Everyone calls it "sell-ee-kah" in the UK lol.. I've literally never heard it pronounced differently _You learn something new every day..._

@@unbearifiedbear1885 In the US I believe it's typically pronounced 'Cell-ickuh' too. I just prefer the south American 'Che-lye-chuh' variant.

@@DiariesOfABadDriver not criticising, by the way ❤

@@unbearifiedbear1885 oh I didn't think you were, so no offence taken! I appreciate you watching and commenting 🙏

@@DiariesOfABadDriver I can say I have never heard it pronounced 'chell-itch-uh' and I thought you were trolling at first 😅

I hope he sees this comment!

Mostly agreed but for tweaking FFB, mileage varies a lot depending on wheel and sometimes you need to change certain filters. I don't usually suffer from that problem running a gear driven logitech wheel, my wheel is simple and I just make the ffb relatively weak since a rally game already is too demanding on my noodle arms lol

@@ElShogoso that's what the respective wheel softwares are for.

Glad you liked it! I think critiquing something so beloved like this without coming across like an arrogant dick is a very delicate balancing act, so I'm glad to hear that you think I managed it! Glad to hear that those improvements are in the works, I think they'd make a very big difference. As for ffb, I guess that you could argue that having less options make it's less confusing, but if you find yourself wishing that you could just make it feel slightly different then it makes me wish the options were there. That might just be me, though.

@@MetallvmPT Wheel software doesn't let you set parameters that are specific to the game, like which simulated forces affect the FFB, what effects you want, and so on. Some games have FFB effects I just find distracting and want to turn off, like certain vibrations that don't really give you information and are just there as a gimmick or for immersion. That's the kind of stuff that changes on a game per game basis. Ironically DR 2.0 is one of the offenders, there are some stuff on the FFB I either completely remove or turn way down, like wheel and tyre friction. Another example is some games having too little or too much curb effect, etc.

Me too...

Also as always another extremely well presented video. If you ever had any ideas for future videos & wanted some community opinions, statements, or help from anyone with real world driving experience alongside sim in regards to rallies, im more then happy to help out :)

Dirt Rally 1 with physics mods is pretty competent. Not RBR level, but LARGELY improves the physics on that game. Might break AI racing though since the AI doesn't really care about your updated physics.

@@ElShogoso Can you mod Dirt Rally 1 despite it being on Steam?

@@Skumtomten1 Yeah you can, I dont really recommend because it might make the game extremely hard, also you cant do any kind of online event

Agreed! I didn't feel right doing this long critique of the game without acknowledging him and paying some much deserved respect. Now that I'm approaching the age that he was when he passed away, it reminds me how fragile life is.

I certainly agree that the NGP physics are ahead of CM's efforts and I agree that the damage model still lacks for a LOT in their games. However, I think that RBR lacks in the immersion, visual consistency and user experience to a far more detrimental degree. The ideal game would have all of these factors nailed down, but RBR stumbles that much harder for my tastes. It's a hard pill to swallow (which is why I've continued to try and like it) but that's my truth. YMMV etc.

​@@DiariesOfABadDriver Yeah I feel you there. I think for me, physics means more than graphics/fidelity. That isn't to say I want to sit down in front of Revs anytime soon (so it has to be within reason) but I'll gladly take a graphical hit if it means the vehicles behave closer to their real life counterparts, flaws and all, and react to hard and soft barriers as they would if I were actually piloting the vehicle. I think part of that, for me, is because I'm VERY late to the sim racing scene. I started with IRL stuff almost 16 years ago. Drifting, autocross, time trials, track days, etc. So when a virtual vehicle reminds me of how it feels to drive the actual vehicle, I'm instantly drawn in with little regard to the graphical presentation. Conversely, a game can be STUNNING (and the EA and Codemasters games are STUNNING) but if I feel like a super hero driving around or as if someone has enabled God Mode, it takes me out of it. I like the fear and danger that comes along with RBR because that's how it actually is in real life. You can't do 90kph sideways into a tree, mountain face, or barrier without sustaining rally-ending damage. Likewise, you can't do 120 into a 1 Right and make it just because you had a well timed handbrake yank HAHAHA! I think that's the ultimate divide between the sims and simcades. One was designed with accessibility and approachability in mind. The other forgoes that in an effort to remind those who have been out there (and to teach those who haven't) what it's like to actually drive quickly.

