Please note that since I made the video, I have had the caseback opened and it is an unbranded non chronometer grade movement, probably an ETA 2824 clone. Unfortunately I can’t post photos without uploading a new separate video.

This is one of the best videos I’ve ever seen. Because it’s all about helping others and taking full responsibility for being burned in the first place. No whining, just honest reflection. So rare to find anywhere. Thanks for posting!

Hope the scammer is caught. The fake watch is getting so good that it’s hard to distinguish and always best to buy from reputable dealer or have the watch authenticated before purchase. Thanks for being kind to share your experience

The easiest way to tell without taking off the back is to pull the crown. If it has a ghost position it's a fake. These fakes made by a factory called ZF have a clone ETA 2824 which have a date setting which the real movement doesn't. So pull the crown, if it has two clicks it's a fake, 1 click it's 99.5% real. You can even put it in the date position and feel the date wheel moving when you turn the crown in this position. There is a way to remove the date setting by swapping out the setting lever jumper but nobody does it. Pretty fool proof method for telling if a BB58 is a fake or not without comparing anything to the real deal or photos of a real watch. That being said, the biggest tell for the ZF BB58 is the flat texture of the dial. The real Tudor dial has a slight texture to it that you can see in direct sunlight and with close inspection but it's a much harder tell than the date setting. Best of luck in your next purchase mate.

The rep industry is absolutely HUGE. The factories actually interact with 'professional' rep collectors who give them feedback on where they can improve. I keep a keen eye on it to better inform myself. Rolex, Tudor, Omega, AP, PP, JLC, actually, any luxury brand even somewhat entry level like Oris or Longines are repped, and it is mindblowing how good they get every iteration.

Honestly other than the movement and physical presence a lot of the differences are so minute that they’re hard to detect.

One of the best watch YT watch videos I've seen (and I've seen a lot), for all the reasons user D W mentioned and more. To the OP, keep it up! That said, and I hope it's not kicking someone when they're down, since the OP sounds well past that point, but this is such an amateur-ish mistake, and goes to show most people have no business buying grey/private.

Without an authentic at hand or experience with one a rep can be so hard to tell. It’s a real shame there are scumbags out there scamming people. I hope the police catch the scumbag.

When in doubt, always meet at your watchmaker nd have him open the watch for inspection. If the seller balks at the idea, then run.

Ive noticed that some of "Vintage Tudor" mainly eBay from what I've noticed to be repainted dials and other noticable changes that are very noticeable when next to the unaltered. Everything is more crisp, when you get close enough you can clearly tell is was done by hand but from regular handling many will not notice so it's good to pay that extra bit of attention so you know what's what on your watch.

I’m so sorry this happened to you. Thank you for this video it helps a lot.

Very insightfu!! Thanks very much.

Sorry to hear about this. This is why it’s best to wait to get a watch from an AD. So many people get burned from flippers or sellers on these online suction sites.

Thanks for this video, man! Got scammed myself from a vintage Tudor sub. I even opened the case back and all and it was signed an all. But so many things didn’t align. The serial is for a no date version, luminova and not tritium, the movement was a non hacking one. Glad I was able to return it still. But I had to pretend I was going to buy more watches from that seller. Indeed buy the seller.

Even with professionals, these reps get by. Case + movement is still abit challenging for black bay fakes, but those bracelets have come so close.. it's almost impossible to tell with a 100x zoom

Thanks for this video very insightful

I'm not sure of all Black Bay models, but most I have seen have a black tube to space the crown further out from the case. I always remember that because it seems like it's packaging, but it is actually permanent. Also noticed the caseback, again not sure if it is always the same, but the one's I've seen read "*shield symbol* TUDOR MANUFACTURE CALIBRE *number*" repeated twice.

Thanks very much for your video. Upon inspection of my movement I found I was in the same situation as you. Bought my Black Bay Heritage from a dealer who got the watch from an estate sale. Removed the case and found no Tudor stamps on the movement.

Thanks for your honesty. It can happen to anyone.

The only tell for me comparing a genuine in my hands to the video, is the polished part (underside) of the clasp on the bracelet. The Tudor branding appears to be etched/ printed rather than engraved? The next would probably be impossible to tell without having a genuine next to it - The triangle on the top of the bezel looks a little off-colour and the crown looks a little larger.

