It’s worse today (6 years later) You have well known Pastors of large churches writing books telling us we “got it wrong”. The local leaders openly show they they welcome this kind of behavior and give such people voice. John and Charles Wesley would cringe at what is being done!

I am not a United Methodist, but it is nice to know that conservative, Bible-believing followers of Jesus still exist within this denomination. I have learned much from the Wesleyan tradition and it is sad to see that it has come to the point that it is right now in history. I am praying that the majority votes for the Traditional plan this afternoon. As Christians, we all affect each other.

As a former Episcopalian now a member of a Southern Baptist Convention affiliated church I understand how difficult this must be. I was one of the Choose This Day group within the Episcopal Church which lead to the formation of the Anglican Church in North America. I am praying for you as a Evangelical Christian for your well being.

Most born again followers of Jesus Christ have long ago left Western churches of all denominations because what is being taught is not Christianity but feel-good churchianity. It's truly disgusting the abominable sins that are now being welcomed in these churches, sins so awful that Sodom and Gomorrah would be embarrassed by them. Yet God wiped out those two cities for far less. Very few sitting in the pews of Western "civilization" churches will ever see the Kingdom. Wesley and Wilberforce weep over what the UMC is doing to Methodism.

he or she who teaches in the church will have a great influence on what path your children take. choose your leaders wisely .if want them to follow god's word, follow the bible , and don't let anyone interpret it for you. read it for yourself !

Up until now I thought when the word said what is wrong will be considered right? And what is right with considered wrong and what is good would be considered evil? And what is evil considered good? I thought it was talking about the world but now I'm starting to believe that it's talking about the church. But then again if you go in the way of the world, what's the difference?

The United Church of Canada, with similar historic origins, went this hyper progressive way, and it is dying. One church a WEEK is closing. Four hundred in the last decade.

left the Methodist church years ago for the assembly of god.

“I appeal to you, brothers, to watch out for those who cause divisions and create obstacles contrary to the doctrine that you have been taught; avoid them. For such persons do not serve our Lord Christ, but their own appetites, and by smooth talk and flattery they deceive the hearts of the naive.” ‭‭Romans‬ ‭16‬:‭17‬-‭18‬ Which one are you?

I, am not Methodist either; I, am CATHOLIC But I feel for this organization. This video was 2016; I read in the paper some groups broke away. We, have a nun where I, live that see nothing wrong with Gay Unions. She noted. at a cousins Wedding# isn't that special no one condemned them. I, told her. # we should # judge not lest we be judged#; but we still do not have to be forced to called good evil true# whatever & beautiful turned into giving in to our lists. We, are Christians whom are, supposed to be ABOVE the world, NOT as bad as. My sister is Methodist and I, pray for the Conservative Church. Jesus said the gate would be narrow& I believe in the Last days True Christians will be very few. in number🙏🙏🙏

The rot of the apostate UMC is just beginning. This decline in the moral atmosphere of the local churches which stayed in the UMC will not be a slow one. Many will weep bitter tears when they see the results of what they have opened the door for in the name of inclusiveness.

Those that like religion in their politics seem to also like politics in their religion. Its a weary road to travel. Rather you keep your eyes on the prize ppl.

if my pastor ever invited abominations into our church, either he goes.. or we go......ths is going to be the pattern as satan branches out into main stream religion...

Dear sir I was raised in the Methodist church the problem is not only are they wrong and out of doctrinal bounds.But you and your group are as well. You and elders like you have totally put aside Paul's, Roman's teachings you have allowed women to take the pulpits intact you applauded it and still do .Remember eve was beguiled by satin and in her or all womans punishments they were to be subjected to men in spiritual things remember christ is head of man and man of woman the UMC stopped following Gods basic plans .UMC, welcome to Gods punishment

Well said, unfortunately. Unfortunate that we even have to have this discussion. Unfortunate, troubling, and a call to action. God Bless your Reverend for being called to action.

