Heck yeah!! I think art is a wonderful way to bring post structuralist prompts to the table, and if you really want to lean into it, ask the players to add descriptions to what the characters see and feel! But that’s really a whole other video!!

My first thought was: I bet Deleuze and Guattari would have been a serious pain to DM for xD

@@ogreboy8843 True. I think they would see D&D having revolutionary potential but in its current state they would say its fascistic.

@@suicidalbomber8048 ...and use Tom Hanks from Mazes and Monsters as an icon of schizo resistance seeking lines of flight. 🤣

As a Doctor of Philosophy with a thesis exploring rhizomatic thinking, I am over the moon to hear someone applying this unorthodox method of thinking to ttrpg Bravo

Thank you so much!! I’ve never been called a chad before!! Haha

Came here to say the same thing lol

Yes yes

I so agree! This is something I keep coming back to Map Crow for. He gets my thoughts running but they are still MY thoughts. I mean, he gives ideas, leaping off points, his own opinion, but it's less like a 'guide' and more like... yeah I don't know there's just something very refreshing about it all.

Nice one!

That works most of the time, but if you happen to run a very old school party that enters the same dungeon more than once, and they choose a different path and notice that you basically railroaded them a bit, well, then they know. I think I would run it very differently in this case, they'd end up somewhere in the middle of the dungeon and have to get out again.

@@profezzordarke4362 You're not wrong. I guess if I knew they were re-entering the dungeon I'd make something else for the path they otherwise took, likely harder than the shortcut they created.

One way of dealing with a sandbox is with the pacing. Whatever path the players decide to take, the clock keeps ticking and there will be consequences to their intervention or non-action. At the same time, it allows you to add even more life to your world because it's not only reacting to your players, it's breathing on its own. That's gonna be up to your players to catch up...

Oh wow. Just yesterday we had a moment like that where they went into a dungeon at night and when they came out the hamlet they rest at was being attacked by a bunch of flesh creatures. I made it very clear to them they wouldn't have attacked that night if they hadn't beaten a different boss the session prior.

This is great and part of the simulation. Our world has ancient trade routes because they were the safest routes.

I started holding my pencils this way before I learned the right way to do it, and it just stuck, I guess. Haha! Cheers!

I'll let my players make bad decisions, but I make sure they know what their characters would know. "Since you were raised in a nearby kingdom, you know that xyz would be very insulting to your hosts." Sometimes I'll call for an ability check to decide how well their character recognizes a hazard that's not obvious to the players. "This architectural style seems familiar to you. This type of entrance is usually trapped and guarded."

I find rhizomatic games easier to prep for especially when using the Lazy DM Steps!

Ha! I was studying Deleuze and Guattari in my MFA program where my art practice was game design. I so many connections from A Thousand Plateaus and what what happening in my games work, so I wanted to bring some of those connections into my work here on the channel.

Right on! Just remember, these shapes are a flow charge of meaningful decisions, not just a map of locations. It's easier to chart this stuff in video games than at the table, but I hope you find it helpful! Cheers, and thank you for the kind words!

It's a good one, but I'd say that's more of a campaign structure. Used in a lot of serialized storytelling where everything returns to a status quo (or slowly advancing C-story) at the end of an adventure.

Yeah! And there is no pure version of any of them, they are models and trends. Smooth spaces are going to be striated and striated spaces are reclaimed by smoothing actions. A Thousand Plateaus seems to argue that smooth spaces in the real world are the ideal, and I tend to agree, but a mixture isn’t just nice in a game world, it’s unavoidable. There is a lot to say about how these concepts interact with gaming, but I want to be mindful of making my videos too long. Haha

@@mapcrow yeah, it is always a fine line when bringing in more academic inspiration. If you want it to inspire people you can't put too much in, but if you keep it too simplified it might not show well what is interesting about it. Really loving the content you're putting out, once I get back from vacation I'll be sure to check out the discord as well :)

Panic Pillow It is a fine line. But than you so much for the thoughtful comments! Have a lovely vacation!

I just looked up A Thousand Plateaus and it sounds super cool. Thanks for recommending my next book!

Yeah! And when you are talking about actual decisions made by players, it’s all linear! Haha

Oh! Thank you so much! I hope this is helpful for folks, and not just needless semantics.

Nope, got that from thousand plateaus as well!

Gosh, I hope I conveyed the concept correctly, however brief it was! I think about smooth and striated spaces frequently, but I don’t know how to bring that into a video! Haha

@@mapcrow Don't sweat it! I think you did a great job, and I feel like they'd be on board with what you're pitching (if they were game designers): blurring the distinction between "rhizomatic," "arborescent" and linear, not necessarily privileging any one sort of design, etc. On a side note: Deleuze himself was pretty loosy-goosy (spelling?) with terminology. He (and Guattari) would express the same idea in different ways, throwing it all at the wall to see what sticks--in a few interviews, he tells the reader to just take what they like and leave the rest (paraphrasing: "if you don't like these words, use other words--they're just words!"). So if you understand the bigger picture, it's not worth losing sleep over particular terms.

Billy Dean Ha!! Wow that’s really encouraging to hear!! Thank you!!

The highest compliment! Thank you!!

If folks are having fun, it doesn’t matter what anyone says. You might just talk to folks who you play with about there experience being you start getting down on yourself.

Oh my gosh!! Thank you!! I’m very glad you found it interesting!!

I think some structure is necessary from the GM in order for a narrative game. But you're right, the idea that a narrative is necessary from the start is a huge assumption everyone makes. It seems like you play very sandbox style games, not really concerned with the idea that a narrative must happen. I really do think that some games rely on a narrative in order to function, but not all of them. I personally prefer my games to have a narrative backbone, a structure, a whatever: it's not so much *what* happens in a story that is important. What I, and I'm sure many others, value is *how* it happens.

