Muzzle Brake Noise?

Рет қаралды 17,452

Жыл бұрын

How much difference to the sound does a muzzle brake actually make?
FYI, just a basic test, not scientific, comparison value only....
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Пікірлер: 131

@paulsimmons5726 Жыл бұрын

I have older hunting rifles, none of which have muzzle breaks or threaded barrels, so this was very informative. My personal experience from the range is that rifles with muzzle breaks seem louder.

@markandsamafterwork Жыл бұрын

Yep, Cheers

@user-eg8hb8xt3j 3 ай бұрын

They are way louder. Anyone that’s shot one at game with no ears in knows this lol

@crasht8 Жыл бұрын

Great video again :) Retired sound engineer here. Could it also be the pressure wave is sent sidewards and rearwards as well downrange with a brake as opposed to mostly downrange with no brake? The 'loudness' difference being the same as standing in front of subs at a festival, it physically moves the air and ground around your body more, and your brain does the math? Very interesting subject

@markandsamafterwork Жыл бұрын

Thanks man, as for pressure wave/waves, some times many, and yes they may influence.... could go way over board testing here, lol, Cheers

@douglash.8862 5 ай бұрын

The PVA Jet Blast, 3 and 4 Port, Brakes produce, LESS Blast / "Concussion" at, the Shooter & way BETTER than anything, we've used, in my Family & now have, 4 of them !

@beware3586 3 ай бұрын

I was in the middle of typing this as a hypothesis when I saw your comment.

@fullhalf420 13 сағат бұрын

know what 😂you mean..kiss concert was the loudest one I was ever at..being 50 feet from the stack of huge speakers..you could feel the blast..

@Hammerback972 Жыл бұрын

Your brakes are some of the highest quality I've seen. Appreciate the knowledge u share here, in the process of bedding my chassis after watching one of your recent videos on that subject

@markandsamafterwork Жыл бұрын

Awesome, Mna, thanks

@brettstewart8765 Жыл бұрын

Every video i learn something thank you Mark and Sam take care and stay safe cheers Yogi 👍

@markandsamafterwork Жыл бұрын

Thanks Yogi

@paulharding1621 Жыл бұрын

Great review Mark. My experience with others using muzzle brakes in range conditions is nothing short of unpleasant. Many years ago a pal was shooting his .270 Win rifle with a Browning BOSS equipped rifle. Shooting positions are approximately 2 meters apart. With my usual hearing protectors ( I was also shooting a .270) the noise or perhaps the concussion significantly hurt my ears. No permanent damage hopefully but not a situation I wish to repeat.

@markandsamafterwork Жыл бұрын

Yes, they are not that nice to shoot along side, not close anyway, Cheers

@michaeladams8772 Жыл бұрын

Interesting video, and interesting comments on the video. Thanks Mark and Sam. Keep up the good work.👍🏼

@markandsamafterwork Жыл бұрын

Thanks Mike

@shanegibb997 Жыл бұрын

That was very interesting , i've always wondered if they were extremely louder or is that what our ears are telling us ?? Great video Mark 👍

@markandsamafterwork Жыл бұрын

Thanks Shane

@vicbittertoo Жыл бұрын

Interesting, I've definitely noticed brakes are a lot louder under the low tin roof at our range, another observation I've found is that when chasing feral pigs, etc, with no brake they'll take off exactly away from your position but with a brake they look more confused about where the sound is coming from and run around in circles, etc ???,. Maybe the brake spreads the sound in different directions so they cant determine the exact source ???, anyone else noticed this effect ??, Shoulda mentioned, this was with a 4AW brake, so order one, the are AWESOME :) cheers, Dave

@markandsamafterwork Жыл бұрын

Thanks Dave, Cheers

@joearledge1 Жыл бұрын

I have with the tin roof at the range, never had a chance to chase hogs. I would suspect that the concussion that the shooter and others feel plays a role in perceiving brakes as louder whether or not they actually are at the time. I may be wrong on that though, I don't know. Keep up the good work guys!