Amen brother! I will keep you in my prayers

God Bless you Rob. I personally had to prematurely leave a church from where I received confirmation and attended thru young adulthood when the (then) Bishop in California appointed his daughter as the assistant pastor and another woman as the senior pastor. Their first order of business was to openly proclaim their desire to perform same sex marriages. My parents had always been fiercely loyal to this small church in Napa and were one of their major financial contributors. But that pronouncement broke their hearts and they never attended church again. I had both their funerals at the cemetery, officiated by former pastors who had been their friends, because I couldn't bear to hold them in the church where they had spent nearly 35 years but where they had been betrayed. You have my heartiest support in this very dividing issue and I will most certainly let my allegiance be known. Crystal Brown

How can "she" become a bishop?

Liberals don't recognize limits such as monetary, time, legal or, obviously, Biblical. To liberals, the rules that govern the United Methodist Church represent another set of limits to ignore as they pursue their agenda. I believe that, if you don't agree with the rules of the organization, then either leave that organization or work within the framework of rules to change what you don't like,. But, in the meantime, the rules as written must be obeyed. To do otherwise will lead to anarchy. I hope the UMC leadership will stand up, as Rev. Renfroe suggests. If they don't, and soon, then it will be time for me to find another denomination that still follows the Bible.

In the Southern Baptist convention is headed down the same dark road as a united Methodist. It is truly the end of times.

Thank you for speaking the Truth.

Come out of Babylon! Go back to the first Church and follow Jesus! Reject all practices of the Whore of Babylon and her daughters. Reject all writings past the first century. Become the Church, be the priest you were meant to be. Read the new agreement forget the obsolete covenants of the Jews and follow Christ.

I've just recently discovered you and your message through my mother-in-law. Thank you for getting the truth out about the fall of the UMC.

Rob, You mentioned that 5 conferences and 4 boards of ordained ministry have said that they would not follow the Book of discipline teaching on ordination. In addition you mentioned two jurisdictions that don't recognize the Book of Discipline. If possible, I would appreciate the exact specifics as to where these are located. If there is anything in writing from these places, I would appreciate seeing those as well. Just curious and wanting more information. Sadly, I think you are absolutely correct that this action was taken as a back-room action to initiate a forced political appointment to a bishopric which will likely trigger a schism in the church. RC

1 Corinthians 6:9-11 New International Version (NIV) 9 Or do you not know that wrongdoers will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived: Neither the sexually immoral nor idolaters nor adulterers nor men who have sex with men[a] 10 nor thieves nor the greedy nor drunkards nor slanderers nor swindlers will inherit the kingdom of God. 11 And that is what some of you were. But you were washed, you were sanctified, you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ and by the Spirit of our God. Footnotes: 1 Corinthians 6:9 The words men who have sex with men translate two Greek words that refer to the passive and active participants in homosexual acts.

In my humble opinion, our pastors are not preaching Jesus. When we get back to the basics, we may have a revival. I love what ALPHA is creating around the world. Churches full of sinners saved by Grace of the Lord Jesus Christ. Try it, it might save the church.

What was the outcome of this I wonder?

now 2017...what is the update? How close are we to coming together or splitting up? I'm new to all this and trying to get caught up. Thank you for your faithfulness to God's word.

God bless you Rob Renfroe I am praying for you and each who stand for the word of God.

Bro. Renfroe Oklahoma churches still hold on to the BOD. However they are trying to start pushing it here. Bro. Renfroe i come back to the Methodist church if they would fix this problem. Thank you for what you are doing John Wesley taught Holiness but the UMC isn't do that.I thank if the UMC split if this every pass in the charger conference . I thank the Church of the Nazarene will be a bigger group. I have a pastor friend that is Nazarene and he told me about 300 tried to pull this whole let's give the gays members in the church and let them be pastor endless to say the Church of the Nazarene shut that down really Fast . I am sorry for the typos and my prayer is that the UMC will get back to it true roots and not let the devil destroys it true values and morals of Holiness in Faith.

