I found this a very interesting interview, and was surprised by Huw’s openness about the answers he gave. As a train driver though, I do think the industrial action does need sorting. I work for GWR, and we have not seen a pay rise for 5 years. Inflation over that time has been huge, yet we are expected by this national dispute to take cuts to our terms and conditions so that the government can feel they’ve won a battle against the unions. Sorry, but we as in a difficult position just like everyone else. Those headline quotes that Huw uses in this interview are not the issues we have on GWR. I cannot decide to take leave at 10pm tonight for tomorrow’s shift, I’ll be lucky if I can book leave today for next year. This dispute needs sorting at local levels where t&c’s are relevant to individual companies, not nationally. We don’t want to strike, we suffer when we do. Bills don’t get paid, just like everyone else. Our electricity, gas, fuel, food has all gone up just like everyone else. We have 1000+ people on our trains whose lives we are responsible for.

An insightful interview! And great to have some insiders asking the minister the questions! Huw has a really impressive overview of how our railways run, and it is clear that he keeps on top of what is going on across the industry. This is really nice to see. We lack real ambition though, where is the long term (20 year plus) vision? Why not have an ambition to run a HS2 line to Edinburgh, Glasgow, Newcastle, the South West? Link it with Heathrow to allow connections that will materially reduce the need for domestic flights. If we're serious about decarbonising, getting people off planes and onto trains we should not be afraid of ambition. We also lack a commitment to be a little more honest as to how HS2 funds are 'reallocated' - we mostly know that this is a smoke screen to soften the blow of disconnecting the north with London. In terms of Industrial Relations however Hew should be better than picking and choosing the most headline grabbing terms from across a wide and varied industry and running away with them to make a political point. The annual leave quotas mentioned are set to allow the lowest quota which allows all annual leave to be taken over an annual cycle. Reduce the quota and you'd be denying people annual leave they are entitled to. My terms also state that I may have my rest day for the following week moved with only 7 days notice, not allowing me to plan any social time with friends or family. My spare arrangements allow the company to extend my working day, on the day, with no notice. The terms are flexible to allow the railway to function. I'm not complaining about these terms, merely highlighting that there is far more nuance than meets the eye here. Double tripping doesn't work in the same way at all operators. Southeastern run mostly short distance services. Of course you can run multiple times in a day here. An end to end journey on a long distance operator is usually between 2 and 4 hours. The only way to introduce double tripping would be to split staffing along a journey where traincrew would normally run through (for example splitting a journey between Manchester and London at Crewe). This splitting occurred at TransPennine Express and was a significant contributor to their poor performance in recent years, as one journey from Liverpool to Newcastle that may have once had one driver, was changed to have maybe three different drivers en-route. This means that if the middle sector driver was delayed or unavailable, the whole journey may have been forced to be cancelled, even if the Liverpool-Manchester and York-Newcastle segments were covered. Theoretically more 'efficient' but the railway should have some resilience built in to afford reliability. With regards to the deal that has been offered to ASLEF, talking is the only medication for mediation here, offering a deal that is the same as the deal offered to the RMT last year could see some movement on this issue. It would break the current deadlock and allow a return to normal working, as we have seen has worked so far in the fact the RMT have not conducted any national action since the deal was agreed. Open access operators are able to have better Industrial Relations as they aren't constrained by the Department for Transport. Cutting the amount of time it takes to train safety critical staff is hardly where the focus should be, do we want to potentially compromise safety in the name of rushing staff to the operational railway? The impacts may not be immediate, but over time could well be felt.

This video is a credit to both Mr Merriman and yourselves. Lots of detail and sense spoken, with a distinct lack of party politics. A really refreshing change.

Nigel &Richard Thankyou both for bringing this to us,a most interesting interview with the Rail minister.

Nigel, Richard and Stef, thank you for bringing us this absorbing interview. Whatever anyone's views may be on the topics covered, it provided a great insight with some very direct and hard hitting questions, and thankfully managed to steer clear of any party politics. Credit to Huw Merriman for answering the questions so openly as well. Huge congratulations indeed!

Mark harper can have 8 meetings with Alstom but can’t bring himself to meet with the unions once in 18months. Huw very selective with the Terms and conditions and leave. If they’re so “passionate” and want to resolve the issues then they’d simply have to talk. Great interview gents

That was excellent . I thought Huw Merman came across very well . He clearly knew his subject and was very passionate on the subject shattering my illusion that these ministers were lightweights with an eye on the next department for career development. Some good examples on working practices too - I can now see why they need to change . Well done on getting the interview . Green Signals rapidly becoming the go to source for information on railways . And even though the subjects can be technical it is explained in straight forward language as opposed to corporate speak ( I nearly said something else there)

Excellent and very insightful interview, with well-chosen questions. Merriman sounds well on top of his brief and fluent on detail, whether or not you agree with him. In his backbench days as Transport Committee Chairman he was well-respected too, I believe. Pity he's unlikely to be in the job much longer!