@hotchihuahua1546 Жыл бұрын

I have been in the woods hunting deer and a friend was 50 yards from me . He took a shot on a nice buck in the opposite direction . I observed the deer I was watching and all they did was look up and then went back to eating . On the other hand , I have made a slight move with a creaky stand and the deer have bolted . You just never know . Lol Even with a silencer a dee will hear it . I think there is some truth to dispersement of sound with a muzzle break confusing an animal as to where it should go .

@geoffkeeler5106 Жыл бұрын

Very interesting. I'm somewhat into acoustics and have wondered what actual effect muzzle brakes would have in this regard. A good working test, complex enough without going to the extremes of scientific rigour (as you explained). Thanks for yet again adding to my knowledge Mark!

@markandsamafterwork Жыл бұрын

Thanks Geoff, Cheers Man

@mistral-unizion-music Жыл бұрын

Pretty cool test indeed. Thanks! I may compare it to being beside speakers playing loud music instead of being behind, the volume is at the same level but the direction of the sound is more toward our ears, so we perceive it louder. Of course any reflecting wall or surface will affect this too. Like If you place you hands behind your ears to make a cup shape, imitating say, deer ears, you will hear more details and sound will be perceived louder, but the level of the sound is the same, you just added increased area for the sound to come and reflect into you ears. Kind of the inverse effect a muzzle break does, instead of increasing ear capacity, you "turn the speaker" more toward your ears, so it dissipate sound more efficiently and directionnaly toward our ears, with the same kind of results.

@markandsamafterwork Жыл бұрын

Thanks Man

@SamBrown-yk8py Жыл бұрын

Very informative and interesting as always Mark. Thank you. I know it's not quite on the same level, but I do a lot of air rifle shooting in the UK, at my local range recently I've noticed a few people using Air Strippers, and there's a notable increase in report from them. Quite a loud, almost crack of air pressure, even at just 12ft/lb muzzle energy.

@markandsamafterwork Жыл бұрын

Cheers Sam

@thomasdaum1927 Жыл бұрын

Thanks for this valuable information , always wondered about this but had no way of measuring it !…… Regards to Sam .

@markandsamafterwork Жыл бұрын

Thanks Tom, cheers

@Taty6260 Жыл бұрын

Very interesting information. Thanks for doing the test M&S ✨🇺🇲🌟🇺🇸✨

@markandsamafterwork Жыл бұрын

Cheers Tate

@brycehiigel235 6 ай бұрын

Thanks for the great video. I was out hunting plains elk in Colorado. I have a radial brake on my Browning X-bolt .270. I forgot my ear defenders and really didn’t notice the sound being that loud. Of course the adrenaline is up. We have a 100yd range to shoot at which is pretty much in a hole and has a metal awning over the top of the shooting benches. That is when it does seem louder. But even the none muzzle breaks seem loud of course the sound is echoing off the walls of the range and tin awning.

@markandsamafterwork 6 ай бұрын

Thanks Bryce, Cheers

@jasonrad9332 Жыл бұрын

Appreciate the info Mark!

@markandsamafterwork Жыл бұрын

Thanks Jason

@davidmackee8575 Жыл бұрын

Good video interesting I never used a muzzle brake at all as I had always thought they were noisier goes to show I was wrong as your figures show thanks for posting Mark 👍👍

@markandsamafterwork Жыл бұрын

Cheers Dave. Thanks

@danielbaker4989 Жыл бұрын

Great video! I hunt with a muzzle break on a 7mm rem mag and a 6.5cm. I have noticed, particularly in the 6.5cm when shooting into a group of animals, they seem to have trouble working out where the sound has come from. They tend to mill around and I often get to shoot a second or third before they take off. My assumption is they don’t want to run until they know which direction the danger is coming from.

