Preach. Long time drummer here. I’ve held for sometime that shell characteristics (other than diameter and depth) play a fairly minor role in overall tone. The points you make also highlight how drum manufacturers have placed way too much emphasis and marketing hype on shell wood species, construction, thickness, etc. Great vid. By the way, I easily made it to the videos end.

I think the same about the term "resonant" - Steve Smith from Journey, and Rob Affuso from Skid Row on the song I Remember You. Probably because in the Remo MD ad they listed Stsve Smith as using clear Emperor, and in a separate ad they described the Emperor as being "....big, open, resonant, and tough". Thank you. I love this channel!

On your recording drums chapter: I use the example of how Eddie Kramer of Led Zeppelin recorded John Bonham. Very few microphones used and he still got great sound from that man. Great video series, Sir! You’re the ultimate Drum Nerd hero! 🤘🏻🤘🏻

Hi, thanks for putting out these contents! It's weird talking about how to get a longer resonance at this time as today's "young" drummers all aim pretty much for a dead thud (i.e. big fat things and Emad premuffled heads). Anyway, I love drum sound and I like your "let's chat about that" approach, si I'd like to share my experience. I've experienced that a thin shell made with non-dense wood (so less amount of wood in a unit) will do what you (and Sonor) says, so it will absorb the energy given by the drummer striking the head and will have less projection, less sustain and a "duller" sound with more fundamental and less overtones. But, a thin (but dense, strong) shell will sustain as long as a thick shell. I think the focus shouldn't be about the lenght of the note but about the sound (tone) that comes out of the drum. On thin (dense) shells you hear more of the fundamental and that's perceived as more low end, while on thick shells the low frequencies are still there but are more focused (and with focused I don't mean less, but clearer). Pretty much all Yamaha drums have thick shells and they are still in demand as live backline kits (a part of that demand is simply because people are used to it since the 80s) so you can mic them up and you're ready to go. Less "boooommmmmmmm" perceived (so a clearer sound to the ears) and the sound guy is happy as he takes less to dial in the sound and create the space for other musicians (other frequencies). But in this case the yamaha YESS mount can "eat up" a lot of the resonance, especially on certain tunings (and this changes based on how you position the hex rod into the bracket, especially on older 80s YESS system), and people on stage aim to those spots so they have "less troubles" (hylarious, yes...) So, based on all the test I've been doing over the last 25 years (backline tech, studio and being a drummer) the mount you have on your toms/floor toms has a big impact on the resonance. Rims are a great choice, I use them on all my drums too, but if the rims gets in contact with 6 of 8 screws on a 14" tom (so it touches the hoop in many spots) it will inhibit the resonance, that's why I cut out some of the "ears" on mine. Same thing on Gretsch 12" Tom, the rims gets in touch with 4 of the 5 screws and you have less resonance. A lot of people complains about the SQ1 (medium-thick shell) 12" tom sounding choke at some tunings, and that's the mount (hinged to the shell) "eating-up" all the resonance. Similar case as Yamaha. Sonor has undersized shells, that meet the hads on the "flat" spot, this allow more resonance, but that's another topic I'm sure you'll cover in the future (if you haven't done it already). Check this out to hear some tests I've made. kzfaq.info/get/bejne/aceieJxp0LCbf3k.html I encurage you to record a fair test by using let's say a 12" thin shell (N&C, Pork Pie, DW, you name it...) and a 12" thick shell tuned the same exact way, with the same heads, mount and mics, not a competition, just to hear the tonal/sustain differences. Personally I like to give a proof when I talk about something, even though it's not easy to hear all the nuances on the internet, but this is what we have! I appreciate what you did in this video and I really like the topic in question, during the last 25/30 years marketing did a great job in selling stuff we don't need. I think that today's internet approch "what's the best choice" is totally misleading as you've pointed out in this video, each project needs different sound, and that's the fun part! Keep up the good work! Cheers from Italy! Dave