A very interesting interview. Plenty I could comment on, but one thing which stuck in my mind was Huw's assertion that Lumo training their drivers far more quickly than other operators was a good thing. I remain to be convinced that is the case, though I accept having just one type of traction and one route might have a slight bearing on it. Cheers, Rob

I keep saying every week Green Signals gets better & better, you’ve just hit the gold standard for this interview. No matter what your views are of Huw it was an insightful & somewhat encouraging interview regarding our railways. Richard & Nigel prove, if any was needed, their professionalism in getting through the chaff to get to the real story. Brilliant, absolutely brilliant.

Great interview as usual gents, very good questioning, especially on the freight sector and the network north work. The rail minister was doing not three bad at that point until, industrial relations. Picking juicy points that are a real minority at certain depots and not the railway norm. The leave he commented on is not the norm, where I am it's 3 off out of 33, any more and it's STT. He never mentions our start time can be moved 3hrs for us if spare and days can be extended and you get 72hrs notice or evening before. On a booked work day, you can be moved to anything to cover work. Cut and paste is a normal practice for us. You cannot plan to do anything on a work day as it cannot be guaranteed as a finish time as you already have an hr extra overtime built in that you can be told to do under certain circumstances. I feel he's been given loud sounding bullet points but has no real idea on the role of a driver or the effect on your social life. As for industrial relations - I don't believe a word he said. They control what is being offered and what is being offered is disgusting. It's basically taking us back umpteen years on what was traded over time. I'd rather stay on what I am than pull my own pants down. If he was serious about his empty words ( I know that doesn't make sense but neither did the minister ) then get sat down with the union before our sister unions go back out on strike for something else. Keep them coming gents as they are really informative

Guys, an excellent interview. I guess it would have been easy to drop into a Labour good, Tory bad approach. Good that neither of you took that approach. Yes, there were times when Huw got himself out of ‘trouble’ by simply saying, “I hold my hands up” or “that’s a fair point” or “I completely agree with that”. But your approach allowed Huw to talk and explain his thinking. At some point he and his colleagues will be in or out of office. That, is of course, down to us as individuals in the privacy of the polling booth.

Keep it up gents, this channel continues to grow and grow and it's good to see. Fair play to Huw for coming on and facing the music. It would be great to get an interview with Louise Haigh for balance

On HS2, when he spoke about habits changing; Croossrail, the Croydon tram( and M25) are all cases, where, once built, they were a huge success. On the M25 no one considered future use, and upgrades had to hurriedly built. Crossrail is a roaring success. Potentially more silly than cancelling Birmingham to Manchester was cancelling/ignoring the between HS1 and HS2.

Considering the number of people I see whilst tending planters at my the local town station who go to the ticket office door and find it locked due to lack of staff, I suspect lots of people will be looking for staff for advice & sales in the ticket office at the front of the station, not wandering around randomly on one of three different platforms behind it. And based on what I've been asked when they realise the old bloke in the orange HV weeding & watering is the only "railway person" around (even though I'm just a community rail volunteer) quite a few of them want the ticket office staffed for journey advice for trips they are planning in the future.

A brilliant interview

Very engaging and informative interview which restored my faith in Huw Merriman. If only every Government Minister, of whichever Party, spoke so knowledgeably in response to detailed, challenging questions. The body language from all three of you also spoke volumes, though, so I’m looking forward to your interview post-mortem!

What a refreshing change, knowledgeable and tough but fair interviewers and a politician that cares and answers questions properly 👍

Impressed with his office, especially the Forth Bridge painting! Great to get this interview, can't claim to have learnt too much new other than the HS2 Euston plans. Very good range of questions and you took no nonsense from the minister, getting some admissions of mistakes. Could maybe have spent more time on HS2 2a and why it's a no brainer especially for link to Scotland, a place he never mentioned. So much for union connectivity. Loved the electric loco question on freight, hope switch back to diesel will stop. Also great he admitted being a green signals listener! Would love to see a discussion between Huw and Mick on those conditions he mentioned. Need some train orders now for the builders. As you say performance and resilience are vital for passenger confidence. Good open access question too. Excellent interview overall and some wins where he accepted many of the points you raised, although don't think he changed his mind on any of the issues.

Ecxellent interview ... bit of a masterclass really!