Doesnt the bible say, "Let the woman learn in silence with all subjection. But I suffer not a woman to teach, nor to usurp authority over the man, but to be in silence. For Adam was first formed, then Eve. And Adam was not deceived, but the woman being deceived was in the transgression.". Had you done what God said, then these women wouldn't be deceiving your members and causing the problems that you now have." If you look at ever denomination that has this problem, it's women who are the leaders of the chaos and confusion In fact if you look at the churches that had this schism first, they were the ones that disobeyed God's word first in allowing women to be pastors.

Thank You Reverend. I had hope after General Conference that this might work out, but it is obvious now that the progressives never intended it to.

So a man who so obviously disobeys 1 Corinthians 11:14 is criticizing a woman disobeying Romans 1. Is this a bit like the Pharisee's prayer versus the tax collector. Certainly we should not be promoting sin, and though we are all sinners, some sins should keep people out of church leadership. I prefer the tax collector's prayer, God be merciful to me a sinner. This needs to be part of the discussion too, because we are all sinners saved by grace.

Thank you again, Rev. Renfroe. These are uncertain times to say the least. I appreciate, though, that you point out what I have also observed--unending positive, hopeful talk doesn't do the situation justice. After hearing good report after good report, I often wonder, "What are they leaving out? What are they not telling us?"

Jesus said love and pray for your enemies……..how liberal is that!!!!!

What if my pastor wants several wives? Is this acceptable? 1 Timothy 3:2.

There are alot of sins that the world is allowing that goes againat the bible. How can only one sin be examined.

Have we rejected God's Word for some other Gospel?

I can't wonder why a protest at the time and place that this bishop was placed in his new seat. If everyone can protest when a black man is done wrong and change some of the things that caused the problems the same type of a protest should work on replacing this bishop. Why would not a few buses of protesters make a showing of how everyone feels, or are everyone just blowing smoke. Cullen Logan in Tampa

