It makes me think the DC5 could have had so much more fame and longevity if Dave had been less I'll say ruthless. It seems to me the creativity of the members and writers weren't respected or paid accordingly. No wonder they left, think of the heights they could have reached. I wish you would have been paid and given the credit that you deserved,

Hello, Ron! I was hoping you’d catch this video! Thank you for corroborating what I researched it really helps a lot. My purpose was to try and shed some light on you and Mike as the writers of many of the early hits since the band is in the HOF, and I know that there are some “perks” that come along with that, such as autograph sessions and panels at music conventions. I will never understand why for some people “all the money in the world” is never enough. Dave had to have it all but didn’t see that keeping you and Mike happier probably would’ve meant more longevity and success for the band. But I guess it’s all in the past. All we can do now is try to add your story to the tapestry. I hope I’ve done that. Thanks for checking in, Ron!

@@TheGuitarHistorian Hello and thanks for your kind words. It's great that there are some people like you around who are 'truth seekers'. I still find it hard to believe even after all these years that after all the help I gave to Dave Clark who at one time I counted as a friend he would turn out to be so greedy, I was willing to give him 50% of my songs (what other song writer would do that?) because we were friends and in the end 50% was not enough for him. Also by saying that unless I let him and Mike Smith put their names to my songs so that he could appear to the DC5 fans as the Bands writers I would not get my 50% (which by the way I never got) he robbed me of having my name on million selling songs which would have helped my song writing career when the Band disbanded. Still I don't hate Dave Clark, people find it strange when I say that, but hate is a very negative thing, and it can consume the hater, but in fact I pity him, OK he made a fortune, and made it on other peoples talents, but what did it cost him in human terms??? I always say 'a person's life is written on their face' and if you look at recent photo's of Dave Clark it's all there to see, all the greed, it's sad to see. Once again thanks for your kind words, time and effort, and hours of research, I thank you and I wish you well.

Hello Ron, nice to hear from you again. I'm not sure if you would remember me but we were having a long conversation on KZfaq a while back. You were sending me links to some of your songs, which I really enjoyed. I'm glad to see you on here to confirm some of the reality from back then. I'm also very grateful for this upload. Let the truth prevail!

@@magneto7930 Hello!! I hope you are well. Glad you like my newer songs. There is a Band in Yorkshire called 'All you need is drums' who are working on an album of my new songs, I have heard a few rough cuts and it's going very well indeed!!

think it was the Best one

and ohoh what a voice

@@jennifursun3303 That is why his nickname was Boomer. He had an amazing voice on the soft ballads also. One of the best!

I wondered why he was called Mike “Boomer” Smith. Not for being a baby boomer, then.

Dave wanted to be the central focus but I always zeroed in on Mike Smith. This video was very enlightening.

I was in the music buiness[ country ] side for forty years until I retired in my hometown NASHVILLE, I found that most bands or single singers will do anything to get a record deal and the producers and other music bigwigs know it, Some of the women singers had to do what is called SPREAD EM, and male singers had to give half of the money they made to the producers and the singers only got a little if it was a hit, But WAYLON, WILLIE, BOBBY BEAR, GEORGE JONES, DAVID ALLEN COE, fought the bigwigs until it changed it, MERLE HAGGARD, HANK JR, are big names and have huge fanbases and have made some good records and are rich and both in my opinion are two of the biggest bull- shiters in NASHVILLE when HANK JR. would hold an outside concert in NASHVILLE he would pretend to be drinking JACK DANIELS BUT IT WAS TEA and he would instigate a fight between boys from KNOXVILLE AND NASHVILLE BOYS while he is safely on stage with bodyguards around him, It's all about the money, a few years ago they made a movie about HANK GARLAND who was one of the top guitar pickers and the tragedy he was involved it,that movie shows hot dirty the Nashville music side is,

I always call them The Mike Smith Five too! Mike was a great talent…,.

I think Dave was probably a bully. He claimed for publicity purposes (to appeal to kids) that he was three years younger than he actually was/is. So, he manipulated (in my opinion) the younger members of the group. Plus, he was a fitness freak, and perhaps that gave him an added edge; older and stronger.

We all thought that as well growing up in the 60's..