I was born in 1971 in Dubuque, Iowa, and therefore I came of age in the 1980s. There was very, very little in the way of technical, sound-centric design theory information available for a young drummer to learn the how’s and why’s of our newly adopted instruments. I can remember tuning my drums by singing the old solfège do re mI fa sol la ti do, haha! There simply were no obvious resources available from which to glean answers to the standard 1,496 questions one must ask in order to have the slightest idea of how to logically and systematically create a workable and reproducible drum sound. Modern Drummer Magazine was really coming into its own around my time so one could learn a thing or two from there. My biggest blessing was the advent of VCR technology, the growing popularity of the video rental market, and the DCI/Hudson Music partnership which focused on creating educational/instructional videos on a very wide spectrum of topics associated with many different musical instruments. There were interviews with popular drummers of the day sitting behind a kit and providing answers to direct interview questions, or full length instructional videos by these individual artists who cover their own chosen curriculum of gear selection, hand/foot technique, networking skills, showmanship skills and so on, as well as my saving grace: a VCR release from Noble and Cooley Drum Company with master drum design engineer Bob Gatzen. His video was around two hours long and he covered just about everything a young person could hope to learn about shell design, tympanic membranes, drumhead design, snare design and drum tuning. It was a Godsend for a young aspiring drumset player in Dubuque, Iowa. I’m very grateful for this internet KZfaq production series that I’m devouring currently. Thank you thank you thank you! 👍👍👍

I have thicker heavier drum shells with outter round over edges. I always used clear emperor batters and clear ambassador resos. After hearing you talk in the shell and edge videos about roundovers robbing some high end and you liking thinner heads on those old thicker sonor shells, I snagged some clear diplomats to try as my resos and then flip my clear ambassadors up to the batter side. WOW! did that make an amazing difference with tuning range and bringing some high end back into the equation, also a better sounding more rounded sustain. Much appreciated sir!

Drum geek here for over 55 years! Now 72! Grew up in LA hanging out in in Professional Drum Shop. Making a living playing drums. I love your channel. Keep it coming.

Drums and science and sound engineering, all coherently explained. What more could you want? Cheers.

This video is amazing and I'm going to recommend it forever to people. The amount of myths being propagated daily, most frequently by drum manufacturers' marketing departments mind you, is astounding, and a down-to-earth assessment of what turns out to be really basic science is sometimes all you need to debunk the lot. I've gotten pretty active on the r/drums subreddit, and while there is enough BS on there as well, the down-to-eartheners there have really educated me on how overestimated things like shell materials etc are and how much more the heads matter to begin with. Really pulls you away from the marketing guff for flagship drum sets and settles you into a nice intermediate kit for a fraction of the price and the same amount of pleasure and reliability. Please never stop, this was by no means a long or winding video but incredibly educational. And your way of telling is nothing short of mesmerizing. Thanks!

I feel less crazy now for preferring thick shells over thin shells. Ludwig 6 ply shells made in the late 70's sound amazing! I also love early 80's Tama Superstar shells. Probably the easiest kit I've ever recorded. Thanks for the video, learned a lot!

….reading drum catalogs instead of my school books? Yeah, me too!

so I can’t sleep and I find your channel. I watched and took flippin’ notes. can’t WAIT to experiment in my basement recording studio tomorrow! seriously great content and please keep it coming!

Thank you for a thought provoking video. Three glaring points that are missed in this discussion of drum "physics." Precedence Effect of the shell to bottom resonant head, whereby the shell transfers vibration from the top head strike and vibration through the shell to the bottom head at a faster rate than through the air collumn. Time Domain, is something we are incredibly sensitive to (phase versus frequency non-linearities). Constrained-layer dampening where more cobined mass, more layers, more glue and more hardware will dampen the solid material and minimize the precedence effect, and or transfer of enery (and it will do so non-linearly with frequency). Yes, you are correct that we're hearing the bottom head resonating, but you're hearing a mix of the air collumn pressure, wave-forms, AND the precedence effect (which arrives earlier) . Thus, shells and shell composition matter greatly, particualrly for those who want maximum mid and high frequency overtones. That's not everyone, granted. However, one must look at the physics without bending it to your aesthic or manufacturing preference. Enjoy!

RefonDrums has an entire YT channel built upon the subject matter of this video. Most drummers really have no clue about drum physics. You nailed it right here! Sonor also hit the nail on the head!

This has to be one of the nerdiest drum videos I've ever seen, and I love it! 🖤

Exactly what I was searching for. Great video man, keep it going!