I want to clarify, I'm not saying that any of your points are invalid. I completely see your side of this, just enjoying a bit of shop talk and back-and-forth with a fellow gear head and sim driver

@@DaveAdams222 that makes total sense! If you're coming from real racing you're naturally going to be more sensitive to physics oddities or inaccuracies than someone like myself who hasn't driven anything other than a rental go kart on the limit.

@@DiariesOfABadDriver Well, here’s the thing. I guess you could say that there are two categories of players (of course there are much more in general but for the sake of this argument I’ll simplify it). And those are gamers and drivers. The gamers will play a lot of many different games of different genres because, well, thats what they like to do. And along the line, they’ll like to sometimes try out a little bit of rallying. For them, the total appeal of the game they are playing will heavily rely on the visual experience and ease of play, as thats what they are getting from majority of games they indluge with. The drivers, on another hand, are the kind that, if possible, wouldnt even play games, but drive rallying in real life but due to budget restrains/other life occurances, simply aren’t able to. For those kind of people, RBR is simply unbeatable because it does that one thing they look for well, very well, and by far the best of any other offering. Its highly likey also their only “game” on the PC aswell, next to maybe one or two other circuit based sims. And they don’t care about the ease of play either, they know how much effort you need to invest into something to work well and how rewarding it is once it does. This is also the reason why we are highly unlikely to ever see a modern big budget rally sim like RBR see the light of day, as the latter group is simply too small of market share to make that kind of game be profitable, and it will be far to brutal and unforgiving to the casual player. Hence why RBR has this hardcore following; its small number of people gathered around one thing that can bring them as close as possibile to their real actual desire: to drive a race car on public roads as fast as possible.

Glad you enjoyed it! And yes, despite all of my problems with it, it does deserve respect.

Thanks for the kind words! Glad you liked it :)

Yep, the car behaviour is very good! When the discussion of 'why don't other rally games drive like this' comes up, I've repeatedly seen RBR diehards say that it wouldn't be commercially viable because it would alienate too many players, or something along those lines. I personally don't buy that argument. I think DiRT Rally was successful because it earnt the reputation of being the 'Dark Souls of racing games', while being far more difficult and more punishing than most arcade racers but tied up in a nice, polished game. The greater industry has absolutely proven that there's an appetite for difficult but fair games, and I think racing titles are no exception.

@@NubbyEvo share your gamepad setting please

Yep, I think RBR ngp reigns supreme in the handling but I don't think codemasters take on things are 'bad', I find them very enjoyably drivable. Combined with the much better sound, visuals and user experience, that's why I spend my time playing those instead.

Yeah I don't go in for the online rallies very much because they often use stages I don't like. I guess I could probably create my own rally with my own stage and car choices and that would help. But, you know, effort 😁

@@DiariesOfABadDriver Yeah it's kinda the type of game you sit on a sunday afternoon to get into the rabbit hole of setting up properly to have a cool rally, I personally don't daily drive it much

Thanks, Chris, very much appreciated! Glad you enjoyed it

Thanks mate. There's dozens of us!

The human eye can only see at 30kph 😁 And thanks! Much appreciated

More than anything, I'd like to see Beamng license their engine to other developers who could make an actual, structure racing sim out of it, rather than relying on user content.

That's interesting. I can't say it's something I've ever noticed personally, but if you find it hard to read the surfaces I can see how that would make driving a nightmare.

I'm glad you're able to enjoy it, I wish I could. But you can't have it all in life, I guess :')

Agreed, better curation would go a long way. As it stands, a new comer could get everything installed, pick a random stage and get one that doesn't exactly scream "OK, so THIS is why people rave about this game".

There's a spreadsheet listed on the RBR discord that gives crowd-sourced ratings for all of the available tracks, so I think that's a pretty good starting point.

Done kzfaq.info/get/bejne/n5tlZKlqtLjem4E.html

Thank you! Yeah, when the game is good? I can absolutely see how it earned its GOAT rep. I just wish it was good more consistently. Perhaps one day.

Yeah I don't blame you. Hopefully some changes are made to the RSF package to cover the initial legwork and make it less tiresome, because it's a big problem that clearly turns some folks away.

That's exactly what I'm going through right now, but ea wrc still doesn't seem to be a stable enough of a game for me to finally bite the bullet, especially with VR.

You're very welcome, I'm just happy that you liked it!

I agree, given the constraints of working without the source code (as far as I know, at least) a lot of great work has been done on the game. I just think that's only worth so much consolation to the end user that has to deal with those problems, and ultimately, many do get turned away because of it.

Cheers, I appreciate it mate!