The Dave Clark Five a lost band? NOPE! I agree with you.

Me too! 😉

Agree about Mike Smith. My family saw them in concert in 65 in Virginia Beach, at least I thought they were playing and singing. Not so sure if what I heard was just a recording. Anyway they did have many great songs.

Mike was a good singer but I think you underestimate Dave Clark. He was one of the first people to buck the system by owning the rights to his own music. While the five person group was a great combination, Dave would have been successful with whatever group he put together.

@@joemalon5763 not in my opinion.....he could not sing... nor were his drumming skills very good....maybe he could have been their manager.

@@katebrownlee56 that's your opinion and you're entitled to it. My opinion is that he was one of the better drummers of that time and Mike Smith was a good singer but no Paul McCartney or Mick Jagger. Have you seen the documentary on the Dave Clark Five? In it, they say he was a musical and business genius accomplishing things before even the Beatles.

@@joemalon5763 mick jagger sounds like a screeching owl..McCartney smooth and soothing Mike Smith raspy and strong ....Saw them in concert 7 x Dave Clark mediocre ....

Smith was the group, Clark was a joke, and the fact that he was not even the drummer on their recorded songs says it all.

Yea Me Too..As A 71 year old , After All Those Years, I Still Have The First Two Mono Albums With Clark's Name On Most of the Tracks! But There's One Song On Session with The Dave Clark Five ( first Album) Called On Broadway , A Real Tribute to Mike Smith..👍

I was born in 1952. I would love to love these presentations, but the super-rushed delivery takes any joy OUT of my experience. You are too close to the mic, and why is the hardware so prominent? Yes, I have roaring Tinitus, having been the sound roadie for the Association in 1975, followed by 30 years in recording studios where producers always wanted the monitors up too loud. (Everything sounds great up loud, but that why Aurotones were invented). I truly wish I could partake of your presentations . . .

I'm 67. Heartbroken is the right word. I had their autographs framed and hanging on my wall. After I heard the real story, I took the autographs down. I no longer look at them.

oh lucky you

All I know is the DC5 had a most terrific blending of voices, the 1st & 2nd voices giving out a really great blend. At 75 yrs old, I stand by what I always claimed, they were better than the Beatles! Nevermind the facts here mentioned, past is past, Dave led the group & they made it, so why bring the past up? I loved them as a group! ❤❤❤

He sure was.. he was the best and i think underrated at times. Love you Mike

Dave Clark was a narcissistic sociopath who only ever cared about his own interests. It is heartbreaking what he did to those 4 hard-working guys especially Mike Smith.

oh that is such a bitter sweet story share - thank you

Guess Mr Clark's invoice for that ticket got lost in the post ....

@@Krzyszczynski I can see that you are against the DC5, so nothing they did is revelent . I like the band regardless of who played on the records and it was Dave's conception of what they wore , recorded or otherwise. He was the manager and retained all rights to the songs. No one knows what the members were paid but they all seemed to do very well after the band broke up, except Mike. He made a few bad investments in the music business and lost quite a lot of money. But he wasn't poverty stricken.

Helped out by an echo chamber and reverb.

@@howie9751 who wasn't

Seemed like DC5’s McCartney.

@@TheCheermeister Had the voice couldn't write like him

I prefer John Lennon. Sue me.

You only have his word he actually wrote anything. A real songwriter would have insisted his name be on an agreement somewhere..

No way in the top 5 but still amazing.. The top 10 would be a hell of a argument alone and he would not make that either.

Ron thank you for the great songs you wrote! Some of my favs… sorry to hear about the Business side .

Yes me too . Found out AFTER the Fact that Mike did some solo concerts but I never knew about them or I would have gone.

@John Cottet Yeah when Mike toured with his own band in 2003there was some fallout about using the DC5 name when advertising the concerts.The venues must have gotten around it because I’ve seen videos with banners mentioning the DC5 name. Hard to believe DC would still want to cash in on his former bandmates🤦🏻‍♀️

Dave Clark did not even drum on DC5 records. Nor did he write the songs he claimed credit for. He did produce the records.