Taytay UMC Of the Philippines is not for same gender marriage

The Bible is by no means silent, on the subject of homosexuality. So let us look at the whole of God's Word… from the Old and New Testament. New Testament… Rom 1:27... "And likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust one toward another; men with men working that which is unseemly, and receiving in themselves that recompence of their error which was meet." And the men, instead of having normal sexual relationships with women, burned with lust for each other. Men did shameful things with other men and, as a result, suffered within themselves the penalty they so richly deserved. 1 Cor 6:9... "Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate (homosexual), nor abusers of themselves with mankind, nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners, shall inherit the kingdom of God." Don’t you know that those who do wrong will have no share in the Kingdom of God? Don’t fool yourselves. Those who indulge in sexual sin, who are idol worshipers, adulterers, male prostitutes, homosexuals, thieves, greedy people, drunkards, abusers, and swindlers-none of these will have a share in the Kingdom of God... unless they repent and sincerely turn from that sin or sins. But they should not wait to long lest their heart become to hardened against God and it will be impossible to repent. Repent therefore today and do not delay! Your eternal soul depends on it. 1 Tim 1:10... "for fornicators, for sodomites (homosexuals), for kidnappers, for liars, for perjurers, and if there is any other thing that is contrary to sound doctrine, These laws are for people who are sexually immoral, for homosexuals and slave traders, for liars and oath breakers, and for those who do anything else that contradicts the right teaching" Rom 1:26... "For this cause God gave them up unto vile affections: for even their women did change the natural use into that which is against nature: That is why God abandoned them to their shameful desires. Even the women turned against the natural way to have sex and instead indulged in sex with each other." Matthew 19: 4-6... "And He (Jesus) answered and said unto them, Have ye not read, that He which made them at the beginning made them male and female, And said, For this cause shall a man leave father and mother, and shall cleave to his wife (the female): and they twain shall be one flesh? Wherefore they are no more twain, but one flesh. What therefore God hath joined together, let not man put asunder." The Old Covenant... or Old Testament… Lev 20:13... "If a man also lie with mankind, as he lieth with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination: they shall surely be put to death; their blood [shall be] upon them." Of course people are not put to death in the US for the act of homosexuality… but the eternal end is the same if they do not repent. Under the New Testament we now have a redeemer who when we cry out to him for what ever sin we may have committed and ask for forgiveness and turn away from that sin whatever the sin… He will forgive us AND cleanse us from all unrighteousness. A beautiful promise from our Heavenly Father. 1 John 1:9… "If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness." Beautiful, beautiful promise from our Heavenly Father. Jesus clearly speaks on the issue of homosexuality in Matthew 19:4-6… and also warns all people everywhere to repent from sin (no matter the sin… not just homosexuality)… "I tell you, except ye repent, ye shall all likewise perish." Luke 13:3 (KJV) Love people enough to lovingly tell them the truth... to show them the whole of God's Holy Written Word and what it actually says. This is love. I say this to all those who may be a homosexual or support the homosexual agenda.... know that we have all sinned and fallen short of the glory of God. But God's Holy Word is clear that the sins we do with our own bodies, our own flesh... are even worse... whether it be adultery, fornication (which is sex outside of marriage), homosexuality, lesbianism, beastiality... if we do these things we are desecrating our own bodies which are made by God to be temples of the Holy Spirit. So if we do those things we in a sense are dragging the Holy Spirit in us to be a part of it also...for He is in the believers. If a person does not have the Holy Spirit in them (because they are not believers) nor a relationship with God/Christ they are not saved... and desperately need to seek God with their whole heart. God did make some men spiritual eunuchs to serve Him. Men who do not desire to marry and have children. Most of the apostles were spiritual eunuchs and were not married. They preached against homosexuality... so we know they themselves where not gay... but God used them to spread the Gospel of Jesus Christ and Salvation by believing and repenting of sin. Without repenting of sin their is no eternal salvation. Grace does not cover unrepented, unconverted, continual proud sinners... who feel there is nothing wrong with their sin... when in fact there is... and it will lead them to hell. Oh Heavenly Father help the gay community to know Gods Truth from your Holy Scriptures... and also to know that you do love them and that you do not want them to perish but to repent. 2 Peter 3:9… "The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance." "Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate (1611 word for homosexual), nor abusers of themselves with mankind, nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners, shall inherit the kingdom of God." Believe… Repent… and be saved. From Mark 1:15 "We have all sinned and fallen short of the glory of God"... "The wages of sin is death, but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ."... Jesus said... "I am he way, the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father but by me." In Christ's love and truth, Aunt Carol P.S. May God bless you and your spiritual journey with Him today... and forever… that you may grow in grace and the knowledge of Jesus Christ our Lord and Savior.

And since this video the leadership of the UMC has only made things worse. Gutless leadership in inaction.

Schisms, Book of Discipline??? Jesus loved the individual! Jesus did not carry a bible and He quoted from the bible when He spoke to people! Jesus hated denominationalism because the individual was the important thing to Him. Yes, He did feed the crowds, but He spoke to them as individuals, not as a group! Pharisees loved the trappings of their religion. Meanwhile, Jesus loved the Publican and hated the Pharisee! The United Methodist Church dispute is not a "Jesus-driven problem." As with most organized churches, their church is "church-committee" directed, not Jesus directed! They are the present day Pharisees! I give the present Christian Churches 25 years. Young people see the sin-focused ways of the present church and they won't darken the door of a Church!

