Radeon HD 5770, and later some $400 on a GTX 980ti. I doubled my RAM, maxing out at 32 GB. I've since upped my storage to over 23 TB, with 1.24 TB of space bing across a pair of SSDs, one for Mac OS, and one for Windows. I'd like to upgrade my core system soon. A new CPU, mobo, and RAM will do wonders, though the hardware, despite being 5 years old, is still holding it's own. Until Apple changes it's ways... and it's not gonna... I won't buy from them again. Apple has lost their way.

useful reminder to user preparing to get a new mac book pro!! thanks so much

Appreciate your input!!! Will stick to my old 2014 mac pro for now XD

the core i9 is poorly implemented in almost every current laptop except for the Alienware 17 and the larger Asus ROG laptop. Apple shouldn't have stuck it into their 15 with no updated thermals. The update to the 13 inch though is very refreshing and probably the fasted 13 inch laptop I have had the pleasure of using.

Tbt to when Apple was good. I used to love Macs, and they had good upgradability, coupled with an OS that shoots Windows out of the water, it was a genuinely great. But this is bullshit, and this is coming from someone who loved Apple. I still don’t mind their iPhones, but their Macs are trash I’m sorry. It’s sad, there’s so much potential here

also i had to replace it the first day i got it because it was running hot. And what was sad was that i was just running garage band. it kept crashing. i didn't understand why . like it was running hot hot

Heya- aweome video! Was just doing some research before buying the Macbook Pro 2018, as I do mostly Photo and Video Editing, I believe this is a good upgrade form my current 2012 model. How would you recommend keeping the laptop cool? And protecting it from data loss?

"Pro" tagged onto a naming scheme is just another way for a company to charge more these days. Prosumer Devices are becoming more of a "PR" campaign to SELL SELL SELL, & at a premium; than actually creating something that is truly able to handle the needs of a "Pro User" in today's world..... Cheers, A

I'd love to have someone to extended stress tests. Let the machine run 24/7. Set a script to run a workload for 8 hours then let it cool down for 4, then 8 more hours... over and over again for weeks.

These suppose to have the 9th gen intel chips that are 10 nm architecture, but due to delays it had to stick with 8th gen chips. I'm hoping for a quiet update in late 2018 (too optimistic), or early 2019 (around the March event).

What would be te best apple macbook pro, that you can still upgrade ssd or ram... Shouln'd they built it a little more high? To enable m2 ssd replacement?