I absolutely agree. But at the Shindig the stupid camera never focused on Mike. That time.. 1964, I was in high school in Seoul, South Korea watching it on US military broadcasting AFKN-TV channel 2.

The “ Mike Smith One “ would have been the reality . Listen to the other instruments. Yes they sound decent on the recordings, but that was not the DC 5 playing or singing with the exception of Mike Smith …

Agree ! Mike Smith was the sound of the DC Five.

The other were literally employees of DC. They should never have excepted the situation. Ed

I knew Mike very well, and I agree with what you say to a point, what I would add is don't overlook the fine work Len' and Den' did in the Band. They were both very good song writers and singers and were a big part in the Bands success.

@@ronvonryan Touché

@@CliffBoothe Shall we call it a draw Cliff LOL.

@@ronvonryan cream rises to the top and it is heartwarming to finally hear/read these treasured stories. Many thanks for opening up!

@@CliffBoothe The thanks should also go to 'truth seekers' like 'The Guitar Historian' for his hard work, time, and effort seeking the truth.

I have heard and you can ask Ron Ryan that Dave made a rule NO TALKING about him or the group or get sued

You have to figure DC had them sign nondisclosure agreements with egregious penalties if they violated them.

@@jennifursun3303 Dave exhibits paranoid sociopathic behaviour. He obviously cared for no one but Dave. I mean, he literally ripped off his friends and bandmates while they were together. We aren't exactly looking at Carl Palmer or Ginger Baker. More like Tom Parker mixed with an okay drummer.

Davidson was, indeed, a very talented guitarist.

Len has whispered a few things here and there. And that is all anyone can say until...

I think he was even BETTER than most of the guys you mentioned.

@@mikehunt-fx7sf - I understand completely. Clever name mike. I like it. Mine used to be Dick Hertz.

@@lastrada52 That is just too funny ! Good one !! LOL !!

agree about Mikes voice

Bobby Graham played on the Kinks first four UK singles and on 75% of The Kinks' debut album. Clem Cattini played on almost all of the group's 3rd album"The Kink Kontroversy" (excepting "Milk Cow Blues" & "Ring The Bells" which feature Mick Avory)

Bobby had an insanely powerful style in any setting but would definitely stick to the stomping template set forth by DC at their sessions. His fills on "It Don't Feel Good" from the Try Too Hard LP are positively explosive!!

Due to a very old friend of mine playing with Bobby Graham on various projects i got to chat with him on many occasions. He was happy to talk about the old days and who he had recorded with. But as his pals said to me it would be a much shorter conversation if i just asked him who he had not recorded with.

Bobby Graham actually came up with that thundering backbeat on the drums that Clark took credit for. He also screwed several songwriters.

Another good drummer around at the time ,with Clem Cattini and Bobby Graham was Mick Underwood.I saw him playing once and marvelled at his technique. Chatting with him after he reeled off plenty of names who got the benefit of his services..I think to be employed as a session drummer ,at that time ,in London you had to be excellent at your instrument ,with the ability to read drum music charts as well..( and to be a tad judicious about telling whom you have " ghost " drummed for !)

trebblemaker: you made an accurate point: there are many sad stories of musicians tragically ripped off in the music industry, so much it almost seems the norm.

Naive, you certainly aint.

He had one of the best raw rock voices, sang with such emotion and passion....him standing by that key board, standing tall and blasting out pure bubble gum clasics.

accident? I was just expressing my concern for a band mates malfeasance above, Ron Ryan. Maybe some incidental pay back leveling of the playing field - such a dark side to the many those, who maybe reaped a better share of what might otherwise been a more rightful, Mutual distribution.

@@thhomasmarks 🤔 Confused on your comment on Mikes eventual, life ending, accident.

​@@thhomasmarks dude died in that.

Toe to toe for about 5 minutes!

@@essexboy5520 More like 4years!

@@PhilZaza23 Mike Smith was a real talent, no doubt about it. THE DC5 had a couple of good singles ie Catch us if you can, is a 60s classic, but not one credible album! And yes I've heard ALL there 60s studio albums ( I collect records) there weak, to put it politely. So they definitely can NOT be compared to those 4 blokes from Liverpool!