It's certainly great for tinkerers, no doubt about that! And in fairness, the RSF package is certainly better in that regard compared to what I experienced with RBRTM back in the NGP 4 and 5 days. I literally spent more time trying to mod it to my liking than I did actually driving the damn thing! RSF is a miles better experience, I just wish it was a little more user friendly and would cut that fat with some of the included content.

🙏 thank you!

Yes, I got RBRHUD up and running part way through the process of making this video, which is why some footage has it and other footage does not. You're right that it does make a difference! Given that it's a totally optional thing that you not only need to tick during RSF installation (and if you don't know what it is, as I didn't, you might not) and then also enable it in the launcher (which is also easy to miss when you're an overwhelmed beginner), I think it's valid criticism.

I haven't finished the video yet, however, i want to comment why i liked it

Thanks bro! Your enthusiasm is always appreciated 😁

​@@DiariesOfABadDriver Yeah 😅 Also, i'm loving the videos, man. I like how you use actual arguments and isn't afraid to poin out RBR's faults. It's one of the rally games i want to try out the most (after Dirt: Rally 2.0). Anyways, can't wait to see what else you're going to do, because i know it's going to be amazing :)

Ok, i forgot to go back, but i remembered it just now. I loved how you mentioned the hassle that is running an old game, and while i don't immedeatly hate the graphics, the fact that in lots of cars the interior is really bad (as you said), and the mirrors don't work, set it really close to being below what's acceptable to me; Again, the extremely wide aspect ratio fills my phone screen almost perfectly. It's a small detail, yes, but together with the narration being on point, the background gameplay also being amazing, and the incredibly well put together video, makes for a masterpiece. Also, i really admire that last section of the video. It's clear the respect that you have for Richard, and for the RBR community to keep him alive, even if just in our hearts. R.I.P Richard Burns

Thank you! Much appreciated

@@LarryAszune yeah I've yet to try VR but I've heard that its implementation in EA WRC leaves a lot to be desired, so I can certainly appreciate that it would be a selling point for RBR!

Thank you! I tried the vanilla game years ago and I remember thinking it was surprisingly decent to drive, though at the time I felt that I still preferred DiRT Rally. The vanilla stages really are great, though! The Wales stages in particular are very good and are my most driven in game by a mile. I will say I've never been a fan of the USA stages, though, but maybe I need to revisit them.

Thank you! Funnily enough, when writing the script for this video, the comparison between RBR and AC did come up but it got left on the cutting room floor for time. I think when it comes to the overall user experience and quality of the content that you can easily find, AC is far, far ahead of RBR. Not being involved in the mod process for either game, I can only assume the core reason for this is because AC is a decade newer, which ties into why I want to see more current competition in the rally game space.

Thanks! I've heard people namedrop NASCAR 2003 a number of times despite having no interest in oval racing so I'm not surprised that it has a similar reputation (with similar problems).

Hey, thanks for watching! I appreciate the kind words :) You're right that storage space is cheap these days, but games are also big these days. The way I see it, every game 'competes' with other games for space on my drives, and if its something that I don't play regularly that takes up a lot of space (I definitely consider a game that is over 100GB to be quite large), then it makes it kinda painful to keep installed when I could get rid of it to make room for something else. Aleksip (who, to my understanding, is involved with RSF) actually commented on this video and mentioned that they are working on converting stages to a file format which will allow them to be more efficiently compressed, so given that there is room for improvement there, I think its a valid criticism. I'm fortunate enough to have plenty of SSD space, but for people on older systems who are more budget constrained than I am, it could be a problem. As for the configuration woes, I allude to some of the other problems I had at 5:23, allow me to focus on the gauges. When installing RSF (at least when I did it), RBRHUD was an optional module, so it's very easy to miss or overlook it, especially when you don't know what it is. If anything, I would argue that it is named very misleadingly (it is NOT a HUD) which if anything means it is more likely that people will miss it. As a first time player, if you start playing and notices that the gauges are static, you either need to; A. Know what RBRHUD is and install/enable it, or B. Go on google/reddit/discord and ask for help and be informed that you need to install RBRHUD. All for something that just works, out of the box with no tinkering required in every other sim I've ever played. Another example is adjusting the cockpit camera position. I had to google how to do that because it's not obvious or intuitive that you need to double right-click to get the menu to appear. It's great that you were able to quickly get RBR running so quickly when you reinstalled it, but that's the key word here. Reinstalled. That implies prior knowledge, which newcomers aren't going to have. There's plenty of anecdotal accounts around (including some in the comments of this video) of people who have had trouble getting things with RBR configured properly. All sims require some tinkering and setup, but RBR required the most for a very long way in my (and other's) personal experience. So, again, I think it's a very valid criticism. And I agree, everyone should choose what they like best!

