SHARP Swords on Bucklers? How do they react? - Shield Knock 2017

  Рет қаралды 17,061

Blood and Iron HEMA

Blood and Iron HEMA

6 жыл бұрын

Something a lot don't think about is how exactly a sharp sword will react against a regular buckler.
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Weapons used in video:
Cold Steel Arming Sword - amzn.to/2yMG2Bi
Buckler: Custom

Пікірлер: 59
@Evan-rj9xy
@Evan-rj9xy 6 жыл бұрын
I wish I was invulnerable like Superman. Save the world? Nah. I'm gonna go play with sharp swords! :D
@Matt_The_Hugenot
@Matt_The_Hugenot 6 жыл бұрын
Considering this together with Roland Warzecha's stuff on training with sharps shows we've still got a way to go in simulating real combat.
@BloodandIronHEMA
@BloodandIronHEMA 6 жыл бұрын
The difference is that the effects of "sticking" of sharp vs sharp goes down dramatically with speed and intensity. - kzfaq.info/get/bejne/gZN_a6V2zdjPeHk.html While with this, it would go up the harder they hit.
@Matt_The_Hugenot
@Matt_The_Hugenot 6 жыл бұрын
Blood and Iron HEMA Yes, all true. I was referring to the difficulty of of replicating these effects with regular training or competition weapons.
@JustGrowingUp84
@JustGrowingUp84 6 жыл бұрын
This was massively cool! Any opportunity to learn, even a tiny bit, how an actual historical fight might be like, is pure gold, and this one doesn't disappoint. Also, thanks Julian for the captions, they really helped.
@HEMASimian
@HEMASimian 6 жыл бұрын
TheFilthyCasual I'm glad they helped, they were such a pain to do :P
@curtisthornsberry4236
@curtisthornsberry4236 Жыл бұрын
Kyle is such an awesome teacher, anyone interested in HEMA in the Phoenix area should check out his school.
@lostwanderer1144
@lostwanderer1144 6 жыл бұрын
I found this both interesting and informative. Thank you. :)
@ziggydog5091
@ziggydog5091 2 жыл бұрын
I had an Arnis teacher that did advanced training with sharp weapons, It was revelatory, you don’t understand what a bind is until you do something like that.
@themightycaolf6549
@themightycaolf6549 6 жыл бұрын
I'm curous, would practicing with slightly magnetic synthetic material achieve the same affect as a sharp sword biting into a buckler, or similar?
@Sk0lzky
@Sk0lzky 3 жыл бұрын
Shield knock 2020 will be pavise and crossbow exclusive
@adriangunn
@adriangunn 6 жыл бұрын
Great stuff!
@simoncooper6939
@simoncooper6939 2 жыл бұрын
Excellent, thank you.
@thelonerider5644
@thelonerider5644 5 жыл бұрын
Heard people mention how the bind is different with two sharp blades than with practice swords... never thought about the same with bucklers! Thanks for sharing this!
@savantesam7048
@savantesam7048 3 жыл бұрын
Huh. That's actually *really cool* to know.
@seanwauters8556
@seanwauters8556 3 жыл бұрын
Thank you for sharing.
@erobwen
@erobwen 6 жыл бұрын
So practice weapons/shields should have sawteeth edges and dimples on the surface to try to emulate the real thing? Or use welcro or some other sticky thing?
@Dhomazhir
@Dhomazhir 6 жыл бұрын
Reminds me of the test Bill SHort did with the wood shield and the spear showing that the spear could get stuck, and get you killed, or it could go through and 'maybe' wound the man (depending on what he is wearing and how it hits).
@thelonerider5644
@thelonerider5644 5 жыл бұрын
BTW, could this be the reason behind a lot of historical bucklers using a wooden rim with a metal boss, that the sword would stick into it or bind better than with metal? I know one reason is metal was more expensive than organic material back then, but this is making me wonder if, while a wood buckler might be more easily damaged than an all steel one, it may had had an advantage in the bind?
@b19931228
@b19931228 6 жыл бұрын
Very interesting, we know blade on blade contact "sticks" to a certain degree. But hey, few of us know that shield and buckler have similar effect as well!
@awlach8
@awlach8 6 жыл бұрын
Roland Warzecha at Dimicator has been talking about this for some time. He emphasizes the bind between 2 swords and how much more control is demonstrable when the swords are sharp.
@BloodandIronHEMA
@BloodandIronHEMA 6 жыл бұрын
Yes and no. Binding with sharps doesn't play nearly as much of a role when speed and intent are involved. When you go slow then the effect is amplified. You can see Sean Franklin's and RJ McKeehan's thoughts on this here - kzfaq.info/get/bejne/gZN_a6V2zdjPeHk.html
@awlach8
@awlach8 6 жыл бұрын
That was a great video. Would you be able to discuss what we see in I33 and Roland's interpretation of it in a video? He's the only person I've come across fencing this way and he does this under the idea that it minimizes the idea of the double kill. Modern HEMA practitioners can throw with speed and intent more recklessly when death is not a real concern (at least that's my interpretation of his work). I am an enthusiast, at best, of historical warfare so some of these topics get a little confusing when not immersed in the subject.
@BloodandIronHEMA
@BloodandIronHEMA 6 жыл бұрын
Adam Whitlach Yeah we have a lot of thoughts on the subject, trying to think of the best way to go about it is taking a while. It's not something that we can half-ass. But something we will mention is that respect of the weapon can be trained, and be part of the salle culture. We have relatively few doubles in our school because of it
@fabricio-agrippa-zarate
@fabricio-agrippa-zarate 6 жыл бұрын
