LMAO Fuck that is so relatable 😂

By the time you've cooked the crew's meal, the sub might have been sunk by depth charges. :/

Do it, Chief Cook..

You are welcome :)

This is a def must for long range shoosting, but I prefer up close and personal.

Thank you for the advice, I actually did not know that Ctrl will allow for a slower periscope movement

exactly the same

Hey I´m happy that I could help. Soon I´ll have to rewatch the video myself. My Cold Waters Campaign is about to end, and then we´ll return to Silent Hunter. Stay tuned for that :)

Shouldn't the angle of the ship produce a proportionately smaller length for the transit time thus preserving the accuracy of the speed measurement?

@@nickhatch1356 He said below that the AOB doesn't change the amount of time it takes for the length of ship to pass by. It does seem counter-intuitive but I think that your observation is correct.

1) is wrong. You are measuring how much time the ship takes to move it's whole length. The AOB is irrelevant as long as it isn't 0 or close to it.

Gleichfalls schönen Abend!

@@Tonci87 okay der moment wenn du nach 3 tagen der verzweifelten Torpedoverschwendung endlich den Bogen raus hast und dein erstes Schiff versenkst 😬 That feeling ! Hast du einen Ratschlag oder Tipp wie die Winkel einzustellen sind wenn man nicht auf 90° interception Winkel kommt, sondern den Zeitpunkt verpasst hat ? LG

@@T0xPaC Die Geschwindigkeit solltest du ja schon gemeßen haben. Diese ist die wichtigste Variable. Im Fall dass du den idealen Punkt verpasst hast, hilft nur Geschwindigkeit gemäß Messung einstellen, Lagewinkel und Entfernung schätzen, Daumen drücken

Thank you. The distance to target didn´t matter here at all though. If you set up a 90° shot, then the distance setting is irrelevant. My shot grouping was a bit off because I made a little mistake when reading the targets course :)

Yeah, that actually works

Thank you for the advice, I do not know why I didn´t think about that at the time :D

I've never tried that. Thanks!

That is useful to know that SH3 has tables for that! I´ll be playing SH3 in the near future :)

@@Tonci87 45 degrees is really easy, though. It is just your own speed. I am not sure if other Guis have it. It may be only on ARB.

Aim at target, press Spacebar

Make sure that you have followed the installation instructions to the letter. If the problem still persists, go to this thread www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=238315

Edit: And someone asked this already. "If the target is sailing away from you then the AOB is greater than 90°. In that case you need to subtract whatever result you get with the RAOBF from 180° ."

@@tommyzDad Yes exactly:)

Also "0" on the numpad is straight rudder which comes in handy with the arrow keys. Left and right arrow set the rudder to 5 degrees in that direction for subtle directional adjustments. Shift + Left or Right arrow is Full left or right rudder. I use those commands to set my heading manually all the time along with the "." numpad heading to view. Even if your underwater, and you want to turn directly toward a sound contact(let's say bearing 270 degrees)... simply walk from the hydrophone station to the observation scope. Turn the scope to 270 and press "." on the numpad and you'll begin a turn directly toward that sound contact.

Please note that this method only works at the maximum magnification of your scope. If the target has an optical range that is greater than 40, then you don´t really need to aim any more to hit it :D. If the target is sailing away from you then the AOB is greater than 90°. In that case you need to subtract whatever result you get with the RAOBF from 180°

I'm pounting to the red line with my mouse, sorry if it is hard to see in the video. You use the middle red line that is pointing upwards and to the right

@@Tonci87 Thanks for the quick response. I did a little googling and I think that the red line (middle one or the bottom one) should be chosen by the current scope zoom (x1.5 / x6). Please correct me if I'm wrong. It's pretty hard to find information for that.

