Stark Varg: Is it a KTM Killer?︱Traction eRag

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Күн бұрын

Four of the eRag gang rode the Stark Varg and two Surron electric dirt bikes over four days. We were so impressed with these new electrics, and we think the Stark Varg will be a serious challenge to KTM in the long term. We had chat with Barry Morris from @crosstrainingenduro who doesn't agree with us... yet!
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But he will also be riding the Starg Varg shortly and may change his mind. Stark Future announced the Varg back in 2021 - with a typical surfeit of optimism and nigh-on grandiose statements of intent, of course. Now that Stark has started delivering bikes to customers, there’s at least a legitimate product to support the lofty claims made back in 2021 - ‘unparalleled performance’, ‘class-leading powertrain’, ‘the most advanced electric motorcycle in the world’ and ‘the fastest motocross bike on the market’. Whether the Varg achieves any of that is something we’d probably need to borrow an MXGP champion to test , but with 80 horsepower shifting just 118kg (plus a presumably gurning rider), that’s the kind of power-to-weight ratio that should see it walk away from 450cc race-ready dirt bikes. The Varg’s configurator sets the bike up for each rider’s weight and chooses between a motocross-ready 19-inch rear wheel or an enduro-spec 18-inch. There’s even the choice of leaving the side stand on the shelf .What the hell is the eRag?

Пікірлер: 54

@bikesbeersbeats 4 ай бұрын

Silicon valley tech exec checking in..... KTM will have executives, directors, careers, partners, supplies, distributors, politics all centered around the internal combustion engine. The issue with new disruptive technologies is they upend the old order - meaning younger people with less industry experience are suddenly in charge. If you had the Stark lead engineer working as an engineer at KTM, you can bet his ideas would be overruled by the existing leadership to ensure he doesnt rise through the ranks too quickly or worse they would keep him out of the way. The Stark was rebuilt from the ground up and threw away a lot of so called sacred cows and introduced entirely new features that the ICE industry couldve added a decade ago. Its exactly the same in the tech industry, older/mature companies have leadership that hold onto power with an iron grip and kill ANY and ALL threats to that power. This is exactly why KTM did not create the Stark Varg. It doesnt make sense to someone on the outside but if you're on the inside it makes absolute sense as everyone at KTM has that years livelihood tied to the existing product roadmap. To bring in something entirely new can wreck sales of the entire product line and take several years to recover from. This is why its known as the innovators dilemma.

@TractioneRag 4 ай бұрын

This may be one of the best insightful and most informative comments we have ever received. 🙏🏻

@chuck7140 4 ай бұрын

The big plus is that it could open new riding areas closer to cities.

@glenngertz9429 4 ай бұрын

It will not open new territory near cities . Dog walkers , hikers and mountain bikers will absolutely hate e-motorcycles on their trails . E-dirt bikes will be loathed in cities .

@TractioneRag 4 ай бұрын

I used to think otherwise but now I think you are right. They are sooooo fast.

@Hinch55 4 ай бұрын

Somebody cited lack of power as a Stark Varg drawback? From all I've seen, power really isn't a problem with this bike.

@crosstrainingenduro 4 ай бұрын

Lack of power is a criticism of quite a few e-bikes to date e.g. KTM E-ride, Sur Ron's Ultra Bee and Lite Bee... and not that justified given the market those bikes are aimed at. But the 'lack of power' comment certainly wasn't directed at the Varg.

@TractioneRag 4 ай бұрын

The power of the Stark Varg will pull your shoulders out of the socket. Terrifying (but adjustable).