That's something I hadn't even considered, but yes, that would certainly kill it for me if I was in that position. Good to hear that the codemasters games run well, though!

Thanks Conrad! Glad you agree that there needs to be a true successor, sometimes I almost get the feeling that its hardcore fanboys don't want that to happen lol

@@DiariesOfABadDriver I think many are concerned that rbr will experience an exodus for a lesser sim and though I'm certain there's a few MuH cHAnGe BaD types out there I'm pretty sure most would move to a modern sim if the driving and feel was as good or better than rbr

Yeah I picked that up cheap years ago and gave it about 10-12 hours before deciding I didn't like it. I remember disliking the pacenotes, visuals and sound, and also having performance problems with it. I might revisit it for a video at some point, we shall see!

@@DiariesOfABadDriver Yeah, I had to uninstall it because of the V-Sync jank. I enjoyed it while it ran well though!

That's interesting regarding the physics. It's true that I wasn't actually able to find any explicit 'patch' or 'release' notes that cite the specific changes, but I distinctly remember when NGP 6 came out watching a Janne Laahanen video where he felt it was grippier on gravel, with others saying similar, too. Another potential explanation is that in the years since my experience with NGP 5 (when I was primarily driving DiRT Rally), I've put a LOT of hours into DiRT Rally 2.0, which is noticeable more slippy than the first game, so maybe that simply got me used to it. Hard to say, but regardless, I like the way NGP drives now so that's all that matters 😄 Thanks for watching and for the comment!

Hey, all the power to you! Obviously it's all subjective when you boil it down, and that's the beauty of having options. Thanks for watching!

I'm hoping to catch a 300 pounder!

Much appreciated!

Punctures would be great, though in classic RBR fashion they'd probably happen way too often

Yeah it's definitely not great in that regard. I mean, with RSF there are effectively three separate options menu, so it's a real mess to navigate and it makes it very easy to miss things.

The damage is very punishing and I, too, crash out with terminal damage very frequently when playing the game. I ummed and uhhed about how to represent damage in the video, and when I think about the collisions I've had that felt unfair to me, I have to say that I think it ultimately ties back in to stage quality, which I of course already harped on quite a lot. So I ultimately settled on briefly touching on the damage system's oddities with the front engine shenanigans, and left it at that because the video was long enough as is 😅 But as I said earlier in the video, I do also genuinely like that it feels dangerous. Even with EA WRC's damage improvements I still think codies games are far too forgiving. Hitting a tree head on at any kind of reasonable speed really should end your rally in the vast majority of cases, and it just doesn't in CM's games.

It's just a shame how you can't be truly competetive without knowing some of the more broken parts of some stages. Although the same goes for CM games when you consider how crazy some corner cuts are.

I've got no idea, but I think you'd be best off going on the rallysimfans forum or discord server to get help there. Good luck!

Well if it's any encouragement, it's very playable on controller as it gives you good tools to dial it in. The worst that can happen is that you realise the game you got for free isn't up your alley, so I recommend you give it a try!

From my very limited time with it, in its current form it doesn't really seem like a racing game, which is why I don't play it much as it seems you've got to go out of your way for that kind of experience. It certainly has the potential to properly cater to people who just want to race, and I hope it gets there, but it's got a long way to go.

I think "casuals and new players GET OUT" would be about the best way to guarantee that your game dies in the ass. I don't really agree with your assessment, though. It's quite clear that the RSF team have done quite a lot to try and make their package accessible and inviting, and those are the reasons that it is the most popular version of RBR. I don't think you have to be a 'casual' to have big problems with it, though.

That's weird, can't say I've had any issues like that before. You might just need to fresh install it.

@@DiariesOfABadDriver ok, i might try that

@@BWB_Cubing worth checking on the RSF discord as well, those guys can probably help you best :)

@@DiariesOfABadDriver ok thanks

Of course we can! I'd say I pronounced it flawlessly.

Thank you! Regarding the SinglePlayer, this is how I see it. RSF is billed as the most convenient, one stop shop way to get up and running with RBR, which means its most likely where a beginner goes to try it. And I think if you're a beginner, you're more likely to want to play a career mode, so it's a shame it isn't there. Having features of the vanilla version broken by mods certainly isn't a good thing, no matter what way you slice it. Is it worth it for the sake of having better physics? I would say so, it's just unfortunate that it had to be sacrificed at all. It is what it is, the modders have constaints that they have to work within.