@@Archydemon There is a difference in meassuring AOB and Distance if you switch to a 1.5x zoom, but how you read the speed is always the same. The ship will take just as much time to pass through the center of your scope in x6 zoom as it does in x1.5 zoom :)

That was a small mistake I made :D

Hi there. Please have a look at the Gyro angle (the two big wheels on the buttom right) I fire when the gyro angle is zero. The Gyro angle determines how much the torpedo will turn after leaving the tube. In order to be independent of the range to target we need a straight running torpedo that impacts at a 90° angle. That is why I have to aim at 350 in this case. I hope that made it easier to understand :)

The recognition manual is part of TWOS. You might have to drag it out from the left side of the screen

It goes 70, 75, 80, 90. The 80 is very close to the 90

A common misconception. The time that the target needs to pass through the center of your periscope from bow to stern will always be the same, regardless of the AOB. Imagine the scene from above, and imagine a line from your sub to just in front of the targets course. Now pay attention to the point where that imagined line crosses the targets course. The target ship will always need the same amount of time to pass that point, even if you let it approach from another direction.

I´m not quite sure what you mean, could you maybe point out a time in the video where that happens?

@@Tonci87 At 18:33, after setting the new course to place the sub at 90° with the target course. The speed pointer is always stopped at zero. Your perplexity made me look at the details of the video again from the beginning. Then I saw this: at 3:45 you go to speed 5 to turn the sub's heading to 0°, at 4:42 you drop to speed 1, your mouse presses 1, but the speed pointer drops to indicate 0. Also on the command log in the lower right corner it says "ahead slow", not "all stop". That's why I thought you were moving at a standstill, the pointer shows "0", but you are actually moving at 1. Even when at 18:33 you move to get at 90° with the target, you are not standing still, the pointer shows 0 but you are already moving at 1, and the log always shows only "23.08 ahead slow". So it's just a bug of the game, the same that I had already noticed in my game, for example I go from 0 to 1, the speed increases, the command "ahead slow" appears but the speed pointer stays at 0. If I want to go back to "all stop" and press 0 nothing happens, I first have to press speed 2 (finally the pointer moves), and then try again with 0, so I can go back to "all stop".

@@luxman14 Ah yes, yeah that is a bug in the game. If you order a speed of 1kn the speed dial will drop to 0.

Hard to tell what went wrong there, but I wouldn´t worry too much about it. You will receive more than enough promotion points during the campaigns. I had my crew maxed out at the end of 1942

Well setting the attack disc to 358 instead of 2 degrees was a mistake, however not a terrible one since a few degrees of error will not have a huge impact. Especially not at that range. As I wrote earlier, the targets speed is the most important value to get right. If your torpedoes keep passing behind the target, that likely means that your calculated speed is too low. When you meassure the speed, then focus on the ships waterline. What I mean by that is, do not start the clock when your targets bow tip is passing through your crosshair. Start it at that point where the bow is coming out of the water. Same for the targets stern.

That is difficult to say without seeing what you are doing. But keep practicing, you´ll get there :)

Try holding CTRL :)

Thank YOU!!!

Don´t worry, I was a noob once as well ;) The number 45 is because of the time I measured. 45 seconds.

The whole point of the TDC is to make attacking multiple targets on the same course and speed easy. If your firing solution is sound the you can fire at one target then track left or right to fire at another and they'll all hit assuming identical courses and speeds independent of range. The TDC updates the AOB as you move the scope. With most solutions range is also mostly unimportant. It has some effect with the parallax of torpedoes that have to turn out of the tubes but for straight no gyro shots its meaningless except to your stop watch, assuming your soultion is accurate enough. If you spend time getting a perfect solution for a convoy attack you can fire all your torpedoes at 2 or 3 targets and hit all of them. The only real extra finesse would be timing your shots so they all mostly hit at the same time.

Multiple attack is actually not that hard, depending on what you want to shoot. If you want to hit three different targets all in a different row and column in the convoy, yeah that is hard. But hitting three targets in the same row is pretty easy. If you set up a 90 degree angle on first target, take distance and speed. Set periscope to zero degrees and put in the data. Then when turning the periscope will adjust the TDC data. I have been thinking about different approaches about this. For example hit three hits around the same time by targeting the middle ship of the row. Fire impact torpedo (at slow speed maybe) at zero gyroangle, then 1 magnetic torpedo (fast speed) to the port and starboard ships, which will have different gyroangles, but if the magntics work that should not be a problem. Stil have to try this out. I do think the early torpedoes had really unreliable magnetic triggers, so maybe go for impact anyway. Love this game.