Will the WCA still take very liberal views on climate change, gun control, government spending, and race relations? I had one UMC pastor lectured me, when I mentioned that my car was due to be traded in, and I was considering a couple of models with V-8 engines. Another pastor, a native of Canada, preached that it was time for America to get over its love affair with guns. My current pastor posted a letter to the congregation on the website, shortly after George Floyd died, as did pastors at other churches in town. While most letters were taken down with Advent of 2020, our website still has the letter posted. While I support the ordination of gays and same-sex marriage and am pro-choice on abortion, I don't like feeling like an outsider in my own congregation, for being fairly conservative politically. Even though 4 senior pastors have admonished me to vote my faith, my faith is Wesleyan/Lutheran, while my politics tends to be like those of William F. Buckley, with economic theory from Milton Friedman. If a WCA pastor is likely to tell me I should drive an electric vehicle, support higher taxes on the wealthy, and that white people are inherently racist, then I need to leave the Methodist movement altogether.

Oppression

Corruption has entered this church. Enforce policy., do not change policy.

REMEMBER, SIN IS INCLUSIVE!...

Radical activists wish only to force others to celebrate their sin. Give them their way at your peril because when this ground is gained then they will simply demand another sin to celebrate. I shudder to think what that may be; perhaps jail for pastors refusing to celebrate their homosexuality?

What is so tragic is that the bishops are forgetting that Satan is the Master Deceiver. God tells us this many times in His Word. When the Church decides to deliberately disavow its own book of disciplines for its leadership what does that tell the congregation? The Bishops and Pastors are to be held above reproach, yet living in sin, totally outside the Word of God, and FLAUNTING it ???? How do WE ....the congregation....reconcile this?

The subject of a beautiful, fulfilling spiritual marriage, along with sex, between a man and woman is rarely preached from the pulpit. The subject of healthy biblical Christian "sex" seems to be "taboo" from the pulpit. If we are going to stop this widespread LGBT movement, then we need to teach why the alternative is the better choice. Ed Young at 2nd Baptist Church in Houston preached a wonderful 12 week series entitled "Sex in America", along with many other sermons on the topic of marriage. So many, at all ages, have not been taught the true spiritual beauty of marriage and love between a man and a woman. It's time we hear this message time and time again from the United(?) Methodist pulpit.

The Bible is the final word period!!!

But yet divorced people are Okay. I remember when this was a big issue.

There's no hate like Christian love

Persoanlly I am more concerned about what God Almighty has to say about homosexuality than what this generation's psychiatrists and psychologists

Rob Renfroe's response makes me cringe, the way he talks about the LGBTQ community is dehumanizing :/

How sad, in 2016, when since 1976 psychologists and psychiatrists have been saying that being LBGTQAI is NOT a mental illness, and not an aberration but just the way some people are born. Just as some of us are born to be short or tall, blue eyes, or brown eyes, or black, white, yellow, or red, we are what we are. Are there those who are homosexual who do harm to others? Yes, but there are those who are heterosexual who do harm to others. My God Bless Karen Oliveto, and may her episcopacy be successful and happy. She has all the credentials, and my husband was pleased to learn that she graduated from his Alma Mater, Drew Theological School!

Do that ever you want to do. The judgement Day of God is coming back. We will all be burn in HEll !! He only take the Holy one. Exp. Noah Ark, he’s a righteous man. He do what God commands him to.

He looks like and sounds like Bill Maher. He should go on Bill Maher's show and teach him God. That will be a debate to watch. Two look alikes ... one atheist and another Christian preacher ... debating each other on God in the same voice!

Does not God love us all? Who are you to judge.

Most churches wouldn't allow a woman to be a bishop, let alone one that is gay...

I understand why you may not want to conduct or affirm gay marriage, but I do not understand why they cannot be a part of your pastoral staff or congregation. What is the issue with that?

Rev. Renfroe indicates only two reasons he believes Rev. Oliveto was elected bishop, neither of which are positive. Might it also be possible that Rev. Oliveto was elected because she is a respected pastor and leader whose faith and wisdom were recognized by her peers?