A good interview up until the industrial relations bit. I'm guessing by Huws body language (arms crossed, constantly shifting in his seat) that there is more to this topic than simple financial negotiations (ideology perhaps?). I would like to have seen him asked about his comment last January (2023) that it had already cost more to fight the unions than to settle and also why only one offer (despite his obvious fixation with 'drivers are paid £60k') has been made (in exchange for a multitude of t&c's, not just the handful that he gave) and why ASLEF have not been allowed to negotiate directly with the employers in the way that he seemed so pleased that the RMT are. Well done once again, though, for a superb podcast and thank you.

The dispute with ASLEF needs sorting out. So passengers can plan their journeys in advance. Not talking to the union for over a year is not a way of this coming to an end. It won't get resolved until after the general election now. Very grim.

Excellent interview - Huw Merriman certainly appeared on top of his brief. Quite a coup for Green Signals. Nonetheless - with a project hat on - I cannot but see that the cancellation of HS2 at this late stage is other than highly costly.

24:50 Surely the £33bn in tax paid by motorists is intended to reflect the social and environmental harm they cause (noise nuisance, air pollution, accidents, microplastic pollution from tyres etc)? It's not supposed to fund more and more roads!

I get the point that conditions need to change with industrial relations but at greater Anglia we have almost none of those conditions so a deal surly would be very easy to come by if it was done TOC by TOC and not nationally. Noting that Greater Anglia drivers are paid £30k below some of the others. Maybe if Aventi see others separately agreeing to conditions that their members may not actually care about or understand need to change maybe be more keen to agree on changing them also.

I think he came across very well here

Huw actually speaks sense at times during this interview. I didn't realise members of his party were allowed to do that!

Great pod cast. Still disagree with Minister about HS2 land. I think they should build a new underground station at Manchester Piccadilly

Great Interview Richard and Nigel. Thought that Huw Merriman came across very well, loved the body language when you asked him some of those questions, but like/loath the minister, he did definitely come across as extremely knowledgeable. Still not sure about some of his motives or the ways that he engages with industry, but I think his heart is in the right place. I wonder whether he feels up to doing a follow-on interview to deal with all the unasked questions that I know you both were itching to ask.

Brilliant and immensely insightful interview I wish all ministers/MPs would give interviews like this However, take a shot every time Huw mentions the transport the select committee lol

Great chat!

My respect for Mr Merriman would grow exponentially if he would go on Railnatter and answer a few questions.

An excellent interview and use of a Father Ted reference boosted my opinion of him. Now, let's get some delivery!

This was a terrific episode of Green signals.... Lot of time about HS2.... I'd loved you to ask about Hs1! What's his view on Ebbsfleet and Ashford reopening.... Many other questions ....

Lumo complete driver training in 8 months ! That probably explains why one driver went over 25 mph points at Peterborough station at around 70mph luckily not derailing the train, smashing the station up along with many people ! Regards leave, like the GWR driver says your lucky to get it next month never mind the night before, I’ve never heard of that 35yrs railway service. They seem not to realise the skill and knowledge required to do this job safely

Great interview guys! Huw was candid, clear-headed, and clearly cares about the railways. I think the HS2 hack-back was out of his hands and until the Conservatives lose the election he won't be able to say publicly that he thought it was a bad idea. Glad to hear that the removal of safeguarding and sale of land is gradual and reversible though. However I think the industrial disputes are more complicated than he makes out and that the govt is more to blame than he admits. We have got ourselves into a bit of a mess with train procurement with the "bust" years of the late 90's and early 00's eroding our manufacturing base, to the boom of the last 10 years or so meaning we have had to assemble foreign products and import complete trains. So now the government is feeling the pressure to prop up Hitachi and CAF as well as Alstom. I don't think we can support 4 plants in the long-term, Derby is the only remaining jewel in the crown and it sounds like a plan is finally coming into effect to give them some certainty and turn it into a centre of excellence for "medium weight" multiple units. Hitachi have built a mediocre product with initially very little local high-value-added content, that is changing but possibly too late? Siemens have a very good history of actually investing in facilities and people in the UK so I expect them to make a success of Goole. CAF looks like a bit of a dead end since they lost out on HS2 work and don't have much more in the pipeline. It would be nice to see the return of electric motor and freight locomotive manufacture to the UK but I don't see that happening without a serious industrial strategy tied to with a proper electrification strategy.

