PMATC - Cheap DIY Automatic Tool Change concept for non-ATC Router spindles -- Poor Man's ATC

Рет қаралды 28,275

3 жыл бұрын

UPDATE Faster version 2 here: • PMATC Rev 2 - Cheap DI...
About $100 to build the ATC system, and keep using the spindle you already have. Most of the parts can be made with the router you already have and scraps. It uses table space for tools but is pretty lean about it and has high capacity for many tools by simply cutting a longer wooden tool rack.
This is a sneak peek at an initial working prototype of a tool changer system for commonly available hobby and entry-level style 110v/220v spindles that are commonly available around $200 that use 2 wrenches for manual collet tightening. In production use now in my shop and undergoing revision and code portability conversion. Intended for CNC routers but probably adaptable to other machines.
In this unprepared demo run the tool being put away ends up not fully seated in its pocket. This and other periodic issues are currently being debugged and the design revised as I find time. Hopefully soon I'll have things in a good state to leave a proper trail for others to follow.
Right now full tool change cycle is just under 2 minutes but it should not be hard to get that down to 1 minute or so just by optimizing motion and adding a probe strip to the tool rack. Horrible time compared to purpose built ATC spindles, but still infinitely better than manual change when you consider eliminating human error, tool height measurement, etc.
Powered by and requires LinuxCNC/Gmoccapy. Requires spindle speed control (and slow speeds ie 100rpm capable) among other things. The collet lock wrench assembly is getting redesigned to use commonly available cheap materials that will be easier for other folks to access. In this prototype I used some round rod linear bearings I had as spare parts from a scrapped engraver, but this will likely change to V groove bearings and a sheet metal type wrench like you find in furniture assembly kits.

Пікірлер: 59

@halopartyboy 2 жыл бұрын

When the stepper fires up to tighten the collet it sounds like a Star Trek TOS phaser firing. That's mint.

@calphis 2 жыл бұрын

I never noticed that but yeah it does now that you point it out. Thanks!

@abhimanyusingh4281 3 жыл бұрын

Great to see this concept. I too had designed this but never implemented it because I thought it would be a little slow. But your implementation is good. Little more optimisation and this could get faster. Instead of this I chose the alternative route where I build my own BT40 spindle and direct drive it with the the 2.2Kw ER20 spindle motor I have. And it has another high torque DC motor along side it on the z axis itself. Which engages using a pneumatically driven idle gear onto the main spindle gear. Along with it a clamp on the bed where the spindle will come and grip the BT40 toolholder to unscrew it and pick a new tool from tool rack just like yours, come back to clamp tighten the BT40 tool holder. Downside my approach is way more heavier and costlier. Upside tool change should be very fast, no need to measure tool height as the tool length will stay same unless I change the tool from tool holder manually. Also I get a bonus low rpm high torque spindle if I use DC motor to drive spindle specially for milling metals. Also I get BT40 benefits.

@calphis 3 жыл бұрын

I thought about doing that as well. Low rpm high torque spindle would be nice, especially for tapping. But wanted to try to come in with lowest cost possible, as you mentioned. I have other machines that can do rigid tapping and wanted this machine to do its work for the least cost investment possible. Regarding the speed, there is a design revision available to watch here: kzfaq.info/get/bejne/j76ciJyL0ZbeknU.html Where the speed is around 60 seconds for my full cycle. this includes my customized processes to remove my dust boot and measure the tool. I like to measure my tools every time to get more precision, but if your tolerances are say 0.005" you can probably get away with just CA glue the tool into the ER collet (or use slightly undersized collet and heat shrink it) and skip measurement. If you did that, this tool change cycle could be as low as 40 seconds perhaps. Further optimization can be made. I think I can eventually make this 30 seconds for the tool change only. Thanks for watching and commenting!

@oneTwo-qr7ok 3 жыл бұрын

This is really great! Thank you for uploading this superb video! You are genius!!!!!!!!!!

@calphis 3 жыл бұрын

Thanks so much!

@bumblebee1440 2 жыл бұрын

Omg only 345 subscribers….dude. This was a massive amount of work. I looooove it!!!! Much love.