I am looking at a blackbay on kijiji right now price seems pretty low. Just wondering what province you got yours from.Waiting to see if he will send me the original receipt. Thanks

The pip looks a little larger, and the gilt on the bezel looks a bit pale. But tough to tell from the angles provided. On some vids of rep spotting I've seen, the richness and body of the all the dial text and minute track don't have as much body on the reps and are flatter and duller in how it plays with light. Curious, did the clasp have the ceramic friction points? I feel like that's something that most reps would gloss over? The feeling is so smooth and effortless, yet so secure.

Zf bb58! Great rep to wear as a daily lol! The rep lacks the warmth of the gen. Flatter dial, lume is whiter, crown stem slightly longer

They rep EVERYTHING. Thanks for sharing your story and this video!

I'm sorry to hear. However, very good style to put out a cautionary video. Thanks from Denmark 🙂

I own several Tudors as it is my favourite brand, and I wear them daily, for fun I bought a replica of one I already own ( GMT) and it is only in adjusting the movement I can tell them apart. So it would be an easy mistake to make if you do not have a real one or can open it. great video, and a good reminder.

The tudor bb58 in black should have guilt colour in the bezel insert aswell. Im not sure if it is the light, but it does seem to be silver in your bezel insert

I've seen reps of Casio F91Ws so of course there would be midrange reps. Especially with Rolex's sibling brand.

Hi there I’d like to do a comparison video of this fake to the real - do you still own this rep and if so, can I purchase it from you?

Wear it like a boss, and don't have to worry about scratching it

I know nothing about watches but isn't the white pip on the red 12 o'clock triangle "off centre"?

Crazy thing I do is if I want to purchase a watch I study every thing about the replica of said watch. There are huge forums discussing what is off on the replica and if you see any of these discrepancies you know it’s fake quickly. Rather than studying in depth the real watch you are looking to buy. May sound crazy but unless you have a real one in hand to check against it’s your best option this day and age to study what is off on the fakes. Just my 2 cents.

I would never buy a watch unless new from a boutique. These reps are getting scary good. Great video, very informative.

This is heartbreaking 💔 I’m going to the AD only now. I was planning on buying three used Tudor watches rather than buying one gray market Rolex explorer 1. Look’s like I’m going to shop for 2 new Tudor watches now. It could make an amazing beater watch though.

I purchased a quality one for around 300 usd since I already owned a real 79230N.. comparing the two, the give away was the feeling of the bracelet on wrist and the crystal smears a lot/stays hazy if you brush up against it

Is there / was there any legal action you could take? I certainly don't know what the legal system is in Canada but I'd be interested to see if you thought about anything you could do.

Thanks for giving this video and what a horrible experience!!!!

Bring your own case back opener. If the seller doesn't let you open it then walk away. Modern Rolexes & Tudors have a free sprung balance.

My BB58 (and, I’ve read on forums, others as well) have a hacking issue where the crown needs a little extra pull to get the stem to fully seat and hack, after being unscrewed and pulled out. It’s not a new position, but a little click (sound and feeling) of the clutch finally engaging so the second hand stops. If this is what you have experienced, I would say it might not be fake. Mine keeps great time as well, winds smooth and substantial, etc.

The lume pip on the bezel jumped out to me immediately also that it is misaligned

How much does it cost to verify if the watch is real at local AD?

It is what it is. If it keeps good time then Youre gonna have a cool beater watch. Tudor used eta before so think of it as of previous model

The lume pip is often a dead giveaway, the fakes have a different color and/or size lume pip. The example in this video also has the placement wrong, it is a bit off center

Thanks for sharing your story sorry that you had to experience that. I do have a bb58 and the bluebay 58 and the bb58 925. I paused your video to compare it to mine, its very close indeed, although the red triangle and the pip looks slightly off colour, the colour of the hour markers are more yellowy on the original, the crown on the fake looks larger. I wish you better luck work your watch journey in the future

Did you buy it from TPG?

I bought one on Aliexpress for $120. The main differences are: The movement is a generic unbranded movement. That is why they don’t have the see-through back. Also, the bezel action and crown are pretty rough. Finally, the GMT hand doesn’t work well or at all. Beware- these come with nice boxes. The straps and bracelets are all branded. A good beater watch.

The main things to look for are the winding feel will be massively different from a real one. The screw pins on the bracelet also sit flush like on a Rolex but on real Tudor watches they have a slight curve ball end to them. Thirdly try the double locking clasp. On the fake you can pull it open by putting your finger/s underneath the clasp and pulling outwards. The real one is designed to stop just that. Lastly the print on the dial will be somewhat duller than on an original one.