Surprisingly enlightening video - I wouldn't vote for his party in a million years, but Huw Merriman really knows his subject and was surprisingly passionate about the future of the railways. Interesting in that he was very committed to the HS2 station at Euston. The bit on cancelling HS2 North of Brum - it very much felt that he was having to follow the Govt line and the party view, but privately would prefer the whole 2a and 2b route to be finished. Reassuring to hear that essentially none of the land for 2a/2b will be sold off any time soon. The industrial relations bit was again reposting the govt view - ASLEF and the current govt/next Labour govt ultimately both need to compromise

Did my ears deceive me or did he really say fares go up by inflation because wages go up? Have I missed something from the RMT and ASLEF disputes where there hadn't been a pay rise in 5 years and staff wages make up a small part of the operating cost?

Loved the interview, though I really wished you could have pushed him more on the IR section.

Just an observation re ticket offices. My brother was a booking clerk on TfL, the booking office was closed and bro was “retrained” as a station supervisor… still on a booking clerk salary. At the same time TfL removed station assistants so ex-booking clerks were expected to run an entire station on their own. He showed me some of the CCTV footage. Frightening. Drunks falling on the track, drug dealer fights, 300 school kids pouring into the platforms - all supposed to be managed by a single person. Ridiculous, fortunately he’s now taken retirement before he had to deal with a fatality which was always his worst nightmare

Thanks

A thought about Derby, the Elizabeth line central core has been built to accommodate I think 300m long trains, why not add the order for those additional vehicles to the new planned 10 train order to future-proof integration with the current fleet of class 345 units making them up to the extra length without design differences. Just a thought.

Thank you for this key interview now at the top of my list (and I am taking notes) ! The Lumo training insight and management shows how we can do better. Probably electrification and decarbonizaton will need the new nuclear reactors (e.g. Xe-100s) perhaps 10 years out ? There are good plans going forward.

10 months to train a Lumo driver as against 18 months norm...what about that Peterborough overspeed close shave?....wasn't that driver error? And are Lumo drivers new recruits or people leaving another driving job? But very good interview, tough but reasonable at the same time, and good humoured.

Huw was a bit more clued up than I expected. But, reform should not stop drivers or guards getting a pay rise . Drivers have not had a rise in 5 years at northern, that’s not fair or reasonable and making them wait , and give up conditions and practices that would make the railway less safe is also not fair or reasonable. No strings pay rise. Move on

Why was the refurbishment of Sunderland station such as mess? why is platform work in Teesside running well past target dates? Why is Northern Rail still an utter mess?

There is much disengenious stuff from Huw especially on industrial relations. The railways have had people from 'outside/other' industries in the last 20-30 years ...In the whole they have proved absolutley useless. Lumo Drivers ..cost over safety !! I think its telling that he mentions the miners.. they beat them into oblivion. The framing of terms and conditions changes wanted of Drivers ..is ludicrous bordering on lies.

I’ve left a few comments there, I hope he or his team have a read and reflect.

With regards to HST2, DfT and gov.uk are just needlessly penny pinching. Beeching said the same in the 60's that taking out the rail network will be replaced by cheaper & better bus networks. It never happened and only encouraged car use with communities and industries became economically isolated for decades.

When will the Sprinters go Huw? When will I not have to stand on tip toes rammed against a train door unable to move? You’ve talked about fixing everything other than passenger experience on the ground.

Nothing in Tees Valley and North East in Network North. Nothing at all in rail projects.

Put Huw Merriman in a room with a load of railway workers instead of journalists or politicians, see how he fairs then…

Grand Centrals trains breakdown all the time, they aren’t required to upgrade these and they are a mess and unreliable, I notice he avoided mentioning GC.

Why did they [Tories] allow Arriva Northern then DfT mislead passengers in North East on Pacers being replaced with new trains?

😅another great program from GS i find Hew Merriman one of the best transport ministers and select committee chairs we have been fortunate to have had, he has a real understanding of his brief and an asset to the railway. keep up the good work GS

32:30 Is the rail minister really unaware of how to buy a ticket from Boundary Zone 6 to Milton Keynes? Or is Avanti still being obstructive to people who do that? (And if they are, couldn't Mr Merriman give the ORR a kick up the backside on the issue?)

There’s the ‘ecumenical’ word again!

Listen to this podcast whilst on a VIA Rail service from Montreal to Quebec. A good interview with lots of fresh initiatives coming up during chat. I wonder, Bradford it could have a through station under the city centre joining the two limited capacity existing station. Similar to what Thameslink improvement contributed to King's Cross.

