Regardless of what you think of the decisions, it's pretty worrying that there were 3 distinct VAR checks and for each one VAR couldn't say what's actually happened.

I think we’re to the point where we need the technology that they used in the World Cup or at least what they use for tennis. We shouldn’t be arguing about whether a ball is out or not. The ref’s should be judging the part that human judgement is needed for (fouls). Not offsides or if the ball is out. That shouldn’t be opinion, it should be fact

Never mind the other 14.... When it's Arsenal, City, Liverpool, Chelsea, Utd or Spurs it's everywhere and gets a special video but when it happens to the other 14 it doesn't matter.

Grown adults can’t say anything against authority in any walk of life these days. We’re on a slippery slope into darkness. In football and in life.

Remember last month when Klopp was absolutely fuming at VAR and when journalists asked Mikel on his thoughts he said “ mistakes happen , you move on” . Only way clubs win against bad officiating , is if they unite with each other

We have seen in other sports, other countries, other competitions (including internal games) that an automated VAR system (regardless of the name of it in that instance) reaches a consistent, fair and faster verdict. Also in NFL, Rugby etc the referee will address the crowd directly explaining the verdict. Automated VAR and referee explanation. There is so much money in football there is no excuse this couldn’t be brought in for next season at the latest.

Agree with Melissa. The other managers all rolled their eyes at Klopp and the press turned on him too. Howard Webb needs to be fired, he has destroyed football. He was a terrible ref and now he’s a terrible head of the PGMOL. It’s a boys club that needs an overhaul. Guardiola said it won’t change until they stop making themselves the main character. They literally make themselves the centre of the game every single week. The football and the players aren’t. What the champions league and Europa league, the VAR decisions are so efficient and you barely know it’s happening cause the refs just do their thing and move on.

The biggest issue I find is this. Linesman are instructed to let play come to an end and let VAR review the decision as to if it was offside. Now any linesman in that game would flag that as out of play 99% of the time. However they have to wait for VAR to review it. So now it goes to VAR and they rule it “inconclusive” so on field decision stands. But the on field decision is forced that way because they have to wait for VAR to review it so it’s a cycle. It’s stupid that they even have it as inconclusive they should extend the tech for goal line along the entire backline. But as I said this whole forcing the lineman’s into that decision and VAR then saying stick with on field decision which is forced into that result… 0 sense there

I'm beginning to think these decisions are delibrate not incompetence

I wonder if the Arteta fine will happen before or after the apology from PGMOL 🤔

I honestly think there is matchfixing happening. Simple example like the Luis Diaz disallowed goal last month. This VAR is chaotic and we are losing the essence of football. This needs to be reviewed by all teams and i think it should completely be scrapped. Somebody is getting a financial kickback.

Melissa is totally right all the teams were saying liverpool are moaning about the decision at spurs.. and i knew it would happen again, so to the fan that said that sod you all and i hope these desicion still happen until all team have this impact

Melissa has a good point regarding to Liverpool, its clear now that its everyone's problem

The problem with the role of VAR is its primary purpose is not to get calls correct! Its role is to protect referees from glaring mistakes, otherwise know as “clear and obvious errors.” In other sports, reviews are solely about getting the call right. A complete AI system would do a much more accurate job of officiating, and then we wouldn’t have to worry about officials’ bias (because we all know they have them as does every fan) or influence from state ownership of teams and lucrative reffing opportunities in other countries.

I can't believe the 20PL clubs still haven't collectively put pressure to the PL for better officiating. The Premier League is nothing without the football clubs.

When MUFC and Liverpool complained, they said we are moaning. Now its Arsenal turn to face the wrath of VAR. But I agree with Arteta the stakes are high and the league should have better technology considering the money involved in the premier league.

theyre also talking about it as 3 points dropped by arsenal? they had 1 shot on target all game? where exactly have they lost out on 3 points? am i missing something? awful biased journalism

Arteta was very dismissive about the Liverpool disallowed goal against Spurs, so to borrow his words, "referees are human, they make mistakes, move on!" I genuinely hope he moves on! Karma knows no bounds!

It was a great Goal, Arsenal and their fans just don't like the fact they were beaten. Move on.

We already moved on from last season’s Brentford game, and it’s happened again and will happen again.

People keep saying that’s 3 points that could change the season… Should be talking about 1 point at best. Since it was 0-0 and Arsenal didn’t look like scoring.