The applied lume dot on the bezel is not centered in the triangle. That's the first thing I noticed. Sorry you were scammed!

Also, I like to Google serial numbers. Fakes use the same numbers in huge batches, even on different models within a brand. A real serial number will have effectively zero results. (Other than maybe a listing of that one actual real watch).

The white dot looks odd on the red triangle and the red looks off to!

That really sucks. It’s one thing buying a replica knowing is a replica…

99.9999999% of people can't tell it's a replica in a social setting

Sucks that you got scammed. It looks good though. Wear it anyway. I bought a Moonswatch that turned out to be fake, I wear it sometimes and if anyone asks (only watch enthusiasts ever ask) I tell them how I came by it and it’s a fun story. Even though it’s a fake it has some value for me.

Although I was apprehensive, I decided to give swissarex a try after reading customer evaluations. Glad I did, too!

If i ever get stuck with a fake im going to make an epoxy table with the watch parts

I’m curious if the clasp and bezel action where giveaways at all? A few years ago when I had a BB58 I got ahold of a replica bracelet and the clasp was absolute crap compared to the real deal. I would think the bezel action would be hard to replicate as well.

the lume pip at the center of the bezel is a big tell.

Always ask for papers of authentication. Including the timegrapher specifications date and time of testing and certification. Actual reference number authentication as well. No papers no sale. Also before any sale get the watch checked over by a certified jeweler or watch boutique. If the seller refuses, the deal is off.

Looks legit to me I have a blue BB and the markings look good from here I'd interested in a video of opening up the case back.

This got me thinking about a Bond era 40mm Omega Seamaster 300M automatic I bought many many years ago on ebay. The seller said he inherited from his father after he passed and had no use for it. No box or instructions. The watch looked legit and had signs of daily wear on the bracelet and clasp so I thought nothing of it. And I assumed the fakes back then weren't good enough to be indistinguishable. I paid around 1300 for it about 5 years ago. There's always the thought on the back of my mind that I could have bought a fake. One day I will take it to Omega to find out.

I'm a Happy owner if a bb58 bought at retail at the ad. I see my watch everyday and can't tell no difference with yours. I'm actually surprised you said is fake

It appears to me that the bezel insert is slightly misaligned. It might just be the viewing angle. The other biggest tell for people to look out for will be the bezel action, a genuine bb58 will have a more positive stop when it’s aligned at the 12 o’clock. None of the reps have this feature as far as I know.

The only tell that I can see is possibly a misalignment of the lume dot on the bezel. The bracelet, clasp, and case looks fantastic, very tough to tell on video. One specific tell in photos or video, is the polish on the crown and the teeth, also the lume brightness and color, and QC on the application of it. Then generally the weight, sound and feel of the bracelet links, clasp, buckle, and rotor are specific tells when you have the watch in hand. Clunky sound of a Miyota is a big tell. Sometimes even the super reps have a bezel that's slightly raised. The serial numbering is repetitive on mid tier reps. But dang it's tough to justify thousands when a rep is that good, especially if you pop the case back and they rep the rotor, engravings, and machining on the face of the movement. Then you look deeper and see it's a Miyota with a mask on. Always pop that case back and get a picture before buying, or buy from a trusted dealer. It's too much money to play with, honestly. Even for a significant savings over retail.

Thanks for sharing the unfortunate experience. I abominate fakes or replicas of contemporary watches :/

The pip centre looks a little bigger than the original. 🇬🇧

People always say never buy watch new from AD, but apparently today that's the only way you guaranteed to get the authentic watch

I had considered getting a rep just for the bracelet, if I could only have gotten my hands on a real one on a strap. Thankfully found a late 2018 on bracelet, unworn slider at a great price.

The bezel insert could be the giveaway. Looks dull with no warmth and not properly seated.

Its still a really nice looking watch. Just enjoy it.

Same thing happened to me about 18 months ago buying online, I caught on (only because of a clear sticker on the inside of the clasp, when they should be blue) and got my money back luckily. Word of warning, it’s very hard to tell the different, you only have a chance if you have them side by side, they are scary good, bezel, bracelet and movement all feel the same! If you have bought a used 58 I would have it checked. The fakes have the 41 BB text on the dial, which is thinner and browner in colour and the 58 uses a bolder golden font.

Off the bat I can see hollow endlinks which is a tell for me.