@markandsamafterwork Жыл бұрын

That would make sense, thanks Daniel, Cheers

@howarddittrich157 Жыл бұрын

Thanks to you and Sam for “filling in the blanks”!

@markandsamafterwork Жыл бұрын

Cheers Howard

@adamswidwa2055 Жыл бұрын

Very interesting material. 👍 Pozdrawiam z Polski 🇵🇱

@markandsamafterwork Жыл бұрын

Cheers

@peterrobins3708 Жыл бұрын

Now its got me thinking about those "blast projectors" that are around. Never been near a firearm with one & not even sure if they legal or affect recoil to a noticable effect(?) Very very interesting stuff.

@markandsamafterwork Жыл бұрын

Cheers

@jasyamaha Жыл бұрын

Very good, thank you.

@markandsamafterwork Жыл бұрын

👍😎

@mikesauer7775 Жыл бұрын

3 years ago I got serious ear injury with ear plugs in,not tight enough. Muzzle brake was 4" in from end of shooting bench. Shock wave off the table rang my ears so bad I heard crickets and buzzing for 3 months. Ears are still sensitive. Wish suppresors were legal without fingerprints registered to FBI

@markandsamafterwork Жыл бұрын

Thanks Mike, Cheers

@boblow2186 Жыл бұрын

Hi mark and Sam. This it a very complicated question. You have to look at sound waves rather noise levels as you found the noise level were about the same. What effect is sound waves reflecting off objects and each other. It’s like throwing a stone into smooth water you see the ripples going out in all directions. When you use two stones at the same time you get the same ripples but at some points the hit each other. They cancel one other or make a longer wave. So the same with sound once the sound waves bump into each outher it’s not louder it’s longer to the perceived ear. And depends on where you are and what’s round you. Hope this helps as it’s a very complicated subject and difficult to explain in simple terms. Bob.

@markandsamafterwork Жыл бұрын

Thanks Bob, noise cancelling sound is a very specific science, not something you will find created in these sort of conditions, Cheers

@boblow2186 9 ай бұрын

This is not sound cancel it’s reflection.

@spartanxlv Жыл бұрын

The guy directly next to me at the range the other day was shooting a 16" .308 AR-10 with a brake, about 4 feet from my face... I had to put a second set of ear pro, but the concussion was still obnoxious, if not painful. I just used it as an opportunity for training to shoot under stress LOL.

@markandsamafterwork Жыл бұрын

Lol, yes not nice at all, Cheers

@leonhorn8062 Жыл бұрын

I think the airpresure (shock wave) that gets re directed back to the shooter cobined with sound at the same time make that we asociate it with more noise. And I think thats why there is no noticeable DB difference on your measurements as the measure sound and not presure.

@markandsamafterwork Жыл бұрын

Cheers

@tommysaulter9171 Жыл бұрын

Mark... I’ve gotten 2 of your brakes. A 4-Port for my 300WSM and a 3-Port for my granddaughter’s .308Win... People at my local range love the looks of the brakes. The side blast ? Not so much...!!!

@markandsamafterwork Жыл бұрын

Thanks Tommy, and yes that where they put the blast, lol, Cheers

@peterconnan5631 Жыл бұрын

Thanks, that was rather interesting. After having my hat and my butler-creek scope cap blown off by a braked .338 Lapua in the next shooting lane, I have wondered whether we experience muzzle blast as "louder".

@markandsamafterwork Жыл бұрын

Cheers Pete

@bmstylee Жыл бұрын

That's one hell of a brake to blow stuff off.

@peterconnan5631 Жыл бұрын

@@bmstylee it had me flinching for the rest of the day!

@bmstylee Жыл бұрын

@@peterconnan5631 sadly I think I gave a kid a flinch. I was doing load development on my 338 Lapua. I was on a 200 yard range when a dad and a kid with a 243 that looked like a first deer rifle came on about 20 minutes after me. I let them know what I was shooting and that it was probably not going to be pleasant to be near. Dad said not to worry. After the first 5 shot group they moved about 15 yards the other way. I guess they didn't dig the blast off my brake. If a silencer for a 338 wasn't so damn expensive I would buy one. I just don't want to spend the $1500 or so for one.