To be honest, when i saw that the ball went out of play and the foul on Gabriel, I was certain that the officials and VAR would make the correct decision and rule the goal out. But they've proved all of us wrong again

Mikel Arteta is embarrassing. Do you think if that decision had gone the other way Eddie Howe would have reacted in any way remotely like that? Especially after Havertz' non-red card when he was blatantly going for the player and nothing else. How many straight reds have we seen already this season for a lot less than that? (Yes, Bruno should also have been sent off). The new images that have come out today show that the ball wasn't out of play. Foul could have gone either way but plenty of former players and pundits today are saying a centre-back needs to be much stronger than that and it wasn't a foul, which I agree with. And the offside was inconclusive. If he's that angry about not winning they maybe should have tried being good enough to have more than one shot all game.

Even though I ain’t an arsenal fan I’m happy that arteta spoke out in an articulate way, he was well within his right to call it out, for the fa to fine him is unbelievable. How was that goal rewarded

It makes you wonder why they can't move over to the same system as rugby officiating.. makes me wonder if there is corruption in the game, as most decisions seem to aid the clubs with the most money..

Darren i commend you for standing up for Arteta , i think its time managers who feel agrieved about daylight robbery eg Klopp , Arteta etc should take on the ref association or the premier league to sort the probldm once and for all period

This is a bigger issue than last nights game, we as (Whoever you support) fans deserve far better from the professionals who officiate.

All clubs need to come together, along with the appropriate associations and fix this once and for all. We mustn't settle for second best, make the EPL the world leader of objective outcomes in the game of football.

VAR to Refereee "Checking the banking app, the cheque has cleared. I repeat the cheque has cleared. Decision Goal stands."

Melissa is 100% correct Rugby has a lot of this ironed out already Why hasn’t football sorted a lot of these simple issues, not now, but from the very beginning of VAR by following other examples 😐 That’s why there’s so much frustration It really isn’t that hard

Where was the video of your panels discussing the decision when similar circumstances happened in the Man United vs Brighton game @Sky Sport?

Arteta is a disgrace. The referee didn't say it was out. They continued playing, 1cm didn't make any difference. They conceded the goal because defence was poor. It is different when VAR awards a penalty when it should not. In this case, they conceded fair and square. Arsenal continued to play and conceded that goal.

people forget Newcastle were on the other end too many times last season and we got on with it without whining about it.

About time Newcastle were on the right side of VAR. Brilliant Win. Referee was abysmal lost all control of the game.Havertz should've been red carded and so should've Bruno. But a great result for Toon👏👏👏

People are taking only one part of Arteta's quote and using it as a stick to beat him. In the same interview when a direct question was placed to him about what he thinks should happen about Liverpool, he pretty much said he hopes Liverpool get what they deserve.

Transparency in all of the communication amongst officials has to happen if respect for and trust in all of the decision making process's and officials involved in them is ever gonna be regained

If it's inconclusive then stick with the original on field decisions.

I think what Arteta said in the past doesn’t matter. Klopp was right before and Arteta is right now. It’s embarrassing that the Premier League is in the place it is now. They need to do better

I like Arteta. Football misses coaches like Mourinho. Fully outspoken because being a manager of a team with so much at stake is not easy...

All I hear is potential this, for me that, inconclusive yadda yadda... Wanting to overturn the on field decision and disallow a goal of that basis is ludicrous. Arteta is the discrace singing a completely different tune to when his team got 50-50 decisions in their favor in the past. He's just crying to the media to deflect from Arsenal having only one single, harmless shot on goal.

"Mistakes happen". Mikel Arteta 1 month ago.

00:04 Controversial VAR decision in the Newcastle vs Arsenal match. 02:14 The VAR couldn't find a conclusive camera angle to make a clear offside decision. 04:17 The Newcastle vs Arsenal VAR goal should not have stood. 06:31 Poor communication and mistrust in the VAR process are major issues in football. 09:00 Liverpool calls for improvement in referee processes and transparency. 11:20 The debate regarding Newcastle vs Arsenal VAR decision continues. 13:26 The VAR decision regarding Newcastle's goal is inconclusive 15:30 VAR controversies continue with Newcastle vs Arsenal match 17:35 Controversial VAR decision in Newcastle vs Arsenal match

They need to ask the nearest person in the crowd what they thought,it would be a lot quicker 😊

Every team is going to be affected at some point in the season if this is allowed to continue.