@calphis 2 жыл бұрын

Probably not as much as it might seem at first glance, but yeah, a fair bit of work. I was a software engineer in a past life so the programming part was easy. The mechanical parts were mostly already on the shelf, and I incorporated design elements from 3 or 4 homebrew ATCs I liked. Have recently rewritten the software so you can just change variables to match your own table's setup/positioning, and about 75% complete redesigning the parts to be off-the-shelf or very cheap for the 2 custom parts (a few dollars, not a few hundred). Hoping late 2022 it will be ready for the public to adopt on their DIY/hobby machines. It will still be a bit of a timesink to get running, but I will have done 90% of the heavy lifting in terms of design and guidance. The adopter will just need to spend time figuring out how to mount on their machine and tweaking the positions, putting the configuration and scripts in the right place, etc

@calphis 2 жыл бұрын

and thank you so much, and thanks for stopping by :)

@visvivacnckenya1620 4 ай бұрын

Bro this is pure awesome.. Please help do this.. Av dreamed of atc but this is awesome.

@blessedwarrior1 2 жыл бұрын

Simply brilliant. 👏👏👏

@calphis 2 жыл бұрын

Thank you so much 😀

@sermadreda399 2 жыл бұрын

genius man , thank you for sharing

@calphis 2 жыл бұрын

Thanks for watching. There's an updated version here that's twice as fast: kzfaq.info/get/bejne/j76ciJyL0ZbeknU.html

@techydiy 2 жыл бұрын

Excellent.

@calphis 2 жыл бұрын

Thanks!

@airgunningyup 3 жыл бұрын

awesome , the 1.5 kw spindle on my mill kills many ideas because tool changes are such a pain in the butt.

@calphis 3 жыл бұрын

Thanks. Yeah, my primary reason for wanting ATC is to eliminate human error. I would often not reset the new tool height properly or something like that. Letting the machine handle the process has resulted in a lot fewer botched workpieces.

@Reburned32 2 жыл бұрын

Beautiful :)

@calphis 2 жыл бұрын

Thanks!

@dronesvisionsaeriennes 4 ай бұрын

Hello, very nice job i discovered now...does it work under GRBL ? thank's a lot Philip

@calphis 4 ай бұрын

Only works for LinuxCNC

@Signmonkey 2 жыл бұрын

Awesome!!

@calphis 2 жыл бұрын

Thanks!

@ericthecyclist 2 жыл бұрын

Magnificent! One thing I don't grasp though: how is a tool picked up versus released when the spindle is at the tool tray? The collet will be loose at this point.

@calphis 2 жыл бұрын

The spindle rpm control is used to thread it on with coordinated Z motion. Similar to screwing a bolt in or out. The tool tray has each pocket with a hex shape that keeps the collet nut from spinning so this can be done. For this reason the spindle has to capable of lower speeds, say 150-300 rpm. At this speed this kind of motor has very little torque, so it's just barely tighter than finger tight -- just enough to hold it in place to move it to the pocket or tightening wrench. Thanks for stopping by!

@calphis 2 жыл бұрын

There is also an updated revision 2 on the channel that cuts the cycle time down to about 1 minute.

@ericthecyclist 2 жыл бұрын

@@calphis That is even more elegant. And the torque explanation explains why you don't use it for the full tightening. Thank you!

@calphis 2 жыл бұрын

Yeah, even if you had a rigid tapping spindle capable of the torque level to tighten it properly you would probably still need a separate wrench assembly to loosen the collet after heavy cuts. As the spindle can, through cutting forces, create a situation where the nut is torqued so tight it cannot under its own power loosen it again.

@marshallmann7620 5 ай бұрын

haha! this is amazing!!!!

@mellis966 5 ай бұрын

This is a fantastic project! Thanks for sharing

@tzfletcher 2 жыл бұрын

Genius!

@calphis 2 жыл бұрын

Thanks! It has its downsides but for what it is (extremely cheap to implement and dont throw away your existing spindle) it works pretty well and is fairly reliable. There is a Rev 2 that works about 2x as fast on the channel also that you might like to see. Thanks for dropping by!

@crocodil.13 6 күн бұрын

Waaaahhhhhhh i LOVE

@TheCalibso Жыл бұрын

Amazing work, Please can you share Post Processer file ?