@@essexboy5520 I didn’t compare them to the Beatles I said they went toe to toe with them meaning the Radio hits they had which were many in the early sixties. This was before AOR radio stations! I’m not talking about there albums I’m talking about thereHits. By the way there were No groups that could come close to the Beatles as far as there albums as a whole were concerned and that includes The Stones TheWho , The Kinks or any other British Invasion band! But they were All great Bands in my humble opinion.

@@PhilZaza23 Not gonna dissagree with that. 👍🙂

I saw those shows, too. They sounded great. Dave Clark even did a crazy drum solo where he stood up, walked around the drums and played congas as well--all with a futuristic light show.

In retrospect his vocals alone is the only thing that stands up well against the Beatles.

@@ijeff2005 the closest thing one could call competition to the Beatles was the Stones. which as those who prefer the Beatles wasnt much...Mike Smith was very good and great with the right song

@@tomdale1313 I think that is true. I probably didn't make my point very well. Another way to put it, the Beatles had the DC5 beat on songwriting, instrumentation, creativity and musical progression. But, Mike Smith's lead vocals were ever bit as impressive as the best efforts of McCartney, Lennon and Harrison. I'd also have to say that mono production mix Clark used created even more excitement to their early records than the Beatles efforts from that same period. As much as I loved "I Saw Her Standing There" and "I Want To Hold Your Hand", when I first heard "Glad All Over" and "Bits and Pieces", it totally blew my mind. Then when "Any Way You Want It" came out I never heard anything that sounded as big as that. They had completely won me over.

@@tomdale1313 Yes, but the stones org had a blues sound and then a rougher rock. it wasn't fair for the Stones because they only had Mick. Just not fair. The Stones however followed the Beatles to constantly look ahead and never stay the same not even to look back to see who was copying them..

I agree. Just like Brian Epstein was NOT the Beatles. Just the manager.

@@egverlander No one ever said Brian Epstein was the Beatles. He never claimed to write their songs.

@@aristedecomgmailcom You completely missed the point. Have another toke.

@@egverlander What point was that? Are you able to tell me?

@@aristedecomgmailcom Good point. Although The Beatles have their own drumming conspiracy, Epstein never played the drums. He just sat back and dictated. DC could have done the same, but his name was upfront and he could play, so ....

I always loved that one too. Not many people mention it but it is one of the greatest and did quite well on the charts too.

"But we both know what happens to them in the end"

@Count Orlock Yes it was. In the U.S. they had one more high charting song in 1967. Ironically they did much better in the UK in the late 60s.

Try2Hard was my “gateway drug” into the DC5. Nothing else ever rivaled it. It remains their standout.

Not quite. It's one thing to be financially savvy, it's another thing to lie and cheat your band mates. And true musicians do put the music first. I've been around too many people who played music primarily for money and it's no fun. Money should be second.

a good case good be made for the Turtles and Paul Revere...

Raiders bassist Phil Volk played on the records. So did lead guitarist Drake Levin.

And The Left Banke.

The speech that Tom Hanks gave at the DC5 induction was shameful. Did he really believe the stuff he said?

@@Mister_Pedantic Shameful? Tom Hanks' speech at the DC5 induction was positive and uplifting. Dave Clark thanked Hanks, and said it was an honor to be introduced by such a distinguished actor. Did you even see the speech?

I love the DC5 and started playing/taking lessons on drums back in 1962. I always said that back then by 1970 there were three solos you needed to know -the Safari's Wipe Out Iron Butterfly's Innagadda Divida (sp) and Rare Earth's Get Ready. I actually learned to play Wipe Out with one hand (using my fingers of course, not a stick) for showing off around the office ..lol. Man that was a great era for EVERYTHING!

I used to hate it when as a drummer in high school someone would ask me, "can you play wipeout." Kids were so easily impressed with almost nothing. Ginger Baker was my hero.

The Drifters did that back in 1963.

I SAW THEM LIVE ALSO 67 GREENVILLE SC ... MY FIRST CONCERT ! THOSE WERE THE DAYS ....

Jon Hiseman probably missed that...

True many Bands did use session players, but they all admit to doing this, only Dave Clark still says that he played on the hits.