When you're too dense to realize that what Arteta said 5 weeks ago in no way contradicts what he said yesterday. He also said yesterday that he doesn't care what PGMOL says to him, because the points are already lost, so they must move on. You can be immensely angry at a decision and express that anger while also saying that mistakes happen and to move on. They are not contradictory statements like the person in the middle is trying to make them sound.

This is worst ref decision i ever seen ball out+offside+foul. Last season was Brantford offside goal and now Newcastle. this is disgrace to premier league refs

As a Newcastle fan we have watched Manu, Chelsea, Man City, Liverpool and Arsenal get lucky decisions against Newcastle and we took it. Get over it. Newcastle deserve their luck right now, so stop crying. The harder you work, the luckier you get....

The PGMOL has too much power that's the problem, they need oversight!

Ball could be in, thus inconclusive and can’t overturn that. I remember when Japan beat Spain in World Cup , ball looked out but was in. Foul- 50/50. So can’t overturn that. Offside - it wasn’t. Goal stands.

Strange newcastle and city haven't been hindered by ridiculous var decisions.

Don’t let it distract you from the fact there was a crappy disallowed goal at FULMUN the same day nobody is talking about. “Subjective offside” my arse

Forget the rest, Gabriel was shoved which impeded him from heading the ball. It was a shove with both arms extended so it was so easy to give a foul. Any Sunday morning ref would give it, why not these supposed professionals. If a player is launching to head a ball even a small nudge will knock them over. A foul anywhere on the pitch.

The real problem is, EPL officials are too comfortable in and with their errors, hence the recurrence and no active move to address future occurrence.

Arteta should be banned and made an example out of. VAR did it’s job regardless of his opinions. VAR is not there to rule out every goal , it’s there to help avoid major mistakes on the field . In this instance there’s no conclusive evidence to suggest the goal be disallowed - what’s the problem. He needs to be fined and made an example of or managers like arteta will do this every week

The comments all overlook the fact that the on field decision was goal. If there had been no VAR, Arteta would have been moaning about its absence. Further, the analysts are not even in agreement about whether the decisions were correct. Gary Neville and Jamie Carragher both felt the goal was correctly given. How can decisions be regarded as outrageous if there is no unanimity about whether they were correct? Alan 23.26

Just moved on Liverpool had to . From the images and replay I thought it was a goal. They tried 3 different checks to disallow it . I'm not a fan of either club. No clear and obvious error.

The only two teams that haven't been "cheated" by VAR and refs so far are Man City and Tottenham. How odd they are on top of the table

This decision is debatable. Arteta’s response was a disgrace based on his Liverpool comments. Havertz should’ve been sent off. Stop relying on refs for points and play better football.

What I would like to know is what exactly was Arteta claiming was wrong about the goal? What were the Arsenil directors claiming was wrong about the goal? What was that bloke in the clip claiming was wrong about the goal? Everyone is claiming it was a farce but not naming the reason for the farce. On the other hand, there was 1) no evidence that the ball categorically went out of play, 2) no evidence that Gabriel was categorically fouled by Joelinton (it is just a matter of opinion whether two hands on your back is enough for a grown man to collapse in a heap), and 3) you cannot be offside if you are behind the ball when it is played. So what exactly was VAR's 'clear and obvious' error that would have justified reviewing the referee's decision onfield to award a goal?

I feel sorry for Arteta. He clearly does not have the mental fortitude to handle losing to a better manager with worse players.

The pictures for the ball out of play are not the best at all. From an above angle, the ball is IN play still. The ball HAS to be COMPLETELY over the line to be considered out, which it wasn't. As for the foul, it's dodgy, from the shown angles it looks like a clear shove, but from the angle shown, it also does look like the Arsenal defender is going forward already to defend the ball. It's a 50/50 case, as people shove and fight for the ball all the time, and calls aren't being made there. The questionable one is the offside for me. As I'm not fully sure the ruling for that one. I do feel like that's the one that can be given more case for.

says it’s not a goal but can’t explain why, says all evidence is inconclusive apart from having ‘two hands on his back’, which btw isn’t a foul, it’s at most a subjective call on the foul… feel like I’m going crazy, everyone thinks it’s not a goal but nobody knows why

VAR must be to get to the right decision, not correcting "clear and obvious" errors. The latter will happen coincidentally if the aim is to always get to the right decision. This rubbish about "not wanting to re-referee the game" must be a secondary outcome if PL wants to get to the right decision every time

Arteta defended the officials when there was a blatant error against Liverpool but now because it’s against his team it’s ridiculous. By the way the ball has been proved to be still in play…

Cannot stand arteta, "I feel sick and ashamed to be a part of this mess", what a load of BS and an embarrassing statement to make.