This is fantastic information! A couple of years ago I we t with a low mass thin shelled kit as my main gigging kit. It was great for the transportation side of it all! But after a year or so I stopped lying to myself and came to the conclusion that the only thing they had going for them was the reduced weight. I switched to Sonor earlier this year, and while its heavier, those 9 plies of Beech have been soooo worth it. Nothing but compliments from sound engineers thus far!

Man, I’m really digging your channel. I was 15 in 1982 so I can totally relate to your story. My head is kinda blown but I also kinda think I intuitively knew this concept between thick shells vs thin shells. I have an early 2000s Tama rockstar custom mahogany and its shells are thicker than one of my six ply maple shell kits and they sound huge, I mean huge, and the bass drum is just killer!! Thanks for bringing this concept to light. Keep up the great work!!

Hi, I am a 65 yr old Engineer that has been playing since I was 15, stopped for a while in midlife due to life biting me in the arse (yes I'm a Brit) but always came back to my drumming. I am not a follower of trends and I like what I like, not what I am "told" that I should like. I was looking to expand my understanding of how I can explore different basic variables in my kits ( Brit :) ). I love your presentation style and the common sense approach to the subject, thanks for taking the time, best regards Steve

I think you're mistaken about the energy loss issue. I understand it as having more to do with sound waves cancelling each other out. If a shell vibrates at a complementary frequency to the heads but phase shifted relative to them, it will literally steal energy from the heads as its phase may oppose and thus cancel certain frequencies from the head's vibration.

Phenomenal channel !!! Thank you for this great information

Love the video Joel!!! This really confirms what I have believed for many years!!! Thanks for sharing!!! Love the channel!!!

I ordered the catalog back and 82 as well. That’s why I’m playing sonar SQ2 drums today! 👍🤟great video thanks for sharing.

Great Video! I have a lot of drums, stave, plexiglass, mahogany 3plys, vintage Luds and Slings..But I will tell you, the best sounding kit I have is a Sonor SQ2 beech..Omg! This kit will tear down a wall..clear tone, rich, and plenty of sustain.. Heavy, yes, but nothing sounds like this kit! Thanks for clarifying my suspicions! I got this kit because of Steve Smith's sound in Journey...Im so glad I did!

Very interesting and informative!! Great presentation!!

Fascinating. Somewhat counterintuitive but makes sense after you explain it. Just discovered your channel and really enjoying the content.

Really gig your channel man! Super thorough wich is great. Thank you 👍

I loved this and immediately subscribed, thank you. I'm 61 and I read that same Sonor Catalogue article in the 80's, I've been quoting it endlessly ever since. Everything you're talking about I have experienced first hand. In fact, my home studio kit is a Sonor Signiature and depending on how it's played or how it's recorded, it just has a huge range of sounds. In fact, I recently recorded a track with everything wide open for that 'vintage' sound but when it came to making the video the artist wanted me to mime on my 60's white marine pearl Gretch because it looked cool. When the comments started coming in about that great Gretch sound I just loved pointing out that it's actually the big thick Sonor with no dampening.

Wow cool in depth video Joel!

I can corroborate this from my experience. My first 2 pro-level kits had thicker shells and nice sustain. The first was an 80’s era Tama Superstar. The second kit was an early 90’s Yamaha Maple Custom. Tuned right with single-ply heads, they would sustain for days. For some reason, I sold those and “upgraded” to an Absolute set, with much thinner shells. Actually, the toms sounded great…until I mounted them. The YESS mount system on those thin shells choked the sound significantly! And because the spaces between the hoops and the lug casings were too small, I could not use RIMMS mounts. That set didn’t last long. I actually went back to the 80’s Tamas.