Well damn... well spotted. You actually found the reason why the torpedoes missed the intended point of impact by a few meters!

Actually range does not matter except for time to impact calculation. That's why you can set up an attack on several ships in a row in a convoy and have them all impact at about the same time as each ship passes your firing mark starting with the furthest.

I just saw that you added a question to your post. Since I know the ships course from my AOB observation, and I'm intercepting it at 90 degrees, i already know the AOB. It will be 90° when the ship is at my 0° bearing. Range does not matter at all if you do a 90° intercept

If you are in a 90° Position and you have set up your TDC accordingly (AOB 90 at bearing 0 and target speed), you turn your Periscope until the Gyro angle is 0. You fire when the target passes your crosshair. The Gyro angle determines by how much the torpedo will turn once it has left the tube. Gyro angle 0 means that the Torpedo will go in a straight line. You will notice that the bearing at which your gyro angle is 0 is determined by the targets speed (and your torpedo speed setting). The faster your target is, the more you will have to turn your periscope from the 0° bearing until your gyro angle is 0.

@@Tonci87 thank you for the answer

Damn, well spotted!

Noticed that too... I added 270 to 62 and couldn't figure out why I was getting a different number for a minute!

Yeah, I made a little mistake there...

You spotted a little mistake I made

@@Tonci87 Can you clarify for me a bit? Bearing was 2 degrees, but adjusted the attack disk to a value of 358 and ran the calculation with a successful hit. Does it have something to do with the target position being port or starboard? is there a "mental conversion" to consider, pending this information (360-2 = 358)? I followed your video elaborating this method successfully for the first ship I sunk, but the last 3 or 4 I some how keep shooting behind the ship after my Attack disk adjustment for the 90 degree intercept. Just looking for things I am doing wrong.

Hi, I received a notification for a comment you made, but that comment is not listed here for some reason. Anyway, it does not matter too much if your AOB calculation is off by a few degrees, as long as you do not shoot at extreme range. The most important value to get right is by far the targets speed. If you keep missing, then that is the value I would verify first.

Well, there of course is no easy answer to that. Every commander and every crew was different and had his/their own preferences. Add to that that the RAOBF and Stadimeter were at some point not included in new periscopes. According to many war diaries the method used most often to get the targets speed is "Ausdampfen" (range and AOB were eyeballed). Ausdampfen however can also mean multiple things. Check out my video on the historical Ausdampfverfahren to see one meaning. The other meaning would be to simply sail parallel to the target and to match its course and speed before your attack.

Can you please give me the time in the video where this is not clear?

@@Tonci87 yeah im sorry i was mishearing you i figured it out last night.

Go to www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?p=2688303#post2688303 and post a screenshot of your issue. That is the best way to get help.

Ich hab das was in Wolves of Steel standardmäßig dabei ist. Also kein Extramod

@@Tonci87 ich hab eine gefunden die geht, wenn man die Masthöhe nicht auf die Kommastelle genau hat ist der Rest schon falsch.

Then you have a very very slow target. You will not miss. You can also use the RAOBF to get the speed

Sorry, no Discord. If you have questions, I will try to answer them here in the comments.

Yes, if you are on the other side of the ship, then you have to use the red side of the bearing disc. But you should still be able to use the same bearing rings

@@Tonci87 Thank you!

While i have you here, if you don't mind. How come the range to the target doesn't matter when you do it like this? I'm trying to wrap my head around it, but i don't understand how the range can be irrelevant even tho it clearly seems to be.