Glad you think so! Thank you for watching!

Glad you enjoyed it!

If there is a Main Story line that you would rather be doing than what your players are doing, just talk to them as people. Talk to them like you are ordering a pizza and see if you can find toppings everyone will enjoy.

@@mapcrow no. The point is that it’s supposed to be a non specific free will story. But the linear progression is somehow a plot point I guess. Maybe I’m confusing myself the more I think about it but I can’t stop. Basically it’s based on the concept that as you said in one of your videos- the MCs aren’t always the good guys. And in this case they are bad guys because when a play session is in progress, the GM gains full control over an already Pre-existing world. making some people into puppets for the main characters and all npcs loose free will as soon as the GM said so. The story in the game is about a GM who wants a linear story, but the True GM’s job is to drive the characters to the same-ish ending while still including the plot points in the chaotic player choices. Lol I just need to write it somewhere and guessed a comment section is a good a place as any

Haha! Glad you found this useful!!

Thank you so much!

I disagree. Within a linear adventure, the consequences of your actions and the freedom of your actions has a distinctive boundary about them, different from the other two. A linear dungeon has literal walls, the adventure does not go outside the dungeon. An arborescent adventure lets you go outside the walls, but you only have one goal to accomplish. The goal could have been accomplished with the dungeon raid, but it didn't have to. The rhizomatic adventure has a multitude of goals, each with arbors or lines within them, or even paths to new goals undiscovered, which is just another rhizome. Nothing is forcing you to complete one goal over the other nor do the goals exist in a distinct hierarchy. While I would say rhizomes are "bigger" in the sense that they can encompass both the previous two and themselves, there's more nuance here than just micro and macro.

Not that I've seen. I've been meaning to follow up on the idea of Rhizomes in TTRPGs for a while, knowing that its a self indulgent topic! Haha

I think the point I making is more about the structure of the choices made available to players. If they are just reacting to whatever the gm preps, it’s linear. If they have choices that lead to a determined point, it’s arborescent. If the players are picking their direction and the gm is reacting, its rhizomatic. This is just the way I see it though. Just trying to clarify the video. Cheers!

​@@mapcrow Good point - it's about what the players get to add to the story. But I'd say all the best games I've been in have had the GM react to the players even if the characters didn't get a choice. It's good if the players keep in mind that their just a group of friends around a table and that they therefore have the greatest agency to alter their characters destiny at the end of any session. This way the GM has time to prepare for such things.

It can certainly be a subjective thing; some players may rebel against even the slightest notion that the DM is "putting them on plot rails" and intentionally sabotage whatever plot they perceive is happening for fear that they're being robbed of agency. I've also witnessed individual players taking it upon themselves to sabotage other players, but I've never heard them use the phrase "railroading" as a defense for it. I have played in two games where I felt the DM was railroading us, and the other players agreed with my assessment (we were all getting frustrated). They were both situations where the DM clearly had a desired outcome we were meant to reach, and only one viable path to reach it; any deviations from his predetermined decision tree were punished with punitive monster attacks or just outright forbidden by the DM. It wasn't a case of "this is the only adventure I have prepped tonight, guys, please don't run off somewhere wild to engage in ridiculous antics;" it was "you came up with a solution that might circumvent my planned encounter, therefore I forbid you to do it." And to add insult to injury, when we failed at any task, the DM brought out his favorite higher-level, magic-item-laden NPC to show up, rescue us from danger, and mock us for our failure. In both cases I'd call it a toxic habit. Probably the most iconic published example of railroading are the 1st Edition AD&D Dragonlance modules. I don't know if they got any better in the later adventures, but the first few at least are very much "your PCs must go to this place and do this thing, in this order, and there is no other way."

Thank you!!

These are just office max brand.

If it is a properly signposted issue, and the players can figure out how they want to approach this obstacle, then it’s probably great. To many players of 5E that I have spoken to, the game is about getting more powerful, and taking things away from them feels like a breach of contract. The things that are interesting and cool for a GM can be counter to what is interesting and cool to the players. These are just my thoughts.

Oh? What exactly do you mean? How to write Rhizomatic adventures or TTRPG modules in general?

@@mapcrow thanks for the response! Yes, i tend to use the node deaign for mysteries but have trouble writing the bigger “sandbox” games i picture in my head. Your video inspired me and gave me hope that there is a better way than I’ve been doing haha

@map crow i love your art btw. I also love to draw so this was such a comforting video to watch!!!

@@chaosung8655 Oh I see! I think my video on Village Crawl Maps would be how I would answer that for the time being. I'm starting a city sandbox game soon, so I'm sure I'll have more thought as I get into that. It's not necessarily a "better" way, just a different one!

I appreciate that! Ill check it out. Honestly right now i feel like my way is mostly “design bad guys and what theyre doing in the background then just wing it” haha so any structure would be a great help.

Right on! I’ll check that out! Cheers!

Plz summon your dark magic in your own video. This be beginner space. Metaphysics can be foundational, so your delineation between philosophy and mathematics need not be so. Map Crow mentions that the DM can feel like he needs to know everything and have everything planned before he can get his players started; it'd be a mistake to try to master graph theory before attempting to apply it. The DM, in my opinion, would do better feeling and reacting to the rhythms of the proceedings instead of scheduling them exhaustively. From General Patton: “A Good Plan, Violently Executed Now, Is Better Than a Perfect Plan Next Week.” I do agree, graph theory can be quite useful, but learning its ropes is for adepts and experienced keeners, I'd say.