@Robphoto37 Жыл бұрын

Interesting. I wondered this too. Certain brakes do reduce recoil more than others so I thought the difference in energy would be equate in a difference in volume . Apparently not though

@markandsamafterwork Жыл бұрын

Thanks Rob

@DoggoWillink Жыл бұрын

All I can say is that in New Jersey, USA, where every semi-auto rifle has a muzzle brake on it, the indoor ranges are full of ARs that can nearly knock your hat off from the next lane over. I honestly don’t like muzzle brakes, unless it’s on a rifle (or in a scenario) where it actually makes sense. For a guy like Mark who at times shoots some larger caliber precision rifles outdoors, a muzzle brake can come in handy. In that case the sound isn’t an issue, because you’re actually gaining a real advantage. Outside of situations where you aren’t gaining an advantage, i.e. it’s a mandated law, I’m not a fan. Edit by the end: Totally agree, great explanation.

@markandsamafterwork Жыл бұрын

Yes, as said, not range friendly items, Cheers

@DoggoWillink Жыл бұрын

@@markandsamafterworkYep I agree entirely, 100%, with your thoughts here after finishing the vid.

@cameronjaeger 11 ай бұрын

I'd also be interested to hear your take on brakes and concussion vs sounds (perceived or measured)

@markandsamafterwork 11 ай бұрын

All on the channel, How to find you answers/info on the channel kzfaq.info/get/bejne/or2fm9yKqtSRp5c.html

@faniebasson4717 Жыл бұрын

Hi . my thoughts about a Mbrake is not loader,but more a pressure wave that hit you as a range officer. As for me a let it go , because anything is fine if you get more rifles on the range. thnx for the vid!

@markandsamafterwork Жыл бұрын

Thanks Man, Cheers

@davidhandyman7571 Жыл бұрын

The perception of sound is an amazing thing. I have hearing issues that requires hearing aids. My left ear seems to have more difficulty hearing but in fact it works better than my right ear. The perception and interpretation by the brain is mind boggling and confusing at times.

@markandsamafterwork Жыл бұрын

Thanks Dave

@davemeister7338 Жыл бұрын

Hunting with a ported marlin 45-70 lever gun from a wooden ground blind. When I shot, the reflection off the wall was like being slapped. Glad I had ears on.

@markandsamafterwork Жыл бұрын

Lol, yep, Cheers

@54Rocketeer Жыл бұрын

Resonance factored out, note Db(a) readings are exponentially increasing

@markandsamafterwork Жыл бұрын

Yep, part of it, Cheers

@bmstylee Жыл бұрын

I run a brake on my rifles for various reasons. I can attest my 338 Lapua definitely does not make me any friends on a rifle range. That boy is loud even when using plugs under my electronic hearing pro.

@markandsamafterwork Жыл бұрын

Yes, not a range gun man, Cheers

@WilhelmNauta Жыл бұрын

Very interesting indeed. The perception is that a brake is louder (even in an open space), but clearly it is not reality.

@markandsamafterwork Жыл бұрын

Cheers Man

@chrismuncey3861 Жыл бұрын

What's your thoughts on the EC tuner brake?. Im thinking about getting one for my CZ 600 Range 308.

@markandsamafterwork Жыл бұрын

Not something we use, never found the need, Cheers

@troyaschebrock4673 Жыл бұрын

I'd be interested to see some testing on the APW Warbird suppressor with the muzzle brake on the end.

@markandsamafterwork Жыл бұрын

Ask those guys to do some tests, suppressor's are not legal here

@troyaschebrock4673 Жыл бұрын

@markandsamafterwork ah my mistake... I'm in kiwiland....

@SixOFord Жыл бұрын

I just like the way they sweep off the neighbors bench at the local gun club.