@@Coinkidoink This only works if you are positioned at a 90° angle to the targets course. Your TDC knows the speed of your Torpedo, and you have entered the targets speed into the TDC. If you now turn your periscope until the Gyro angle is 0° you will know when to fire so that your torpedo will travel straight until it collides with the target. Your TDC calculates the solution for a triangle. Draw a triangle where your boat is Point A, a line straight out from your boat representing the torpedo path to point B where it intersects the targets course at 90°. Point C will represent the target, and will be somewhere along the target course line. The line from A to C should be drawn at an angle that represents you looking at a bearing where your gyro angle will be 0. The angle depends on the speed of the target. A faster target means a bigger angle. The triangle now shows the situation when you shoot the torpedo. Your TDC knows that the torpedo will need x seconds to arrive at point B. It also knows how fast the target is travelling. So the TDC now calculates at what point the target will also need x seconds to go from C to B and it sets the gyro angle accordingly. So what happens if you move the line with the targets course farther away from point A? The torpedo path gets longer, and the travel path of the target gets longer until it reaches point B. Your angle at A will stay the same though, because the torpedo and the target now both need y seconds to meet at B.

@@Tonci87 Ah, i understand, thank you!

No it doesn't. Regardless of the angle, the time between the ships bow and stern passing through the crosshair, will always be the same :)

@@Tonci87 yeh had another think about that.

Do you see the little brown brass tab on the right side of the recognition manual? Look for that on the left side of your screen after you press E. Grab it with your mouse and pull it out.

If you follow this tutorial you should have no issues setting up a good shot at that range. Is there a specific thing you are having trouble with?

@@Tonci87i did understand the methods of calculating speed, range and aob. But, i didnt understand the gyroscope thing. When encountering a contact, i aim my crosshairs at it, press space, tell the torpedo man to auto identify it and then look itu up on the ERM. I used the u jagd and raobf to calculate speed, range and then aob. Then i set up the attack disk which usually tells me where to turn so that i have a 90 deg aob. My problem is the final part of it... knowing when to shoot What i did was i fired right when the ship crosses my crosshair. My periscope was set in a way that both of my gyroscope gives a 0 degree reading. Missed There is a pdf explaining how to get the lead angle, however im not very familiar with the back side of the attack disk (and worsened by very little of image explaining step by step) Also after firing, do torpedoes turn to the bearing we are aiming at before we press the fire button or do they always travel straight after firing?

@@vortex6818 Ah I see, I think I might know where the problem is. By the way, you do not need the backside of the attack disc at all. Try this if you want to set up a 90° attack: Get the targets speed and course. Set yourself up on a 90° angle to the targets course. Point you periscope straight forward at bearing 0°. Press the little button to activate the manual TDC input. Set AOB to 90° left or right (depends on the side the target is showing you). Enter the targets speed. Press the button again. You will now notice that your gyroangle (This btw. is how much the torpedo will turn once it leaves the tube. 0° = straight run) is NOT 0°. Now turn your periscope until the gyro angle is at 0° (By how much you had to turn your periscope is your lead angle btw.). Fire once the target is in your crosshairs. I think your problem is that you are setting up the data for a 90° shot while looking at your target, is that right? But once you turn your periscope the angle has changed.

@@Tonci87 roget that, will try it out thanks!

Thank you, I'm not using the 4 Bearings method that very often, but I'll see what I can do.

Hi there, unfortunately I can not help with that. However, people on subsim.com might be able to. Here is the link to the TWOS issues thread: www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=238315

Look for the little handle of the book on the left edge of your screen and pull it out (activate documents first of course)

Wenn du feuerst, so dass der Torpedo bei 90° AOB trifft, ist die Distanz irrelevant, solange du die Geschwindigkeit richtig geschätzt/gemessen hast.

@@Tonci87 Danke. Das ging schnell.