@@ronvonryan which of course is a big fat LIE. Bobby Graham one of the top studio drummers played on the majoprity of their hits between 64-66.Clark drummed on the tours. I mean he had to.

Clark a manipulator liar greedy scam artist

@@ronvonryan - and even more germane to this grotesque example of what money can do to "friendship", how many studio players - including The Wrecking Crew - were ever assured, sealed with a handshake, that they'd be "taken care of properly" by a FRIEND, who then completely reneged on that agreement? Ron, I'm just so SO glad (all over) to have learned the truth about a man who wrote so many of the great songs that framed my youth. Thank you, Brother, for the extraordinary soundtrack you helped to provide any and all of us who "came of age" at such a formative time in this nation's (the US) history. Civil Rights Movement, Vietnam and the Anti-War Movement (my brother served USMC in Vietnam '68-'69), the Women's Movement, Watergate and Nixon, etc. (Brian Patrick Clarke, NOT my wife, Kathy, LOL!)

@@kathyjohnsonclarkeoly2710 Hello Kathy, thank you for your wonderful words, And yes you are I am sure right, many session players and writers both sides of the pond back in the day got ripped off. In the music business you expect to get ripped off by managers, agents, and promoters, that's par for the course, but not from someone you regarded as a close friend, that as my American friends would say came right out of left field!! Dave Clark was going to get 50% of my songs for doing nothing!! I did all the writing and the music, but that was not enough for him, very sad. I often wonder if all that money made him happy? but I doubt it.

Thank you again, Ron! So glad I could return some justice to you and your efforts.

@@TheGuitarHistorian And thank you mate, if you lived near me I would take you down my local Village pub and buy you a pint or two!!! Stay safe mate.

I LOVE i know you. I always rhought it should have been an A side single in its own right. Ba da da da bump!

Also check out Lenny's jazzy guitar on the cool instrumental "Time" on the Glad All Over album. And his country-tinged guitar work on "I'm On My Own" from the I Like It Like That album to accompany his rare lead vocals. Awesome and certainly very underrated!

I agree! Very under rated! Anybody can play the guitar but when an artist can make the instrument talk to you, that goes beyond talent! Davidson did that!

Davidson went on to become a music teacher and took up classical guitar. I once played a Vivaldi trio with him at a classical guitar festival. Great player.

The DC5 should have featured Davidson’s guitar playing more than they did. The song “I’m on my own” was a different sound for them. That was a Nashville sound and he was on fire! I had read where he was playing more classical guitar in recent years. Thanks for sharing that about him, Donald.

Lenny Davidson, great singer and song writer !

@fangirllinda1964 I wanted to say thank you to Guitar Historian for recounting and accurate story of the DC5... Cheers to Ron Ryan for chiming in too.😘🎶😘I’ve read his comments on other sites and it makes me appreciate the music more ! I think this whole time I’ve been a Ron Ryan fan 😀🎶

Somebody, somewhere must have a decent live recording of them besides those semi live recordings on Ed Sullivan. The only one I know of is “Nineteen Days” at a royal performance. KZfaq has it.

no he didn't, the Divine concert only lasted 12 minutes. They opened with Peter Gunn, then Do You Love me, Money ,Glad All Over. It was half way through the next number "Bits and Pieces" that the concert was stopped due to overcrowding and numerous people being hurt. Most folks I've interviewed who were there said they couldn't hear anything for the crowd noise

@TheRealJukebox I bought the Star Club album back in 1977 when it was released. Regardless of the fidelity, it's actually one of my favorite albums because of the whole atmosphere and the historical aspects of it.

Sorry to contradict you Bjorn

@@artiewithers6980 What part of the appearances on Ed Sullivan were live? Certainly not the singing, not with the microphones a foot or more away from the actors' faces. I remember the time they tried to perform Any Way You Want It live on Sullivan, with cables running across the floor for effect. It was a dreadful performance.

It worked

Jan Wenner is a HACK, & RS mag is nothing but pretentious twaddle!NOT to be taken seriously! I mean come on, the ONLY band they really stood behind were the Grateful Dead for god's sake!

Rap band??

@@linb5216 LOL!

A rap group being inducted into the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame is akin to Joe Biden residing in the White House. The fix is in!