@markandsamafterwork Жыл бұрын

Cheers

@kuronyan3006Ackley Жыл бұрын

😄👍‼️

@markandsamafterwork Жыл бұрын

Cheers Man

@chrisgabbert658 Жыл бұрын

👍😊

@markandsamafterwork Жыл бұрын

👍👍

@npet6842 Жыл бұрын

I noticed that some rifle manufacturers OEM brakes are not size unique ie. a .300 and a .338 get the same brake for sale . This will make the .300 brake much less effective .

@markandsamafterwork Жыл бұрын

Make a small difference, not a lot, Cheers

@oldschooljack3479 Жыл бұрын

Not louder in decibels... Same decibels more highly concentrated in a given direction. Is that a fair summation?

@markandsamafterwork Жыл бұрын

Sort of, Cheers Jack

@mr.mr.3301 8 ай бұрын

I went hunting and you don’t typically use hearing protection with hunting with a muzzle brake and screwed up my left ear. I think it has to do with concussion and not necessarily sound.

@markandsamafterwork 8 ай бұрын

Cheers Man

@philipfreeman72 Жыл бұрын

Why have top slot muzzle brakes gone out of vogue ? I put one on my Swede & it shot higher.

@markandsamafterwork Жыл бұрын

We have videos to explain about muzzle brakes.... Cheers

@keithfalcao1844 Жыл бұрын

Could be wrong - db is not linear , each additional db is doubling the sound isn’t it ?

@markandsamafterwork Жыл бұрын

Not a sound engineer, but sure can tell you 101dB has no noticeable difference to 100dB, more than 5dB at that level to even notice a difference, Cheers

@TubeDobs Жыл бұрын

The concussion makes you feel it louder with muzzles break.

@markandsamafterwork Жыл бұрын

Cheers

@born2beashooterjosh397 Жыл бұрын

Theres a very easy solution for the ‘extra sound’ created by shooting muzzle brakes at ranges indoors etc… all u have to do is buy u a pair of mechanical filtered ear plugs to pit on and then put your electronic muffs ocer those theyre cheap like $10 for a nice solid performing pair of ear plugs and u wont notice that much of a difference between muzzle beake and no brake other than the concussion waves hitting u theres no solution for that besides a suppressor but other than that ur ears dont get damaged and fatigued plus j can still hear jus as good as long as ur using electronic ear pro u can withstand to shoot way way more with brakes but eventually the pressure waves do start to fatigue ur eyes so unfortunately theres still a lil bit of things u have to accept dealing with while using brakes theyre way more than worth it if u ask me in fact i wouldnt try shooting long range without them not even rimfire they jus bring too much benefit to the shooting experience especially when shooting long range then theyre damn near invaluable

@markandsamafterwork Жыл бұрын

Yes, all things have there place, use them in there place, all is good, lol, Cheers

@donaldpowers8331 Жыл бұрын

Concussive wave distribution, proximity to muzzle blast and the db increase (scientific formula) equates too the use of effective hearing protection. For any rifle range "mandatory" hearing protection should be a requirement, once you enter the shooting area, double protection is best, electronic headset over soft plugs. Tinnitus is no fun, hearing loss and the use of hearing aids, is no fun. Shooting is fun, but, be smart.

@markandsamafterwork Жыл бұрын

Yep, thanks Don, Cheers

@jenHry-ng3pw Жыл бұрын

I can do shotguns under for with Sordins only no problem. But I was next to 5.56 AR15 with a muzzle brake, earplugs under the Sordins and it was still almost painful.

@pijnto Жыл бұрын

Very interesting video I cancelled my membership with a big Australia wide Ass. because they refused to allow me on their ranges with a muzzle brake.

@markandsamafterwork Жыл бұрын

Yes, ranges and muzzle brakes rarely mix, Cheers Man

@andyschuler3459 Жыл бұрын

Your data isn't making sense to me. You're seeing peak sound in the 114db range. Every other study I've seen published on this has peak volume at the shooter in the 150-180db range. This is a couple orders of magnitude difference from your data. 22lr is generally cited at around 140db and below 130db is consider hearing safe...so your data seems way off to me. Am I missing something here?