@@simsch97 Gerne

It is part of the Wolves of Steel Mod

That is hard to explain without drawing a picture. But basically imagine this, or draw it if it helps: A triangle with our ship, the enemy ship at the position where we shoot, and the enemy ship at the position where we hit it as the corner points. Our TDC knows how fast our torpedo is going. That is the side of the triangle from our boat to the point of impact. We also know how fast the enemy is travelling. That will be the side from the enemies position where we fire, to the point of impact. Since we attack at an 90° angle the other two angles in the triangle have to add up to 90°. The Range does not matter because with a 90° angle the ratio between target and torpedo speed always remains the same. So imagine we drag the corner with the impact point away from our submarine. The sides of the triangle will expand at the same ratio. The thing that will not be changing is the angles. If we change the distance from our submarine to the point of impact, the target will always remain on the line that is formed from our submarine to the targets position when we fire. We will always see it at the same bearing when we fire, regardless of the range. That bearing is calculated by the TDC based on the torpedo and target speed. Basically at bearing x the target will take how many seconds to arrive at bearing 0? When will the time to impact be equal for the target and the torpedo? This is a very crude explanation, and I am sorry if it doesn´t help.

There used to be an animated GIF that showed the problem easily. But basically, when a line of ships is crossing your bow at 90 degrees to your heading, with a 90 degree AOB if you fire on zero gyro angle it will hit any ship that crosses the vertical reticle at any distance. This make sit hugely convenient when a convoy of ships passes in front of you with nice neat rows and columns of ships. Your sub is pointed 90 degrees to the convoy course, but your scope will be pointed 10 degrees or so to the left or right for zero gyro angle. As the farthest column ship passes your reticle, you fire. Then the next closes ship will cross, fire again. Then the next closest ship, fire again, then the next closest ship, fire again. If you have the speed set properly, and the ships don't spot your torpedoes and alter course/speed, each ship will be hit nearly simultaneously.

Thank you

@@Tonci87 you are most welcome. Thank you for all of your tutorials and explanation on subsim. I would love to see you back in hte saddle and have a playthrough !

@@Dusty7460 There will be more Silent hunter content on the channel within the next months. However, it will be SH3 and not SH5. (If I can get everything to work well). While SH5 has been much improved by TWOS, the game is still full of bugs, issues and bad AI. SH3 with Mods looks almost as good as SH5 but has better AI, more playable Subs, more realism, crew management, etc. So you can look forward to that :)

@@Tonci87 I can t wait to see it. :)

Mit dem Bug Richtung Ziel muss man sich nur für die Geschwindigkeitsmessung stellen. Es wäre gut wenn du identifizieren könntest an welchem Schritt sich bei dir Fehler einschleichen. Für die Kursermittlung benötigt man den Lagewinkel, und für den die Entfernung. War die den richtig gemessen?

@@Tonci87 hab den fehler gefunden, hab bei der attack disc das erste ding auf die falsche skala gelegt und dann falsch abgelesen. eine frage hätte ich aber noch, unzwar wie is das wenn das bearing auf 270 zb ist. die attack disc geht ja nur bis 180.

@@tripplesix8459 Welches Bearing ist gerade gemeint? Die Attack Disc hat für Bearing und Kurs 360°. Oder meinst du den Lagewinkel wenn der über 90° hinausgeht, also das Ziel von dir wegdampft? In dem Fall wird der ja wieder kleiner. Du erhältst den korrekten Winkel wenn du das errechnete von 180° abziehst.

@@Tonci87 ja den lagewinkel meine ich d.h. wenn ich n bearing von 270 hab muss ich 270-180 rechnen? ich hatte mich jetzt auch nicht mit dem vorderen bug richtung feind gestellt, sondern die berechnung direkt aus der ausgangsstellung dieser mission vorgenommen.