@@rockahbilly76 LOL!

I remember a friend of mine, his mother, driving us to see the movie “Having a Wild Weekend”. Both of us were just shy of our 16th birthday that June 1965 so we were not driving. All I remember most, for some reason, as we passed a Pontiac on the street. It hood was up and the engine had overheated. I don’t remember much about the actual movie except it seem rather non-consequential. I like to help a lot better a couple of months later. This was in Oklahoma City. I now live in Southern California. I may go rent that movie at the last movie rental store I know of, Cinefile.

Not exactly the best movie in the world, but I didn’t care!

I agree with what you say about the writing of this piece Bob, it must have taken much hard work, time, and effort to do researching all the facts. Here's some more facts, each Band member had to sign a contract to Dave Clark if they wanted to stay in the Band!! And they were paid a set weekly wage regardess of how much the Band was making on tours, live shows, and TV shows. Also it was written in the contract that any song any of the Band members wrote had to have Dave's name on as 'co writer' so that Dave could take 50% of each songs royalties.

@@ronvonryan I could say something nasty about Clark...but...it's Sunday

@@BobPerrone Don't say anything nasty about him mate, pity him, he made his fortune from exploting his friends (like me) and his Bandmates, and he has to live with that, so pity him, a very sad indevidual

Amen to that Tom.

Agree 100 percent!

'Anyway you want it' was the last song I wrote for the DC5. I was pleased with it as I thought it would mark a new direction for the Band, a more Gospel/Soul/ Rock way to go. But it was then that Dave Clark made it clear that he was not going to pay me the agreed %0% of my songs, and so like I said that was the last song I wrote for the Band.

@@ronvonryan Hi Ron, as a 10 year old I thought this was the most kick ass song around. I wore out the 45. I do remember your name in the song listings. I also remember Adrian Clark. Was that another partnership between Dave and somebody else?

@@htwrk2 Thanks Bill. As for Adrian Clark he was a procucer and no relation to Dave I believe.

@@ronvonryan Thank you for the reply. I knew Bobby Graham was the session drummer for Dave but was there a session player for Rick Huxley? I heard it was Eric Ford, don’t know if that’s true. All I know as a kid was that I loved the fat round bass sounds on the records.

So very true, I always call them The Mike Smith Five!

Agree, Mike had a great voice.

Exactly. I love the clip of the Ed Sullivan show where the background tape freezes, and the guys, in front of the crowd, just stand looking at each other until they get it cued up again. I'm a big fan of the music, but I don't think I've ever heard them actually play live.

@@JohnSmith-oj6ir From what I’ve read, they went down a storm at their local gigs, Clark’s very basic foot stomping four in a bar was ok for live, dancehall gigs. Clark’s talent was in the management of the band and music.

@@JohnSmith-oj6ir Mike made light of it with that face he made. Again, that performance was semi live, if I recall.

Love the "Paul Harvey" pause! 😊

Great memories.

Dave broke all the bones in his right hand in the 70s, so he could never play again. He used a session drummer for the few appearances they made and a backing track.

@@wesleycook7687 That's Clark's story, what's his excuse for using a studio drummer on their songs in the sixties ??? I'm not really sure he produced the recordings because I have a CD that has actual recording sessions and it was Mike Smith making all the calls.

@@wesleycook7687 Dave Clark could not play drums before he broke all his bones in his right hand

@@johnclay4811 that's your opinion not mine.

@@wesleycook7687 Hi Wes agreed yes an opinion , which is actually true. Ask any self respecting drummer who their heroes are. You will hear names like Bonham Rich Krupa Morello, Paice, Copeland etc. Dave Clark would never come up , unless of course if the bloke who was saying it has got the same lack of technical skill and general inability to play drums as Clark. Buddy Rich has been dead the thick end of 40 years and is still the guv. Clark is a billion billion miles away from that.

DC5 weren't a real band. DC didn't write the songs he claimed and didn't play on DC5 records. Mike Smith was the real deal however.

And (as per the DC5) some were screwed over by their heartless band mates eg: Tom Jones' shameful treatment of his band the Squires comes to mind. (source: "Just help yourself" by Vernon Hopkins)