You should have asked Huw about his plans to cross the floor & defect to Labour

Silly question why on earth do we need to go all the way to Euston. We need to go to Central london not Euston. Duh. A new Paddington would suffice and avoid tunneling under central London

Great interview chaps. A few observations if I may; Sorry, but Merriman must live in a world of Merriman reality which isn't the reality of most rail users. I'm sure he believes everything he said and for the best of intentions but the net effect of the proposals in his time in office across the board is a rail service that is no longer as good as it was and continues to leave a wake of former staff and customers paid off, priced off and 'eed off. To sit there as Rail Minister and shrug his shoulders at the reality of seeing £12Bn wiped off future rail enhancement work to be used on road schemes which already enjoy greater funding and sources of funding then remain in post........? Maybe he believes staying in post he's able to protect the interests of rail users more effectively, with £12Bn less to protect! He waxed lyrical about multi skilling ticket office staff - as if they are not already skilled, and were in desperate need of saving from a life of boredom. I regularly use three stations in Worcester, and all three of them would have seen staff removed entirely from those stations, to be replaced by a 'mobile' teams who presumably would have been in only one place at a time and much of it in a van! Freight - the Q was on infill OLE - spot on. No excuses as the distances being proposed are tiny compared to a whole mainline project. But he while acknowledging an 'interest' he rapidly deviated onto the subject of Battery tech and the class 230 trial?????? What has this to do with freight, and freight traction needs? 'Last mile' battery powered traction at the terminal of course but the Q was about getting to the terminal from the nearest OLE with a 1500+ Ton payload, not 65T! Re the IA - all he has to do is negotiate! We know that hasn't happened. One final point which also illustrates a significant difference in approach to GBR between the two main political parties; HM feels the railway lacks adequate PM capability - I think that's what he was implying and sees the solution to bring in more people from outside to 'help' the industry. I suspect he'll need to set a budget which allows for constant schooling for the outsiders of why one REALLY can't do certain things in different way! Perhaps by 'outside' he means from the traditional rail consultancies? That would likely avoid the schooling but hopefully doesn't simply offset the benefits they may bring to the table with their bill to pay at the end of each month? Labour on the other hand made a big play on populating GBR with 'rail experts'..........gets my vote. To be fair to HM, he was asked questions I suspect we did all want to hear answers to, and by and large he gave a response to the majority in his words. He clearly brings enthusiasm for his role. He clearly talks a good game.......And to your credit, just as the you did in the interview with Mick Whelan you allow the guest to answer as they see fit which makes for great viewing and generally better insight. And you were polite and totally cordial.

I thought he came across well, it’s obviously not a job where you can please everyone but at least he didn’t dodge the questions. The points about reforming terms and conditions are well made, he mentioned a couple but there’s plenty more. Some rail employees will comment on here and go on the defensive, but really it’s not good enough to be wedded to archaic ways of working in this day and age when passengers deserve better. It’s not unreasonable to ask for some modernisation.

An excellent interview, with a refreshingly honest politician who seems really committed to rail. What a pity he is very unlikely to be in any decision making role in the next few months. Let's hope the new incumbents are equally committed and as broad-minded as Mr Merriman.

Skirting round some issues, incorrect on some but bye and large answers that he thought they wanted to hear. Not impressed.

We must Stop this obsession with talking about Tax Payers money subsidising the railway or paying for any public service. As currency issuer, the Govt.does not need to raise money. It can just spend money into the economy, to pay for anything, the only limitation being the economies ability to absorb that spending without becoming inflationary. Taxes, provision the Govt & get people to work, so that they earn currency to pay their taxes, which control inflation & people's behaviour. When money was first introduced, it came first & spent into the economy. Taxes were then introduced to give value to currency, by reducing the risk of inflation. This is, I believe, an accurate description of how the economy works & not as we have constantly been led to believe. Alan Greenspan, former U.S.Federal Reserve Chairman from 1987 to 2006, is one such person who was honest enough to admit this.

HST extension to Manchester and even Scotland is as obvious as the nose on your face! He can talk as long as he likes, it wont change the facts

No operator allows you to book leave 22:00 the night before! This man is an out and out liar. He's also twisting existing conditions of service that exist in one company to suit his own agenda without understanding how they actually work. If the DfT removed the stranglehold it has over the operators this dispute would have been solved 2 years ago. I wouldnt be using Lumo as a shining example of slashing the length of time it takes to train a Driver up....

Bradford like Teesside and Wearside is stuck to with Grand Central as an operator that’s becoming increasingly unreliable.

So ticket prices go up everywhere, but the majority increase in travel standards remains down south.

He should really be the PM.

Not impressed with Merriman on HS2. He focuses on headline quotes. His opening remark about rump HS2 creating a lot more capacity is a very political statement. It isn't based on reality. His remarks about lifting land safeguarding are simply avoiding the issue about future capacity improvements. Not convinced about Euston. Still, like most ministers he'll be gone soon.

Thanks