Amazing content. Thank you

Just started watching your channel today. So, to give my opinion context, I've been playing close to 25 years and recording for 15. Was also the 12 year old getting his hand on every gear catalog I could find, eventually working in the drum department of local music shops in my area and moving on to build several of my own kits even. So let me tell you how surprised I was to hard find out something I didn't know today!! This video is absolutely brilliant, and I have a whole new metric to evaluate drum shells and sound by. I also had a set of those Ludwigs and foolishly sold them (though I play modded Rogers Fullertons, which are fun in their own way. All with Remo ambassadors top and bottom, wide open btw), but I've got a new project shell set of them that will be coming together in the next year (when I have the time haha), and this video got me super hyped for them!! Anyway, sorry for the rant. I'm just really excited to see content from another drummer with similar opinions and I'm really looking forward to more videos from you! I've got a couple other teachers in my area I'm friends with, I'll be sure to share this with them

I think you'll find that actually the shell takes it's energy from both the head AND the vibrating air within the shell when the head is hit. So the natural resonance of the drum shell has a far more complex impact on the sound of the drum than just "sucking" the energy out of the head and reducing it's sustain. It's very similar to what happens in hi-fi speakers, if the cabinet has any vibrations it "colours" the sound of the speaker because it impacts the linearity of the speaker cone's response, both in an additive and subtractive way depending on the way the resonance in the cabinet affects the pressure of the interior of the cabinet at particular frequencies. Exactly the same physics process is happening in a drum when you hit the head.

I always thought the same thing I totally agree with you it's great that you're sharing your knowledge because it's all true so thank you my friend and I'm looking forward to seeing you again everytime I watch our videos I learn something bless you brother

Love the channel!

Great video man! I've mostly bought into the whole "thinner=resonant" marketing trick for most of my 20 years of playing, but this made a ton of sense! One of my favorite kits I've tried was a Starclassic bubinga elite (if memory serves, 8 ply, thicker, dense bubinga shell) and when compared to the newer Star line bubingas (much thinner shells) it sounded so much more full and powerful. Always thought I was perceiving wrong, but this confirms my thoughts! Also, out of many dozens of snares I've had over the years, the fullest toned, most resonant and responsive snare I've owned is my suuuper dense, thick, and heavy Cherry Hill block construction snare. It all makes sense now!

Just came across your channel. Quite enjoyed the videos thus far on Drum Sound Physics and this brochure from Sonor you referenced is quite insightful. Thanks for the solid content!

I think this was part of the idea behind Peavey Radial drums. Their snare shell in particular was a beast! Great video! Edit: Thinking back on it, this was the concept behind the _snare_ but I think the tom concept was to create sort of a "violin" with a thin, vibrating shell and a stiff "bridge". However the concepts are completely different. The violin, guitar, etc, are taking relatively low sound magnitudes (bow across strings, fingers plucking strings) and using the bridge and body (a resonating box with vents) to amplify the vibrations. A drum doesn't really need that, as you point out with your example of the Rototoms. The drum head is getting relatively _high_ magnitude impulse from the stick into the head, which then doesn't require much amplification. Cheers!

Thanks Joel, I just love all of this. What you (and Sonar Catalog) explained about energy makes total sense for me. I can't wait to try a really massive drum.

new to me. Nice. I like that you put it out there to reflect.

Love the series about drum physics, thank you! You should team up with Sounds like a Drum, that collab would be a blast to watch. /Amateur drummer and occasional drum builder.

That's why our seamless walnut snare shells are 1/2 to 3/4" thick. Now it's time to build a thick walled seamless walnut kit. The "Wallnut Series" 😀

Now this was interesting. I have kind of made the same conclusions by myself. This actually verified that what I've observed is on the right track. The first time I heard how the shell really rings and affects the overall sound was when I tested the different mic positions for recording. It is quite a suprise how the different drum shells sound when you mic up both heads and add a shell mic in the middle for comparison.

Why I didn’t discover this channel earlier?! It is simply amazing! I’m doing my first custom drum order and I finally start to understand what I need to in order to match my sound preferences ❤

I agree with you 100% about the lack of thicker shelled drums in the current marketplace. It's almost impossible to find any major manufacturer offering production line thick shelled drums. Sure, you can custom order a heavy shell from from many of them, and you pay thru the nose for them. Thin and medium shells are great, but the market is utterly flooded with them. It's also time to move away from the 18x22 as the standard size for bass drums. Good luck finding a 16x24 or a 14x26 without having to go custom. It's even hard to find a 16x22. Frustrating time for many of us drummers.