Interesting, very very interesting. Could this be aplied aswell in shield and sword ?
@alaskankare
@alaskankare 6 жыл бұрын
Si what happens if you wrap the polyshield in leather? Does it catch a poly sword?
@handmade3681
@handmade3681 4 жыл бұрын
Would using flex spray on a cold steel buckler simulate this effect?
@DavidBarnwell876tkdja
@DavidBarnwell876tkdja 4 жыл бұрын
What about straight thrusts to the legs.
@gunblade7610
@gunblade7610 Жыл бұрын
I'm wondering if cutting blade catchers (like on a sail daggers) onto the sides of bucklers would help to simulate that - cause yeah those glancing strike hits are garbage....though I'll use them myself TBH. Also, I'm on a. Crusade to help S&B against R&D and those thrust focused 45 inch rapiers are annoying. I'm wondering if dimpling buckler faces can help "stick" points more though with tipp guards not sure how that would work... Maybe coating your buckler with duct tape before sparring?🤣🤣🤣
@spencerpalmer2918
@spencerpalmer2918 6 жыл бұрын
Great video! Does anyone have any ideas how to simulate this with synthetic swords and the plastic Cold Steel buckler? Could we get a more realistic feel if the buckler were covered in leather?
@sharkinahat
@sharkinahat 6 жыл бұрын
How about putting two sided duct tape on the shield?
@Chaosism
@Chaosism 6 жыл бұрын
Have you guys ever tried the Blackfencer sharp simulator line of synthetics?
@BloodandIronHEMA
@BloodandIronHEMA 6 жыл бұрын
Chaosism We have not, though we hear from people who have done sharp on sharp stimulation that they're not far off. Those are definitely on the list to get eventually
@Chaosism
@Chaosism 6 жыл бұрын
+Blood and Iron HEMA Cool. I've heard criticism that they're too "sticky" compared to sharp blades. I'd love to see you guys test them out. :)
@whatever41421
@whatever41421 6 жыл бұрын
This is a cool looking event, is it an annual thing?
@BloodandIronHEMA
@BloodandIronHEMA 6 жыл бұрын
This was the first one, and there will definitely be more. So yes!
@whatever41421
@whatever41421 6 жыл бұрын
Sweet! I'll try to keep up to date with it, I live miles away but if I could make it then that would be excellent
@mikajlod25
@mikajlod25 6 жыл бұрын
So what about all metal bucklers?
@BloodandIronHEMA
@BloodandIronHEMA 6 жыл бұрын
As Julian says at the end of the video, Kyle has tested this on steel bucklers as well. It's very similar.
@johnnypopulus5521
@johnnypopulus5521 6 жыл бұрын
I thought that a sharp would bite and stick like they do when it's sword-sword. It's difficult to get that sharp reaction from anything else.
@GermanSwordMaster
@GermanSwordMaster 4 жыл бұрын
Steel Bucklers arent the most common type in any time and place scenario anyways i would say.
@TheApocalypticKnight
@TheApocalypticKnight 6 жыл бұрын
Flip flops??? o_O
@Alpha.Phenix
@Alpha.Phenix 6 жыл бұрын
The one negative to this is, just think of all the damage. Yes, I am aware that going into a battle and expecting to come out with your gear being as good as new is just silly. However, how many strong hits would a buckler really be able to sustain, before being noticably weeker?
@BloodandIronHEMA
@BloodandIronHEMA 6 жыл бұрын
Alpha PHENIX I think you answered your own question ;) If you're going into a fight, your equipment will be damaged. Thankfully a buckler is easier to replace
@Chaosism
@Chaosism 6 жыл бұрын
I don't think the sword would bite too much more into the bucker with a more powerful blow; the blade encounters increasing resistance from friction as it drives deeper, so twice as powerful =/= twice as deep. Over time, the edges of the buckler might get whittled down, but given that the sword is designed with flexibility, this reduces some of the torqueing energy and it won't damage the buckler too much. Please note that this is mere speculation on my part, and broad speculation at that.
@Dhomazhir
@Dhomazhir 6 жыл бұрын
Do a test, film it, and share. :) Bucklers are not hard to make and they did come in many qualities & materials & sizes.
@Alpha.Phenix
@Alpha.Phenix 6 жыл бұрын
If I had the recording gear and a place to do it without people calling cops on me, I would have.
@breaden4381
@breaden4381 6 жыл бұрын
When doubt loot the dead
@dizzt19
@dizzt19 6 жыл бұрын
The leather is kind of an extreme "prove my point" material. I can absolutely see someone teaching techniques based on using leather bucklers though!
@BloodandIronHEMA
@BloodandIronHEMA 6 жыл бұрын
ZaxProxy Its a wooden buckler with a rawhide cover. As Julian mentioned the end, Kyle has tested this against a metal buckler and results were similar.
@dizzt19
@dizzt19 6 жыл бұрын
I'm aware, I'm just saying the material matters and "similar" means more testing is needed, as I'd expect is going to happen even just for the fun of it. :)
@migmindy
@migmindy 6 жыл бұрын
to simulate this in fencing, bucklers should have little catches. easy to get out of, but wouldn't allow for some of that nonsense we see. my thought, anyhow
@thelonerider5644
@thelonerider5644 5 жыл бұрын
I'm wondering if the swords had little teeth on the tip or at least grooves, just enough to increase traction while still being blunt. Or conversely, the buckler could have a textured surface. like checkering.
@Algado
@Algado 6 жыл бұрын
Все такие жирные/толстые... - Американцы?
@ollejanson9071
@ollejanson9071 6 жыл бұрын
Instructing in flip flops?! Disapprove!
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