@@tripplesix8459 Vergessen wir mal den eigenen Bug. Der Lagewinkel ist nichts anderes als, der Winkel zwischen dem Kurs des Ziels, und deiner Position, vom Ziel aus gesehen. Wenn das Ziel also genau auf dich zukommt ist der Lagewinkel 0. Dampft es genau von dir weg ist der Lagewinkel 180. So weit klar? Kommt das Ziel auf dich zu, und du siehst die rechte, also die Steuerbordseite des Ziels, wird der Lagewinkel irgendwo zwischen 0 und 90° Steuerbord liegen. Dampft das Ziel von dir weg und du siehst die Steuerbordseite, wird der Lagewinkel irgendwo zwischen 90 und 180° liegen. Das selbe nochmal für die Backbordseite mit 0-90° Backbord und 90-180° Backbord. Einen Lagewinkel 270° gibt es deshalb gar nicht. Deshalb bin ich so verwirrt wenn du von Bearing 270° sprichst. Oder meinst du doch den Wert den du in deinem eigenen Periskop ablesen kannst, also deine eigene Blickrichtung?

Doppebild Entfernungs- und Zielkurswinkelschätzer Stell es dir vor wie den Stadimeter, nur das man das überlappende Bild auch horizontal verschieben konnte bis der Bug das Heck berührte. Abhängig von der eingestellten Länge und vorher gemessenen Entfernung konnte dann der Lagewinkel abgelesen werden. Im Laufe des Krieges wurden neue Boote irgendwann nicht mehr damit bestückt, wahrscheinlich aus Kostengründen.

Usually that is an indication that your range reading is wrong. It happens. In such a situation I say trust your gut feeling. The target should be close to 90°, so, add or subtract (depends if the target is going towards you or away from you) about 10° and go for it. It won´t matter too much if you are off by a few degrees. If you feel something might be wrong with your game, there is an AOB and range finder script that you can start in the automation menu. I think it is in Tutorials->Sub. That might help you to check your results for possible errors. For example, if you regularly get a wrong range reading, it might help you to figure out why this happens. Another tip for you, if a target is going away from you, you have to subtract the AOB that you read off on the RAOBF from 180°.

@@Tonci87 Ok ok, thanks man, really, appreciate it. Normally the range is right, i use the standimeter to see if its right too, and it's a pretty close value D:. But appreciate it.

@@icarogibson5743 No problems, I´m glad if I can help somehow.

I´m not sure what you mean. 62° is the course that the target ship is sailing on, not the AOB

@@Tonci87 my problem is around this step, I can get the range, and the length of the ship but always when I try to do this last step on the RAOBF I just don't get it, this degree you got where it came from ? how do you get it cause I followed every step and I cound't see how it works

@@Tonci87 Wait false alarm, my bad I just needed to take a break from the tutorials and I saw what I understood wrong sorry for the uncovinience -w-'

@@Tonci87 I misunderstood 16 for 60 thats why I freaked out causa that make nosense to me im really sorry, but I'm happy to see that you keep replying even your 2 years old videos, your tutorials has been helping me a lot along the years..

@@damiem6172 No Problem, I read all of the comments, and and I´m always happy to help

Yes, there will be another video this week

@@Tonci87 o men that great , im stuck on the installation of sh5 n wos on my pc , idk why its not working !

@@666wolffy You should ask for help in the WOS thread on Subsim

@@666wolffy Sorry, but no. There are other people on Subsim who are far more familiar with TWOS issue than me, so you should really ask in the thread there to receive competent help.

Hi there, no it doesnt. At speed x the target will always take the same time to pass in front of you regardless of the AOB.

Basically, they did everything they had the time to do. You are correct, that they very often didn't have the time to set up a super precise firing solution, and just eyeballed it. However, the attack disc was used very frequently, because it is a tool that can be used very easily in every situation

There are a lot of players who love using lots of gadgets and equate tedious difficulty as being realistic when in reality it's just making things tedious, unrealistic, and unnecessarily difficult.

TWOS includes an optional mod that will remove the flag from your Sub, so the only times when you will see the flag is in port. (You will of course also see the Swastika on various charts and documents). I understand your feelings, but I'll rather put up with a few flags, in the end it is historically accurate, than to miss out on TWOS.

@@Tonci87 I didn't know that. Thank you. I'll have a look into the files later and maybe implement my own flags like a pirate flag or sth. Great Vids anyway!

Keep trying

Yes exactly :)