1. The ball was in 2. It wasnt a foul 3. Gordon was behind the ball being played so was onside Where is the incorrect decision?

The issue here is that if they don’t have proper cameras what were they hoping to check in the VAR review when the ball went out??? It was clearly going to be close to the line so without the right cameras the “best” conclusive evidence is that image that shows the ball outside of the line. If they argue the ball’s curve might have been above the line, I would argue there is just no way for them to check that so how on earth can they ever make a fully conclusive call on a similar situation, their calls should be based on the best available evidence. Same with the push on Gabriel. They say it wasn’t a strong enough push, how do they measure that?? The best available evidence is the image with 2 hands on his back and him falling over. What kind of conclusive evidence would have changed that call? What do they need to see to give that as a foul? It is a foul and everybody would demand that as a foul if it was against their team.

If this happens to any football team, fans should call it out, even if that team is one they hate the most, because if you say 'get over it,' your team will eventually fall victim to this.

I thought it was probably a goal when I first saw it. But now I've seen better angles, I don't. The push on Gabriel seems like the main foul. The ball also hits Joelinton's arm, there's a possible offside, and if they'd ruled the ball out of play I think there'd be way less controversy, because it did kinda look out of play to most. So I think it should've been ruled out. I also think both Havertz and Bruno should've been sent off. I don't agree with Arteta that it was a disgrace and an embarrassment. As I said, my initial thought was that the goal should stand, so it wasn't an obvious error. I agree that standards should be high, but I think people are too harsh on the officials. Opinion is still split on the legitimacy of the goal 24 hours later with all the video clips available, so how can we expect the officials to get it perfect in 30-60 seconds? I think they made the decision they thought was right at the time. You win some, you lose some. There's most justice now with VAR than there was without it. But it's still not perfect, and the more we moan about it, the more they'll delay games in fear of getting the wrong decisions. Better tech to decide if the ball went out of bounds and if there was an offside would be beneficial, like a sensor in the ball. But we're not there yet.

What a media muppets 😂 You are forgetting that like 10 years ago we would never even talk post-match about this goal. Arsenal were pathetic yesterday. They deserved nothing from this game and got nothing from it. Unfortunately they will never learn their lesson and this kind of behaviour will doom this group of players to never touch a silverware.

I'm glad that this goal score against Arsenal. If it's Arsenal score this kind of goal to Newcastle, media will not bat an eye.

The goal should have stood because the football went into the net and no one died in the build up. *FACTS!*

If the goal was cancelled there won't have been any outcry based on the evidence

Why isn’t there cameras in the corner flag and the goal posts? Or a similar style sensor for when the ball crosses the goal line?

It goes both ways. We should be encouraging and awarding more goals. When there's inconclusive evidence, you can go both ways: disallow or allow the goal. No one talks about allowing the goal. 3 walls came up to prevent the newcastle goal: offside was inconclusive, ball was clearly in play (just see the BeIN sports footage), wasn't deem a foul by ref. How is this not a goal? If an accused was trialed and there was inconclusive evidence, how can he be punished? Arsene Wenger said before; we should encourage more goals, we want entertainment. Any subjective matter should be favored towards a goal.

Melissa ❤

Kudos to Melissa for working between the SKY and the BBC

No reason for the decision to be changed. Simple as. No big deal.

I have no idea who he is but that bloke on the right is definitely an Arsenal fan his views are too biased 1) Bein Sports(or whatever they're called) already proved the ball was in 2) As Neville said it wasn't a foul 3) They can't actually see if it's offside or not so have to give the goal

Why does everyone desperately want to find conclusive evidence that the goal should’ve been disallowed? There were two teams in this game. The only thing “embarrassing “ and a “disgrace “ is MA’s reaction. He said they’ve lost 3 points - if the goal was disallowed it would’ve been a draw!