This is why i always go back to my original late 90s maple custom and notice this after ive been playing my thin shelled kit the thicker shelled drums have a lot more projection and open up more also they sing more at low volume as well

Joel, you're my new favourite youtuber!! thank you

Awesome content thank you! When I first bought my PDP drums few months ago I noticed a difference right away from other drums I had. These or the made in Mexico LX series that were really DW drums. I don't believe there anywhere near thick as what you're talking about, but at that point there were the best drums I had. I still have. But when I got them home and tuned up the 12, my son said my face lit up with the smile from ear to ear. The sound to me was amazing! And I realized after listening to this that it was the heads. They came with the original DW heads that were single ply with a little white coated stripe around the edges. Top and bottom. Prior to this all of the heads I had used were always double ply on top. Like Evans EC2S. When I ordered new drum heads for the kit I ordered all DW heads again thinking I absolutely love that sound. And it's just that it's an open drum. I've learned so much in the last 10 months about drum sound. Listening to stuff from you augments it a lot!

In SONOR's defense, note and pitch are listed as a synonyms for tone and we describe the interval between notes as tones (ie semitone) and we the pitch of things as a tone (he spoke in a low tone) and the lack of a defined note as atonal. Great video by the way.

I watched the entire video.. and yes I’ve been a victim of marketing.. I have those thin shell lacquered maple drums… but what you’re saying makes so much sense.. looking forward to you next video. BTW. I have never played big enough venues to need mics on my drums and have always had that non studio processed sound. So I spend a lot of time tuning. Great channel. Keep them coming.

Thank you for this input and taking the time to express some facts. I am a full time professional and are very familar with the Sonor book you are reading, furthermore I play a Sonor Signature Kit. The shells are super thick, heavy and super mass. The kick drum shell is 20mm thick with each shell reducing in thickness in relation to size (diameter). The projection and sound of these drums is unmatched, I,ve stacked them up against everything over my years in the industry. Yes thick shells are awesome, head selection is critical to getting that sound. I also have a Sonor Designer Series Kit , same configerations as the Signature Kit but with rims mounting. The shells are thick and reducing also, the sustain is unbelievable and well defined. Really there is nothing between the two Kits when using the same heads on both. Shalom.

80’s Sonor Signature Series! Love them.

Really nice and well thought out video. I had a copy of that same Sonor catalog way back as well. I like the end where u mention wrapped shells. Crazy how coveted vintage drums where the laminate was wrapped right into the seam early in manufacturing have become. On to something there I do believe. My Pearl BLX birch kit with Long high tension lugs and 7.5/8.5mm shells were the best sounding kit I ever owned. Sound engineers at clubs I played often praised my 24x16 kick. Thunderous!!Only regret was not buying the champagne mist over birdseye maple Pearl Z customs. Even thicker shells. I did play’em. Epic sound and focus. I’m sure most drummers know Todd Sucherman has Pearl make him custom kits featuring thick shells similar to the Sonors he keeps in his collection. One of the best sounds in the business for sure. Keep up the good work!

This video is fantastic, some great information here. Keep up the good work!

I have a thin shell snare drum made of cheaper maple, and one thicker made of brass. The brass drum definitely carries on for longer and feels louder. The thin one sounds thin close up because of overtones, more full further away since in my experience overtones don’t travel far. This video and the talking absolutely matched my experience.

Cant wait for part 2 you’re just what i needed Joel! Cant wait to learn all there is to know about drums from you this will really take my music production to the next level

Got that same Sonor catalogue in the early eighties,still have it,along with a set of 1984 Sonor phonics.10,12,13,14,16-22 BD,absolutely killer drums,still have those also,they just turned 40 and sound better than ever,all drums and hardware are in unbelievable shape and they have been moved a lot.Thanks for the excellent content ✌️

I can fully agree to you. I have a Pearl Masters MCX with a 7.5 mm Maple Shell. They have so much tone and Resonance. I can tune them up and down and they always sound wonderful. I can see, that the most great drum companies today are going to manufacture thinner shells. Under 6mm. Even the MCX Series was replaced by the MCT Series, which in my mind is just a save-mony-by-save -material move. MCX had 7,5mm shells, MCT has 5,4 mm. The MCX are sounding way better. The Exceptions im the high end ranges of drums are the Pearl Masterworks Stadium and the Yamaha Phoenix drums. All with a shell over 10mm.