@karlgutsche1601 4 ай бұрын

Sorry for the long post. I think the Stark is incredible. I got mine about 8 weeks ago. I also have and love my 2018 KTM 300 XC which, in my opinion, is arguably the best all around dirt bike ever made. It’s by far the best dirt bike I’ve owned. All that said, I have not even thought about riding the 300 at all since the Stark arrived. Maybe it’s just because the Stark is the “new girlfriend in town” or the Stark is just that good? I think a lot depends on what type of riding one does. The Stark is just OK in the super tight technical stuff. You feel the weight at slow speeds and the suspension is on the stiff side. It’s also a very tall dirt bike. In flowy trails with the occasional open spaces, the Stark is so much fun. For me, the crazy HP modes are addicting and for me, cranking down a straightaway in 80hp WITHOUT MAKING A LOT OF NOISE is so much fun in its own way. My 300 is also powerful but it feels like you’re beating it up to get it to really rip. With IC engines the harder you crank them the louder they get(stating the obvious) and the more I feel like I’m abusing my bike. With the Stark, it’s effortless instant power and torque regardless of what HP setting you choose or how hard you crank it. I recently used the Stark in 80 hp to burn in new trails in a virgin wooded area. I literally was dragging the front brake and gunning the throttle hundreds of times. I never felt like I was abusing it nor that it was working hard. Also of note is that the only reason I got permission to cut new trails was because of the silent Stark…something to consider. When is the last time any of us got permission to cut trails in an area near businesses and homes with IC bikes? Bottom line: If I had only pick one? It would be the Stark. Mostly because I always find myself laughing and giggling when I ride it.

@TractioneRag 4 ай бұрын

Thank you for such a thoughtful comment, Karl. 👍🏻

@TractioneRag 4 ай бұрын

This is the full discussion. A shorter version appeared on Cross Training Enduro recently. Prefer the condensed version? kzfaq.info/get/bejne/mcpzpq-auNvTd6s.html Full review coming soon! NOTE: We mention 'no maintenance' in the vid, this refers to things like air filters and oil changes. The electric motor should be low maintenance compared to ICE. Obviously all other aspects of brakes, suspension, chassis etc will be the same levels of maintenance.

@kristiangunderson 4 ай бұрын

3.5 engine hours per ride is more than I usually do, but unfortunately I don't think a new bike of any kind is in my near future. I say this after I missed out on the recent great riding weather because I've got my 20+ year old cheap KTM completely torn apart so that I can fix a ton of typical old cheap bike problems. Time to go press the steering head bearings into the frame now. One more thing, I feel like a kid, but I still get a huge kick out of seeing my local trails in your videos. I'm so lucky I get to ride these places from my house.

@TractioneRag 4 ай бұрын

You are in BC? 😁

@firffighter 4 ай бұрын

Not really 3.5 hrs. 33 miles and just over 2hrs of realistic woods riding. kzfaq.info/get/bejne/pZ11gpuh3rm4ZGQ.htmlsi=hh3qd8Xs8xRr6BFt

@ThisTall 4 ай бұрын

@10:38 it states 54km range. I can squeeze 240km out of a stock tank in my 2018 exc500. How fast can I refill the battery off a 20 amp, 120v wall outlet?

@TractioneRag 4 ай бұрын

Yep, not quite there but close. I suspect a percentage of riders are going to adopt this for their specific situation.

@SWTrailsAndWheels 4 ай бұрын

The range still limits the bike for many trail and enduro uses. My fast desert trails are mostly sand and the shortest rides are 20 miles, longest rides are 60 miles. Based on user reports, the Varg can barely complete a 20 mile ride in deep sand.

@TractioneRag 4 ай бұрын

Yep, these bikes are not going to do well in the SW USA. Good woods bikes tho!

@gpaull2 4 ай бұрын

No maintenance? Maybe less maintenance. No engine oil or air filters. The chassis is the same though. Tires, brakes, chain, sprockets, suspension fluids, crash damage, have been the majority of the routine maintenance on my modern dirt cycles. The engine and clutches have been pretty trouble free for hundreds of hours on my modern bikes. I’ve been into high performance electric aircraft for over a decade now…electric brings its own challenges, maintenance, and troubleshooting skills. High perf electrics are far from trouble free…and my experience is from a niche that isn’t being drug through the sand and mud.

@crosstrainingenduro 4 ай бұрын

See pinned first comment

@TractioneRag 4 ай бұрын

Cool that you are already embedded into electric. We don't know a thing about living with electric. Only that they were exhilarating to ride.

@rotorhead5000 4 ай бұрын

I'm kinda in the market for a new dirtbike, and the points Dalas brings up really resonate with me. I typically dont ride more than a few hours at a time without a major stop, I enjoy maintaining my bikes, but also like the idea of needing to do less of it, its not really heavier (if you believe the spec sheets) than the 450's which power wise is rhe closest comparison, so i dunno, its a real consoderation, the real deciding factor i think will be how cheap will i be feeling when I get around to buying something.