Melissa is amazing and so so accurate…. Omg. Brains, amazing articulation and looks…..

He chose his words well?😂 bloke was screaming “disgrace”😂🤦‍♂️

Ball not out. Not a foul. Not offside, keeper made mistake = GOAL!!!!!

Not much of a "debate" when you only include people who agree with one side is it?

Wtf is up with people fake-quoting Arteta?

Who was on VAR? Andy Madley & Stuart Burt - who take refereeing jobs in the Saudi league which is owned by PIF which owns Newcastle. That's how you get the PGMOL saying nonsense like Guimaraes hit on Jorginho was okay because it was his forearm and not his elbow, and how they ignored the ball being out, it hitting Joelinton's arm, Joelinton pushing Gabriel with both arms fully extended, and an offside all ignored to give the goal.

I’m a newish grassroots referee. It is a very complicated, but it’s an offsides. Basically the arsenal keeper stepped up, which means that the offside line should be drawn at gabriel’s foot. You can see that the newcastle attackers foot is ahead of him when he heads the ball. So regardless of foul or out of play it’s offside. It’s a very complicated rule and these premier league referees are dumb so I’m not surprised. I’m also a liverpool fan so I have absolutely no bias in this regardless

Im a Toon fan. I cant say conclusively wether it should have stood or not but the rules are VAR is there to overturn a clear and obvious error. There was No clear error. That said Newcastle were robbed of at least 7 points last season by poor officiating and VAR decisions, Look at the non goal against Palace at St James for eg. Eddie Howe and Newcastle accepted it without the fuss and moaning. Its the standard of officiating thats needs addressing not just VAR. Howe'ay the lads

A grown man can say that... "i'm embarrassed for the Premier League" is MUCH more offensive. The clear point here is that this was a difficult goal to allow or disallow. If it had been disallowed, the other half would be screaming about VAR. If VAR had not been in place, we still don't know if the goal would have been given or not.

I’m a Newcastle fan and thought ball was out of play. If the goal hadn’t stood, think we would be having the Havertz conversation.

Everyone says "we don't have the angles" but apparently this guy does

I'm not a fan of either team but the ball was out, in fact it was more out than Rashford's ball against Brighton earlier. That was called out and this was called in. Ridiculous as VAR and handball decisions are ruining this game.

WHAT CAN YOU DO WHEN THE SAUDI OWNED TEAMS, MANCHESTER CITY, NEWCASTLE, INCLUDING CHELSEA ARE CLEARLY BEING FAVOURED BY THESE REFS OVER AND OVER AGAIN.

The ball is in and the push is questionable. Goal stands simple as.

If all three decisions are debatable, which they are, it's not a clear and obvious error so the goal stands. It's really as simple as that. 1. No proof the ball was out 2. Gabriel didn't end up in the position he was in because of Joelinton, he was dipping down to head the ball. It's debatable how much contact Joelinton actually made. 3. There was no camera angle for offside. On field decision was goal, not enough evidence to overturn it, so it stands.

It shouldn't be tribal, we should come together to sort VAR out. *But, no-one mentions United factually being the worst effected by VAR this season and also had a goal disallowed that looked more 'on-field' than Newcastle's.* Why not? Decisions following the Onana outrage have been just as bad as any club?

There will always be inconclusive data. In those instances, you go with the original decision on the pitch. Linesman says ball stayed in, ref said it wasn’t a foul, and linesman didn’t see an offside. It’s absurd how much criticism the officials are getting for this particular goal. Also, please, please can people educate themselves on how perspective works. Seeing green between the ball and the line does not mean the ball isn’t overhanging the line!

OK, VAR can't conclusively provide evidence on whether 3 separate events that were occurred. That's already bad enough. But what about that handball check that never was? From within the left inside goal angle it was clear to see that the ball slid off Joelington's left arm before Gordon kicked it in. So there are in fact 4 issues with this goal against 30 cameras in the place, and Attwell isn't even bothered to go check the monitors for himself? Arteta is absolutely within his rights to call this blunder out.

I’d love to see the stats of which clubs have benefitted the most from controversial VAR decisions and the points awarded/lost because of them.

It is different than the Liverpool case which was an error whereas this remains inconclusive. Bein technology has shown the ball was still in play. The other issues remain inconclusive so to not award the goal would be very harsh on Newcastle and you would be having the same discussion the other way round.