Awesome info and videos... I build Stave Snares and drums and 100% agree with you. My drums that are made from Aussie hardwood are thick, heavy, solid and sound amazing 😀. And what I have found from snares I have built from softer timber like Cypress Pine or Norfolk Island Pine are amazing for needing dampening as they have very little in the way of overtones.

What a great channel! You have a very deep understanding of drums an are really good at explaining stuff. My main drum is made of thin maple shells, and what you describe is exactly what i discovered. Especially in Studio situations or whenever i had the chance to try another kit with thick heavy shells i preferred that tone over my kit. Keep on making great content like this, you rule.

I have a stave snare drum that I made, Very thick shells. Best sounding drum in my collection

Such great videos!!

I have an issue I'd like to address... I want to subscribe so badly with every video, but I already have hahaha. Your verbal illustrations are top-notch! So, I was the 7th grader with a knack for getting a 'good' recording of 1 or 2 guitars, a bass, vocals and drums with a tiny boombox with one onboard mic... in a small, cinderblock and sheetrock basement room (2 of each type of wall). That is to say that physics has (have?) always been very forthcoming to me. An honest relationship with open communication, if you will. But YOU have dropped some heavy science on me, here! Some stuff I never really thought about much. It's also pretty nifty that we ate from the Sonor menu as my primary kit right now is a Force '05 birch (except the snare, it's meh) with Evans G1s on the toms... wide open. If I don't find any Hayman or Ajax in your backlog I'd like to request you do something about that ;) please.

Super explanation!

Great information, thank you.

Very interesting and insightful video Joel, and I must admit has given me some food for thought. As someone who reviews drums and is a definite drum geek (happily watched it all, my videos aren't exactly short either!), I often refer to things like resonance, projection etc and even though I think I know what I'm trying to say, it can be hard to articulate! Will continue to follow the channel, great content!

Just found this channel. Will spread the word. Great content dude.

Very fascinating stuff. BTW I have that same Sonor catalog, and several other old ones. Helpful stuff to know the science not just what we believe.

again great video!

There's a few bits of relevant physics worth clarifying a bit more. (1) The shell being relatively rigid and immovable creates sustain because head vibrations hitting the shell can't be transmitted into the shell, and get reflected right back into the head going the other way. (That's a lot like how guitars get sustain. Most of the energy of string vibration hitting the bridge or nut or fret can't be transmitted into the guitar, and is reflected right back into the string.) Only a little fraction of the energy is transmitted from the head(s) into the shell, leaving most of it in the heads, to be transmitted into the air bit by bit at successive cycles of vibration. (2) Rigidity works together with mass to resist vibration, so a shell that is more rigid may resist vibration better than one that is more massive. Rigidity braces the edge of the shell against more mass of shell. (Imagine that the shell was completely rigid. You couldn't move the edge of the shell at all without moving the entire shell exactly that much, so the entire mass of the shell would resist the vibration at the bearing edge. If the shell is flexible, only the mass near the bearing edge matters much... a floppy connection to the rest of the mass of the shell doesn't help a lot.) (3) THICKNESS of the wood usually matters FAR MORE to stiffness than the intrinsic stiffness of the particular wood itself. A particularly dense wood might be twice as stiff for a given thickness than a lighter wood, and usually about twice as dense, but you can just make the lighter wood a little thicker and it will be just as stiff. Stiffness depends on the CUBE of the thickness, so you can double the stiffness by using 26 percent thicker wood. (1.26 * 1.26 * 1.26 = very slightly over 2.000) If you double the thickness, you can make the shell 2 * 2 * 2 = EIGHT TIMES as stiff. That means that if you a wood that is 2x lighter and 1/2 as stiff, but make it twice as thick, it will give you a shell that weighs the same but is several times stiffer than the thinner shell of the harder wood. That is why the soundboards (tops) of acoustic guitars are usually made of light woods (usually spruce or cedar), NOT dense hardwoods. The only really important tonewood in a guitar is usually a cheap, soft, light wood, not the expensive "tonewoods" that raise the prices so much, because for a given mass you can make it significantly thicker and thus much stiffer. (4) That means---and everyone needs to understand this---PARTICULAR WOODS DON'T HAVE PARTICULAR SOUNDS INDEPENDENT OF THEIR THICKNESS, and SEEMINGLY SMALL DIFFERENCES IN THICKNESS MATTER A LOT, up to a point. Maple doesn't have a particular sound, nor does mahogany, or beech, or poplar, or any of them. They all have roughly similar mechanical properties aside from their density and stiffness, which are strongly correlated and don't vary all that much. The shell's stiffness is what's important to how much it resonates, and at what frequencies, and that depends more on how thick it is than which of those woods it's made of. Once the wood gets to a certain thickness and stiffness, though, you reach a point of diminishing returns. If the shell is stiff and massive enough that very little energy is being transmitted from the heads into the wood, make it even more stiff and more massive won't make much of a difference.