@calphis Жыл бұрын

It's not a file, but a series of files and subroutines that right now that require LinuxCNC and user must be very familiar with LinuxCNC custom macros system to make any real use of it. I'm working on making the files portable to run on other people's linuxCNC machines, and easier to setup, but I'm not done yet. No plans to port to any other controller like Mach3. not sure if it would even work.

@GeorgeZaharia Жыл бұрын

seems ATC adaptors are more expensive than a CNC milling machine .... is crazy ... nvrm il do it myself.

@rok1475 2 жыл бұрын

How do you hold the spindle while loosening and tightening the nut?

@calphis 2 жыл бұрын

There is a wrench bolted to a plate that runs on a linear guide rail. There is a heavy 900g linear solenoid that pushes it in the direction of the spindle. This gives it an even force but its magnetic so it can "Flex" until the wrench has meshed. The spindle is made to slowly turn until the flat part mates with the wrench. There are switches on the guide rail so the machine gets a signal when the wrench has fully meshed, and when the wrench is completely free and its safe to move the spindle again. Thanks for looking!

@rok1475 2 жыл бұрын

@@calphis Very clever!

@colinfinn5592 2 жыл бұрын

What spindle did you use for this?

@calphis 2 жыл бұрын

This is just a regular "run of the mill" 1.5kW 24krpm 65mm diameter air cooled spindle from China, with a Huanyang 220V VFD. no reason it wouldn't work with a 120V or a 400W for that matter on a 3018. it works with any spindle where you can get rpm control and FWD/REV control.

@NamelesshunterGaming 4 ай бұрын

f ing impressive

@RoboArc 3 ай бұрын

Did you edit the GRBL source for this ?

@calphis 3 ай бұрын

this is not Grbl. It's LinuxCNC

@RoboArc 3 ай бұрын

@calphis ahhh, well damn. So its macros

@tca3899 Жыл бұрын

What kind or model of spindle are you using?

@calphis Жыл бұрын

This is just a typical Chinese made 24krpm 4 bearing spindle with a VFD. This is a 65mm diameter body variant. this one happens to be 220V 1.5kW. This approach will work with any spindle capable of low rpm like 100rpm or so.

@calphis Жыл бұрын

Huanyang vfd or its many clones will work

@cemileri4166 2 жыл бұрын

Poor ? There lies a quiet great treasure there..

@calphis 2 жыл бұрын

Thanks for the kind words! There is an improved version you can see here that is twice as fast and adds more error checking. kzfaq.info/get/bejne/j76ciJyL0ZbeknU.html

@Tchefter 3 жыл бұрын

wow - thats great - there is a lot of brainwash in it - thanks for the show!

@calphis 3 жыл бұрын

My pleasure!

@JonasDM46 3 жыл бұрын

Nice idea, but way to slow compared to a regular atc spindle.

@calphis 3 жыл бұрын

Thanks for looking. This video is just the first pass on design and testing and had not been optimized for speed yet. The current version I have in use does the tool change only in about 40 seconds or so. Still, slow compared to conventional ATC, true. But this is not intended for production shops who are counting seconds of cycle time. They can and should invest in proper industrial grade ATC. The primary design goal here is to retrofit existing machines that hobbyists and small or custom shops already have, keep the spindle you already have, and spend the least amount of money (about $120 if you build it yourself) to get things automated. Just "check the box" for eliminating human error on tool measurement/offset setup, and downtime waiting on operator to do tool change but he's elsewhere drinking coffee, etc.

@Rftyree84 2 жыл бұрын

Faster than I can change a tool on mine. And consistently the same length of time probably.

@calphis 2 жыл бұрын

@@Rftyree84 Thanks. Yep fairly consistent. There is sometimes a failed mesh of the wrench/socket or the tool doesn't come out in the pocket. There are sensors and loops to detect this, so it can correct itself and carry on. But time is lost when it happens. But its uncommon and usually only adds 10-20 seconds. On par with dropping a tool on the floor during a manual change. There is now a Rev2 that does the whole thing (including new height measure in just under a minute). Thanks for looking.