@TractioneRag 4 ай бұрын

The day you take one out for a test ride will be the most expensive ride you've been on. 😎

@metlmuncher 4 ай бұрын

It will be interesting in the next few years. I want to ride one. I need to be convinced that you can do technical riding without a clutch 🎉

@TractioneRag 4 ай бұрын

You will never forget that day, I promise.

@bayselec 5 ай бұрын

They are a great motocross bike at the moment as the range isn't as important. They will not challenge a full off road racing enduro bike with the limitations they have but for me as a humble trail rider who goes out for a few hours for fun will be great. Just need a headlight and the rest off the gear for rego and maybe some enduro type maps and traction control to limit the wheel spin ohh trail weapon... 🤤😎👍

@talon0863 4 ай бұрын

The stark varg needs a better name (cus dam ) and a loudspeaker to make the brapp noises

@TractioneRag 4 ай бұрын

Hockey card in the spokes!

@talon0863 4 ай бұрын

Yeah anything would be nice@@TractioneRag

@minkusmcminkus7598 4 ай бұрын

Big f.cking hill mode and resonable jetting . Still mixing the fuel ,cigarettes with coffee

@johannescarlsson4559 4 ай бұрын

I think KTM have a whole site dedicated to e-bike development. They are certainly recruiting for it. Stark Varg is there. It's awesome 👌 Waiting for the street legal version and then in a few years we have 3x the range in the battery.

@TractioneRag 4 ай бұрын

Thank you for the info about the recruitment. This also hints that e-bikes are here to stay.

@johannescarlsson4559 4 ай бұрын

They make sense, so they will stay. Just the fact they are silent, no argument against noisy dirtbikes. Then the power, handlebar brake, no shifting, and ease of maintenance Just charge and go.

@snupermoto723 4 ай бұрын

The only reason I wouldn't have one is the up-front costs.

@snupermoto723 4 ай бұрын

But I'm a cheap bastard.

@TractioneRag 4 ай бұрын

The costs amortize way better than combustion - cheap to run and the "engine" should have 2000 hours. When's the last time you saw a combustion bike with even 1000 hours.

@Clasenca 4 ай бұрын

No it is not,but it will change and improove with more and more other companies on the market,creating the challenge of competition. The technical world will never stop .Noice in a ever shrinking world will play a bit role.Easy of maintance will be another important fact.

@TractioneRag 4 ай бұрын

All great comments.

@GregKhar-NU-Metalhead2000 4 ай бұрын

Tips: if u wanna be noisy just play metal song on ur bluetooth speaker "nOtHiNg CaN bEaT tHe SoUnD oF 2 sTrOkEs" Yes there are, its called distorted guitars 🎸🎸

@firffighter 4 ай бұрын

The problem is the range Just over 33 miles and 2hrs of realistic woods riding. Only about 1/2 of our typical day riding. kzfaq.info/get/bejne/pZ11gpuh3rm4ZGQ.htmlsi=hh3qd8Xs8xRr6BFt

@TractioneRag 4 ай бұрын

Yep, they aren't for everyone (yet), but for a percentage of peeps, they'll be ready right now.

@williamb.6918 4 ай бұрын

Ditto. I need double that range. My other chief gripe is the hassle to get these things street legal (assuming it is even allowed where you live). Until those two things change it will not be replacing a EXC for me.

@snupermoto723 4 ай бұрын

Deja-view

@crosstrainingenduro 4 ай бұрын

See pinned first comment

@brianmartindale2221 4 ай бұрын

Oh, come on now, we all know KTM will buy something. I'm losin track of how many brands and producers they have sucked up. But hey, electric recharging that takes as long as a gas fill-up or a solar-charged 50 hp 110kg unit is a long, long way off for this traveler. (I'll have the dream until I die) In my assessment, KTM ain't much of a Borg if it can't do that

@TractioneRag 4 ай бұрын

What evidence do you have of them snatch up other companies?? 😆

@lophophorawilliamsii9740 4 ай бұрын

Electric vehicles aint it unless they get a different battery technology.

@JoshDurston 4 ай бұрын

The name is super unfortunate. It's going to knee cap the bike.

@TractioneRag 4 ай бұрын

I think it means Lone Wolf in Swedish.

@JoshDurston 4 ай бұрын

That works nicely. I guess in English stark means bleak, naked or destitute, more of a negative vibe. Cool bike though, noise is killing the riding areas where I live, electric seems like the only way forward if we want to keep our riding areas close to people@@TractioneRag