Invaluable content. I use to have a 9mm shell drums. Very resonant. Super loud!

Just discovered your channel. I Really love it. I appreciated how you pointing out Perception regarding “softer & louder” relative to overtones. It’s easily misunderstand.

Great content!

I approve of this message. Nice... well done. Great explanation... all accurately grounded in wave physics.

Great discussion! Part of me is finding some of this hard to swallow, but my balanced mind is reminding myself here, that there are MANY factors that determine how drums sound and perceived resonance (and even some of which are beyond our direct control....like the ROOM). I am now a new subscriber. Best regards and respect.

Great tutorial. Thank you, really helps to understand how the shell works with the heads.

very insightful stuff. nice

I just binged the whole series. Phenomenal content, please continue. Would love to hear about the inside treatment of shells: Silver sealer, vibra fibe, unfinished,etc. Also physics differences specific brands, building off the content in all of these videos but applying it to comparing how everyone builds their drums. Also thank you for not being brief and actually explaining all of the nuances. Can’t say enough good things here.

I came across your channel today with this video, and you changed my mind, I thought the opposite, just as companies advertise. But everything you said makes sense, and specially coming from Sonor, it must be well studied, they are my favorite drums along with Ludwig.

Great Video!

The best comparison is a bow and a guitar, the bow being a soft and elastic wood will "resonate" for 0.05 seconds and a guitar being a hard wood will resonate more than 5 seconds. So, in conclusion, get the drums that have a better hardware and better looks for you and nevermind the wood (unless you really like the grain pattern).

Years ago I joined a drum forum online and avidly read all the posts on shell construction theories, different wood tonal qualities and generally the pursuit of the ultimate drum. I came to realize that everybody had the same basic beliefs on drum construction but it seemed that most had a pretty firm but perhaps differing opinions on how to apply that knowledge into drum building. Many were actively building drums in search of their idea of the ultimate drum sound. It was incredibly interesting. I look forward to seeing your videos and see where you go with this.

Found the facts I was hoping were true, thanks. I’m 70 so the era I’ve tried to copy with my drums you just solved

Very good explanation of the physics of drums, but . . . resonance and sustain are not the same thing. In fact, they are inversely related. Resonance is when all of the drum components are vibating together (warm, round tone w/ shorter sustain), and it is indeed enhanced by using thin/low mass shells, low mass parts, and roundover bearing edges . It sounds like you prefer drums with strong sustain, essentially isolating the heads to let them vibrate as long and openly as possible. It's totally a valid sound, but certainly not the only approach, and not the sound that many drummers are going for (and why so many are drummers fighting this type of sound with gels, tape, rings, 2 ply heads etc.). I would argue that most drum companies ARE making thick-shelled heavy drums, and very few are effectively making thin-shelled, lightweight (and resonant) drums.

one thing about thinner shells is they are good on the back and smaller venues hence going back to Premier as a second kit..... And Premier is all over the place with thickness some definitely need rings inserted while others have a bit more meat to their shells

Great video.

Tone is not a bad word to use for note. Western music uses a 12 tone system and scales made up of semi- tones and whole tones. We tend to use the word tone for color or character of the sound and note for pitch, which isn't wrong. I hate carrying heavy drums anymore no matter how good they sound. I'll carry my Gretsch Catalina Club Mahogany all day and bf happy. And they sound great. Thin shells. The Yamahas will stay in the studio unless I have to take them.