There are two things that visually stand out about this watch, maybe 3. One the bezel appears to be misaligned, I've never seen a Tudor with a misaligned bezel. Maybe that happens, I've just never seen it. Two the model number lasered on the back appears to be fuzzier than it normally is and possibly three the end links appear to not fit perfectly flush with the case. Tudor has practically no room between the lugs and the endlinks, they fit absolutely perfectly on a gen watch.

They’re actually making fake Tudors! Dang I need to check mine!

The Tudor Black Bay, wether it's the original 41 or the 58 has a unique feature where the bezel is slightly harder to turn when it's at the prime 12 o'clock position. I don't need to tell you why so is this, but I think this is a point worth checking when you're buying a new watch.

It seems like the non-in house tudors are now using whats seems to be standard eta and sellita 2824-2 and SW200-1 movements, they are decorated and have a fancy rotor but they don't have the fancy regulator like in the past so it would be kind if easy for 1 if the 4 cloke 2824 producers in China to copy, they could even buy a real stellita movement (maybe 100 to 150 dollars in bulk for standard) and get it decorated. You can remove the ghost date position on any 2824 or clone. Buying used I would demand to see the movement, if it's not in house then I would have to get it verified by a 3rd party.

That’s a good looking fake .. I’m not surprised it fooled you. Sure looks the part. I’d have to see it closer to notice any inconsistency. But on first blush that does look genuine.

Damn. Sorry man 😢

No box and paper...still got the watch.....

The lumepip on 13 is to greenshiny and the gold colour on the bezel is not right. The original matches perfekt with the golden hands. This are to silvery… but the case and the straps looks ident

To me the only thing that looks off is the case back- in my experience the ridged section is recessed, making it flush with the back

ouch, that hurts!

Never buy a modern watch without B&P. There is no reason why the seller wouldn’t have it.

The crowns are usually the easiest giveaway.

Few differences: 1. The rivets are too small. 2. Lume pip is too dark. 3. Reference number is laser burnt. 4. Dial print is too bright. 5. The crystal is milky. 6. The crown tube is a little too long. 7. Tudor stamp on the clasp is too shallow.

The pip at the top looks wrong. It doesn't have the metal enclosure. The bezel font and markers look to be a little off as well, size and color. Not going to lie, its hard to tell from your video. Scammers suck.

I feel your pain, man. What are you thinking of doing?

This video never really shows it, but under the "flap" that makes up the clasp, there are white ball type things on the genuine one. It may have been the angle or the lighting but I don't see them on this

Where to buy?

The ZF rep you got has white tone hands and plots instead of the creamer hue of the Gen. the date spot in the movement is a tell, but there are others more visually that you could have spotted if you would have done your research before buying.

What about the power reserve? The watch was running for 70 hours ?

Afaik, reps don't have the stop at the 12 o clock position when the rotating bezel.

It's scary how closely watches can be replicated these days.

Always open the back check the movement

How long is your power reserve when fully wound? Should be 70 hrs. That may tell you the movement is not what it’s supposed do be.

I have this exact same watch and the colors in your video seems a bit off but if I haven’t red the tittle I wouldn’t know. I always question why I pay a ton of money while the exact same item is available for 1/20th of the price. Especially for watches that don’t keep their value.

This is why I don't buy pre-owned from private sellers! Seller may have been scammed and in turn scammed you, just to recoup his money! An old friend of mine went the gangster route to get his money back from a scammer on eBay some yrs. back! And that was the case of that seller!

The lume pip and really the bezel as whole are off, and the Tudor brand engravings on the back are a give away. Pretty good fake all in all though

Bad luck there. Its hard to tell from the video. I took a look at photos of a genuine and compared, there are a few things that look different. The shield on the dial looks to have thicker lines than the real one, the vertical leg of the "T" in the word Tudor on the dial looks like it flares as it goes down as opposed to having parallel sides, the "milled" part of the crown appears thinner than the genuine watch and the neck is longer as a result, also the milling on it appears to have less blunt peaks than the genuine item. The "rose" on the crown does not look that crisp (the genuine item, is extremely well defined). The pearl at the 12.00 O'clock on the bezel does not look central. Lastly, the chamfer down the side of the case is very sharp on the genuine, but looks softer on this one. But without seeing high detailed still images, these might all be an illusion of the video.

The lume pip looks of vs a real one. And the bezel is a 120 click bezel instead of a 60 click bezel.

Unless you know EXACTLY the tell signs for a specific model dont ever buy grey. You have no idea how close some of them are.