I believe in God. And I believe that God is love: radical, unstoppable effervescent. Breaking through stone the way a flower breaks up between the cracks in the sidewalk pavement. And I believe that in the seemingly tragic vote today by the United Methodist Church’s General Convention, God has presented us with a tremendous opportunity, not one to be wasted. Not a single day should go by now - not one single day - but that plans are being laid for the creation of a new Methodist Church in America. Do something, and do it now: plan meetings, build coalitions, design websites, talk to each other, think about a name for this enterprise - do anything but do something. And start now, today.

Pastors like Bob Renfroe are why I am no longer a United Methodist. This notion that everyone who disagrees with him are somehow heathen sheep who have gone astray is ludicrous, and speaks volumes of his ego, and that of the WCA and Good News.

Seems like the British Methodist Church is moving in the right direction. Huge majority in favor of moving to allow same sex marriages in the buildings of the Methodist church. They’re really clearly signaling a shift, very much like that in the US church against the racism and bigotry against people of color. I understand there are many people, in African and some Asia-Pacific regions of the UMC, and some southern US areas where WCA and Good News or IRD is more popular, but they can continue to be the way they are in their own groups.

This is a CRAZY !!!!! GOD please help us !!!!!! 🙏❤️🙏

well, the rest of the universal church is leaving you behind... I'm Lutheran.

You should join Westboro BC

You people have so much vested in your hatreds.

Z

I have been doing a ton of research on what the UMC's response has been to the "progressive" movement in the church. (Just to preface, I myself am wanting to see the church move in a more accepting, loving, "progressive" direction.) To sum up my current feelings thus far, I am incredibly disappointed in the Methodist Church as a whole. As someone who has grown up in the Methodist faith, I believe that our God is one of love, and He will welcome anyone with welcoming arms. While it seems that many people are divided on what is and is not considered sin, why are we ignoring the main idea? Why focus on hate and abandon love? I believe that our God is a being of love and forgiveness, no matter the sin an individual has committed. That is also to say, being of the LGBTQ+ community is NOT sinful. Personally, I believe that in separating the church into love and ignorance, we are our own worst enemy. If you wish to worship a God that represents rules rather than love, I would advise that perhaps the Methodist faith is not for you. I respect that everyone is entitled to their own interpretation of the Bible, but I feel that to single out damning verses rather than try to extract the overall meaning of the text will lead to the misinterpretation of the word of God. However, please reference back to where I had said that I was concerned with the Methodist Church "as a whole". I do also recognize that there are many within the faith that are also suffering from the decision to stay with the Traditional Plan (as decided in the GC2019). Many individuals, pastors, and churches are dissatisfied with this decision, as am I. There are many that are dissatisfied with this decision, some even going as far as to remove themselves from the Methodist Church as a response. In this time of debating whether our church is all-inclusive, or one that does not accept all people as His children, I would advise that we all still try to treat each other with mutual respect and love regardless of our different mindsets. Please pray for peace and direction within the Methodist Church, and remember to be kind. God loves us all.

😂😂😂

Rob seems rather less heterosexual.

Satan at his finest.

This guy calls himself “Reverend”! Who does the Bible refer to as “Reverend”? Psalms 111:9 He sent redemption unto his people: he hath commanded his covenant for ever: holy and reverend is his name.

THE BOOK OF DISCIPLINE HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH SCRIPTURE. THE BOOK OF DISCIPLINE ALSO SAYS DRINKING ALCOHOL IS WRONG... HOW MANY OF Y'ALL DRINK ALCOHOL???

The bible is also very clear about your hair.

The Bible is weird...

Just a sign if the end. This church is rotten like they all are

The older you get, the less cool the long hair is. What makes it especially unattractive, however, is the hate speech.

Sad to see narrow-mindedness in this day and age. God made all of us. Our son was gay when he was born. He did not choose to be gay. He is a child of God just as we are. Grateful for the wisdom, compassion, and open hearts of many Methodist clergy and other spiritual leaders in our world.

repent, for the flying spaghetti monster will return !