Dude thank you for making this! I started building my own drums a few years ago and I decided to go with the thicker shells. I have questioned myself along the way because there is so much propaganda that says thinner is always better and yes “more resonant”….but I swear by thicker shells, for the ear test and the feeling test they are just all around better in every way, and like you say it’s better to have more to work with and take things away than to not have enough to start with because you can’t add on more! This was also good confirmation that I am in fact a drum nerd because I would like to know that I am putting in the work and figuring things out as someone who builds drums.

loved this

Great vid. Lot of comments so sorry if i repeat others, but Steve Smith was playing a Sonor lite cream lacquer in Journey. Keep the good job, great video again.

THANK YOU. Super nicely put together, amd I don't have an issue with almost any of the statements. I have been trying for years to beat this logic into people and some drum builders I talked with. Suffice to say, they didn't listen, but I'm glad that SOME other people get it.

The "resonace" mith is really true!!

I just picked up a Ludwig 1960s bass drum and tom, 70s ludwig snare. Wow, Im thinking about selling my DW Collector's these drums are Amazing. Key Stone Badge. No serial number. They Survived the 04 Hurricanes! 24x14 kick there a little Rough. Don't Care! The Sound! Love the Channel! Thanks for Sharing!

Great video. I completely agree with the message that the shell does not contribute to the sound through resonance, but may rob energy from the drum head by resonating and thereby, indirectly, altering the sound. I always questioned adds and videos talking about the "warm sound of mahogany", etc... It would be interesting to test the thickness and weight threshold beyond which it is impreceivable to hear a difference, and only size, edge shape and head determine the sound.

I loved your comment ..." Ask my wife .. I've got a lot of Drum Sets"! Same here! Lol ! Just for that I'm going to subscribe to your channel! Great subject , very good information!

LOVE this stuff Joel

My first kit as a kid was a 1980s Sonor kit and it weighed an absolute ton. I wasn't enough of a drum geek at that stage to appreciate the sonic qualities its massiveness engendered, and it's fascinating to learn about the science behind it, but man did it suck lugging that heavy kit around to gigs and rehearsals. This video was so good it almost made up for it. :)

By the way, resonance only has one meaning in physics. i.e. the frequency at which the output of the system (be that current, voltage, sound waves) drastically increases disproportionately compared to the input. Put another way, you sweep the input frequency (the driving frequency) at the same level and the output drastically increases at a particular frequency. That's the resonance frequency of that "system". For physical things such as drum shells it's also known as "natural" resonant frequency, which is the fundamental frequency (read note or tone) you hear when you tap a drum shell (without any attachements). You're correct it's something completely different to sustain. One of the attributes of resonance is Q. Q determines the "sharpness" of the resonance peak. In reality, nearly all resonant systems (particularly physical ones) are damped to some degree. It's the amount of damping that determines how long a resonant note will "ring" or sustain.

DW Collector Series drums actually have a note printed inside them. In the late 1970's I played with guy who was a keyboard player (for our band) who was actually a producer of music in the early 60's. More spacifically Beach Music. He had produced over 6 #1 hits...and he had almost 20 top 10 and 29 top 25 hits. He told me, and I did it, to tune my snare to a middle C. I had a 8x14 chrome over wood Ludwig snare. It did make a difference to me in the tone of the drum...especially miced up. I did some 4 or 5 years later stop this practice and just tuned it to what I liked my snare to sound . Most drummer always said they loved my snare sound. But being able to just tune a drum correctly makes a huge difference. I would say 1/3rd of the drummers I have seen in my time had no idea how to actually tune drums. Interesting vids. Thanks.

I think when people talk about resonance they mean that they hit the skin & as well as the note tuned for there is another tone that is introduced by the Shell(whether that's desirable or not is neither here nor there) I think that's what they mean not some kind of resonant filter anything That you mentioned I tend to be a believer that tone is coming from the heads primarily and I think that shells have little to do with it and the good feeling you have for your red Drums is because they're heavy build is minimising to the heads That said the notion that Choice of materials having some kind of affect on a drum is fascinating to me...🤞 I think with enough effort practically any drum can sound like any other drum especially if it's of the same diameter I believe, drum libraries not withstanding (!) That the Drum sounds we actually require in the real world are a very limited pallet anyway I would just like to add that of all my drum kits the one that is most fussy when it comes to choice of heads is my arbiter flats that have no shells at all!