@markandsamafterwork Жыл бұрын

Yes I would agree the readings where all lower than expected, possibly the peek spike is not captured with these tools, maybe the position of mic's, but as explained, not a scientific test, just a comparison between all that was explained, Cheers

@keithfalcao1844 Жыл бұрын

Could be wrong , thought db isn’t linear - each db doubles the sound ?

@andyschuler3459 Жыл бұрын

@@keithfalcao1844 You’re right it’s not linear, but I think it’s more like 3db doubles the sound energy.

@andyschuler3459 Жыл бұрын

@@markandsamafterwork I did a little looking and it appears there are two different types ways of measuring sound, sometimes sound meters can only do one or the other. “A-frequency-weighting” is more commonly used but “C-frequency-weighting” is used for gunshots or explosions. This is signified by the notation dB(A) or dB(C). I wonder if your meter is doing the “A” variant? Might be why you are getting lower than expected readings? Anyway, thanks for spurring the conversation, I learned something new 😎

@LudwigsPrecision Жыл бұрын

you got one thing there , for every 3db increase you dubbel the sound (1db is about 25% lounder or lower, 3db is 2x more sound . sound Energy is amost as high, so the sound is felt a lot in differens when you talk 1 digits)

@markandsamafterwork Жыл бұрын

At low levels that is the case, but 100dB to 103dB is not a discernable difference, or around 3% so not relevant at these levels, Cheers

@kenpickett9317 Жыл бұрын

Fired a 300Blk equipped with a brake in a small gully once without hearing protection and just about blew the eardrums right out of my head. Painful! Ringing ears for a week or two afterwards. Never again.

@markandsamafterwork Жыл бұрын

Yep, Cheers

@redrock425 Жыл бұрын

I switched to a moderator as I can find brakes can make my ears ring even with muffs and plugs if I'm next to one.

@markandsamafterwork Жыл бұрын

Cheers

@socandyman Жыл бұрын

think people are perceiving pressure as sound

@markandsamafterwork Жыл бұрын

Can be part of it, Cheers

@smithderf 7 ай бұрын

Except you can have a muzzle brake that does not make the rifle louder to the operator, or those standing 90 degrees from it. There is a muzzle brake design that can do this and still reduce recoil. How does it do it? First see how most all muzzle brakes work. Holes are made to direct escaping gases reward to eliminate recoil. In the process it also directs sound and debris backward toward people. Not a good thing even though recoil is reduced. A better design is to make a muzzle brake that directs escaping gases slightly forward. Yes, slightly forward. Hear me out..... Suppose you had a barrel that directed all of the gases straight forward. That barrel would have 100% recoil. Now take a second barrel that has a muzzle brake which has slightly forward facing holes drilled in it. We now have maybe 50% of the gases going forward and 50% going slightly forward. With this configuration of a muzzle brake not only is the recoil reduced but the noise and debris is reduced also. Another way to look at this is imagine we explode a gas in a plugged tube with only 90 degree holes at one end. There will be no recoil. Slightly move the holes forward. There will be just a little recoil. Gentry is an example. Not affiliated with them.

@markandsamafterwork 7 ай бұрын

We have videos to explain about muzzle brakes, lots more details too it, FYI noise is not one of the features most are concerned with, lol, Cheers

@peteengard9966 Жыл бұрын

A scientific test would be done in a controlled laboratory setting and not real life. Better to be real than theoretical.

@markandsamafterwork Жыл бұрын

Thanks Pete

@DanielReyes-hz1qk Жыл бұрын

In fairness most guns aren't shot in controlled environments so a laboratory setting wouldn't accurately represent the perceived noise differences a person shooting a rifle on a range would. Best to test things that like the way they're used