@@DiariesOfABadDriver I think it's a matter of personal preference, but I certainly wouldn't expect a singple player option from any game that's purpose built for multiplayer, because it's built for that. And in case of the RBR plugins they are meant for multiplayer. If one wants to play singple player, can just download the vanilla game for free and play it. Sure it's one more extra step, but again, i expect no single player from any game that was made for a competitive, multiplayer experience.

I generally like playing with the SAT reasonably high, as I find it particularly helpful for high rotation RWD cars. But in RBR I find that the RWD cars have very light feeling ffb. If I turn it up to compensate, it then makes the other types of cars excessively heavy, so I just can't win 🙄

Cheers!

The Toyota Celica. Surprised you haven't heard of it, it's a classic!

@@DiariesOfABadDriver 😄

That sounds annoying!

Yep, what you're saying is bang on, it really isn't a casual friendly experience at all. Given how elitist some people can be about this sort of stuff, they probably WANT it like that 🤣 It's definitely going to turn some people away who would otherwise be interested, though. A better user experience is integral for the RBR community's growth.

@@DiariesOfABadDriver Agreed 100%. Smooth out the UI, make one settings page that I can change while driving so I can test it immidietely and optimize the install size and the game would bring a lot of new players into it. Probably it's way harder to do as it's all mods of a 20 yo game, but with all that people's effort they could create a new game, RBR 2.0 you could say and I believe it could be a massive success. Anyway, great video, keep it up :)

Yeah, some people can look past the visuals but I can't, unfortunately. That's why the vanilla stages are my most driven.

The one TRUE pronunciation!

Well, that's just, like, your opinion, man.

I think I personally find WRC less forgiving than DR2, but they're both quite forgiving compared to rbr, that's for sure.

Ultimately, they are games, which means there should still be an enjoyment element buried in there somewhere. DR2.0 and EA WRC both have that, partly because they have to appeal to a wide-enough player base to be commercially successful. But using that base game to then toggle on and off an option for 'full simulation' including damage, would be good for those for whom the very act of getting to the end is the challenge. If only former Codies staff from the DR days could work with the NGR modders to implement the RBR handling model inside a modern and aesthetically pleasing game...

I did, years ago. It's been a long time but my feeling was that it was good for a game from 2004 but was nothing particularly special in today's context. I think it needs the mods to have any sort of relevancy.

It’s free and most of the things he lists are factually incorrect

@@labelfilms6838 what is incorrect? I played the game myself and uninstalled it months ago for the same reasons he mentioned in the video

@@Emerich2 to list a few: file size is not game size but individual stage selection ie user preference, replays are customizable, pacenotes DO have special cases for chicanes and others. Consistency is a big issue with RBR currently but other than that this an OPed

@@labelfilms6838 the problem with file size is when you first install everything you have no idea what stages are good and bad so you download every stage in the rally sim fans version and 120gb for thease low poly stages is huge.

Despite all my criticisms, my sincere advice is that it's a no brainer to at least try RBR. What have you got to lose?

Yeah I mean RSF certainly isn't the only option, it's just what I use because it's both popular and convenient (relatively speaking). That said, the RSF installer does allow you to deselect any stages you don't want, which is where I think most of the size comes from.

Honestly, more than anything I'd like to see an entirely different developer use BeamNG as a base to make an actual, proper, from-the-ground-up racing game. It would be great for rallying in particular.

May the force (feedback) be with you

You'll never be deceived again when you drive a Toyota See-Lie-Car! The only problem is, people might see your lies as well, which is exactly what happened to Toyota.

Agree, but I prefer to have both.

I pretty much just want a codemasters game with RBR physics. I don't think that's asking too much.

And that's pretty bad news since it isn't either of those things.

Great graphics certainly don't make a good game on their own, absolutely agree with that. But I also think that if graphics are bad enough, it can seriously detract from a good game. That's how I feel about RBR.

For me, RBR's flaws ruin the experience far more for me than the physics shortcomings of, for example, codemaster's games. That's entirely subjective of course, I'm in no doubt that people feel the opposite and if anything I'm jealous that you're able to enjoy RBR, because the driving is legitimately great. Ah well, we can't have it all in life...

@@DiariesOfABadDriver,dial “Alexey Lukyanuk” and listen to the 2-time European rally champion.

Ok

I think the biggest game changer would be if the source code was made available (as far as I'm aware, it isn't).